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The Trial of Alex Salmond


Trapper John McIntyre

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6 hours ago, doctor jambo said:

from the outside, looks very much like a political machine protecting the FM at the expense of a number of women.

Covering up harrasment allegations by, instead of dealing with the behaviour, putting in place unofficial measures to stop further incidents

 

Power works that way. 

 

See what the Defence is. 

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4 hours ago, weehammy said:

My take too. Salmond is obviously a total reptile but the ‘ look the other way’ response by officialdom reflects poorly on our politics at that time.

 

 

Pretty normal. 

 

If you are as powerful as Salmond was. 

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It does look like there will be questions for the SNP and it's high office holders when it's over.      Looking very grim for them.   

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Diadora Van Basten

Alex Salmond has a pretty impressive play book:

 

1 The only room in the building with heating was the bedroom.

2 Pretending to be a zombie

3 Trying to recreate a Jack Vetrriano painting 

 

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2 hours ago, Zlatanable said:

'The civil service took steps to prevent women having to work alone with Alex Salmond at night, his trial has been told. 

Chris Birt, a Scottish government civil servant, said new rotas were drawn up after two female colleagues told him about alleged incidents involving Mr Salmond.

But he said the new policy was never formally written down.

Mr Salmond denies 13 charges of sexual assault against nine women.

The alleged offences are all said to have happened when Mr Salmond was serving as Scotland's first minister and the leader of the SNP.'

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-51908343

 

If this is to be believed, this is shocking. 

I’m 54 and work with a lot of women from early 20’s upwards often in one on one situations with nobody else in the room. If I was prone to getting a little bit handsy would these arrangements be put in place or would I be out the door without my feet touching the ground? As it should be. 

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Trapper John McIntyre

Alex Salmond has been called as the first witness for the defence.

He has been sworn in on the witness stand.

almond has described his occupation as “journalist, TV presenter, retired politician”

Salmond has described his political career, including becoming first minister in 2007.

Gordon Jackson QC, for the defence, asked Salmond if he was aware of a policy where female workers were not allowed to be alone in his presence.

Salmond said he wasn’t.

He added “there was no policy like that”.

Salmond was asked about the allegations by Woman B that he forcefully tried to recreate a Christmas card kissing scene by pulling her wrists.

He said: “I didn’t do that.”

Salmond added: “I took her hands and said let’s recreate the card but it was a joke. It was hijinks, a piece of fun.”

He said the “incident has developed in the course of time”

Salmond has been asked about the allegation by Woman C that he put a hand on her leg while giving her a lift in a government car.

Mr Jackson asked if he “disputed” that happened.

Salmond replied: “Yes.”

He recalled her being in a car with him, but that he spent most of the journey in conversation with another passenger.

He said it would be “absolutely impossible” for him to put his hand on her leg for a number of minutes without being seen by the driver or front passenger.

Salmond was asked about the allegations made by Woman D.

He acknowledged he had “tugged” her hair but he had done so “affectionately”.

He added: “There was nothing sexual in it whatsoever.”

Salmond was asked if he stroked Woman D’s face while she was asleep.

He replied: “I did, yeah.”

He explained that it was to wake her up in a “gentle not abrupt way”.

Salmond said “some” of the allegations against him were “fabrications” for a “political purpose”.

He added “some” were “exaggerations” which had been “taken out of proportion”.

He said Woman F had a “legitimate complaint” although as described it was “not what actually happened”.

Salmond was asked about the allegation by Woman G that he smacked her buttocks at a restaurant.

He said: “It didn’t happen.”

Salmond said he put his hand on her “lower back” to hurry her up with a “gentle shove”.

He said there was “no sign she took any exception” to it.

He added: “It was totally and absolutely harmless.”

 

 

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Trapper John McIntyre

Defence lawyer asks Alex Salmond: “Do you think sometimes your sense of humour went too far?” He replies that with a “better understanding now...Yes.”

Alex Salmond responds to allegation by Woman D - a ScotGov civil servant that he sexually assaulted her, telling the court he would “tug her hair” as an “affectionate gesture...There was nothing sexual in it whatsoever.”

Alex Salmond tells the jury he believes “events are being reinterpreted & exaggerated” & that he wishes he had been “more careful with people’s personal space.”

Defence asks Mr Salmond if he touched Woman G’s bottom leaving restaurant after dinner & he replies: “No. It didn’t happen.” He tells court he touched her lower back as a “gentle shove to chivvy her up the stairs” on way into venue. Mr Salmond describes it as “harmless.”

