Racism rears its ugly head....again

[JWL]

Terracing is not racist in itself.

 

The whole world has changed, what was shouted and sung at the football twenty to thirty years ago, would probably get you jailed in this day and age. Most Hearts fans have changed in pace with the world, some have not, but the language used at the football is infinitely better than it was.

 

If you want an example of how things have changed, watch an episode of the 70's BBC sitcom "Love Thy Neighbour". That was good clean wholesome family viewing back then, but is cringingly embarrassing now.

 

 

Your kidding, they should bring that back on UK Gold. It's a comedy classic. Eddie Booth.............top man.

[richierich]

Is Sone Aluko a rapper? Or an African American??

 

I thought it was a mobile phone but that's a Sony Ericsson

[Guest C00l K1d]

I thought it was a mobile phone but that's a Sony Ericsson

[maroonshrew]

its outrageous that someone can come on here and make unproven allegations about someone so easily recognisable

if any of you lot went to the games you would no exactly who he is !

If you want to convince yourself ive made this up then thats fine but why And for the record I have a season ticket. However it is not in the wheatfield stand where he reportedly sits. I got to about 7 or 8 away games a year and have never seen him. So im not sure if im a good enough fan in your eyes.

 

I understand you need to accumulate a certain number of games before you find 'ni**er' offensive. I couldve made up a story that my gf, mother, or whoever is blakc and im sure people would have been more understanding of my disgust but i dont feel i need to. Its offensive.

[the general]

If you want to convince yourself ive made this up then thats fine but why And for the record I have a season ticket. However it is not in the wheatfield stand where he reportedly sits. I got to about 7 or 8 away games a year and have never seen him. So im not sure if im a good enough fan in your eyes.

 

I understand you need to accumulate a certain number of games before you find 'ni**er' offensive. I couldve made up a story that my gf, mother, or whoever is blakc and im sure people would have been more understanding of my disgust but i dont feel i need to. Its offensive.

 

you misunderstand my point,I am saying that its outrageous to identify this person on an internet forum - who knows if this did happen and if you were even at the game!

[Eckauskas]

I agree with the General.

 

Unless you have concrete proof that he did actually say it, describing his appearance on an internet forum is completely out of line.

[Budgie.]

you misunderstand my point,I am saying that its outrageous to identify this person on an internet forum - who knows if this did happen and if you were even at the game!

 

Why is it outrageous?

 

It's been verified by other posters who also witnessed it.

 

The only outrageous thing is the behaviour of the individual involved and that of those defending it.

[maroonshrew]

Well maybe i shouldnt have. Although i didnt name him as I didnt know his name. But other people, who know him, have conceded this isnt out of character and someone else has said they heard him. So either two of us are lying or hes a racist.

[Budgie.]

I agree with the General.

 

Unless you have concrete proof that he did actually say it, describing his appearance on an internet forum is completely out of line.

 

If he's the type of person who shouts these things then he deserves all he gets.

[Eckauskas]

Well maybe i shouldnt have. Although i didnt name him as I didnt know his name. But other people, who know him, have conceded this isnt out of character and someone else has said they heard him. So either two of us are lying or hes a racist.

 

No, you shouldn't have.

 

If he's the type of person who shouts these things then he deserves all he gets.

 

Vigilante justice, eh?

 

Can't beat it.

[Budgie.]

Well maybe i shouldnt have. Although i didnt name him as I didnt know his name. But other people, who know him, have conceded this isnt out of character and someone else has said they heard him. So either two of us are lying or hes a racist.

 

You haven't done anything wrong mate.

 

All you've done is start the ball moving in getting rid of a racist gobshite from our support.

[maroonshrew]

No, you shouldn't have.

 

 

 

Vigilante justice, eh?

 

Can't beat it.

 

I said maybe to be polite as this is a discussion board with different opinions on how to go about things. It was not an invitation for you to say what is absolutely right and wrong. So as for what i definitely shouldnt have done, ill leave that to my conscience thanks, not you. I know what I heard and my conscience is clear.

[Eckauskas]

I said maybe to be polite as this is a discussion board with different opinions on how to go about things. It was not an invitation for you to say what is absolutely right and wrong. So as for what i definitely shouldnt have done, ill leave that to my conscience thanks, not you. I know what I heard and my conscience is clear.

 

Translation; I can say and do what I want, because it's my opinion. You're not allowed one, however as it disagrees and criticises mine.

[Nikoliunas]

I said maybe to be polite as this is a discussion board with different opinions on how to go about things. It was not an invitation for you to say what is absolutely right and wrong. So as for what i definitely shouldnt have done, ill leave that to my conscience thanks, not you. I know what I heard and my conscience is clear.

dont go near the upcoming derby at ER. Your head might explode with all the bad words flying about!!!

