U.S. Politics megathread (merged)

[Jambo-Jimbo]

9 hours ago, JFK-1 said:

 

I was thinking along those lines too. If he loses his blatant corruption is going to come even more to the fore when he can't interfere with investigation. Who in their right mind will want to be associated with him in any way?

Negate an election result everybody knows is legitimate? That's going way too far for anybody who wants to retain a shred of credibility. What's more likely to happen is anybody touched by him will be distancing themselves from him as much as they can.

Staffers Worry That "Trump Stink" Will Prevent Them From Getting Jobs If Trump Loses 
 

 

 

Thought and been saying this for quite some time now, when Trump is no longer president just watch the rats leave the sinking ship in their droves.

I hope that he lives long enough to see his 'business empire' crash & burn around him and it will, mark my words it will, It probably would have already, if he hadn't lucked his way into the WH.

 

[3fingersreid]

.
 

Edited October 24, 2020 by 3fingersreid

[Seymour M Hersh]

11 hours ago, Kalamazoo Jambo said:

The good news for Biden is that there are fewer undecideds than in 2016 and that there’s already 50+ million votes made. But at the end of the day, it’s only the battleground states that matter. My worst fear is that this goes to the courts which are growing more and more right-wing (and with that, often pro- voter suppression) in their makeup.

 

Surely that's only good news for Biden if the majority of the 50m voted for Biden. 

Edited October 24, 2020 by Seymour M Hersh

[Seymour M Hersh]

14 hours ago, Lovecraft said:

Fake news!

 

He is fine.

 

Nothing to see here.

 

That's just what normal hands look like.

 

 

 

Apparently it's a condition fairly common in older folk. 

[Sawdust Caesar]

12 hours ago, Kalamazoo Jambo said:

The other (bigger) reason for Dems voting early is that (in general) they believe COVID is real and dangerous and therefore don’t want to deal with crowds on Election Day itself. Republicans are much less concerned about that.

 

The ability to track absentee ballots varies from state to state but I was able to track mine today in Michigan. So my ballot has been received. That’s not the same as being counted however. If the election officials think my signature doesn’t match what’s on file, for example, they have to contact me to confirm. But again, that’s just Michigan. It’s hard to overstate how much rules vary across the country.

I saw a news report a few weeks ago where this could be a problem area and another way to suppress votes. They had a hand writing expert (I think he was anyway) who said that people's signatures can change  quite significantly over time. They showed Richard Nixon's (iirc) signature over a couple of decades and the difference was remarkable. It looked like it was 2 different people's hand writing. He also said that other factors can come into play to make your signature look different from what could be on file i.e. if you were standing or sitting when you sign something, the type and size of pen and a few others that I forget. The difference in your signatures could be enough for someone to think your ballot has been signed by someone else. 

[Beni]

37 minutes ago, Barack said:

Don't even care that it's Trump. This is just brilliant unintentionally comedic timing.

 

 

 

 

 

Paging Dr Pavlov.

 

[Mac_fae_Gillie]

15 hours ago, SectionDJambo said:

The bad news is that if he loses, he’s expected to leave the United States and live in .......

Scotland.

On one of his golf courses.

Live in Scotland, no chance not even the rightist  right wing nazi, KKK member would believe his tan is natural if he lived here.

[redjambo]

13 minutes ago, Mac_fae_Gillie said:

Live in Scotland, no chance not even the rightist  right wing nazi, KKK member would believe his tan is natural if he lived here.

 

But Jimmy Calderwood managed to get a great tan living in Scotland! It must be something genetic.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

16 hours ago, SectionDJambo said:

The bad news is that if he loses, he’s expected to leave the United States and live in .......

Scotland.

On one of his golf courses.

 

Not a chance of that happening, HMRC will have his card well and truly marked.

[Maple Leaf]

I read today that how people in the UK view America has declined sharply in the last 4 years, with only about 40% viewing the US favourably.  In France it's only about 20%.  A similar decline has been recorded throughout the western democracies, America's allies for the last 80 years.  At least half the people interviewed said that a relationship with China is as important, or more important, than a relationship with the USA.

