shaun.lawson Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 That has a use. Ewen Cameron - even more useless than fertiliser. That has quite a ring actually! As an aside, Ipswich Town were sponsored by Fisons for several seasons. Explains an awful lot, don't you think? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainmac Posted December 13, 2008 Author Share Posted December 13, 2008 Pure speculation. Club loses ?3m per annum and only survives by borrowing against the single asset - the stadium. Sell, the stadium, move to MF and still lose ?3M - there were no additional revenue streams at MF, in fact the crowds may have even plummeted - what happens after year 1 /2, when we are ?3M / ?6M in debt with no overdraft facilities? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seymour M Hersh Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 ? CPR didn't threaten to close Hearts down. Did you support Pie-rat's ideas for the club in 03/04? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drylaw Hearts Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 Club loses ?3m per annum and only survives by borrowing against the single asset - the stadium. Sell, the stadium, move to MF and still lose ?3M - there were no additional revenue streams at MF, in fact the crowds may have even plummeted - what happens after year 1 /2, when we are ?3M / ?6M in debt with no overdraft facilities? Correct me if I'm wrong but would we still be losing ?3million if we didn't have a debt in excess of ?20million ? A large chunk of that loss would have disappeared as there would have been no interest payment on the large OD/Loan. I'm not saying CPR was right to want to move but I do think saying Hearts would have died then is on a par with those who say we are on the verge of dying now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaun.lawson Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 Club loses ?3m per annum and only survives by borrowing against the single asset - the stadium. Sell, the stadium, move to MF and still lose ?3M - there were no additional revenue streams at MF, in fact the crowds may have even plummeted - what happens after year 1 /2, when we are ?3M / ?6M in debt with no overdraft facilities? Don't get this bit. Bear in mind that I agreed entirely with SOH's stance, and still do - but we'd have had to ensure our outgoings didn't exceed our incomings. Meaning a very low wage bill, and a position in the bottom six in all likelihood - but there are a number of SPL clubs even now whose wage bill barely exceeds ?2m. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainmac Posted December 13, 2008 Author Share Posted December 13, 2008 Perhaps - but he opines about a whole range of different things in the article. I also think it's possible - just possible - that if Levein believes HMFC is headed for deep trouble, he thinks it's in our best interests to keep publicising as much. The man has a lot of integrity, and such an explanation would make perfect sense to me. It's only a possibility, though. Really? Some wouldn't quite see it as you do. Dens Park - his manager and team mates for instance Starks Park - Graeme Hogg, Levein cost the guy his Hearts career Leicester - agreed to move but never told the Hearts board for 3 weeks and then admitted to "wanting out for a year". If that's your idea of integrity, fair enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drylaw Hearts Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 Did you support Pie-rat's ideas for the club in 03/04? Nope. Why ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainmac Posted December 13, 2008 Author Share Posted December 13, 2008 Don't get this bit. Bear in mind that I agreed entirely with SOH's stance, and still do - but we'd have had to ensure our outgoings didn't exceed our incomings. Meaning a very low wage bill, and a position in the bottom six in all likelihood - but there are a number of SPL clubs even now whose wage bill barely exceeds ?2m. So, lower crowds in all probability - even less revenue coming in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seymour M Hersh Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 Nope. Why ? Just curious mate, some of your posts sound almost as if you miss him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainmac Posted December 13, 2008 Author Share Posted December 13, 2008 Correct me if I'm wrong but would we still be losing ?3million if we didn't have a debt in excess of ?20million ? A large chunk of that loss would have disappeared as there would have been no interest payment on the large OD/Loan. I'm not saying CPR was right to want to move but I do think saying Hearts would have died then is on a par with those who say we are on the verge of dying now. You are correct but the stadium rent would have been an additional cost that might have just neutralised that particular saving, then you have the very real possibility of lower crowds at MF. Not looking too good, is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaun.lawson Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 Really? Some wouldn't quite see it as you do. Dens Park - his manager and team mates for instance Starks Park - Graeme Hogg, Levein cost the guy his Hearts career Leicester - agreed to move but never told the Hearts board for 3 weeks and then admitted to "wanting out for a year". If that's your idea of integrity, fair enough. I take it they're all qualified doctors, then? As for the other two examples: sure. We all make mistakes. But it doesn't mean the integrity many of us have somehow vanishes - and integrity is what I strongly believe Levein to possess. It's his integrity which leads him to be as forthright as he is and confront injustices against his team and his good name wherever he sees them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaun.lawson Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 So, lower crowds in all probability - even less revenue coming in? Our wage bill in 04/5 was barely below ?5m. Lower crowds at Murrayfield would have meant a lower wage bill, but one many SPL clubs could easily handle. Doesn't mean I agreed with moving - I absolutely did not! - but I can certainly see how we could have survived. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirk Diggler Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 I wonder how many more ex players and legends we can slag off before the end of the day, who's next, Robbo? Or possibly Hartley Don't be silly John, Robbo and Hartley are Hearts legends. :xmastongue: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainmac Posted December 13, 2008 Author Share Posted December 13, 2008 I take it they're all qualified doctors, then? As for the other two examples: sure. We all make mistakes. But it doesn't mean the integrity many of us have somehow vanishes - and integrity is what I strongly believe Levein to possess. It's his integrity which leads him to be as forthright as he is and confront injustices against his team and his good name wherever he sees them. No, not Doctors - just a bunch of guys committed to the HMFC cause. I think they would have been in a better position than you to make a judgement though and the fact that it still rankles with them 22 years on should tell you something. BTW, when the biggest "injustice against his team" was being perpetrated - he did his best to help the perpetrator. Maybe that's why he's so bitter now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Old Tolbooth Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 Don't be silly John, Robbo and Hartley are Hearts legends. :xmastongue: Heh heh, until they sneeze in the wrong direction and a little bit of mucas lands on our doorstep Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drylaw Hearts Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 Just curious mate, some of your posts sound almost as if you miss him. Thats just poor interpretation on your part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainmac Posted December 13, 2008 Author Share Posted December 13, 2008 Our wage bill in 04/5 was barely below ?5m. Lower crowds at Murrayfield would have meant a lower wage bill, but one many SPL clubs could easily handle. Doesn't mean I agreed with moving - I absolutely did not! - but I can certainly see how we could have survived. Well, there were some very bright people - including Donald Ford, a CA - who couldn't!! Perhaps you could do what CPR never could and provide us with the business plan that would have let us survive? Maybe we had nothing to worry about back then after all? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drylaw Hearts Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 You are correct but the stadium rent would have been an additional cost that might have just neutralised that particular saving, then you have the very real possibility of lower crowds at MF. Not looking too good, is it? As I said..... Pure speculation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaun.lawson Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 Well, there were some very bright people - including Donald Ford, a CA - who couldn't!! Perhaps you could do what CPR never could and provide us with the business plan that would have let us survive? Maybe we had nothing to worry about back then after all? We had plenty to worry about. But at least some of the belief that armageddon was nigh was based, I think, on our emotional attachment to Tynecastle. We had an idiot in charge with a lamentable record of utter incompetence, who could provide no convincing business plan - but I'm certain others could've done. 9 or 10,000 fans at Murrayfield - however ghastly it would undoubtedly have been - would still have been more fans than seven other SPL clubs enjoy; and they all seem to cope OK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainmac Posted December 13, 2008 Author Share Posted December 13, 2008 As I said..... Pure speculation. OK then, you win. I can't remember the exact figure for the stadium rent and I can't be arsed to dig it out but IIRC there was no real savings in interest when the rent was factored in. I guess everything is speculation until it happens - thankfully it didn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
siegementality Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 Well, there were some very bright people - including Donald Ford, a CA - who couldn't!! Perhaps you could do what CPR never could and provide us with the business plan that would have let us survive? Maybe we had nothing to worry about back then after all? http://lh4.ggpht.com/_GDYPrsNG9Dc/SIrySAJxgJI/AAAAAAAAAIA/zarRGDZnuG0/Shanghai,+happy+bus+scene.JPG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 The stadium rental for Murrayfield UEFA Cup games in 2004-05 was ?20K per match. IF this figure was used for 19 home SPL games the rental would have been ?380K, if the SRU had doubled this to ?40K per game then ?760K season rental and it would take ?100K per game to reach a rental figure of ?1.9M ....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Kilpatrick Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 Well, there were some very bright people - including Donald Ford, a CA - who couldn't!! Perhaps you could do what CPR never could and provide us with the business plan that would have let us survive? Maybe we had nothing to worry about back then after all? Iain, it was obvious to anyone with half a brain that the Murrayfield move was to stymie administration and stave off the shareholders losing all of their investment. However, that doesn't mean that Murrayfield was the definite end. The only possible way that it could have, IMHO, was if the incumbent board at that time had resigned en masse to allow a new board to "rally the troops", so to speak. Whether that would have happened or not we will never know. However, just as the 'financial viability' of the projections was rubbish, so was our imminent demise had we had to sell up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainmac Posted December 13, 2008 Author Share Posted December 13, 2008 We had plenty to worry about. But at least some of the belief that armageddon was nigh was based, I think, on our emotional attachment to Tynecastle. We had an idiot in charge with a lamentable record of utter incompetence, who could