Harry Cochrane leaving

[Maroon Sailor]

I wonder why he thinks his future lies elsewhere. Lack of opportunity or lack of belief in his own ability ?

 

 

Edited April 16, 2021 by Maroon Sailor

[Brighton Jambo]

I see the usual posters are using this as another opportunity to have a pop at the club.  
 

He isn’t good enough it’s as simple as that.  He had plenty of chances and couldn’t nail down a spot in the first team.  Hickey did so we don’t have a problem playing them if they are good enough.  
 

He then went to Dunfermline and Montrose and didn’t perform well for either club.  If he can’t do that he’s certainly not good enough for us.  
 

Offering a new deal was sensible to protect the investment we have made but it absolutely no loss he is leaving.  

[johnking123]

Just make sure we put a sell on clause on him. 

[Brighton Jambo]

2 minutes ago, Cruyff said:

Said this in another thread. Cochrane is a talented ball player, who's best position is as a playmaking midfielder. There was no team willing to play Harry as their main midfielder at 18-20 in that role. Instead he was being asked to go box to box, which athletically he is unsuited too, much like it was with O. Lee. 

He needs to find a team that plays good football that will make him their main man. I'd probably say moving to League 1 or 2 in England would give him the opportunity to show his talent as he'd get wads of time on the ball. 

With respect to your viewpoint if he can’t make an impact at Montrose he isn’t going to get a game in league one or two in England.  An opinion I wouldn’t mind being proved wrong on though! 

[leith_dude]

The interesting thing is where he is going to end up.  I'd be surprised if it's at a bigger club than us. 

 

He had a great game against Celtic that day but I can't remember seeing him play that well since then.

 

Still another day another opportunity for some folk to have a go at the club.

 

 

 

[Siphiwe Tshabalala]

We’d be better off adopting the Brentford model and doing away with the academy.

 

For every player that breaks through we will be wasting thousands on others through the years who are not good enough but are needed to carry that 1 player who does breakthrough.

 

Academy coaches will tell you different but that’s the harsh reality.

[Harry Potter]

Will always remember him for that win against Celtic, hope he finds a decent club.

[Siphiwe Tshabalala]

Also, the reason the club won’t do away with the academy is due to the funding the club will receive from the SFA.

[jambo19]

24 minutes ago, sadj said:

 

Jesus Christ! You do know that Cochrane couldn’t get in a poorer Dunfermline team last year? But you think he should have been playing for us this year? He has/had a major attitude problem...Only time will tell if he gets that sorted out. You CAN NOT do everything for a young player. Not every young player makes it that can be due to injury , attitude , application , personal reasons. 
 

Or Harry Stone he seems to be doing fine.

Is there a case if style of play though? You'll always need a goalie and lower league teams may face plenty of shots so the keeper will be more involved. Creative midfield playmaker on the other hand? This isn't just Cochrane, Smith at Arbroath, Irving at Falkirk even Holt at Raith ?

[Howdy Doody Jambo]

I don't think Harry got a chance after an encouraging start 

I think our club has FAILED massively to our youth players and anything in the academy in recent year's 

The talent is their but maybe our coaching staff should question themselves when youngsters stagnate, do not improve and are eventually released 

Good luck to the lad he must be gutted right now but he will be stronger now and have gained experience of what is required to improve his career

Just sick of this shit show top to bottom, What is the point of Riccarton and all these youth teams if no it doesn't produce any 1st team player's of quality? Whose fault is this? 

[gorgieheart]

Cochrane has hardly kicked a ball since that goal against celtic  , couldn't get a game for a very poor dunfermline ... but folk are ragin because we didn't give him the offer of guaranteed first team football in the Premier league  ?

This place has a growing amount of angry people who are just angry because they are just angry... 

 

[Eldar Hadzimehmedovic]

Why loan players to lower league teams? What's the benefit? They play with a bunch of huddies, get kicked all over the place, and get training and instructions from some other random coaches and managers. Much better to let them stay, play youth games and bounce games with their mates, and develop muscle memory in how teams throughout the club play while developing understanding with guys you might break into the first team with. I'd demolish the whole loans program. Hasn't proven helpful at all. 

Edited April 16, 2021 by Eldar Hadzimehmedovic

[JTJ]

After Harry clogged John McGinn at Easter Road Hibs targeted him in 2 youth games. I think it was one red card and one yellow but he was out for a long time after each game. Losing a year at a young age and your body growing can ruin any player's career. 

