Harry Cochrane leaving

[Costanza]

2 hours ago, King prawn said:

Thanks for that goal against Celtic and tackle in the Hibs game but apart from that he didn’t do much. Won’t play for a bigger club than Hearts imo but good luck to him. 

I was actually disappointed in that tackle against Hibs. I want a player who has the pace and determination to win the ball back, not be outpaced and cynically hack a player down.

I don't think he was particularly developed well by Levein and feel a bit sorry for him being shunted out on loan this season.

You'd have thought this season would have been the ideal time to throw some youngsters in and give them game time in the system we intend to play. Neilson however has just decided to win the league at all costs it seems and we don't seem to have moved our youth development on at all.

Anyway,  good luck to him.

[sadj]

1 hour ago, No Idle Talk said:

I am a little mystified and a bit disappointed by what has happened here. To play the way he played at the age of 16 against a very good Celtic side just screamed potential. But for whatever reason, things just haven't kicked on from there.

 

Hearts did offer him a new contract, so they must still see something in him, but maybe he feels he needs first team football at this stage in his career and that he is more likely to find that elsewhere. If that is the case then good luck to the lad. 

Not always , possibly in Harry’s case but he has done nothing in nigh on 3?? years to warrant a contract offer so may be something to do with compensation of he goes elsewhere in Scotland. 
 

 

1 hour ago, blairdin said:

I don't think the problem is developing young players at the Academy - the thing we've got wrong for years is integrating the best of the youngsters into the first team squad and starting XI, and figuring out how to keep them there and keep them motivated. I don't think 6 month loans here and there is the right way to keep them happy and developing.

 

It's something Stendel seemed better at during his short spell. 

 

Hickey was an exceptional talent and made himself undroppable, but for me Cochrane had and still has bags of potential. I don't understand why he was loaned out this season. 

 

Irving and Cochrane both seeing their futures elsewhere is a bit concerning.

 

You don’t understand why he was loaned out this season when we didnt have reserve or bounce games to play in , when we required to bounce straight back up and also when he failed badly at Dunfy last year? You think we should have kept him around and done what with him? 

[Thomaso]

3 hours ago, EH11 said:

 

To quote the JKB 'experts'

 

"Craig Levein is an arrogant cock-womble who is responsible for everything that is wrong with Hearts, including the size of the cludgies".

 

Insert and repeat at your leisure.

 

It's boring, it doesn't bring anything to the conversation, it encourages division.  The same folks repeating the same opinions as truth day after day.

 

You aren't the worst Thomaso but the 'debate' on here is knickers.

Your quote is bang on - apart from the size of the cludgies which was down to the architect! 

[Diadora Van Basten]

I think this is really down to how we develop youth. It seems to me that we sign young players give them a few games then loan them out and thats it.

 

My sons team were very successful at u18 level and had some really talented players. In my days the touch line would have been full with scouts now there are none they are all watching u10 matches. 
 

Boys are getting taken from their friends put into performance schools miles away and at the age of 19 released.

 

I just think it’s all wrong.

[Hearts1975]

1 hour ago, No Idle Talk said:

I am a little mystified and a bit disappointed by what has happened here. To play the way he played at the age of 16 against a very good Celtic side just screamed potential. But for whatever reason, things just haven't kicked on from there.

 

Hearts did offer him a new contract, so they must still see something in him, but maybe he feels he needs first team football at this stage in his career and that he is more likely to find that elsewhere. If that is the case then good luck to the lad. 

By offering him a new contract, at least on the same amount of money that he was on with his current deal, the club protect the development fee due.
 

If they don’t offer him a contract, he can leave for nothing. 
 

Does anyone know what happens if no club want to pay the development fee ? Does that mean he won’t get to move on, or is there an expiry period. Honestly not sure on this point. 

[Jambo in Bathgate]

Saw the writing on the wall for Cochrane last game of the season against Kilmarnock he one was the senior players in that team which had very young guys in team and subs bench.  He never shone through and was at fault for Kilmarnock goal. The other youngsters that day looked much better. He was substituted. He lacks application and self development and really has only himself to blame. 

[1874jrs]

Harry is another player we have failed to develop for whatever reason. We seem to be failing our youth system with the system levein developed of training coaches up. We need the best coaches available to bring our young players on .

