Dougie told me to lie

[Drylaw Hearts]

Book him for what?

 

I obviously can't say for certain but I suspect it's for running towards the linesman or maybe even swearing at him.

[albishop]

I obviously can't say for certain but I suspect it's for running towards the linesman or maybe even swearing at him.

 

Then I suppose Davie Weir should be booked in the first 10 minutes of every game? Assuming that they treat all teams equally, of course....

[wibble]

 

 

It's begs the question - why has nobody ever came forward, told their story and made the remainder of their lives that little bit more comfortable ?

 

Out of all the men who give up their Saturdays to run around being shouted at by a bunch of nutters, surely one of them must have felt enough guilt to reveal all and put a stop to the corruption ?

 

 

 

They are all ex-cops, ministers and masons. They all know the value of keeping their mouths shut and the penalties for blabbing.

 

 

 

[Radge21]

The video is just more proof how corrupt Dallas is.

The wee gimp is in charge of referee's in Scotland.

He tells lies they tell lies but the whole thing will

end up as a corrupt whitewash.

Dougie MacDonald has never told lies before and he never will again.

Well not till the next time.

Corrupt wee gimps

[Spellczech]

Was talking to a referee today. He was telling me that there may be a few refs who would be willing to back up Craven about the bullying if he asks them to...Apparently Dallas is really pushing his son towards being a Grade 1 ref and this is not appreciated by some. Reckons McDonald may have to go as Glasgow Broadsheets want his head on a plate - may not be able to brave out the last 1.5years until his fiftieth and that surely he has lost all chance on being on referees commission or any senior role after he stops whistling.

 

I heard about this one guy who was a Grade 1 ref for 5 years and hoped to get SPL games this year. Dallas made him Grade 3 and effectively ended his career as a ref. I asked what team the guy supports which threw him a bit, but he said "he is an Hearts fan". I said "there you go - it figures as McDonald is the token Hobo and Murray is the token Jambo". He said he wasn't aware that Murray is a Jambo as he's never mentioned supporting any team. He then told me that there are a number of young refs at the Academy who live in Stirling area but have chosen to join Glasgow area association, so yes even the refs must recognise Glasgow bias and it is better for them to be "west coast".

 

Incidentally, all refs have been called to a meeting and been told that under NO circumstances are they to mention the current hoo-ha. The whitewash is in effect it seems...

[Spellczech]

from your Scotsman link

Dallas said: "I think the main thing is that the final decision that was taken was correct. And the referee is well within his rights to change his mind as long as he has not restarted play.

 

"Dougie, after having given the decision, then received information from the assistant referee that the goalkeeper had played the ball.

 

"There is a really good replay of the incident from the offside-line camera, which clearly shows the ball changing direction - and that was something that Dougie did not enjoy at the time. So the decision was overturned and it's not the first time that has happened this season. It's already happened down at Kilmarnock, where the assistant referee and fourth official overturned a penalty decision."

 

Unless it has been edited since you posted, at no point does Dallas say Craven called the ref over. He only says after receiving information from the Assistant referee that McHobo changed his decision.

I see nothing in the quotes that damage Dallas' credibility.

 

The below is from the Scotsman article on the Wednesday but we now know that Lennon was lied to and that Dallas knew this on the Sunday when McDonald owned up:

However, Dallas claimed that Lennon had changed his opinion after further discussion. "Neil Lennon took the time to go to the referee's dressing-room about 40 minutes after the match was concluded," the former World Cup referee said. "They had a discussion and Neil accepted that the decision was correct. It was just unusual. He received a full explanation."

 

 

Dallas must go.

[Spellczech]

Is Craven telling the truth though ?

 

He's lied at least once already and he was prepared to stand-by and watch Utd concede a pen which he has admitted he didn't think should have been awarded.