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Trapper John McIntyre

Gordon Jackson moving on to Woman A. Alex Salmond says claims he kissed and touched her are “a fabrication from start to finish”; they were out in public at the centre of attention, it “would be insane to be doing anything like that”

Alex Salmond says the claim he sexually assaulted Woman A is “not just a fabrication, it’s ludicrous”. He says it “makes no sense whatsoever” and says Woman A has encouraged some of the other complainers to “exaggerate or make claims against me”.

 

Salmond is being asked about the allegations by Woman A who said he would give her unwanted kisses on the lips and touch her bottom while they walked in 2008.

Salmond said such behaviour would be “high risk” as reporters and many other people would be around.

Asked if he kissed her on the mouth, he replied: “No.”

Asked if he touched the side of her breast or buttocks with his hands, he replied: “No.”

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Wonder what the 'political purpose' claimed by Salmond to be the reason for these allegations.

 

Coming as they are from declared supporters of Independence. 

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Trapper John McIntyre

Salmond said as “first minister of Scotland” people would be watching him in public places.

He said he wouldn’t have inappropriately touched Woman A “under any circumstances” but it would be “insane apart from anything else and I didn’t” during such public occasions.

He added: “Her claims are a fabrication from start to finish.”Salmond said as “first minister of Scotland” people would be watching him in public places.

He said he wouldn’t have inappropriately touched Woman A “under any circumstances” but it would be “insane apart from anything else and I didn’t” during such public occasions.

He added: “Her claims are a fabrication from start to finish.”

Salmond alleged to court that Woman A had “encouraged at least five other people to exaggerate or make complaints against me”.

Salmond said he met with First Minister Nicola Sturgeon in April 2018 to ”talk over the process and causes of concern about the allegations levelled against him” by two women.

 
 
 
Edited by Trapper John McIntyre
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Trapper John McIntyre

Salmond said he was only aware of the “very large number of other issues” with further complainers when he was later interviewed by police at Dalkeith police station.

 

Salmond described an incident with Woman F.

He said he’d tried to give her a “kiss goodnight”.

Salmond said: “I meant to kiss her on the cheek but missed and kissed her on the mouth”.

He said it was a “brief kiss” and not a “sexual kiss”.

Salmond is describing being in a bedroom at Bute House with Woman F.

They moved to the bedroom because the room they had been working in was “cold”.

Asked if there was anything “sinister” in that, he replied” “Nothing whatsoever.”

After doing some work, they had a “light-hearted conversation”.

He said they were “both” drinking the Chinese spirit maotai.

He agreed they were both “tipsy”.

almond said he went to give Woman F a “kiss goodnight”.

He said “we lapsed” into a “sleeping cuddle” across the bed “with both our feet on the floor”.

Asked why, Salmond said: “I don’t know the answer to that.”

He said it happened when they were both “tipsy” and “shouldn’t have happened”.

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Trapper John McIntyre

Gordon Jackson notes this is a charge of sexual assault with intent to rape. “It’s not true” says Alex Salmond. “Not in the slightest. I’ve never attempted to have non consensual sexual relations with anyone in my entire life.”

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Trapper John McIntyre

Salmond said Woman F was on the bed with “my left arm underneath her”.

Both their feet were still on the floor, he added, and it “was not particularly comfortable”.

He said : “We were side-by-side, both fully dressed.”

Salmond said this “lasted not more than a few seconds” and he was “saying nothing” to her.

He said: “I believe I kissed her on the cheek - not on the mouth” then he said Woman F told him, ‘I’ll have to be going’.

Salmond said she then told him, ‘This is a bad idea.’

He said he “snapped” out of it and said, ‘This is a very bad idea’.

Salmond said Woman F picked up a folder and said, ‘Good night, first minister’ and he replied ‘good night’.

She then left Bute House, he said.

Salmond said a civil servant approached him about a “sensitive” matter soon afterwards.

He said it was about Woman F and an incident at Bute House.

Salmond said he apologised to the Woman F on the same day, he believed.

He said he apologised for putting her in an “embarrassing position and that wasn’t right”.

Woman F said she’d been drinking as well, said Salmond.

He said he told her it was “my responsibility” as first minister.

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Trapper John McIntyre

Salmond said a civil servant approached him about a “sensitive” matter soon afterwards.