[Acey]

Translation; I can say and do what I want, because it's my opinion. You're not allowed one, however as it disagrees and criticises mine.

 

I'll never understand this "I'm not allowed an opinion bloo bloo bloo" shite. He's not deleting your posts, is he? If not, your terrible opinion is being aired LIVE, across the ENTIRE INTERNET!

 

Hope the guy gets banned. If I ever see him in the Gorgie Stand I'll say it to his face.

[Budgie.]

Translation; I can say and do what I want, because it's my opinion. You're not allowed one, however as it disagrees and criticises mine.

 

All you're succeeding in doing here Eck is making yourself look like a complete bellend. Reading between the lines here I'm beginning to think either you are pals with the perp or you share their views.

[maroonshrew]

Translation; I can say and do what I want, because it's my opinion. You're not allowed one, however as it disagrees and criticises mine.

No thats the opposite of what im saying. In this thread I have not once told people they are wrong. Its you that said 'no you shouldnt' when i sai dmaybe i shouldnt have posted like that. It is you saying im totally wrong. I was leaving it open to debate. You are entitled to your opinion, what I dont appreciate is you judging definitively if i am in the right or wrong. Re-read the thread and see how tolerantly i have talked to people who werent in agreeance.

[maroonshrew]

dont go near the upcoming derby at ER. Your head might explode with all the bad words flying about!!!

Ive got no problem with 'bad words'. I have a problem with prehistoric words that are so disgustingly racist. In fact no, I have a problem with racists.How immature of me. I will go to Easter Road and Ill say it again if I hear that kind of racism. But of course its me in the wrong.

[Eckauskas]

I'll never understand this "I'm not allowed an opinion bloo bloo bloo" shite. He's not deleting your posts, is he? If not, your terrible opinion is being aired LIVE, across the ENTIRE INTERNET!

 

Hope the guy gets banned. If I ever see him in the Gorgie Stand I'll say it to his face.

 

Thanks for the update Acey, I'm glad you're here to show me how this internet thing works

 

All you're succeeding in doing here Eck is making yourself look like a complete bellend. Reading between the lines here I'm beginning to think either you are pals with the perp or you share their views.

 

I know the person in question, yes. If he said it, then he's perfectly open to criticism.

 

However, if the OP wants action to be taken about this matter, naming a defenceless older man with a walking stick on an internet forum full of roasters is a very poor choice.

 

No thats the opposite of what im saying. In this thread I have not once told people they are wrong. Its you that said 'no you shouldnt' when i sai dmaybe i shouldnt have posted like that. It is you saying im totally wrong. I was leaving it open to debate. You are entitled to your opinion, what I dont appreciate is you judging definitively if i am in the right or wrong. Re-read the thread and see how tolerantly i have talked to people who werent in agreeance.

 

I'm not saying your opinion on the matter is wrong, I'm saying that naming and shaming the guy on an internet forum is a poor show.

[Acey]

Thanks for the update Acey, I'm glad you're here to show me how this internet thing works

 

No worries - you seem to have trouble grasping the concept, so anything I can do to help, really.

[maroonshrew]

Thanks for the update Acey, I'm glad you're here to show me how this internet thing works

 

 

 

I know the person in question, yes. If he said it, then he's perfectly open to criticism.

 

However, if the OP wants action to be taken about this matter, naming a defenceless older man with a walking stick on an internet forum full of roasters is a very poor choice.

 

 

 

I'm not saying your opinion on the matter is wrong, I'm saying that naming and shaming the guy on an internet forum is a poor show.

Well thats now quite how you worded it Eck, it was a condescending 'no you shouldnt'. but fair enough, I see your point. However, I didnt name him. I did describe him yes and others named. Although admittedly it was an obvious description. However, I would say any man willing ot shout these things at a game is far from defenceless. Your description of a 'defenceless older man' makes me sound like a bully of a pensioner when we both know that isnt quite true. Particularly as you know him. My problem is, what should I have done? Kept quiet and reported it to the club if i felt strongly. Then everyone on here calls you a grass and pathetic. Apparently there is no right thing to do except keep your opinoon to yourself and tolerate racism and that isnt something im willing to do.

[the general]

I'm surprised the mods have not pulled this as surely this could be slander / libelous?

[Acey]

I'm surprised the mods have not pulled this as surely this could be slander / libelous?

 

It's really not.

 

p.s. No such thing as slander/libel in Scotland.

