U.S. Politics megathread (merged)

[redjambo]

10 minutes ago, JackLadd said:

Sleazebag liar Kavanaugh gets FBI Investigation. One week. 

 

Yes, but do you think he's telling the truth?

[redjambo]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/world-us-canada-45682267

 

[milky_26]

vote goes 11-10 for kavanaugh

[Don Dan]

22 minutes ago, JackLadd said:

Sleazebag liar Kavanaugh gets FBI Investigation. One week. 

 

That fact amazed me that he was still in post after, according to Democrat Senators he’d told “untruths” if that is the case why wasn’t he punted for hold judicial posts and allowed to teach law. To be honest I’m struggling to believe anything any of them say. 

[Mark M]

On 26 September 2018 at 23:58, Barack said:

Ma man...

 

The first man to combine uselessness/ incompetence and effortless cool. Continues to make the cosmopolitan class feel good about themselves though and could do them a mean secular Sunday Sermon.

[Mark M]

Eminently  likeable. I like him. I like his books. We probably like the same movies. But if the past two yrs have shown us anything it is that the  chattering class don't like it up em. 

[Ulysses]

7 hours ago, Craig Gordons Gloves said:

Alfa - what did you see/hear that makes you form the opinion that her testimony was a train wreck and his blew all allegations out the water?

 

The Bible.  Just saying. 

[Ulysses]

3 hours ago, redjambo said:

For me, I have no clue whether or not Christine Ford is lying. But what I do know is that other witnesses need to be called and all the allegations properly examined. The position is too important to warrant otherwise.

 

 

 

I thought Christine Ford's testimony had credibility, but mainly because I couldn't see why she'd put herself through the experience unless she really had a story to tell.

 

Kavanaugh, on the other hand, 100% convinced me he was lying.  He made a better witness for her than she did.

[Ulysses]

1 hour ago, Barack said:

 

 

 

One can't say what one really thinks because otherwise one will get banned from JKB and shunned by respectable society, so one will pretend it's all about metropolitan elites and libtards.

 

Just asking questions, as one might say. 

[Ulysses]

5 minutes ago, Barack said:

Touch of the TH's going on. One might say...

 

I'll take a PM.     

[Watt-Zeefuik]

I went to a private middle school for a few years (long story), and I went to an elite private liberal arts college. I know Kavanaugh;'s type -- I don't know as many Harvard/Yale types, but I know the Georgetown Prep types (I might even know a few alums, if I look at my Facebook page in depth). And I hate his type -- and yes, his type are often rapists. They're all faith and family and duty until you get a few drinks in them and then suddenly they're bragging about their sexual exploits and affairs and all kinds of other ugliness comes out.

 

I entered the week thinking Kavanaugh was another Gorsuch type, and thinking Dr. Ford had the right to be heard and taken seriously but not having an opinion about whether she was credible. After this week, two things are utterly doubtless -- one, Dr. Ford was assaulted, and almost certain by Kavanaugh; two, Kavanaugh is a petty, immature compulsive liar who is completely unfit for the court regardless of what he did or didn't do in his teens (for a breakdown: https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2018/09/28/heres-where-kavanaughs-sworn-testimony-was-misleading-or-wrong/).

Edited September 29, 2018 by Ugly American
Auto-linking quit working for me, edited to fix

[Maple Leaf]

1 hour ago, Ugly American said:

I went to a private middle school for a few years (long story), and I went to an elite private liberal arts college. I know Kavanaugh;'s type -- I don't know as many Harvard/Yale types, but I know the Georgetown Prep types (I might even know a few alums, if I look at my Facebook page in depth). And I hate his type -- and yes, his type are often rapists. They're all faith and family and duty until you get a few drinks in them and then suddenly they're bragging about their sexual exploits and affairs and all kinds of other ugliness comes out.

 

I entered the week thinking Kavanaugh was another Gorsuch type, and thinking Dr. Ford had the right to be heard and taken seriously but not having an opinion about whether she was credible. After this week, two things are utterly doubtless -- one, Dr. Ford was assaulted, and almost certain by Kavanaugh; two, Kavanaugh is a petty, immature compulsive liar who is completely unfit for the court regardless of what he did or didn't do in his teens (for a breakdown: https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2018/09/28/heres-where-kavanaughs-sworn-testimony-was-misleading-or-wrong/).

