Israel and Palestine

[Diadora Van Basten]

Whoever added the music after David Cameron replied is genius.

[Japan Jambo]

2 hours ago, Diadora Van Basten said:

Research shows terms like 'massacre' and 'slaughter' are only ever used by the New York Times to describe the killing of Israelis, never for the killing of Palestinians.

Now the Intercept has found the NYT memo that specifically bars its journalists, and even interviewees, from using these terms in relation to Palestinian deaths, as well as a ban on the use of 'genocide', 'ethnic cleansing', 'occupied territories', 'refugee camps' and 'Palestine'. 

The term 'terrorism' is restricted to describing Palestinian attacks, according to the memo. Israeli attacks on Palestinian civilians and civilian infrastructure, such as hospitals, is excluded.   

The entire Palestinian narrative – and the region's history – has been erased from the NYT's coverage, exactly as Israel would want it to be.

Now we just need to unearth the memos issued by the BBC, Guardian and a host of other outlets that are serving precisely the same purpose of skewing the coverage exclusively in Israel's favour.

 

I'm sure if you go looking you may find the BBC memo that refuses to call the proscribed terrorist organisation Hamas a terrorist organisation because terrorist is a loaded word. In the interests of balance of course...

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67083432

[Taffin]

19 minutes ago, Japan Jambo said:

 

I'm sure if you go looking you may find the BBC memo that refuses to call the proscribed terrorist organisation Hamas a terrorist organisation because terrorist is a loaded word. In the interests of balance of course...

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67083432

 

Sounds a very balanced approach.

 

I'm not sure how it provides balance to the post you quoted though

Edited April 17 by Taffin

[Diadora Van Basten]

Bernie Sanders tells it how it is. No improvement in aid since the killing of the UK aid workers (despite the promises to open more crossings and turn on water). 450 Palestinians including 100 children killed in the West Bank by Israel and Israeli settlers.

 

 

[Diadora Van Basten]

A picture paints a thousand words.

[Jim_Duncan]

12 minutes ago, Diadora Van Basten said:

A picture paints a thousand words.

"Why you got your willie in that pig, Dave?"

"Don't worry Ben, it's no' like you're gonnae eat it afterwards."

[Diadora Van Basten]

The UK Government, the UK media and Israel have tried to dehumanise Palestinians while they deny that Genocide has taken place and continues to take place in Gaza.

 

This is the story of 6 year old Palestinian girl Hind Rajab.
 

Learn her story so that you are not dehumanised. Then once you have learned it, think about the other 13,000 children like Hind who have been killed by Israel with the complicity of our Government, the opposition (labour party) and our media (The BBC).

Never again means never again for everyone.

 

 

Edited April 18 by Diadora Van Basten

[manaliveits105]

The two-state solution to the Israeli–Palestinian conflict proposed to resolve the conflict by establishing two nation states in former Mandatory Palestine. The implementation of a two-state solution would involve the establishment of an independent State of Palestine alongside the State of Israel.
1947 

Refused by Palestinians and Arabs 

and here we are if they had accepted there would be no settlements as sovereignty would have been recognised by all countries 

[Diadora Van Basten]

23 minutes ago, manaliveits105 said:

The two-state solution to the Israeli–Palestinian conflict proposed to resolve the conflict by establishing two nation states in former Mandatory Palestine. The implementation of a two-state solution would involve the establishment of an independent State of Palestine alongside the State of Israel.
1947 

Refused by Palestinians and Arabs 

and here we are if they had accepted there would be no settlements as sovereignty would have been recognised by all countries 

Imagine Muslims in the UK asked for their own state within the UK I am sure you would think it was ridiculous then apply the same logic to Palestinians in 1947.

[XB52]

13 minutes ago, Diadora Van Basten said:

Imagine Muslims in the UK asked for their own state within the UK I am sure you would think it was ridiculous then apply the same logic to Palestinians in 1947.

It's pure madness to accuse Palestinians of being the problem. Bit by bit they have had their land stolen while the zionists murder them with impunity. 

[Jim_Duncan]

36 minutes ago, Diadora Van Basten said:

Imagine Muslims in the UK asked for their own state within the UK I am sure you would think it was ridiculous then apply the same logic to Palestinians in 1947.

I think that’s called Bradford. 

[escobri]

Well done Joe that's them telt, time for ice cream and a nap. 

 

[luckyBatistuta]

11 hours ago, escobri said:

Well done Joe that's them telt, time for ice cream and a nap. 

