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The neverending saga of Jamie Walker / no deal, he stays at Hearts (updated)

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Escobar PHM

No offense, but you and others that are saying "anything is better than nothing" are totally missing the point.

If we gave in this time and accepted an offer way below our valuation, regardless of whether the player doesn't perform and then leaves at the end of his contract, it would mean in the future no-one would take us seriously as a selling club. They would just make a token offer, knowing that we we'd bend over and accept whatever crumbs they chuck at us.

If this means we've missed out on a few quid this time(don't forget they were offering it in instalments) then so be it.

Sorry but thats shite. We seriously overvalued Walker at ?1million when he had a year left on his deal and at the same time we wanted to sell an unhappy player.

 

Each set if circumstances is different. If we've a player who is happy with us on a long deal and we get interest in him, what we did with Walker is a completely different case and would have no impact.

 

We were and still are in a weak position with Walker. On players where we are in a stronger position we've the right to expect the fee to be closer to a players worth.

 

This is a player with one year to go. An uncapped player with a history of injury and inconsistent form. ?500k was a decent offer and we should have taken it.

 

Im not sure how you know it was instalments but its hardly uncommon is it?

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moonraker

Installments from a club that may soon find it difficult to cover existing outgoings. Bit risky.

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Deevers

who are you ?

Fine. Whose yer sell

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maroonnicky63

Fine. Whose yer sell

ah can't read either 

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Ugly American

seriously ? '' yes'' Family member no , if I was I would come no where near a place like this where some fans just slate for the sake of it. Jamie may not have been playing at his best but there maybe other reason behind it that we don't know about. I said at the time it was madness to keep him against his will we should have took the money and moved on 500k or more for a club like Hearts who need the money was bonkers

 

They never offered ?500k up front, and if they did I imagine we would have taken it. We've been burned by Rangers before on deferred payment, no sense in offering them extended credit now.

 

Sorry but that's nonsense. Our 'assets' are worth what someone is willing to pay for them. What we think they are worth is irrelevant.

 

Incorrect. Walker has multiple values to the team. He could be sold for cash to Rangers, yes. He also can be sent onto the pitch to play football, something that if we sell him we can't do, and for the value Rangers offered we couldn't come close to replacing his productivity. Selling him at too low a price also decreases the value of future sales for us, which is value lost if we had taken their offer. Finally, although he wouldn't see much of the pitch, selling him to Rangers would inevitably strengthen them as a team, increasing the likelihood that they finish ahead of us, which has a value too.

 

Hearts played this exactly correctly IMO.

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luckydug

Well it's no secret I am an ex player so don't get your point but still a hearts supporter and season ticket holder for many years but you explained it better that time

 

 

It's no secret that you SAY you are an ex player.

I don't believe the rest of your post either.

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JamboJimmyB

The way Levein was talking it sounds like he thought Rangers would come back in with a higher bid just before the window closed. A gamble that has back fired on the club.

 

Whatever you think, the fact that he is still at the club clearly confirms he was over valued as quite simply no one has bought him.

 

It is not a little hypocritical when I believe the club allegedly offered Motherwell ?50k for Cadden who on current form is a better player.

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Mikey1874

The way Levein was talking it sounds like he thought Rangers would come back in with a higher bid just before the window closed. A gamble that has back fired on the club.

 

Whatever you think, the fact that he is still at the club clearly confirms he was over valued as quite simply no one has bought him.

 

It is not a little hypocritical when I believe the club allegedly offered Motherwell ?50k for Cadden who on current form is a better player.

Not sure how you get that

 

Levein's comments suggest Rangers promised to Jamie they would sign him or at least that they rated him highly

 

They offered peanuts compared to what they spent elsewhere suggesting they didn't rate him highly compared say to Dorrans.

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Ugly American

The way Levein was talking it sounds like he thought Rangers would come back in with a higher bid just before the window closed. A gamble that has back fired on the club.

 

Whatever you think, the fact that he is still at the club clearly confirms he was over valued as quite simply no one has bought him.

 

It is not a little hypocritical when I believe the club allegedly offered Motherwell ?50k for Cadden who on current form is a better player.

 

Upside down thinking IMO.

 

Walker was clearly told by Rangers they would pay the asking price for him, then tried to low-ball the club with almost all the money in deferred payments.

 

I think we opened with a bid for Cadden which Motherwell knocked back. I firmly believe we had a verbal agreement with Well that if Rangers met the price for Walker that we'd turn a fair amount of the money around for Cadden. No sense in spending money we never got for a player we won't need because Walker stayed.

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deejtee

This is partly true but JW and his agent engineered a situation whereby they restricted the "market" for Jamie Walker to one club. Thus they took competition as regards market value out of the equation. Therefore JW didn't really have a market value. He had a value that was dictated by the single club that he was prepared to move to.