 

Kavanaugh is a snivelling wretch of a man who has obvious, glaring biases. There's also enough evidence to suggest that he is, probably, a serial liar and it's appalling that he will be appointed to the SCOTUS.  But he's the Republican champion and they will ram his appointment through.  Party ideology before country.

 

The USA is fecked for decades to come, except for people who want a hard-core Christian theocracy.   

[Sharpie]

21 minutes ago, Maple Leaf said:

 

Kavanaugh is a snivelling wretch of a man who has obvious, glaring biases. There's also enough evidence to suggest that he is, probably, a serial liar and it's appalling that he will be appointed to the SCOTUS.  But he's the Republican champion and they will ram his appointment through.  Party ideology before country.

 

The USA is fecked for decades to come, except for people who want a hard-core Christian theocracy.   

 

I am not sure if one should be too optimistic, but, his school pal Judge is according to his lawyer willing to cooperate with F.B.I.  His lawyer may have advised him that they could tell fibs in a letter although subject to prosecution, but face to face with a Fed may be a bit different. Kavanaugh may be considering his options, Trump stating on tv that the woman was credible may be a clue to his traditional waivering loyalty, he must also realise when it looks like the ship may go down Trump will be first in the lifeboat, and if he can arrange it probably the last. With the fact that Kavanaugh possibly believed that Trump would protect him, never

believed that there would ever be any kind of F.B.I investigation. I would hope that he may consider getting out is better than taking any chances, and withdraw.

Some of the organisations he stated that thought highly of him have refuted these claims, he is unfortunately for him looks like he is being abandoned.  I don't like the man, which is being kind, quite unfairly really but I just didn't like his face and his smile for some reason bothered me he always had a look I though of arrogance, conveying that everything was a farce, and why would they need to interview him. Ihave a high level of empathy for his parents, who must have been so proud of their son, to have him identified for what he is must be terrible. His wife on the other hand must have seen some of his lesser complimentary things, and she will have to live with it. The whole thing is a tragedy to all involved, and particularly the American people, and the truth is you can blame it all on one man, and its not Kavanaugh.

[Joey J J Jr Shabadoo]

That kavanaugh looks like a snivelling, bible bashing, rapist. Trump's the same, not a bible basher, but desperate for their vote. It's unbelievable the US has ended up with those two beasts in high office. 

[Steve_Jersey_HMFC]

As a lawyer I’ve Always hated how political the judiciary is in US, always makes you realize how lucky we are in England and Wales, Scotland, Northern Ireland and where I am in Jersey to have unbiased apolitical judges whose appointments are not the farce you have in US. 

 

As for Kavanaugh he doesnt seem credible and as others have said he was Dr Fords best witness, but a senate appointment committee isn’t the place to have a de facto criminal hearing 

[jake]

15 minutes ago, Steve_Jersey_HMFC said:

As a lawyer I’ve Always hated how political the judiciary is in US, always makes you realize how lucky we are in England and Wales, Scotland, Northern Ireland and where I am in Jersey to have unbiased apolitical judges whose appointments are not the farce you have in US. 

 

As for Kavanaugh he doesnt seem credible and as others have said he was Dr Fords best witness, but a senate appointment committee isn’t the place to have a de facto criminal hearing 

Mmm.

The judiciary in the UK much like it's politicians I suspect are all Oxbridge.

 

That's political no?

[Steve_Jersey_HMFC]

1 hour ago, jake said:

Mmm.

The judiciary in the UK much like it's politicians I suspect are all Oxbridge.

 

That's political no?

 

Not all judges in the 3 legal jurisdictions of the UK are Oxbridge, even if they were that's academic background not politics. Some of them may be more right wing in their views, some more left wing. The beauty is not knowing what their views are. It also helps that social issues like abortion, gay marriage etc aren't litigated as much in UK as the US, and when they are it doesn't come down to what is effectively a political vote in the US Sup Ct

[jake]

1 hour ago, Steve_Jersey_HMFC said:

 

Not all judges in the 3 legal jurisdictions of the UK are Oxbridge, even if they were that's academic background not politics. Some of them may be more right wing in their views, some more left wing. The beauty is not knowing what their views are. It also helps that social issues like abortion, gay marriage etc aren't litigated as much in UK as the US, and when they are it doesn't come down to what is effectively a political vote in the US Sup Ct

Granted the US is bi partisan.

 

UK judges who attended Oxbridge make up 71%.

And although you say that's an academic background it's highly likely they have a conservative mindset.

