FOH named preferred bidder

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

Again, it was simply a statement that (quite understandably and rightly) they get away with things that other bidders wouldn't, at least not without questioning. On one trivial level it is being free to speak meaningless stuff like "provide multi-layered protection" without anyone questioning what on earth it means. There is also a level of secrecy and obscurantism which I find a bit inconsistent with the principle of fan funding and control. Until today my understanding of the model was that the Foundation would buy the club with funds provided by those "capitalising" the pledges, and would (subject to the obligation to repay and probably with security being provided in the form of a charge over the assets)gain immediate control over running of the club. Today's statement says that a separate entity Bidco will initially acquire the club and sell it over time to the Foundation (Murray in his interview clearly says Fanco is in essence the Foundation). The timescales, and how the club is run during what it seems could be a significant transition period are unclear. I repeat I have no problem with any of it, am very happy and not in the least bitter, but I stand by what I said as a simple statement of fact. Why others get so worked up by simple facts I have no idea.

 

It's all about context.

 

I've no argument with you that how the Foundation have handled this process up until the last few months has been pretty poor, to the point that more people favoured the Gasman consortium pre their pulling out. That said, they have upped their game and now, hopefully, they will close the deal.

[frankbroxup]

 

Months ago (if people had bothered to read the posts) JKB was told what was happening.

 

It was clear there were people with funding who would purchase the club and then would be 'paid back' by the fans as they wanted overall control diluted into fan ownership.

 

All that has happened today is a description of how that will happen IF it comes to pass.

 

Despite all the work there seems to still be some who leave the impression that they will not be happy unles its all done in the exact manner they would like and who seem to want 100% answers to some questions that are dependant upon factors outwith the control of Bidco.

For example the purchase timescale will depend upon the number of pledgers, the purchase price and whether those pledging do so until purchase is completed some 3-5 years from now if we are lucky to have a CVA agreed. (never mind the costs involved if we are relegated)

 

Clarify the mechanics and you would double the number of pledgers.

[Watt-Zeefuik]

I have no problem with it at all. I am slightly amazed that a simple statement of fact has brought forth accusations of negativity. I very much welcome the White Knights from the Edinburgh business community. The fact that they are not in it for themselves but are offering their cash to facilitate the Foundation's aims make them a particularly shining example of White Knights, as others expressions of gratitude for their generosity testify.

 

Can you really not understand the difference between a "White Knight" on the one hand who comes in and buys the club, keeps control of the majority of the board, and runs it by fiat, and "White Knights" who do nothing more than provide low interest bridge financing for a fan buyout?

[CJGJ]

Clarify the mechanics and you would double the number of pledgers.

Clarify your statement and I might be able to answer it...............we are talking about football and not a car I take it ?

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

 

 

Can you really not understand the difference between a "White Knight" on the one hand who comes in and buys the club, keeps control of the majority of the board, and runs it by fiat, and "White Knights" who do nothing more than provide low interest bridge financing for a fan buyout?

To be fair to FA, he was alluding to the Q&A on here with the Foundation who said there were no white knights period, which was nonsense. If you wouldn't call this interest-free loan without commitment a "white knight" offer, what would you call it?

[JyTees]

Months ago (if people had bothered to read the posts) JKB was told what was happening.

 

It was clear there were people with funding who would purchase the club and then would be 'paid back' by the fans as they wanted overall control diluted into fan ownership.

 

All that has happened today is a description of how that will happen IF it comes to pass.

 

Despite all the work there seems to still be some who leave the impression that they will not be happy unles its all done in the exact manner they would like and who seem to want 100% answers to some questions that are dependant upon factors outwith the control of Bidco.

For example the purchase timescale will depend upon the number of pledgers, the purchase price and whether those pledging do so until purchase is completed some 3-5 years from now if we are lucky to have a CVA agreed. (never mind the costs involved if we are relegated)

 

So basically you just want people to throw their money in the hole without knowing the facts.

 

Many have (nearly 7000), many more would if it was a bit more black and white.

 

[CJGJ]

So basically you just want people to throw their money in the hole without knowing the facts.

 

Many have (nearly 7000), many more would if it was a bit more black and white.

You really think at this stage it is 'throwing money into a hole' ?..........oh and what money have you thrown away yet via FOH ?.. none !!

