Charlie-Brown Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-1104017/Scottish-referees-accused-hounding-Lithuanians-Hearts.html?ITO=1490 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grumpyjambo Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Spot on statements, lets see if the GFA try and fine Hearts for he comments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Quagmire Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 SFA wink wink wink. He is just stating what we have seen for the last few seasons. I wonder if Gordhun Smith would do the same for his countrymen playing abroad ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sdoffstl Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 BBC world news is carrying the story about big Zal reconsidering his future in Scotland due to the referees, in there sports section. It's also one of the scrolling headline's at the bottom of the screen during there news broadcasts. SFA's shame being brought to the attention of the world; Well done mr Brines Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mickmaroon Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Well said Liutauras! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nucky Thompson Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Spot on statements, lets see if the GFA try and fine Hearts for he comments.He has nothing to do with Hearts anymore but that probably won't stop the GFA looking for a loophole to fine us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Brent Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 HEARTS? dispute with Iain Brines has taken a new twist when it was claimed the ref swore at Jambos players ? before sending off Lee Wallace for abusing him. ?Some players struggled to come to terms with the officiating on the day. This feeling was fuelled by Christian Nade being sworn at by the ref during the game. It was one of a number of things that contributed to the ill-feeling that continued after the whistle.? http://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/scotsol/homepage/sport/spl/article2086932.ece Brines>> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brownkg Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 The only proviso with this is the comment that he has not seen the video yet. Had he done so then this would carry more weight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grumpyjambo Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 He has nothing to do with Hearts anymore but that probably won't stop the GFA looking for a loophole to fine us. Yep, I bet the letter containing notification of the fine is on its way to Tynie right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Freewheelin' Jambo Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Great to see this getting national attention. And also that it has been done in a tactful, carefully worded manner, not from a Vlad monkey rant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Busby ! Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Refereeing bias against our Lithuanian players specifically ? I don't think so. Refereeing bias against Hearts and Hearts players in general ? Yes, I think thats going on to an extent. Refereeing incompetence in games involving Hearts and in the SPL as a whole ? Undoubtedly. For us, its impossible to distinguish the 2 incompetence and bias "signals" and determine their relative percentages but I'd take a stab at the current rash of absurd decision making in Hearts games being down to 80 to 90 % incompetence and the remainder down to some undoubted petty bias. But outright xenophobia ? No,,, I don't believe so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted January 2, 2009 Author Share Posted January 2, 2009 Why are people always reluctant to believe that cheating or corruption exists in British or more specifically Scottish football when we already know and been proven it exists and has exsited elsewhere for a long time including in some of the very top leagues in the world, what makes Scots / Brits immune from such base behaviour? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Don Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 This is clever stuff, I would bet Vlad has had a word with Liutauras and told him to come out publicly with these comments knowing he is no longer anything to do wiyth Hearts so the corrupt SFA would find it extremely difficult to try and censure him, or take action against us. His position gives him a good footing for this to be highlighted on a much higher level, exactly what is needed. I had suggested the other day that Vlad uses supporters groups as well to get messages across, and into the media. This has the potential to stir a lot of hornets nests and hopefully Rock the SFA. As long as it's not all forgotten about in a weeks time and then back to business as usual. There has to be sustained pressure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boof Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 I'd be interested to see Zali's disciniplary record from his new club after a year or two (assuming he does go). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gambo Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 HEARTS’ dispute with Iain Brines has taken a new twist when it was claimed the ref swore at Jambos players — before sending off Lee Wallace for abusing him. “Some players struggled to come to terms with the officiating on the day. This feeling was fuelled by Christian Nade being sworn at by the ref during the game. It was one of a number of things that contributed to the ill-feeling that continued after the whistle.” http://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/scotsol/homepage/sport/spl/article2086932.ece Brines>> Who was the ref who had an onfield foul mouthed rant at Elliott a couple of seasons ago? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
