Maroon Sailor Posted September 8, 2016 Author Share Posted September 8, 2016 4-6-0 will forever be associated with Levein At least he's honest and said the idea was to play for a draw Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maroon Sailor Posted September 8, 2016 Author Share Posted September 8, 2016 Was the Italy game when we got an offside goal and Italy scored in 91 minutes? Yip Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bauld Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 This is incredible Our games so rotten to the core over the last 10 years our national team makes the Romanov years at Hearts look tame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maroon Sailor Posted September 8, 2016 Author Share Posted September 8, 2016 About time Scotland had a team to be proud of Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Internet Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 Twitter is like entering a pub and everyone is on their 9th pint What a great quote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HMFC 86 Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 Bertie was on a hiding to nothing as Brown left an ageing squad and didnt blood many youngsters. Bertie cast his net far and wide with many players not good enough but he IIRC he gave the likes of Darren Fletcher their first cap Yep absolutely, but programme silent on that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i wish jj was my dad Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 Yep absolutely, but programme silent on thatagreed. Auld broon kept that squad together 4 or 5 years too long Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambof3tornado Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 Scotland v Italy Referee was murder that night and I'm convinced he was bribed - a devastating loss. Hutton got taken out cleanly but the foul goes to Italy and the rest is history Yup. A poor ref would have given nothing, a corrupt ref gave the foul to them allowing the goal to be scored. Football is corrupt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaw Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 Paul Mitchell's "James McFadden scores the best goal he's scored for his country" seems an ever more miserable example of a commentator failing to do justice to the occasion. Salmond just stopped short of saying Stein was ahead of his time because he knew deep down that independence was the answer and the annual Scotland-England matches got in the way of this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Placid Casual Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 Bertie was on a hiding to nothing as Brown left an ageing squad and didnt blood many youngsters. Bertie cast his net far and wide with many players not good enough but he IIRC he gave the likes of Darren Fletcher their first cap Good point. Also, the perennially useless SFA have been to blame. After not qualifying for the second tournament in a row (in 2001) they should have acted. Many other countries (France, Germany and Belgium for instance) did so after poor campaigns ? increasing participation and investing in key areas. Did Henry McLeish not produce recommendations that were basically ignored? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bauld Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 Bertie was on a hiding to nothing as Brown left an ageing squad and didnt blood many youngsters. Bertie cast his net far and wide with many players not good enough but he IIRC he gave the likes of Darren Fletcher their first cap Agreed and looking at the state of the team Burley had to deal with is incredible. Burley should have sacked half that entire squad and gone with whatever was left and whatever else he could scratch together. He might have failed miserably but it would have outed the players for what they are/were. It certainly brought to light the toxicity of the OF getting the lions share of the squad places. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sooperstar Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 That Scotland 1990 kit is a thing of beauty. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seymour M Hersh Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 Good point. Also, the perennially useless SFA have been to blame. After not qualifying for the second tournament in a row (in 2001) they should have acted. Many other countries ? France, Germany and Belgium for instance ? did so after poor campaigns. Did Henry McLeish not produce recommendations that were basically ignored? Quite why they decided a failed politician with dirty laundry was the right person to bring the game up to speed is anyones guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maroon Sailor Posted September 8, 2016 Author Share Posted September 8, 2016 That Scotland 1990 kit is a thing of beauty. Prefer 78, 82 and 86 to it, especially 78, the most iconic Scotland shirt ever Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Placid Casual Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 Quite why they decided a failed politician with dirty laundry was the right person to bring the game up to speed is anyones guess. There were (and are) better qualified people to do so. At least he made the effort though. Found it here: http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/scotland/8638920.stm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i wish jj was my dad Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 That Scotland 1990 kit is a thing of beauty. I loved it. Very much of its time though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i wish jj was my dad Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 Agreed and looking at the state of the team Burley had to deal with is incredible. Interesting comments from Elvis and pat butcher. I got the impression at the time that they were raging and there was more to it than was reported. Barry armband brought seems a toxic prick Burley should have sacked half that entire squad and gone with whatever was left and whatever else he could scratch together. He might have failed miserably but it would have outed the players for what they are/were. It certainly brought to light the toxicity of the OF getting the lions share of the squad places. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaggy2 Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 Bertie was on a hiding to nothing as Brown left an ageing squad and didnt blood many youngsters. Bertie cast his net far and wide with many players not good enough but he IIRC he gave the likes of Darren Fletcher their first cap He also gave Craig Gordon and McFadden (possibly?) their introductions. Including Fletcher, three guys who at least gave us hope. To a lesser extent, he capped Webster as well as a 19/20 year old. These guys would not have been capped so early under Brown. I've always defended Berti on the basis his competitive match record stands up to scrutiny. We've had shockers like Moldova all through history and he was the SECOND manager to draw with the Faroe Islands. Right after he was punted, Walter the saviour dropped Craig Gordon for Italy and lost to Belarus at home shortly after that. Don't think Berti lost a home competitive game until Norway (his last), including a draw against Germany and a playoff victory over Holland? Bad start to campaign 2 did for him and the ongoing media witch hunt proved successful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricardo Quaresma Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 Only caught a bit of it; anyone know how long before it's available? They state shortly after broadcast Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Placid Casual Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 What a pair of ignorant shits Ferguson and McGregor were with their Primary 1 gestures and childish smirks. Watching that tonight made we want to lamp them both. Cringing watching that again. A right couple of arseholes... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martin_T Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 Berti got the ultimate hospital pass from Craig Brown who spent years capping the same players and left no legacy. Hence we were reduced to playing at times with Steve Crawford and Steven Thompson up front. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maroon Sailor Posted September 8, 2016 Author Share Posted September 8, 2016 What a pair of ignorant shits Ferguson and McGregor were with their Primary 1 gestures and childish smirks. Watching that tonight made we want to lamp them both. If the clip ran longer it would have shown Berra laughing at it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sooperstar Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 If the clip ran longer it would have shown Berra laughing at it It did show Berra laughing at it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maroon Sailor Posted September 8, 2016 Author Share Posted September 8, 2016 It did show Berra laughing at it. Yeah I've just seen it again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlimOzturk Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 If Berti was given enough time we would not be in the mess we are in today. He blooded youngsters and got slaughtered for it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bauld Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 If Berti was given enough time we would not be in the mess we are in today. He blooded youngsters and got slaughtered for it Bring in foreign manager to try and change our style and modernise our national set up in order to breathe new life into it. Run them out of town on a rail for trying. He wasn't a success but I always got the feeling he wasn't meant to be. Thrown to the wolves in order to prove the dinosaurs right in the eyes of the nation. Keeping said dinosaurs in their positions of power. Behold the next appointment is Walter 'jobs for the boys' Smith. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tokyowalnut Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 Felt sorry for Vogts. OK, he capped ALOT of players, but I think he had to. Get the feeling from what Burley said about big personalities in the squad that he wants to say more on the subject. Fair play to CL for saying he provided the stick for which he was beaten with. Good programme again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doc Rob Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 Looking back at the Vogts era is painful. I wanted him to go at the time, but that was because we were all so used to Scotland qualifying for tournaments (1990, 1992, 1996, 1998). In retrospect he was dealt a horrible hand and deserved to be given more time. He certainly wasn't afraid to cap young players and started a number of excellent careers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marquis Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 Disappointed in tonight's edition. Simply a run through the last 30 years of Scotland's managers - no insight, no analysis, no examination of the routinely ignored reports (Walker, McLeish), in fact nothing to provoke debate. Maybe that comes next week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marquis Posted September 8, 2016 Share Posted September 8, 2016 Double post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samuel Camazzola Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 They never showed his "Christian" comment after Dailly out of shot called our opponents ******g cheating c@nts. Was that Germany ? Yeah, it was Germany. Neil McCann was harshly sent off which led to Dailly's outburst. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gashauskis9 Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 Disappointed in tonight's edition. Simply a run through the last 30 years of Scotland's managers - no insight, no analysis, no examination of the routinely ignored reports (Walker, McLeish), in fact nothing to provoke debate. Maybe that comes next week. Beyond the nostalgia i think it's been a poor series that has left more questions than answers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gashauskis9 Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 If Berti was given enough time we would not be in the mess we are in today. He blooded youngsters and got slaughtered for it This. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
We_are_the_Hearts Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 Our last win at a World Cup finals with big Craigy and Disco Dave keeping Brolin and Ekstrom quiet. That was after Craigs injuries, what a player he could have been! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
We_are_the_Hearts Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 Yeah, it was Germany. Neil McCann was harshly sent off which led to Dailly's outburst. It was Maurice Ross was it not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
We_are_the_Hearts Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 We need to go down the Vogts road again. A strong character with no OF ties who is given time to look at the big picture and develop a structure for the long term. We are just stumbling from one campaign to the next with no vision for the future. Strachan is only thinking about his record and how he is perceived IMO. Gordon Greer in a friendly a prime example Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaggy2 Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 Disappointed in tonight's edition. Simply a run through the last 30 years of Scotland's managers - no insight, no analysis, no examination of the routinely ignored reports (Walker, McLeish), in fact nothing to provoke debate. Maybe that comes next week.Agreed. Each of the managers, or someone at least giving an opinion on their behalf, could easily have had a 20 minute segment to tell their stories. For instance, Berti making the playoffs and his side of the David Weir story, where Weir behaved like a spoilt brat when told he'd played shite, which he had! Christian Dailly at least had the strength to take the criticism on the chin. Walter fecked off as soon as Rangers batted their eyelids, so feck him and his story. He got such an easy ride anyway, why would he claim any ill fortune? McLeish