 

Get a grip, read and view what has been stated today and in the past then tell us what hole you are referring to... you do know the money will initially go to purchasing the club.......what kind of 'hole' is that.......first time I have heard of owning the club as being money 'thrown into a hole'......................this is not the 2012 share issue/loan/leaning on fans scandal which many on here told us was necessary for the survival of our club..........this is our chance to own,run and save our club.

 

This seems to be about trust and so far FOH have not let us down on that front so why are some still sceptical.

[frankbroxup]

 

 

Clarify your statement and I might be able to answer it...............we are talking about football and not a car I take it ?

 

Yes professional football not Sunday League. This is a business. How will the BIDCO investment be recorded ?

I assume they will be issued shares which will then be sold back to the FANCO or will there just be loans, repayments and cash swilling about? My argument if you have read my posts is that the BIDCO investors a should be issued a ?1 share for every ?1 they invest and likewise the pledgers should be issued a ?1 share for every ?1 they invest then everything is transferable. The BIDCO investors just release their shares to the pledgers FANCO on an ongoing basis.

[topcat]

To be fair to FA, he was alluding to the Q&A on here with the Foundation who said there were no white knights period, which was nonsense. If you wouldn't call this interest-free loan without commitment a "white knight" offer, what would you call it?

 

Turn that round.

 

When you read the phrase "White Knights" in context did you really think that meant people willing to forego a few hundred grand in interest to let us buy the club with our own money?

 

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

Yes professional football not Sunday League. This is a business. How will the BIDCO investment be recorded ?

I assume they will be issued shares which will then be sold back to the FANCO or will there just be loans, repayments and cash swilling about? My argument if you have read my posts is that the BIDCO investors a should be issued a ?1 share for every ?1 they invest and likewise the pledgers should be issued a ?1 share for every ?1 they invest then everything is transferable. The BIDCO investors just release their shares to the pledgers FANCO on an ongoing basis.

 

How BIDCO is funded and structured is nothing to do with us. What will matter is how the shareholding in HMFC (UBIG and Ukio) is owned. Will BIDCO own 100% of that shareholding and transfer it in instalments to FANCO? Will FANCO own it initially in keeping with the FoH structure and have a liability to BIDCO to be paid? None of that is clear at the moment but, TBH, it is all academic until a CVA is agreed.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

Turn that round.

 

When you read the phrase "White Knights" in context did you really think that meant people willing to forego a few hundred grand in interest to let us buy the club with our own money?

 

Yes, I can live with that definition. After all, if they are business people there are probably plenty of opportunities that will earn them a better return (even using your example, investing in gilts).

[niblick1874]

So after being told for nine months there were no white knights, the club is to be bought by a still anonymous group of ... white knights. Amazing what leeway being "guid Hearts men" gives you.

I see this post as being a about us having white knights.

[frankbroxup]

 

 

 

So basically you just want people to throw their money in the hole without knowing the facts.

 

Many have (nearly 7000), many more would if it was a bit more black and white.

 

You really think at this stage it is 'throwing money into a hole' ?..........oh and what money have you thrown away yet via FOH ?.. none !!

 

Get a grip, read and view what has been stated today and in the past then tell us what hole you are referring to... you do know the money will initially go to purchasing the club.......what kind of 'hole' is that.......first time I have heard of owning the club as being money 'thrown into a hole'......................this is not the 2012 share issue/loan/leaning on fans scandal which many on here told us was necessary for the survival of our club..........this is our chance to own,run and save our club.

 

This seems to be about trust and so far FOH have not let us down on that front so why are some still sceptical.

 

Wake up and smell the Coffee. Don't you think the fans are wary having been totally ripped off 12 months ago.

Issue a ?1 share for every ?1 pledged and paid up and you will provide the comfort.

You will double the uptake because if property prices improve the ?1 you spend could be worth a ?1 in assets.

TRANSPARENCY

 

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

 

 

 

 

Wake up and smell the Coffee. Don't you think the fans are wary having been totally ripped off 12 months ago.

Issue a ?1 share for every ?1 pledged and paid up and you will provide the comfort.

You will double the uptake because if property prices improve the ?1 you spend could be worth a ?1 in assets.

TRANSPARENCY

Frank, the system that has been chosen is one member one vote. If you don't like it, campaign to change it.

