Clerry Jambo Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 ..according to Donkey:rolleyes: http://www.talk107.co.uk/article.php?article=5228 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julio Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 ..according to Donkey:rolleyes: http://www.talk107.co.uk/article.php?article=5228 Thats why we will have been linked with CL so the regime can say they tried............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainmac Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 Thats why we will have been linked with CL so the regime can say they tried............. Who actually linked us with Levein though? Was it 'the regime' or the tabloid press? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julio Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 Who actually linked us with Levein though? Was it 'the regime' or the tabloid press? The usual spin from the likes of Charlie boy et al............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clerry Jambo Posted March 24, 2008 Author Share Posted March 24, 2008 I really doubt either will be at Tynie next season.....IF Motherwell get into Europe then that maybe enough for McGhee to stay. Then Hearts what or who's next on the hitlist:confused: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gigolo-Aunt Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 The usual spin from the likes of Charlie boy et al............. Julio, I know you are a wind up comedy character on Kickback - But have a ****ing day off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainmac Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 The usual spin from the likes of Charlie boy et al............. Must have missed that - where did Charlie say this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitch41 Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 ..according to Donkey:rolleyes: http://www.talk107.co.uk/article.php?article=5228 107 (donkey) understands mark the MOD EDIT mcghee is hearts prefered option. now this is why i have no confidence in the muppets who are making these decisions. of all the managers in the world they come up with this guy who hasn't been a success in any of his many previous jobs. so let's hope donkey has got this one wrong for the hearts sake. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cylawny Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 Must have missed that - where did Charlie say this? Ian , the spin most probably came from a Hearts source. Even you must realise that. You seem to come over as a " Regime apologist " don't get too close you might get burned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainmac Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 Ian , the spin most probably came from a Hearts source. Even you must realise that. You seem to come over as a " Regime apologist " don't get too close you might get burned. A "regime apologist" - that's a cracker! Has any "Hearts source" been credited with the Levein story? That's all I'm asking - it's a yes / no kind of question. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 All that report says is Eddie Thomson's opinion - that was in several other papers too - if Hearts approached either Levein or McGhee or any other manager then i'd be more interested in their comments than the chairman of their club who will obviously posture to keep his manager / play hardball for compensation / appease his own fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cylawny Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 A "regime apologist" - that's a cracker! Has any "Hearts source" been credited with the Levein story? That's all I'm asking - it's a yes / no kind of question. The "regime apoligist" will be proved or disproved come July when Fail or some other feckwit is appointed. The Hearts source being credited ? Not that I am aware of. Which proves feck all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clerry Jambo Posted March 24, 2008 Author Share Posted March 24, 2008 107 (donkey) understands mark the tattie muncher mcghee is hearts prefered option. now this is why i have no confidence in the muppets who are making these decisions. of all the managers in the world they come up with this guy who hasn't been a success in any of his many previous jobs. so let's hope donkey has got this one wrong for the hearts sake. Mitch I agree with your thoughts - I have never been on the McGhee Train - but if he comes he has my full support and IS better than what we have presently. Is this the guy who Charlie Mann believes would sell season tickets........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudi must stay Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 All that report says is Eddie Thomson's opinion - that was in several other papers too - if Hearts approached either Levein or McGhee or any other manager then i'd be more interested in their comments than the chairman of their club who will obviously posture to keep his manager / play hardball for compensation / appease his own fans. exactly. What's he gonna say, 'Yes he's going to Hearts tomorrow' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julio Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 Mitch I agree with your thoughts - I have never been on the McGhee Train - but if he comes he has my full support and IS better than what we have presently. Is this the guy who Charlie Mann believes would sell season tickets........ CJ strong rumours through in the west that MM will replace WGT at the Piggery when they win SFA this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainmac Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 The "regime apoligist" will be proved or disproved come July when Fail or some other feckwit is appointed. The Hearts source being credited ? Not that I am aware of. Which proves feck all. No idea what you mean by the bit in bold but if the Jan 1st statement is not honoured, I will certainly be making no apologies for this regime - clear enough? Julio suggested that the source of the story was Charlie Mann - it appears that CM is now putting words into Eddie Thompson's mouth!! Very powerful man if true - he needs to be watched! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
