Toby

[H2]

17 hours ago, Clerry Jambo said:

Atkinson hill Rowles Cochrane is your back 4 for Saturday 

Wrong, It will rightly be:

Hill, Sibbick, Rowles, Cochrane.

[Smithian]

Sibbick is too young to give up on. But they have to add an experienced defender next to him and not just hope for Halkett's health.

[feej]

38 minutes ago, bigfatskinnyjambo97 said:

Aye, he's got mistakes in him. But how many times we seen him make a 50 yard recovery run and put a challenge in as last man? He's not the finished article, but all this 'he's shite' stuff is from the tilted old losers brigade. Stick Halkett in beside him and the worst parts of his game are somewhat eliminated. 

He can certainly cover the ground when required. 

As I've said multiple times on various threads we need a centre back that can organise, be aggressive and can talk others through the game.

Toby and Rowles would benefit from that. I like and rate Halkett and hope he gets back to something like his best but I do wonder about his durability with all those injuries he gets.

Whoever in charge will hopefully know this and we'll get at least one new centre back that fits the bill.

[bigfatskinnyjambo97]

1 hour ago, feej said:

He can certainly cover the ground when required. 

As I've said multiple times on various threads we need a centre back that can organise, be aggressive and can talk others through the game.

Toby and Rowles would benefit from that. I like and rate Halkett and hope he gets back to something like his best but I do wonder about his durability with all those injuries he gets.

Whoever in charge will hopefully know this and we'll get at least one new centre back that fits the bill.

Yeah spot on mate! One thing I know for sure - Rowles definitely cannae play left back again. Did you notice how bad his positioning was at times? Serious serious schoolboy stuff. 

[ramrod]

Sibbick doesn't do the ugly side of defending anywhere near enough. 

Will never cut it up here unfortunately. 

Goldson, CCV , Starflelt, Pollock, Scales , all huddles but absolutely perfect for the Scottish game. 

We should be on the phone to Blackpool trying to off load him as soon as the season is over.

[KyleLafferty]

Still think he’s a holding midfielder is giving time.

[feej]

33 minutes ago, bigfatskinnyjambo97 said:

Yeah spot on mate! One thing I know for sure - Rowles definitely cannae play left back again. Did you notice how bad his positioning was at times? Serious serious schoolboy stuff. 

Indeed, disappointed how Rowles is doing to be honest, not a left back and not convincing as a centre back yet.

Had a great WC but was maybe being talked through these matches, willing to give him a chance though.

[OTT]

31 minutes ago, KyleLafferty said:

Still think he’s a holding midfielder is giving time.

 

Yeah, folk can insist till they're blue in the face that he's a CB. We're not binning Rowles, and since the two can't partner each other because they're awful together, he's a defensive mid. 

 

Would rather give up the ghost and watch him grow there, than keep persevering. He may well turn into a CB later in his career, but he just isn't offering enough within our current partnership. If we had a left footed ball winner like Berra, I've no doubt he'd look good. But we need to deal with the cards we have, not what we wish we had. 

[pettigrewsstylist]

1 minute ago, OTT said:

 

Yeah, folk can insist till they're blue in the face that he's a CB. We're not binning Rowles, and since the two can't partner each other because they're awful together, he's a defensive mid. 

 

Would rather give up the ghost and watch him grow there, than keep persevering. He may well turn into a CB later in his career, but he just isn't offering enough within our current partnership. If we had a left footed ball winner like Berra, I've no doubt he'd look good. But we need to deal with the cards we have, not what we wish we had. 

Last 3 games only, business end of the season. Its truly farsical, eyebleeding and inexplicable after so many minutes at CB. Wish it wasnt so.

Like the guy, talented and athletic, strong and energetic with good attitutude as far as i can tell. Pace to burn. Get him out of CB before ruined though. 

Cant rely on 40 from Shanks and Gino next yr to scrape 4th.

 

[bigfatskinnyjambo97]

20 minutes ago, feej said:

Indeed, disappointed how Rowles is doing to be honest, not a left back and not convincing as a centre back yet.

Had a great WC but was maybe being talked through these matches, willing to give him a chance though.

Aye, definitely. Same with Sibbick, has some good attributes but needs to tune his game a bit to meet the required standard. Still fairly young in terms of CBs so I have hope for him! 

[Koolkeith]

19 hours ago, Cruyff said:

Does the right thing 90% of the time, makes a mistake and that's what everyone sees. 🤷🏻‍♂️ They're no robots. 

Makes mistakes that lead to goals on a regular basis. For me he can’t read the game well defensively. Constantly in the wrong place when defending balls into the box.  

