We've Been Skacelated [Merged Shenanigans]

[Special Agent Dale Cooper]

Rudi Can't Fail

 

The Clash don't lie!...FACT

[Bert Le Clos]

I would take him as a winger. But not as a make-shift left-back or a central midfielder.

 

I saw him play left-back for Southampton, he was pish. And it wasn't just one game, he was truly pish several times. As far as I'm aware he's never played as a central midfielder, so signing him in the hope he would be an answer to our attacking midfield problem would be stupid.

 

But if he was available for decent money, he's a gamble I would take to play left wing, given Driver's injury problems. But I reckon there's about a 3% chance of us signing him.

[Special Agent Dale Cooper]

I would take him as a winger. But not as a make-shift left-back or a central midfielder.

 

I saw him play left-back for Southampton, he was pish. And it wasn't just one game, he was truly pish several times. As far as I'm aware he's never played as a central midfielder, so signing him in the hope he would be an answer to our attacking midfield problem would be stupid.

 

But if he was available for decent money, he's a gamble I would take to play left wing, given Driver's injury problems. But I reckon there's about a 3% chance of us signing him.

 

about 3%..that's quite a claim. I'd go nearer the 0.01% myself. but hey it's a very slow day on JKB

[bistokid]

get him signed.

 

he'll play more games than driver.

[Rudolf's Mate]

On the back of Hartley going to aberdeen. If Skacel went to motherwell i would be "shaking with rage" as some people like to say on here.

 

Couldn't have put it better myself. Surely if a free then getting him in to have a look over re fitness wouldn't be a bad idea. The guy terrorised defenders and was sheer class.

[Only a Game]

Your obsession with putting driver down at every opportunity Is boring. Anyone would think you have something personal against the guy.

 

 

I think he's right. Skacel never had an injury problem the whole time he was with us. (except the time he got Vlad flu) If he signed he would UNDOUBTEDLY IMO play more games this season than Driver.

 

Driver is an injury magnet. Full stop

[Wyness_is_a_leg_end]

Rudi was just on Radio Scotland speaking to Chick Dung. Now a free agent...would you take him back?

RESEARCH RESEARCH RESEARCH, go do some and you'll see that he is playing in Greece.....

[buba]

RESEARCH RESEARCH RESEARCH, go do some and you'll see that he is playing in Greece.....

 

I notice that he's contracted to larrisa till June 2011. I thought he'd maybe been released, by the look of it he only played 7 games last season.

 

Also notice that ibrahim tall signed a 2yr deal with them last week, I thought he wasn't interested in money and just wanted to play in France!!!!

[johnjl]

I think he's right. Skacel never had an injury problem the whole time he was with us. (except the time he got Vlad flu) If he signed he would UNDOUBTEDLY IMO play more games this season than Driver.

 

Driver is an injury magnet. Full stop

It's all been argued before but driver has had one injury ravaged season and that doesn't make him an injury magnet.

Who knows if rudi may end up having a season like that sometime.

 

Anyway as another poster said rudi played seven times last season do you have any idea why?

[Wyness_is_a_leg_end]

I notice that he's contracted to larrisa till June 2011. I thought he'd maybe been released, by the look of it he only played 7 games last season.

 

Also notice that ibrahim tall signed a 2yr deal with them last week, I thought he wasn't interested in money and just wanted to play in France!!!!

Didn't Rudi sign in January after being released by Slavia? I heard hes been struggling for fitness recently and has devoped a belly like Nad?!!

[gowestjambo]

It's all been argued before but driver has had one injury ravaged season and that doesn't make him an injury magnet.

Who knows if rudi may end up having a season like that sometime.

 

Anyway as another poster said rudi played seven times last season do you have any idea why?

 

 

Now I dont know for sure, but it appears to me Driver has been injured most of his time here!

 

I was also told Driver has been plagued with injury since his teens. What is happening with him is not a new phenomenon..........

[Stanley_]

Now I dont know for sure, but it appears to me Driver has been injured most of his time here!

 

I was also told Driver has been plagued with injury since his teens. What is happening with him is not a new phenomenon..........

 

He broke into the team in 06/07 and played 22 games. Then 29 in 07/08 and 31 in 08/09. Last season he had injuries and only played 15 times. That hardly qualifies as him being "injured most of his time here".

[davemclaren]

So we've been arguing about signing a player on a free...and he's already signed for someone else.

[johnjl]

He broke into the team in 06/07 and played 22 games. Then 29 in 07/08 and 31 in 08/09. Last season he has injuries and only played 15 times. That hardly qualifies as him being "injured most of his time here".

