U.S. Politics megathread (merged)

[luckydug]

Theresa May getting ready to sook up to Trump .I suppose we need the business at any price now that we have no friends left in Europe. Of course Tory governments have no morals anyway so it's no surprise.

[Space Mackerel]

Theresa May getting ready to sook up to Trump .I suppose we need the business at any price now that we have no friends left in Europe. Of course Tory governments have no morals anyway so it's no surprise.

Maggie May giving up 500 millionpeople fair trading policy and then going cap in hand to get her ***** grabbed for $10 and a fumble in the White House :-/

[Thunderstruck]

What is your point Thunder?

What you're saying is that Brexit and Trump have piggied back of a proper social democratic movement but didn't have a clue what their social and democratic movement was about?

 

Post the Tories Brexit White Paper please? The media and the public want to know your plans.

Are you honestly saying that Salmond never used Greed and Grievance to influence voters.

 

Are you saying he never used the "hated Tories" mantra or touted a gross misrepresentation of oil wealth and "secret" oilfields? Two small but well-recognised examples.

 

Here's a wee tip -don't use Salmond or Sturgeon saying "hated Tories" as a cue in a drinking game. You will be on a liver transplant waiting list in next to no time.

[The Real Maroonblood]

Theresa May getting ready to sook up to Trump .I suppose we need the business at any price now that we have no friends left in Europe. Of course Tory governments have no morals anyway so it's no surprise.

The special relationship.

What a lot of shite.

[Nookie Bear]

Theresa May getting ready to sook up to Trump .I suppose we need the business at any price now that we have no friends left in Europe. Of course Tory governments have no morals anyway so it's no surprise.

What do you expect her to do? Tell Trump to stuff his trade, knowing he would react in the same way he is with Mexico?

 

Trump will be away in four years, but trade goes on forever and May can't jeopardise the long term just to make some sort of moral point.

[AlphonseCapone]

What do you expect her to do? Tell Trump to stuff his trade, knowing he would react in the same way he is with Mexico?

 

Trump will be away in four years, but trade goes on forever and May can't jeopardise the long term just to make some sort of moral point.

Fair and pragmatic approach. But she should cut out the soundbites where she talks about adhering to our values etc. Money is valued, that's about it.

[The Real Maroonblood]

Fair and pragmatic approach. But she should cut out the soundbites where she talks about adhering to our values etc. Money is valued, that's about it.

As long as she rolls over and let's Trump tickle her belly everything will be fine.

[Nookie Bear]

Fair and pragmatic approach. But she should cut out the soundbites where she talks about adhering to our values etc. Money is valued, that's about it.

Definitely. But that kind of talk is just cheap show for the crowd and I would hope she is a bit more blunt behind the scenes.

[Thunderstruck]

Theresa May getting ready to sook up to Trump .I suppose we need the business at any price now that we have no friends left in Europe. Of course Tory governments have no morals anyway so it's no surprise.

Wee Nicky will be over there as quickly as a Ferret up a drainpipe - if she ever gets an invitation. Hypocrisy is not limited to the Tories.

[Nookie Bear]

Wee Nicky will be over there as quickly as a Ferret up a drainpipe - if she ever gets an invitation. Hypocrisy is not limited to the Tories.

To be fair, Trump is half-Scottish so it makes sense to take advantage of that strong bond !

[Francis Albert]

Theresa May getting ready to sook up to Trump .I suppose we need the business at any price now that we have no friends left in Europe. Of course Tory governments have no morals anyway so it's no surprise.

Governments of all persuasions have for decades sooked up to despotic regimes in the Middle East and Asia despite having "friends" in Europe. Including regimes which condoned the stoning to death of women adulterers. But hey the Donald has done much worse I suppose.

[doctor jambo]

In the words of Trump, everything and everyone is "tremendous" Coal workers, car workers, steel workers, all his appointees etc etc

I'm sure he 'll have his radio show in 6 months.

I love the fact that the Left wingers come on here and lambast Trump for protecting the coal industry, steel industry and manufacturing,

Whilst simultaneously despising Thatcher for destroying the coal industry, steel industry and manufacturing

Good on him for his stance on these things

If a politician stepped up in Scotland and said they would protect these things here they would be lauded as a left wing hero

[AlphonseCapone]

I love the fact that the Left wingers come on here and lambast Trump for protecting the coal industry, steel industry and manufacturing,

Whilst simultaneously despising Thatcher for destroying the coal industry, steel industry and manufacturing

Good on him for his stance on these things

If a politician stepped up in Scotland and said they would protect these things here they would be lauded as a left wing hero

Your generalising of the left shows you up tbh. It's not one cohesive movement, it has many strands. As does the right. To try to paint it as one says more about your biases than anything else really.

