Too many foreigners and temporary contracts

[PeterintheRain]

With these words you make my case. Thanks. Nice to know you can't call someone foreign anymore. 

 

 You can't abuse people for being foreign.   Unless you're a xenophobic bigot.    Do you feel the urge to join in with, "Rudi Skacel is a ****ing refugee"?

 

  That is racist abuse of a foreigner.  Makes you proud to share their sentiment doesn't it?

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

I'm never more devastated about not wanting to join in a discussion, than when my contribution would be backing up Jeffry.

 

Not being funny Mothy but when you are telling people to ignore the poster in replies to you, you have a bloody cheek.

[PeterintheRain]

Try telling that to the 3,000 Hearts fans who stood at Easter Road last night screaming at Martin, Kitchen et al to get stuck in. Significant that both were hooked at half time and home grown players came on and at least TRIED. This is not about "bloody" foreigners as you call them but about players having a feel for the Scottish game and its up-and-at-em tempo in local derbies. The only player who started the game who seemed to get it last night was Jamie Walker. Try reading his comments today in the papers about some of the new foreign players - then call him racist.

 

 Jamie Walker was rank rotten both matches.   Pick another example of a, "good Scottish laddie," who apparently gets it.

[PeterintheRain]

Try telling that to the 3,000 Hearts fans who stood at Easter Road last night screaming at Martin, Kitchen et al to get stuck in. Significant that both were hooked at half time and home grown players came on and at least TRIED. This is not about "bloody" foreigners as you call them but about players having a feel for the Scottish game and its up-and-at-em tempo in local derbies. The only player who started the game who seemed to get it last night was Jamie Walker. Try reading his comments today in the papers about some of the new foreign players - then call him racist.

 

 Jamie Walker was rank rotten both matches.   Pick another example of a, "good Scottish laddie," who apparently gets it.

[Beast Boy]

Not being funny Mothy but when you are telling people to ignore the poster in replies to you, you have a bloody cheek.

I have four cheeks Jeffry. I honestly think your life would be improved if you kissed at least half of them on a daily basis.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

I have four cheeks Jeffry. I honestly think your life would be improved if you kissed at least half of them on a daily basis.

Hilarious. Any wonder you think everyone is out to get you?

[Beast Boy]

Hilarious. Any wonder you think everyone is out to get you?

I'm not up on Australian pop music... Is this a line from a real banger?

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

I'm not up on Australian pop music... Is this a line from a real banger?

Only if you're a singer as well.

[Beast Boy]

Only if you're a singer as well.

It's about the one entertaining thing I'm not amazing at Jeff. I'm quite sexy though, and I reckon my groin would win most audiences over.

 

You could always provide an alternative show where you discussed traffic and roadworks or the best places to buy de-icer.

 

Play to your strengths is what I say!

[Juho_Makela_Goal_Machine]

some irony floating about re opening posters handle

 

5 goals in 23 games aint a goal machine chief ,your taking the piss out of a foreign player that played

for our favourite football club chief surely

 

shrapnel

 

 

Cult hero mate, we're not all Stoics on here like yourself

[a safe pair of sells]

OP's right. All clubs and all countries have derbies and just because ours is old it doesn't mean it's bigger or more fiercely contested than, say, the Athens derby. Lenny Sowah was quoted in the press recently talking about having to go play for St Pauli as a Hamburg fan so he knows all about local rivalries too. Hughes will have sampled the Tyne Tees derby a few times I imagine and it's pretty testy sometimes. Besides, Celtic are hardly a team of wall-to-wall Scots and they're plenty able to rouse themselves for Old Firm games.

 

What happened last night was that we tried to play a certain way, Hibs didn't let us, scored early, rattled us, harried us and as the evening went on they broke us. If Cathro thought he had instilled some fight in his players it didn't work, or it wasn't enough. If he thought we could out play them he was wrong, we couldn't. Ultimately there was a disconnect between his tactics/gameplan and the event itself, a blood and thunder derby and cup tie.