 

And now Israel has only gone and done it. Just struck Isfahan in Iran. Near nuclear facilities too it’s saying on some sites. Worrying times.

Edited April 19 by luckyBatistuta

[Better call Saul]

That Biden is brutal 

 

[Francis Albert]

On 17/04/2024 at 14:05, Japan Jambo said:

 

I'm sure if you go looking you may find the BBC memo that refuses to call the proscribed terrorist organisation Hamas a terrorist organisation because terrorist is a loaded word. In the interests of balance of course...

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-67083432

BBC just maintaing its tradition of balance upheld during WW2?

And the Falklands war. Though surely the word invasion was a loaded word when referring for example to Alsace and Sudetenland?

 

[Debut 4]

21 hours ago, Diadora Van Basten said:

Imagine Muslims in the UK asked for their own state within the UK I am sure you would think it was ridiculous then apply the same logic to Palestinians in 1947.

So, where the does the line start and stop with history?  Does it just suit to whatever narrative you prefer?  A lot of decisions are ideology driven, not political as many want to believe.   Maybe you missed the Muslim leader meeting the Nazis to agree to doing whatever they can to stop the Jews finding a safe haven in the Middle East from the brutality of Europe in WW2?
 

Way way before that the Jews were chased out their homeland from Muslim conquests.  Christians played their part too.  The world is a big place. Many , Jews, Christians, Muslims want to live in peace and get on with an ordinary life but equally many don’t like the other side and let thousands of years of history and religious influence still affect their attitude towards the “enemy”.  
 

It’s all been put in the mix with modern politics but strip it all back and you find the real reasons.  
 

 

[Taffin]

40 minutes ago, Debut 4 said:

So, where the does the line start and stop with history?  Does it just suit to whatever narrative you prefer?  A lot of decisions are ideology driven, not political as many want to believe.   Maybe you missed the Muslim leader meeting the Nazis to agree to doing whatever they can to stop the Jews finding a safe haven in the Middle East from the brutality of Europe in WW2?
 

Way way before that the Jews were chased out their homeland from Muslim conquests.  Christians played their part too.  The world is a big place. Many , Jews, Christians, Muslims want to live in peace and get on with an ordinary life but equally many don’t like the other side and let thousands of years of history and religious influence still affect their attitude towards the “enemy”.  
 

It’s all been put in the mix with modern politics but strip it all back and you find the real reasons.  
 

 

 

Having bad things done to you and your people's historically doesn't excuse doing it to others, in the same way more recent history doesn't justify Hamas terrorism

 

Palestinians have been absolutely shafted by Israel, imo. 

 

If Scotland was suddenly backed by the US militarily would we be justified in occupying parts of England and trying to eradicate their existence just because of previous wrongs due to their ideology?

 

Would Ireland be justified eradicating and occupying Scotland if backed by China, simply because of Britains previous actions towards them?

 

For some reason people seem to give Israel carte blanche to do what they want.

Edited April 19 by Taffin

[Lovecraft]

**** Israel and **** Hamas.  Also, **** Iran.

 

Israel needs to keep the US onboard, so they will continue to goad Iran to keep the threats real.

 

Give them all nukes and let them get on with it.

 

 

[Francis Albert]

2 minutes ago, Lovecraft said:

**** Israel and **** Hamas.  Also, **** Iran.

 

Israel needs to keep the US onboard, so they will continue to goad Iran to keep the threats real.

 

Give them all nukes and let them get on with it.

 

 

Iran funds a tobe tperrorist groups in every state surrounding Israel and beyond and Israel is goading Iran? Poor little Iran!

[Gundermann]

1 hour ago, Debut 4 said:

So, where the does the line start and stop with history?  Does it just suit to whatever narrative you prefer?  A lot of decisions are ideology driven, not political as many want to believe.   Maybe you missed the Muslim leader meeting the Nazis to agree to doing whatever they can to stop the Jews finding a safe haven in the Middle East from the brutality of Europe in WW2?
 

Way way before that the Jews were chased out their homeland from Muslim conquests.  Christians played their part too.  The world is a big place. Many , Jews, Christians, Muslims want to live in peace and get on with an ordinary life but equally many don’t like the other side and let thousands of years of history and religious influence still affect their attitude towards the “enemy”.  
 

It’s all been put in the mix with modern politics but strip it all back and you find the real reasons.  
 