[Unknown user]

Your generalising of the left shows you up tbh. It's not one cohesive movement, it has many strands. As does the right. To try to paint it as one says more about your biases than anything else really.

Succinctly put

[Nookie Bear]

Your generalising of the left shows you up tbh. It's not one cohesive movement, it has many strands. As does the right. To try to paint it as one says more about your biases than anything else really.

The same could be saiD about the right as well, surely? It is not one cohesive group either.

 

From where you are stand,how would you respond to the point that was made?

[doctor jambo]

The same could be saiD about the right as well, surely? It is not one cohesive group either.

 

From where you are stand,how would you respond to the point that was made?

He wouldn't- he'd generalise about the right, whilst utterly missing the point

In the same way they have made assumptions about tories, Trump voters and so on

Being judgemental is the sole preserve of the left

[AlphonseCapone]

The same could be saiD about the right as well, surely? It is not one cohesive group either.

 

From where you are stand,how would you respond to the point that was made?

My post literally says, "as does the right".

 

Which point?

[Nookie Bear]

My post literally says, "as does the right".

 

Which point?

Oops, so it does !!

 

As you were...

[AlphonseCapone]

He wouldn't- he'd generalise about the right, whilst utterly missing the point

In the same way they have made assumptions about tories, Trump voters and so on

Being judgemental is the sole preserve of the left

Not responding to me directly is pretty cringey tbh.

 

Did you ignore the part in my post where it said, "as does the right "? Your response above is wrong.

 

Look through my posts on Donald Trump on this thread, specifically my conversation with Frances Albert the other day and you'll see what I've said specifically on Trump. It doesn't fit in with your narrow generalising of the left.

 

You can also check points I've made about generalising about Tory voters and those on the right as well if you want. I've had a few good debates with those with different views to me on here and I'd say in the main I listen and try to be open minded.

 

But you don't like evidence Doc. You generalise and only respond to the posts that are easy for you to respond to.

[Eldar Hadzimehmedovic]

I love the fact that the Left wingers come on here and lambast Trump for protecting the coal industry, steel industry and manufacturing,

Whilst simultaneously despising Thatcher for destroying the coal industry, steel industry and manufacturing

Good on him for his stance on these things

If a politician stepped up in Scotland and said they would protect these things here they would be lauded as a left wing hero

This is the problem with anonymous Internet debating, which has become the problem with politics recently. Everything is split into us and them, right and wrong, black and white. Your post actually raises an interesting question worthy of debate but you begin by taking a completely unnecessary swipe at 'the other', 'the enemy'.

[Craig Gordons Gloves]

Trump's import tax idea on goods from Mexico is a cracker.

 

For example - a can of tomatoes costs $1 to buy from the supplier,  the grocery store adds 20% margin and the consumer pays $1.20.  All cool.   Then all of a sudden, it costs $1.20 to buy that can of tomatoes from the supplier, the grocery store has a choice - continue with their 20% margin, meaning a consumer pays $1.44 now or they reduce their margins.  Either way, someone in the US loses out.  Consumers either pay a higher price or businesses reduce their margins - resulting in pay cuts or job losses or eventually going out of business.  At the same time, tax revenues from those out a job disappear and the government pays out more in unemployment. 

 

I appreciate that this is very simplistic and there are other factors but even a high school economics student can see how it would happen.

 

Now - of course, American farmers could produce more tomatoes so that the suppliers can buy from them and avoid an import tax.  However, the cost of producing these tomatoes in the US is already higher than in Mexico so they're going to be more expensive to buy. Employees then want more money because the cost of goods has risen and the whole system collapses at some point. 

 

But yeah - the mexicans will pay for the wall....

 

And finally -it's all moot anyway since crops will get damaged on a more frequent basis due to more happenings of extreme weather caused by changes to the ecosystem which in turn is caused by more use of pollution inducing fuels and all of a sudden, we'll be living in a wasteland where a tomato is a luxury. 

