Derby ratings

[red]

2 hours ago, tcjambo said:

For me Cochrane and Boyce

Agreed

[red]

2 hours ago, Martin_T said:

 

Disagree re Boyce, felt he was poor today, rarely found a team mate.

 Are you having a laugh! He was immense today 

[NB GIN]

3 hours ago, Scott Leitch said:

Totally baffling changing formation. You wonder what goes through his head. 

He is a fool never come across a manager like him 

Stick to a formation and get on with it 

 

When do rangers or Celtic change shape ?

 

never 

[NB GIN]

2 hours ago, JamboBoy said:

3 main problems.

Not taking chances

Making too many subs when they are not actually needed and are quite frankly just disruptive. The same last week v RC and in my view was a factor in us losing the goal.
Making a change of formation when the previous one was working just fine.

Last 2 are down to Robbie. He tries to be too clever too often. I hope someone is making this point to him. These are the results that will cost us dearly this season. We need to keep clean sheets too. Both matches so far should have been, but we’rent unfortunately. 

100% spot on but you will get the abuse for stating the obvious. He overthinks and thinks he is sold kind of tactical genius. 
Also changed players for the sake of it 

He cost us the game not the players 

[XB52]

3 hours ago, Walter Bishop said:

Neilson 0 - If ever there was a game to sum Robbie Neilson up then this was it. 

FTH

[XB52]

3 hours ago, Gordon Ramsay said:

Neilson 0. Only rating that matters unfortunately. *****. 

FTH

[XB52]

Gordon 8

Smith 5

Halkett 7

Rowles 8

Cochrane 9

Haring 8

Grant 6

Forrest 7

Boyce 9

McKay 7

Shankland 8

 

Atkinson 7

Sibbick 2

Devlin 3

Halliday no time

 

Cochrane MoM

[XB52]

4 minutes ago, NB GIN said:

100% spot on but you will get the abuse for stating the obvious. He overthinks and thinks he is sold kind of tactical genius. 
Also changed players for the sake of it 

He cost us the game not the players 

Our players were knackered, you would have noticed that if you were watching the game. 1 second earlier and everyone would have been happy but the pHoodle boys are ecstatic tonight 

[NB GIN]

6 minutes ago, XB52 said:

Our players were knackered, you would have noticed that if you were watching the game. 1 second earlier and everyone would have been happy but the pHoodle boys are ecstatic tonight 

They were totally in control of the game before he changed it 

[i8hibsh]

Gordon 6 

Smith 2

Halkett 5

Rowles 4

Cochrane 8

Haring 6

Grant 2

Forrest 2

Boyce 5

McKay 6

Shankland 5

 

Atkinson 1

Sibbick 0

Devlin 0

 

Atkinson does some good work going forward but he is a quite awful defender. Sibbick is a bombscare, Forrest had a good 20 minute spell but was anonymous for the rest.  Apart from shite corners, I never even noticed Grant.  Smith needs to retire and Rowles was meh.

 

All the above being said, we were still the better team and deserved the 3 points.

 

 

[XB52]

4 minutes ago, NB GIN said:

They were totally in control of the game before he changed it 

We were totally in control after he changed it

[mitch41]

the game was won then Neilson's bottle went and he went all frightened rabbit

[colinmaroon]

3 hours ago, Taffin said:

 

When it comes to Sibbick it's becoming apparent that is the case for some.

 

The same mentality that saw Zal as a bombscare, which he was to start with.

 

Thank goodness we stuck with him.

 

 

[upgotheheads]

4 hours ago, Walter Bishop said:

Neilson 0 - If ever there was a game to sum Robbie Neilson up then this was it. 

 

4 hours ago, Greedy Jambo said:

We suck. 

 

4 hours ago, Gordon Ramsay said:

Neilson 0. Only rating that matters unfortunately. *****. 

 

What a load of P15h

[Cynic]

Cochrane for me by a street

[Taffin]

3 minutes ago, colinmaroon said:

 

The same mentality that saw Zal as a bombscare, which he was to start with.

 

Thank goodness we stuck with him.

 

 

 

Yeh, I'm probably a bit swayed by that. I met Zal when he first joined and he was an absolute gent, so I was always desperate for him to do well. I'd have defended him to the hilt...but he was a bombs at times early days.