[mitch41]

8 minutes ago, Jambo in Bathgate said:

Saw the writing on the wall for Cochrane last game of the season against Kilmarnock he one was the senior players in that team which had very young guys in team and subs bench.  He never shone through and was at fault for Kilmarnock goal. The other youngsters that day looked much better. He was substituted. He lacks application and self development and really has only himself to blame. 

The lads potential has been wasted and it's all down to a lack of a midfield mentor,  when you think of Levein/ Jardine, Robbo/Bone & Clark, Pointon/Naismith and you can go through the years but try and think who was on hand to help Cochrane ?

[Pasquale for King]

11 minutes ago, mitch41 said:

The lads potential has been wasted and it's all down to a lack of a midfield mentor,  when you think of Levein/ Jardine, Robbo/Bone & Clark, Pointon/Naismith and you can go through the years but try and think who was on hand to help Cochrane ?

Levein had Whelan play with him in the reserves for at least one game. It’s still a coaches job to bring him on, none of those names you’ve mentioned could mentor a player they didn’t play beside, Cochrane didn’t get much of chance as around 20 midfielders came and went in his time with us. 

[GavK1012]

We may even do a Jason Holt and wave any fee for his new employers...

 

🤪

[jambopilms]

Didnt show anything at Dunfermline or Montrose. Why are we upset again. 

I would be upset if he was who we were looking at to improve our midfield for next season.

[underwaterwoodwelder]

I blame Robbie he get the blame for everything else.

[Mikey1874]

6 hours ago, CloustonHMFC said:

Disappointed he didn't kick on because he had potential. Both club and player at fault here for stalling. Hasn't set the heather alight when on loan. Not particularly disappointed he's leaving though.

 

He got injured in his second year which set him back. 

 

But it's a curious one. See how his career goes from now.

 

He clearly wants a fresh start. 

[Mikey1874]

16 minutes ago, GavK1012 said:

We may even do a Jason Holt and wave any fee for his new employers...

 

🤪

 

Unless its say Rangers, who can afford his development fee?

[Mikey1874]

1 hour ago, 1874jrs said:

Harry is another player we have failed to develop for whatever reason. We seem to be failing our youth system with the system levein developed of training coaches up. We need the best coaches available to bring our young players on .

 

The big question is how much is it the club and how much the player.

 

I think players are key to succeeding. How much they believe in themselves. How hard they work. Then they need to play. 

 

How many who show promise at 16 actually succeed is another question. 

[Bongo 1874]

Still people deluded to the fact, Levein quoted he was the most technically gifted midfielder, he has seen in a long time 🤔. 

 

Yet our club done hehaw with him 🤔, but it's Harry's fault 🤔even though the plan was to bring through youth players, but we signed rejects like Whelan, Nowak, Kitchen, 

 

And the list goes on and on?. 

 

Are our club responsible for anything these days?. 

 

[Mikey1874]

Just now, Bongo 1874 said:

Still people deluded to the fact, Levein quoted he was the most technically gifted midfielder, he has seen in a long time 🤔. 

 

Yet our club done hehaw with him 🤔, but it's Harry's fault 🤔even though the plan was to bring through youth players, but we signed rejects like Whelan, Nowak, Kitchen, 

 

And the list goes on and on?. 

 

Are our club responsible for anything these days?. 

 

 

At what stage should he have played? In what games? Instead of who? Some say he was played too much. What games should he not have played. 

 

After his first season he was pretty much injured. So that would be season 2019/20 he should have been back in. 

[Bongo 1874]

4 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

The big question is how much is it the club and how much the player.

 

I think players are key to succeeding. How much they believe in themselves. How hard they work. Then they need to play. 

 

How many who show promise at 16 actually succeed is another question. 

That only goes so far in the game, what they are being coached and how they are set up to play, has a big say on how a player can develop his game. 

 

 

Levein said he protected Harry, pure and utter bollocks, he got assaulted at Celtic Park by Brown. 

 

 

This idea that players have to be ready etc bull aswell, if you are good enough you play, didn't do Wayne Rooney any harm. 

Edited April 16, 2021 by Bongo 1874

[Mikey1874]

5 minutes ago, Bongo 1874 said:

That only goes so far in the game, what they are being coached and how they are set up to play, has a big say on how a player can develop his game. 