super_vlad Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 The "regime apoligist" will be proved or disproved come July when Fail or some other feckwit is appointed. The Hearts source being credited ? Not that I am aware of. Which proves feck all. The things in the media were a complete joke ! LAzy *******s the lot of them. All they did was pull all of the infromation from a post on here than go away and fill in the holes with there own names. The was nothing about hearts source or any insider near MMG or CL ! For what it matters they were better off printing the whole post and leave it at that ! Interesting to see larry linked with spurs and WBA, 5 million would do nicely guys ! P.s I would like to see us keep him and build a team around him tho ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K1874M Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 I have a funny feeling it will be JJ who joins us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudi must stay Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 I have a funny feeling it will be JJ who joins us. would be disappointed if you're right. McGhee and Levein have done far better this year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alwaysthereinspirit Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 Julio, I know you are a wind up comedy character on Kickback - But have a ****ing day off. Some comedy characters are even known to be funny. Unfortunately...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
super_vlad Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 CJ strong rumours through in the west that MM will replace WGT at the Piggery when they win SFA this season. So MM is not good enough for some of the fans on here but will appease the celtic fans ! I actually have no idea about how daft OF fans are, they seem to go lower and lower in my eyes every day. WGS won the title in his first 2 seasons, played better football than in the past, got futher in europe than MO'N but the majority of fans would want him out and replace him with a man who has never won FA as a manager and has being sacked by every club ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dagger Is Back Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 107 (donkey) understands mark the tattie muncher mcghee is hearts prefered option. now this is why i have no confidence in the muppets who are making these decisions. of all the managers in the world they come up with this guy who hasn't been a success in any of his many previous jobs. so let's hope donkey has got this one wrong for the hearts sake. Totally agree Mitch. The almost masturbatory response that McGhee has caused up here is hard to fathom. The guy has done really well with extremely limited resources but his record over the medium term is actually pretty poor. Most managers can see an upturn in performance following their appointment (well OK Rix excepted) but sustaining it is considerably more difficult. The jury is still out for me on McGhee but ar least he is streets ahead of that incompetent Shaggy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djf Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 CJ strong rumours through in the west that MM will replace WGT at the Piggery when they win SFA this season. McGhee isn't even on the Celtic radar. Strachan is leaving in the Summer but there are four names - at least - who are preferred to McGhee. David Moyes and Tony Mowbray to name just two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Only a Game Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 107 (donkey) understands mark the tattie muncher mcghee is hearts prefered option. now this is why i have no confidence in the muppets who are making these decisions. of all the managers in the world they come up with this guy who hasn't been a success in any of his many previous jobs. so let's hope donkey has got this one wrong for the hearts sake. 1. McGhee played for 4 years of his 18 year playing career at Celtic. He played almost twice as many games for Aberdeen as he did for Celtic and spent almost as long at both Newcastle and Reading as a player. He's hardly your classic "tattie muncher" (what that phrase means in football terms and why it should stop us welcoming him as a manager I dont know, well I do actually but the very thought is archaic and disgusts me) 2. Any manager who has been at several clubs will have been sacked at one point. Several very good managers have been sacked in their careers. 3. McGhee has had a sucess as a manager, albeit at lower English league level. He has got teams promoted in difficult leagues and kept them there, as well as reaching an FA cup semi final. Not a hugely remarkable sucess as a manager I'd agree (he wouldnt be quoted for the Hearts job if he was) but certainly not a failure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitch41 Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 Mitch I agree with your thoughts - I have never been on the McGhee Train - but if he comes he has my full support and IS better than what we have presently. Is this the guy who Charlie Mann believes would sell season tickets........ of course if mcghee did become hearts manager i'd give him my support but i can't believe this loser is the best romanov and his puppets can come up with. they really haven't a clue and if the people who are appointing a hearts manager are clueless what chance do we have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djf Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 The things in the media were a complete joke ! LAzy *******s the lot of them. All they did was pull all of the infromation from a post on here than go away and fill in the holes with there own names. The was nothing about hearts source or any insider near MMG or CL ! For what it matters they were better off printing the whole post and leave it at that ! Interesting to see larry linked with spurs and WBA, 5 million would do nicely guys ! P.s I would like to see us keep him and build a team around him tho ! It seriously must be the easiest job in the world. Get a nothing sound byte from the Dundee Utd chairman then write a report around 5 words. Talk107 