[Independence]

Yes, I can live with that definition. After all, if they are business people there are probably plenty of opportunities that will earn them a better return (even using your example, investing in gilts).

 

Your posts would put sleeping beauty to sleep. Is there not something else you could be doing....like being positive! Most readers of KB I know just groan when they see that you have added your negativity once again!

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

 

 

Your posts would put sleeping beauty to sleep. Is there not something else you could be doing....like being positive! Most readers of KB I know just groan when they see that you have added your negativity once again!

Far better being "negative" than an unquestioning fanboy like yourself. Just check your posting history on Vlad.

[Davie749]

I dont really get all this arguing and moaning about shares and what not when nobody is really much the wiser. We have been told a bit more how things will operate but not a lot.

 

Certain people are fronting the money, we the fans pay them back and thats it.

 

Sit down and chill out till things become a bit more clearer.

[luckydug]

I have no problem with it at all. I am slightly amazed that a simple statement of fact has brought forth accusations of negativity. I very much welcome the White Knights from the Edinburgh business community. The fact that they are not in it for themselves but are offering their cash to facilitate the Foundation's aims make them a particularly shining example of White Knights, as others expressions of gratitude for their generosity testify.

 

 

 

 

I was under the impression that the plan was always for a group of wealthy fans to put the money for a CVA up front and be paid back from the pledges. When a FOH spokesmenn said there were no White Knights coming in to rescue the club I took it to mean there was no mega rich businessman ready to pour millions into the club. I just don't understand why some people cant be happy that FOH given us the best chance of saving Hearts. FOH have played a blinder so far IMO.

[JyTees]

 

You really think at this stage it is 'throwing money into a hole' ?..........oh and what money have you thrown away yet via FOH ?.. none !!

 

Get a grip, read and view what has been stated today and in the past then tell us what hole you are referring to... you do know the money will initially go to purchasing the club.......what kind of 'hole' is that.......first time I have heard of owning the club as being money 'thrown into a hole'......................this is not the 2012 share issue/loan/leaning on fans scandal which many on here told us was necessary for the survival of our club..........this is our chance to own,run and save our club.

 

This seems to be about trust and so far FOH have not let us down on that front so why are some still sceptical.

 

I have read what's been stated. So far very little has transpired in the way of answers.

 

The hot air you're blowing adds the sum total of diddlysquat I already know!

[Francis Albert]

 

 

Can you really not understand the difference between a "White Knight" on the one hand who comes in and buys the club, keeps control of the majority of the board, and runs it by fiat, and "White Knights" who do nothing more than provide low interest bridge financing for a fan buyout?

I understand the difference. The latter seem to me more deserving of the title "white knights" than the former. I think your "little more" is a wee bit insulting to our white knights. Putting up a few million quid with no prospect of financial gain is not to be sneezed at.

[niblick1874]

I have read what's been stated. So far very little has transpired in the way of answers.

 

The hot air you're blowing adds the sum total of diddlysquat I already know!

I have read what's been stated. So far very little has transpired in the way of answers.

 

The hot air you're blowing adds the sum total of diddlysquat I already know!

Answer his Questions.

[Francis Albert]

 

 

 

 

 

 

I was under the impression that the plan was always for a group of wealthy fans to put the money for a CVA up front and be paid back from the pledges. When a FOH spokesmenn said there were no White Knights coming in to rescue the club I took it to mean there was no mega rich businessman ready to pour millions into the club. I just don't understand why some people cant be happy that FOH given us the best chance of saving Hearts. FOH have played a blinder so far IMO.

I am happy. I am particularly happy that some businessmen are prepared to pour millions into the club for the sole purpose of selling it back to us.

[Watt-Zeefuik]

I understand the difference. The latter seem to me more deserving of the title "white knights" than the former. I think your "little more" is a wee bit insulting to our white knights. Putting up a few million quid is not to be sneezed at.

 

By "nothing more" I meant in the positive sense -- they don't treat the club as their personal toy. The "White Knights" that I understood to be dismissed (and I missed the reference to the interview, thanks GK) meant the Abramovich/Mansour model, where an individual or individuals dump in money with no realistic expectation of financial return. BIDCO are providing bridge financing and control during an interim period. The true "white knights" here are the pledgers.