 

 

Levein said he protected Harry, pure and utter bollocks, he got assaulted at Celtic Park by Brown. 

 

 

This idea that players have to be ready etc bull aswell, if you are good enough you play, didn't do Wayne Rooney any harm. 

 

So Stendel is as much to blame as Levein and Neilson 

[Newton51]

1 hour ago, Hearts1975 said:

By offering him a new contract, at least on the same amount of money that he was on with his current deal, the club protect the development fee due.
 

If they don’t offer him a contract, he can leave for nothing. 
 

Does anyone know what happens if no club want to pay the development fee ? Does that mean he won’t get to move on, or is there an expiry period. Honestly not sure on this point. 

He will be in limbo if we don’t agree A fee and a sell on maybe? If he goes to USA then no fee required 

[Dinger]

3 minutes ago, Bongo 1874 said:

That only goes so far in the game, what they are being coached and how they are set up to play, has a big say on how a player can develop his game. 

 

 

Levein said he protected Harry, pure and utter bollocks, he got assaulted at Celtic Park by Brown. 

 

 

This idea that players have to be ready etc bull aswell, if you are good enough you play, didn't do Wayne Rooney any harm. 

 

lets be honest, Wayne Rooney was just a crazy good player who went on to be Man Utds all time leading scorer, 

 

on the flip side, you have Ravel Morrison who was said (by Ferguson and a host of first team players) to be the most gifted player to come through United's academy, but his off field antics ruined what could have been a tremendous career 

[OldGorgie]

Far to many on here are happy to write off young talent at the club and then bullshit about how great the academy is. 

[thecarnbeejambo]

surely a sad indictment of our acadamy that yet another young player fails to make it.. the only one to break through ( andy irvine)

has refused a new deal..loaning them out so early in their career does not seem to be successful.. would it not have been better to see them develope physically and in a football sense and then loan them out for game time.. we dont expect every player who shows promise  at 14--16 will make the grade but the turn out from our acadamy is very poor... perhaps we will find a 38 year old gem and give him a 4 year deal

[gnasher75]

The last game I remember Cochrane playing was a League Cup game at Tynecastle against Raith at the start of this season. Him and McGill ran the show and Wighton scored a hat trick. Moore and Henderson were both in the starting line up. I had high hopes that night that the young boys would get a good run of games in the Championship. A bit like Paterson, Walker, King etc a few years ago. But for some reason the club has wasted money bringing in more expensive players most of which haven't improved the team. 

 

I would love to know if the contract offered was a decent offer or just at the same level in order to get the development fee. Disappointed once again in the direction we are going.

[Bunny Munro]

Summer 2018 we brought in Lee, Bonzanic, Clare, and Edwards. Haring too although he was supposed to be centre half. Djoum was still at the club.

 

Harry never had a chance after that.

[jambopilms]

Fairly sure Walker, Paterson, Holt and others went out on loan in their early years and did well. Maybe Harry just hasn't got it.

Nonsense to suggest that he was good enough but we just didn't give him a chance. 

Edited April 16, 2021 by jambopilms

[Bunny Munro]

1 hour ago, mitch41 said:

The lads potential has been wasted and it's all down to a lack of a midfield mentor,  when you think of Levein/ Jardine, Robbo/Bone & Clark, Pointon/Naismith and you can go through the years but try and think who was on hand to help Cochrane ?

To be fair, Don Cowie was around for Harry breaking through - I've heard he was good with the helping the younger players.

[been here before]

I get the impression that Cochrane has knocked Hearts back and is now sitting there fully expecting Real Madrid, Bayern, PSG or Barcelona to phone.

 

 

[Spellczech]

2 hours ago, siegementality said:

Amazing to think that Neilson himself - given his very limited ability -was one of the 1 in 10 that came to something!!!

Not really. Neilson was a decent cross-country runner and his energy never lagged during a match. Wasn't hugely fast but was fast enough and could run all day. Cochrane looked slow and lacking in stamina, and worse he was meant to be playing in the "engine room"...Personally, I gave up on Cochrane over a year ago. We simply had too many neat and tidy technical players who failed to offer what the team has been lacking for years - speed. Basically our backup players were even slower than the players they were meant to be alternates for... 