 

Craven is a Celtic man - was told this by a ref. Of course he didn't want McDonald to blame him for the reversal of the decision! He was happy enough to go along with McDonald's decision, and perhaps it was because McDonald appeared to have a better view, but to get blamed for McDonald's change of mind...come on, no Celtic supporting official would want death threats from his own fellow fans!

[Deevers]

Was talking to a referee today. He was telling me that there may be a few refs who would be willing to back up Craven about the bullying if he asks them to...Apparently Dallas is really pushing his son towards being a Grade 1 ref and this is not appreciated by some. Reckons McDonald may have to go as Glasgow Broadsheets want his head on a plate - may not be able to brave out the last 1.5years until his fiftieth and that surely he has lost all chance on being on referees commission or any senior role after he stops whistling.

 

I heard about this one guy who was a Grade 1 ref for 5 years and hoped to get SPL games this year. Dallas made him Grade 3 and effectively ended his career as a ref. I asked what team the guy supports which threw him a bit, but he said "he is an Hearts fan". I said "there you go - it figures as McDonald is the token Hobo and Murray is the token Jambo". He said he wasn't aware that Murray is a Jambo as he's never mentioned supporting any team. He then told me that there are a number of young refs at the Academy who live in Stirling area but have chosen to join Glasgow area association, so yes even the refs must recognise Glasgow bias and it is better for them to be "west coast".

 

Incidentally, all refs have been called to a meeting and been told that under NO circumstances are they to mention the current hoo-ha. The whitewash is in effect it seems...

 

 

I hear that he even got rid of a match supervisor who dared to give his son a poor rating at a match he was covering. The goings on inside the referees department at Hampden are quite shameful I've been told.

[Miller Jambo 60]

They are all ex-cops, ministers and masons. They all know the value of keeping their mouths shut and the penalties for blabbing.

 

 

 

 

 

Wot are cops 1 chief in corrie does it on the net love it

[DETTY29]

from your Scotsman link

Dallas said: "I think the main thing is that the final decision that was taken was correct. And the referee is well within his rights to change his mind as long as he has not restarted play.

 

"Dougie, after having given the decision, then received information from the assistant referee that the goalkeeper had played the ball.

 

"There is a really good replay of the incident from the offside-line camera, which clearly shows the ball changing direction - and that was something that Dougie did not enjoy at the time. So the decision was overturned and it's not the first time that has happened this season. It's already happened down at Kilmarnock, where the assistant referee and fourth official overturned a penalty decision."

 

Unless it has been edited since you posted, at no point does Dallas say Craven called the ref over. He only says after receiving information from the Assistant referee that McHobo changed his decision.

I see nothing in the quotes that damage Dallas' credibility.

 

Salecc,

 

(Apologies for the delay, back online for first time with my pc)

 

You are correct to an extent in that I have misread the article, notably the direct quotes from Dallas however, I still stand by that Dallas is culpable and should be made to resign. Rememeber it has now widely reported and accepted by both Dallas and MacDonald that Dallas was in receipt of the full facts on Sunday evening.

 

However, to me this is the part that he says that is key. Yes at no point does Dallas say Craven called over MacDonald however Dallas was very sparse in his explanation as to what happened.

 

"Dougie, after having given the decision, then received information from the assistant referee that the goalkeeper had played the ball.

 

To most observers, this has been interpreted that Craven offered information. Indeed, Angus Wright in his assumption of events writes:-

 

Television pictures appeared to back the linesman's decision - but it wasn't the linesman's decision though was it? The only decision the linesman made was to concur with MacDonald that it was a penalty or not enough of an injustice or wrong decision from MacDonlad to flag for an over-rule.

 

Angus Wright also comments on 01 November.

 

In the days immediately after the incident, Dallas explained that assistant referee Steven Craven had alerted McDonald to his error in pointing to the spot following United goalkeeper Dusan Pernis' challenge on Gary Hooper - Again all the onus on Craven in the early aftermath, but still after Dallas was aware of the facts.