 

His value then becomes a two layered process. The club value him at ?1m but Sevco are only prepared to pay ?500k. At this point the club has to ask itself, do we get more value out of JW staying at Hearts for a season than selling him to a rival club at half of what we think a fair value in a competitive market would be.

 

It is not therefore irrelevant what Hearts think a player is worth as, as an asset, part of a player's value is what he brings to the team.

 

On form, JW could be win a cup final and/or get us one or two places higher up the league - there is value in that.

Agreed. Simplistic to say Walker is only worth what Rangers are prepared to pay. Things have a value to their owner for their utility and replacement cost and as you say a fit and on form Walker may be worth a lot to us.

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socrates82

Sorry but thats shite. We seriously overvalued Walker at ?1million when he had a year left on his deal and at the same time we wanted to sell an unhappy player.

 

Each set if circumstances is different. If we've a player who is happy with us on a long deal and we get interest in him, what we did with Walker is a completely different case and would have no impact.

 

We were and still are in a weak position with Walker. On players where we are in a stronger position we've the right to expect the fee to be closer to a players worth.

 

This is a player with one year to go. An uncapped player with a history of injury and inconsistent form. ?500k was a decent offer and we should have taken it.

 

Im not sure how you know it was instalments but its hardly uncommon is it?

We didn't overvalue him if it would cost us at least a million to replace him withsomeone of similar standard. It's Rangers who clearly undervalued him as they wanted him abd failed to get him. Edited by socrates82

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socrates82

The way Levein was talking it sounds like he thought Rangers would come back in with a higher bid just before the window closed. A gamble that has back fired on the club.

 

Whatever you think, the fact that he is still at the club clearly confirms he was over valued as quite simply no one has bought him.

 

It is not a little hypocritical when I believe the club allegedly offered Motherwell ?50k for Cadden who on current form is a better player.

We offered 300 grand. Too much IMO.

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maroonnicky63

It's no secret that you SAY you are an ex player.

I don't believe the rest of your post either.

oh my god you are the very last person I would worry about,I could not give a coos tit what you think mr negative , closet hibs fan you are

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Escobar PHM

We didn't overvalue him if it would cost us at least a million to replace him withsomeone of similar standard. It's Rangers who clearly undervalued him as they wanted him abd failed to get him.

Your having a mare now mate. Just stop.

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Escobar PHM

Upside down thinking IMO.

 

Walker was clearly told by Rangers they would pay the asking price for him, then tried to low-ball the club with almost all the money in deferred payments.

 

I think we opened with a bid for Cadden which Motherwell knocked back. I firmly believe we had a verbal agreement with Well that if Rangers met the price for Walker that we'd turn a fair amount of the money around for Cadden. No sense in spending money we never got for a player we won't need because Walker stayed.

Tonights fantastic story - Tommorows FACT.

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luckydug

oh my god you are the very last person I would worry about,I could not give a coos tit what you think mr negative , closet hibs fan you are

 

What team did you play for and when ?

Anyone could say they are a former player.

You are a wum .

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The Future's Maroon

Nicky Walker was born in '62 (Wiki....could be wrong)! :rofl:

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Fxxx the SPFL

What team did you play for and when ?

Anyone could say they are a former player.

You are a wum .

John Colqhoun born 1963

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i wish jj was my dad

Against his will :rofl:

 

On 3/4k a week :rofl:

 

I'm willing to be a hostage Hearts

Great post. 

 

Poor Jamie will be heading to the food bank shortly at this rate. 

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The Future's Maroon

Saints manager, Tommy Wright? :rofl:

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i wish jj was my dad

Sorry but thats shite. We seriously overvalued Walker at ?1million when he had a year left on his deal and at the same time we wanted to sell an unhappy player.

 

Each set if circumstances is different. If we've a player who is happy with us on a long deal and we get interest in him, what we did with Walker is a completely different case and would have no impact.

 

We were and still are in a weak position with Walker. On players where we are in a stronger position we've the right to expect the fee to be closer to a players worth.

 

This is a player with one year to go. An uncapped player with a history of injury and inconsistent form. ?500k was a decent offer and we should have taken it.

 

Im not sure how you know it was instalments but its hardly uncommon is it?

Well that's nonsense.  How much would Rangers want for their top scorer and player of the year in the last year of his contract?

 

Fair enough that Jamie's form has been less than consistent (on fire then no trying a leg) but I doubt any hun would expect anybody on their team sheet to be worth less than a million.  

Clearly, Pedro doesn't think he merits a place on their team sheet. 

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Escobar PHM

Well that's nonsense.  How much would Rangers want for their top scorer and player of the year in the last year of his contract?

 

 

I imagine they'd sell him for what another club was prepared to pay, or they'd keep him for the last year and get another good year out of him before Bosman kicks in depending on what they thought was in their best interests

 

Is this even difficult to understand ?