[Pivo]

I struggle to understand how anyone -

 

A- Had not already grasped that this was how the CVA would be funded given that this has been implied by FOH for months.

 

B- Worked out that this is an interest FREE loan from wealthy Hearts fans who have the same goal as everyone on JKB and want nothing in return bar their money back over X years.

 

C - That once the interest loan is paid back that those who have helped pay it back via pledges will own the club.

 

FFS if we pull this off it is the deal of the century in the current financial climate. Pledge and we will have a club to support,don't pledge and at best we have a Newco in the 4th tier of Scottish football.

 

Every financial investment carries a risk but few come with the upside that they can supply you with the best days of your life.

 

I would have signed up to pay ?20 a month for the rest of my life to anyone just to witness the 19th of May for zero return. The return is that we have a team to support and the chance to embarrass the wee team forever more.

 

Rant over............

 

[yorkshire jambo]

I struggle to understand how anyone -

 

A- Had not already grasped that this was how the CVA would be funded given that this has been implied by FOH for months.

 

B- Worked out that this is an interest FREE loan from wealthy Hearts fans who have the same goal as everyone on JKB and want nothing in return bar their money back over X years.

 

C - That once the interest loan is paid back that those who have helped pay it back via pledges will own the club.

 

FFS if we pull this off it is the deal of the century in the current financial climate. Pledge and we will have a club to support,don't pledge and at best we have a Newco in the 4th tier of Scottish football.

 

Every financial investment carries a risk but few come with the upside that they can supply you with the best days of your life.

 

I would have signed up to pay ?20 a month for the rest of my life to anyone just to witness the 19th of May for zero return. The return is that we have a team to support and the chance to embarrass the wee team forever more.

 

Rant over............

This This This ffs,pledge a tenner at least folks and do your bit....I want to say I was there at the start of it all !!

[Hartley Jambo.]

 

 

 

 

 

Wake up and smell the Coffee. Don't you think the fans are wary having been totally ripped off 12 months ago.

Issue a ?1 share for every ?1 pledged and paid up and you will provide the comfort.

You will double the uptake because if property prices improve the ?1 you spend could be worth a ?1 in assets.

TRANSPARENCY

No, people are putting money up regardless of the previous share issue, the vast majority of the pledgers will be the same people.

It's not seen by me as an investment regardless of property prices, it's about saving the club.

That's maybe the disconnect you have.

 

What does a share give me as an creditor in the worst cast scenario, I'm not interested in a return if the club goes to the wall.

Equally if property prices rise and it gives (fanco) the club an asset then good.

I'm not in it for a profit, doubt anyone else is either.

 

The paper profit will happen regardless, no fan really cares post admin what the ground is worth unless it provides security for the club, nothing to do with a share issue value.

 

Your target audience is further west.

[niblick1874]

I struggle to understand how anyone -

 

A- Had not already grasped that this was how the CVA would be funded given that this has been implied by FOH for months.

 

B- Worked out that this is an interest FREE loan from wealthy Hearts fans who have the same goal as everyone on JKB and want nothing in return bar their money back over X years.

 

C - That once the interest loan is paid back that those who have helped pay it back via pledges will own the club.

 

FFS if we pull this off it is the deal of the century in the current financial climate. Pledge and we will have a club to support,don't pledge and at best we have a Newco in the 4th tier of Scottish football.

 

Every financial investment carries a risk but few come with the upside that they can supply you with the best days of your life.

 

I would have signed up to pay ?20 a month for the rest of my life to anyone just to witness the 19th of May for zero return. The return is that we have a team to support and the chance to embarrass the wee team forever more.

 

Rant over............

[Francis Albert]

I struggle to understand how anyone -

 

A- Had not already grasped that this was how the CVA would be funded given that this has been implied by FOH for months.

 

B- Worked out that this is an interest FREE loan from wealthy Hearts fans who have the same goal as everyone on JKB and want nothing in return bar their money back over X years.

 

C - That once the interest loan is paid back that those who have helped pay it back via pledges will own the club.

 

FFS if we pull this off it is the deal of the century in the current financial climate. Pledge and we will have a club to support,don't pledge and at best we have a Newco in the 4th tier of Scottish football.

 

Every financial investment carries a risk but few come with the upside that they can supply you with the best days of your life.