was at leat allowed to discuss his bad luck and told an interesting story about the Italian press. Although it has been mentioned we were very fortunate with our equaliser against Italy being allowed to stand. Despite all his well known problems, George Burley was a win away from the playoffs and only a Scott Brown open goal and a Kenny Miller sitter prevented us from taking the lead against a Netherlands side who had already qualified and didn't care. They cared enough, though, to accept David Weir's gift and beat us 1-0. Craig Levein was also not without the problems highlighted on the programme (the fallout of 4-6-0) but he was arguably the victim of the poorest decisions of all by officials. Steven Fletcher's header in Cardiff that would have made it 2-0 and that outrageous dive by the Czech Republic forward which resulted in their equaliser, again denying us a playoff spot. The meejia now have the man they want and despite the fact he's the first guy ever to lead us to a fourth place finish in a qualifying group he continues to get a far easier ride than any of his recent predecessors (apart from the ones with Rangers connections, of course). Nowt as queer as folk, eh, especially Scottish, Glasgow based journalists! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasAndy Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 Doesn't matter who the manager is if we don't have the players. We just haven't produced any great players for over 20 years now. All it takes is one or two to lift things a la Bale or Ronaldo with a very ordinary Portugal team. Until then the manager can only p*ss with the c**k he has. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maroon Sailor Posted September 9, 2016 Author Share Posted September 9, 2016 Doesn't matter who the manager is if we don't have the players. We just haven't produced any great players for over 20 years now. All it takes is one or two to lift things a la Bale or Ronaldo with a very ordinary Portugal team. Until then the manager can only p*ss with the c**k he has. Players attitudes towards the national team have to change as well. Some of them were far too precious and showed a lack of respect for certain managers. You have to have someone in who commands that air of respect and authority. A Jock Stein type figure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loveofthegame Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 It's a brilliant series, I've really enjoyed it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
We_are_the_Hearts Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 Doesn't matter who the manager is if we don't have the players. We just haven't produced any great players for over 20 years now. All it takes is one or two to lift things a la Bale or Ronaldo with a very ordinary Portugal team. Until then the manager can only p*ss with the c**k he has. Greece would never have won the Euros with that attitude Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RudiHMFC Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 Players attitudes towards the national team have to change as well. Some of them were far too precious and showed a lack of respect for certain managers. You have to have someone in who commands that air of respect and authority. A Jock Stein type figure Instead we appointed people like Burley and Levein who were well out their depth and nobody respected them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nookie Bear Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 Greece would never have won the Euros with that attitude Ah, but they had the Greek God of Defending in their team... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nookie Bear Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 Did Pressley say that the rangers players did not like his celtic connection? Do these mugs not realise that celtic and rangers are the same entity that rely on each other for PR and exposure?? I am sure I heard that it used to be the same in England between Liverpool and Man Utd. Oh, and Ferguson and McGregor should not have been allowed to remain with the squad after that nonsense. Putting them in the stand was a mistake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Worthing Jambo Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 Not many Hearts fans down this neck of the woods but one was spotted in the second programme and I'm sure another one was in last nights. Posts on here if I'm right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Samuel Camazzola Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 It was Maurice Ross was it not? Sounds right. Perhaps McCann scored and I got mixed up. I recall sending off being harsh. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudi must stay Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 Weakest of the programmes I thought. Plenty of problems but no solutions from the coaches Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bauld Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 Weakest of the programmes I thought. Plenty of problems but no solutions from the coaches The problem with scottish people talking about the national side is alot of them are still people with something to lose. Their reputation in the game still counts for something whether it be at a managerial level or higher up. Levein, Walter, Burley, Strachan, Eck etc all still have to be careful with what they say. Whether it bites them now or later. Pressley came over the best because he doesn't give a shit anyway and he's not going to care if what he says offends or causes trouble. I could tell Burley has alot more to say on that squad if he was allowed or in a position to just let loose and name and shame. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricardo Quaresma Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 That ref for the Italy game was utterly transparent; the ref for the 2 - 2 Czech game was about the same Wasn't fletcher's goal from a corner or a very narrow angle? Seem to remember that the claim was that it went over the bye-line, back in then blew into the net Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Findlay Posted September 9, 2016 Share Posted September 9, 2016 Hunger is missing nowadays. We are not breeding winners as the in thinking at schools and boys football is that there are no losers and more importantly no winners. School sports days. All get a badge/medal nowadays regardless of whether first or laSt. In my opinion that's a nonsense. Same with boys football. If a team are say 8 nil up take a player off them to even things up. Nonsense. It doesn't happen in adult football do why in children's? In all sport there are winners and there are losers. With our attitude of taken away the competitiveness we are breeding losers and this is what has to change. I got some hammerings playing for the school and boys club. What did it mean for me personally? Determined to do better the next time. 9 times out of 10 I did. Never dreamed of packing it in because I got beat. I wanted to win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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