understands.... Yeah, I can read the Sunday Mail as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Striker Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 For the past few weeks on Hearts World, Donaldson has been saying that in his opinion Hearts are after McGhee. I do think there is definite substance to this rumour. Levein is a non-starter in my opinion for reasons pretty much outlined by his current boss. Interesting that all has went quiet on the JJ front when there was an initial bit of press speculation that he would come to us if asked. His name never seems to get put forward as a candidate now. Don't think we need to worry about Celtic going for McGhee if they part company with Strachan. I think they would aim a bit 'higher' but I wouldn't rule him out as a future choice. If that means he's been successful with us...so be it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djf Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 of course if mcghee did become hearts manager i'd give him my support but i can't believe this loser is the best romanov and his puppets can come up with. they really haven't a clue and if the people who are appointing a hearts manager are clueless what chance do we have. He's proven though and thats a million times more than we've had since Burley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fat Striker Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 1. McGhee played for 4 years of his 18 year playing career at Celtic. He played almost twice as many games for Aberdeen as he did for Celtic and spent almost as long at both Newcastle and Reading as a player. He's hardly your classic "tattie muncher" (what that phrase means in football terms and why it should stop us welcoming him as a manager I dont know, well I do actually but the very thought is archaic and disgusts me). Good point. It bugs the hell out of me when people keep going on about him being 'celtic-minded' etc (whatever that means!) Personally I associate him more with Aberdeen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mitch41 Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 1. McGhee played for 4 years of his 18 year playing career at Celtic. He played almost twice as many games for Aberdeen as he did for Celtic and spent almost as long at both Newcastle and Reading as a player. He's hardly your classic "tattie muncher" (what that phrase means in football terms and why it should stop us welcoming him as a manager I dont know, well I do actually but the very thought is archaic and disgusts me) 2. Any manager who has been at several clubs will have been sacked at one point. Several very good managers have been sacked in their careers. 3. McGhee has had a sucess as a manager, albeit at lower English league level. He has got teams promoted in difficult leagues and kept them there, as well as reaching an FA cup semi final. Not a hugely remarkable sucess as a manager I'd agree (he wouldnt be quoted for the Hearts job if he was) but certainly not a failure. easily disgusted are we. well if mcghee gets the job i believe you'll be even more disgusted, but thats only my opinion. if mcghee is the best romanov, ogilvie and the rest of them can come up with it's a sorry state of affairs. in all the clubs mcghee has managed, and there's too many for the age he is, he's hardy been a success. huge disappointment yes, success no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cantbeatus Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 Levein Staying at Tannadice http://www.eveningtelegraph.co.uk/output/2008/03/24/story11112127t0.shtm As a United fan, i was worried about Hearts coming in for CL (for obvious reasons), but after thinking about it, i dont see him leaving United within the next 12-18 months, he is enjoying it here, he has only just got started, he has only just got a squad with depth and all available, a squad full of young hungry and some exciting players, mixed with good experience, i reckon CL thinks he can do even better next season and dont think he will leave for now, he already said he would see out his contract at least recently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 Craig Levein tells local rag he likes his current job....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Only a Game Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 easily disgusted are we. well if mcghee gets the job i believe you'll be even more disgusted, but thats only my opinion. if mcghee is the best romanov, ogilvie and the rest of them can come up with it's a sorry state of affairs. in all the clubs mcghee has managed, and there's too many for the age he is, he's hardy been a success. huge disappointment yes, success no. On the contrary I'll be reasonably pleased if he gets the job.(His religion, ancestory or feelings toward previous clubs are completely irrelevant and yes, any suggestion that they might be relevant disgusts me, deal with it) Who knows whether he'll be a succes or not. The thing is that Hearts are NOT in the market for a class manager with a good track record of success, the sooner you accept that the less disappointed you are going to be when the appointment is announced. He's managed 5 clubs I reckon in 12 years, two of whom have sacked him, one of whom was Wolves who had ambition far outwith their financial clout and sacked managers with astonishing regularity. He won Division 2 twice with different clubs and was 35 seconds off taking Millwall, YES MILLWALL, to the play offs for the premiership. He also took Wolves to the FA cup semi final and lost narrowly to Arsenal. As I said, not a massive sucess but certainly not a failure either. I think youve been asked several times in the last few weeks who you would realistically like as manager and havent been able to answer. McGhee doesnt exactly set the heather alight as an appointment but he is in the top tier of what we can hope to get. Some of that is Romanov's fault because he's made the club unattractive to manage, but mostly its because any "bigger" managers will want "bigger" jobs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToadKiller Dog Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 Levein Staying at Tannadice