portobellojambo1 Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Refereeing bias against our Lithuanian players specifically ? I don't think so.Refereeing bias against Hearts and Hearts players in general ? Yes, I think thats going on to an extent. Refereeing incompetence in games involving Hearts and in the SPL as a whole ? Undoubtedly. But outright xenophobia ? No,,, I don't believe so. Agree with this. I think we have had 7 red cards this season, 3 times the player has been Lithuanian, 3 times Scottish and once Icelandic, which to me does not suggest they are deliberately targeting Lithuanians. Incompetence/bias/cheating, yes, racism/xenophobia, no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted January 2, 2009 Author Share Posted January 2, 2009 Agree with this. I think we have had 7 red cards this season, 3 times the player has been Lithuanian, 3 times Scottish and once Icelandic, which to me does not suggest they are deliberately targeting Lithuanians. Incompetence/bias/cheating, yes, racism/xenophobia, no. I would say our Lithuanian players are treated more harshly for similar offences than other players are - as an example in 2 of Zaliukas red card incidents Lee Wilkie & Lee Miller could have also been sent off but weren't, Miko & Ksanavicius & Velicka were all carded for simulation far more often than other players who go down just as easily, Miko gets special attention from referee's. I wouldn't say our ref's are downright xenophobic or racist towards our players but there is strong bias against them in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seymour M Hersh Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Who was the ref who had an onfield foul mouthed rant at Elliott a couple of seasons ago? Brines iirc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Busby ! Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 An opportunity missed by Hearts I think. The club made the right kind of noises a couple of days ago in suggesting that the appeals process was flawed and needed an overhaul. Thats something that most clubs would agree on. That could have built a few bridges and perhaps started to form some kind of embryonic force for change as regards refereeing standards in general. Now we're striking out alone on the xenophobia line, we can kiss goodbye to any chance of a united front on the crucial matter of refereeing standards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fergie_Jambo Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Agree with this. I think we have had 7 red cards this season, 3 times the player has been Lithuanian, 3 times Scottish and once Icelandic, which to me does not suggest they are deliberately targeting Lithuanians. Incompetence/bias/cheating, yes, racism/xenophobia, no. Fair point if you stick to this season. Going back over the last few years ,I'm not so sure that the Lith's have not been given special attention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr. Sheldon Cooper Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Brines iirc. Did Charlie Richmond not have a rant at one of our players last season at Motherwell? Not sure if it was Elliot though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted January 2, 2009 Author Share Posted January 2, 2009 An opportunity missed by Hearts I think. The club made the right kind of noises a couple of days ago in suggesting that the appeals process was flawed and needed an overhaul. Thats something that most clubs would agree on. That could have built a few bridges and perhaps started to form some kind of embryonic force for change as regards refereeing standards in general. Now we're striking out alone on the xenophobia line, we can kiss goodbye to any chance of a united front on the crucial matter of refereeing standards. Hearts haven't said anything of the sort DB - however the President of Lithuanian football has about the treatment of his players and whilst he is closely involved with Romanov and of course ex-Hearts director there is still a subtle but important distinction - if he can't speak out and express an opinion on the perceived treatment of his players then who can? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mysterion Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 bottom line - we've been dealt some horrendous decisions. it's towards the club rather than individuals. the real issue is the appeals board here. to allow Brines to be part of the process shows little impartiality as he will not want to undermine his own useless performance. the pressure that needs to be kept up is to find ways to improve the game and an independent appeals panel will help this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gambo Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 I can't believe that there are some who think the Lithuanians who have came to our club have been treated just the same way as others who have came to our club. Whilst i agree it is Hearts as a whole who are targetted imo the Lithuanians within that Hearts team get that extra 5% scrutiny from the referees due to where they are from, and as for the attention they receive from the press.......shocking imo. Too many times we have said at games that he has been 'booked' because he is Lithuanian an not solely because he was a Hearts player (Audrey being denied a penalty and booked at Parkhead in the cup last season, and Miko at Pittodrie last season are 2 examples) Christ Miko can't make a tackle(tackles that 10times out of ten a Rangers player will get away with and 4 times out of ten a non Lithuanian Hearts player will get away with) at Ibrox without finding his way into the book. IMO it is hard enough being a Hearts player when it comes to refereeing decisions, it is that wee bit harder if you are a Lithuanian Hearts player. It is an interesting read to hear what a Lithuanian perceives to be the case (Zal also said similar imo). I don't know if xenophobic/racist etc are the correct words to use though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