 

 

Just wondering when and where this happened?

 

Not denying it but there's plenty evidence of Jews, Muslims and Christians living in close proximity and peace with each other. Even in Andalucia, IIRC, the Jews that had lived there during the Caliphate were then expelled by the Reconquistas. Conversions and intermarriage wasn't that uncommon too, I believe.

 

Basically, most people just want to get on with their lives. Zealots and bams in power in both Iran and Israel are dragging us into this.

Edited April 19 by Gundermann

[Jim_Duncan]

12 minutes ago, Gundermann said:

. Zealots and bams in power in both Iran and Israel are dragging us into this.

And to think we have the capability of sending people to the moon but don’t use it. 

[Diadora Van Basten]

Netanyahu has announced Israel are going to spend £5 billion on rebuilding Gaza for Israeli settlers.

 

The US that claims to be in favour of a two state solution has used its veto to stop Palestine being recognised as a state by the UN.

 

Israel bombed a children’s play park killing 12 kids.

Edited April 19 by Diadora Van Basten

[Diadora Van Basten]

18 minutes ago, Gundermann said:

 

Just wondering when and where this happened?

 

Not denying it but there's plenty evidence of Jews, Muslims and Christians living in close proximity and peace with each other. Even in Andalucia, IIRC, the Jews that had lived there during the Caliphate were then expelled by the Reconquistas. Conversions and intermarriage wasn't that uncommon too, I believe.

 

Basically, most people just want to get on with their lives. Zealots and bams in power in both Iran and Israel are dragging us into this.

The Palestinians believed they could live in peace with the Jews based on their experiences in Andalucia. Whilst the Zionists were peddling the myth that Palestine was a land without people for a people without a land.

[OBE]

28 minutes ago, Jim_Duncan said:

And to think we have the capability of sending people to the moon but don’t use it. 

 

Oz, still has capacity, they could take em, many could even die en route using sail through the Rid Sea...

Edited April 19 by OBE

[Gundermann]

4 hours ago, Jim_Duncan said:

And to think we have the capability of sending people to the moon but don’t use it. 

😄

 

Who polices the police though...?

[OTT]

4 hours ago, Diadora Van Basten said:

Netanyahu has announced Israel are going to spend £5 billion on rebuilding Gaza for Israeli settlers.

 

The US that claims to be in favour of a two state solution has used its veto to stop Palestine being recognised as a state by the UN.

 

Israel bombed a children’s play park killing 12 kids.

 

Its disgusting and an abuse of the veto. 

 

No nation should be vetoed from joining the United Nations. The People of Palastine are a seperate and distinct group from Israel, and as you say, by virtue of their alleged support for a 2 state solution, they're just abusing their veto at this point. 

 

I think a question all of us should be asking is why is our political establishment so cosy with Israel, whilst the rest of the country isn't. Being out of step in this manner is wrong, and suggests to me that Politicians are serving 2 masters here - The people & Israel. This friends of Israel lobby group needs to be banned. If we had a China, North Korea or Russian one, I'm fairly certain folk would be up in arms about foreign interference in our politics. 

 

God help our politicians if we're dragged into a war defending those ****s because they will not be taking the population at large with them there, and I do wonder how long before demonstrations turn into riots. 

[Gundermann]

4 hours ago, Lovecraft said:

**** Israel and **** Hamas.  Also, **** Iran.

 

Israel needs to keep the US onboard, so they will continue to goad Iran to keep the threats real.

 

Give them all nukes and let them get on with it.

 

 

 

Netanyahu's get out of jail card, it seems. After the bombing of the aid-workers and world opinion, even in the US turning against the Israeli govt, and with growing opposition at home, it's perfect for Netanhayu to start a war with another nearby bam.

 

Like oor ain Wattie observed with Thatcher and the Falklands... 

 

 

[Diadora Van Basten]

15 minutes ago, OTT said:

 

I think a question all of us should be asking is why is our political establishment so cosy with Israel, whilst the rest of the country isn't. Being out of step in this manner is wrong, and suggests to me that Politicians are serving 2 masters here - The people & Israel. 

Norman Finkelstein made the point “in every country that is allies with Israel, both the government and the opposition support Israel while the population does not”. Even in the US recent polling show more Americans think that Israel is committing genocide to those that don’t think they are committing genocide and that is despite no main stream media and hardly any politicians calling it a genocide.

 

In short Israel has either brainwashed or bought our politicians or in Keir Starmer’s case both apply.

