Even More SNP Nonsense

[Space Mackerel]

You know if it turns out that Labour become more Labour than Tony Blair's efforts I would not be too upset about it.

 

A left leaning, socialist, progressive party that actually looks after the many and not the rich few would be a great thing indeed.

 

I always want Independence for Scotland as I believe we would prosper however; not getting it to a party that has policies that I described above would be the next best thing.

 

The tories can just sook it! Horrible pig skull lovers.

 

Im sorta with this train of thought too. However it won't be long till the Torys would be back in again. The vicious circle continues.

[Pans Jambo]

Is that how you describe conservative supporters to your children (should you have any)? 

My relationship with my children is not your concern.

 

My absolute disdain to the tory party and their supporters however is plain to see.

[Pans Jambo]

Im sorta with this train of thought too. However it won't be long till the Torys would be back in again. The vicious circle continues.

True.

[deesidejambo]

You know if it turns out that Labour become more Labour than Tony Blair's efforts I would not be too upset about it.

 

A left leaning, socialist, progressive party that actually looks after the many and not the rich few would be a great thing indeed.

 

I always want Independence for Scotland as I believe we would prosper however; not getting it to a party that has policies that I described above would be the next best thing.

 

The tories can just sook it! Horrible pig skull lovers.

 

I think Labour have tapped-in to a big vein of support.

 

Many support Nationalising public services as a principle. 

 

Many agree that the rich-poor gap is too large and that the wealthy can now afford to help the rest without too much pain on their part.

 

Added to that Labour in Scotland will now take a strong anti-Indy stance that Davidson previously beat them to, hence capturing all the voters who voted Tory at the GE to keep the Nats out.

 

If they continue that the Central belt seats are there for the taking.

[Boris]

Im sorta with this train of thought too. However it won't be long till the Torys would be back in again. The vicious circle continues.

 

As it would also be in an independent Scotland.

 

Independence, however desirable, will not eliminate the Conservative Party from Scottish Politics.  It may actually invigorate it.

[deesidejambo]

As it would also be in an independent Scotland.

 

Independence, however desirable, will not eliminate the Conservative Party from Scottish Politics.  It may actually invigorate it.

Not imo.

 

Th only reason people voted Tory up her was for the anti-Indy perspective and not for Tory policies per se.

 

Now that Labour are taking a strong anti-indy stance along with their the manifesto points, they will pick up the Tory anti-Indy votes along with the SNP anti-tory votes.

 

Indy is doomed.

[Space Mackerel]

As it would also be in an independent Scotland.

 

Independence, however desirable, will not eliminate the Conservative Party from Scottish Politics.  It may actually invigorate it.

 

Thanks for that awful thought! :-/

[Boris]

Not imo.

 

Th only reason people voted Tory up her was for the anti-Indy perspective and not for Tory policies per se.

 

Now that Labour are taking a strong anti-indy stance along with their the manifesto points, they will pick up the Tory anti-Indy votes along with the SNP anti-tory votes.

 

Indy is doomed.

 

My point was more that if Scotland were independent, there would still be a right of centre Conservative party involved in politics.

 

And they would eventually get their turn at the helm, be that as a single ruling party, or as part of a coalition.

 

In fact you may well see it at Holyrood some day.

[frankblack]

Not imo.

 

Th only reason people voted Tory up her was for the anti-Indy perspective and not for Tory policies per se.

 

Now that Labour are taking a strong anti-indy stance along with their the manifesto points, they will pick up the Tory anti-Indy votes along with the SNP anti-tory votes.

 

Indy is doomed.

 

This.

 

In order to recover voters, the SNP now have to actually pass some legislation and make an impact domestically and remove themselves from other matters such as Brexit.  However, it appears Sturgeon is still banging on about wanting a seat at the negotiating table.

 

Indy 2 is dead and the SNP should leave Brexit negotiations to the UK Parliament, and work constructively with Westminster to devolve relevant EU legislation to Holyrood.

 

I reckon it was a combination of the SNP's demand for Indy 2 and their contempt for the result of the Brexit referendum (a lot of SNP voters wanted Brexit), which ultimately bit them in the ass at the ballot box.  Its as much an own goal as the dementia tax proposal in the Tory manifesto was to their voters.

[Doogz]

My point was more that if Scotland were independent, there would still be a right of centre Conservative party involved in politics.

 

And they would eventually get their turn at the helm, be that as a single ruling party, or as part of a coalition.

 

In fact you may well see it at Holyrood some day.