 

People just look to pin everything on Sibbick, like they did with Clare. Yeh, they might not be up to scratch but when you start seeing him blamed solely for what happened today it's clear it's personal. If he'd stayed in his position he'd have been blamed for not covering, so he covers and still gets the blame as he made a hash of it. Should he have done better? Yes...but he shouldn't have needed to. Where was the midfield tracking back, or the centre back, or the left centre back? It was a collective mess, yet it was Sibbick who immediately cops it.

[upgotheheads]

4 hours ago, Cruyff said:

Gordon 8

Smith 6

Halkett 8

Rowles 8

Cochrane 9

Haring 9

Grant 6

Forrest 6

Boyce 8

McKay 8

Shankland 8

 

Atkinson 5

Sibbick 2

Devlin 3

Halliday N/A

 

Pretty fair. H1b5 were just about worth the draw on the day. An away point to a team who might well be our nearest league competitor this season is not so bad.

[Mac80]

Cochrane was top class. 

[Martin_T]

1 hour ago, red said:

 Are you having a laugh! He was immense today 

 

Worked hard but we need more from someone playing in the no 10 role than just work rate. Don't recall him either creating any chances or having any himself.

[DS98]

2 hours ago, upgotheheads said:

 

Pretty fair. H1b5 were just about worth the draw on the day. An away point to a team who might well be our nearest league competitor this season is not so bad.

I’m all for positivity but unless we plan on finishing 8th or 9th then no, that dugshit Hibs team won’t be our nearest competitor. For a home team in a derby they were absolutely rotten.

[ArcticJambo]

Here's what I remember from the game:

Gordon, diving strong arm save,

Smith, nothing

Halkett, strolled it

Rowles, pumping balls up the pitch often aimlessly, and often without pressure

Cochrane, hit by chips, otherwise failing to see the love

Haring, generally on the ball, wan yelly (good game)

Grant, ohh my give the corners to someone else, anybody else

McKay, guid but ffs put it away

Boyce, hustlin Rocky

Forrest, nothing

Shanks, nice finish. unlucky poke and hustlin Rocky.

 

Bold are mymen!!

Edited August 7, 2022 by ArcticJambo

[PaddysBar]

5 minutes ago, ArcticJambo said:

Here's what I remember from the game:

Gordon, diving strong arm save,

Smith, nothing

Halkett, strolled it

Rowles, pumping balls up the pitch often aimlessly, and often without pressure

Cochrane, hit by chips, otherwise failing to see the love

Haring, generally on the ball, wan yelly (good game)

Grant, ohh my give the corners to someone else, anybody else

McKay, guid but ffs put it away

Boyce, hustlin Rocky

Forrest, nothing

Shanks, nice finish. unlucky poke and hustlin Rocky.

 

Bold are mymen!!

Agreed. Especially on Rowles although would disagree on Cochrane. Thought he made a few very important interceptions to stop the attacking. Rowles Hitting 7 irons up the pitch to no-one and twice put it out of play when he could easily have passed back to CG. Was good in the defensive sense though. 
 

Atkinson will be gone by the end of the season I reckon. Quite like him but will take a fair degree of improvement to make the grade and I’m not sure he’s capable but happy to be proved wrong. 
 

Still time to recruit 3/4 decent players though, we’re going to need them. 

 

 

 

[No Idle Talk]

Craig Gordon - 8

Michael Smith - 5

Alex Cochrane - 9

Craig Halkett - 8

Kye Rowles - 6

Peter Haring - 7

Jorge Grant - 6

Barrie McKay - 7

Liam Boyce - 7

Alan Forrest - 6

Lawrence Shankland - 8

 

Not going to rate the subs. 

 

Craig Halkett was my MOTM until the last kick. He got skinned in the build up to their goal so I had to knock a point off him for that. He had a great game otherwise.

[ArcticJambo]

2 minutes ago, PaddysBar said:

Agreed. Especially on Rowles although would disagree on Cochrane. Thought he made a few very important interceptions to stop the attacking. Rowles Hitting 7 irons up the pitch to no-one and twice put it out of play when he could easily have passed back to CG. Was good in the defensive sense though. 
 

Atkinson will be gone by the end of the season I reckon. Quite like him but will take a fair degree of improvement to make the grade and I’m not sure he’s capable but happy to be proved wrong. 
 