 

Bearing that in mind, it's startling, at least to me, that 60+ million Americans will vote for another 4 years of Trump. 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

15 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

I read today that how people in the UK view America has declined sharply in the last 4 years, with only about 40% viewing the US favourably.  In France it's only about 20%.  A similar decline has been recorded throughout the western democracies, America's allies for the last 80 years.  At least half the people interviewed said that a relationship with China is as important, or more important, than a relationship with the USA.

 

Bearing that in mind, it's startling, at least to me, that 60+ million Americans will vote for another 4 years of Trump. 

 

And one of them was just on Sky News, saying that she'll vote for Trump because if Biden wins he'll turn America into something like Venezuela with his socalist policies.

[JFK-1]

17 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

I read today that how people in the UK view America has declined sharply in the last 4 years, with only about 40% viewing the US favourably.  In France it's only about 20%.  A similar decline has been recorded throughout the western democracies, America's allies for the last 80 years.  At least half the people interviewed said that a relationship with China is as important, or more important, than a relationship with the USA.

 

Bearing that in mind, it's startling, at least to me, that 60+ million Americans will vote for another 4 years of Trump. 

 

Hardly surprising is it. Statistics I discovered yesterday. In the US 25% of the population believe QAnon. Also 25% believe the Clinton pizza parlour paedophile ring story is true. A further 24% aren't sure. So basically half the population go for that.

This is a dysfunctional society detached from reality.

[Tazio]

36 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

 

Hardly surprising is it. Statistics I discovered yesterday. In the US 25% of the population believe QAnon. Also 25% believe the Clinton pizza parlour paedophile ring story is true. A further 24% aren't sure. So basically half the population go for that.

This is a dysfunctional society detached from reality.

These type of figures and the ones about how foreign countries view America really depress me. I’ve visited the US on several occasions for holidays and work and always had a good time and met good people. 

[JFK-1]

3 minutes ago, Tazio said:

These type of figures and the ones about how foreign countries view America really depress me. I’ve visited the US on several occasions for holidays and work and always had a good time and met good people. 

 

With numbers like that it's becoming difficult for me to see a way back to rationality for them even post Trump. Apparently 25% of the population think Biden is involved in a paedophile ring and a further 24% aren't sure.

How can a nation function with such levels of detachment from reality? Trump claims China want him to lose the election because he's so tough on them. Personally I don't believe that. He's ideal for them to further displace the US as a word leader.

And while Trump can't see past the last circuit of the bowl they play the long game.

[Maple Leaf]

21 minutes ago, Tazio said:

These type of figures and the ones about how foreign countries view America really depress me. I’ve visited the US on several occasions for holidays and work and always had a good time and met good people. 

 

Same here.  I've been there countless times, and even lived/worked for a year in suburban DC, and always liked the country and the people.

 

But I realised a long time ago that there are topics of conversation that foreigners like me should avoid ... religion, politics, gun control, evolution, and abortion.  With many Americans, expressing an opinion on those subjects would be like waving a red flag at a bull.

[Cade]

The Lincoln Project responds to Ivanka Trump and Jared Kushner's lawsuit for defamation over these two billboards in Times Square:

 

“The level of indignant outrage Jared Kushner and Ivanka Trump have shown towards the Lincoln Project for exposing their indifference for the more than 223,000 people who have lost their lives due to the reckless mismanagement of Covid-19 is comical."

“While we truly enjoy living rent-free in their heads, their empty threats will not be taken any more seriously than we take Ivanka and Jared.
It is unsurprising that an administration that has never had any regard or understanding of our constitution would try to trample on our first amendment rights.
But we fully intend on making this civics lesson as painful as possible.

“Jared and Ivanka have always been entitled, out-of-touch bullies, who have never given the slightest indication they have any regard for the American people.
We plan on showing them the same level of respect.
The billboards will stay up.
We consider it important that in Times Square, the crossroads of the world, people are continuously reminded of the cruelty or density and staggering lack of empathy the Trumps and the Kushners have displayed towards the American people.”