[Francis Albert]

Trump's import tax idea on goods from Mexico is a cracker.

 

For example - a can of tomatoes costs $1 to buy from the supplier,  the grocery store adds 20% margin and the consumer pays $1.20.  All cool.   Then all of a sudden, it costs $1.20 to buy that can of tomatoes from the supplier, the grocery store has a choice - continue with their 20% margin, meaning a consumer pays $1.44 now or they reduce their margins.  Either way, someone in the US loses out.  Consumers either pay a higher price or businesses reduce their margins - resulting in pay cuts or job losses or eventually going out of business.  At the same time, tax revenues from those out a job disappear and the government pays out more in unemployment. 

 

I appreciate that this is very simplistic and there are other factors but even a high school economics student can see how it would happen.

 

Now - of course, American farmers could produce more tomatoes so that the suppliers can buy from them and avoid an import tax.  However, the cost of producing these tomatoes in the US is already higher than in Mexico so they're going to be more expensive to buy. Employees then want more money because the cost of goods has risen and the whole system collapses at some point. 

 

But yeah - the mexicans will pay for the wall....

 

And finally -it's all moot anyway since crops will get damaged on a more frequent basis due to more happenings of extreme weather caused by changes to the ecosystem which in turn is caused by more use of pollution inducing fuels and all of a sudden, we'll be living in a wasteland where a tomato is a luxury.

On the other hand if the import tax means more goods are produced and manufactured in the USA, American unemployment falls, wages rise, and American consumers can afford to pay more for tomatoes and lots of other things.

 

Climate change is a different issue surely? Wouldn't consuming more locally produced goods reduce use of pollution inducing transportation fuels?

Edited January 27, 2017 by Francis Albert

[Francis Albert]

Anyway the Huffington post has as usual got the heart of the matter, leading on the news that in White House briefings Theresa has been misspelt as Teresa. Adding to the enormous embarrassment this causes, there is apparently an American porn star called Teresa May. The special relationship is certainly over now if it wasn't before.

Edited January 27, 2017 by Francis Albert

[Peebo]

On the other hand if the import tax means more goods are produced and manufactured in the USA, American unemployment falls, wages rise, and American consumers can afford to pay may for tomatoes and lots of other things.

 

Indeed. But then how is the wall being "paid" for? By Mexico, through reduced export revenues? The US being "reimbursed" through higher domestic production? Is that how this plan actually works?

[Francis Albert]

Indeed. But then how is the wall being "paid" for? By Mexico, through reduced export revenues? The US being "reimbursed" through higher domestic production? Is that how this plan actually works?

I have no idea. I was just saying I think the tomato-based analysis of the impact of an import tariff is incomplete.

[Peebo]

I have no idea. I was just saying I think the tomato-based analysis of the impact of an import tariff is incomplete.

I hope someone knows how it is going to work.,

[Francis Albert]

I hope someone knows how it is going to work.,

I doubt it very much. At the end of the day Trump will find some way of showing Mexico has paid, and the Mexicans that they haven't, and the impact of the tariff will be so complicated and the cost of the wall so lost in the much bigger numbers on trade and the US economy that no-one will ever know.

[alwaysthereinspirit]

80% of all Mexican exports head north to the US and Canada. Chances are the 5/20% tax is not going to be picked up by the consumer. Mexican businesses have 2 choices. Pay the tax and sell for the same costs as before. Cutting into their profits but still moving stock. Or try and find a new export market. Trump may not be the most articulate man on the planet but he's not the dummy some people on here would have you believe.

[jb102]

Anyway the Huffington post has as usual got the heart of the matter, leading on the news that in White House briefings Theresa has been misspelt as Teresa. Adding to the enormous embarrassment this causes, there is apparently an American porn star called Teresa May. The special relationship is certainly over now if it wasn't before.

I think she was English.A "Parade"regular when wnk mags were the thing.

[Peebo]

80% of all Mexican exports head north to the US and Canada. Chances are the 5/20% tax is not going to be picked up by the consumer. Mexican businesses have 2 choices. Pay the tax and sell for the same costs as before. Cutting into their profits but still moving stock. Or try and find a new export market. Trump may not be the most articulate man on the planet but he's not the dummy some people on here would have you believe.