portobellojambo1 Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 I would say our Lithuanian players are treated more harshly for similar offences than other players are - as an example in 2 of Zaliukas red card incidents Lee Wilkie & Lee Miller could have also been sent off but weren't, Miko & Ksanavicius & Velicka were all carded for simulation far more often than other players who go down just as easily, Miko gets special attention from referee's. I wouldn't say our ref's are downright xenophobic or racist towards our players but there is strong bias against them in my opinion. I agree with a subsequent post, again by DB Charlie. If/where there is bias it is best to use the club(s) as a whole rather than players from individual nations. We are doing ourselves no favours by going down the racism/xenophobia route. That will not gain us support from other clubs, that will lose us support. The initial bone of contention that we raised, in relation to the appeal process being altered is the one we should have stuck to, that I think would attract support from most other clubs. The danger now is that we alienate ourselves by saying all referees dislike Lithuanians, and Lithuanians only. Lets not forget that there were a large number of Hearts fans who also felt that the players you mention, Velicka, Ksanavicius and Mikoliunas had a habit of going to ground rather easily, although I accept they are far from alone in that. Referees may be incompetent/biased/cheats, but when they can get away with it players will try their damn hardest to cheat as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted January 2, 2009 Author Share Posted January 2, 2009 I agree with a subsequent post, again by DB Charlie. If/where there is bias it is best to use the club(s) as a whole rather than players from individual nations. We are doing ourselves no favours by going down the racism/xenophobia route. That will not gain us support from other clubs, that will lose us support. The initial bone of contention that we raised, in relation to the appeal process being altered is the one we should have stuck to, that I think would attract support from most other clubs. The danger now is that we alienate ourselves by saying all referees dislike Lithuanians, and Lithuanians only. Lets not forget that there were a large number of Hearts fans who also felt that the players you mention, Velicka, Ksanavicius and Mikoliunas had a habit of going to ground rather easily, although I accept they are far from alone in that. Referees may be incompetent/biased/cheats, but when they can get away with it players will try their damn hardest to cheat as well. Hearts didn't make this complaint or opinion PJ1 - the President of Lithuanian Football Federation did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Busby ! Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Hearts haven't said anything of the sort DB - however the President of Lithuanian football has about the treatment of his players and whilst he is closely involved with Romanov and of course ex-Hearts director there is still a subtle but important distinction - if he can't speak out and express an opinion on the perceived treatment of his players then who can? Mon ami, of course he can do what he wants and express any opinion he wants. Fine if he wants to get that off his chest. But its a subjective feeling and I hope that the club itself does not now follow the line of all this being a xenophobic/Lithuanian persecution complex. The Brines affair is a microcosm of the state of refereeing in this country. As I've said numerous times in the last few days, merely "googling" Brines name indicates the extent of his massive incomptence in multiple games, impacting multiple teams and without the SFA doing anything about it. We should put the focus on Brines incompetence, which is where all the evidence leads. There are lots of other teams, managers and fans who are aware of this. We should be trying to build bridges with them. A xenophobia line won't do that, instead we'd remain (in the eyes of other fans and teams) a club with a unique chip on it's shoulder and not someone who they could make alliances with in any search for change in SFA standards and practices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drylaw Hearts Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 I agree with a subsequent post, again by DB Charlie. If/where there is bias it is best to use the club(s) as a whole rather than players from individual nations. We are doing ourselves no favours by going down the racism/xenophobia route. That will not gain us support from other clubs, that will lose us support. The initial bone of contention that we raised, in relation to the appeal