 

But yes I concede the US is more political .

[Steve_Jersey_HMFC]

1 hour ago, jake said:

Granted the US is bi partisan.

 

UK judges who attended Oxbridge make up 71%.

And although you say that's an academic background it's highly likely they have a conservative mindset.

 

But yes I concede the US is more political .

 

I can see your reason for assuming that those from an Oxbridge background might have a conservative mindset but that doesn’t square with media headlines which often attack judges as being bleeding heart liberals who don’t put peadophiles behind bars for long enough or are “enemies of the people” for interpreting the constitution and not blindly agreeing with the Government’s assertions over its powers to execute brexit without parliament. 

 

 

[Justin Z]

18 hours ago, Cade said:

Any nation which has politically appointed judges is a basket case.

The Judiciary should be kept totally separate from the Executive and the Legislature, unbiased and apolitical.

 

The USA is a ridiculous nation.

 

Ehm

 

How precisely would justices get to be on the Supreme Court if not put there by a political process? By vote!?

 

Elected judges are an absolute nightmare, because--surprise--they're necessarily political. They do things on the bench to get reelected instead of being fair and impartial, the exact things judges are supposed to be.

 

The confirmation process didn't used to be partisan, which is the problem, even though it has always been political. Lifetime appointments means insulation from politics, even if the process to reach them is a political one. States which vote in their judges are the basketcases, so if you think it's bad now, you'd only multiply the issue tenfold by making this a popularity contest.

[Justin Z]

7 minutes ago, Steve_Jersey_HMFC said:

 

I can see your reason for assuming that those from an Oxbridge background might have a conservative mindset but that doesn’t square with media headlines which often attack judges as being bleeding heart liberals who don’t put peadophiles behind bars for long enough or are “enemies of the people” for interpreting the constitution and not blindly agreeing with the Government’s assertions over its powers to execute brexit without parliament.

 

 

That's an issue with media headlines, not judges.

[Justin Z]

16 hours ago, Barack said:

Flake chucks a spanner in it though. Only voted yes, with proviso an FBI investigation is forthcoming 

 

If they don't, he'll blatantly vote against in the full Senate vote. 

 

[Justin Z]

17 hours ago, Dannie Boy said:

 

Is she lying, no idea but if you listen to the Senators  a few things jump out. Opportunist revelation of the alleged incident but only when it suited the Democrats. 3 witnesses contradict the Ford testimony. Why wait 35 years to come forward which now means Ford can’t remember where it happened or exactly when it happened. The sad thing is Ford and the  allegation along with the other allegations have become a battle between Left and Right. 

 

I'd like to respectfully request that you engage your brain on this particular aspect of this issue a bit more. Here is some guidance.

 

[Scnorthedinburgh]

17 hours ago, Dannie Boy said:

 

Is she lying, no idea but if you listen to the Senators  a few things jump out. Opportunist revelation of the alleged incident but only when it suited the Democrats. 3 witnesses contradict the Ford testimony. Why wait 35 years to come forward which now means Ford can’t remember where it happened or exactly when it happened. The sad thing is Ford and the  allegation along with the other allegations have become a battle between Left and Right. 

You fall for one of their tricks there.

On numerous occasions they have stated that 3 witnesses contradict her.

That is a lie. The 3 witnesses said they could not remember being at a party like that.

Not contradiction anything.

Yet the reps. Got away with saying they did.

[Don Dan]

1 hour ago, Justin Z said:

 

I'd like to respectfully request that you engage your brain on this particular aspect of this issue a bit more. Here is some guidance.

 

 

As I say why wait assault is assault and should be dealt with. The fact that the accused is running for high office should not be the starting point, especially after many years.

 

[Don Dan]

1 hour ago, Scnorthedinburgh said:

You fall for one of their tricks there.

On numerous occasions they have stated that 3 witnesses contradict her.

That is a lie. The 3 witnesses said they could not remember being at a party like that.

Not contradiction anything.

Yet the reps. Got away with saying they did.

 

Well to me that’s a contradiction. The party involved sexual activity. The party did not involve sexual activity. Ford said it did they said it didn’t. To me that’s contradicting a claim.

Not proven.

 

the thing is if this did happen and  Ford did not report it that something may we’ll have happened to others. Speak up it may not be proven but will help build a picture of someone’s behaviour. Don’t sit on it for 35 years.