[IMA MAROON]

On this occasion I heard a guy say

 

"catch that little ni**er'

 

and

 

'dont let a ni**er do that to you' as Aluko skinned one of us.

 

 

i seen the guy you were talking about, i was sitting in front of him. i didnt hear him say any of this but im not calling you a liar, i think it is shoking what he said

 

However, I would say any man willing ot shout these things at a game is far from defenceless.

 

Did he shout?

[maroonshrew]

I'm surprised the mods have not pulled this as surely this could be slander / libelous?

 

Yea i think it will go sharpish. i didnt set this out as a witch hunt, just to see what people thought. Has been interesting and in my opinion disappointing seeing some of the results. But the face people think it could be a libellous allegation at least means they admit there is somethign wrong with what was said.

[MacDonald Jardine]

It's really not.

 

p.s. No such thing as slander/libel in Scotland.

 

But there is defamation in Scotland.

 

If the allegation was untrue it would be defamatory.

[Drewjambobusby]

I'll never understand this "I'm not allowed an opinion bloo bloo bloo" shite. He's not deleting your posts, is he? If not, your terrible opinion is being aired LIVE, across the ENTIRE INTERNET!

 

Hope the guy gets banned. If I ever see him in the Gorgie Stand I'll say it to his face.

 

Was it the Walking stick part that prompted this keyboard bravado ???? I wouldn`t i were you mate.

 

I have been called a 90 minute racist(see previous post) Okay i will clarify. My point is , when you are all off your soap boxes that things are siad in the heat of the moment. It is when a team get`s you so worked up that you want them to win so badly that you say something that you may ? Late regret ? Don`t say all you liberal PC`s haven`t been in this situation ? Might not have even been at a football match but you have been in this situation.

 

To name the guy on a public internet forum (and i know him) is scandalous.

 

And to sum up for 90 minutes i become an uncontrollable person who HATES EVERYONE FOR 90 MINUTES, WHO ISN`T WEARING MAROON !! Regardless of Race, Creed, Colour, sexuality etc. If everyone including the lily whites were the same then maybe Tynecastle might become more of the feared place it once was and the atmosphere would be better than it is.

 

I have made shouts at a football match which i would never normally make and are not necessarily my beliefs outside the hallowed ground.

 

So in otherwards git a life !!

[maroonshrew]

Did he shout?

 

I dont know what amount of decibels makes it a shout. If youre trying to work out if im lying then fine. But he said it loud enough for me to hear it. As loud as a guy would comment at a linesman or a ref or a player. I dont really know what youre getting at. why would i make it up?

[duckandcover]

Yea i think it will go sharpish. i didnt set this out as a witch hunt, just to see what people thought. Has been interesting and in my opinion disappointing seeing some of the results. But the face people think it could be a libellous allegation at least means they admit there is somethign wrong with what was said.

If i'm being honest mate, I think it's pretty disguisting the way you've came on here and decided to potentially land someone in the shit. You may say that you haven't name and shamed the guy but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know who you are talking about. As for the people that are wanting to be PM'd more information about the guy so you can report him to the club, getting a life you ******* sad acts.

[maroonshrew]

If i'm being honest mate, I think it's pretty disguisting the way you've came on here and decided to potentially land someone in the shit. You may say that you haven't name and shamed the guy but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know who you are talking about. As for the people that are wanting to be PM'd more information about the guy so you can report him to the club, getting a life you ******* sad acts.

more disgusting than saying the comments in the first place?

[I.J]

Smashing stuff here, which does nothing to dispel my theory that 90% of Hearts fans are utter ****s.

 

Here's another theory - ALL racists, and those who defend them should be euthanised. Don't like that? Cool - I don't give a ****.

 

Splendid.

[I.J]

If i'm being honest mate, I think it's pretty disguisting the way you've came on here and decided to potentially land someone in the shit. You may say that you haven't name and shamed the guy but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know who you are talking about. As for the people that are wanting to be PM'd more information about the guy so you can report him to the club, getting a life you ******* sad acts.

 

I hope the vermin gets banned for life. He's trash.

[Budgie.]

Was it the Walking stick part that prompted this keyboard bravado ???? I wouldn`t i were you mate.

 

I have been called a 90 minute racist(see previous post) Okay i will clarify. My point is , when you are all off your soap boxes that things are siad in the heat of the moment. It is when a team get`s you so worked up that you want them to win so badly that you say something that you may ? Late regret ? Don`t say all you liberal PC`s haven`t been in this situation ? Might not have even been at a football match but you have been in this situation.

 

To name the guy on a public internet forum (and i know him) is scandalous.