 

A player who lacks pace must cover for that with other things - stamina, different position where pace isn't so necessary, supreme skill with a ball which is worth a yard of pace, effort/drive. It appears that for one reason or another Cochrane failed to find a way of covering for his inherent slowness.

Edited April 16, 2021 by Spellczech

[Bongo 1874]

37 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

So Stendel is as much to blame as Levein and Neilson 

Stendel played Moore, Henderson, Irving, Brandon, all in a relegation battle, give him these players during pre season. 

 

And not coming back of a loan, during a relegation battle?. 

 

Stendel gave more chance to youth last season, than Robbie has this season check the stats. 

 

And that's during a relegation battle. 

 

And if you listen to his podcast he did with Craig fowler, he said if he was in charge this season, he planned to have the basis of the team being youth. 

 

Cochrane, Irving, Smith, Hamilton, etc were all in his plans, stone, he wanted to bleed youth in the championship.

 

Suggest you give his podcast a listen 👍. 

 

 

[Bongo 1874]

42 minutes ago, Dinger said:

 

lets be honest, Wayne Rooney was just a crazy good player who went on to be Man Utds all time leading scorer, 

 

on the flip side, you have Ravel Morrison who was said (by Ferguson and a host of first team players) to be the most gifted player to come through United's academy, but his off field antics ruined what could have been a tremendous career 

Are you suggesting Harry's off field antics have ruined his career with us?. 

 

Or could it be recruiting players in his position ruined it?. 

Edited April 16, 2021 by Bongo 1874

[MadVlad1962]

Embarrassing from the club letting a talent like that go to waste! Levin done the best job with him!! We have 0 assets

[gorgie rd eh11]

It’s a shame he never made it with us and I hope he can go on to have a decent career, but he never kicked on from his early promise so it’s no surprise he’s moving on.

[Bongo 1874]

Aye he doesn't have stamina and pace 😂😂. 

 

Ok guys 👍. 

[GinRummy]

It’s a shame he’s leaving as showed a lot of promise. Best of luck wherever he ends up. 

[Bongo 1874]

Does anyone know how to edit, the video to the goal against celtic to have the song, thunderstruck playing in the background?. 

[Ethan Hunt]

A few people would do well to remember that the club offered Cochrane a new contract, which he has declined. If - as some seem to think - Cochrane ‘doesn’t have it’ then it would appear recruitment at the club is still poor, because - from the media release - it would appear the club wanted to keep him.

 

Somethings wrong somewhere.

[Tom Hardy’s Dug]

1 hour ago, underwaterwoodwelder said:

I blame Robbie he get the blame for everything else.

I can’t think many young players will feel that enthused with the club at present and their chances under Robbie. If you don’t blood a few youngsters in a season in the championship with no pressure from fans in the ground and when you would win the league with a team with 8 donkeys regularly playing in any event when the hell do you do it??

[DH1986]

Harry is leaving......and Bongo miraculously manages to mention Stendel.

 

Sound.

[Hearts1975]

1 hour ago, Newton51 said:

He will be in limbo if we don’t agree A fee and a sell on maybe? If he goes to USA then no fee required 

That’s what I thought - wonder what the fee would be in £ 

[been here before]

34 minutes ago, Bongo 1874 said:

Stendel played Moore, Henderson, Irving, Brandon, all in a relegation battle, give him these players during pre season. 

 

And not coming back of a loan, during a relegation battle?. 

 

Stendel gave more chance to youth last season, than Robbie has this season check the stats. 

 

And that's during a relegation battle. 

 

And if you listen to his podcast he did with Craig fowler, he said if he was in charge this season, he planned to have the basis of the team being youth. 

 

Cochrane, Irving, Smith, Hamilton, etc were all in his plans, stone, he wanted to bleed youth in the championship.

 

Suggest you give his podcast a listen 👍. 

 

 

 

 

As usual...

 

 

Its freaky as **** how you cant get over him.

 

He's gone, he's not coming back.

 

[Tom Hardy’s Dug]

1 minute ago, Ethan Hunt said:

A few people would do well to remember that the club offered Cochrane a new contract, which he has declined. If - as some seem to think - Cochrane ‘doesn’t have it’ then it would appear recruitment at the club is still poor, because - from the media release - it would appear the club wanted to keep him.

 

Somethings wrong somewhere.