 

http://sport.scotsman.com/celticfc/Dougie-McDonald-found-wanting-as.6605823.jp

 

So for a near 5 full days the SFA, notably Dallas were in receipt of the facts but still allowed the press and the general public to put the whole onus on Craven without in anyway making any attempt to divert the circling pack. Indeed even as early as Sunday night there were people on here noting that the linesman had taken up the position of agreeing with the penalty award(or not debating the penalty decision). So they couldn't even get the 'cover up' done professionally without making a pig's ear of it.

 

So this then beggars another question - what if the reports hadn't been leaked to Celtic from within the SFA? Would we be where we are just now? Maybe they might be trying to convince us Santa is real after all.

 

It's being reported today that SPL managers have lost all confidence in MacDonald and aren't too convinced about Dallas' part in this. And be sure these guys will be in receipt of information that hasn't hit the public domain yet.

 

Oh and one final point, again the investigation has discovered that the ref supervisor MacBurney was also told of the origianl cover up, but refused to let the referees report either be changed, or an addendum attached. Is he under any disciplinary procedures? Not been reported as yet.

 

I stand by that for any credibility to come out of this MacDonald, Dallas and MacBurney should be sacked, and if Stewart Regan was anyway culpable in allowing the general public to continue to believe Craven alerted MacDonald and was the primary reason that the penalty was overturned, should go to.

[Miller Jambo 60]

Wot are cops 1 chief in corrie does it on the net love it

 

 

Take it no one reads the papers papers sorry was a joke there

[Ben Dover]

Here's a wee question?

Why have we not heard from any of the United players what exactly McHobo said to them?

Supposedly he put his hands up and said "My mistake"

Were any of them in earshot during the McHobo / Craven post award chit - chat ?

Investigative journalism at it's ruthless best I see

 

Anyway, to reiterate my take on this.

The refs might even have scored a point during this if Dallas had just allowed the officials to put their hands up and admit to being falable.........while ultimately getting it correct !

Instead, as I see it, the arrogant ^^^^ demanded that no human frailty be admitted lest it undemined his pompous stance that refs are never wrong and in fact it's the Managers, players and fans that always are !

 

 

 

[redm]

Don't remember spotting a link yesterday but this article from the Herald is well worth a read...

 

http://www.heraldscotland.com:80/mobile/sport/more-scottish-football/storm-has-some-way-to-blow-yet-1.1065260

 

Salmond meeting Regan later today. SFA clubs to meet tomorrow. This week could be interesting...

[shaun.lawson]

Don't remember spotting a link yesterday but this article from the Herald is well worth a read...

 

http://www.heraldscotland.com:80/mobile/sport/more-scottish-football/storm-has-some-way-to-blow-yet-1.1065260

 

Salmond meeting Regan later today. SFA clubs to meet tomorrow. This week could be interesting...

 

That was a very intriguing read. If something big emerges from all this though, you just know it'll be entirely geared towards Celtic and Rangers, and not the rest of us. Already, my feeling from this whole affair is that Celtic will probably just get more refs scared of and favouring them in the future, but the rest of us don't seem to matter.

[rossthejambo]

That was a very intriguing read. If something big emerges from all this though, you just know it'll be entirely geared towards Celtic and Rangers, and not the rest of us. Already, my feeling from this whole affair is that Celtic will probably just get more refs scared of and favouring them in the future, but the rest of us don't seem to matter.

 

That's all they've been after for the past 2 seasons, sowing seeds, sending letters to ask them to explaing decisions and leaking them publicly. This new fiasco is another of these and is only so that they can scare refs from giving decisions against them.

 

It seems to completely pass them by that it was the RIGHT decision not to award a penalty in That Game and that Stokes should have been sent off in the first minute of the OF game. Genuinely sick to death of the institution that is Celtic FC

[Chad Sexington]

I wonder if McHobo has been to the quacks yet to get something to help him sleep.