http://www.eveningtelegraph.co.uk/output/2008/03/24/story11112127t0.shtm As a United fan, i was worried about Hearts coming in for CL (for obvious reasons), but after thinking about it, i dont see him leaving United within the next 12-18 months, he is enjoying it here, he has only just got started, he has only just got a squad with depth and all available, a squad full of young hungry and some exciting players, mixed with good experience, i reckon CL thinks he can do even better next season and dont think he will leave for now, he already said he would see out his contract at least recently. Is it not disappointing that you are not seeming to get the support at home in the league for what is United best squad for many a year ,just over half full for a top of the table clash with well should have been a near sellout in the home end at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LarrysRightFoot Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 George Foulkes said, not that i trust him 100% or anything, in the EEN that he has 'reason to believe' that Levein would be interested in coming back to Hearts. Now you cant read too much into that statement but Foulkes is far more on the 'inside' of footballing circles than any of us are and him saying that interested me. As for me I think, much to the annoyence of any United fans, that Levein with the right garauntees would walk back to Tynecastle. Yes he has an affection to United and may feel loyalty to Eddie Thomson but Hearts are his club and like any of us fans I think he would find the lure to strong just as Jeffries did when he was at Falkirk. Now I am not saying he will get the job. He may not even get approached. He may not get the garauntees BUT if he did he would come back IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
portobellojambo1 Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 The "regime apoligist" will be proved or disproved come July when Fail or some other feckwit is appointed. The Hearts source being credited ? Not that I am aware of. Which proves feck all. Not sure how you work out that if Frail is appointed manager this proves that iainmac is a "regime apologist". No one at Hearts, as far as I am aware, has made any indication that Craig Levein has been approached to take the job. Speculation that he will be in the frame is being produced by the press, but that is all it is, speculation, being used as a means of filling an empty space in the paper prior to going to print. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Only a Game Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 George Foulkes said, not that i trust him 100% or anything, in the EEN that he has 'reason to believe' that Levein would be interested in coming back to Hearts. Now you cant read too much into that statement but Foulkes is far more on the 'inside' of footballing circles than any of us are and him saying that interested me. As for me I think, much to the annoyence of any United fans, that Levein with the right garauntees would walk back to Tynecastle. Yes he has an affection to United and may feel loyalty to Eddie Thomson but Hearts are his club and like any of us fans I think he would find the lure to strong just as Jeffries did when he was at Falkirk. Now I am not saying he will get the job. He may not even get approached. He may not get the garauntees BUT if he did he would come back IMO. He hasnt said he wouldnt take it, which suggests he would be interested otherwise why not just kill the story stone dead and tell the press, your chairman, and the fans of your current club, that your not interested. But the deal would have to be right for him and a nagging doubt I would have is that he is quoted as saying he'd like to try England again. Suggests that he'd bunk off again if he attracted attention from down south. Not really what we needed to hear him say if he IS interested . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rudi must stay Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 Levein Staying at Tannadice http://www.eveningtelegraph.co.uk/output/2008/03/24/story11112127t0.shtm As a United fan, i was worried about Hearts coming in for CL (for obvious reasons), but after thinking about it, i dont see him leaving United within the next 12-18 months, he is enjoying it here, he has only just got started, he has only just got a squad with depth and all available, a squad full of young hungry and some exciting players, mixed with good experience, i reckon CL thinks he can do even better next season and dont think he will leave for now, he already said he would see out his contract at least recently. yup and he told us Leicester hadn't even talk to him, then not even a day later he was their manager Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cantbeatus Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 Is it not disappointing that you are not seeming to get the support at home in the league for what is United best squad for many a year ,just over half full for a top of the table clash with well should have been a near sellout in the home end at least. Hardly, the only big crowd we have had at home to mwell i recall was 11500 in 1997. Think it was decent enough considering setanta covered it and made it early kick off which had an effect, mwell never bring any more than a couple hundred. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tazhearts Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 I can't believe how people don't think McGhee is good enough because he hasn't won anything and has been sacked a couple of times! Think of the number of teams there are in the scottish and english leagues.... Now think about how many major trophy's are up for grabs each season.... Do you really think Hearts would beable to lure a manager to Tynecastle who had won things (i.e. cups of league titles excluding lower league titles)? If you do you are living in cloud cookoo land. If we want an experienced manager then it stands to reason that they will have probably been sacked at some point during their career. There are very few (if any) experienced managers who have never been sacked in their careers and who are available / would be interested in joining Hearts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spellczech Posted March 24, 2008 Share Posted March 24, 2008 Mitch I agree with your thoughts - I have never been on the McGhee Train - but if he comes he has my full support and IS better than what we have presently. Is this the guy who Charlie Mann believes would sell season tickets........ Afraid I am less than overwhelmed by McGhee too. Every job he starts he does well initially and then seems to get sacked or leave. The same is happening at Motherwell as we speak... However, from the standpoint of how he talks to the media and the way he analyses games, he is a far better option than Frail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hhjambo Posted March 25, 2008 Share Posted March 25, 2008 Just because someone seems better than Frail doesn't mean that they are the right person for the job. We should be looking to appoint the best possible candidate. Not just someone who is better than our temporary coach. No offence to Frail, but a club of our stature should be setting the bar higher than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Ian Malcolm Posted March 25, 2008 Share Posted March 25, 2008 Just because someone seems better than Frail doesn't mean that they are the right person for the job. We should be looking to appoint the best possible candidate. Not just someone who is better than our temporary coach. No offence to Frail, but a club of our stature should be setting the bar higher than that. Possible is the key word there. More often than not, the best candidate for the job is someone who isn't likely to take it. Look at how Hearts will be viewed in the eyes of others - big club in domestic terms with a big fanbase (again in terms of Scottish football), there's definate potential. That potential is offset against an autocratic owner with history of interference. Once we've shown that the issue with Romanov is no longer an issue then we can look at bigger (and don't forget more expensive) names. Realistically, we're going to attract other SPL managers and those out of work down south who would be willing to come to Scotland. The only one in that bracket (very loosely) is Billy Davies (who didn't do nearly asd well as McGhee at Well on a much bigger bidget. He also didnt have to cope with his captain dying mid-season or an insane fixture backlog). If we are limited to other SPL managers, then surely the most successful of those are the best candiates available? McGhee isn't perfect, but we're not going to get anyone who is. A solid if unspectacular appointment is the first step along the road to the bigger and better names. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaun.lawson Posted March 25, 2008 Share Posted March 25, 2008 Afraid I am less than overwhelmed by McGhee too. Every job he starts he does well initially and then seems to get sacked or leave. The same is happening at Motherwell as we speak... Right. Seeing as you've written the above over and over again in threads about McGhee, I'm going to address it. Let's have a look at his managerial career, shall we? Reading: Took them over when they were going nowhere in the third flight of English football. Secured a dominant league title, then amazingly had them bang in contention for a second straight promotion to the Prem as well. This was back when ramshackle Elm Park was their home, and Madejski hadn't started spending money yet: he did fantastically well there. Then a much bigger club, Leicester, came in for him, and he left. Verdict? Big success. Leicester: pretty much doomed to the drop when he took over, but doing ok midway through the following season when he amazed and infuriated many observers by leaving for Wolves: something he now bitterly regrets. Verdict? Conducted himself poorly, the manner of his exit leaving a scar on his reputation. Wolves: The poisoned chalice. Had spent shedloads, but were still stuck in Division 1, and were notorious for not giving managers enough time to do the business anyway. In his first full season, had them straight in contention for automatic promotion, eventually ending up 3rd, before losing in the play-offs. This was as well as any manager did there throughout the 1990s. Needed money to strengthen the squad, but it wasn't forthcoming; faded slightly to 7th, but did reach a Cup semi-final. Left the following season. Verdict? Not a success, but not a failure either: indeed, if any job he did fits the criteria of your stereotype about him, this is it. At this point, McGhee's stock was relatively low, and he needed to prove himself again. So it was off to: Millwall: going nowhere in the middle of the third level, just like Reading had been. Took them to a dominant league title, and against all expectations, then got them straight in the First Division play-offs. In their entire history, only one manager has ever done better. But serious off-field problems, exacerbated by the ITV Digital collapse totally ruined their chances of going any further: Millwall would be in administration and back in Division Two within a few years, but this was hardly McGhee's fault. Verdict? Success. Brighton: a club with no ground, no money, and a desperately poor quality squad. Yet up they went under his command - before astonishingly, in to my mind the greatest achivement of his whole career, he kept them up in the Championship. They had the lowest budget in the division by a mile, and Brighton fans recognised what a miracle he'd worked; and sure, they went down the following year, but sustaining themselves at that level without a proper stadium was literally impossible. Verdict? Big success. Motherwell: took over a side which was greatly mismanaged by Maurice Malpas, but equally, had never looked as good under Butcher as it now did under McGhee. Most people expected them to end up comfortably in the bottom half, perhaps even in a relegation battle: instead, McGhee had them chasing Europe, and playing some great stuff too. And yes, they've had a bad run lately, but for heavens sake: in December, they lost their most experienced player, not to injury (which'd mess up most similarly small squads), but to tragedy, something bound to affect them emotionally for months to come. Then their training and ability to peak for games was totally screwed by their disgrace of