Still more than rudi can anyone give his appearances for the last few seasons please?

 

This NEED by some to have a go at driver and the willingness to write him off is something I don't really understand tbh

[gowestjambo]

He broke into the team in 06/07 and played 22 games. Then 29 in 07/08 and 31 in 08/09. Last season he had injuries and only played 15 times. That hardly qualifies as him being "injured most of his time here".

 

 

If you read what I said"I dont know for sure" - but it appeared to me Andy Driver has been injured or carrying an injury for a very long time, your stats are accurate but the perception is he is very injury prone!

[Stanley_]

Still more than rudi can anyone give his appearances for the last few seasons please?

 

This NEED by some to have a go at driver and the willingness to write him off is something I don't really understand tbh

 

05/06-Hearts-40

06/07-Southampton-41

07/08-Southampton-18 (+16 at Hertha Berlin according to Wiki)

08/09-Southampton-29

 

Harder to tell since then but according to Wiki he played 5 times for Slavia Prague and 7 for Larissa.

[johnjl]

05/06-Hearts-40

06/07-Southampton-41

07/08-Southampton-18 (+16 at Hertha Berlin according to Wiki)

08/09-Southampton-29

 

Harder to tell since then but according to Wiki he played 5 times for Slavia Prague and 7 for Larissa.

So in the last two seasons he has played less than driver. Amazing how some posters said he would be certain to play more than him if he signed. I'm not saying this wouldn't happen but now seems less certain.

[johnjl]

If you read what I said"I dont know for sure" - but it appeared to me Andy Driver has been injured or carrying an injury for a very long time, your stats are accurate but the perception is he is very injury prone!

That perception would appear to be exaggerated, maybe because he came back from and then was injured again several times.

[bighusref]

It's all been argued before but driver has had one injury ravaged season and that doesn't make him an injury magnet.

Who knows if rudi may end up having a season like that sometime.

 

Anyway as another poster said rudi played seven times last season do you have any idea why?

 

..and successfully clarified before, with stats that were worse than other young players who were considered "injury prone" (I used Giggs and Owen as examples) in their youth.

 

However, the next part of that argument is "auch he's young though" and "he wasn't injured, he just wasn't selected". Still never mind, he will be fit soon and will most likely be injury free from there on in, won't he?

[Stanley_]

So in the last two seasons he has played less than driver. Amazing how some posters said he would be certain to play more than him if he signed. I'm not saying this wouldn't happen but now seems less certain.

 

He's got good stats for the first 4 seasons that I listed (especially considering he doesn't seem to have done very well at Southampton). Also he was only at Slavia from October-January and I wouldn't trust the accuracy of stats for foreign leagues on wikipedia.

[johnjl]

..and successfully clarified before, with stats that were worse than other young players who were considered "injury prone" (I used Giggs and Owen as examples) in their youth.

 

However, the next part of that argument is "auch he's young though" and "he wasn't injured, he just wasn't selected". Still never mind, he will be fit soon and will most likely be injury free from there on in, won't he?

In the two seasons prior to lat he played 29 and 31 times is that not quite a lot or even most games

[Felix Lighter]

RESEARCH RESEARCH RESEARCH, go do some and you'll see that he is playing in Greece.....

 

The OP is right.I also caught the interview yesterday.CY asked him how he was getting on in Greece and he replied he'd been released and was a free agent.

CY then asked if there was any chance we might see Rudi back playing at Tynecastle and he replied anythings possible and he'd happily come back to Scotland.It was at this point pa broon chipped in and jokingly mentioned swapping phone numbers with Rudi.

 

If he's fit and is affordable then it's a no brainer for me.

[Stanley_]

In the two seasons prior to lat he played 29 and 31 times is that not quite a lot or even most games

 

If you look at who played the most times in those seasons then it is:

 

08-09-Karipdis-38 (Driver joint 6th with 31)

07-08-Berra-41 (Driver joint 9th with 29)

 

Doesn't look too bad to me.

[bighusref]

In the two seasons prior to lat he played 29 and 31 times is that not quite a lot or even most games

 

..but you are doing exactly the same as those you criticise. You criticise others for looking at a section of his career and not looking at the whole, then go and pick a section of his career and not look at the whole.

 

Anyway, this is a cyclical argument as stats don't matter when people don't want to read them. Let's just hope that his injury prone time is nearing it's end and he plays more games this coming season. I fear we have not seen the last of his injuries.