Still time to recruit 3/4 decent players though, we’re going to need them. 

 

 

 

I mean I just don't remember, which probably means he was fine/solid.  Seen a lot of nods to MotM. Think if that was the case I might have noticed him, I'd have thought. Still two good games for him so far so no complaints really.

 

Yes, definitely need a coupl emore players at least, Stromng running CF and a RCB.

[Chillidigits]

Early days. First derby at Tynie last season all square. After that we didn't do too badly if I recall.

[Mac80]

2 hours ago, Martin_T said:

 

Worked hard but we need more from someone playing in the no 10 role than just work rate. Don't recall him either creating any chances or having any himself.

He put one on a plate for atkinson when he cut it back to him. 

[Martin_T]

23 minutes ago, Mac80 said:

He put one on a plate for atkinson when he cut it back to him. 

 

Fair enough, forgot about that one. I like him as a player, but didn't think he performed today. Opinions eh! 

 

[BervieJambo]

So those having a go at Robbie for changing the shape when Smith went off are the same ones who say that Atkinson can’t defend… hence the need to put Sibbick in behind him. So he should have kept the same shape and put on Sibbick out of position (ok some may say RCB is not his position, but RB certainly isn’t) or risk 19 year old Neilson in that position.

I’ll go against the grain & say that both subs did well in the time they were on, apart from being jointly culpable with the rest of the back line (including MOM Cochrane) for Boyles goal.

The only mistake I think Robbie made was not bringing on Gino for Shankland at the same time as Halliday came on to worry them with his pace. They do need to work on retaining possession though, as giving it away so often just put more pressure on the defence & eventually led to the goal.

I’d give 6s all round apart from Gordon, Cochrane & Shankland who get 7s.

[hearts00]

56 minutes ago, BervieJambo said:

So those having a go at Robbie for changing the shape when Smith went off are the same ones who say that Atkinson can’t defend… hence the need to put Sibbick in behind him. So he should have kept the same shape and put on Sibbick out of position (ok some may say RCB is not his position, but RB certainly isn’t) or risk 19 year old Neilson in that position.

I’ll go against the grain & say that both subs did well in the time they were on, apart from being jointly culpable with the rest of the back line (including MOM Cochrane) for Boyles goal.

The only mistake I think Robbie made was not bringing on Gino for Shankland at the same time as Halliday came on to worry them with his pace. They do need to work on retaining possession though, as giving it away so often just put more pressure on the defence & eventually led to the goal.

I’d give 6s all round apart from Gordon, Cochrane & Shankland who get 7s.

Completely agree with the point about retaining the ball. This is the key marker of a proper team. Until I see this, the ability to dominate the ball, retain it, doctate the tempo we are not taking it to the next level. 
 

While I thought we were far superior to Hibs I was quite disappointed by our use of the ball. We didn’t break the lines enough and too often went long from the back. 

[PhoenixHearts]

7 hours ago, Debut 4 said:

Mate, you need to see beyond that.  If we need to improve as a team we need more perception and quicker play in his role.  I never said he was crap, it was a mixed bag.  I’ve felt for long enough that to people they see a guy play in an area and do a job, we need more than that.

 

He’s rarely getting beyond half way.  He rarely takes a quick touch and plays it quicker.  It’s all methodical and safe.  Many instances today if you saw the game.
 

Don’t get me wrong, I’ve like Peter for most part at Hearts. I’ve nothing against him in general.   His injuries have caught up and anyone would have sympathy there.  I do.   It’s time to move on or Hearts won’t.   

 

In my humble opinion, that is a load of absolute hogwash.

[Jamhammer]

10 hours ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

Yes I have. He wasn't rectifying anything, he was in No Man's Land.

Waiting for a ball to come to him rather than attacking it like the rat did.

Yes, Halkett was skinned but that’s basic defending 

[ScoPo]

4 hours ago, DS98 said:

I’m all for positivity but unless we plan on finishing 8th or 9th then no, that dugshit Hibs team won’t be our nearest competitor. For a home team in a derby they were absolutely rotten.

Correct.

 

We were carving them open at will until Neilson changed it and sat in for a 1-0.

