Genuine question : are Leveins days numbered?

[davemclaren]

2 minutes ago, Central Belt 1874 said:

 

I agree, it began to go downhill in that summer transfer window. If you believe Robbie, it was his signings. He then walked out on us, months after being given a new contract. 

 

Our (the fans) expectations changed that summer, but it was full steam ahead with the new stand and Budge and Leveins initial 5 year plan was not adapted.

Why would Robbie lie now?

[Bazzas right boot]

Just now, Des Lynam said:

 

Hahaha!! You only best people in your own mind. You get the reaction you look for. I was barely on this forum five minutes and you were telling me you wanted hibs to win the cup. 

 

 

 

Nope, you were barley on it 5 minutes and slagging me off for wanting rangers beat as you picked up on another poster having a go at me.

I then responded.

 

I remember, because I thought you were a previous poster on the wind up and looking to re hash old arguments.

 

I have stated Cleary I hate the OF more than anyone else. I still stand by this and will not change. I understand other poster feeling the same way about hibs. live and let live.

[Central Belt 1874]

4 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

Why would Robbie lie now?

 

Im not saying he is. There are plenty fans who think he didn’t have complete control of signings. 

[Des Lynam]

3 minutes ago, BigDave'sHeed said:

Nope, you were barley on it 5 minutes and slagging me off for wanting rangers beat as you picked up on another poster having a go at me.

I then responded.

 

I remember, because I thought you were a previous poster on the wind up and looking to re hash old arguments.

 

I have stated Cleary I hate the OF more than anyone else. I still stand by this and will not change. I understand other poster feeling the same way about hibs. live and let live.

 

Did you cheer when Gray's header went in? 

[Bazzas right boot]

Just now, Des Lynam said:

 

Did you cheer when Gray's header went in? 

 

Was in Turkey, never watched it.

 

 

[Des Lynam]

1 minute ago, Central Belt 1874 said:

 

Im not saying he is. There are plenty fans who think he didn’t have complete control of signings. 

 

I think the Cathro farce showed Levein wasn't dictating signings 

[Des Lynam]

1 minute ago, BigDave'sHeed said:

 

Was in Turkey, never watched it.

 

 

 

Did you smile when you heard the result? 

[Spencer]

9 minutes ago, BigDave'sHeed said:

 

The only reason there were no Hibs or Rangers Is that we kept them down, the damn right stupidity of the " there was no rangers or hibs" is hilarious, maybe we should have stayed down and let them up first?

Nothing backs this up, in fact we were actually still improving as proven by the league position when he left.

 

Funnily enough my Aberdeen mate when out in Liverpool on Thursday said we've finished 2nd or 3rd if he'd stayed, I was arguing his team would have still been 2nd and we'd likely have been 3rd at best still but wouldn't have dropped to 5th  we ended up arguing opposite views, it was a bit trippy as we usually just rip the pish out of each other teams.

 

Anyway, the past is the past, you and others got your way, Robbie left.

This is comedy gold 

 

Another pair of perfectly good underpants ruined 

[Bazzas right boot]

Just now, Des Lynam said:

 

Did you smile when you heard the result? 

 

I was sitting next to a ranger fan on the plane when he told me the score.

 

I said that was unlucky to him, but inside was laughing at him, but then was pissed off when other folk on the  flight celebrated and shouted.  Very confusing my hatred of Rangers v dislike of hibs. 

 

However, as the final didn't involve Hearts, I had a drink, fired on the suntan lotion then enjoyed my break, then forgot all about it until a hibs fan or what is more common- folk on here bring it up on random threads to discuss, which I find strange, even 2 years later.

 

 

[Bazzas right boot]

6 minutes ago, Spencer said:

This is comedy gold 

 

Another pair of perfectly good underpants ruined 

 

Go and change them then.

[Spencer]

1 minute ago, BigDave'sHeed said:

 

Go and change them then.

3rd in the league with 3rd biggest budget

 

Hooray for Robbie eh 

 

Budgeted for 4th the next season though with normal order expected to follow follow as it were 

 

Some could have seen that a sign of what was to come  

[Bazzas right boot]

Just now, Spencer said:

3rd in the league with 3rd biggest budget

 

Hooray for Robbie eh 

technically it was 5th biggest.