 

And to sum up for 90 minutes i become an uncontrollable person who HATES EVERYONE FOR 90 MINUTES, WHO ISN`T WEARING MAROON !! Regardless of Race, Creed, Colour, sexuality etc. If everyone including the lily whites were the same then maybe Tynecastle might become more of the feared place it once was and the atmosphere would be better than it is.

 

I have made shouts at a football match which i would never normally make and are not necessarily my beliefs outside the hallowed ground.

 

So in otherwards git a life !!

 

[Ray Winstone]

I'm surprised the mods have not pulled this as surely this could be slander / libelous?

 

 

If it was, which it is not, it would come under deformation in this country.

[Budgie.]

If i'm being honest mate, I think it's pretty disguisting the way you've came on here and decided to potentially land someone in the shit. You may say that you haven't name and shamed the guy but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know who you are talking about. As for the people that are wanting to be PM'd more information about the guy so you can report him to the club, getting a life you ******* sad acts.

 

Rio and Thierry disagree...

 

[IMA MAROON]

I dont know what amount of decibels makes it a shout. If youre trying to work out if im lying then fine. But he said it loud enough for me to hear it. As loud as a guy would comment at a linesman or a ref or a player. I dont really know what youre getting at. why would i make it up?

 

You have changed your story.

[Drewjambobusby]

 

Are you sure Maroon is the colour ???

[Drewjambobusby]

If i'm being honest mate, I think it's pretty disguisting the way you've came on here and decided to potentially land someone in the shit. You may say that you haven't name and shamed the guy but it doesn't take a rocket scientist to know who you are talking about. As for the people that are wanting to be PM'd more information about the guy so you can report him to the club, getting a life you ******* sad acts.

 

Just backs up the comments i made earlier about how sad some of our support has become. PM`d to find out identity FFS

 

Go watch Scotland at Rugger you idiots

[Budgie.]

Just backs up the comments i made earlier about how sad some of our support has become. PM`d to find out identity FFS

 

Go watch Scotland at Rugger you idiots

 

[maroonshrew]

You have changed your story.

no I havent. I stand by my story. Im not being cross examined here mate, ive done nothing wrong. I wasnt sitting next to him and I heard it. others heard it too. It was said loudly. good enough for you? Ive been called disgusting, pathetic, cowardly and told to get a life. All beacuse I chose to alert fans to people finding it ok to show that level of racism. I have a clear conscience. Only in Scotland could I be the defendant in this discussion.

[duckandcover]

more disgusting than saying the comments in the first place?

Thats a matter of opinion mate. I just find it a bit hard to believe that you would travel all the way up to Aberde en have a great day, great result and instead of chilling out and enjoying the win, you would rather come on here and snitch someone for saying a naughty word, when at the time the stewards took no action against the guy.

[Drewjambobusby]

 

I AM STANDING UP.

 

I am standing up for the rights for people to shout at football matches ?????? If occassionally something comes out which is something which you or i don`t agree with I AM STANDING UP FOR THE RIGHT TO GET OVER IT !!!!!!

 

FFS It`s going to be a boring place if we listen to all the Liberal PC`s and get on with our Prawn sandwiches at half time.

 

A witch Hunt for a comment at a football match is not right and frankly makes me puke.

[Acey]

Was it the Walking stick part that prompted this keyboard bravado ???? I wouldn`t i were you mate.

 

Ok.

 

I have been called a 90 minute racist(see previous post) Okay i will clarify. My point is , when you are all off your soap boxes that things are siad in the heat of the moment. It is when a team get`s you so worked up that you want them to win so badly that you say something that you may ? Late regret ? Don`t say all you liberal PC`s haven`t been in this situation ? Might not have even been at a football match but you have been in this situation.

 

What, called a guy a n*gger in anger? No.

 

To name the guy on a public internet forum (and i know him) is scandalous.

 

Has he been named? In any case, it sounds like plenty of people saw/heard him, so defamation doesn't come into the equation, since it's been proven that he's a racist.

 

And to sum up for 90 minutes i become an uncontrollable person who HATES EVERYONE FOR 90 MINUTES, WHO ISN`T WEARING MAROON !! Regardless of Race, Creed, Colour, sexuality etc. If everyone including the lily whites were the same then maybe Tynecastle might become more of the feared place it once was and the atmosphere would be better than it is.

 

I have made shouts at a football match which i would never normally make and are not necessarily my beliefs outside the hallowed ground.

 

Then get some self-control, you simpleton. If not, you deserve everything you get.

 

So in otherwards git a life !!

 

I'm not the racist windowlicker, champ.