Th ability of Mexican exporters being able to effectively absorb a ~17% price reduction (based on a 20% import tax) will vary from industry to industry. For some, might be a simple(ish) reduction in their cost base (e.g. labour-intensive goods and services) through wage reductions. That would definitely see Mexico "paying" in one form. If Mexican exports are reduced and/or redirected elsewhere, then the US will probably be left with a funding deficit to fill.

 

It's a very complex way of trying to get another country to "pay" for something, It could do some weird and wonderful things to the oil market, for example. Do drivers in Wisconsin really want to pay more for their petrol so that a wall can be built along the Mexican border? Purely for example, of course.

 

If Trump has worked all this out, good on him.

Edited January 27, 2017 by Peebo

[Craig Gordons Gloves]

On the other hand if the import tax means more goods are produced and manufactured in the USA, American unemployment falls, wages rise, and American consumers can afford to pay more for tomatoes and lots of other things.

 

Climate change is a different issue surely? Wouldn't consuming more locally produced goods reduce use of pollution inducing transportation fuels?

As i said, it's not a complete analysis and there are many other factors.  The more goods being produced in the US is an interesting argument though.  Goods that are currently produced overseas are generally cheaper due to lower cost of living/lower labor costs etc.  If these goods are now going to be manufactured in the US, as you say - the wages rise because the american labor market is more expensive as is the cost of living.  The cost of living then rises in line with the increase in cost of goods and wages continue to rise. People don't have any more money, they just pay more for what they need.  I don't believe that the majority of american consumers will be happy with paying more for goods simply because they're made here.  It's the problem with a consumer driven economy, price and ability/desire to pay that price is the key factor.  The wall is still being paid somehow by the American consumer, it'll be convoluted and complex. 

 

You're right about climate change being a different issue and yes - more locally produced goods would reduce pollution.  However, to get americans back to work, he's talking about utilizing more climate change inducing fuels and/or relaxing rules on pollution so the arguments become interlinked.  The more climate change then the higher likelihood that the environment changes so that tomatoes can't be grown in the US anyway. 

 

I'm pretty sure this makes sense in my head.  I'm not an economist though. 

[Craig Gordons Gloves]

80% of all Mexican exports head north to the US and Canada. Chances are the 5/20% tax is not going to be picked up by the consumer. Mexican businesses have 2 choices. Pay the tax and sell for the same costs as before. Cutting into their profits but still moving stock. Or try and find a new export market. Trump may not be the most articulate man on the planet but he's not the dummy some people on here would have you believe.

 

I don't think he's a dummy, you don't build a business of his business value by being stupid - whether that's through clever borrowing, clever utilization of regulations etc.  I also don't think that his business experience fully applies to economics/diplomacy/world trade etc. 

 

You're right - the Mexican export business won't stop exporting to the US, chances are though that they have pretty tight margins and if they absorb the tax without increasing costs then they will end up out of business and the exports dry up anyway. 

[Francis Albert]

As i said, it's not a complete analysis and there are many other factors.  The more goods being produced in the US is an interesting argument though.  Goods that are currently produced overseas are generally cheaper due to lower cost of living/lower labor costs etc.  If these goods are now going to be manufactured in the US, as you say - the wages rise because the american labor market is more expensive as is the cost of living.  The cost of living then rises in line with the increase in cost of goods and wages continue to rise. People don't have any more money, they just pay more for what they need.  I don't believe that the majority of american consumers will be happy with paying more for goods simply because they're made here.  It's the problem with a consumer driven economy, price and ability/desire to pay that price is the key factor.  The wall is still being paid somehow by the American consumer, it'll be convoluted and complex. 

 

You're right about climate change being a different issue and yes - more locally produced goods would reduce pollution.  However, to get americans back to work, he's talking about utilizing more climate change inducing fuels and/or relaxing rules on pollution so the arguments become interlinked.  The more climate change then the higher likelihood that the environment changes so that tomatoes can't be grown in the US anyway. 

 

I'm pretty sure this makes sense in my head.  I'm not an economist though.

Basically I think you are probably right. My point really was that short of Mexico writing a cheque for $12bn (which of course was never going to happen) Trump will easily lose the cost, and be able to justify it and argue that somehow "Mexico paid" in the very complicated analysis of the economic impact of the wall and tariff. No-one will be able to prove incontrovertibly whether or to what extent the US or Mexico has "paid". $12bn sounds a lot but it is less than 0.17% of US government expenditure, or maybe 0.05% per year over 3 years or however long it takes to build the bloody thing.