 

Rangers and hibs had bigger budgets, so 3rd best in the country was good.

 

 

[Spencer]

Just now, BigDave'sHeed said:

technically it was 5th biggest.

 

Rangers and hibs had bigger budgets, so 3rd best in the country was good.

 

 

They weren't in the same league Toshy!!! 

 

Ffs man stop. I'm going to be shaking like a shitting dog in a minute 

[Des Lynam]

3 minutes ago, BigDave'sHeed said:

 

I was sitting next to a ranger fan on the plane when he told me the score.

 

I said that was unlucky to him, but inside was laughing at him, but then was pissed off when other folk on the  flight celebrated and shouted.  Very confusing my hatred of Rangers v dislike of hibs. 

 

However, as the final didn't involve Hearts, I had a drink, fired on the suntan lotion then enjoyed my break, then forgot all about it until a hibs fan or what is more common- folk on here bring it up on random threads to discuss, which I find strange, even 2 years later.

 

 

 

Its funny because when you tell your stories I always think about the scene in the Sopranos before Pussy is whacked. Tony asks if any of his stories are true. 

[Bazzas right boot]

1 minute ago, Spencer said:

They weren't in the same league Toshy!!! 

 

Ffs man stop. I'm going to be shaking like a shitting dog in a minute 

 

 

only because we, under Robbie kept them down, even on a smaller budget

 

[Bazzas right boot]

3 minutes ago, Des Lynam said:

 

Its funny because when you tell your stories I always think about the scene in the Sopranos before Pussy is whacked. Tony asks if any of his stories are true. 

 

whatever floats yer boat.

 

the point about Hearts fan on here banging on about it is certainly true. in fact, I think you are the Commander in chief of reminding everyone hibs won the ****ing cup. You seem to get it in at every opportunity, even on a thread about CL-  quite a feat.

[Des Lynam]

1 minute ago, BigDave'sHeed said:

 

whatever floats yer boat.

 

the point about Hearts fan on here banging on about it is certainly true, in fact I think you are the Commander in chief of reminding everyone hibs won the ****ing cup. You seem yo get it in at every opportunity, even on a thread about CL-  quite a feat.

 

I do it to keep you happy Toshy baby! 

[Bazzas right boot]

1 minute ago, Des Lynam said:

 

I do it to keep you happy Toshy baby! 

 

As I say, whatever floats yer boat!

 

Toshy- so who where you before?

I wasn't Tosh when you joined? 

[Des Lynam]

Just now, BigDave'sHeed said:

 

As I say, whatever floats yer boat!

 

Toshy- so who where you before?

I wasn't Tosh when you joined? 

 

You also weren't Dave when I joined. 

[Spencer]

9 minutes ago, BigDave'sHeed said:

 

 

only because we, under Robbie kept them down, even on a smaller budget

 

No argument on that specific point bud

[Bazzas right boot]

Just now, Des Lynam said:

 

You also weren't Dave when I joined. 

I was Rudi.

Toshy was before you joined, your mask has slipped. You're  someone I bested in verbal JKB combat and had to reincarnate themselves, much like Rangers- to come back and try to have a go, but like rangers you are failing.

[Bazzas right boot]

10 minutes ago, Spencer said:

No argument on that specific point bud

 

and that we need to get better... quickly

[Des Lynam]

1 minute ago, BigDave'sHeed said:

I was Rudi.

Toshy was before you joined, your mask has slipped. You're  someone I bested in verbal JKB combat and had to reincarnate themselves, much like Rangers- to come back and try to have a go, but like rangers you are failing.

 

I used Toshy today because Thomaso called you it earlier in the thread. I had a previous account which I used to get folk to fill in a survey for my dissertation. 

 

You also get called Tosh all the time you odd character. 

[Generic Username]

The sobering reality of our situation is that, as a minimum, we'll be stuck with Levein for the season regardless of how poorly performances and results on the pitch continue to be. We find ourselves again staring at the calendar waiting for January and hoping that it'll finally be the transfer window where we correct the imbalance in the squad.