 

A Pars fan told me he looked good - if given plenty time on the ball, if harassed he struggled. We offered him a deal so weren't giving up on him but it'll be interesting to see where/what level he goes to.

[Tazio]

By sheer coincidence this popped up on my newsfeed. 
https://apple.news/AuHqkITpNRTO4vwngCdTfpQ

[Francis Albert]

21 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

FTFY.

 

Shame, thought he looked an excellent prospect. Very slow and weak though and doesn't appear to have done much to rectify that.

 

Think he'll do well somewhere else and re-appear in the SPL in a few years as a decent player. 

 

Wish him all the best.

So 9 years at our Academy with the best facilities in the country and we haven't developed his speed and strength. Many decades ago (when training meant Guillane sands, running up and down the terracing, and laps of the pitch) we had a professional sprinter helping to develop speed.  

 

If his attitude has been as bad as portrayed on here why would we have offered an extension? Or indeed kept him on the books  for so long? When our first criteria in signing players is supposed to be character and attitude (not that that has always been obvious)

[sjh1874]

No competitive league minutes given to any under 20's this season and people are asking why the kids want to take their chances elsewhere. Development under the current regime is lost.

[The Wrinkly Ninja]

Seems t be loads of experts on here saying that the club has no responsibility for developing players and that he is simply not good enough. So does that mean you believe he was never going to make it at Hearts?

 

Do questions then need to be asked why the club offered him a contract?

[Skivingatwork]

It’s systemic of a wider problem in Scottish football and has been for many years. We bring through a large number of promising players yet seem unable to develop them.

 

For years Scotland has agonised over grass roots football and youth development. However, our younger teams (club and country) tend to compete to around U18 level. Beyond this our players seem to plateau in their progress and get left behind by the top European leagues. 
 

Harry is just another example. Burst on to the scene at 16 and doesn’t appear to have progressed much in terms of ability from there.

 

That’s the club’s fault but is not exclusive to Hearts in Scotland.

[Bazzas right boot]

1 hour ago, OmiyaHearts said:

I think both sides need to take responsibly for the lack or development. No players improve at Hearts, at best, one or two a season might show some improvement.

 

But you canny blame him for not signing a new deal. Why would any young player want to be at Tynecastle?

 

 

Cochrane might have improved-how do you know he hasn't?

Improved and improved enough are two different things. 

 

Maybe he isn't good enough, he's struggled to hold down a place at the various clubs he's been loaned to. 

 

Souttar improved with us, got capped. 

Patterson improved 

Sow improved 

Hickey improved - left celtic to do so. Moved to Bologna. 

One of the Kings went to Swansea. 

Stone is improving. 

Irving improved 

 

Some Players do improve with us, many just don't get to the level we want or need. 

 

99% of clubs are in this position. 

 

 

 

 

 

[Tokyo Drifter]

2 hours ago, lou said:

A bit gutted about this, there is huge talent there, can't help but think we didn't handle his development as well as we should have

I second that.

[Ainsley Harriott]

17 minutes ago, The Maroon Pound said:

I don't think Harry got a chance after an encouraging start 

I think our club has FAILED massively to our youth players and anything in the academy in recent year's 

The talent is their but maybe our coaching staff should question themselves when youngsters stagnate, do not improve and are eventually released 

Good luck to the lad he must be gutted right now but he will be stronger now and have gained experience of what is required to improve his career

Just sick of this shit show top to bottom, What is the point of Riccarton and all these youth teams if no it doesn't produce any 1st team player's of quality? Whose fault is this? 

Agree about our youth system failing but Harry Played 30 first team games for us being going out on loan where he didn't do well. He had more than enough opportunity to prove himself.

[Tazio]

Social media is covered in people saying it’s a disgrace and we should do everything to keep him and he’ll come good eventually. 
When will that be though? He could be one of those players that are still getting referred to as a good young prospect at the age of 26 but spend their life on the bench. 

[JTJ]

Three subs only this season (ONLY for the Championship) has been an issue as our aim has always been to win the league and with injuries there have been few opportunities to bring on younger players who have been better off out on loan.  Taking chances with unproved players could have been problematic. 