a pitch. In 99/0, Hearts endured a ridiculous number of postponements in the first half of the season, and just couldn't get going as a result; then, once the call-offs stopped, we shot up the league. It's ridiculous to somehow argue that the "McGhee pattern is happening again" when they've had this amount of **** to deal with - and they could still make 3rd, even now. Verdict? So far, big success. His record suggests he's an experienced, good manager who's learned from his mistakes and has managed pretty well amidst great adversity. He'll be well down in the pecking order should the Celtic job become available - but Celtic, having played in the Champions League last 16 the last two seasons, are bound to look at a much higher managerial bracket. They're in a different league to us really; and in the circumstances, he's about as good as we're likely to get. Oh, and for the benefit of Mitch: are you telling me he was a "disappointment" at Reading, Millwall or Brighton, or has been a "disappointment" at Motherwell? What on earth are you talking about? Your comment above suggests that actually, it's not because you think MM isn't good enough, but because he committed that well known crime of playing for Celtic for a few years - otherwise, why the need for such a remark? For so long, your signature has justifiably been "if only we had a manager" - yet when a perfectly decent one is being considered, you throw your toys out of the pram. Go figure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scott_jambo Posted March 25, 2008 Share Posted March 25, 2008 Right. Seeing as you've written the above over and over again in threads about McGhee, I'm going to address it. Let's have a look at his managerial career, shall we? Reading: Took them over when they were going nowhere in the third flight of English football. Secured a dominant league title, then amazingly had them bang in contention for a second straight promotion to the Prem as well. This was back when ramshackle Elm Park was their home, and Madejski hadn't started spending money yet: he did fantastically well there. Then a much bigger club, Leicester, came in for him, and he left. Verdict? Big success. Leicester: pretty much doomed to the drop when he took over, but doing ok midway through the following season when he amazed and infuriated many observers by leaving for Wolves: something he now bitterly regrets. Verdict? Conducted himself poorly, the manner of his exit leaving a scar on his reputation. Wolves: The poisoned chalice. Had spent shedloads, but were still stuck in Division 1, and were notorious for not giving managers enough time to do the business anyway. In his first full season, had them straight in contention for automatic promotion, eventually ending up 3rd, before losing in the play-offs. This was as well as any manager did there throughout the 1990s. Needed money to strengthen the squad, but it wasn't forthcoming; faded slightly to 7th, but did reach a Cup semi-final. Left the following season. Verdict? Not a success, but not a failure either: indeed, if any job he did fits the criteria of your stereotype about him, this is it. At this point, McGhee's stock was relatively low, and he needed to prove himself again. So it was off to: Millwall: going nowhere in the middle of the third level, just like Reading had been. Took them to a dominant league title, and against all expectations, then got them straight in the First Division play-offs. In their entire history, only one manager has ever done better. But serious off-field problems, exacerbated by the ITV Digital collapse totally ruined their chances of going any further: Millwall would be in administration and back in Division Two within a few years, but this was hardly McGhee's fault. Verdict? Success. Brighton: a club with no ground, no money, and a desperately poor quality squad. Yet up they went under his command - before astonishingly, in to my mind the greatest achivement of his whole career, he kept them up in the Championship. They had the lowest budget in the division by a mile, and Brighton fans recognised what a miracle he'd worked; and sure, they went down the following year, but sustaining themselves at that level without a proper stadium was literally impossible. Verdict? Big success. Motherwell: took over a side which was greatly mismanaged by Maurice Malpas, but equally, had never looked as good under Butcher as it now did under McGhee. Most people expected them to end up comfortably in the bottom half, perhaps even in a relegation battle: instead, McGhee had them chasing Europe, and playing some great stuff too. And yes, they've had a bad run lately, but for heavens sake: in December, they lost their most experienced player, not to injury (which'd mess up most similarly small squads), but to tragedy, something bound to affect them emotionally for months to come. Then their training and ability to peak for games was totally screwed by their disgrace of a pitch. In 99/0, Hearts endured a ridiculous number of postponements in the first half of the season, and just couldn't get going as a result; then, once the call-offs stopped, we shot up the league. It's ridiculous to somehow argue that the "McGhee pattern is happening again" when they've had this amount of **** to deal with - and they could still make 3rd, even now. Verdict? So far, big success. His record suggests he's an experienced, good manager who's learned from his mistakes and has managed pretty well amidst great adversity. He'll be well down in the pecking order should the Celtic job become available - but Celtic, having played in the Champions League last 16 the last two seasons, are bound to look at a much higher managerial bracket. They're in a different league to us really; and in the circumstances, he's about as good as we're likely to get. Oh, and for the benefit of Mitch: are you telling me he was a "disappointment" at Reading, Millwall or Brighton, or has been a "disappointment" at Motherwell? What on earth are you talking about? Your comment above suggests that actually, it's not because you think MM isn't good enough, but because he committed that well known crime of playing for Celtic for a few years - otherwise, why the need for such a remark? For so long, your