 

If we can fix the problem position that is the left back spot and get a couple of pacy bodies in midfield there should be enough there to stumble to a top six spot. If it's another dumpster fire and we can't unload bodies or wind up with a left back who's got legs made of match sticks then we're gubbed.

 

All of that really hinges on getting a few guys off the books and I'm not sure how easy that will be.

[Bazzas right boot]

7 minutes ago, Des Lynam said:

 

I used Toshy today because Thomaso called you it earlier in the thread. I had a previous account which I used to get folk to fill in a survey for my dissertation. 

 

You also get called Tosh all the time you odd character. 

Aye, from folk that knew me as Tosh's left foot!

 

Anyway, CL is staying to fix this mess out as Meestah says recruitment will be key. CL has his head on the chopping block now.

[soonbe110]

46 minutes ago, Central Belt 1874 said:

 

Im not saying he is. There are plenty fans who think he didn’t have complete control of signings. 

Why would they  think he was lying?

[wavydavy]

41 minutes ago, Spencer said:

3rd in the league with 3rd biggest budget

 

Hooray for Robbie eh 

 

Budgeted for 4th the next season though with normal order expected to follow follow as it were 

 

Some could have seen that a sign of what was to come  

 

I wonder what position AB has budgeted for this season?

[wavydavy]

15 minutes ago, Meestah Sahmon said:

The sobering reality of our situation is that, as a minimum, we'll be stuck with Levein for the season regardless of how poorly performances and results on the pitch continue to be. We find ourselves again staring at the calendar waiting for January and hoping that it'll finally be the transfer window where we correct the imbalance in the squad.

 

If we can fix the problem position that is the left back spot and get a couple of pacy bodies in midfield there should be enough there to stumble to a top six spot. If it's another dumpster fire and we can't unload bodies or wind up with a left back who's got legs made of match sticks then we're gubbed.

 

All of that really hinges on getting a few guys off the books and I'm not sure how easy that will be.

 

I can remember the days when Levein used to say there were loads of good players available after the window shut. He said that because Robbie failed to sign anyone but if it was really the case how come he hasn't managed to sign anyone before January or was it him just making up excuses again?

[socrates82]

4 hours ago, Spencer said:

It really is though Toshy. You haven't changed tone despite a horrible run of results and more crucially - performances.  1 point from home games against Partick and Kilmarnock is die. Absolutely dire 

 

As I said above - nothing less than 6 points from next 2 games is acceptable given foregoing 

 

Need to remove players like Callachan as Sunday showed he's overawed 

 

See this thing of ditching managers and players after a relatively short period. It’s the most stupid idea ever because it’s proven not to work. Sadly it seems to be common amongst those who want managers and players sacked or released every few months before they’ve had a chance to turn things around. 

 

Here’s an idea. How about the negative brigade back the guy in charge for a change whether you like him or not? Be a supporter for a bit. You never know, it might make a difference.

[wavydavy]

2 minutes ago, socrates82 said:

 

See this thing of ditching managers and players after a relatively short period. It’s the most stupid idea ever because it’s proven not to work. Sadly it seems to be common amongst those who want managers and players sacked or released every few months before they’ve had a chance to turn things around. 

 

Here’s an idea. How about the negative brigade back the guy in charge for a change whether you like him or not? Be a supporter for a bit. You never know, it might make a difference.

 

The guy in charge has to take responsibilty and put a team out on the park that give the fans some encouragement to feel they have something to shout about.

 

Has he ever played the same team twice? apart from injuries he mucks about playing players out of position all over the park. Fullbacks in midfield, Strikers on the wing etc. No wonder we are struggling to win games.

 

It's a two way thing remember. Sunday should have been a terrific atmosphere and it was for little bits during the game but it was subdued because of the style of play and flat performance.

 

These players should have been up for it first game back at the revamped ground, big crowd but instead it was all a bit depressing, hardly the sort of way to get the fans excited.

 

Does it ever occur to you that just because people on here have a moan about the football and those coaching etc that they might still go and support their team.