 

 

[JFK-1]

3 minutes ago, Cade said:

The Lincoln Project responds to Ivanka Trump and Jared Kushner's lawsuit for defamation over these two billboards in Times Square:

 

“The level of indignant outrage Jared Kushner and Ivanka Trump have shown towards the Lincoln Project for exposing their indifference for the more than 223,000 people who have lost their lives due to the reckless mismanagement of Covid-19 is comical."

“While we truly enjoy living rent-free in their heads, their empty threats will not be taken any more seriously than we take Ivanka and Jared.
It is unsurprising that an administration that has never had any regard or understanding of our constitution would try to trample on our first amendment rights.
But we fully intend on making this civics lesson as painful as possible.

“Jared and Ivanka have always been entitled, out-of-touch bullies, who have never given the slightest indication they have any regard for the American people.
We plan on showing them the same level of respect.
The billboards will stay up.
We consider it important that in Times Square, the crossroads of the world, people are continuously reminded of the cruelty or density and staggering lack of empathy the Trumps and the Kushners have displayed towards the American people.”

 

 

 

Ouch. Helluva slapdown and I suspect that pair are so dumb they couldn't anticipate it. Aside from the guaranteed slapdown they have probably created a Streisand effect around the billboards.

For those who don't know what the Streisand effect is.
 

Quote

The Streisand effect is a social phenomenon that occurs when an attempt to hide, remove, or censor information has the unintended consequence of further publicizing that information, often via the Internet.

It is named after American entertainer Barbra Streisand, whose attempt to suppress the California Coastal Records Project's photograph of her residence in Malibu, California, taken to document California coastal erosion, inadvertently drew further attention to it in 2003.

Attempts to suppress information are often made through cease-and-desist letters, but instead of being suppressed, the information receives extensive publicity, as well as media extensions such as videos and spoof songs, which can be mirrored on the Internet or distributed on file-sharing networks.

The Streisand effect is an example of psychological reactance, wherein once people are aware that some information is being kept from them, they are significantly more motivated to access and spread that information.

Before Streisand filed her lawsuit, "Image 3850" had been downloaded from Adelman's website only six times; two of those downloads were by Streisand's attorneys.

As a result of the case, public knowledge of the picture increased greatly; more than 420,000 people visited the site over the following month. The lawsuit was dismissed and Streisand was ordered to pay Adelman's legal fees, which amounted to $155,567.

 

[Kalamazoo Jambo]

14 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

 

Ouch. Helluva slapdown and I suspect that pair are so dumb they couldn't anticipate it. Aside from the guaranteed slapdown they have probably created a Streisand effect around the billboards.

 

They deserve it for their barbraous behavior.

[Maple Leaf]

The Lincoln Project has definitely been one of the highlights of this campaign.  If nothing else, they've proved that not all Republicans have been taken in by Trumps' lies.

[JFK-1]

Highlights of Donald Trump's Leaked Interview with '60 Minutes'

 

 

 

[Cade]

58 minutes ago, JFK-1 said:

 

Ouch. Helluva slapdown and I suspect that pair are so dumb they couldn't anticipate it. Aside from the guaranteed slapdown they have probably created a Streisand effect around the billboards.
 

 

Like when Mike Read refused to play "Relax" on Radio 1.

 

Languishing at #35, one Top of the Pops performance had them bring it up to #6, then the ban saw it hit the top spot.

For five weeks.

 

[JFK-1]

There's a prediction of a record voter turnout with an estimated 53 million having already voted as of yesterday.

 

Quote

Prof McDonald, who runs the US Elections Project, told Reuters news agency that he predicts that a record 150 million people could vote in this election - which would be about 65% of eligible voters in the country, and the highest turnout by percentage since 1908.

 

And according to Prof McDonald's data so far, the mail-in ballots are already leaning towards a Democrat majority.

 

Full BBC article containing that quote and more. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-54665375

[Jambo-Jimbo]

48 minutes ago, Cade said:

 

Like when Mike Read refused to play "Relax" on Radio 1.

 

Languishing at #35, one Top of the Pops performance had them bring it up to #6, then the ban saw it hit the top spot.