[Diadora Van Basten]

23 minutes ago, Gundermann said:

 

Netanyahu's get out of jail card, it seems. After the bombing of the aid-workers and world opinion, even in the US turning against the Israeli govt, and with growing opposition at home, it's perfect for Netanhayu to start a war with another nearby bam.

 

Like oor ain Wattie observed with Thatcher and the Falklands... 

 

That’s exactly his strategy. 

[OTT]

11 minutes ago, Diadora Van Basten said:

Norman Finkelstein made the point “in every country that is allies with Israel, both the government and the opposition support Israel while the population does not”. Even in the US recent polling show more Americans think that Israel is committing genocide to those that don’t think they are committing genocide and that is despite no main stream media and hardly any politicians calling it a genocide.

 

In short Israel has either brainwashed or bought our politicians or in Keir Starmer’s case both apply.

 

Oh I think they've bought and paid for the vast majority of politicians. 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Labour_Friends_of_Israel#Officers

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservative_Friends_of_Israel

https://www.declassifieduk.org/david-lammy-friend-of-israel/

https://www.declassifieduk.org/labour-mps-have-accepted-over-280000-from-israel-lobby/#:~:text=Eight of those MPs are,he had won the election.

 

Its beyond scandalous. I've no doubt there is some tenous arguement about how technically those donating are based in the UK therefore its okay, but the fact remains that these donations have compromised the ability of parliamentarians to look at a ****ing genocide for what it is. All objectivity has been lost, and despite over 13,000 children now dead, they still are pussy footing around calling this out. Christ, Israel bomb the Iranian embassy in Syria, Iran responds and Iran are the bad guys? Actually do me a favour. 

 

 

IIRC Lindsay Hoyles dad is a very senior member of the LFI and given Hoyles antics around the SNPs opposition day around the vote on Gaza, its pretty clear to see that they will throw the rule book out of the window to continue justifying Israels crimes. 

 

Israel remind me more and more of the malnurished wee chav we all had at School that acted the big man because their big brother would always dig them out of any bother. Thats exactly what the US/ West at large are doing for them. 

[Diadora Van Basten]

5 minutes ago, OTT said:

 

Israel remind me more and more of the malnurished wee chav we all had at School that acted the big man because their big brother would always dig them out of any bother. Thats exactly what the US/ West at large are doing for them. 

Israel are desperate for the US to attack Iran. Former prime minister Naftali Bennet wrote in the Washington post back in December 23 urging them to bomb the headquarters of the Iranian Revolutionary guard. It was also always the Neocons plan to attack Iran after Iraq but Iraq was such a disaster that it didn’t happen.

[Jim_Duncan]

1 hour ago, Gundermann said:

😄

 

Who polices the police though...?

Sting.

[OTT]

2 minutes ago, Diadora Van Basten said:

Israel are desperate for the US to attack Iran. Former prime minister Naftali Bennet wrote in the Washington post back in December 23 urging them to bomb the headquarters of the Iranian Revolutionary guard. It was also always the Neocons plan to attack Iran after Iraq but Iraq was such a disaster that it didn’t happen.

 

Its like they're choking on WW3. 

 

I'm sick of it. Politicians and their need for self importance are going to be the death of us all. I hate them all. 

[J.T.F.Robertson]

14 hours ago, luckyBatistuta said:

And now Israel has only gone and done it. Just struck Isfahan in Iran. Near nuclear facilities too it’s saying on some sites. Worrying times.

 

A "now we're even" gesture, save face and prevent something worse.

Pity every potential conflict isn't handled similarly.

 

 

 

[Jim_Duncan]

3 hours ago, OTT said:

 

Its like they're choking on WW3. 

 

I'm sick of it. Politicians and their need for self importance are going to be the death of us all. I hate them all. 

WW2 didn't work out too well for them at the time, so I'm assuming they hope the law of averages comes into play.

[OTT]

Just now, Jim_Duncan said:

WW2 didn't work out too well for them at the time, so I'm assuming they hope the law of averages comes into play.

 

If Politicians cause WW3, we better be having a no holds barred repeat of the Nuremberg trials. Hang the *******s, one and all. 

 

Sick of America thinking they're playing 4D chess with international politics/security

Sick of Israel behaving like they're untouchable

Sick of the UK supporting Israel

Sick of Germany's Holocaust guilt justifying them turning the other way on Israels genocide

Sick of Russia despite being the largest ****ing country angling for even more land

Sick of China trying to get Taiwan - they don't want to be ****ing Chinese!!