[Watt-Zeefuik]

8 hours ago, davie1980 said:

 

I've seen us start with 7 or 8 defensive outfield players in the past and defended the decision.

 

But looking at that today shines it in a different light.

You actually see the team doing well, playing well and on top away from home in one of the biggest fixtures of the season.

 

Then you see us creep back in terms of shape and then progressively get slightly more defensive minded with each successive sub and you see how we ended up absolutely backs to the wall.

 

We talk about the OF winning mentality, could you ever imagine Celtic doing what we did today after being the better team for so long and only being a goal ahead? It'd never happen.

 

I'm not all that far from you on this, but can I imagine Celtic doing it? Ange's Celtic do it all the time. It's how we caught them once last season and nearly got a result at Celtic Park. They roar at you for 60 minutes then the steam goes out.

 

7 hours ago, Taffin said:

 

Yeh, I'm probably a bit swayed by that. I met Zal when he first joined and he was an absolute gent, so I was always desperate for him to do well. I'd have defended him to the hilt...but he was a bombs at times early days.

 

People just look to pin everything on Sibbick, like they did with Clare. Yeh, they might not be up to scratch but when you start seeing him blamed solely for what happened today it's clear it's personal. If he'd stayed in his position he'd have been blamed for not covering, so he covers and still gets the blame as he made a hash of it. Should he have done better? Yes...but he shouldn't have needed to. Where was the midfield tracking back, or the centre back, or the left centre back? It was a collective mess, yet it was Sibbick who immediately cops it.

 

Halkett too. The JKB consensus was that he was never good enough to be a CH and was a bombscare. Now he's the old castle rock of our defence.

[Uncle Buck]

Gordon - 7 One very good save.

 

Smith - 6 Did ok.

Halkett - 8 Strolled it until the last minute.

Rowles - 7 A good defender but distribution was poor.

Cochrane - 8 Some great interceptions - motm.

 

Grant - 6 Didn’t try to control the game enough and set pieces poor.

Haring - 8 Bossed it.
 

Forrest - 6 A grafter but not much influence. 
Boyce - 8 Best game for a while. Worked hard and was creative at times.

McKay - 7 Has that little bit of magic but should have scored.

 

Shankland - 8 Great goal and great strength/work ethic.

 

 

All the subs were poor and to change formation around the 60 minute mark was simply bizarre.

[red]

I thought the divide in class yesterday was there for all to see. We were brilliant for large spells yesterday away from home. Halkett, Boyce and Cochrane superb. Gutted at the way we lost it the win but that’s football and we must be taking these chances (McKay 🤦🏻‍♂️) but we are making the chances and in time Boyce and Shanks WILL put them

away. They have done their whole career. 
 

gutted about the outcome but delighted with the performance. 
 

also for once after looking at the team selection I walked over the bridge of doom happy that we were playing our best team (minus SK). Scottish Football doesn’t require wholesale changes week in week out so ffs stick to the team Robbie! 

[jambo_4_eva]

17 hours ago, davie1980 said:

 

I've defended him a hundred times on here. Often because we set up defensive and changed it later in the game.

 

Often starting with 7 defensive players keeps it tight early then we change and get something, some times it doesn't work.

 

But today we set out ambitious and showed, on their patch, that we are a better team.

 

We then swapped a fullback for a centre back, and a winger for a full back. And changed to a more defensive set up.

Then we subbed a supposedly more creative midfielder for a combative defensive one then finished by taking off a forward for another fullback.

 

Every change took us deeper and in the end we invited pressure and sat in and lumped the ball out just for it to come back at us and in the end we got what we deserved.

That was entirely down to mentaility today and a team with a winning mentality, who have beeen the better team for the vast majority of the first 80 minutes don't fold like that.

 

Robbie was being praised for his set up at the start and he is to thank for us being the better team for long spells but has to take the blame for that result, which should never have happened.

Disagree a bit. We were comfortable letting hibs pile the pressure. We made mistake and got punished. Need to stop analysing what went wrong. We had chances to finish the game. Its all fine margins. 

[We_are_the_Hearts]

Neilson out, will never change. We can do better

[The Black Prince]

Just goes to show how people see the game so differently - any number of comments on here making me think: WTF? Were we watching the same game?

 

For me...

