***Official Heart of Midlothian v Istanbul Basaksehir ( KO 17:45 ) Match Thread***

[Francis Albert]

22 minutes ago, Pans Jambo said:

Maybe they should just give Hearts £3M for finishing 3rd so we don't have to bother with European games.

We are blatantly nowhere near the levels required to compete. Complete whipping boys in Europe it seems.

Why would we get paid for  finishing third?

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

I think the problem is that people think we are better than what we are. 2 king size holes in the team, Souttar and Simms. Not that they played that often together, however when one other or both played we were strong up front or at back.

 

Midfield has not been addressed in the summer or well enough, we have one more part yet to see. 

 

However we cant compare ourselves to teams paying 20k a week for a player, we can certainly expect better against 10 teams in our league.

 

Folk need to get out of their camps and find the middle ground, I'm not happy with what I'm seeing right now, but it can turn back the other way very quickly. If they stop sulking, show some character, been sadly lacking this last couple of weeks, arses need kicked

[GinRummy]

Just now, Lord Beni of Gorgie said:

I think the problem is that people think we are better than what we are. 2 king size holes in the team, Souttar and Simms. Not that they played that often together, however when one other or both played we were strong up front or at back.

 

Midfield has not been addressed in the summer or well enough, we have one more part yet to see. 

 

However we cant compare ourselves to teams paying 20k a week for a player, we can certainly expect better against 10 teams in our league.

 

Folk need to get out of their camps and find the middle ground, I'm not happy with what I'm seeing right now, but it can turn back the other way very quickly. If they stop sulking, show some character, been sadly lacking this last couple of weeks, arses need kicked

Halkett as well tbf. We are a shambles defensively and we’re not a shambles when Souttar was out last season. 

[4marsbars]

Some of our key players out injured, several others clearly not fully fit, outplayed by a better team with a much bigger budget.

 

Disappointing, but we're hardly in 'sack the manager' territory.

[We_are_the_Hearts]

Robbie doing his bit for the local pubs. Every cloud n that 

[Ex member of the SaS]

Apart from the obvious defending disasters I thought we did well until the second went in and feel the result doesn't reflect the game as they got two deflections that I feel Craig would have saved. There is the obvious questions as to why Robbie is playing Mckay so deep and on the wing when he plays better with a roving slot. Why do we have everyone back at corners? 

There were flashes of decent play and we need to be sharper/quicker when moving the ball/striking, we seem to want to walk the ball into the net when in a night like last night the ball being wet etc we should be having a go from the edge of the box.

I have said before we should not be ignoring the league for this as we will not get anywhere this season and should concentrate on getting third and the money that bring so we can build a team able to compete at this level. Imagine the teams we would be facing had we gone into the higher league?

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

10 minutes ago, GinRummy said:

Halkett as well tbf. We are a shambles defensively and we’re not a shambles when Souttar was out last season. 

Halkett too, yes. I thought we deteriorated through April in truth, but again Halkett was out then also. I havent mentioned Beni either, we have suffered some blows, really done very little to reinforce the spine, unless Orestis turns out good.

 

Shankland cant do what Simms did, unfair to think it, he is a pen box striker trying to do other bits, might be an unpopular view but Humprhys looked more likely when he came on to get us moving or hold it in.

 

We have lost our way more than a wee bit, some calm required, some resolve required, grind out back to back results, momentum swings back. 

[GinRummy]

6 minutes ago, Lord Beni of Gorgie said:

Halkett too, yes. I thought we deteriorated through April in truth, but again Halkett was out then also. I havent mentioned Beni either, we have suffered some blows, really done very little to reinforce the spine, unless Orestis turns out good.

 

Shankland cant do what Simms did, unfair to think it, he is a pen box striker trying to do other bits, might be an unpopular view but Humprhys looked more likely when he came on to get us moving or hold it in.

 

We have lost our way more than a wee bit, some calm required, some resolve required, grind out back to back results, momentum swings back. 

All fair view and observations. Hopefully the football is off for a week or two, other than the trip to Riga, as a chance to regroup and maybe get a player or two back would do us the world of good. If we can come back with Halkett, Kiomourtzoglou and Snodgrass all fit and ready to go, you’d hope we’d improve. 