[Sharpie]

This

 

 

Absolutely correct, the terracing brought out some pretty bad stuff. However as pretty well all the players were white generally Scottish born neither race or colour were generally involved. They generally focussed on religion and the non marital status of the individuals parents. Words such as ******* and git were taken quite seriously, gay also still meant happy and had no relation to a persons sexual orientation. In a way the packed terracing was a bit like the internet, if you were surrounded by a group in agreement with you you would be quite anonymous in stating your case.

 

I am against racism and probably rightly classed as PC, but shouted insults at football games is institutional, rightly or wrongly it is a venue where expressions of displeasure with opponents or even own players are hurled. These it seems follow a generational pattern and involve expletives which are perceived as the most hurtful at the particular time, i.e racist, draft dodger, gay or illegitimate. All wrong and should be acted on, but like acne in teens or arthritis in aged it happens. Quite frankly in the arena environment I can neither get too upset or too surprised.

[Budgie.]

Thats a matter of opinion mate. I just find it a bit hard to believe that you would travel all the way up to Aberde en have a great day, great result and instead of chilling out and enjoying the win, you would rather come on here and snitch someone for saying a naughty word, when at the time the stewards took no action against the guy.

 

Wow. Just wow.

[Drewjambobusby]

Ok.

 

 

 

What, called a guy a n*gger in anger? No.

 

Not necessarily that i meant lost your obviously ever so cool head.

 

 

 

Has he been named? In any case, it sounds like plenty of people saw/heard him, so defamation doesn't come into the equation, since it's been proven that he's a racist.

 

Obviously not read the early posts then ???

 

 

 

Then get some self-control, you simpleton. If not, you deserve everything you get.

 

Would like to see that anytime ?? It`s called passion. The self-control you state is whats killed atmos[phere in grounds. I.e BY FOLK OBVIOUSLY LIKE YOU.

 

 

 

I'm not the racist windowlicker, champ.

 

So calling people a windowlicker is better than a racist ????

 

And calling people you don`t know a simpleteon also suggests you have a problem again !! From behind a keyboard of course

[Budgie.]

I AM STANDING UP.

 

I am standing up for the rights for people to shout at football matches ?????? If occassionally something comes out which is something which you or i don`t agree with I AM STANDING UP FOR THE RIGHT TO GET OVER IT !!!!!!

 

FFS It`s going to be a boring place if we listen to all the Liberal PC`s and get on with our Prawn sandwiches at half time.

 

A witch Hunt for a comment at a football match is not right and frankly makes me puke.

 

It is one thing standing up at a match and calling someone a Hibee b'stard etc, but when you begin using the N word you have well and truly crossed the line.

 

You are defending the indefensible here.

[Drewjambobusby]

Absolutely correct, the terracing brought out some pretty bad stuff. However as pretty well all the players were white generally Scottish born neither race or colour were generally involved. They generally focussed on religion and the non marital status of the individuals parents. Words such as ******* and git were taken quite seriously, gay also still meant happy and had no relation to a persons sexual orientation. In a way the packed terracing was a bit like the internet, if you were surrounded by a group in agreement with you you would be quite anonymous in stating your case.

 

I am against racism and probably rightly classed as PC, but shouted insults at football games is institutional, rightly or wrongly it is a venue where expressions of displeasure with opponents or even own players are hurled. These it seems follow a generational pattern and involve expletives which are perceived as the most hurtful at the particular time, i.e racist, draft dodger, gay or illegitimate. All wrong and should be acted on, but like acne in teens or arthritis in aged it happens. Quite frankly in the arena environment I can neither get too upset or too surprised.

 

Point i have been trying to make. Only, you make it much better

[maroonshrew]

Thats a matter of opinion mate. I just find it a bit hard to believe that you would travel all the way up to Aberde en have a great day, great result and instead of chilling out and enjoying the win, you would rather come on here and snitch someone for saying a naughty word, when at the time the stewards took no action against the guy.

 

But do you think its ok that nothing got done mate? Thats what worries me, that this is acceptable behaviour to most. Also, it is this 'snitch' or 'grass' mentality that stops people ever speaking out. You seem a reasonable guy so I know I can get a decent answer from you without it turning to 'get a life'. Are you happy that the stewards did the right thing in saying nothing?

 

And Drew, i have nothing against shouting at games, standing at games, swearing at games. ive done all three. but surely not liking repeated racism at a game does not make me PC crazy or Prawn Sandwich.

[Drewjambobusby]

It is one thing standing up at a match and calling someone a Hibee b'stard etc, but when you begin using the N word you have well and truly crossed the line.

 

You are defending the undefensible here.

 

I am merely stating that it was made in the heat of the moment. The times where comments you make, and later regret, are generally made in the heat of the moment.