 

I go to the games and support the team and more often than not nowadays I leave disappointed and vent my frustrations on here. I still support the team though.

 

The negativity in my eyes is coming from Levein and his style of play and lack of leadership for his players and coaches. 

[mitch41]

9 hours ago, Ryder said:

 

How does he? Did you read his post?

 

He admits that he is unhappy with results and has doubts about Levein. All he is saying is that it’s too early to judge him a failure so early in the job.

If he doesn't know by now he'll never know that Levein & co. are not up to the job. I'm sick of losers our club should be up challenging at the top of the league. Toiling against teams like Partick Dundee Killie ect is just not good enough. Hearts are a shambles of a team. Time he wants they always want time and then we get the excuses.

Our fans deserve better.

[JKBMod 3]

Any more personal stuff and people will be taking breaks from the forum. 

[TexasAndy]

To answer the OP question I would say No his days are not numbered.  No guarantees that won't change as season progresses if we don't improve and start winning especially at home.  We have had way too much upheaval this year already.  We need to show a wee bit of patience and allow a guy who's been over the course before time to fix things.  2-3 key signings could spark this team.  We just look imbalanced and still short of confidence but as a squad it's not the worst I have seen by a long shot.

[socrates82]

21 minutes ago, mitch41 said:

If he doesn't know by now he'll never know that Levein & co. are not up to the job. I'm sick of losers our club should be up challenging at the top of the league. Toiling against teams like Partick Dundee Killie ect is just not good enough. Hearts are a shambles of a team. Time he wants they always want time and then we get the excuses.

Our fans deserve better.

 

Newsflash: we’ve often toiled against clubs like those. And we’ve never regularly challenged at the top of the league. So if that’s your expectations then welcome to a lifetime of disapppintment. 

 

Those if us who are more realistic tale the good times when they come and back the club during the bad times.

 

We agree on the problem - a rubbish team

for 8 months - but not the solution. We heard similar with Robbie and things got worse after he left. Cathro was universally backed as a good appointment and failed dismally. 

 

So how can you be so certain that sacking levein after a few months is the answer?

 

you can’t so as I say how about changing your approach and backing the guy in chare for longer than a handful if games.

[soonbe110]

25 minutes ago, JKBMod 3 said:

Any more personal stuff and people will be taking breaks from the forum. 

About time too. Some posters on here have been ott with the personal stuff. 

[soonbe110]

5 minutes ago, socrates82 said:

 

Newsflash: we’ve often toiled against clubs like those. And we’ve never regularly challenged at the top of the league. So if that’s your expectations then welcome to a lifetime of disapppintment. 

 

Those if us who are more realistic tale the good times when they come and back the club during the bad times.

 

We agree on the problem - a rubbish team

for 8 months - but not the solution. We heard similar with Robbie and things got worse after he left. Cathro was universally backed as a good appointment and failed dismally. 

 

So how can you be so certain that sacking levein after a few months is the answer?

 

you can’t so as I say how about changing your approach and backing the guy in chare for longer than a handful if games.

Couple of excellent posts from you. Deaf ears from some no doubt but your proposed approach is what is needed. It also used to be an accepted approach from a Hearts fans. Sadly no longer the case with a small, noisy minority. They just seem to want continual turmoil at the Club. Can’t believe some on here also want Budge out. I would suggest they support some other club and let us get on with the current progress. For those that have been around a long time things are looking healthier  than any time in last 40 years other than the two financially disastrous short-lived spells following SMG investment and Vlad’s takeover. Next 18 months will determine whether we have the right people in charge of the first team after the Cathro debacle. Any new manager needs a couple of windows to sort things out. 

[Des Lynam]

1 hour ago, socrates82 said:

 

See this thing of ditching managers and players after a relatively short period. It’s the most stupid idea ever because it’s proven not to work. Sadly it seems to be common amongst those who want managers and players sacked or released every few months before they’ve had a chance to turn things around. 

 

Here’s an idea. How about the negative brigade back the guy in charge for a change whether you like him or not? Be a supporter for a bit. You never know, it might make a difference.