 

I would have signed up to pay ?20 a month for the rest of my life to anyone just to witness the 19th of May for zero return. The return is that we have a team to support and the chance to embarrass the wee team forever more.

 

Rant over............

 

A. Nothing until today suggested FoH would not be the vehicle which purchased and controlled the club in the first instance.

B. It is not clear the loan is interest free.

C. As things stand pledgers will not own the club - they will be members of the Foundation for as long as they keep up their membership fees.

 

But the fact everything you said was wrong doesn't change my support for and gratitude towards FoH.

[luckydug]

I struggle to understand how anyone -

 

A- Had not already grasped that this was how the CVA would be funded given that this has been implied by FOH for months.

 

B- Worked out that this is an interest FREE loan from wealthy Hearts fans who have the same goal as everyone on JKB and want nothing in return bar their money back over X years.

 

C - That once the interest loan is paid back that those who have helped pay it back via pledges will own the club.

 

FFS if we pull this off it is the deal of the century in the current financial climate. Pledge and we will have a club to support,don't pledge and at best we have a Newco in the 4th tier of Scottish football.

 

Every financial investment carries a risk but few come with the upside that they can supply you with the best days of your life.

 

I would have signed up to pay ?20 a month for the rest of my life to anyone just to witness the 19th of May for zero return. The return is that we have a team to support and the chance to embarrass the wee team forever more.

 

Rant over............

 

 

 

 

 

Sums it up IMO

[Pivo]

 

 

 

A. Nothing until today suggested FoH would not be the vehicle which purchased and controlled the club in the first instance.

"The bid was submitted by the Foundation of Hearts' bid team under the company title BIDCO" you are splitting hairs BIDCO are FOH.

 

B. It is not clear the loan is interest free.

"BIDCO funders will not make any personal gain from the agreement with FANCO" it is in black and white, why are you so suspicious.

 

C. As things stand pledgers will not own the club - they will be members of the Foundation for as long as they keep up their membership fees.

Once BIDCO have been repaid all that is left within FOH are FANCO which is owned by the fans with the hint being in the name, again you are splitting hairs.

 

But the fact everything you said was wrong doesn't change my support for and gratitude towards FoH.

 

Happy to let others make their own mind up on whether you or I are correct.

[luckydug]

A. Nothing until today suggested FoH would not be the vehicle which purchased and controlled the club in the first instance.

B. It is not clear the loan is interest free.

C. As things stand pledgers will not own the club - they will be members of the Foundation for as long as they keep up their membership fees.

 

But the fact everything you said was wrong doesn't change my support for and gratitude towards FoH.

 

 

 

A I must just have assumed that FOH had backing as I was always under that impression and it seems plenty of others thought so too.

B While the loan may not be interest free no one is looking to make any profit out of lending money so interest will be minimal.

C The pledgers are members of FOH so therefor will eventually own the club maybe not individually but collectively.

 

I cant help feeling your nose is a little out of joint because you did not see these developments coming .

[Pivo]

Made an mess my last post, my answers are in the quote above.

[JyTees]

Answer his Questions.

 

Wtf you on about?

 

If you mean the rhetorical pish being slavered by CBGJ I think I'll pass.

 

It's me that was asking the question and being shot down for having the temerity to do so. Questions for that matter that can only be answered by the FoH!

 

 

[JyTees]

Can one of our enlightened members who keep telling us the fans will own the club after the debt's repaid explain to me what will happen in the event of the club being sold?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No...thought not.

[Davie749]

 

 

I cant help feeling your nose is a little out of joint because you did not see these developments coming .

 

Trolls generally dont see that far in front of them.

[Davie749]

Can one of our enlightened members who keep telling us the fans will own the club after the debt's repaid explain to me what will happen in the event of the club being sold?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No...thought not.

 

Why would the fans sell the club after its on sound financial footing?

[frankbroxup]

 

 

 

No, people are putting money up regardless of the previous share issue, the vast majority of the pledgers will be the same people.

It's not seen by me as an investment regardless of property prices, it's about saving the club.

That's maybe the disconnect you have.

 

What does a share give me as an creditor in the worst cast scenario, I'm not interested in a return if the club goes to the wall.

Equally if property prices rise and it gives (fanco) the club an asset then good.

I'm not in it for a profit, doubt anyone else is either.