 

You can criticise him for not having in advance a clear idea of how it will work, but then Blair/Bush embarked on the Iraq war with no idea of how it would work.

Edited January 27, 2017 by Francis Albert

[alwaysthereinspirit]

Th ability of Mexican exporters being able to effectively absorb a ~17% price reduction (based on a 20% import tax) will vary from industry to industry. For some, might be a simple(ish) reduction in their cost base (e.g. labour-intensive goods and services) through wage reductions. That would definitely see Mexico "paying" in one form. If Mexican exports are reduced and/or redirected elsewhere, then the US will probably be left with a funding deficit to fill.

 

It's a very complex way of trying to get another country to "pay" for something, It could do some weird and wonderful things to the oil market, for example. Do drivers in Wisconsin really want to pay more for their petrol so that a wall can be built along the Mexican border? Purely for example, of course.

 

If Trump has worked all this out, good on him.

The original Trump issue was with Carrier and then Ford. Building HVAC units and cars at home while paying union workers $40 an hour and selling the product for X. Building the same unit/car in Mexico and paying workers $5 an hour and selling the product for the same X.

Granted transport cost from Mexico would cut in to overall profits but not enough to make it not worthwhile. Now with a tax/tariff it doesn't look as enticing. I'm going to give him more than a week before ridiculing him and some of his ideas.

America is such a huge country that we've all paid for things over the years that we'll never see or will impact us on a personal level. Army core of engineering projects being a prime example. Infrastructure in cities I'll never visit too. I've paid more for gas just because the closest refinery is X miles away. Some Northern cities and states pay more for certain products as a "punishment" for not being near the coast with easy access to coastal freight depots. You lived in Texas. I bet you've never paid what I've paid for a steak here. Ranting now.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

Goods that are currently produced overseas are generally cheaper due to lower cost of living/lower labor costs etc.  If these goods are now going to be manufactured in the US, as you say - the wages rise because the american labor market is more expensive as is the cost of living.  The cost of living then rises in line with the increase in cost of goods and wages continue to rise. People don't have any more money, they just pay more for what they need.  I don't believe that the majority of american consumers will be happy with paying more for goods simply because they're made here.

 

 

This is going to be one of the major problems with bringing the jobs back to the USA from places like China etc.

American workers will expect something like what $15-20 per hour?  Whereas their Chinese counterparts are on $5-8 per hour.

Prices will inevitably have to rise as the wages rise and like you say will the American consumer be willing to pay an extra $100-150 for a (for example) washing machine with a 'Made in USA' sticker on it?

Of course some will buy it, but will enough do it.

 

Then there is the foreign trade to take into account, because outside of the USA people won't care if that washing machine is made in the USA or Korea or China, the majority will buy according to the price or what they can afford, so if an American machine costs ?400 and a Chinese machine with the same specs costs ?300 then you know what one the majority of people will chose.

 

As far as I can see the same reasons why the jobs were shipped overseas in the first place still exist and you'll be doing really well to be competitive with China & the rest of the Far East, and if you can't be competitive then those jobs won't last long I'm afraid.

Edited January 27, 2017 by Jambo-Jimbo

[alwaysthereinspirit]

I don't think he's a dummy, you don't build a business of his business value by being stupid - whether that's through clever borrowing, clever utilization of regulations etc.  I also don't think that his business experience fully applies to economics/diplomacy/world trade etc. 

 

You're right - the Mexican export business won't stop exporting to the US, chances are though that they have pretty tight margins and if they absorb the tax without increasing costs then they will end up out of business and the exports dry up anyway.

Not saying you called him stupid. Others have. I think his background does bode well for him as far as economics and world trade go. As for diplomacy? there is none. That he'll have to learn on the job. He has no filter. World leaders already know this. They'll just have to deal with it. They have no choice for at least 4 years. Its American democrat politicians that I fear. Trying to stop him at every turn. Even if they know it makes sense. They need to learn to pick their battles. Theres a lot of Democrats looking to be re-elected in 2 years. They need to take heed of how their constituents voted in the general election.

[Peebo]

The original Trump issue was with Carrier and then Ford. Building HVAC units and cars at home while paying union workers $40 an hour and selling the product for X. Building the same unit/car in Mexico and paying workers $5 an hour and selling the product for the same X.