 

Up until the Corbyns resurgence of Labour I'd have expected politics in an independent Scotland to largely mirror what we've seen in Westminster since Blair - a narrowing of left/right scale with parties abandoning some of their traditional values in an attempt to occupy a more central ground as much as possible to give them the best chance of winning an election. I'd have expected the Scottish equivalent to be to the left of Westminster's but still end up with a similar scenario of a largely bland choice of 2 or 3 parties that aren't vastly different from each other. If nothing else Corbyn may have succeeded in taking us back to a place/time where there is a more distinct choice to be made in future elections.

[Boris]

This.

 

In order to recover voters, the SNP now have to actually pass some legislation and make an impact domestically and remove themselves from other matters such as Brexit.  However, it appears Sturgeon is still banging on about wanting a seat at the negotiating table.

 

Indy 2 is dead and the SNP should leave Brexit negotiations to the UK Parliament, and work constructively with Westminster to devolve relevant EU legislation to Holyrood.

 

I reckon it was a combination of the SNP's demand for Indy 2 and their contempt for the result of the Brexit referendum (a lot of SNP voters wanted Brexit), which ultimately bit them in the ass at the ballot box.  Its as much an own goal as the dementia tax proposal in the Tory manifesto was to their voters.

 

As the third largest party at Westminster I'm sure the SNP will be very much involved at a UK parliamentary level!

 

I don't disagree that the SNP at Holyrood now has to start performing.

 

I'd hope that given the outcome of the general election there would be a more consensual approach to Brexit and its negotiations.

[jack D and coke]

As it would also be in an independent Scotland.

 

Independence, however desirable, will not eliminate the Conservative Party from Scottish Politics. It may actually invigorate it.

I believe Ireland has never elected a Labour Party since they got the independence from the uk.

The same would likely happen here imo.

[frankblack]

As the third largest party at Westminster I'm sure the SNP will be very much involved at a UK parliamentary level!

 

I don't disagree that the SNP at Holyrood now has to start performing.

 

I'd hope that given the outcome of the general election there would be a more consensual approach to Brexit and its negotiations.

 

The SNP have 35 seats and proportionally an insignificant percentage of the House of Commons chamber.  I just think its time that Sturgeon stopped trying to take the lead on non-devolved matters.

 

If Brexit goes through (and there has to be some doubt after the results last week) then Holyrood will have a huge amount of legislation to pass with powers transferring from the EU.

 

The SNP need to stop making demands over Brexit as whatever is agreed is for the whole of the UK.  We can't have Scotland being a member of the single market if the rest isn't, and have to negotiate hard with the EU or we will inevitably get a no deal scenario.

 

[JamboX2]

My point was more that if Scotland were independent, there would still be a right of centre Conservative party involved in politics.

 

And they would eventually get their turn at the helm, be that as a single ruling party, or as part of a coalition.

 

In fact you may well see it at Holyrood some day.

2021... FM Ruth Davidson.

[Boris]

2021... FM Ruth Davidson.

 

In coalition with whom?

[Boris]

The SNP have 35 seats and proportionally an insignificant percentage of the House of Commons chamber.  I just think its time that Sturgeon stopped trying to take the lead on non-devolved matters.

 

If Brexit goes through (and there has to be some doubt after the results last week) then Holyrood will have a huge amount of legislation to pass with powers transferring from the EU.

 

The SNP need to stop making demands over Brexit as whatever is agreed is for the whole of the UK.  We can't have Scotland being a member of the single market if the rest isn't, and have to negotiate hard with the EU or we will inevitably get a no deal scenario.

 

 

So the third biggest party in the house of commons should just sit on its hands?

 

The SNP should stop making demands, but what if the DUP have specific Brexit demands?  Should they stop interfering in non-devolved matters too?

[Thunderstruck]

2021... FM Ruth Davidson.

Couldn't do worse than the current incumbent whose popularity is on a downward trajectory steeper than the roof on Spacey's pal's chalet in Switzerland.

[deesidejambo]

So the third biggest party in the house of commons should just sit on its hands?

 

The SNP should stop making demands, but what if the DUP have specific Brexit demands?  Should they stop interfering in non-devolved matters too?

 

Another irony is that its in the SNPs hidden interests for Brexit to fail miserably.   I wonder if they will try to orchestrate that?

[Boris]

Another irony is that its in the SNPs hidden interests for Brexit to fail miserably.   I wonder if they will try to orchestrate that?

 

Not sure how they could, tbh.  I also think that party politics aside, the SNP don't want Brexit to fail, as it affects us all.

[pablo]

What a mess she's made of the whole Brexit situation. I actually can't believe she came out fighting like that the day after and nailed her colours to the mast.

 

A substantial number of her own supporters thinking wait a minute here,what's the rush? and loads of No and Remain voters, thinking not in my name everytime she mentioned "material change" or "dragged out against it's will".

