Nookie Bear Posted December 20, 2019 Share Posted December 20, 2019 2 hours ago, GinRummy said: Don’t disagree with much of that. What I would add, which doesn’t contradict what you say, is CL did not get the best out of the players available last season. The warning signs were plain for all to see. The amount of failures in the players he signed last season were plain to see. This was accepted or ignored by AB which was a serious error on her part. He should have gone last season and the fact he was allowed to start this season has cost us dear. He also signed some very limited players like Bozanic, Mulraney, Wighton, McLean, Damour, Dikamona, Zlamal, Doyle etc When players get injured you would want others to step up but 90% of our squad are one-paced and/or lacking in football intelligence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ToqueJambo Posted December 20, 2019 Share Posted December 20, 2019 1 hour ago, annushorribilis III said: Get over it ? I was delighted the day it was announced and I've posted next to nothing on the matter since. Unlike you who still harks on about injuries , injuries, injuries. I think the injuries have been downplayed by some Jambos and in the media but also agree Levein failed in many ways. It’ll be interesting to see what Stendel can get out of the same players. Levein’s man management and motivational skills deserted him but Stendel seems to be known for both. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ToqueJambo Posted December 20, 2019 Share Posted December 20, 2019 1 hour ago, Toxteth O'Grady said: Cathro Levien Forgot seats Stand delay and overspend Contracts for family Doesn’t speak up for and is quick to judge Hearts supporters Sanctioned horrific signings Saved us when we needed money which is probably always going to trump everything else. I think we’d be better with someone else to take us forward now though Did the 2.5 seasons before Cathro not happen? The basic facts are she's presided over nearly 5.5 seasons. If you think of a league title in a difficult league, European qualification and never being out of the top 3 in that time high league positions as a good return, that means she's presided over 2.5 excellent to average/above average (depending how you view finishing 3rd) seasons and 3 below average seasons in terms of league positions. Everyone can look up how that compares with previous owners, but it's pretty average overall and we still haven't finished outwith the top 6 under her, which we did under Romanov, and we got to a cup final which is much rarer in our history than people seem to think. Saving the club definitely has to trump a couple of meh seasons (not counting this terrible one so far) The stadium is also huge for us, considering how long the threat of us having to leave Tynecastle has been hanging over us. Who cares about delays? Was Budge the project manager? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusk_Till_Dawn Posted December 20, 2019 Share Posted December 20, 2019 TorqueJambo - the one poster on here who would find positives in relegation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckydug Posted December 20, 2019 Share Posted December 20, 2019 2 hours ago, Toxteth O'Grady said: Cathro Levien Forgot seats Stand delay and overspend Contracts for family Doesn’t speak up for and is quick to judge Hearts supporters Sanctioned horrific signings Saved us when we needed money which is probably always going to trump everything else. I think we’d be better with someone else to take us forward now though Any Ideas? Leeann Dempster ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxfee Posted December 20, 2019 Share Posted December 20, 2019 Utter tosh on this thread Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sid Posted December 20, 2019 Share Posted December 20, 2019 4 hours ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said: The first two points you raised were valid but it’s typical of the see-no-evil attitude of the likes of yourself that you failed to offer any context about how those decisions came about the absolute mess that Stendel has inherited. People on here have been telling us for months that it’s all in hand. I honestly wonder what I’ll take for them to be duly embarrassed about how wrong they’ve been. The start of this debate was specifically about Ann’s recent football decisions. Longer term has been debated to death around budgets, attempting to purchase players above our standard and the risk of injury in doing so and actual injuries against poor choice of player. These are not recent footballing decisions of a Ann. No answers to the recent footballing decisions of Ann listed by me. No alternative examples of poor recent footballing decisions to counter the argument. Just change to question to try and support a failed argument. I am not being selective in points raised. These are just the recent footballing decisions made by Ann. add or challenge the recent footballing decisions of accept accusation was wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusk_Till_Dawn Posted December 20, 2019 Share Posted December 20, 2019 11 minutes ago, Sid said: The start of this debate was specifically about Ann’s recent football decisions. Longer term has been debated to death around budgets, attempting to purchase players above our standard and the risk of injury in doing so and actual injuries against poor choice of player. These are not recent footballing decisions of a Ann. No answers to the recent footballing decisions of Ann listed by me. No alternative examples of poor recent footballing decisions to counter the argument. Just change to question to try and support a failed argument. I am not being selective in points raised. These are just the recent footballing decisions made by Ann. add or challenge the recent footballing decisions of accept accusation was wrong. I don’t accept your definition of recent, mainly because you’re an apologist who would find any excuses going. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GinRummy Posted December 21, 2019 Share Posted December 21, 2019 7 hours ago, Nookie Bear said: He also signed some very limited players like Bozanic, Mulraney, Wighton, McLean, Damour, Dikamona, Zlamal, Doyle etc When players get injured you would want others to step up but 90% of our squad are one-paced and/or lacking in football intelligence. Aye. The signings have been terrible, by and large. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sid Posted December 21, 2019 Share Posted December 21, 2019 9 hours ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said: I don’t accept your definition of recent, mainly because you’re an apologist who would find any excuses going. That’s an absolutely fantastic basis of an argument. I think you’ve beaten me with your fact-based debate. I accept all of the points I raised, none of which you countered, must be wrong due to the strength of your agreement. Levein must still be manager, Stendel is not really here, players mentioned have not been signed, and Malaury is still here. I apologise for my errors and accept all Anne’s recent footballing decisions have been abysmal. You win. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pettigrewsstylist Posted December 21, 2019 Share Posted December 21, 2019 12 hours ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said: TorqueJambo - the one poster on here who would find positives in relegation. 😂😂😂😂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HMFC 86 Posted December 21, 2019 Share Posted December 21, 2019 3 hours ago, Sid said: That’s an absolutely fantastic basis of an argument. I think you’ve beaten me with your fact-based debate. I accept all of the points I raised, none of which you countered, must be wrong due to the strength of your agreement. Levein must still be manager, Stendel is not really here, players mentioned have not been signed, and Malaury is still here. I apologise for my errors and accept all Anne’s recent footballing decisions have been abysmal. You win. He’s absolutely right though, you are an apologist, always looking for excuses Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BangkokHearts Posted December 21, 2019 Share Posted December 21, 2019 17 hours ago, annushorribilis III said: You are , you go on about it relentlessly. He was not sacked because of injuries - you need to accept that and move on. And I'd go as far to say , if AB hadn't been firefighting in getting the new stand shambles sorted he would have been out on his arse even sooner. I won't be judging Stendel on injuries or not but what he can get out of this dire squad, maybe/hopefully with a couple of desperately needed signings in January. I don't know why you go on about the "last two seasons" - AB gave CL a free pass on last season but she didn't fall for his nonsense when it became apparent even to her that the team was going nowhere. Like I say, the warning signs were there in the League Cup games - a total embarrassment - and it got worse. Much worse. It's a romatic notion, hoping there would be a turnaround under Levein, and I suppose one many Hearts fans wanted too. I guess many of us were not wanting to accept one of our Legends wasn't up to the task. Just one thought lingers... HTF did we go on that unbeaten run last year, we looked unbeatable? What could have been if Craig didn't have a heart attack, and how we far declined since that incident. Mental. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sid Posted December 21, 2019 Share Posted December 21, 2019 10 minutes ago, HMFC 86 said: He’s absolutely right though, you are an apologist, always looking for excuses Do you want to discuss the points raised or use a very similar approach of when facts are put up for debate, ignore the facts and resort to personal abuse? if it’s personal abuse, crack on. If you want to add to the debate, let’s hear what you have to say about the facts I’ve stated. Wrong/right anything else relevant to support your views? Presume it will be further personal abuse or silence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Real Maroonblood Posted December 21, 2019 Share Posted December 21, 2019 16 hours ago, annushorribilis III said: Get over it ? I was delighted the day it was announced and I've posted next to nothing on the matter since. Unlike you who still harks on about injuries , injuries, injuries. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HMFC 86 Posted December 21, 2019 Share Posted December 21, 2019 2 minutes ago, Sid said: Do you want to discuss the points raised or use a very similar approach of when facts are put up for debate, ignore the facts and resort to personal abuse? if it’s personal abuse, crack on. If you want to add to the debate, let’s hear what you have to say about the facts I’ve stated. Wrong/right anything else relevant to support your views? Presume it will be further personal abuse or silence. Personal abuse aye? Hardy that. You seem very sensitive Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
boag1874 Posted December 21, 2019 Share Posted December 21, 2019 It's easy to criticise her in for Cathro in hindsight, but at the time most were happy with the appointment of a highly rated young coach. I also don't see how backing her managers by sanctioning signings could possibly be seen as a negative, is she supposed to conduct her own scouting missions before deciding whether to give them the funding? That would be invasive and people would be furious about her tightening the purse strings. Imo the only real thing she's done wrong as an owner in terms of the footballing side of things was her blind spot when it came to Craig Levein. He was given too much time & control, and it's left us in a mess that Stendel now has to try & clean up. If she goes at the end of the season she genuinely goes with all my best wishes & respect for all the good she's done. Without her we genuinely wouldn't be here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamboelite Posted December 21, 2019 Share Posted December 21, 2019 (edited) 5 minutes ago, HMFC 86 said: Personal abuse aye? Hardy that. You seem very sensitive He has a point debate the content not the poster. Edited December 21, 2019 by Jamboelite Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sid Posted December 21, 2019 Share Posted December 21, 2019 26 minutes ago, HMFC 86 said: Personal abuse aye? Hardy that. You seem very sensitive possibly stronger word than it merits. but happy to place you in the happy to slate people for having a view but absolutely not interested in contributing to the debate in any sensible way except the personal criticism. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusk_Till_Dawn Posted December 21, 2019 Share Posted December 21, 2019 2 hours ago, boag1874 said: It's easy to criticise her in for Cathro in hindsight, but at the time most were happy with the appointment of a highly rated young coach. I also don't see how backing her managers by sanctioning signings could possibly be seen as a negative, is she supposed to conduct her own scouting missions before deciding whether to give them the funding? That would be invasive and people would be furious about her tightening the purse strings. Imo the only real thing she's done wrong as an owner in terms of the footballing side of things was her blind spot when it came to Craig Levein. He was given too much time & control, and it's left us in a mess that Stendel now has to try & clean up. If she goes at the end of the season she genuinely goes with all my best wishes & respect for all the good she's done. Without her we genuinely wouldn't be here. I don’t knock the Cathro appointment. It was clearly misjudged with hindsight but he was easy to get excited about at the time. I wanted him to get the chance. It’s her response to that debacle which has been so pitiful and has done so much damage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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