[BigAlim]

3 minutes ago, Tazio said:

Social media is covered in people saying it’s a disgrace and we should do everything to keep him and he’ll come good eventually. 
When will that be though? He could be one of those players that are still getting referred to as a good young prospect at the age of 26 but spend their life on the bench. 

 

Will be the same folk who start waffling every time Callachan or Robinson score a goal

[Cruyff]

33 minutes ago, Brighton Jambo said:

With respect to your viewpoint if he can’t make an impact at Montrose he isn’t going to get a game in league one or two in England.  An opinion I wouldn’t mind being proved wrong on though! 

Not being funny but you get a lot more time on the ball in England at that level. 

[sadj]

25 minutes ago, jambo19 said:

Is there a case if style of play though? You'll always need a goalie and lower league teams may face plenty of shots so the keeper will be more involved. Creative midfield playmaker on the other hand? This isn't just Cochrane, Smith at Arbroath, Irving at Falkirk even Holt at Raith ?

Not sure so much about style of play being the main factor. Itll be part of it Id imagine. Scottish Football is horrendous for style its like glorified Sunday League football. I think that can be detrimental to skilful players developing as much as anything. It still lies primarily with the players themselves though. There needs to be a better structure for younger players within the Scottish Game imo. 

[A_A wehatethehibs]

To be fair, after he struggled at Dunfermline, and Montrose were the best club interested to take him on loan? I knew that was pretty much it for him at Hearts. 
 

Wish him all the best and I do think he could still eventually make his way back up to the premier one day 5-6 years time if he works hard enough.. Hearts have Haring, Mceneff, Halliday and will be looking for an upgraded at CM to add to that. So, all the best Harry. 

 

[KyleLafferty]

The biggest factor for me now is there is no reserve football. Kids who are 16/17/18 learn nothing playing with and against people the same age. If Harry was able to play with experience players in reserves without added pressure he might have thrived. I don’t agree with under 23 leagues or under 20’s. Young players need to play with and against older pros, whilst still training within the club first team.

[Absolute Scenes]

Might be the pessimist in me but I think he’s going to come back and haunt us. 
can see him going to Hamilton/Killie and the likes and kick on from there. 

[Famous 1874]

Roger Arnott another one that needs sacked 

[sr2008]

The answer to why Harry didn’t kick on probably sits somewhere between making his own progress and the club not developing him properly but the bigger picture piece here is that whilst it is not always the clubs fault a prospect doesn’t develop this is now a trend within the club and it’s taking a lot of people a while to realise this.

 

The statement the club have put out and quotes within it portray a picture of ‘we offered a contract which was turned down but we will move onto developing other young talent to progress to the first team’ but it simply doesn’t happen.

 

If management haven’t made any attempt this season to blood youngsters in as poor a Championship as we will see there is no chance they will start to promote youth players back in the Premiership.

 

It frustrates me as the club talk like we are a club with a pathway to the first team but reality is that no longer exists and young players are blocked by poor journeyman signings.

[Pasquale for King]

44 minutes ago, Jeffros Furios said:

Just like lots of other young players he wasn't good enough , I don't see how that's the club's fault .

Why did the club offer him a new deal if he wasn’t good enough? You’re criticising the club whilst trying to defend it 🤔🤷🏾‍♂️?!?’

[Pasquale for King]

Just now, Famous 1874 said:

Roger Arnott another one that needs sacked 

Exactly. 

[sadj]

 

14 minutes ago, Skivingatwork said:

It’s systemic of a wider problem in Scottish football and has been for many years. We bring through a large number of promising players yet seem unable to develop them.

 

For years Scotland has agonised over grass roots football and youth development. However, our younger teams (club and country) tend to compete to around U18 level. Beyond this our players seem to plateau in their progress and get left behind by the top European leagues. 
 

Harry is just another example. Burst on to the scene at 16 and doesn’t appear to have progressed much in terms of ability from there.

 

That’s the club’s fault but is not exclusive to Hearts in Scotland.

Don’t agree with the last line I think it lies primarily with the SFA but agree with the rest.

7 minutes ago, Tazio said:

Social media is covered in people saying it’s a disgrace and we should do everything to keep him and he’ll come good eventually. 
When will that be though? He could be one of those players that are still getting referred to as a good young prospect at the age of 26 but spend their life on the bench. 