 

Amateur stuff.

[Thunderstruck]

Not sure how they could, tbh. I also think that party politics aside, the SNP don't want Brexit to fail, as it affects us all.

You would think so but they have "previous" in that there is no apparent limit to the lengths that they will go simply to stoke grievance. Their ultimate aim is independence and everything else is subservient.

[Seymour M Hersh]

My relationship with my children is not your concern.

 

My absolute disdain to the tory party and their supporters however is plain to see.

 

True but maybe you should grow up.

[Trapper John McIntyre]

She's either in denial or more likely not go the bottle to shelf it. Fanatics gotta fanatic I suppose. 

 

http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/general-election/sturgeon-election-result-may-not-have-been-rejection-of-indyref2-1-4473781

[pablo]

She's either in denial or more likely not go the bottle to shelf it. Fanatics gotta fanatic I suppose.

 

http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/general-election/sturgeon-election-result-may-not-have-been-rejection-of-indyref2-1-4473781

The problem Sturgeon has, and consequently therefore all Nationalists, is that she's lying when she says she'll discuss it at a wider level across the SNP to help make her mind up.

 

What she'll really do is discuss it with her husband and then they might tune in Swinney after the event.

 

And as they're quite frankly, a couple of weirdos, they'll no doubt bash on.

 

Good news for Unionists, less so for the dwindling band of Nationalists.

[deesidejambo]

She's either in denial or more likely not go the bottle to shelf it. Fanatics gotta fanatic I suppose. 

 

http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/general-election/sturgeon-election-result-may-not-have-been-rejection-of-indyref2-1-4473781

 

I hope she goes for it.  She will get absolutely hammered.   The Country voted against it.    But go for it Nicola - you know best!

[Trapper John McIntyre]

I hope she goes for it.  She will get absolutely hammered.   The Country voted against it.    But go for it Nicola - you know best!

 

Obsessives and fanatics don't do moderation. Can you honestly see her dumping her Rasputin-like husband the way May was forced to drop her own advisors? No chance.

 

The truth is her and her party are becoming less credible as time passes. And more inflexible. Even Corbyn had to compromise on the Labour manifesto.

 

And Corbyn and McDonnell will shit all over the SNP if they get the chance.  To win an election Labour have to get Scotland back. Even that pair of old Marxist rabble rousers will reckon that they've now got more of a half decent chance of doing that.

Edited June 12, 2017 by Trapper John McIntyre

[JamboX2]

In coalition with whom?

No one. She'll do a Sturgeon/Salmond and run a minority and dare her opposition to vote her out.

[JamboX2]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-40267571

 

So Tommy Sheppard is out of the running after a few days to be Westminster Leader. Frankly, to me, he's the greatest danger to Labour. Quite surprised by that, think Sheppard would align better to members than Cherry, Blackford and Hendry.

[Pans Jambo]

True but maybe you should grow up.

Why? To suit your agenda?

 

The Tories are the worst thing to happen to this country since Nazy Germany.

 

I make no apologies for hating them.

 

& by the way, my dads bigger than yours so there!

[JamboX2]

Tommy would have been a great choice.

Story is party big wigs are falling in behind ex-investment banker and party treasurer Ian Blackford.

 

Journos on Twitter saying Cherry is offering "offices" for votes. Might be in jest. However her card is marked from that nurse thing in the campaign.

 

None, to me, are anywhere near the same class as Robertson.

[JamboX2]

Tommy is probably a bit too radical for them at this point, massive opportunity lost though.

 

Robertson going was a blow to all the opposition parties, really had May on the ropes at times. Hope that Corbyns new found confidence fills the gap. He had a couple of zingers today.

I said on this thread some time ago that Black and Sheppard are not in keeping with their discipline first party of the centre ground. And I think this proves it: investment banker vs QC. Very left wing

 

The party will roll those two out as and when needed. No more. No less.

 

He done well in the Commons. Found him an irritable tosser in the media though.

 

Let's hope. Corbyn and Labour seem emboldened. PLP meeting a roaring success from reports tonight. Let's hope it's the sign of better things to come.

[Maroon Sailor]

Story is party big wigs are falling in behind ex-investment banker and party treasurer Ian Blackford.

 

Journos on Twitter saying Cherry is offering "offices" for votes. Might be in jest. However her card is marked from that nurse thing in the campaign.

 

None, to me, are anywhere near the same class as Robertson.

 

If Cherry gets it the SNP might as well call it a day once and for all

[Roxy Hearts]

If Cherry gets it the SNP might as well call it a day once and for all

Cherry doesn't have the quality. There are not a lot of strong candidates and I support the SNP. Need Alex Salmond back in some capacity.