He said it was about Woman F and an incident at Bute House.

Salmond said he apologised to the Woman F on the same day, he believed.

He said he apologised for putting her in an “embarrassing position and that wasn’t right”.

Woman F said she’d been drinking as well, said Salmond.

He said he told her it was “my responsibility” as first minister.

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Trapper John McIntyre
Alex Salmond tells court there was no sexual contact between himself & Woman H on either of 2 alleged occasions. He tells jury there was a “consensual sexual liaison which did not involve full undress...Two old friends & things had gone too far” in August 2013.
Alex Salmond describes the encounter to court, adding: “we both realised it wasn’t a good idea. We parted good friends...It shouldn’t have happened. Both of us agreed it would be put behind us.”
Alex Salmond tells court on occasion he & Woman D went off for an ice cream together: “It was perfectly friendly...nothing untoward at all.” Mr Salmond adds: “It demonstrates the blurring of the boundaries. That’s the nature of the business.”
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
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Trapper John McIntyre
24 minutes ago, Boab said:

Nobody really gives a **** right now, mate !

 

😐

Takes your mind of your own lockdown problems.

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Just now, Trapper John McIntyre said:

Takes your mind of your own lockdown problems.


How long has it to go ?

Will it even finish ?

Why am I even asking ?

😷

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Trapper John McIntyre
1 minute ago, Boab said:


How long has it to go ?

Will it even finish ?

Why am I even asking ?

😷

Why? Because your fascinated  by it too just like everyone else...don't let an apocalyptic pandemic distract you too much...

Looks like it could end this week. Fairly shooting through it now. Eck's still giving 'evidence.'

Next he'll be cross -examined by prosecutor. I'd pay money to watch that.

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2 hours ago, Trapper John McIntyre said:

Salmond said: “I meant to kiss her on the cheek but missed and kissed her on the mouth”.


Aye right oh Alex! 

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Trapper John McIntyre

Salmond has been taken through various duties, meetings and events entered in the first minister’s diary for May 2014.

Woman H gave details of an alleged sexual assault in Bute House in that month by Salmond.

Salmond said he could see no event at Bute House that Woman H could have been present at with him.

Salmond told the court that Woman H wasn’t present at a June 2014 event after which he is accused of attempting to rape her.

He said: “I say she wasn’t there.”

Asked by Mr Jackson if it was possible he didn’t remember her presence, Salmond replied: “It’s not possible.”

Mr Jackson suggested if Woman H wasn’t at the dinner then she “told a pretty big story that isn’t true”.

Salmond replied: “That’s correct.”

Mr Jackson suggested if she wasn’t there then her story wasn’t true.

Salmond replied: “That’s correct.”

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Trapper John McIntyre

Salmond has been taken through various duties, meetings and events entered in the first minister’s diary for May 2014.

Woman H gave details of an alleged sexual assault in Bute House in that month by Salmond.

Salmond said he could see no event at Bute House that Woman H could have been present at with him.

Salmond told the court that Woman H wasn’t present at a June 2014 event after which he is accused of attempting to rape her.

He s

Mr Jackson asked if there was any reason that Woman H may have made up the allegations.

Salmond said he had declined to support her in a work project.

Mr Jackson asked if Woman H’s claim to be at a June 2014 event at Bute House was “just a lie”.

Mr Salmond agreed it was.

aid: “I say she wasn’t there.”

Asked by Mr Jackson if it was possible he didn’t remember her presence, Salmond replied: “It’s not possible.”

Mr Jackson suggested if Woman H wasn’t at the dinner then she “told a pretty big story that isn’t true”.

Salmond replied: “That’s correct.”

Mr Jackson asked if there was any reason that Woman H may have made up the allegations.

Salmond said he had declined to support her in a work project.

Mr Jackson asked if Woman H’s claim to be at a June 2014 event at Bute House was “just a lie”.

Mr Salmond agreed it was.

 

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Trapper John McIntyre

Prosecutor Alex Prentice QC has begun his cross examination of Salmond.

Mr Prentice asked whether Salmond took into account Woman B’s feelings when he sought to recreate the Christmas card kissing scene.

Salmond replied that it was meant to be a “joke”.

Mr Prentice asked if Salmond was aware he inspired a “sense of fear” in staff and colleagues.

Salmond replied: “It was not my belief, intention or perception.”