[johnjl]

..but you are doing exactly the same as those you criticise. You criticise others for looking at a section of his career and not looking at the whole, then go and pick a section of his career and not look at the whole.

 

Anyway, this is a cyclical argument as stats don't matter when people don't want to read them. Let's just hope that his injury prone time is nearing it's end and he plays more games this coming season. I fear we have not seen the last of his injuries.

Yes I am but I never said he wasn't injury prone in the first place. It is only natural to respond to a negative with a positive for the purpose of debate. My point originally, was with another poster who seems to take every opportunity to have a go at driver.

 

If you have stats that show he is injury prone other than last season I am more than happy to read them. What I won't accept is that rudi is a better option without hearing a bit more about what he has been doing and how he has played for the last few seasons.

[bighusref]

Yes I am but I never said he wasn't injury prone in the first place. It is only natural to respond to a negative with a positive for the purpose of debate. My point originally, was with another poster who seems to take every opportunity to have a go at driver.

 

Again, it's not the positive that is the issue. If you disagree with a negative, it is indeed natural to respond with a positive. My point is that you are using the same restrictive criteria that those on the opposing side of the argument are.

 

If you have stats that show he is injury prone other than last season I am more than happy to read them. What I won't accept is that rudi is a better option without hearing a bit more about what he has been doing and how he has played for the last few seasons.

 

Not that it matters, as I mentioned in my last post that stats are ignored. However, when I mentioned these stats, I ignored his bad year and looked at his first three seasons, doing the same with Giggs and Owen. You may or may not have seen them but you did post on the very same thread.

 

http://www.hmfckickback.co.uk/index.php?/topic/74342-possible-new-driver-bid-merged-threads/page__st__40

 

Oh, and for the record, I don't know that Skacel is a "better option" than Driver, what I do believe is that signing Skacel would be a positive move and I do not think it is outwith the realms of possibility that Skacel and Driver could play in the same team. This isn't a Kello or Balogh situation IMO.

[Only a Game]

So in the last two seasons he has played less than driver. Amazing how some posters said he would be certain to play more than him if he signed. I'm not saying this wouldn't happen but now seems less certain.

 

 

Maybe Rudi hasnt played as much partly because he isnt up to the somewhat higher level (higher than the SPL) that he's been playing at since he left us. Driver has been injured many times in the last 3 years and has missed games specifically because of it, although I think one of the injuries was the Vlad flu that was going around back in the day. He also seems to take an age and a half to recover from even the most minor niggle.

 

Rudi at his best is/was way out of Driver's league IMO. Rudi fit and performing at a even a half of his best would be better and would contribute more than Driver half fit and a yard or two short of pace, as he has been for most of the last two years

[johnjl]

Again, it's not the positive that is the issue. If you disagree with a negative, it is indeed natural to respond with a positive. My point is that you are using the same restrictive criteria that those on the opposing side of the argument are.

 

 

 

Not that it matters, as I mentioned in my last post that stats are ignored. However, when I mentioned these stats, I ignored his bad year and looked at his first three seasons, doing the same with Giggs and Owen. You may or may not have seen them but you did post on the very same thread.

 

http://www.hmfckickback.co.uk/index.php?/topic/74342-possible-new-driver-bid-merged-threads/page__st__40

 

Oh, and for the record, I don't know that Skacel is a "better option" than Driver, what I do believe is that signing Skacel would be a positive move and I do not think it is outwith the realms of possibility that Skacel and Driver could play in the same team. This isn't a Kello or Balogh situation IMO.

 

To be honest I took the season before last and the season before that to prove my point. I still think those stats are relevant and worth throwing in. However there can be no argument that recently he has indeed been injury prone.

 

Thanks for reminding me about the man u players stats was quite surprised at how many games they played in.

 

As I mentioned it is not so much the fact that driver is or isn't injury prone it is the willingness, no in fact eagerness of some supporters to write the guy off that I just don't understand. One fan also stated that rudi would play more than driver but when you look at rudis stats this is by no means certain.

 

I have no idea how good rudi would be for us now and as I have said I would rather go for players in positions we need filled.

[johnjl]

Maybe Rudi hasnt played as much partly because he isnt up to the somewhat higher level (higher than the SPL) that he's been playing at since he left us. Driver has been injured many times in the last 3 years and has missed games specifically because of it, although I think one of the injuries was the Vlad flu that was going around back in the day. He also seems to take an age and a half to recover from even the most minor niggle.