For five weeks.

 

 

I remember that, same with the Sex Pistols & God Save the Queen, ban it and it just makes it all the more popular.

 

[JFK-1]

5 minutes ago, Jambo-Jimbo said:

 

I remember that, same with the Sex Pistols & God Save the Queen, ban it and it just makes it all the more popular.

 

 

Indeed. I think if I were a new band releasing a single I would be trying to attract a BBC ban.

[JFK-1]

Well I doubt I would be too concerned. Hillary still not locked up after 4 years but this nut is becoming ever more dangerous. This kind of rhetoric instigates crazies. 
 

 

[JFK-1]

Trump Could Lose Multiple Lawsuits Because He Can't Pay His Legal Bills

 

 

 

 

[JFK-1]

Hardly surprising.

Michael Cohen Confirms Rudy Giuliani "Drunk All the Time"

 

 

 

[Boof]

14 hours ago, Maple Leaf said:

But I realised a long time ago that there are topics of conversation that foreigners like me should avoid ... religion, politics, gun control, evolution, and abortion.  With many Americans, expressing an opinion on those subjects would be like waving a red flag at a bull.

 

Why is that?

 

Can't they engage in healthy, open debate?

 

Are they so insecure that they feel the need to defend the indefensible? Continually proclaim the greatness of the U S A?

 

Are they brainwashed from youth?

[Boof]

1 hour ago, Barack said:

I frequently find the old : "Y'all ain't even from America. Keep your opinions to yourself" is a firm favourite of many.

 

Whilst voicing their own opinions upon the state of the world? Them Russkies/Chinese/muslims/queen of England (sic)..etc etc.

Some misguided sense of self-worth or self-importance? 'Waaal, shucks. I'm 'murican...course I'm the greatest at anything and everything'.

 

Note, American JKB contributors, I'm NOT lumping everyone from your, frankly (potentially) outstanding country, into the same bracket - just those who would fit into the stereotype pictured.

 

1 hour ago, Barack said:

They can't seem to grasp that people outside of their own State, never mind country, can have coherent opinions and debate on the USA and world affairs.

 

Unwillingness to see themselves as others see them?

 

1 hour ago, Barack said:

When in reality, what happens to the USA and those who run the Government, affects virtually every country on the planet, whether they like it or not.

 

Until 45 takes them so far down the shitter they do become like Venezuela.

 

1 hour ago, Barack said:

They hate it even more, when you know more about the subject than they do. That includes their own history. Of which millions are ignorant. Though, same can be said for living here too, in fairness.

 

And pretty much anywhere, I'd guess.

[Dawnrazor]

1 hour ago, Boof said:

 

Whilst voicing their own opinions upon the state.......

Pretty much like the SNP thread.

[ri Alban]

2 minutes ago, Dawnrazor said:

Pretty much like the SNP thread.

The SNP isn't the state. The Tories are. Have you actually posted on that thread? 🤔

 

 

Oh, Trump's a bellend. 

Edited October 25, 2020 by ri Alban

[Dawnrazor]

Just now, ri Alban said:

The SNP isn't the state. The Tories are. Have you actually posted on that thread? 🤔

 

 

Oh, Trump's a bellend. 

You know the point I make, same principle. 

[ri Alban]

59 minutes ago, Dawnrazor said:

You know the point I make, same principle. 

Yip, I know bud. Everything seems to be tribal now. Then I just think, Feck this, you'll(not you) do for today. 

Take the Coronavirus thread it's horrendous, and I hope no-one is actually in charge of any kids with some of their views. (I don't really care which government is fighting this, they have the facts, we don't and there is no way they've decided 2020 is the year to take away people's freedoms) 

I've had quite a number of pals(Not close) take ill lately. And now one is in proper trouble with Covid19. Folk will not learn unless it chaps on their door and that can be too late. 

Enjoy your deer stovies. 👍

 

 

[Dawnrazor]

3 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

Yip, I know bud. Everything seems to be tribal now. Then I just think, Feck this, you'll(not you) do for today. 