Mr Prentice asked if Salmond believed himself “so powerful” that he could reach out and touch the hair of Woman D in the presence of a civil servant.

Salmond said he didn’t, adding: “I had no reason to believe she would have found that offensive”.

Mr Prentice put it to Salmond that he attempted to rape Woman H.

Salmond replied: “I did not.”

Mr Prentice put it to Salmond that he “grabbed” Woman K’s backside because “you could”.

Salmond said he did not do it.

Asked about kissing Woman F “good night”, Salmond said in his his experience you can “go to kiss someone on the cheek and you end up kissing them on the lips”.

Alex Salmond has completed his evidence and returned to the dock.

Edited by Trapper John McIntyre
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Trapper John McIntyre

On to Woman F - Alex Prentice asks if Alex Salmond can see how “chilling” it was for the FM to ask a younger female staff member to sit down on his bed? “That’s not what happened, she went to sit there to put on her boots”.

What is a sleepy cuddle, Alex Prentice asks? Alex Salmond says “both of us were slightly tipsy and it was something that wasn’t meant to happen, it was across the bed with her feet on the floor...it wasn’t a pre-arranged anything.” He says Woman F left “in perfect order”.

Alex Prentice asks if Alex Salmond can see how demeaning it would be for a young woman to have her bottom smacked in public; he says yes, but that’s not what happened with Woman G. He says he “ushered her up a staircase”.

Alex Prentice asks if Alex Salmond thought it was appropriate to touch Woman D’s hair. “I tugged her hair occasionally, it was not meant to convey anything sexual”. What about the age difference between them? “I wasn’t in any way shape or form pursuing a sexual relationship”

Alex Prentice asks if it surprised Alex Salmond to hear rotas were changed so female staff were not alone with him? “I had no knowledge at the time and it couldn’t have been put into effect without me noticing....I don’t think the arrangement could have been put into effect”.

Was Alex Salmond surprised to hear one witness claim that staff had suffered mental health issues? “I think it was unfair of him to say that. He was misleading, intentionally or otherwise.”

Alex Prentice asks if Alex Salmond has respect for women? “I did and I do”. Did he seek to avoid humiliating women? “Always”. Did he have a duty of care to staff? “Yes” - and he regarded sexual harassment as a serious issue.Alex Prentice asks if Alex Salmond instilled a sense of fear in staff? “That’s not my belief, intent or perception”. He says some people have said they found him intimidating, but “clearly it’s not a universal belief”.

Alex Prentice repeatedly asked if Alex Salmond had “any regard” for Woman B’s feelings when he tried to reenact the Christmas card. He says “it was a joke, it was high jinks”. He says he wouldn’t do it again, it’s a “good lesson” not to invade people’s personal space

 
 
 
 
 

 
 
 
 
 

 

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manaliveits105
18 hours ago, Trapper John McIntyre said:

Salmond said as “first minister of Scotland” people would be watching him in public places.

He said he wouldn’t have inappropriately touched Woman A “under any circumstances” but it would be “insane apart from anything else and I didn’t” during such public occasions.

He added: “Her claims are a fabrication from start to finish.”Salmond said as “first minister of Scotland” people would be watching him in public places.

He said he wouldn’t have inappropriately touched Woman A “under any circumstances” but it would be “insane apart from anything else and I didn’t” during such public occasions.

He added: “Her claims are a fabrication from start to finish.”

Salmond alleged to court that Woman A had “encouraged at least five other people to exaggerate or make complaints against me”.

Salmond said he met with First Minister Nicola Sturgeon in April 2018 to ”talk over the process and causes of concern about the allegations levelled against him” by two women.

 
 
 

and yet both Scottish news programmes failed to mention the meeting with FM in 2018 ?

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Trapper John McIntyre

Tasmina Ahmend Sheikh brought in as defence witness.

 

Eck at desperation stage.

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Space Mackerel
21 minutes ago, Trapper John McIntyre said:

Tasmina Ahmend Sheikh brought in as defence witness.

 

Eck at desperation stage.

 

I've been watching the news a fair bit with this virus kicking about, I haven't heard a peep about it.

 

You must be raging about this Coronavirus eh? 😄

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jambos are go!
58 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said:

Hearing SNP support is up to 53%. 
 

Hows the trial going lads? 

Can you provide details ?

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59 minutes ago, Space Mackerel said:

Hearing SNP support is up to 53%. 
 

Hows the trial going lads? 