 

The paper profit will happen regardless, no fan really cares post admin what the ground is worth unless it provides security for the club, nothing to do with a share issue value.

 

Your target audience is further west.

 

Can't disagree with anything you say but for this to work we need to attract a wider audience. Trust me if the club isn't successful on the park the pledgers will drop off. What's wrong with your investment having an equity value? . I can not see your logic.

We're is the incentive for someone to invest ?1000 per month if He can afford it ? None.He has the say as the Guy who can afford ?10.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

Can one of our enlightened members who keep telling us the fans will own the club after the debt's repaid explain to me what will happen in the event of the club being sold?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No...thought not.

No one can explain that until the terms and conditions of the contract between bidco and fanco are made public. I do not believe it will be anything to concern yourself about.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

 

 

 

Can't disagree with anything you say but for this to work we need to attract a wider audience. Trust me if the club isn't successful on the park the pledgers will drop off. What's wrong with your investment having an equity value? . I can not see your logic.

We're is the incentive for someone to invest ?1000 per month if He can afford it ? None.He has the say as the Guy who can afford ?10.

Yet bidco are investing ?x millions between them with very little say, apparently, so why should the ?1000 per month investor get preferential treatment?

[Davie749]

 

We're is the incentive for someone to invest ?1000 per month if He can afford it ? None.He has the say as the Guy who can afford ?10.

 

If you have that kind of money then you should be talking to Ian Murray and becoming part of BIDCO, have you got that kind of money kicking about loose?

[frankbroxup]

 

 

 

If you have that kind of money then you should be talking to Ian Murray and becoming part of BIDCO, have you got that kind of money kicking about loose?

 

I could have six figures to invest but there is no vehicle. That's the point.

 

[frankbroxup]

 

 

Yet bidco are investing ?x millions between them with very little say, apparently, so why should the ?1000 per month investor get preferential treatment?

 

Don't you worry until they are paid back they will have all the say.

And why would someone invest ?1000 there is no incentive to do so .

You are answering my question.

[JyTees]

 

No one can explain that until the terms and conditions of the contract between bidco and fanco are made public. I do not believe it will be anything to concern yourself about.

 

I know this Geoff. But apparently there's a load of people on this thread that see it differently which is why I'm asking the question!

 

I didn't think you'd fall for it...and I'm not concerned either.

 

[Davie749]

I could have six figures to invest but there is no vehicle. That's the point.

 

There is a vehicle, you set up a meeting with Ian Murray and have a discussion with the rest of the BIDCO team. It aint rocket science.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

 

 

 

Don't you worry until they are paid back they will have all the say.

And why would someone invest ?1000 there is no incentive to do so .

You are answering my question.

Well if they do, I have no issue with it.

[Davie749]

Don't you worry until they are paid back they will have all the say.

And why would someone invest ?1000 there is no incentive to do so .

You are answering my question.

 

What incentives are you looking for? Making money? Free ST?

But BIDCO have stated that its a non profit making organisation. To me, that means whatever capital is provided is subject to 0% interest.

[The Gasman]

 

What incentives are you looking for? Making money? Free ST?

But BIDCO have stated that its a non profit making organisation. To me, that means whatever capital is provided is subject to 0% interest.

 

I suspect you'll actually find there will be interest to pay (in other words, it's not 0%) but is limited to the rate of inflation, which would be non-profit making, as Ian Murray referred to it.

[Hartley Jambo.]

 

I could have six figures to invest but there is no vehicle. That's the point.

The pledge scheme by definition is not meant for people with six figure sums to invest.

That is for the vast majority of the fans, or is that too hard to grasp.

 

These potential six figure investors not pledging dont really exist except in your mind.

If you have a six figure sum then approach FoH directly. There would be a point.

 

You are creating an argument now for the sake of it.

Fan ownership for hearts isn't about those with six figures to invest, go west young man, go west.

[Davie749]

I suspect you'll actually find there will be interest to pay (in other words, it's not 0%) but is limited to the rate of inflation, which would be non-profit making, as Ian Murray referred to it.

 

I watched Ian Murrays interview on Hearts TV, I cant remember him saying that but Im glad youve put me right. In the end, in real terms, you cant get a better bank loan that that.

[slashishere]

Was wondering how I'd get to sleep tonight but reading that last page seems to be doing the trick, cheers guys!