So that's 2 head coaches in a row that there's been a"disconnect"between tactics/gameplan and the event?

[Sandy Clark]

We are a club that has not won the league since 1959/1960. We have only won the league 4 times in our history and only twice in the last century. We have won the Scottish cup 8 times in our history and the League cup 4 times. Why on earth do we want to continue to play the same style of football that we have done for the last 142/143 years and that has resulted in 127 seasons of winning nothing. Take away 1800's and the golden period between 1954 to 1962, we have won 5 honours. Five honours in all that time.

 

 

Sobering and factual post. Thanks.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

It's about the one entertaining thing I'm not amazing at Jeff. I'm quite sexy though, and I reckon my groin would win most audiences over.

 

You could always provide an alternative show where you discussed traffic and roadworks or the best places to buy de-icer.

 

Play to your strengths is what I say!

The character Kirk St Moritz from 80s TV comedy Dear John just popped into my head when I read this.

 

Anyway, having pointed out your hypocrisy, let's move on.

[Nookie Bear]

Still too many Yoonion, Yoonion men in our support. They're too scared to admit that it's the number of darker skinned players that they hate not just the numbers from outside Scotland.

Could you let me know if this is an ironic or a serious post before I decide to respond?

[Bauld]

I've been thinking about this a lot because I believe the idea that foreign players are the problem is a lot of shite.

 

I believe I've narrowed down the the problem. It's not about the players being from other countries it's about them being raised in a different environment.

 

Players raised in the Scottish game are raised in a high energy, high tempo environment from day one. We don't have the quality so it's compensated for by work rate.

 

We've signed a team of players who are quality players and technically very gifted but they have been raised in a low tempo environment where you get time on the ball.

 

As a result we have lost the balance between a high tempo, combative style that is a must in scottish football and high technical footballing ability.

 

 

So in a way people are right. We need some Scottish raised talent to mix with what we have. They don't have to be Scottish but they need to be raised in that high tempo environment. It might reduce the technical ability of the team but it will give us the fight and increase in tempo required.

[Boab]

I've been thinking about this a lot because I believe the idea that foreign players are the problem is a lot of shite.

 

I believe I've narrowed down the the problem. It's not about the players being from other countries it's about them being raised in a different environment.

 

Players raised in the Scottish game are raised in a high energy, high tempo environment from day one. We don't have the quality so it's compensated for by work rate.

 

We've signed a team of players who are quality players and technically very gifted but they have been raised in a low tempo environment where you get time on the ball.

 

As a result we have lost the balance between a high tempo, combative style that is a must in scottish football and high technical footballing ability.

 

 

So in a way people are right. We need some Scottish raised talent to mix with what we have. They don't have to be Scottish but they need to be raised in that high tempo environment. It might reduce the technical ability of the team but it will give us the fight and increase in tempo required.

 

The 2005 team was a perfect mix. Granted, the foreign lads were better than these guys but the balance was perfect. 6 Scots, 5 foreign lads sometimes vice versa.

 

How good was it !

[Maiden Gorgie]

Yup, posted similar last night after the debacle at ER. We don't need (or want) scrappers all over the park but need a few players in key positions that will stick the boot in, take no shit, and give it to a Djoum/Walker type who can provide the killer pass.

 

As someone posted last night, football is a simple game that we seem hellbent on over-complicating.

[Bauld]

The 2005 team was a perfect mix. Granted, the foreign lads were better than these guys but the balance was perfect. 6 Scots, 5 foreign lads sometimes vice versa.

 

How good was it !

Some good memories there!

[underwaterwoodwelder]

I dont doubt their ability and have no problems with players from foreign shores, but tonight I would have rather played 11 Scottish youth players who would have given anything to pull on the shirt. We many have lost by more than 3-1 but i doubt we would have been left feeling like they didnt at least give it everything they had.

 

I am not surprised so many of that starting 11 were left wanting, as they clearly have no apprecaition of how scottish football is played, and in particular a scottish derby, its not their style and not what they are used to.