🤣 leave them to rant , its what they do best. People who moaned Irving wasnt in the team then moaned he was in the team then moaned he wasnt performing. 

3 minutes ago, Cruyff said:

Not being funny but you get a lot more time on the ball in England at that level. 

🤔😉

[Pasquale for King]

1 minute ago, sr2008 said:

The answer to why Harry didn’t kick on probably sits somewhere between making his own progress and the club not developing him properly but the bigger picture piece here is that whilst it is not always the clubs fault a prospect doesn’t develop this is now a trend within the club and it’s taking a lot of people a while to realise this.

 

The statement the club have put out and quotes within it portray a picture of ‘we offered a contract which was turned down but we will move onto developing other young talent to progress to the first team’ but it simply doesn’t happen.

 

If management haven’t made any attempt this season to blood youngsters in as poor a Championship as we will see there is no chance they will start to promote youth players back in the Premiership.

 

It frustrates me as the club talk like we are a club with a pathway to the first team but reality is that no longer exists and young players are blocked by poor journeyman signings.

Spot on

[jr ewing]

30 minutes ago, The Maroon Pound said:

I don't think Harry got a chance after an encouraging start 

I think our club has FAILED massively to our youth players and anything in the academy in recent year's 

The talent is their but maybe our coaching staff should question themselves when youngsters stagnate, do not improve and are eventually released 

Good luck to the lad he must be gutted right now but he will be stronger now and have gained experience of what is required to improve his career

Just sick of this shit show top to bottom, What is the point of Riccarton and all these youth teams if no it doesn't produce any 1st team player's of quality? Whose fault is this? 

Just doesn't work on the scale we have. Best left for the biggest clubs. 

[sadj]

3 minutes ago, KyleLafferty said:

The biggest factor for me now is there is no reserve football. Kids who are 16/17/18 learn nothing playing with and against people the same age. If Harry was able to play with experience players in reserves without added pressure he might have thrived. I don’t agree with under 23 leagues or under 20’s. Young players need to play with and against older pros, whilst still training within the club first team.

That ties in to what I was talking about. When I was 8 i was having kickabouts with Junior teams , training with the senior pros at the club etc. It makes a huge difference. Faffing about with kids your age when a large percentage wont make it doesn’t in my opinion help past a certain point. U23 leagues and u20s can have beneifts but there needs to be a middle step. With Brexit the oweness should be able to go back onto young Scottish players but that might not suit the OF

[jr ewing]

4 minutes ago, sr2008 said:

The answer to why Harry didn’t kick on probably sits somewhere between making his own progress and the club not developing him properly but the bigger picture piece here is that whilst it is not always the clubs fault a prospect doesn’t develop this is now a trend within the club and it’s taking a lot of people a while to realise this.

 

The statement the club have put out and quotes within it portray a picture of ‘we offered a contract which was turned down but we will move onto developing other young talent to progress to the first team’ but it simply doesn’t happen.

 

If management haven’t made any attempt this season to blood youngsters in as poor a Championship as we will see there is no chance they will start to promote youth players back in the Premiership.

 

It frustrates me as the club talk like we are a club with a pathway to the first team but reality is that no longer exists and young players are blocked by poor journeyman signings.

Just  not good enough to begin with. 

[Nookie Bear]

Losing Cochrane and Irving (potentially) within weeks for zero return, and the lack of young players on the squad, is something that should have alarm bells ringing at Tynecastle. 
 

Questions need asked, answered and action taken. 

[132goals1958]

49 minutes ago, Jeffros Furios said:

Just like lots of other young players he wasn't good enough , I don't see how that's the club's fault .

 

Some will blame us for Marc Leonard being released from Brighton.

[Taffin]

25 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

So 9 years at our Academy with the best facilities in the country and we haven't developed his speed and strength. Many decades ago (when training meant Guillane sands, running up and down the terracing, and laps of the pitch) we had a professional sprinter helping to develop speed.  

 

If his attitude has been as bad as portrayed on here why would we have offered an extension? Or indeed kept him on the books  for so long? When our first criteria in signing players is supposed to be character and attitude (not that that has always been obvious)

 

We don't improve anyone, was my point. Not just academy players. I can't think of any players in the budge era who have got better during their time at Hearts. 

 

Harry I'm sure is a great character with a good attitude (hence trying his luck somewhere else rather than taking the easy option). I reckon we would have liked to keep him but also were making sure we got a development fee by offering a contract.