 

Edited September 29, 2018 by Dannie Boy

[Justin Z]

6 minutes ago, Dannie Boy said:

 

As I say why wait assault is assault and should be dealt with. The fact that the accused is running for high office should not be the starting point, especially after many years.

 

 

I think a review of what's being said about this woman now, with an actual attempt at empathy and good faith desire to understand, would satisfy the question "why wait?".

 

The question usually, of course, is "why never report?", because 99.999% of sexual assault victims who don't report their assaults aren't going to ever see the man who assaulted them going up for a position of power like Supreme Court justice. The answers to that question are many and varied, and most involve not wanting to re-live something that was already a real-life nightmare to one extent or another. You shouldn't need me to tell you that.

 

But you're going to have to stop being reactionary and actually try to understand . . . in order to understand.

[Justin Z]

Also, the standard for a successful nomination and appointment to the Supreme Court is not "reasonable doubt" or "proven/not proven". For criminal liability, sure it is. This is not a criminal trial.

 

 

Edited September 29, 2018 by Justin Z

[Ulysses]

10 minutes ago, Dannie Boy said:

 

As I say why wait assault is assault and should be dealt with. The fact that the accused is running for high office should not be the starting point, especially after many years.

 

 

A lot of sexual assault victims don't report at the time - in fact, more don't than do.

 

I don't see how blaming her for reporting now helps.  I don't see how blaming a victim does anything but make things worse.

[Don Dan]

5 minutes ago, Justin Z said:

Also, the standard for a successful nomination and appointment to the Supreme Court is not "reasonable doubt" or "proven/not proven". For criminal liability, sure it is. This is not a criminal trial.

 

 

 

Im being objective here and question the motive. 

Why wait? How many others over the years and around that time suffer sexual assault? If Ford and the others who said that this was a regular occurrence as has been claimed then Kavanaugh would have been nowhere near law never mind a judge or teaching law.

I have no idea if speaking up then might have stopped it. We’ll never know sadly. 

 

Im walking to the game now so it’s difficult to type think and walk ?

lets see see what the FBI come up with.

 

[Don Dan]

14 minutes ago, Ulysses said:

 

A lot of sexual assault victims don't report at the time - in fact, more don't than do.

 

I don't see how blaming her for reporting now helps.  I don't see how blaming a victim does anything but make things worse.

 

If anything I’m blaming her for not reporting at the time. She has carried that with her (if true) for years with little or no closure. 

Let me say this if it is true then Kavanaugh deserves all he gets. 

Ford and Kavanaugh’s family will be the victims in all this. A victim devastated for her life so far and a family having to come to terms with the fact their father and husband is or was a sexual predator.

 

[Justin Z]

I think you believe you're being objective, but in my view, you're not.

 

Enjoy the game. Maybe have a read of this, which just popped up for me serendipitously, this evening.

 

Christine Blasey Ford's decades-long silence is no anomaly. I know, because I did the same

 

'Most victims of sexual assault will tell you that this is perfectly understandable. Like I say, you bury it deep. You don’t want it to blight your life, you don’t want to be defined by it, you don’t want people to see how much you blame yourself: “I shouldn’t have been there”, “I should have fought harder”, “I led him on”. You blame yourself because it seems so utterly unreal that another human being would want to harm you – hurt you when you have done nothing to harm them.'

[Don Dan]

11 minutes ago, Justin Z said:

I think you believe you're being objective, but in my view, you're not.

 

Enjoy the game. Maybe have a read of this, which just popped up for me serendipitously, this evening.

 

Christine Blasey Ford's decades-long silence is no anomaly. I know, because I did the same

 

'Most victims of sexual assault will tell you that this is perfectly understandable. Like I say, you bury it deep. You don’t want it to blight your life, you don’t want to be defined by it, you don’t want people to see how much you blame yourself: “I shouldn’t have been there”, “I should have fought harder”, “I led him on”. You blame yourself because it seems so utterly unreal that another human being would want to harm you – hurt you when you have done nothing to harm them.'

 

Thanks Justin ?

[Maple Leaf]

19 minutes ago, Dannie Boy said:

 

Im being objective here and question the motive. 

Why wait? How many others over the years and around that time suffer sexual assault? If Ford and the others who said that this was a regular occurrence as has been claimed then Kavanaugh would have been nowhere near law never mind a judge or teaching law.

I have no idea if speaking up then might have stopped it. We’ll never know sadly. 