signature has justifiably been "if only we had a manager" - yet when a perfectly decent one is being considered, you throw your toys out of the pram. Go figure. :fing25: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamboron Posted March 25, 2008 Share Posted March 25, 2008 ..according to Donkey:rolleyes: http://www.talk107.co.uk/article.php?article=5228 Having spent a ***** weekend after the Falkirk game , this has cheered me up no end hopefully it`s true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bighusref Posted March 25, 2008 Share Posted March 25, 2008 Levein is an honourable man. He will not leave Eddie Thomson in it right now. As crass as it is, Levein will not leave United as long as Eddie lives IMO. Hearts ARE Leveins club, he has said it often enough. We may not have seen the last of him here. As for our current vacancy, of the names banded about, Davies or McGhee would be my first choices. As an aside, on Donkey's report did anybody notice that we lost any chance of beating the mighty Falkirk on Saturday because Cesnauskis went off injured? I wasn't there, but if that were the case, i would have liked Frail to say that he had given up after fifteen minutes so I could get myself back to the pub. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaun.lawson Posted March 25, 2008 Share Posted March 25, 2008 Possible is the key word there. More often than not, the best candidate for the job is someone who isn't likely to take it. Look at how Hearts will be viewed in the eyes of others - big club in domestic terms with a big fanbase (again in terms of Scottish football), there's definate potential. That potential is offset against an autocratic owner with history of interference. Once we've shown that the issue with Romanov is no longer an issue then we can look at bigger (and don't forget more expensive) names. Realistically, we're going to attract other SPL managers and those out of work down south who would be willing to come to Scotland. The only one in that bracket (very loosely) is Billy Davies (who didn't do nearly asd well as McGhee at Well on a much bigger bidget. He also didnt have to cope with his captain dying mid-season or an insane fixture backlog). If we are limited to other SPL managers, then surely the most successful of those are the best candiates available? McGhee isn't perfect, but we're not going to get anyone who is. A solid if unspectacular appointment is the first step along the road to the bigger and better names. I'd slightly query this. For one thing, Davies finished 4th, while McGhee's side could end up 5th. For another, while Motherwell were certainly overspending at the time, so was everyone else: not least ourselves. I have a particular interest in the period leading up to the financial crash in Scottish football in 2002 - and have the figures of all SPL clubs to hand. In 99/0, Motherwell's wage bill was the 6th largest in the division at ?3.3m, barely any bigger than either Dundee United's or Killie's. In other words, they comfortably outperformed their budget - but the problem was that fans just would not come through the turnstiles. So even such a relatively modest budget amounted to 99% of turnover, and though they only had the 10th biggest wage bill the following season (now below Killie, United, Dunfermline and Dundee), because results and gates got worse, they were now operating at 107% of turnover. How much of this was actually Davies' fault? Very little, I'd say: indeed, even in 00/1, they did better than their wage bill by finishing 9th on the 10th largest budget. John Boyle took a gamble, and it blew up in his face - but in truth, there was a madness affecting us all at the time, and as long as clubs like Rangers, Hearts, Hibs, Dundee and Dunfermline (the latter two to preposterous degrees) kept overspending, Motherwell had little option other than to do so as well. Looking back, even though they claimed to have done really well just to be in contention for Europe, they actually had to finish 3rd in 1999/2000, or face the consequences. And thanks to the tabloid press' absurd overhyping of Don Goodman's essentially harmless comments, they came up short: on such small things do managers and sometimes even whole clubs stand and fall. I've often wondered what might've happened had Goodman said absolutely nothing: JJ's team talk for the crucial game against Hibs is believed to have featured just three words ("Don f*****g Goodman!"), and Juanjo and McSwegan did the rest. And granted, Motherwell's budget is, in relative terms, lower now - but that's because most of the rest of the division have seen sense, and cut back themselves. I actually think Davies did about as well there as could've been expected in the circumstances - and given he's become a much better manager since, would hardly be gutted if he ends up getting the job (though on aesthetic grounds as well as those of experience, would prefer McGhee). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaun.lawson Posted March 25, 2008 Share Posted March 25, 2008 Possible is the key word there. More often than not, the best candidate for the job is someone who isn't likely to take it. Look at how Hearts will be viewed in the eyes of others - big club in domestic terms with a big fanbase (again in terms of Scottish football), there's definate potential. That potential is offset against an autocratic owner with history of interference. Once we've shown that the issue with Romanov is no longer an issue then we can look at bigger (and don't forget more expensive) names. Realistically, we're going to attract other SPL managers and those out of work down south who would be willing to come to Scotland. The only one in that bracket (very loosely) is Billy Davies (who didn't do nearly asd well as McGhee at Well on a much bigger bidget. He also didnt have to cope with his captain dying mid-season or an insane fixture backlog). If we are limited to other SPL managers, then surely the most successful of those are the best candiates available? McGhee isn't perfect, but we're not going to get anyone who is. A solid if unspectacular appointment is the first step along the road to the bigger and better names. Incidentally, further to what I wrote above, there are actually