[OTT]

Just now, pettigrewsstylist said:

Last 3 games only, business end of the season. Its truly farsical, eyebleeding and inexplicable after so many minutes at CB. Wish it wasnt so.

Like the guy, talented and athletic, strong and energetic with good attitutude as far as i can tell. Pace to burn. Get him out of CB before ruined though. 

Cant rely on 40 from Shanks and Gino next yr to scrape 4th.

 

 

Yeah, our defence is an embarrassment. Genuinely. I've posted on other threads, but we have an absolute Rolls Royce in Shankland being supported by crap. Good players like that, when they're dragging their team kicking and screaming to a fairly mediocre season aren't likely to stick around for long. We need to get a proper defence so Shanklands goals aren't being spent on draws and defeats. 

 

I'm not slating Toby, my view is that both Rowles and Sibbick are good players but they're too alike and neither are a leader at the back. We need to decide on one or the other and then sign an appropriately sided experienced "heid the baw" type centreback. I know we have Halkett, but his fitness cannot be relied on anymore and we'd be daft to go into next season without a proper CB pairing. 

 

I really can't overstate how disappointed I am in this team, as well as Savage and those we trust to know football matters. 3rd was there for the taking, even after our capitulation but because we had delusions of grandeur about ball playing CBs, we've ended up with a soft as shite defence. Its all just a bit amateur and pathetic. 

[Finlay James]

20 hours ago, Absolute Scenes said:

Have defended him and love him but he single handedly cost us a win tonight. Ridiculous brain fart. We’d have won that game and gone into Saturday playing for third. We’re now going in to stop us finishing 5th. Unacceptable and we need to upgrade

You’re right he made a mistake.  We all do and we learn and move on.

 

Toby will be all the better for it, he has huge potential.

[Tom Hardy’s Dug]

8 hours ago, Taffin said:

He's got great assets - pace, one on ones and passing.

 

Last night was a real shocker and we can't continue as we are. 

 

I still believe with an experienced partner he can become a really good player for us at cb. Him and Rowles isn't the way forward though. It one plus Halkett or a new signing for me, and I'd much prefer it to be Sibbick as I don't think Rowles has anywhere near the raw attributes of Sibbick.

I tend to agree with this.

 

I also think that if a proper experienced respected coach came in (🤨) and said “you could earn a fortune by switching to DM” he’d do it.

 

Hed be like Haring on speed IMO.

[Taffin]

23 minutes ago, Tom Hardy’s Dug said:

I tend to agree with this.

 

I also think that if a proper experienced respected coach came in (🤨) and said “you could earn a fortune by switching to DM” he’d do it.

 

Hed be like Haring on speed IMO.

 

Interesting you mention Haring on speed. I was thinking the same last night, until I remembered aerial ability is an asset for Haring. I guess up against opposing midfielders he may be just on stature alone. But the rest, absolutely agree. There's definitely a good player in there. If he was good in the air and not prone to brain farts he'd be well above our level imo.

[pettigrewsstylist]

1 hour ago, OTT said:

 

Yeah, our defence is an embarrassment. Genuinely. I've posted on other threads, but we have an absolute Rolls Royce in Shankland being supported by crap. Good players like that, when they're dragging their team kicking and screaming to a fairly mediocre season aren't likely to stick around for long. We need to get a proper defence so Shanklands goals aren't being spent on draws and defeats. 

 

I'm not slating Toby, my view is that both Rowles and Sibbick are good players but they're too alike and neither are a leader at the back. We need to decide on one or the other and then sign an appropriately sided experienced "heid the baw" type centreback. I know we have Halkett, but his fitness cannot be relied on anymore and we'd be daft to go into next season without a proper CB pairing. 

 

I really can't overstate how disappointed I am in this team, as well as Savage and those we trust to know football matters. 3rd was there for the taking, even after our capitulation but because we had delusions of grandeur about ball playing CBs, we've ended up with a soft as shite defence. Its all just a bit amateur and pathetic. 

August window was a gamble that backfired almost immediatley. Jan window was negligent in extreme.

Really hope we are not heading for next season based on what we have , minus Hill and Smith, plus Halkett .

Edited May 25, 2023 by pettigrewsstylist

[pettigrewsstylist]

38 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

Interesting you mention Haring on speed. I was thinking the same last night, until I remembered aerial ability is an asset for Haring. I guess up against opposing midfielders he may be just on stature alone. But the rest, absolutely agree. There's definitely a good player in there. If he was good in the air and not prone to brain farts he'd be well above our level imo.

So lets try moving  him to a part of the pitch where that doesnt result in attempts on goal. The guy can go on to be a real baller and influence games. Look at his goal at easter rd. I think we can use his head up approach from midfield to good effect.