 

Im walking to the game now so it’s difficult to type think and walk ?

lets see see what the FBI come up with.

 

 

You ask, "Why wait?"  How about embarrassment, shame, humiliation?

 

A person close to me was sexually assaulted as a child, on numerous occasions, by someone she trusted.  That was years ago and she never told anyone.  She was determined to take her secret to the grave, for the reasons I've given above.  Two years ago circumstances changed and she reported the matter to the police.  The perpetrator is now in jail.

 

Dr. Ford is not the person who should be scrutinised here, it's Kavanaugh.  In my opinion she is credible and he is a liar.

[Justin Z]

Another point which is getting lost amidst the sexual assault allegations--you can take those away, and he's still not a suitable nominee.

 

So let's do that. Not even taking the assault allegations into account: He came out trying to paint himself as a choir boy, and this has been shown to have been bare-faced lying. If he'd just have said "well, I had some wild days when I was younger, I'd like to think most of us do and I'd hope that wouldn't disqualify me now," I think any reasonable person could have said "fair enough". But he didn't. Instead he lied. Basically, he lied about something he didn't even need to lie about. Subsequently, he's been shown to have been lying about all sorts of other things, including perjuring himself before Congress on two different occasions--or if you're being extra charitable or a Republican politician, he "gave imprecise testimony".

 

So if he'll lie about the insignificant, little things, he's definitely going to lie about things that matter (and he's already been shown to have done that too). That alone is sufficient to show he's not fit to be a Justice of the Supreme Court, before we even get into everything else.

It's also telling that we had absolutely nothing like this going on with Neil Gorsuch's (stolen) nomination and confirmation. If all this is fabricated, why not for him? Occam's Razor answers that one pretty nicely.

[Sharpie]

Put aside all the reasons for the recent Hearing, just look at his conduct at the meeting. He acted with an air of I am a Yale trained lawyer, now a judge, possibly soon to be a Supreme Court Judge, ask your stupid questions, and I will give you stupid answers because that is what I think of you. What are you a bunch of elected officials you have only proved you can't get a better job anywhere else, especially the numerous lawyers amongst you. His response to questions about his beer drinking and passing out to one Senator was "do you". He explained his strong liking for  beer and answered a questioning Senator with "do you".  I have done many job interviews and asked questions related to drugs alcohol amongst others, if any applicant had responded to me with the arrogance, insult, lack of respect he showed to the elected body seeking answers, my applicant and I would both have been looking for jobs, and I would probably be looking for a lawyer to represent me in my assault case.

His anger, emotion, feeling of being subject to a conspiracy, are all feelings that anyone being questioned naturally feels, but the average, and he claims to be above average handle this at the time, and release any pent up feelings privately. Remove Professor Ford from the full equation other than she was the stimulus, but for me Kavanaugh has proved himself unworthy and too biased politically to hold such a responsible position for so long into the future.

[J.T.F.Robertson]

Methinks Brett's "god" on this earth is more important to him than the one he claims to hold in such high esteem.

 

 

[Justin Z]

 

 

 

[Don Dan]

2 hours ago, Justin Z said:

Another point which is getting lost amidst the sexual assault allegations--you can take those away, and he's still not a suitable nominee.

 

So let's do that. Not even taking the assault allegations into account: He came out trying to paint himself as a choir boy, and this has been shown to have been bare-faced lying. If he'd just have said "well, I had some wild days when I was younger, I'd like to think most of us do and I'd hope that wouldn't disqualify me now," I think any reasonable person could have said "fair enough". But he didn't. Instead he lied. Basically, he lied about something he didn't even need to lie about. Subsequently, he's been shown to have been lying about all sorts of other things, including perjuring himself before Congress on two different occasions--or if you're being extra charitable or a Republican politician, he "gave imprecise testimony".

 

So if he'll lie about the insignificant, little things, he's definitely going to lie about things that matter (and he's already been shown to have done that too). That alone is sufficient to show he's not fit to be a Justice of the Supreme Court, before we even get into everything else.

It's also telling that we had absolutely nothing like this going on with Neil Gorsuch's (stolen) nomination and confirmation. If all this is fabricated, why not for him? Occam's Razor answers that one pretty nicely.

 

If he’s lied and a proven liar which he is. He should step back and say sorry I’m not a suitable person. 