provide no convincing business plan - but I'm certain others could've done. 9 or 10,000 fans at Murrayfield - however ghastly it would undoubtedly have been - would still have been more fans than seven other SPL clubs enjoy; and they all seem to cope OK. Yes, sitting watching a bottom six team - by your own calculation - in a soulless bowl of a stadium would have had the crowds flocking along. That was the CPR plan - surely you can top that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drylaw Hearts Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 OK then, you win. I can't remember the exact figure for the stadium rent and I can't be arsed to dig it out but IIRC there was no real savings in interest when the rent was factored in. I guess everything is speculation until it happens - thankfully it didn't. Agreed. Which is why I find it frustrating that speculation surrounding our January FireSale (amongst other things) is swept under the carpet by many yet other speculation is received with open arms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drylaw Hearts Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 The stadium rental for Murrayfield UEFA Cup games in 2004-05 was ?20K per match. IF this figure was used for 19 home SPL games the rental would have been ?380K, if the SRU had doubled this to ?40K per game then ?760K season rental and it would take ?100K per game to reach a rental figure of ?1.9M ....... Too many speculative figures to be worth taking seriously. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magicTs Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 No, not Doctors - just a bunch of guys committed to the HMFC cause. I think they would have been in a better position than you to make a judgement though and the fact that it still rankles with them 22 years on should tell you something. As much as I loved Gary as a player and respect him now he is easily the most letdown ex Hearts player of the last 40 odd years given the fact we won our first major trophy such a short time after he finished a career spanning 700 odd games. He even admits he couldn't face the aftermath of the 98 Cup Final win and headed down south. I suspect he still has a lot of baggage from 86 which will go to his death bed. This is not a criticism just an observation. What I find desperately sad however is how Gary, Craig and Steven, 3 of the most important figures HMFC have had in the last 20 odd years are now having their memory tarnished by Hearts fans. If there is one thing I despise about the Romanov era (there are several but this may be the worst) it is that he has split the Hearts support like it has never been split before. All this 'together' pesh is a total lie. The support are at war with each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drylaw Hearts Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 Yes, sitting watching a bottom six team - by your own calculation - in a soulless bowl of a stadium would have had the crowds flocking along. That was the CPR plan - surely you can top that? That reminds me of Season 2007/2008. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainmac Posted December 13, 2008 Author Share Posted December 13, 2008 Iain, it was obvious to anyone with half a brain that the Murrayfield move was to stymie administration and stave off the shareholders losing all of their investment. However, that doesn't mean that Murrayfield was the definite end. The only possible way that it could have, IMHO, was if the incumbent board at that time had resigned en masse to allow a new board to "rally the troops", so to speak. Whether that would have happened or not we will never know. However, just as the 'financial viability' of the projections was rubbish, so was our imminent demise had we had to sell up. Geoff, not sure I understand what you are saying here. If the incumbent board resigned - no sign of that at the time BTW - that would have meant "the definite end"? Maybe I'm misreading what you typed? I'm not saying 'demise was imminent' but you can't keep trading ad infinitum when you have no borrowing facilities and the club keeps making a loss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaun.lawson Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 Yes, sitting watching a bottom six team - by your own calculation - in a soulless bowl of a stadium would have had the crowds flocking along. That was the CPR plan - surely you can top that? I think there's a sizeable hardcore who'll always watch Hearts regardless of how bad the team is or where we were playing. It's what makes us, in Scottish terms, a big club. If the club was slowly withering away, we'd have had to hope that someone would've come forward with the money - or alternatively, started groundsharing somewhere which wouldn't have been such a cavernous bowl. Easter Road or Almondvale, in other words. A deeply depressing scenario - but not one which would've meant death. To repeat: I think the 'club will die' line didn't resonate with enough people, because it was purely speculative. It's also imperative we continue to be aware of our worst case scenario options now: the club itself is more important than Tynecastle, and we shouldn't leave ourselves in a position of Tynecastle or bust if we're ever in the same position again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drylaw Hearts Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 As much as I loved Gary as a player and respect him now he is easily the most letdown ex Hearts player of the last 40 odd years given the fact we won our first major trophy such a short time after he finished a career spanning 700 odd games. He even admits he couldn't face the aftermath of the 98 Cup Final win and headed down south. I suspect he still has a lot of baggage from 86 which will go to his death bed. This is not a criticism just an observation. What I find desperately sad however is how Gary, Craig and Steven, 3 of the most important figures HMFC have had in the last 20 odd years are now having their memory tarnished by Hearts fans. If there is one thing I despise about the Romanov era (there are several but this may be the worst) it is that he has split the Hearts support like it has never been split before. All this 'together' pesh is a total lie. The support are at war with each other. Spot on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IMA MAROON Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 If there is one thing I despise about the Romanov era (there are several but this may be the worst) it is that he has split the Hearts support like it has never been split before. All this 'together' pesh is a total lie. The support are at war with each other. It is simple, you get behind the people that represent the club. On and off the park. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alwaysthereinspirit Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 He didn't do due diligence where Mad is concerned. One interview with Mad in an Edinburgh hotel then off to Leicester as qiuck as he could. Correct me if I'm wrong but were we not still in Europe. CL couldn't wait to dump us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainmac Posted December 13, 2008 Author Share Posted December 13, 2008 As much as I loved Gary as a player and respect him now he is easily the most letdown ex Hearts player of the last 40 odd years given the fact we won our first major trophy such a short time after he finished a career spanning 700 odd games. He even admits he couldn't face the aftermath of the 98 Cup Final win and headed down south. I suspect he still has a lot of baggage from 86 which will go to his death bed. This is not a criticism just an observation. What I find desperately sad however is how Gary, Craig and Steven, 3 of the most important figures HMFC have had in the last 20 odd years are now having their memory tarnished by Hearts fans. If there is one thing I despise about the Romanov era (there are several but this may be the worst) it is that he has split the Hearts support like it has never been split before. All this 'together' pesh is a total lie. The support are at war with each other. Depends what you mean by 'aftermath' - he was at the game and celebrated just like the rest of us. You would need to talk to others in the '86 team about CL - it's not Gary I was referring to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 As much as I loved Gary as a player and respect him now he is easily the most letdown ex Hearts player of the last 40 odd years given the fact we won our first major trophy such a short time after he finished a career spanning 700 odd games. He even admits he couldn't face the aftermath of the 98 Cup Final win and headed down south. I suspect he still has a lot of baggage from 86 which will go to his death bed. This is not a criticism just an observation. What I find desperately sad however is how Gary, Craig and Steven, 3 of the most important figures HMFC have had in the last 20 odd years are now having their memory tarnished by Hearts fans. If there is one thing I despise about the Romanov era (there are several but this may be the worst) it is that he has split the Hearts support like it has never been split before. All this 'together' pesh is a total lie. The support are at war with each other. Mackay and Levein's dispute pre-dates the Romanov era so how you can somehow try to blame this on Romanov is beyond me and Elvis split the support with his own actions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaun.lawson Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 No, not Doctors - just a bunch of guys committed to the HMFC cause. I think they would have been in a better position than you to make a judgement though and the fact that it still rankles with them 22 years on should tell you something. BTW, when the biggest "injustice against his team" was being perpetrated - he did his best to help the perpetrator. Maybe that's why he's so bitter now? Not true. He did his best to just do his job, and look after his players. On your other point: maybe it's just 1986 which rankles with them above all else? It certainly would with me if I'd been a player who'd had to endure such heartbreak. There's something quite endearing about believing players should turn out even if they're in no condition to do so - but it's also quite wrong. It's at least arguable that others at Dens should've followed Craig's lead, depending on whether replacements were available, of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainmac Posted December 13, 2008 Author Share Posted December 13, 2008 He didn't do due diligence where Mad is concerned. One interview with Mad in an Edinburgh hotel then off to Leicester as qiuck as he could.Correct me if I'm wrong but were we not still in Europe. CL couldn't wait to dump us. His decision to go South was made weeks before he even met Vlad. That meeting was a sham - more evidence of his 'integrity'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaun.lawson Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 As much as I loved Gary as a player and respect him now he is easily the most letdown ex Hearts player of the last 40 odd years given the fact we won our first major trophy such a short time after he finished a career spanning 700 odd games. He even admits he couldn't face the aftermath of the 98 Cup Final win and headed down south. I suspect he still has a lot of baggage from 86 which will go to his death bed. This is not a criticism just an observation. I agree. I've always felt gutted for the man that he never had the chance to pick up a winners' medal with the club he loved and served with such distinction. Ditto Alex MacDonald, who hit the post so often in his career (with Airdrie as well as us) it's unbelievable! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 Too many speculative figures to be worth taking seriously. There are some old articles I read recently DH that said the rental quoted was approx ?600K per season, I don't know what other costs would have been involved - however Hearts would not have been debt free as they had to pay the cost of clearing the site at Tynecastle and the Cala Homes offer was dependant on units built & sold and prices paid within a specific time period - for hearts to get a clear ?20M was very optimistic estimate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainmac Posted December 13, 2008 Author Share Posted December 13, 2008 Not true. He did his best to just do his job, and look after his players. On your other point: maybe it's just 1986 which rankles with them above all else? It certainly would with me if I'd been a player who'd had to endure such heartbreak. There's something quite endearing about believing players should turn out even if they're in no condition to do so - but it's also quite wrong. It's at least arguable that others at Dens should've followed Craig's lead, depending on whether replacements were available, of course. More revisionism - he came out and publicly backed the move to MF. The SOH campaign deliberately kept the players and management out of it - CL jumped in to aid his mate and mentor. How is that "just doing his job and looking after his players"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magicTs Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 It is simple, you get behind the people that represent the club. On and off the park. Not to the detriment of the memory of several Hearts heroes, unless of course your a classless fandan. Christ, in this of all weeks when a a legend of a bygone era, our most decorated player was laid to rest you would think some people might take a moment before disrespecting players who gave so much to our club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drylaw Hearts Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 Geoff, not sure I understand what you are saying here. If the incumbent board resigned - no sign of that at the time BTW - that would have meant "the definite end"? Maybe I'm misreading what you typed? I'm not saying 'demise was imminent' but you can't keep trading ad infinitum when you have no borrowing facilities and the club keeps making a loss. Is/Was it better to be able to borrow almost unlimited amounts of cash, whilst being told we weren't in any debt and money was no problem etc, whilst losing more money in such a short period than ever before in our history ? And then finding out we are actually due all that money we were told we weren't !!! CPR and VR are both a couple of erses who, during their respective periods of ownership, lied, conned and treated the Hearts fans with complete contempt. One is treated like the most hated man in Europe and the other isn't. Why ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drylaw Hearts Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 It is simple, you get behind the people that represent the club. On and off the park. Were you right behind CPR ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
magicTs Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 I agree. I've always felt gutted for the man that he never had the chance to pick up a winners' medal with the club he loved and served with such distinction. Ditto Alex MacDonald, who hit the post so often in his career (with Airdrie as well as us) it's unbelievable! Yep as much as it was incredibly emotional watching Robbo lift the cup I'm sure many Hearts fans raised a glass to Gary that night. He was the unluckiest player going when it came to the final hurdle. It's why I could barely watch Elvis's penalty as it would have been so unfair for him to miss out on lifting the cup and be responsible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie-Brown Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 You have to feel sympathy for Henry Smith, Walter Kidd, Gary Mackay, Craig Levein & John Colquhoun that their Hearts careers ended just a few years short of the 1998 cup win, Robbo & McPherson were very lucky in that respect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drylaw Hearts Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 His decision to go South was made weeks before he even met Vlad. That meeting was a sham - more evidence of his 'integrity'. Just like VR's meeting with Elvis the week prior to his exit from Hearts. More evidence of VR's 'integrity'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Geoff Kilpatrick Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 Sorry Iain. Just realised I missed an important word - worked! As in how Murrayfield could have worked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sherlock Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 Yes, sitting watching a bottom six team... in a soulless... stadium. To clarify, are you talking about last season or what would have happened if we had moved to MF? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shaun.lawson Posted December 13, 2008 Share Posted December 13, 2008 More revisionism - he came out and publicly backed the move to MF. The SOH campaign deliberately kept the players and management out of it - CL jumped in to aid his mate and mentor. How is that "just doing his job and looking after his players"? Off-field protests are bound to impact on the team to some degree, however much the intention is the exact opposite. I continue to be amazed that we walked 3rd with a huge total in 2003/4 despite what was going on off the park - it's practically unprecedented. Levein needed to know his budget in order to plan ahead at all, so backed the move: not least because he could've then told his players who'd be staying, and who'd be let go. That's what I mean by "looking after his players". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iainmac Posted December 13, 2008 Author Share Posted December 13, 2008 Is/Was it better to be able to borrow almost unlimited amounts of cash, whilst being told we weren't in any debt and money was no problem etc, whilst losing more money in such a short period than ever before in our history ? And then finding out we are actually due all that money we were told we weren't !!! CPR and VR are both a couple of erses who, during their respective periods of ownership, lied, conned and treated the Hearts fans with complete contempt. One is treated like the most hated man in Europe and the other isn't. Why ? Delusions of grandeur - he was only the most hated man in Baberton. :xmassick: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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