[colinmaroon]

 

I watched Toby's brainfart again, and I think his intention was to back-head it to Clark.   That's a very difficult thing to get timing spot on when he was backing off.

 

KISS!

 

Keep it simple stupid.

 

 

[Tom Hardy’s Dug]

41 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

Interesting you mention Haring on speed. I was thinking the same last night, until I remembered aerial ability is an asset for Haring. I guess up against opposing midfielders he may be just on stature alone. But the rest, absolutely agree. There's definitely a good player in there. If he was good in the air and not prone to brain farts he'd be well above our level imo.

Maybe we were both just thinking about speed?

 

Anyway, point remains. From even a snapshot last night Haring is infinitely better in midfield than defence and I think Sobbick could make a huge step forward in his career by doing the same.

 

I don’t know why he is adverse to it? Youthful inexperience?

[DS98]

He’s almost a brilliant centre half. Unfortunately he’s got zero aggression and very weak in the air. Two things that often go hand-in-hand and you can’t really teach. You’ve either got it or you don’t. 
 

Been better than Rowles this season though. 

[Tom Hardy’s Dug]

2 hours ago, colinmaroon said:

 

I watched Toby's brainfart again, and I think his intention was to back-head it to Clark.   That's a very difficult thing to get timing spot on when he was backing off.

 

KISS!

 

Keep it simple stupid.

 

 

Was a brain fart but what communication did he get from Clarke?

[BackOfTheNet]

Now I think of it, thinking back to the seethe and unnatural hatred for one of our own players Sibbick received earlier in the season, I think many have had to reluctantly bottle up their seethe when he went months playing consistently well and doing things like scoring one of the all time classic derby goals.

 

Now he’s had a bad mistake, and a couple of games where multiple people are to blame but some only want to single him out, it’s like these people who he shut up last year are letting it all out now.

Edited May 25, 2023 by BackOfTheNet

[soonbe110]

2 hours ago, colinmaroon said:

 

I watched Toby's brainfart again, and I think his intention was to back-head it to Clark.   That's a very difficult thing to get timing spot on when he was backing off.

 

KISS!

 

Keep it simple stupid.

 

 

If he just let it go it was going to Clark. 

[the posh bit]

14 hours ago, Flimsy said:

Me too. Rowles and Sibbick wouldn't have to make so many recovery tackles if they dealt with situations first time and their positioning was better. They both couldn't lace the boots of many of the excellent centre backs we've been lucky to see at Hearts over the years. Sibbick has been compared to Zaliuckas and Pressley on this thread, but although both took a year to settle in, they never made as many brainfarts between them over several years as out current pairing have this season alone.

 

I loved Zaliukas but the above just isn't correct, it took much more than a year for him to become a very good player for us, although for some he was never really liked. 

 

Folk that think defenders who make 40 yard run recovery tackles are doing a good job are having a laugh. 

[bigfatskinnyjambo97]

10 minutes ago, the posh bit said:

 

I loved Zaliukas but the above just isn't correct, it took much more than a year for him to become a very good player for us, although for some he was never really liked. 

 

Folk that think defenders who make 40 yard run recovery tackles are doing a good job are having a laugh. 

Give the guy some credit man! If he had everything, he wouldn't be at the club. Not the finished article but a good lad and a decent player. 

[the posh bit]

4 minutes ago, bigfatskinnyjambo97 said:

Give the guy some credit man! If he had everything, he wouldn't be at the club. Not the finished article but a good lad and a decent player. 

 

Who Zal or Toby? 

[bigfatskinnyjambo97]

7 minutes ago, the posh bit said:

 

Who Zal or Toby? 

Thread name: "Toby" 

[the posh bit]

Just now, bigfatskinnyjambo97 said:

Thread name: "Toby" 

 

I like Toby. I think he could play in midfield. 

[bigfatskinnyjambo97]

3 minutes ago, the posh bit said:

 

I like Toby. I think he could play in midfield. 

Good. Me too. Remember his first spell under Stendel he played there against St Johnstone in Perth and he was decent! 

[the posh bit]

24 minutes ago, bigfatskinnyjambo97 said:

Good. Me too. Remember his first spell under Stendel he played there against St Johnstone in Perth and he was decent! 

 

Yes, he will hopefully feature in the midfield more next season. 

[colinmaroon]

2 hours ago, Tom Hardy’s Dug said:

Was a brain fart but what communication did he get from Clarke?

 

If he had glanced it back it would have been as safe as houses, but he didn't, so, brainfart.  As I said, back peddling ss he was, too difficult to get timing right, clear it ya numpty. 

[colinmaroon]

2 hours ago, soonbe110 said:

If he just let it go it was going to Clark. 

 

Probably.