Edited by Escobar PHM

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MacDonald Jardine

They never offered ?500k up front, and if they did I imagine we would have taken it. We've been burned by Rangers before on deferred payment, no sense in offering them extended credit now.

 

 

Incorrect. Walker has multiple values to the team. He could be sold for cash to Rangers, yes. He also can be sent onto the pitch to play football, something that if we sell him we can't do, and for the value Rangers offered we couldn't come close to replacing his productivity. Selling him at too low a price also decreases the value of future sales for us, which is value lost if we had taken their offer. Finally, although he wouldn't see much of the pitch, selling him to Rangers would inevitably strengthen them as a team, increasing the likelihood that they finish ahead of us, which has a value too.

 

Hearts played this exactly correctly IMO.

Have we been "burned" before?

My understanding is the new Rangers had to pay off the football debts.

We are still a football club.

 

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

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MacDonald Jardine

Upside down thinking IMO.

 

Walker was clearly told by Rangers they would pay the asking price for him, then tried to low-ball the club with almost all the money in deferred payments.

 

I think we opened with a bid for Cadden which Motherwell knocked back. I firmly believe we had a verbal agreement with Well that if Rangers met the price for Walker that we'd turn a fair amount of the money around for Cadden. No sense in spending money we never got for a player we won't need because Walker stayed.

Almost all of that is pure speculation on your part.

 

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

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i wish jj was my dad

I imagine they'd sell him for what another club was prepared to pay, or they'd keep him for the last year and get another good year out of him before Bosman kicks in.

 

Is this even difficult to understand ?

If you are looking at it from the club's point of view Hearts think a switched on Walker is worth ?1m and won't be dicked around by a shower of charlatans who want to rip the piss out of us. That's what I understand 

 

They also expect Walker to behave like a professional and give 100%.  That's the risky part

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MacDonald Jardine

We didn't overvalue him if it would cost us at least a million to replace him withsomeone of similar standard. It's Rangers who clearly undervalued him as they wanted him abd failed to get him.

It depends what We're replacing of course.

The JW of the last few months won't be difficult to replace.

 

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MacDonald Jardine

If you are looking at it from the club's point of view Hearts think a switched on Walker is worth ?1m and won't be dicked around by a shower of charlatans who want to rip the piss out of us. That's what I understand

 

They also expect Walker to behave like a professional and give 100%. That's the risky part

I think we're playing it right but also think JW will be a waste of a jersey this year.

That says more about him though.

 

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

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Escobar PHM

It depends what We're replacing of course.

The JW of the last few months won't be difficult to replace.

 

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

His replacement is already at the club, and he'll be better IMO.

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Escobar PHM

If you are looking at it from the club's point of view Hearts think a switched on Walker is worth ?1m and won't be dicked around by a shower of charlatans who want to rip the piss out of us. That's what I understand 

 

They also expect Walker to behave like a professional and give 100%.  That's the risky part

It doesnt matter what we think he is worth. Thats already proven.

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jambocub

His replacement is already at the club, and he'll be better IMO.

Whos his replacement?

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Kiwidoug

I'm disappointed in him but I wish he would pull his finger out and cause some major damage while he is still with us. I would like to see this damage inflicted on teams who wear green and blue in particular and I include St Johnstone in that.

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moonraker

For the sake of argument, lets say Milinkovic is his replacement. 

 

if Milinkovic keeps him out of the team and rips up the league, which of the two are TTFKAR likely to be most interested in. I say this with absolutely no knowledge whatsoever of Milinkovic's contractual status once his loan deal with us expires. Seems to me that Walker is in a situation where he has to perform, or his chances of maximising his potential salary with the tribute act, is put at risk. this seems like a good thing to me.

Edited by moonraker

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jambocub

This thread is bloody crazy no one on here has a clue what went on between walker levein

 

Dont have a clue about what rangers offered or what hearts were willing to accept

 

Why cant we just let them get on with the football and try cheer the team on to victory.

 

Surely we trust levein to pick the best team available to him and if jamies part of that so be it .

 

If hes not performing then he'll be dropped its that simple

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Escobar PHM

For the sake of argument, lets say Milunkovic is his replacement. 

 

if Milunkovic keeps him out of the team and rips up the league, which of the two are TTFKAR likely to be most interested in. I say this with absolutely no knowledge whatsoever of Milunkovis's contractual status once his loan deal with us expires. Seems to me that Walker is in a situation where he has to perform, or his chances of maximising his potential salary with the tribute act, is put at risk. this seems like a good thing to me.

He has no chance of going to Rangers unless he has a BIG season for us. I imagine this is the first thing Levein would have said to him.

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Deevers

Let's just see how he performs today - that supposing that he is actually selected.