[Watt-Zeefuik]

2 hours ago, Justin Z said:

 

 

 

 

[JackLadd]

It is an odd country the U.S; despite being founded on classical and enlightened French Western principals it is also a patriarchal society that Islam would approve of. They treat woman like second class citizens but the political partisanship runs so deep that a lot of woman go along with it. Weird place. Kavanaugh would be past tense anywhere else. 

Edited September 29, 2018 by JackLadd

[Maple Leaf]

4 hours ago, Justin Z said:

 

 

 

 

Outstanding!!! 

[Mark M]

42 minutes ago, JackLadd said:

It is an odd country the U.S; despite being founded on classical and enlightened French Western principals it is also a patriarchal society that Islam would approve of. They treat woman like second class citizens but the political partisanship runs so deep that a lot of woman go along with it. Weird place. Kavanaugh would be past tense anywhere else. 

 

Not caving to mobs in the absence of evidence is your hallmark of enlightened western principles here. Rule of law and presumption of innocence.  

 

And for what it's worth, a former Miss Baghdad was gunned down yesterday for protesting actual Handmaid's Talesque patriarchy. They are not the same.

 

In fact there are few places as good in human history to be a woman as USA 2018.

[The Real Maroonblood]

6 hours ago, Justin Z said:

 

 

 

[redjambo]

1 hour ago, Mark M said:

 

Not caving to mobs in the absence of evidence is your hallmark of enlightened western principles here. Rule of law and presumption of innocence.  

 

And for what it's worth, a former Miss Baghdad was gunned down yesterday for protesting actual Handmaid's Talesque patriarchy. They are not the same.

 

In fact there are few places as good in human history to be a woman as USA 2018.

 

Here's the country-by-country data. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/17xsCvAb3BuOgmcRM7KEOIVJcIDdmzdA3K387CuSNUTM/edit#gid=9

 

How's that federal US legal right to paid maternity leave thing working out, for example?  (clue: it isn't, there is none)

 

And here's a nice table. You're 16th. Not bad! But not really living up to the excitement of your last sentence.

 

https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/women-full-list

 

The person you were replying to was obviously incorrect. Particularly with the "Kavanaugh would be past tense anywhere else" milarky - no he wouldn't be in many other countries in the world.There are numerous countries in this world where woman are treated abysmally. But that doesn't make the States a beacon of light in that regard. You still have a lot to do.

Edited September 29, 2018 by redjambo

[ri Alban]

I thought it was shite. 

[Mark M]

8 hours ago, redjambo said:

 

Here's the country-by-country data. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/17xsCvAb3BuOgmcRM7KEOIVJcIDdmzdA3K387CuSNUTM/edit#gid=9

 

How's that federal US legal right to paid maternity leave thing working out, for example?  (clue: it isn't, there is none)

 

And here's a nice table. You're 16th. Not bad! But not really living up to the excitement of your last sentence.

 

https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/women-full-list

 

The person you were replying to was obviously incorrect. Particularly with the "Kavanaugh would be past tense anywhere else" milarky - no he wouldn't be in many other countries in the world.There are numerous countries in this world where woman are treated abysmally. But that doesn't make the States a beacon of light in that regard. You still have a lot to do.

 

16th pretty much supports what I said. And most of the countries ahead are not like for like. They are small ,largely cultural homogenous ones where it's easy to implement policies. 

 

Appreciate  you bringing data to the table again for what it's worth. 

Edited September 30, 2018 by Mark M

[redjambo]

6 minutes ago, Mark M said:

 

16th pretty much supports what I said. And most of the countries ahead are not like for like. They are small ,largely cultural homogenous ones where it's easy to implement policies. 

 

Appreciate  you bringing data to the table again for what it's worth. 

 

Appreciation always has great worth.

[Ulysses]

4 hours ago, redjambo said:

 

Appreciation always has great worth.

 

But data makes Mark M sad.  Don't do that again. 

[Scnorthedinburgh]

On 29/09/2018 at 14:02, Dannie Boy said:

 

Well to me that’s a contradiction. The party involved sexual activity. The party did not involve sexual activity. Ford said it did they said it didn’t. To me that’s contradicting a claim.

Not proven.

 

the thing is if this did happen and  Ford did not report it that something may we’ll have happened to others. Speak up it may not be proven but will help build a picture of someone’s behaviour. Don’t sit on it for 35 years.

 

No they did not say they were at the party, they could not remember any party.

So they could not contradict or for that matter confirm anything about the issue.

But the reps still say it does and you like many buy it.