[Pans Jambo]

1 hour ago, Francis Albert said:

Why would we get paid for  finishing third?

So we don't have to endure another shitshow like last night!

[buzzbomb1958]

3 hours ago, ali_jambo said:

People said that in the championship season. We won the league at a canter.

 

People said that last season. Came third at a canter and got to a cup final.

 

Is it possible that you guys just don't like Robbie?

Nothing personal but he’s a championship manager no more than that the season we came up the teams in the league we’re absolutely shit , beaten by Brora ffs that should have done for him , his recruitment is a shambles and injuries are being covered by guys that should have been let go 

[ali_jambo]

20 minutes ago, buzzbomb1958 said:

Nothing personal but he’s a championship manager no more than that the season we came up the teams in the league we’re absolutely shit , beaten by Brora ffs that should have done for him , his recruitment is a shambles and injuries are being covered by guys that should have been let go 

A championship manager who has never finished any lower than third in the Prem. 😄

[Francis Albert]

51 minutes ago, Pans Jambo said:

So we don't have to endure another shitshow like last night!

Who would pay us and why would they?

We are not exactly guaranteed third are we?

[No Idle Talk]

The morning after the night before. I have a hangover to match my mood. A few drinks were necessary after yesterday's performance. A few reflections of mine..............

 

That was another poor performance. Yes their team is worth a lot more money than ours is but that was still unacceptable. We can't just hide behind the money argument, look at the result Rigas got. 

 

One of the most troubling aspects of last night's performance is that we looked scared at the start of the match and then our heads went down when the scoreline went to 0-2. This is not a good sign. There is a real lack of confidence throughout the team at the moment. Perhaps not surprising given that we have lost six of our last seven fixtures and we have failed to score a goal in the last three.

 

Robbie needs to sort the mess out soon or he is in trouble. Yes we have injuries. Yes that isn't helpful. But we still have enough in the squad to be doing better than we have been doing lately. It is Robbie's job to find solutions. Switching back and forth between the same two formations, and shifting around deckchairs on the Titanic with his team selections, is not working. He needs to find some way to get these players back on track. It looks to me like the players are beginning to lose confidence in what they are doing and in themselves. If this is allowed to fester for too long, a season can turn bad. I'm not sure what the coaching staff are working on in training as far as our attacking play goes but we look a shell of a team in that department. Some creative thinking is needed in that area.

 

The atmosphere last night. I didn't think it was great. They managed to dampen the atmosphere down pretty quickly I felt. That was a bit disappointing. Maybe the strange kick off time played some part in it, I don't know. Hopefully it will be better for Fiorentina.

 

And finally...........the minute's silence. Having read the accounts of people on here who were at the match, the following is what seems to have happened. During the minute's silence, one idiot has shouted out FTQ. Some people have reacted and started booing when they heard this. Unfortunate but understandable. Once enough people start booing you get people shouting out telling people to shut up and the whole thing gets messy. Then some people decide it is a good idea to sing GSTQ. It wasn't. That just escalated things. My conclusion is.......the guy who shouted FTQ is an idiot. He should have been chucked out the ground for the rest of last night's match. The people who decided they wanted to turn Tynecastle into Ibrox for ten minutes, I view them as no better. As someone else on here quite wisely said earlier, the fact that most people booed the initial person who shouted FTQ, and also booed when the Rangers song book broke out, probably is indicative of the fact that most Hearts fans views are in alignment on this issue. In that they don't want politics brought into Tynecastle on match days. Which is a good thing.

 

All in all it was a pretty disastrous evening. The football was bad and of course there was the other carry on. Hopefully there are better nights to come in Europe but it's hard to feel confident of that the way the team is performing right now. These are beginning to become worrying times.

[jr ewing]

2 hours ago, Lord Beni of Gorgie said:

Worked as I expected......mores the pity

Pity. 

[Harry Potter]

4 hours ago, John Findlay said:

Why did we get schooled tonight?

Simple answer they are a far better team than us.

Why is this?

Imho their players are far more football intelligent than us.