There's a lot of sex sex pests in the Nationalist corner.

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Trapper John McIntyre
6 minutes ago, SE16 3LN said:

There's a lot of sex sex pests in the Nationalist corner.

Witnesses for the defence saying they saw nothing untoward , Eck's a lovely chap, victims lying etc etc

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1 minute ago, Trapper John McIntyre said:

Witnesses for the defence saying they saw nothing untoward , Eck's a lovely chap, victims lying etc etc

He"s also saying in was just a joke 😀

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Trapper John McIntyre

Philip Sim of BBC saying the debate over what is allowed to be tweeted has intensified.

 

Strange it should happen when defence has brought in its witnesses. Nicky's name was mentioned again though...

 

 

 

 

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Trapper John McIntyre
23 minutes ago, Dannie Boy said:

giphy.gif

 

Nicola Sturgeon!?

Other witnesses claiming they saw nothing, he's a great person... Tough but fair.... Old fashioned manners towards women.. holds doors open etc . All round gent.

 

Some of these people have marvellous recall. They also must have been with him 24/7.

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1 minute ago, Trapper John McIntyre said:

Other witnesses claiming they saw nothing, he's a great person... Tough but fair.... Old fashioned manners towards women.. holds doors open etc . All round gent.

 

Some of these people have marvellous recall. They also must have been with him 24/7.

 

You can posses all these qualities but still be a dirty old letch. 

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Trapper John McIntyre
Just now, Dannie Boy said:

 

You can posses all these qualities but still be a dirty old letch. 

Allegedly.

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24 minutes ago, Trapper John McIntyre said:

Other witnesses claiming they saw nothing, he's a great person... Tough but fair.... Old fashioned manners towards women.. holds doors open etc . All round gent.

 

Some of these people have marvellous recall. They also must have been with him 24/7.

 

Tripper, you really ought to just say you want a show trial with no defence at all and be done with it. Either way it's clear you've never seriously contemplated how lawyers craft defences of clients. Here's a bit of free counsel from one: you take what you can get.

 

Edit:

  

22 minutes ago, Dannie Boy said:

 

You can posses all these qualities but still be a dirty old letch. 

 

The correct answer.

 

Edited by Justin Z
To include Dannie Boy's keen skill for boiling things down.
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Trapper John McIntyre
11 minutes ago, Justin Z said:

 

 

Tripper, you really ought to just say you want a show trial with no defence at all and be done with it. Either way it's clear you've never seriously contemplated how lawyers craft defences of clients. Here's a bit of free counsel from one: you take what you can get.

 

Edit:

  

 

The correct answer.

 

 Thanks for the advice, Petrocelli.

 

So you're admitting a defence lawyer has to scrape the barrel to find suitable witnesses?

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2 minutes ago, Trapper John McIntyre said:

 Thanks for the advice, Petrocelli.

 

So you're admitting a defence lawyer has to scrape the barrel to find suitable witnesses?

 

Haha Jesus, what is it with you and outdated American television references? :lol:

 

A defence lawyer will do whatever is necessary to zealously defend their client, as they are ethically bound to do.

 

Dannie Boy's statement is the correct way to interpret all of this. You can be all the things those witnesses have described, and still be lecherous and potentially, to an unlawful extent. It's up for the jury to decide if that's so in any particular case, but to simply disregard the need to boost your client's character to the jury, using witnesses who will describe positive and neutral behaviour they saw, would be gross malpractice.

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Trapper John McIntyre
16 minutes ago, Justin Z said:

 

Haha Jesus, what is it with you and outdated American television references? :lol:

 

A defence lawyer will do whatever is necessary to zealously defend their client, as they are ethically bound to do.

 

Dannie Boy's statement is the correct way to interpret all of this. You can be all the things those witnesses have described, and still be lecherous and potentially, to an unlawful extent. It's up for the jury to decide if that's so in any particular case, but to simply disregard the need to boost your client's character to the jury, using witnesses who will describe positive and neutral behaviour they saw, would be gross malpractice.

 Okay Perry. I am aware of the distinction.

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28 minutes ago, Trapper John McIntyre said:

 Okay Perry. I am aware of the distinction.

 

That's good, Tonto! Maybe consider posting like it from here on. :thumbsup:

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Trapper John McIntyre
26 minutes ago, Justin Z said:

 

That's good, Tonto! Maybe consider posting like it from here on. :thumbsup:

No objection

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