 

Excellent post. I was giving Levein stick on here at the weekend but going to chill and take your advice! 

[Bazzas right boot]

1 hour ago, wavydavy said:

 

I wonder what position AB has budgeted for this season?

 

No idea, problem come out at the meeting, I'd say min 5th and expecting vat least 4th.

[NANOJAMBO]

14 minutes ago, socrates82 said:

 

Newsflash: we’ve often toiled against clubs like those. And we’ve never regularly challenged at the top of the league. So if that’s your expectations then welcome to a lifetime of disapppintment. 

 

Those if us who are more realistic tale the good times when they come and back the club during the bad times.

 

We agree on the problem - a rubbish team

for 8 months - but not the solution. We heard similar with Robbie and things got worse after he left. Cathro was universally backed as a good appointment and failed dismally. 

 

So how can you be so certain that sacking levein after a few months is the answer?

 

you can’t so as I say how about changing your approach and backing the guy in chare for longer than a handful if games.

Hopefully AB & the board think differently. They better, they've got a stadium to fill.  You're deliberately missing the point : people aren't talking about "regularly challenging at the top of the league".   They're frustrated with a club which has done well and then spent two years in meltdown since Robbie left. the frustration  of being in the best position we've been in for 50 years IMO , and it's all been lost (on the playing side).  There's so much goodwill, so much money going into the club but we can't even get a team that looks good enough for a top 6 finish.  And not everyone  wants Levein sacked - maybe if you read the posts you would see that.  Plenty of questions on his appointment, his performance so far but people are still willing to give him a decent shot at it, in the main. 

[NANOJAMBO]

10 minutes ago, soonbe110 said:

Couple of excellent posts from you. Deaf ears from some no doubt but your proposed approach is what is needed. It also used to be an accepted approach from a Hearts fans. Sadly no longer the case with a small, noisy minority. They just seem to want continual turmoil at the Club. Can’t believe some on here also want Budge out. I would suggest they support some other club and let us get on with the current progress. For those that have been around a long time things are looking healthier  than any time in last 40 years other than the two financially disastrous short-lived spells following SMG investment and Vlad’s takeover. Next 18 months will determine whether we have the right people in charge of the first team after the Cathro debacle. Any new manager needs a couple of windows to sort things out. 

What  a load of arrogant patronising nonsense. 

[Beast Boy]

1 minute ago, NANOJAMBO said:

What  a load of arrogant patronising nonsense. 

 

Not all of them are, but some of them are summed up perfectly by his description.

[bobskeldon]

5 hours ago, BigDave'sHeed said:

 

 

Everyone knows we need the improve.

 

Changing tone? I'm a supporter, I can also see an improvement since Cathro left, we need to further improve.

 

Also, some posters haven't changed tone from since we were third. Negative then, negative under Cathro, negative now. Constantly called for change- how did that work out.

 

I agree, we need to make the most of the home run.

I haven't seen any improvement since Cathro left and the stats probably evidence that. In fact I would say there were a few times under Cathro when we were outstanding and played with a real swagger going forward e.g. first hour at Dundee, first half against Partick, 40 mins at Motherewell. 

[jambobill4901]

Don't think so. There's been enough turmoil at this club. We need stability at this time.

CL I believe will turn things round, but sniping for his head is ridiculous.

[Bazzas right boot]

2 minutes ago, bobskeldon said:

I haven't seen any improvement since Cathro left and the stats probably evidence that. In fact I would say there were a few times under Cathro when we were outstanding and played with a real swagger going forward e.g. first hour at Dundee, first half against Partick, 40 mins at Motherewell. 

I'd say we've improved from the LC .

 

 

[socrates82]

15 minutes ago, Des Lynam said:

 

Excellent post. I was giving Levein stick on here at the weekend but going to chill and take your advice! 

 

I'm not even that big a fan of Levein as a manager but getting rid now or soon isn't a better solution that giving him more time.

 

Some folk seem to have bought into the Romanov the hire me fire em approach and that was largely a disaster.