 

Dead man walking.

[269miles]

They would have to be the best judge of characters in the world to only be able to employ dodgy sorts.

 

Also...

 

I'm glad they're now dragging this out and slinging mud at each other as the longer it goes on the less likely those involved will be able to stick around.

 

 

Re : Craven

 

I think he's anything but the good guy - he's as bad as the other 2 as he was quite willing to stand back and watch while Celtic were about to handed an unfair opportunity to win the game.

 

Good point.

 

What also seems to have been overlooked in the frenzy to hang McHobo is Craven says he didn't think it was a penalty but he didn't say anything at the time because he'd been in a similar situation before with McHobo and been over ruled.

 

The cynics amongst us could say , Craven is a Sellick fan so was NEVER going to say anything , even though he has publicly stated he disagreed with the penalty decision. In addition , McHobo DID go over to Craven , so Craven must have some idea that McHobo had some reason to come over to speak to him about the correctness of the decision. But even then , he keeps his mouth shut - because there is no way on this earth a Sellick supporting linesman is going to over rule a referees decision to award a penalty in favour of Sellick - his life wouldn't be worth living.

On the other hand, what;s the point in having match officials who never raise their concerns about such key points in agame. Either way , it's just as well Craven has resigned or he would have been in an impossible decision.

[Victorian]

it would be naive to believe that craven is some sort of rare figure of ultimate integrity and virtue within the rotting corpse of scottish football refereeing. his part in initially taking part in 'the little white lie' points to him being, at the very least, open to persuasion when it comes to deceit.

 

from our own experiences over the years and our personal suspicions of what really goes on amongst them when nobody else can hear, there has long been a widespread belief that there isn't a single top official who isn't tainted by the ingrained corruption in the game. certainly not everyone holds these beliefs but a significant number do.

 

can it really be that it's craven himself who is the main 'baddie' of the piece in all of this? i hardly think so. does anyone really believe that he would concoct a whole version of events by himself and go up against the 'might' of the SFA and the refereeing fraternity, just because he holds some sort of grudge against hugh dallas?

 

when there's overwhelming evidence of jiggery pokery going on behind the scenes such as this then the natural reaction for me is to ask "how many more instances haven't come to light?"... "how many times have these characters had their paws in the till and not been rumbled?".

 

managers have been severely restricted in recent years in what they can say about match officials and what they can insinuate. in years past i can remember times when managers have quite openly said that similar 'cover stories' to this one have been conveniently hatched by the officials of a match in the immediate aftermath of a game. for me it's fairly clear that this kind of thing has been going on on a regular basis for many years and that the SFA have done a pretty good job of keeping a lid on it, for the most part. god only knows by what means.

 

corrupt to it's very foundations.

[Ben Dover]

Well lets hope the GFA aren't allowed to close the book on this by calling it an unfortunate 'one-off'

It's nothing of the sort, with The Rev Mike McCurry shambles ( RANGERS 3 -1 DUNDEE UNITED ) being another incident

where the officials appeared to concoct decisons to furnish a desired outcome ( no loss to Rangers at Ibrox )

MM was quietly put out to grass with that case never being investigated IIRC

And lets not go anywhere Davisgate or this screen is gonna get launched oot the windae

[DETTY29]

That was a very intriguing read. If something big emerges from all this though, you just know it'll be entirely geared towards Celtic and Rangers, and not the rest of us. Already, my feeling from this whole affair is that Celtic will probably just get more refs scared of and favouring them in the future, but the rest of us don't seem to matter.

You could argue the opposite however that by Celtic calling for transparency, they might actually end up shooting themselves in the foot and end up getting even less priveleges than they are currently in receipt of.