[JamboX2]

Cherry doesn't have the quality. There are not a lot of strong candidates and I support the SNP. Need Alex Salmond back in some capacity.

He really isn't the answer anymore for the SNP.

[jack D and coke]

Salmond is now free to lead the charge towards independence ...

Salmond needs to disappear now for me. There was a time I really liked him, found him pretty witty and affable but he's lost it imo. He's like some zombie snp voters they put more people off than they're ever likely to convert.

[HaymarketJambo]

The problem now for the SNP is that Scottish Labour are back in business thanks to Jeremy Corbyn and not Dugdale.

 

I hope Drew Henry gets the nod to be SNP Westminster Group Leader tonight.   

 

My view is that the SNP should have went for Mhairi Black to be SNP Group Leader that would have been fun in the old House of Commons?  

[Jambo-Jimbo]

Salmond needs to disappear now for me. There was a time I really liked him, found him pretty witty and affable but he's lost it imo. He's like some zombie snp voters they put more people off than they're ever likely to convert.

 

Agreed, he just comes over as a smarmy self righteous condescending prick.

There was a time when I'd watch and listen to everything he had to say, now I often change the channel when he comes on, he needs to be put out to pasture.

[deesidejambo]

Salmond needs to disappear now for me. There was a time I really liked him, found him pretty witty and affable but he's lost it imo. He's like some zombie snp voters they put more people off than they're ever likely to convert.

 

As a Unionist I hope Salmond stays around.   His star has faded and he is more toxic than endearing to undecided voters.  Smarminess only works for a certain period of time and once the credibility is gone it just comes out as bitterness and grievance.

 

Stay around Alex.

 

And Mhairi.

 

And Spacey.

[JamboX2]

Something tells me that he'll have an important role to play when Scotland gains its Independence.

Really hope not.

[Pans Jambo]

As a Unionist I hope Salmond stays around.   His star has faded and he is more toxic than endearing to undecided voters.  Smarminess only works for a certain period of time and once the credibility is gone it just comes out as bitterness and grievance.

 

Stay around Alex.

 

And Mhairi.

 

And Spacey.

Oi...leave Mhairi alone.

 

See actually gives a feck and tries to make a difference to the folk she represents.

 

Wish there were more politicians like her of all colours (except the tories. they are self interested mutants).

[Thunderstruck]

Oi...leave Mhairi alone.

 

See actually gives a feck and tries to make a difference to the folk she represents.

 

Wish there were more politicians like her of all colours (except the tories. they are self interested mutants).

Ms Black must be seriously conflicted as "Labour left her, she didn't leave Labour". Now we have a realistic chance of Labour returning to power and implementing progressive policies that can only be a dream in a "cover all bases" SNP.

 

That she lost votes to Tories in Paisley of all places must be giving her some pause for thought in her executive airline lounge.

[Pans Jambo]

Ms Black must be seriously conflicted as "Labour left her, she didn't leave Labour". Now we have a realistic chance of Labour returning to power and implementing progressive policies that can only be a dream in a "cover all bases" SNP.

 

That she lost votes to Tories in Paisley of all places must be giving her some pause for thought in her executive airline lounge.

Stood up for what she beleived and tried to deliver what her constituents wanted. Her hard push on the WASPI issue was really excellent. Where was Labour on that front?

 

Tories are still kin lizards though.

[pablo]

 

Tories are still kin lizards though.

It's personal with you. What did they do to you specifically?

Something to do with your local pit closing would be my guess.

[Space Mackerel]

As a Unionist I hope Salmond stays around. His star has faded and he is more toxic than endearing to undecided voters. Smarminess only works for a certain period of time and once the credibility is gone it just comes out as bitterness and grievance.

 

Stay around Alex.

 

And Mhairi.

 

And Spacey.

Afternoon pal.

 

[Thunderstruck]

Still parroting the "executive airline lounge" lie Thunder?

Who to believe - my own eyes or an internet poster. There's a conundrum.

[reaths17]

Who to believe - my own eyes or an internet poster. There's a conundrum.

go wi the delusional brainwashed cult member...........what could go wrong

[Pans Jambo]

It's personal with you. What did they do to you specifically?

Something to do with your local pit closing would be my guess.

LIZARDS!!!!'

[Thunderstruck]

Indulge me, share a link.

I know I am quite advanced but my personal observations and memory are not yet connected to the web.

[deesidejambo]

I know I am quite advanced but my personal observations and memory are not yet connected to the web.

I dont think he understands.   

[pablo]

LIZARDS!!!!'

It makes much more sense when shouted lol. Was just curious, no biggie.