What do I mean by this?

I mean their speed of thought is far quicker than our players, so speed that they do things on the pitch is far quicker than our players.

Their is a reason why this team are the top seeds.

We all know we are not going to win this competition, therefore I see no reason why we do not give games from the start to the likes of Finlay Pollock and Connor Smith. I am convinced their young minds will act quicker and therefore their actions with the ball will be far quicker than I'm afraid to say Andy Halliday and Michael Smith.

Both have been very good servants to the club in their time here but, they are not what we need in these European games.

Yes Peter Haring was at fault for the first goal when he fannied about with the ball at the edge of his own box, but he did come the closest to scoring for us during the whole game when his header was cleared off the line, though it did look over the line to my naked eye high up in section S. Peter will play a forward ball.

I'm gutted as that was our highest European defeat since the gubbing PSG gave us in Paris nearly 40 years ago, the highest European defeat since Hamburg schooled us in 1976, still at least they went on to win the European Cup Winners Cup that season.

Despite last night it still won't stop me from being at Tynecastle for our next two home ties, and our next home league game(whenever that may be now), I'm a Hearts supporter, and that never changes.

 

PSG were far better than that lot last night.

[Sinbad the Sailor]

Close the thread. They were miles better than us. Not a surprise unless you're thick. Minute silence an absolute embarrassment. No matter anyone's views its not much to ask to shut up for 60 seconds.

 

 

[John Findlay]

3 minutes ago, Harry Potter said:

PSG were far better than that lot last night.

There can be a good argument put forward that the 1984 Hearts team were better than the current team.

Football has changed a very lot in the last forty years(not by a longshot for the better), the pursuit of money not trophies has ruined it a great deal.

Unfortunately Heart of Midlothian don't have the money that many in the support would wish.

[Tom Hardy’s Dug]

3 hours ago, Lord Beni of Gorgie said:

I think the problem is that people think we are better than what we are. 2 king size holes in the team, Souttar and Simms. Not that they played that often together, however when one other or both played we were strong up front or at back.

 

Midfield has not been addressed in the summer or well enough, we have one more part yet to see. 

 

However we cant compare ourselves to teams paying 20k a week for a player, we can certainly expect better against 10 teams in our league.

 

Folk need to get out of their camps and find the middle ground, I'm not happy with what I'm seeing right now, but it can turn back the other way very quickly. If they stop sulking, show some character, been sadly lacking this last couple of weeks, arses need kicked

Through ignorance they also think teams or players they haven’t heard of aren’t any good.

 

It seems unless a team is in the EPL they are pish.

[Sherbet]

3 hours ago, Lord Beni of Gorgie said:

I think the problem is that people think we are better than what we are. 2 king size holes in the team, Souttar and Simms. Not that they played that often together, however when one other or both played we were strong up front or at back.

 

Midfield has not been addressed in the summer or well enough, we have one more part yet to see. 

 

However we cant compare ourselves to teams paying 20k a week for a player, we can certainly expect better against 10 teams in our league.

 

Folk need to get out of their camps and find the middle ground, I'm not happy with what I'm seeing right now, but it can turn back the other way very quickly. If they stop sulking, show some character, been sadly lacking this last couple of weeks, arses need kicked

souttar hardly  played

[Pasquale for King]

Players turning their backs on shots, and guys like Cochrane refusing to put their bodies on the line for the cause does not help in any way. 

[Pasquale for King]

20 minutes ago, Tom Hardy’s Dug said:

Through ignorance they also think teams or players they haven’t heard of aren’t any good.

 

It seems unless a team is in the EPL they are pish.

That’s a British thing, nobody is as good us. 

[Pasquale for King]

4 minutes ago, Sherbet said:

souttar hardly  played

We weren’t great at the back either when he did, Gordon was one the busiest GKs in the league last season. 

[Watt-Zeefuik]

3 hours ago, Lord Beni of Gorgie said:

I think the problem is that people think we are better than what we are. 2 king size holes in the team, Souttar and Simms. Not that they played that often together, however when one other or both played we were strong up front or at back.

 

Midfield has not been addressed in the summer or well enough, we have one more part yet to see. 