 

Rudi at his best is/was way out of Driver's league IMO. Rudi fit and performing at a even a half of his best would be better and would contribute more than Driver half fit and a yard or two short of pace, as he has been for most of the last two years

Aye maybe maybe maybe. Wouldn't you fancy finding out the reasons he hasn't played rather than guess. Maybe he's been injured. Maybe he's turned into a lazy decker and can't be bothered playing football

 

And maybe he will never be at his best again.

 

Also remember how old driver is nowhere near his peak IMO.

[bighusref]

To be honest I took the season before last and the season before that to prove my point. I still think those stats are relevant and worth throwing in. However there can be no argument that recently he has indeed been injury prone.

 

Thanks for reminding me about the man u players stats was quite surprised at how many games they played in.

 

As I mentioned it is not so much the fact that driver is or isn't injury prone it is the willingness, no in fact eagerness of some supporters to write the guy off that I just don't understand. One fan also stated that rudi would play more than driver but when you look at rudis stats this is by no means certain.

 

I have no idea how good rudi would be for us now and as I have said I would rather go for players in positions we need filled.

 

What I would add, is that I am not so certain that Skacel would be the wrong signing. We are desperately crying out for an attacking player from midfield, could Skacel do that? Could he do that from the centre of midfield? IMO, yes to both. Oh, and he would be available now due to him being "available" and would not cost the earth (I think).

[johnjl]

What I would add, is that I am not so certain that Skacel would be the wrong signing. We are desperately crying out for an attacking player from midfield, could Skacel do that? Could he do that from the centre of midfield? IMO, yes to both. Oh, and he would be available now due to him being "available" and would not cost the earth (I think).

I think Ross said something similar earlier in the thread. If he could be accommodated into the side by him changing position or someone else changing position then that would certainly be something worth considering I just don't see our wide positions as much of a problem.

 

What concerns me is just why rudi has played so little football recently and I wouldn't mind finding that out

[bighusref]

I think Ross said something similar earlier in the thread. If he could be accommodated into the side by him changing position or someone else changing position then that would certainly be something worth considering I just don't see our wide positions as much of a problem.

 

What concerns me is just why rudi has played so little football recently and I wouldn't mind finding that out

 

Who knows dude.

 

What I do know is that laterally at Southampton he was played at left back, if he continues to be selected at left back you are watching an inferior player IMO. As I know little of the other teams he went to, I cannot really comment. What I will say is sometimes players just fit with a club, and I for one think it wouldn't be the biggest of gambles to give him a six month/year long deal.

[bistokid]

The debate whether he should sign will most likely be moot, given that his departure from the club was acrimonious and we know Vladimir is partial to grudges.

[bighusref]

The debate whether he should sign will most likely be moot, given that his departure from the club was acrimonious and we know Vladimir is partial to grudges.

 

I don't necessarily disagree, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't debate.

[Regular John]

When I saw Rudi play for Southampton a few times he looked fairly overweight and his play was sluggish.

 

Not sure what he would bring to the team nowadays other than a bit more character.

 

 

 

[bistokid]

I don't necessarily disagree, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't debate.

Personally, I would absolutely take him back. But the circumstances surrounding his departure were probably worse than Hartley's, and we all seen how that turned out.

[smartgair]

Hartley might have a quiet word with magoo to see if there,s any chance rudi could join aberdeen.

 

That would break my heart if that happened.

 

However,would rudi want to join the sheep

[smartgair]

Paul Hartley Never wanted to sign for the sheep but he did thanks to our wonderful owner

[Gregory House M.D.]

Not got a clue why folk wouldnt take him back, more ability in that left pegger than all of our squad.

 

Fixed that.

[Only a Game]

Aye maybe maybe maybe. Wouldn't you fancy finding out the reasons he hasn't played rather than guess. Maybe he's been injured. Maybe he's turned into a lazy decker and can't be bothered playing football

 

And maybe he will never be at his best again.

 

Also remember how old driver is nowhere near his peak IMO.

 

I've no idea why Rudi hasnt been playing. Both of your suggestions are perfectly possible. My suggestion would be that he was very good with us for 5 months, not so good for a further 5 months, got a move to a higher level on the back of the 5 very good months but in fact, isnt really all that good. (Although still good enough for us IMO)

 

I do know why Driver hasnt been playing though. Its because he's injury prone and his recovery time to full match fitness is enormous every time it happens. Also, his missing 10% ( the 10% he's been missing even when he has played in the last two years) makes him not such a good player even when he's apparently physically fit to play

 

Look, I wouldnt dream of advocating that we replace Rudi (as he is now) with Driver (at full potential)

 

But the fact is that Driver is no use to us sitting on a treatment table. We cant even sell him just now because he's so bedevilled with injuries( if he wasnt he'd be off already IMO) If he's back soon and gets back to his potential, potential he last showed us a decent part of, getting on for two years ago now, then great. I have to say I'm beginning to wander if if he's ever going to get back to what he was, far less fulfil what potential he had. The worst case scenario, which I've thought of a few times recently is that he may not even get back at all in any form.