 

Add to that the amount of 6 month contracts, of players who have simply been asked to fill a gap, then there is no chance they are going to be up for investing in fighting tooth and nail.

 

Problem is how you change that quickly?

 

If they arent invested then no matter how much you scream and shout, or are nice and persuasive.... if you dont get them to give a shit, they wont give you any fight.

I couldn't agree more with this op.

If you have players more passionate to fight for the cause and the gulf in class is only just slight then the more passionate team in my opinion will win more often than not.

We may have fallen into the trap of having to many average foreign players that are week when the fight is on. I hope IC can change attitudes in the dressing quickly.

[Deevers]

No problem with foreign players. Anyone who has really has a problem. I do have a problem with these short contracts though. You get the impression that some of these folk are only going through the motions to keep themselves fit until they can find a permanent club. It's akin to what we laughed at Hubs for doing a few years ago. Cathro and Levein have questions to answer over this. I want players at this club who want to be here and want to push themselves to the limit for success. Quite frankly I don't see that with many just now. The summer will be make or break for both Cathro and Levein as a complete reshape is needed. We don't need any players here who just want to free wheel. They should be making that crystal clear to the present squad.

[The Internet]

No problem with foreign players. Anyone who has really has a problem. I do have a problem with these short contracts though. You get the impression that some of these folk are only going through the motions to keep themselves fit until they can find a permanent club. It's akin to what we laughed at Hubs for doing a few years ago. Cathro and Levein have questions to answer over this. I want players at this club who want to be here and want to push themselves to the limit for success. Quite frankly I don't see that with many just now. The summer will be make or break for both Cathro and Levein as a complete reshape is needed. We don't need any players here who just want to free wheel. They should be making that crystal clear to the present squad.

 

The short contracts were a necessity at the time,  we'd lost too many players and had to get bodies in even if it was just to pad out the squad for the rest of the season. People would probably complain if we were handing out 2/3 year deals to what are clearly short-term fixes. Agree that the summer is huge in terms of recruitment, definitely need to get it right this time. 

[henry]

Last summer the recruitment was poor & as a result come January we had to panic into several signings, two injuries didn't help but it's the summer recruitment that's key & we totally failed to get the right players in. The buck stops at DOF & should have questions to answer with Budge but she won't be capable of knowing if it's been a botch up or not. This summers going to be another massive rebuilding with no doubt scurrying around at the last min trying to sign some unknown foreigner that turns out to be shite.

[Diego10]

Not read the whole thread but the problem isn't the fact we have too many foreign players, just too many players who either aren't good enough or are not suited to Scottish football.

No-one questioned the attitude of foreign players like Skacel, Adam, Flogel etc, so where they come from is not the issue.

One thing with Flogel is he looked miles off it at first and Jeffries had the luxury of blending him in gradually because we had a solid core.

 

It does take some players a while to settle in and get up to the pace of the game here.

[Deevers]

The short contracts were a necessity at the time, we'd lost too many players and had to get bodies in even if it was just to pad out the squad for the rest of the season. People would probably complain if we were handing out 2/3 year deals to what are clearly short-term fixes. Agree that the summer is huge in terms of recruitment, definitely need to get it right this time.

 

Short term contracts are fine if they are being used as a carrot on a stick to tempt players to try and gain a longer contract. I feel that only a couple actually fit that bill. I know that we needed to recruit in the last window. I just wonder about the appetite that one or two on these contracts have to step up to the mark when it's required. Wednesday night really asked that question.

[269miles]

Last summer the recruitment was poor & as a result come January we had to panic into several signings, two injuries didn't help but it's the summer recruitment that's key & we totally failed to get the right players in. The buck stops at DOF & should have questions to answer with Budge but she won't be capable of knowing if it's been a botch up or not. This summers going to be another massive rebuilding with no doubt scurrying around at the last min trying to sign some unknown foreigner that turns out to be shite.

Finding it hard not to agree with this. Especially the last bit.