 

Gordon was excellent, didn't have a chance with the goal and made one outstanding save early. Dealt well with crosses.

 

Cochrane - fantastic - my MOTM.

 

Shankland was good - did a power of work at both ends, and Boyce very effective. But the strikers (plus McKay and Atkinson) should've put the game beyond doubt much earlier. Need someone fast up front both for impact and defensive outlet.

 

Rowles and Halkett look like they are developing a really good relationship but probably needs to be in a 4 at the back. All the changes to shape and personnel late got eveyone confused. I would've had Rowles as a contender for MOTM until his miscalculation led to the chaos from which they scored. As for his aimless balls forward - there were two or three late as he was clearing the danger, but there was no outlet for him. Everyone had dropped so deep he would only have brought extra pressure if he'd tried to finesse the ball out of harm's way. Before then, his distribution was spot on and he even brought the ball forward a few times - especially first half.

 

Haring - pretty good game.

 

As for Atkinson, I suspect some are still seeing the game he had last week and judging him on that. He brought some good impetus going forward (except for a couple of overhit passes) and I don't remember him missing a tackle in defense. Played one dodgy ball out of defense but made up for it by winning the ball straight back. He had plenty of decent games last year, didn't he? Needs to practice his finishing though - that shot had to go far post and the keeper doesn't even see it.

 

 

 

 

[Boof]

I tend not to do ratings but I notice that the clueless prick, Andrew Petrie (perhaps there's a clue in the name?), has awarded MotM on the BBC page to Martin Boyle.

Hibernian 1-1 Heart of Midlothian: Boyle earns hosts dramatic draw - BBC Sport

[RobboM]

17 minutes ago, The Black Prince said:

 

 

As for Atkinson, I suspect some are still seeing the game he had last week and judging him on that. He brought some good impetus going forward (except for a couple of overhit passes) and I don't remember him missing a tackle in defense. Played one dodgy ball out of defense but made up for it by winning the ball straight back. He had plenty of decent games last year, didn't he? Needs to practice his finishing though - that shot had to go far post and the keeper doesn't even see it.

 

 

 

 

Not just last week but since signing Atkinson hasn't looked to be a good enough defender. I don't think Neilson trusted him as  a straight like for like replacement for Michael Smith at right back so when he was subbed he made the change to shape which contributed to the draw. We've got a RB problem.

[Harry Potter]

10 hours ago, Chillidigits said:

Early days. First derby at Tynie last season all square. After that we didn't do too badly if I recall.

good call , bit sensible for this place.

[The Black Prince]

12 minutes ago, RobboM said:

Not just last week but since signing Atkinson hasn't looked to be a good enough defender. I don't think Neilson trusted him as  a straight like for like replacement for Michael Smith at right back so when he was subbed he made the change to shape which contributed to the draw. We've got a RB problem.

Agree the change of shape wrong-footed the team and contributed to the dropped points but still don't see what Atkinson did that let the team down in defence. He let the team down more with his shooting.

[hmfc_liam06]

15 hours ago, davie1980 said:

 

I've seen us start with 7 or 8 defensive outfield players in the past and defended the decision.

 

But looking at that today shines it in a different light.

You actually see the team doing well, playing well and on top away from home in one of the biggest fixtures of the season.

 

Then you see us creep back in terms of shape and then progressively get slightly more defensive minded with each successive sub and you see how we ended up absolutely backs to the wall.

 

We talk about the OF winning mentality, could you ever imagine Celtic doing what we did today after being the better team for so long and only being a goal ahead? It'd never happen.

 

Celtic don't do it because their resources and talent are miles ahead of every other opponent bar Rangers.

 

We're better than Hibs, but we're not at a level where we can expect to continually attack. 9/10 a team who are 1-0 up in this league will inevitably sit in towards the end, we've done it it numerous derbies and got the result, as luck would have it we didn't quite manage it yesterday.

 

If we had everyone would be congratulating Neilson and the team on a brilliant win. As I said yesterday, this was the result some were looking for in order to get their pitchforks out again, it's embarrassing.

[The Black Prince]

Just rewatched the equaliser...