 

All that said, he's got to take some responsibility for not increasing his power and energy to be a bit more 'dynamic'.

[Chaps]

Vastly overrated on here. 
 

Has been living off the Celtic game.

[upgotheheads]

58 minutes ago, Japan Jambo said:

 

Spot on. There should be a stewards enquiry here; we need to fully learn what went wrong and understand better why we are unable to progress players with talent through to our first team. 

 

52 minutes ago, Jeffros Furios said:

Just like lots of other young players he wasn't good enough , I don't see how that's the club's fault .

 

I have lost count over the years of apparently talented young players (scores of them) who don't 'train-on' as the racing stables would say. Often it's not talent on the ball that they lack, it's physical strength and pace, which might be the case with Harry. Sometimes it's just work ethic, and attitude, you need to be more than skillful to have a good career at the top levels.

I wonder if that tackle by Broon, which broke his collarbone was significant, but by then it was clear that he couldn't boss his area of the field as he needed to. Maybe he's just too nice a guy. 

[Taffin]

12 minutes ago, sr2008 said:

The answer to why Harry didn’t kick on probably sits somewhere between making his own progress and the club not developing him properly but the bigger picture piece here is that whilst it is not always the clubs fault a prospect doesn’t develop this is now a trend within the club and it’s taking a lot of people a while to realise this.

 

The statement the club have put out and quotes within it portray a picture of ‘we offered a contract which was turned down but we will move onto developing other young talent to progress to the first team’ but it simply doesn’t happen.

 

If management haven’t made any attempt this season to blood youngsters in as poor a Championship as we will see there is no chance they will start to promote youth players back in the Premiership.

 

It frustrates me as the club talk like we are a club with a pathway to the first team but reality is that no longer exists and young players are blocked by poor journeyman signings.

 

I've admittedly not watched a lot of our games this year's compared to normal but earlier in the season I thought McGill looked a terrific prospect when I saw him play.

 

I'm amazed he's not played more given how poor we've been, the level we're playing and looking likely to lose Irvine from the midfield.

 

Anyone know why he didn't feature more? Injury? Or just not fancied?

[Thomaso]

2 hours ago, lou said:

A bit gutted about this, there is huge talent there, can't help but think we didn't handle his development as well as we should have

To quote the JKB ‘experts’ 

 

“Craig Levein has done a fantastic job with the Academy”

 

😏

[Jeffros Furios]

19 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

Why did the club offer him a new deal if he wasn’t good enough? You’re criticising the club whilst trying to defend it 🤔🤷🏾‍♂️?!?’

They may have offered a shit wage with a big incentive for playing or a short contract .

Either way he's not good enough and I wasnt in any way criticising the club .

[damo]

Perhaps mentioned already but it frustrated me that he never bulked himself up. Especially when you consider the facilities at his disposal. I'm certainly not saying this makes you a better footballer but I saw countless occasions of him getting brushed aside in our shitty leagues. He wasn't blessed with pace either but he was two footed....or at least I think he was!  Like others have said, you see these headlines and you're left just shaking your head at the conveyor belt of false dawns.

 

 

[sr2008]

6 minutes ago, Taffin said:

 

I've admittedly not watched a lot of our games this year's compared to normal but earlier in the season I thought McGill looked a terrific prospect when I saw him play.

 

I'm amazed he's not played more given how poor we've been, the level we're playing and looking likely to lose Irvine from the midfield.

 

Anyone know why he didn't feature more? Injury? Or just not fancied?

To my knowledge he has been fit most of the season and just not utilised.

 

A good example of a young player we could have used at different points and tried to get him 5-10 games in the championship ahead of stepping up to the Premiership. Especially given he plays in a position that at times we have been short on options and also there have been some occasions whereby the game is won with 20 mins to go and little risk in putting him on (not enough occasions as we haven’t dominated games and put teams away as we should have but don’t want to turn it into a Neilson bashing session)

[KyleLafferty]

Harry Was incredible at receiving the ball on the half turn. Also at finding space, his passing was also good, obviously it hasnt worked out, but good luck to him.

[NB GIN]

I think we need to have a serious look at who is running our academy. This 5 year plan has been a disaster with youth coming through.

Budge really has been a disaster at our club with so many poor appointments.

 

What is the problem with this academy ?