process being altered is the one we should have stuck to, that I think would attract support from most other clubs. The danger now is that we alienate ourselves by saying all referees dislike Lithuanians, and Lithuanians only. Lets not forget that there were a large number of Hearts fans who also felt that the players you mention, Velicka, Ksanavicius and Mikoliunas had a habit of going to ground rather easily, although I accept they are far from alone in that. Referees may be incompetent/biased/cheats, but when they can get away with it players will try their damn hardest to cheat as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted January 2, 2009 Author Share Posted January 2, 2009 Mon ami, of course he can do what he wants and express any opinion he wants. Fine if he wants to get that off his chest. But its a subjective feeling and I hope that the club itself does not now follow the line of all this being a xenophobic/Lithuanian persecution complex. The Brines affair is a microcosm of the state of refereeing in this country. As I've said numerous times in the last few days, merely "googling" Brines name indicates the extent of his massive incomptence in multiple games, impacting multiple teams and without the SFA doing anything about it. We should put the focus on Brines incompetence, which is where all the evidence leads. There are lots of other teams, managers and fans who are aware of this. We should be trying to build bridges with them. A xenophobia line won't do that, instead we'd remain (in the eyes of other fans and teams) a club with a unique chip on it's shoulder and not someone who they could make alliances with in any search for change in SFA standards and practices. What is wrong with a 2 pronged approach - Hearts could attempt to do something about Brines / referee-ing standards / appeals processes etc whilst the Lithuanians can highlight the less-than-fair treatment their players receive which even highlighting a perceived problem might place ref's under closer scrutiny and ensure they might get fairer treatment going forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
portobellojambo1 Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Hearts didn't make this complaint or opinion PJ1 - the President of Lithuanian Football Federation did. I am aware of that, but still think it is a dangerous route to go down. I just hope he cleared it with his federation before making the statement, or he may regret it, and I hope Hearts do not act on his comments. Incompetence/cheating/bias in Scottish football did not start in 2005, with the arrival of the Lithuanians, it has been going on since Jesus was a lad. To move the goalposts and now class it as racism is stupid, imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gambo Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Does anyone think that at times a referee thinks.........thats a Lithuanian that went down/did that or do you think they always look upon that player as player x and the 'Lithuanian' part never ever comes into it as far as the referee is concerned? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drylaw Hearts Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Does anyone think that at times a referee thinks.........thats a Lithuanian that went down/did that or do you think they always look upon that player as player x and the 'Lithuanian' part never ever comes into it as far as the referee is concerned? I don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dazo Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 I am aware of that, but still think it is a dangerous route to go down. I just hope he cleared it with his federation before making the statement, or he may regret it, and I hope Hearts do not act on his comments. Incompetence/cheating/bias in Scottish football did not start in 2005, with the arrival of the Lithuanians, it has been going on since Jesus was a lad. To move the goalposts and now class it as racism is stupid, imo. Completely agree PJ1 and I would not be the least bit surprised if SFA did not complain to Fifa about Varanavicius's comments. Also anyone thinking just because it was Varanavicius that said these things that it will not have a direct negative effect on hearts are in dreamland. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gambo Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 I am aware of that, but still think it is a dangerous route to go down. I just hope he cleared it with his federation before making the statement, or he may regret it, and I hope Hearts do not act on his comments. Incompetence/cheating/bias in Scottish football did not start in 2005, with the arrival of the Lithuanians, it has been going on since Jesus was a lad. To move the goalposts and now class it as racism is stupid, imo. To just totally ignore/turn a blind eye, to the way our Lithuanians have been treated/welcomed in this country by the football authorities and media would be stupid also imo. As you say incompetence/cheating/bias has been going on for donkey years in Scottish football........right now Hearts are having a bad time of it, and imo because of where certain players are from they are targetted that little bit more. It is first a Hearts thing but within that there is imo a Lithuanian thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Brent Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 An opportunity missed by Hearts I think. The club made the right kind of noises a couple of days ago in suggesting that the appeals process was flawed and needed an overhaul. Thats