 

I've said this before, I don't believe there is wholesale corruption in the game, but as with football through out the world larger teams get more of the breaks. In Scotland I believe there is a very strong favour for Rangers within the corridors of power (and the press), then Celtic, then the rest. Mere talk of refereeing Old Firm games differently, which then lends to games involving the Old Firm teams differently, quite simply isn't fair. On the face of it this isn't down right corruption because there is a view that powder keg games need to be refereed differently for public safety. This isn't down right corruption per se, but it sure as heckers isn't right. And while we continue to have no transparency, then the unfairness continues. It is up to the other teams of course not to get into bed with either of the Old Firm (although backing Celtic on this is no bad thing) and make sure that our grievances are heard, and publicly to in a dignified and well thought out manner. Going back to my earlier point re Old Firmn games, it was Willie Young, one of Scotland most experienced whistlers who said this. How can this be in favour of Rangers or Celtic if he is asked to explain his statement to a Holyrood committee - which the rest of the clubs should be piushing for just now.

 

It's unbelievable to think that we have got to where we are with this, when the only real error was that MacDonald was just too sharp in blowing his whistle, and actually had the b@lls to think about changing his mind because he thought he had made a mistake.

 

But instead we've had a week's worth of cover ups, an assistant ref hung out to dry - (and I also stand by that I personally don't think he did too much wrong at the game. He has to feel 100% in his mind that the ref made a mistake to consider an over-rule, especially under the circumstances of that game where MacDonald was perfectly positioned - remember playing the ball in the tackle doesn't necessarily mean no foul)

 

For the good of the game this cannot be left to lie, when actually, it might in Celtic's best interests to do so.

[hawaii]

There are 9 SFA regions so why not have a re-org where each region has 1 Grade 1 referee??

 

I mean surely the SFA could still wangle it so that most of them are OF fans and keep the status quo, but is it not about time that some journalist worth the name investigate how this has been allowed to come to pass?

 

As for the information that Dougie McDonald went along to the Referee Committee made up of 6 of his pals and some guy from the Highland League I still can't work out why the press haven't made more of that.

 

 

 

[world_3]

You could argue the opposite however that by Celtic calling for transparency, they might actually end up shooting themselves in the foot and end up getting even less priveleges than they are currently in receipt of.

 

Let's hope so, the nauseating hypocrisy and paranoia of their scumbag supporters is really grating on the thruppenies.

 

I've said this before, I don't believe there is wholesale corruption in the game, but as with football through out the world larger teams get more of the breaks. In Scotland I believe there is a very strong favour for Rangers within the corridors of power (and the press), then Celtic, then the rest. Mere talk of refereeing Old Firm games differently, which then lends to games involving the Old Firm teams differently, quite simply isn't fair. On the face of it this isn't down right corruption because there is a view that powder keg games need to be refereed differently for public safety. This isn't down right corruption per se, but it sure as heckers isn't right. And while we continue to have no transparency, then the unfairness continues. It is up to the other teams of course not to get into bed with either of the Old Firm (although backing Celtic on this is no bad thing) and make sure that our grievances are heard, and publicly to in a dignified and well thought out manner. Going back to my earlier point re Old Firmn games, it was Willie Young, one of Scotland most experienced whistlers who said this. How can this be in favour of Rangers or Celtic if he is asked to explain his statement to a Holyrood committee - which the rest of the clubs should be piushing for just now.

 

This alone is corruption pure and simple. If the OF game was refereed according to the rules of the game, then in the following few weeks key OF players who have been red or yellow-carded would have to serve their suspensions. That this doesn't happen under normal circumstances in Scotland disadvantages the non-OF teams unfairly.

[bean counter]

I'm sure that somewhere on this thread a poster pointed out that Jim Traynor had said Celtic had written to the SFA 30 times last year re decisions, ( that's almost every game ).

 

Do we know how many times each of the other Clubs wrote and complained it would be interesting to see who else felt aggrieved by our refs decisions

[Boomstick]

anybody involved in this is corrupt to the core

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ztXYNmFen6s

 

She's due home any minute and I'm now in a foul mood.

 

Cheers.