Properly managed Cochrane does have it.

 

I think part of the problem is that Hearts haven’t managed the loaning out process very well. Youngsters haven’t gone to clubs that suit their style or managers that are good enough to properly man manage young professional players.

 

I understand that agents have also had an influence in where players have been loaned to which is just crazy to me.

 

As I see it if we are to loan players out to lower league teams we should choose one championship team and one League one team. We need to know and trust the manager.
 

I’d be loaning to any team coached by John McGlynn for example. Laugh all you want but he was the guy that brought in Paterson from nowhere (as an example) and played and improved Templeton to the extent his transfer kept us afloat.

[Spellczech]

3 minutes ago, Ethan Hunt said:

A few people would do well to remember that the club offered Cochrane a new contract, which he has declined. If - as some seem to think - Cochrane ‘doesn’t have it’ then it would appear recruitment at the club is still poor, because - from the media release - it would appear the club wanted to keep him.

 

Somethings wrong somewhere.

Is it not the old Paterson thing where you have to make an offer in order to be in a position to get a development fee? The offer could've been a fiver per week and a packet of smarties for each appearance...

[jr ewing]

30 minutes ago, Bongo 1874 said:

Aye he doesn't have stamina and pace 😂😂. 

 

Ok guys 👍. 

Physicality is everything nowadays. 

[Ethan Hunt]

1 minute ago, Spellczech said:

Is it not the old Paterson thing where you have to make an offer in order to be in a position to get a development fee? The offer could've been a fiver per week and a packet of smarties for each appearance...

The procedure is you have to offer a “realistic” new contract in order to receive a development fee. If you offer a fiver and a packet of smarties  for each appearance, then don’t be too surprised when you get a can of Irn Bru and a Greggs steak bake as a development fee.

[DH1986]

5 minutes ago, Spellczech said:

Is it not the old Paterson thing where you have to make an offer in order to be in a position to get a development fee? The offer could've been a fiver per week and a packet of smarties for each appearance...

The offer has to be at the same or better than his current deal.

[Spellczech]

1 minute ago, Ethan Hunt said:

The procedure is you have to offer a “realistic” new contract in order to receive a development fee. If you offer a fiver and a packet of smarties  for each appearance, then don’t be too surprised when you get a can of Irn Bru and a Greggs steak bake as a development fee.

Ok, forget my flippancy. 

 

I've always believed it is far better for any player to sign for a club for a fee, rather than on a free - why? because it is a degree of proof that the new club actually wants you to play, rather than to merely make up numbers.

 

So perhaps, if Cochrane has intimated that he is going to move on, the club still makes an offer which is serious enough, which the player rejects?

 

What's in it for the player? Perhaps the level of sign-on fees at this level is not particularly high, or perhaps the player wants the club to recoup a development fee?

[hmfc_liam06]

2 hours ago, mitch41 said:

The lads potential has been wasted and it's all down to a lack of a midfield mentor,  when you think of Levein/ Jardine, Robbo/Bone & Clark, Pointon/Naismith and you can go through the years but try and think who was on hand to help Cochrane ?

 

Who was Hickey's mentor, Paterson's? I'm curious.

[Ethan Hunt]

3 minutes ago, Spellczech said:

Ok, forget my flippancy. 

 

I've always believed it is far better for any player to sign for a club for a fee, rather than on a free - why? because it is a degree of proof that the new club actually wants you to play, rather than to merely make up numbers.

 

So perhaps, if Cochrane has intimated that he is going to move on, the club still makes an offer which is serious enough, which the player rejects?

 

What's in it for the player? Perhaps the level of sign-on fees at this level is not particularly high, or perhaps the player wants the club to recoup a development fee?

Ultimately it’s all guesswork. Easy for a player to start a rumour they want to move on. The club takes the bait, make a serious enough offer, and the player accepts. Doubt it works like that to be honest. 
 

Cochrane will have something lined up. Something that he seems to think is better than being at Hearts at this time. Time will tell what that is.

[Bongo 1874]

23 minutes ago, DH1986 said:

Harry is leaving......and Bongo miraculously manages to mention Stendel.

 

Sound.

If you check back fowler you will see I wasn't the one who mentioned Stendel whatsoever 😂 I suggest you and a few others go to specsavers 👍.