 

However we cant compare ourselves to teams paying 20k a week for a player, we can certainly expect better against 10 teams in our league.

 

Folk need to get out of their camps and find the middle ground, I'm not happy with what I'm seeing right now, but it can turn back the other way very quickly. If they stop sulking, show some character, been sadly lacking this last couple of weeks, arses need kicked

 

We won over 50% of our games before Simms arrived, including beating Celtic. I honestly think we miss Boyce more than Simms.

[OldGorgie]

7 hours ago, Francis Albert said:

How do Riga and Hearts compare financial backing wise? There were lots of mismatches financially in Conference League games last night. There were few if any mismatches on the pitch as great as that in our game.

The reality is if we cannot beat Livi how on earth can we beat European teams

[Fozzyonthefence]

8 minutes ago, OldGorgie said:

The reality is if we cannot beat Livi how on earth can we beat European teams

Riga drew twice with Linfield, scoring in injury time in the first leg and the 120th minute in the second leg to take it to penalties, yet they managed a draw away to Fiorintina.  I don’t know what their budget is but I’d wager it’s a hell of a lot less than ours. Just shows what is possible. 

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

2 hours ago, Sherbet said:

souttar hardly  played

Not true at all

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

1 hour ago, Led Tasso said:

 

We won over 50% of our games before Simms arrived, including beating Celtic. I honestly think we miss Boyce more than Simms.

We miss both, doesn't have to be one or tother, more or less, problem with this forum, everything has to be so definitive in a desperation to be correct, not aimed at you in all honesty

[chrystaf]

1 minute ago, Lord Beni of Gorgie said:

We miss both, doesn't have to be one or tother, more or less, problem with this forum, everything has to be so definitive in a desperation to be correct, not aimed at you in all honesty

Moot point.

[Sherbet]

1 hour ago, Lord Beni of Gorgie said:

Not true at all

He missed more than he played

[Luckies1874]

Was some strike but wtf was Haring up to 

 

 

[Pasquale for King]

9 minutes ago, Luckies1874 said:

Was some strike but wtf was Haring up to 

 

 

Forrest turning away wasn’t great either, the deflected goal and the one where Cochrane didn’t challenge Okaka were poor also. 

[Unknown user]

11 hours ago, Pasquale for King said:

Players turning their backs on shots, and guys like Cochrane refusing to put their bodies on the line for the cause does not help in any way. 

 

I forgot about this til you said that, about 15 minutes in we cleared some danger from the box, but not far. Atkinson, pretty much on our penalty spot, turned to shout at the linesman about offside or something, turning his back on the play that then moved into the right back position after they'd won the ball back!

 

I've been supportive of him but someone has to have a chat with him about the basics of defending - bloody concentrate for starters!

[Riccarton3]

Could someone kindly remind me the guaranteed financial monies due to Hearts from the group matches? And any additional for a point or win?

[Sherbet]

2 minutes ago, Riccarton3 said:

Could someone kindly remind me the guaranteed financial monies due to Hearts from the group matches? And any additional for a point or win?

Think the monies for wins will.be nil.  But remember it's a learning curve

[Riccarton3]

2 minutes ago, Sherbet said:

Think the monies for wins will.be nil.  But remember it's a learning curve

Yep. But there is guaranteed £ for just being in the group. 

[Jeff]

8 hours ago, Pasquale for King said:

Forrest turning away wasn’t great either, the deflected goal and the one where Cochrane didn’t challenge Okaka were poor also. 

 

Everybody looked scared to challenge Okaka.

 

In fairness there whole team looked bigger and fitter... Begs the question what are they doing that we don't?

[Pasquale for King]

Just now, Jeff said:

 

Everybody looked scared to challenge Okaka.

 

In fairness there whole team looked bigger and fitter... Begs the question what are they doing that we don't?

Indeed, said it at the time that there’s no reason why our players can’t be as fit or stronger than they are currently. Remember Zal trying to outmuscle Defoe and bouncing off him against Spurs all those years ago?