Take the Coronavirus thread it's horrendous, and I hope no-one is actually in charge of any kids with some of their views. (I don't really care which government is fighting this, they have the facts, we don't and there is no way they've decided 2020 is the year to take away people's freedoms) 

I've had quite a number of pals(Not close) take ill lately. And now one is in proper trouble with Covid19. Folk will not learn unless it chaps on their door and that can be too late. 

Enjoy your deer stovies. 👍

 

 

👍

[Maple Leaf]

5 hours ago, Boof said:

 

Why is that?

 

Can't they engage in healthy, open debate?

 

Are they so insecure that they feel the need to defend the indefensible? Continually proclaim the greatness of the U S A?

 

Are they brainwashed from youth?

 

On the subjects I mentioned ...  religion, politics, gun control, evolution, and abortion ... for many in the US, there is only one right position to take, and those people are unwilling to listen to any other viewpoint.  In fact, any other viewpoint is offensive to them.  I should say that almost all of the people I'm referring to call themselves conservatives.  I believe it's because they were raised in a family where their beliefs were firmly held. 

 

For example, if one is daft enough to say "I think gun violence is out of hand and there should be gun controls", or "I think a woman should get an abortion in the first three months of pregnancy just by asking for it," or "Humans are descended from earlier creatures through a process called evolution," at the very minimum you are likely to get into a loud argument.

 

Ten years ago I would have added gay rights to that list, but those attitudes have softened a bit.  Still a long way to go though.

[Boof]

1 minute ago, Maple Leaf said:

 I believe it's because they were raised in a family where their beliefs were firmly held. 

 

Would it be that much of a leap, then, to equate that sort of upbringing to some sort of fundamental ideology?

 

Is it that far removed from the way that so-called muslim fundamentalists are brought up? Those muslims that receive widespread condemnation amongst the Trumpian following? 

[Maple Leaf]

3 minutes ago, Boof said:

 

Would it be that much of a leap, then, to equate that sort of upbringing to some sort of fundamental ideology?

 

Is it that far removed from the way that so-called muslim fundamentalists are brought up? Those muslims that receive widespread condemnation amongst the Trumpian following? 

 

No and no, imo.

 

Having said that, I know very little about Islam.

[Boof]

I appreciate the responses.

 

I'm not really expecting to get a definitive answer - more musing 'out loud'.

[Tazio]

13 minutes ago, Boof said:

 

Would it be that much of a leap, then, to equate that sort of upbringing to some sort of fundamental ideology?

 

Is it that far removed from the way that so-called muslim fundamentalists are brought up? Those muslims that receive widespread condemnation amongst the Trumpian following? 

I’ve often thought that way, such as an American flag in a classroom is patriotic, a soviet flag in a classroom was seen as state controlled brainwashing. American athletes thanking God after winning is good, Muslim athletes thanking Allah is fanaticism. 

[Kalamazoo Jambo]

 

 

Nothing to see here - just the White House Chief of Staff giving up on controlling the virus.
 

 

[redjambo]

28 minutes ago, Barack said:

Biden campaign's got it's ad for the remaining 9 nights. Played frequently, but mostly in swing states.

 

I envisage them hoping that whatever their final figures are in death's, once they leave office*(*assuming a loss) that Biden won't be able to contain it until a vaccine is introduced.

 

They'll be privately wishing for high numbers to use against them. And if by chance a vaccine occurs in the next year, hopefully; they'll take credit for that. In the same way they have for ObamaCare & the mythical replacement they've not developed.

 

Covid is where the real "riot" may come from if Biden wins. Biden gets in and encourages state and local officials to mandate mask wearing. Some areas which hadn't done so, now do so. Local anti-maskers react badly and other right-wingers pile in. Conflict and chaos reigns (which the right would love as they would say that it shows that Biden can't hold the country together).

[Lone Striker]

6 hours ago, Boof said:

 

Why is that?

 

Can't they engage in healthy, open debate?

 

Are they so insecure that they feel the need to defend the indefensible? Continually proclaim the greatness of the U S A?

 

Are they brainwashed from youth?