Granted transport cost from Mexico would cut in to overall profits but not enough to make it not worthwhile. Now with a tax/tariff it doesn't look as enticing. I'm going to give him more than a week before ridiculing him and some of his ideas.

America is such a huge country that we've all paid for things over the years that we'll never see or will impact us on a personal level. Army core of engineering projects being a prime example. Infrastructure in cities I'll never visit too. I've paid more for gas just because the closest refinery is X miles away. Some Northern cities and states pay more for certain products as a "punishment" for not being near the coast with easy access to coastal freight depots. You lived in Texas. I bet you've never paid what I've paid for a steak here. Ranting now.

Of course all this is true (although I've bought a few expensive steaks in my time...). However, Trump has insisted that the wall will be built, and Mexico will "pay" for it. Clearly they won't just cut a cheque for it. Market economics make it incredibly complex to work another way, though.

 

We shall see...

[Hendricks]

Corona's costing 20% more this summer you say........gee thanks POTUS. 

 

[Craig Gordons Gloves]

Not saying you called him stupid. Others have. I think his background does bode well for him as far as economics and world trade go. As for diplomacy? there is none. That he'll have to learn on the job. He has no filter. World leaders already know this. They'll just have to deal with it. They have no choice for at least 4 years. Its American democrat politicians that I fear. Trying to stop him at every turn. Even if they know it makes sense. They need to learn to pick their battles. Theres a lot of Democrats looking to be re-elected in 2 years. They need to take heed of how their constituents voted in the general election.

 

so just a switch from the past 8 years when the house and senate republicans tried to block Obama at every turn even when it makes sense?

 

The more things change, the more they stay the same 

[Jambo-Jimbo]

Coming to the UK on a state visit later this year.

 

Just as long as he minds not to call the Queen, Lizzie or something like that.

 

I have to say, it's the first time that I've seen Trump act anything like Presidential during his press conference with Theresa May.

[Maple Leaf]

Building the wall will be an enormous engineering challenge.

 

The US/Mexican border is 3,200 kilometres long.  That's roughly the distance between Madrid and Moscow.  The border runs through mountains, valleys, rivers, lakes, farmers fields, etc. How will they do that, and can it be done for around $4 million per kilometre?

 

If a farmer's field is dissected by the wall, or a golf course is dissected, or a housing community, who is going to compensate the owners for their loses, and relocate those American citizens who will suddenly find their homes on the wrong side of the wall?  The three examples I've quoted are real, not hypothetical.  If the US builds a wall on the north side of the Rio Grande, does that mean they are ceding the territory south of the wall to Mexico, because the border is in the middle of the river.

 

Even if they overcome all the technical, financial, and political issues, for every 12-foot wall there is a 13-foot ladder.  What will the wall achieve?

[Bindy Badgy]

Even if they overcome all the technical, financial, and political issues, for every 12-foot wall there is a 13-foot ladder.  What will the wall achieve?

 

As much as a waffle iron.

[elvoys]

This is going to be one of the major problems with bringing the jobs back to the USA from places like China etc.

American workers will expect something like what $15-20 per hour? Whereas their Chinese counterparts are on $5-8 per hour.

Prices will inevitably have to rise as the wages rise and like you say will the American consumer be willing to pay an extra $100-150 for a (for example) washing machine with a 'Made in USA' sticker on it?

Of course some will buy it, but will enough do it.

 

Then there is the foreign trade to take into account, because outside of the USA people won't care if that washing machine is made in the USA or Korea or China, the majority will buy according to the price or what they can afford, so if an American machine costs ?400 and a Chinese machine with the same specs costs ?300 then you know what one the majority of people will chose.

 

As far as I can see the same reasons why the jobs were shipped overseas in the first place still exist and you'll be doing really well to be competitive with China & the rest of the Far East, and if you can't be competitive then those jobs won't last long I'm afraid.

100% this. As a sign of how far he and Bannon (much closer to a state centred Leninist iconoclast than the fascist that the braindead MSM and SJW crowd make him out to be) have crashed the system, this protectionism is akin something tony benn would have advocated than the likes of the Institute of Ayn Rand who appeal to hardcore neo cons. And its a flash in the pan IMO as globalism economically at least seems to me to be something you can't contain. Folk here will be old enough to remember when a washing machine would cost you 400 quid on 10k average wages. Edited January 27, 2017 by elvoys

[elvoys]

https://mobile.twitter.com/LaloDagach/status/824788955619028993/photo/1

 

Just another piece of 'sisterhood' from the pro sharia, Hamas linked Linda Sarsour who organised and spoke at the march last week.