 

the squad right now is made of players signed by 3 managers in a relatively short period. We don't have a huge budget so any new man has a massive task to overhaul the squad and/or get underperforming players playing for him - and doing it within the few months some folk seem to give managers these days.

 

Levein at least has done this job before and we know he can do it and - the biggest reason for not sacking him IMO - he knows the players coming through from the academy. Some of our best young players ever have broken through when the club is at a low and playing badly. If folk want something positive to cling on to that should be it.

 

New managers almost never risk playing youngsters, especilly when they first break through. If Levein can stabilise the ship for some else to take over that would be a good outcome, obviously doing as well as possible in the league no cup as well.

 

as others have said, the Hibs tie makes the job a poisoned chalice in the short term. Levein at least knows what it's about and will be in Budge's ear for signings in January.

[bobskeldon]

1 hour ago, socrates82 said:

 

See this thing of ditching managers and players after a relatively short period. It’s the most stupid idea ever because it’s proven not to work. Sadly it seems to be common amongst those who want managers and players sacked or released every few months before they’ve had a chance to turn things around. 

 

Here’s an idea. How about the negative brigade back the guy in charge for a change whether you like him or not? Be a supporter for a bit. You never know, it might make a difference.

What exactly does a "bit" mean? If we lose 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 of the next 8 games, does your "Be a supporter for a bit" still apply?

[socrates82]

Just now, bobskeldon said:

What exactly does a "bit" mean? If we lose 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7 of the next 8 games, does your "Be a supporter for a bit" still apply?

 

I dunno, until things get better or nothing gets better. Everyday has their own limits of patience. I take a long term view. Do you think a few months is enough for a manager to turn things around? If a boxer's getting a hammering in the first 2 rounds do you tell him he's shite or try to build his confidence and back him to turn it around?

[tolcross lad]

 

Craig Levein thought that managing a team was a younger mans job 3 years ago. He is a reluctant volunteer and his body language shows it.He is acting as a part time manager as far as taking the teams workouts  are concerned and  he would willingly leave the show to Daly and Macphee. Its a very strange situation and I cannot feel positive about it. To achieve a successful motivated squad needs a sense of togetherness and committed leadership.Lukewarm will just not do.

[davemclaren]

2 minutes ago, tolcross lad said:

 

Craig Levein thought that managing a team was a younger mans job 3 years ago. He is a reluctant volunteer and his body language shows it.He is acting as a part time manager as far as taking the teams workouts  are concerned and  he would willingly leave the show to Daly and Macphee. Its a very strange situation and I cannot feel positive about it. To achieve a successful motivated squad needs a sense of togetherness and committed leadership.Lukewarm will just not do.

This has been mentioned several times but is there any hard evidence that Craig is not taking any/some of the workouts. To be fair, Cloughie left it to Peter Taylor anyway. ?

[socrates82]

2 hours ago, Central Belt 1874 said:

 

I agree, it began to go downhill in that summer transfer window. If you believe Robbie, it was his signings. He then walked out on us, months after being given a new contract. 

 

Our (the fans) expectations changed that summer, but it was full steam ahead with the new stand and Budge and Leveins initial 5 year plan was not adapted.

 

No offence but that's bollocks. The signings weren't spectacular that summer but Robbie had the team miles ahead of St J and level pegging or above Rangers and Aberdeen. (So does that make him a great manager then? A different debate.)

 

Several signings - notably Johnson, Muirhead and Rossi - were doing well and coming on to regular good games. Walker, Djoum and CP were flying or at least playing well. Hamilton was shaky in goal but our defensive record was still solid, including Rherras who remains the best LB we signed Eckersley. Even someone like Nowak looked like a decent option at defensive mid. And we were on a 5 game unbeaten record, 6 if you include Daly taking on Neilson's team for one game. Even Sammon, after being banished to the bench, looked useful as a 10 minute impact sub.

 

The slide happened when Cathro joined and ripped everything up needlessly. Levein made that happen and it's his mess to clear up IMO. Seems like Budge agreed although if he did need to be persuaded to take the job that's a problem for me, but relatively easy to solve - Levein just needs to screw the nut and remember how to be a good football manager.