 

It's a long throw. Rowles is nearest to the man receiving the ball and decides to go for the challenge then realises he won't get there and drops off. He probably expects the man to control the ball but instead it's chested off to Boyle putting Rowles way out of position. To his credit, he tries to bring down Boyle but misses and stumbles. Boyle plays the ball to (I think) Youan who skins Halkett and hits a ball hard and low back across where Sibbick might have intercepted but Boyle nips in ahead and Gordon has no chance.

 

All three are to blame, but it's basically a loss of judgment and timing due it being the 95th minute. They switched off.

 

Hopefully Neilson is all over that but also reflecting on his own error of judgment in making so many changes at the back in the closing stages. The players were all over the place.

[Harry Potter]

19 minutes ago, The Black Prince said:

Just rewatched the equaliser...

 

It's a long throw. Rowles is nearest to the man receiving the ball and decides to go for the challenge then realises he won't get there and drops off. He probably expects the man to control the ball but instead it's chested off to Boyle putting Rowles way out of position. To his credit, he tries to bring down Boyle but misses and stumbles. Boyle plays the ball to (I think) Youan who skins Halkett and hits a ball hard and low back across where Sibbick might have intercepted but Boyle nips in ahead and Gordon has no chance.

 

All three are to blame, but it's basically a loss of judgment and timing due it being the 95th minute. They switched off.

 

Hopefully Neilson is all over that but also reflecting on his own error of judgment in making so many changes at the back in the closing stages. The players were all over the place.

Another case of our defence not closing down attackers quick enough.

[The Old Tolbooth]

19 hours ago, Martin_T said:

8s and 9s from drawing with Hibs? Not for me.

 

That's my take from it too, Gordon only had 2 saves to make, but he done it well (not counting the goal obviously), I thought Shankland, Boyce, and Haring all had really good games along with Rowles, the rest were middle of the road and bang average, I didn't think it was a good performance at all against a woeful Hibs side and we sat further and further back from midway through the second half, when it was very clear that if we kept on attacking them, then they were folding at the back very easily, our finishing was poor, but probably fell to the wrong players. Rocky Bushiri makes Sibbick look like Virgil Van Dyke, he's that bad! 

[ford donald]

18 hours ago, red said:

 Are you having a laugh! He was immense today 

 Agree,Boyce worked his socks off,wonder what game the op was watching!

[ford donald]

22 hours ago, David McCaig said:

Today was the day Alex Cochrane become a man, absolutely immense and his best performance in a maroon jersey.

 

Thought thats the best i have seen him,long may it continue!

[Chillidigits]

5 hours ago, The Black Prince said:

Just rewatched the equaliser...

 

It's a long throw. Rowles is nearest to the man receiving the ball and decides to go for the challenge then realises he won't get there and drops off. He probably expects the man to control the ball but instead it's chested off to Boyle putting Rowles way out of position. To his credit, he tries to bring down Boyle but misses and stumbles. Boyle plays the ball to (I think) Youan who skins Halkett and hits a ball hard and low back across where Sibbick might have intercepted but Boyle nips in ahead and Gordon has no chance.

 

All three are to blame, but it's basically a loss of judgment and timing due it being the 95th minute. They switched off.

 

Hopefully Neilson is all over that but also reflecting on his own error of judgment in making so many changes at the back in the closing stages. The players were all over the place.

Yes switched off and the same happened for the Ross County goal. If they switch off again and to conserve energy switch off the power so that the showers run cold as a gentle reminder not to **** up again.

[Gimme an H...]

6 hours ago, The Black Prince said:

Just rewatched the equaliser...

 

It's a long throw. Rowles is nearest to the man receiving the ball and decides to go for the challenge then realises he won't get there and drops off. He probably expects the man to control the ball but instead it's chested off to Boyle putting Rowles way out of position. To his credit, he tries to bring down Boyle but misses and stumbles. Boyle plays the ball to (I think) Youan who skins Halkett and hits a ball hard and low back across where Sibbick might have intercepted but Boyle nips in ahead and Gordon has no chance.

 

All three are to blame, but it's basically a loss of judgment and timing due it being the 95th minute. They switched off.

 

Hopefully Neilson is all over that but also reflecting on his own error of judgment in making so many changes at the back in the closing stages. The players were all over the place.

 

A few failures right enough - but the complete lack of awareness from Sibbick and his half arsed sticking out of a leg towards the cut back sums him up as a player. 

 

Far too casual and weak.