 

She jokes about wishing to remove the genitals of the incredible Ayaan Hirsi Ali - a women living with round clock security, on the death list of Al Qaeda (and fellow travellers the SPLC) and who was subjected to FGM. Ayaan actually knows what campaigning for equality means.

 

Sarsour is a very nasty piece of work - this far outstrips any sexist bs Trump has came out with but of course Bernie Sanders and the rest of the idiotic American left have rushed to her side. A sick bunch.

[Ulysses]

It's not her belly Big Don will be wanting to tickle.

 

 

........there is apparently an American porn star called Teresa May. The special relationship is certainly over now if it wasn't before.

 

 

 

I saw this, and I thought of both of you.

 

 

 

 

[Eldar Hadzimehmedovic]

https://mobile.twitter.com/LaloDagach/status/824788955619028993/photo/1

 

Just another piece of 'sisterhood' from the pro sharia, Hamas linked Linda Sarsour who organised and spoke at the march last week.

 

She jokes about wishing to remove the genitals of the incredible Ayaan Hirsi Ali - a women living with round clock security, on the death list of Al Qaeda (and fellow travellers the SPLC) and who was subjected to FGM. Ayaan actually knows what campaigning for equality means.

 

Sarsour is a very nasty piece of work - this far outstrips any sexist bs Trump has came out with but of course Bernie Sanders and the rest of the idiotic American left have rushed to her side. A sick bunch.

I'm not sure what the point is here. Even if Linda Sarsour was an out and out racist (and those tweets, while not very nice, don't really deserve the bluster attached to them), do you think her involvement deligitimises 4.5m people marching around the world? Edited January 27, 2017 by Eldar Hadzimehmedovic

[Jambo-Jimbo]

100% this. As a sign of how far he and Bannon (much closer to a state centred Leninist iconoclast than the fascist that the braindead MSM and SJW crowd make him out to be) have crashed the system, this protectionism is akin something tony benn would have advocated than the likes of the Institute of Ayn Rand who appeal to hardcore neo cons. And its a flash in the pan IMO as globalism economically at least seems to me to be something you can't contain. Folk here will be old enough to remember when a washing machine would cost you 400 quid on 10k average wages.

 

I'm old enough to remember slot TV's from British Relay, and my first ever VHS Video Recorder was rented from Curry's as they were way too expensive to buy outright, about ?300 which was a lot of money back then (1983), in the days where you got ?3 per hour (if you were lucky), ?120 per week, ?6200 per year wages, before tax & NI of course. 

Many folks nowadays don't know how lucky they are, they don't have a clue what life used to be like.

[Nookie Bear]

I saw this, and I thought of both of you.

 

 

 

 

Bit lame and vulgar, if you ask me.

[elvoys]

I'm not sure what the point is here. Even if Linda Sarsour was an out and out racist (and those tweets, while not very nice, don't really deserve the bluster attached to them), do you think her involvement deligitimises 4.5m people marching around the world?

A racist? Zilch to do with race albeit she is likely angry she cant play the race card with Ayaan, a Somalian. Rather, she organised the march supposedly for women's rights yet cruelly says she would like to remove the vagina of a woman who has already had hers mutilated by the same religion she has made a career of victimhood defending. All the while defending the same religious law that produces these clitorectomies and keeps women in gender apartheid. I'm not sure how many more layers of sick hypocrisy one could add. Just as Trump should have called out the KKK leader (although he never supported him like Bernie has her) , prominent leftists should call out this twisted woman instead of rallying to her side.

Edited January 27, 2017 by elvoys

[Maple Leaf]

I've just read that Trump has signed an Executive Order than bans entry to the USA of people from Iran, Iraq, Libya, Somalia, Sudan, Syria and Lebanon.  He says that this EO is aimed at keeping radical Islamic terrorists out of the USA.

 

Interestingly, 18 of the 19 hijackers responsible for the September 11 attacks came from Saudi Arabia, United Arab Emirates, and Egypt.  Citizens from those countries are still free to enter the USA.

 

Strange logic from Trump.