 

Skacel, as someone else said, would not be an outrageous gamble of a signing, provided he was properly contracted and 'bonussed' up to the hilt. Also, as someone else said. I doubt its going to happen so perhaps we're wasting our time even discussing him at the length we have

[Only a Game]

In the two seasons prior to lat he played 29 and 31 times is that not quite a lot or even most games

 

How many of those games was his performance effected by not being fully fit or carrying an injury which subsequently had to be treated ? How many times, if we're being honest did people comment afterwards, that he shouldnt really be playing whilst so clearly unfit. (Quite a lot I'd suggest). How many times was he selected and played through or with an injury because we simply didnt have the choice.? (not his fault I agree but it did happen frequently) How many of those 60 games in two years did he make a telling contribution in( a contribution appropriate to a player with such apparently huge potential) Not many I'd suggest.

[johnjl]

How many of those games was his performance effected by not being fully fit or carrying an injury which subsequently had to be treated ? How many times, if we're being honest did people comment afterwards, that he shouldnt really be playing whilst so clearly unfit. (Quite a lot I'd suggest). How many times was he selected and played through or with an injury because we simply didnt have the choice.? (not his fault I agree but it did happen frequently) How many of those 60 games in two years did he make a telling contribution in( a contribution appropriate to a player with such apparently huge potential) Not many I'd suggest.

 

I'm hopeless at remembering individual performances from a year or two back so maybe others could answer you. What I will say is his value has soared to over 2.5 million so he mustve done something right in that time and he has almost always looked the part to me.

[Valentine Jambo]

No thank you. He was a lazy bar steward!!

[Drylaw Hearts]

No thank you. He was a lazy bar steward!!

 

I disagree VJ.

 

Just because he didn't bomb all over the pitch doesn't mean he was lazy.

[CJGJ]

He's in talks with us -- 100%

 

http://www.scotsman.com/heartofmidlothianfc/Skacel-keen-on-return-to.6514195.jp

[davemclaren]

He's in talks with us -- 100%

 

http://www.scotsman.com/heartofmidlothianfc/Skacel-keen-on-return-to.6514195.jp

 

 

It's a tease just like Hartley.

[Valentine Jambo]

I disagree VJ.

 

Just because he didn't bomb all over the pitch doesn't mean he was lazy.

 

 

I'm very close to one of the coaches he had when he was at Southampton. The coaching staff and players would get really frustrated with him in training and in games due to his laziness.

After signing him for Saints, George himself said Fyssas and Hartley made him look a better player than he actually was.

[Drylaw Hearts]

He's in talks with us -- 100%

 

http://www.scotsman.com/heartofmidlothianfc/Skacel-keen-on-return-to.6514195.jp

 

40 pages.

[CJGJ]

40 pages.

 

 

At least

 

Now I am split on this -- a bit like meeting your first love -- you remember the passion, the good times, the unbelievable way it made you feel............ but then you remember you are 4/5 years older, a bit wiser and the reasons why it didn't work and suddenly you think it should stay as a great memory.

 

BUT.... god it was good and for a few months he contributed to some of the best football I have watched from a Hearts team, you went to a game knowing they would entertain you and he made you feel he cared for the fans showing such emotion that I defy anyone to state they did not love him (as aplayer!!) during that early period -- a bit of me wants to think it can happen again but somehow you know it won't.

[Drylaw Hearts]

At least

 

Now I am split on this -- a bit like meeting your first love -- you remember the passion, the good times, the unbelievable way it made you feel............ but then you remember you are 4/5 years older, a bit wiser and the reasons why it didn't work and suddenly you think it should stay as a great memory.

 

BUT.... god it was good and for a few months he contributed to some of the best football I have watched from a Hearts team, you went to a game knowing they would entertain you and he made you feel he cared for the fans showing such emotion that I defy anyone to state they did not love him (as aplayer!!) during that early period -- a bit of me wants to think it can happen again but somehow you know it won't.

 

A short term deal until January wouldn't do any harm.