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Escobar PHM

Let's just see how he performs today - that supposing that he is actually selected.

He cant win really.

 

If he plays well today, the haters will say "Aye, a one off, lets see if he keeps it up" If it keeps it up he'll merely be 'playing to ensure he gets his move'

 

I don't care what his motivation is now. Its apparent he is leaving next summer. If we get goals and performances out of him until then, I don't think any criticism is valid.

Edited by Escobar PHM

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jambocub

He cant win really.

 

If he plays well today, the haters will say "Aye, a one off, lets see if he keeps it up" If it keeps it up he'll merely be 'playing to ensure he gets his move'

 

I don't care what his motivation is now. Its apparent he is leaving next summer. If we get goals and performances out of him until then, I don't think any criticism is valid.

Who do you think is his replacement

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Cheile

This thread is bloody crazy no one on here has a clue what went on between walker levein

 

Dont have a clue about what rangers offered or what hearts were willing to accept

 

Why cant we just let them get on with the football and try cheer the team on to victory.

 

Surely we trust levein to pick the best team available to him and if jamies part of that so be it .

 

If hes not performing then he'll be dropped its that simple

 

 

Spot on, but far too sensible for many on here.

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Geoff Kilpatrick

He cant win really.

 

If he plays well today, the haters will say "Aye, a one off, lets see if he keeps it up" If it keeps it up he'll merely be 'playing to ensure he gets his move'

 

I don't care what his motivation is now. Its apparent he is leaving next summer. If we get goals and performances out of him until then, I don't think any criticism is valid.

 

The criticism is all to do with the highlighted bit. The performances have been the issue.

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sairyinthat

He cant win really.

 

If he plays well today, the haters will say "Aye, a one off, lets see if he keeps it up" If it keeps it up he'll merely be 'playing to ensure he gets his move'

 

I don't care what his motivation is now. Its apparent he is leaving next summer. If we get goals and performances out of him until then, I don't think any criticism is valid.

got damn all to do with hating.Aberdeen are top of the league and playing well so a difficult task for us today.Why in hell would we want to throw them an advantage by playing Walker? We can't go on the he might put in a performance that is crazy,he has the situation he has created let him live with it.

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Deevers

The criticism is all to do with the highlighted bit. The performances have been the issue.

Exactly so. Repeats of the performances that we got post February would be absolutely unacceptable. The Aberdeen game in particular.

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Escobar PHM

The criticism is all to do with the highlighted bit. The performances have been the issue.

Fair enough. But there are numerous players who fall into the same underperforming category as he does since January. Djoum being the obvious one. He's also never tired of touting himself for a move but he doesnt get anything like the same level of vitriol.

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Escobar PHM

got damn all to do with hating.Aberdeen are top of the league and playing well so a difficult task for us today.Why in hell would we want to throw them an advantage by playing Walker? We can't go on the he might put in a performance that is crazy,he has the situation he has created let him live with it.

Good job Levein is picking the team then isn't it. I think he will play from the start, as he should. Lets see. If he plays and doesnt try a leg, you'll have a case. Until then, your blethering.

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Escobar PHM

Who do you think is his replacement

Milinkovic for now with Cochrane as the future.

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luckydug

got damn all to do with hating.Aberdeen are top of the league and playing well so a difficult task for us today.Why in hell would we want to throw them an advantage by playing Walker? We can't go on the he might put in a performance that is crazy,he has the situation he has created let him live with it.

 

I agree with this post.

Surely the team should be picked on form.

JW has not shown much of that recently.

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maroonnicky63

What team did you play for and when ?

Anyone could say they are a former player.

You are a wum .

Oh you mean you don't believe me,you must be mistaking me for someone who gives a dam what someone like you thinks pal

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Geoff Kilpatrick

Fair enough. But there are numerous players who fall into the same underperforming category as he does since January. Djoum being the obvious one. He's also never tired of touting himself for a move but he doesnt get anything like the same level of vitriol.

Fair point. In saying that, Djoum has been talking about England as his goal from Day 1. Walker, on the other hand, came through the ranks like Paterson, Nicholson et al. Compared to Paterson, he has been extremely unprofessional.

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Notts1874

Oh you mean you don't believe me,you must be mistaking me for someone who gives a dam what someone like you thinks pal

I will ask then. Who did you play for?

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Deevers

Fair enough. But there are numerous players who fall into the same underperforming category as he does since January. Djoum being the obvious one. He's also never tired of touting himself for a move but he doesnt get anything like the same level of vitriol.

 

I can't remember his stipulating that he only wanted to go to one club, nor can I recall any of his relatives going on line and spreading absolute nonsense about the club.

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XB52

For the good of Hearts I hope that Walker starts and plays a blinders. If he starts it means that Levein is happy with his performances in training and that will do for me

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