[Pasquale for King]

8 hours ago, Smithee said:

 

I forgot about this til you said that, about 15 minutes in we cleared some danger from the box, but not far. Atkinson, pretty much on our penalty spot, turned to shout at the linesman about offside or something, turning his back on the play that then moved into the right back position after they'd won the ball back!

 

I've been supportive of him but someone has to have a chat with him about the basics of defending - bloody concentrate for starters!

Yeah and my mate beside nearly had a fit when he tried that clearance in the second half. He’s needs to learn soon. 

[Jeff]

12 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

Indeed, said it at the time that there’s no reason why our players can’t be as fit or stronger than they are currently. Remember Zal trying to outmuscle Defoe and bouncing off him against Spurs all those years ago?

 

Makes you wonder what the sports science teams in Scotland are all about.

[Nelly Terraces]

2 minutes ago, Jeff said:

 

Makes you wonder what the sports science teams in Scotland are all about.

After he returned from his stint at MKD Robbie Neilson himself said he didn’t think players here are as fit as their English based counterparts.
 

Surprising then that it looks as if he’s done virtually nothing to rectify that issue at the club he’s the manager of, despite having the best infrastructure & expertise you could wish for.

[BossmanDaz]

16 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

Yeah and my mate beside nearly had a fit when he tried that clearance in the second half. He’s needs to learn soon. 

I had some choice language at that myself if you mean the penalty box incident. 

[Riccarton3]

7 minutes ago, Nelly Terraces said:

After he returned from his stint at MKD Robbie Neilson himself said he didn’t think players here are as fit as their English based counterparts.
 

Surprising then that it looks as if he’s done virtually nothing to rectify that issue at the club he’s the manager of, despite having the best infrastructure & expertise you could wish for.

When so far behind financially, you need to find ways to counteract it. Superior or at least equality in fitness levels would seem one achievable target. Though it may be a level of athleticism is beyond some of our players especially ones who are too battle scarred to reach the required levels

Edited September 10, 2022 by Riccarton3

[cameron79]

1 hour ago, Riccarton3 said:

Could someone kindly remind me the guaranteed financial monies due to Hearts from the group matches? And any additional for a point or win?

Think its around 400k for a win and 200k for a draw

[cameron79]

48 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

Yeah and my mate beside nearly had a fit when he tried that clearance in the second half. He’s needs to learn soon. 

Me or Atkinson? 😄😄

[hmfc_liam06]

9 hours ago, Pasquale for King said:

Forrest turning away wasn’t great either, the deflected goal and the one where Cochrane didn’t challenge Okaka were poor also. 

All the goals were shocking from our point of view, all totally avoidable.

[Pasquale for King]

22 minutes ago, cameron79 said:

Me or Atkinson? 😄😄

I thought we had swapped personalities for a split second 😜?!?!

Edited September 10, 2022 by Pasquale for King

[Pasquale for King]

50 minutes ago, BossmanDaz said:

I had some choice language at that myself if you mean the penalty box incident. 

Indeed, it was a scary moment. 

[Pasquale for King]

2 minutes ago, hmfc_liam06 said:

All the goals were shocking from our point of view, all totally avoidable.

Absolutely, and if Sibbick or Neilson had been at fault they would’ve been slaughtered for it. 

[Pasquale for King]

58 minutes ago, Jeff said:

 

Makes you wonder what the sports science teams in Scotland are all about.

It really does, as Nelly says we have the best facilities apparently. Although I remember being told they skimped on the equipment when they built it. 

[Dayman]

If we could afford superior athletes, they’d be of far inferior technical abilities.
 

There’s a reason why players get fitter, stronger and faster as you go into better leagues.

 

Not every body is made the same. The top level clubs can identify those “built differently” from a fairly young age. They then nurture those players with superior facilities and coaches. It’s not rocket science.

 

It would take years and years of intense dedicated training to improve our players to that elite level, if even possible. If Okaka sat in his house for 5 years, would Kingsley ever be able to out strength him, even with the top strength coaches for the next 5 years? Maybe. But probably not.

 

So please stop saying “wE CaN aTlEaSt Be FitTeR tHaN tHeM”.

 

The extra time committed to attempt to get there would make the product on the park horrific. 

 

Yours sincerely, an S+C coach.