Basically.... yes.  Not sure if it's still part of the curriculum in all or some states, but each morning assembly in primary schools used to include everyone joining in the national anthem and the shared  rendition of a prayer/poem  pledging allegiance to the president, the flag and "freedom".    Most white kids probably cling on to that attitude in later life, while most  blacks and hispanics probably rebel to some degree - which in turn re-inforces and justifies the racial divisions.

 

I often wonder (as many posters have mentioned) what is behind the stubbornness of many Americans to just wrap themselves in the flag and adopt an unquestioning nationalist view of everything.   Is it something to do with the USA being a young country, founded by white incomers from Europe whose pioneering spirit is now revered and celebrated ?       A willing blindness by many  to sweep under the carpet the  inhumane sins which took place along the way (plight of the oppressed  native American indians  ....  and  widespread slavery of captured Africans)  ?            Is the hatred of "socialism"  (previously it was communism)  a view that is only held by wealthy whites ?     

 

Completely weird and unfathomable

[Tazio]

1 minute ago, Lone Striker said:

Basically.... yes.  Not sure if it's still part of the curriculum in all or some states, but each morning assembly in primary schools used to include everyone joining in the national anthem and the shared  rendition of a prayer/poem  pledging allegiance to the president, the flag and "freedom".    

 

This is what I was alluding to earlier on, if that was presented in a film in a Middle Eastern, or communist country in the past, it would be presented as fanaticism and brainwashing. A very real lack of self awareness by many in the USA, but obviously not all. 
 

 

[Eldar Hadzimehmedovic]

2 hours ago, Tazio said:

I’ve often thought that way, such as an American flag in a classroom is patriotic, a soviet flag in a classroom was seen as state controlled brainwashing. American athletes thanking God after winning is good, Muslim athletes thanking Allah is fanaticism. 

 

Spot on. 

[redjambo]

3 minutes ago, Eldar Hadzimehmedovic said:

 

Spot on. 

 

I often judge how confident a country is in itself by the number of flags I see fluttering in that country. There's less need for nationalism and patriotic pride when you're just confident that your country is working well.

[Eldar Hadzimehmedovic]

Just now, redjambo said:

 

I often judge how confident a country is in itself by the number of flags I see fluttering in that country. There's less need for nationalism and patriotic pride when you're just confident that your country is working well.

 

Totally. 

 

American exceptionalism was fine in the middle of the last century when they were booming and it really was a place where anyone could make it - apart from black people of course but they didn't give a shit about that. Since the 80s when they began to gut education and siphon off all wealth to the richest, it's been a disaster. The problem they're finding now is that the poor, uneducated white people who have been deliberately left behind still believe they live in the greatest country ever. It's emboldened them to be absolute dicks. 

[Tazio]

1 minute ago, redjambo said:

 

I often judge how confident a country is in itself by the number of flags I see fluttering in that country. There's less need for nationalism and patriotic pride when you're just confident that your country is working well.

I always relate that to when I travelled across the USA from coast to coast a few years ago. Leaving California where there were hardly any flags, seeing the number increase in each town and state then them starting to thin out again as I approached New York. The patriotic heartland indeed. 

[Justin Z]

5 hours ago, Dawnrazor said:

Pretty much like the SNP thread.

 

💘

[JFK-1]

A new poll by The Dallas Morning News and the University of Texas at Tyler shows former Vice President Joe Biden leading President Trump by three points in Texas, a state that hasn’t voted for a Democrat for president since 1976.

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/522657-dallas-morning-news-poll-shows-biden-leading-trump-in-texas

[redjambo]

Just now, JFK-1 said:

A new poll by The Dallas Morning News and the University of Texas at Tyler shows former Vice President Joe Biden leading President Trump by three points in Texas, a state that hasn’t voted for a Democrat for president since 1976.

https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/522657-dallas-morning-news-poll-shows-biden-leading-trump-in-texas

 

The polls in Texas have been more favourable to Trump though. I did half-joke earlier on that I thought Biden would take Texas, but it's probably a bridge too far for him. Taking Florida should be enough.