something that most clubs would agree on. That could have built a few bridges and perhaps started to form some kind of embryonic force for change as regards refereeing standards in general. Now we're striking out alone on the xenophobia line, we can kiss goodbye to any chance of a united front on the crucial matter of refereeing standards. The SFA and the media must be forced into discussing the whole rotten state of Scottish football. They have a history of remaining silent when these issues are raised, knowing that the pressure to respond will fade once sufficient time has passed. The statement from the Lithuanian FA chairman is another means of keeping this issue in the media. The SFA cannot refuse to respond to a challenge that Lithuanians are the victims of discrimination. If there isn't discrimination against Lithuanians, let them make a statement about the Brines decision. If the Scottish media will not spotlight unfair practice, then the wider media may take an interest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawrrrrrrr Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 An embarassing statement which just takes away from the issue. Is the refeereing **** poor in this country? yes Is the appeals process a joke ? yes , is it all down to racism, is it hell!! The fact that he is claiming it is racist, and himself admits he hasnt seen the incident just takes away any validity his statement has. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gambo Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 I don't. But then again you think referees are all above board and equal. You think Rangers players are treated as harshly as Hearts players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dazo Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Does anyone think that at times a referee thinks.........thats a Lithuanian that went down/did that or do you think they always look upon that player as player x and the 'Lithuanian' part never ever comes into it as far as the referee is concerned? I think referees have a "cheating foreigner" mentality that generally effects every club outside the OF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted January 2, 2009 Author Share Posted January 2, 2009 I don't. Certainly in games I've watched DH Miko, Velicka & Ksanavicius were all carded more often for simulation than Clarkson, Nakamura, Mackie, Boyd, Broadfoot, Darcheville etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gambo Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 An embarassing statement which just takes away from the issue. Is the refeereing **** poor in this country? yes Is the appeals process a joke ? yes , is it all down to racism, is it hell!! The fact that he is claiming it is racist, and himself admits he hasnt seen the incident just takes away any validity his statement has. Who said referees being poor and a joke appeals system IS ALL down to racisism? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Commander Harris Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 I don't. you've suggested in the past that Scottish players could be liable to being treated differently to Lithuanian players by the Hearts support. Do you not think referees could fall into the same trap? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John S Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 I can't believe that there are some who think the Lithuanians who have came to our club have been treated just the same way as others who have came to our club. Whilst i agree it is Hearts as a whole who are targetted imo the Lithuanians within that Hearts team get that extra 5% scrutiny from the referees due to where they are from, and as for the attention they receive from the press.......shocking imo. Too many times we have said at games that he has been 'booked' because he is Lithuanian an not solely because he was a Hearts player (Audrey being denied a penalty and booked at Parkhead in the cup last season, and Miko at Pittodrie last season are 2 examples) Christ Miko can't make a tackle(tackles that 10times out of ten a Rangers player will get away with and 4 times out of ten a non Lithuanian Hearts player will get away with) at Ibrox without finding his way into the book. IMO it is hard enough being a Hearts player when it comes to refereeing decisions, it is that wee bit harder if you are a Lithuanian Hearts player. It is an interesting read to hear what a Lithuanian perceives to be the case (Zal also said similar imo). I don't know if xenophobic/racist etc are the correct words to use though. Gambo sums it up perfectly, and hopefully in a way that we can all (well mostly) agree with. Hearts get a rough deal because of the (beautiful) badge, the Lithuanian players get 2 for 1, ie a rough deal as a Hearts player with a bit extra added on because they're Lithuanian. Some compare the Scottish players cautions/sanctions with the others to suggest that 'Lithuanin' is not at least part of the issue, however, I'd suggest that when looking closely at the treatment of the Lithuanians you find a clear case of these boys being treated very unfairly, whereas at least some of our other cautions/reds are valid. Good post Gambo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted January 2, 2009 Author Share Posted January 2, 2009 An embarassing statement which just takes away from the issue. Is the refeereing **** poor in this country? yes Is the appeals process a joke ? yes , is it all down to racism, is it hell!! The fact that he is claiming it is racist, and himself admits he hasnt seen the incident just takes away any validity his statement has. Prancer - read the article again - he has seen the video. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Old Tolbooth Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Does anyone think that at times a referee thinks.........thats a Lithuanian that went down/did that or do you think they always look upon that player as player x and the 'Lithuanian' part never ever comes into it as far as the referee is concerned? I don't think that a ref has the time to make up his mind what nationality a player is when he goes down, and I certainly don't buy the anti Lithuanian pish, and as PJ1 already stated, it's a very dangerous road to go down. I do however think they have an agenda against Miko, and only Miko, simply because of the Davisgate incident, and also his dive at Hampden, it has been conveniently swept under the carpet that Gary O'Connor blatantly dived in the same game and not a word was said, although he didn't win a penalty. Miko has been the subject of some ridiculous refereeing decisions since that day at Hampden, and I think any observer looking at any footage or evidence from UEFA would simply have to agree, it's that obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gambo Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 I think referees have a "cheating foreigner" mentality that generally effects every club outside the OF. I tend to agree with regards to your foreigner comment, but i also think that whilst others are classed as 'cheating foreigners' our Lithuanians are classed as 'cheating Lithuanians' the press are as good as the officials when it comes to this viewpoint imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drylaw Hearts Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 But then again you think referees are all above board and equal. You think Rangers players are treated as harshly as Hearts players. Prior to Saturday Zaliukas had only 2 yellow cards for the entire Season. The same number of yellows Chrisophe Berra and 2 less than Rob Jones. That hardly suggest he's been given some sort of harsh treatment. This is an arguement you will never, ever win because there are too many stats like the ones above that blow this SFA/anti-lithuanian theory out of the water. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rawrrrrrrr Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 Prancer - read the article again - he has seen the video. Fair enough I had picked up on a comment someone else made that he hadnt seen the incident. All the same I think its a pretty crap statement which will be treated with the contempt it deserves by most. The refeereeing issues are nothing to do with nationality and trying to turn it into a race issue is going to get us nowhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drylaw Hearts Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 you've suggested in the past that Scottish players could be liable to being treated differently to Lithuanian players by the Hearts support. Do you not think referees could fall into the same trap? I think that Refs will no doubt have guys they like and guys they don't like, the ONLY Lithiunian player who has been harshly treated over a sustained period of time is Miko. And it's not because of his Nationality imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted January 2, 2009 Author Share Posted January 2, 2009 Prior to Saturday Zaliukas had only 2 yellow cards for the entire Season. The same number of yellows Chrisophe Berra and 2 less than Rob Jones. That hardly suggest he's been given some sort of harsh treatment. This is an arguement you will never, ever win because there are too many stats like the ones above that blow this SFA/anti-lithuanian theory out of the water. Referee's can only card players when they are involved in incidents DH - just because other players have received more cards has nothing to do with whether certain players are treated harshly regards incidents they are involved in and also whether referee's are being fair and consistent in awarding cards for the same or similar offences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John S Posted January 2, 2009 Share Posted January 2, 2009 I don't think that a ref has the time to make up his mind what nationality a player is when he goes down, and I certainly don't buy the anti Lithuanian pish, and as PJ1 already stated, it's a very dangerous road to go down. I do however think they have an agenda against Miko, and only Miko, simply because of the Davisgate incident, and also his dive at Hampden, it has been conveniently swept under the carpet that Gary O'Connor blatantly dived in the same game and not a word was said, although he didn't win a penalty. Miko has been the subject of some ridiculous refereeing decisions since that day at Hampden, and I think any observer looking at any footage or evidence from UEFA would simply have to agree, it's that obvious. John (and Ian) - fwiw I really enjoy both of your contributions to JKB; I have to say however that I'm tuly surprised that neither of you buy into an anti Lithunian agenda. For me its as clear as night follows day, its real and it happens with alarming regularity. I most definately agree with your comment on Miko - the way that boy has been treated since Davisgate, (not helped by hamdump) is nothing short of a national disgrace, and makes me embarrased and ashamed of our country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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