Sick of ISIS not ****ing dying off

Sick of Gordon Brown opening his ****ing trap like he didn't lie through his teeth in 2014. 

 

Probably more stuff I'm sick of, but thats a solid start

[Mikey1874]

On 17/04/2024 at 16:38, Diadora Van Basten said:

A picture paints a thousand words.

 

"Brexit and Libya... don't feck up again"

 

[Mikey1874]

Clearly antisemitic. Expect complaints.

 

 

[il Duce McTarkin]

10 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

Clearly antisemitic. Expect complaints.

 

 

 

😢

[Jim_Duncan]

43 minutes ago, OTT said:

 

If Politicians cause WW3, we better be having a no holds barred repeat of the Nuremberg trials. Hang the *******s, one and all. 

 

Sick of America thinking they're playing 4D chess with international politics/security

Sick of Israel behaving like they're untouchable

Sick of the UK supporting Israel

Sick of Germany's Holocaust guilt justifying them turning the other way on Israels genocide

Sick of Russia despite being the largest ****ing country angling for even more land

Sick of China trying to get Taiwan - they don't want to be ****ing Chinese!!

Sick of ISIS not ****ing dying off

Sick of Gordon Brown opening his ****ing trap like he didn't lie through his teeth in 2014. 

 

Probably more stuff I'm sick of, but thats a solid start

You’ve got a lot of anger. Chill. 

[OTT]

2 minutes ago, Jim_Duncan said:

You’ve got a lot of anger. Chill. 

 

I'm genuinely not angry, I'm tired. But I do stand by hanging the *******s if there is another world war. 

[Diadora Van Basten]

The US just voted to give £21.3 billion to the fascist, racist state of Israel to help them murder more Palestinian civilians.

 

No doubt a percentage of this money will find its way into US Congress politicians back pocket via AIPAC.

Edited April 20 by Diadora Van Basten

[Cade]

On 19/04/2024 at 19:45, OTT said:

 

Sick of China trying to get Taiwan - they don't want to be ****ing Chinese!!

 

 

Taiwan still calls itself The Republic of China, considers itself to be the only true China and lays claim to all of China as its rightful government.......

Which is why mostly every other nation on the planet doesn't get involved, diplomatically.

[il Duce McTarkin]

1 hour ago, Diadora Van Basten said:

The US just voted to give £21.3 billion to the fascist, racist state of Israel to help them murder more Palestinian civilians.

 

No doubt a percentage of this money will find its way into US Congress politicians back pocket via AIPAC.

 

They'll be able to do a fair amount of murdering for £21.3 billion, one would imagine.

 

[Mikey1874]

Ryan Garcia is an American professional boxer. 

 

 

[Diadora Van Basten]

3 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

Ryan Garcia is an American professional boxer. 

 

 

There is plenty of aid available but it’s being blocked by Israel from entering Gaza.

 

I have not seen anything in the media to say that Israel have actually opened the gates they said they would open in the North following the World kitchen murders. 

[XB52]

11 minutes ago, Diadora Van Basten said:

There is plenty of aid available but it’s being blocked by Israel from entering Gaza.

 

I have not seen anything in the media to say that Israel have actually opened the gates they said they would open in the North following the World kitchen murders. 

World opinion, even in the governments of US and UK we're turning against Israel. A quick bombing of the Iranian consulate and Gaza is forgotten once again. 

[Jim_Duncan]

21 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

Ryan Garcia is an American professional boxer. 

 

 

And Andrew Tate is a British-American professional arsehole. 
 

If he’s backing the Palestinians, it’s probably a fair shout to go full-Zionist. 

[Diadora Van Basten]

19 minutes ago, XB52 said:

World opinion, even in the governments of US and UK we're turning against Israel. A quick bombing of the Iranian consulate and Gaza is forgotten once again. 

Yet again the UK and media are found missing in action and the bombing of the Iranian consulate, the first bombing of a consulate since the Venice convention of 1961 and previously considered an act that would turn the entire world against a country and killed Iranian army Generals amongst others went by without condemnation and has been air brushed out of the UK government narrative that concentrated entirely on the pre warned, slow motion, non lethal Iranian retaliation.

[Mikey1874]

As I said on the other thread, Britain has transferred all its intelligence resources and some military support from Ukraine to support Israel against Iran.

 

Priorities.