quite strong similarities between Motherwell under Davies and Motherwell now. True, Davies didn't have to deal with his skipper dying or such a massive backlog - but then, as now, their most productive spell was in November and December; now, as then, they largely fell away during the dozen or so games after that; Fir Park played up at times, and they were often more fluent and effective on their travels than at home; and they also had the two huge problems of captain Shaun Teale being sacked by John Boyle for comments he made about the club (which hugely disrupted team morale), and a massive furore in the media regarding Boyle's alleged, completely unproven desire to merge Motherwell with Airdrie and form Lanarkshire United. The latter disenchanted fans so much that gates actually fell immediately afterwards, all of which made the club's job tougher and tougher. In the end, after a late revival, they came up just short - and I could easily envisage the same happening again this season. Finishing positions of 3 Dundee United, 4 Motherwell and 5 Hibs sound about right to me: in which case, McGhee would have done exactly as well as Davies, but no better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PTBCAL Posted March 25, 2008 Share Posted March 25, 2008 Right. Seeing as you've written the above over and over again in threads about McGhee, I'm going to address it. Let's have a look at his managerial career, shall we? Reading: Took them over when they were going nowhere in the third flight of English football. Secured a dominant league title, then amazingly had them bang in contention for a second straight promotion to the Prem as well. This was back when ramshackle Elm Park was their home, and Madejski hadn't started spending money yet: he did fantastically well there. Then a much bigger club, Leicester, came in for him, and he left. Verdict? Big success. Leicester: pretty much doomed to the drop when he took over, but doing ok midway through the following season when he amazed and infuriated many observers by leaving for Wolves: something he now bitterly regrets. Verdict? Conducted himself poorly, the manner of his exit leaving a scar on his reputation. Wolves: The poisoned chalice. Had spent shedloads, but were still stuck in Division 1, and were notorious for not giving managers enough time to do the business anyway. In his first full season, had them straight in contention for automatic promotion, eventually ending up 3rd, before losing in the play-offs. This was as well as any manager did there throughout the 1990s. Needed money to strengthen the squad, but it wasn't forthcoming; faded slightly to 7th, but did reach a Cup semi-final. Left the following season. Verdict? Not a success, but not a failure either: indeed, if any job he did fits the criteria of your stereotype about him, this is it. At this point, McGhee's stock was relatively low, and he needed to prove himself again. So it was off to: Millwall: going nowhere in the middle of the third level, just like Reading had been. Took them to a dominant league title, and against all expectations, then got them straight in the First Division play-offs. In their entire history, only one manager has ever done better. But serious off-field problems, exacerbated by the ITV Digital collapse totally ruined their chances of going any further: Millwall would be in administration and back in Division Two within a few years, but this was hardly McGhee's fault. Verdict? Success. Brighton: a club with no ground, no money, and a desperately poor quality squad. Yet up they went under his command - before astonishingly, in to my mind the greatest achivement of his whole career, he kept them up in the Championship. They had the lowest budget in the division by a mile, and Brighton fans recognised what a miracle he'd worked; and sure, they went down the following year, but sustaining themselves at that level without a proper stadium was literally impossible. Verdict? Big success. Motherwell: took over a side which was greatly mismanaged by Maurice Malpas, but equally, had never looked as good under Butcher as it now did under McGhee. Most people expected them to end up comfortably in the bottom half, perhaps even in a relegation battle: instead, McGhee had them chasing Europe, and playing some great stuff too. And yes, they've had a bad run lately, but for heavens sake: in December, they lost their most experienced player, not to injury (which'd mess up most similarly small squads), but to tragedy, something bound to affect them emotionally for months to come. Then their training and ability to peak for games was totally screwed by their disgrace of a pitch. In 99/0, Hearts endured a ridiculous number of postponements in the first half of the season, and just couldn't get going as a result; then, once the call-offs stopped, we shot up the league. It's ridiculous to somehow argue that the "McGhee pattern is happening again" when they've had this amount of **** to deal with - and they could still make 3rd, even now. Verdict? So far, big success. His record suggests he's an experienced, good manager who's learned from his mistakes and has managed pretty well amidst great adversity. He'll be well down in the pecking order should the Celtic job become available - but Celtic, having played in the Champions League last 16 the last two seasons, are bound to look at a much higher managerial bracket. They're in a different league to us really; and in the circumstances, he's about as good as we're likely to get. Oh, and for the benefit of Mitch: are you telling me he was a "disappointment" at Reading, Millwall or Brighton, or has been a "disappointment" at Motherwell? What on earth are you talking about? Your comment above suggests that actually, it's not because you think MM isn't good enough, but because he committed that well known crime of playing for Celtic for a few years - otherwise, why the need for such a remark? For so long, your signature has justifiably been "if only we had a manager" - yet when a perfectly decent one is being considered, you throw your toys out of the pram. Go figure. Excellant post but is he coming? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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