SNP WIN Glasgow East ( merged threads )

[jamboinglasgow]

It was also a good result for the Conservatives, who moved up a place into 3rd, overtaking the Lib Dems despite their "famous by election machine" they lost their deposit and their voters.

 

The tired old chat of Tories being against the NHS, scrapping the minimum wage et al is not even close to fact, and is barely worthy of a rebuttal. It does the political debate on this board no credit to get down to such old myths and scare stories.

 

As a fellow tory that pleases me that we beat lib dems. It also makes me laugh as a friend of mine who is lib dem mad that she actully helps campaign for them. Me and her were having a disscusion about this by-election and she was certain that the lib-dems would surprise everyone and win it.

 

I also agree with you the old myths which labour continully bring out to try and discredit the tories. It was over 10 years ago and though there were a past there have been major changes in the party. also I think it rich when Gordon Brown blames any things that go wrong with the government now on the tory goverment over 10 years ago.

[felix]

I agree, I am a Tory too.

The Tories could flourish in an independent state, and I, for one, would welcome it

were Scotland to be independent I believe it could be very wealthy indeed, a prime breeding ground for the right, adn Ithink that deep down the working Scot is not only right wing, but pretty conservative tooIf the Tories in the North could separate themselves from the Etonites, they would see a resurgence

 

Deep down the working Scot is benevolent and socialist .

A Conservative challenge to an SNP-led, rejuvenated independant Scotland ,would be as insignificant as a middle-ground Lib.Dem challenge.

[troonjambo]

This is true. If Scotland did get independence then it's all start again for political parties. It's hard to see what would happen to the SNP if it happened as many of its members would leave to join other parties more accurately reflecting their political views.

 

and as the 2 tory flag boys;) above have so correctly stated in a independent Scotland finally free of the thatcher anti tory sentiment the new Scottish conservative party would flourish must admit i was stunned they did not get more votes last night as locally they ran a good campaign and god knows there is enough unionist sentiment around here to tap into but i think some tactical voting may have been in play

[doctor jambo]

Deep down the working Scot is benevolent and socialist .

A Conservative challenge to an SNP-led, rejuvenated independant Scotland ,would be as insignificant as a middle-ground Lib.Dem challenge.

 

the working scot was benevolent and socialist in the days everyone worked hard and were more or less equal

Now the working Scot will do whatever they can to escape the mess our estates have become- sinkholes for an underclass

They seek escape to what was previously middle class suburbia

Scotland has a large nouveaue middle class- Torie heartlands they wiould be called in England

OUr estate is full of them- working thier backsides off to escape the areas of their upbringing and keep their kids out of it

Even the previously rabid socialist catholics- a large part of the working classes are doing this

Prime Tory stuff this- aspirational, determined, family people willing to work to better themselves and really P'd off at funding feckless losers at a cost to themselves

[troonjambo]

ps it is not going to happen because deep down a staggering amount of the people are extremely unionist in there outlook and if not proud to be brittish have enough common sense to realize they ARE BRITISH

[i8hibsh]

Those thick weegie tossers should not even be allowed the vote.

 

They have voted with media influence i.e media says how crap labour are and these vile monsters in Glasgow say ok we will vote elsewehere

 

If there were no media they would be none the wiser

 

Blaming everyone bar themselves for the squaler they live in!!

 

they are all bad - total trash and should be neukd!

 

now we have another seat in Westminster for this racist mickey mouse party

 

I swear if the we ever get independence I will become a refugee abroad!

 

I hate alex Salmon more than I actaully hate anyone in the world

 

I'd rather have sex with Neil Lennon than even shake that national embarrassments hand!

 

FTSNP!

[interista]

Deep down the working Scot is benevolent and socialist .

A Conservative challenge to an SNP-led, rejuvenated independant Scotland ,would be as insignificant as a middle-ground Lib.Dem challenge.

 

That might well be so but are they also inherently wasteful and dishonest ? la Labour Party.

 

I have always supported the SNP while believing in the realignment of the party political scene in a post independence environment.

[interista]

Those thick weegie tossers should not even be allowed the vote.

 

They have voted with media influence i.e media says how crap labour are and these vile monsters in Glasgow say ok we will vote elsewehere

 

If there were no media they would be none the wiser

 

Blaming everyone bar themselves for the squaler they live in!!

 

they are all bad - total trash and should be neukd!

 

now we have another seat in Westminster for this racist mickey mouse party

 

I swear if the we ever get independence I will become a refugee abroad!

 

I hate alex Salmon more than I actaully hate anyone in the world

 

I'd rather have sex with Neil Lennon than even shake that national embarrassments hand!

 

FTSNP!

 

See ya

 

 

 

Look forward to your emigration

[i8hibsh]

See ya

 

 

 

Look forward to your emigration

 

I look forward to seeing you in poverty speaking Gaelic and living the life of a bronze age neanderthal

 

Scotland Revenue 27 billion

 

Budget

 

26.5 billion on getting independence

0.5 billion on police, schools and NHS

 

salmons MUST be stooped!

[loveofthegame]

The thought of independence scares the life out of me. I know how i'll be voting.

 

Save the Union.

[i8hibsh]

See ya

 

 

 

Look forward to your emigration

 

those nasty english eh

 

You will soon have your freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom!

[i8hibsh]

The thought of independence scares the life out of me. I know how i'll be voting.

 

Save the Union.

 

you obviously live in the real world and not a sexed up romantic image that the fat warrior salmond creates

 

Whay gets me is the fact he knows he is a total fat sack of useless **** and noone wants independence apart from a select few bravehearts.

 

His main policy is to lower the voting age - as the young are more receptive to his propoganda bull****

 

He is subtly laying the seeds now bu issuing schools with Saltire flags etc

 

I utterly despise even the notion of independence and the thought of that fat wesel churns my unionist stomach!

[EIEIO]

The thought of independence scares the life out of me. I know how i'll be voting.

 

Save the Union.

 

This fear of controlling your own destiny and relying on blaming others for the state of the country was not shared by the voters of Glasgow East yesterday, hats of to them.or

[Drew Busby !]

those nasty english eh

 

You will soon have your freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom!

 

Keep it coming mate, you're increasing my happiness today EXPONENTIALLY.

 

:D :D :D :D

[i8hibsh]

This is true. If Scotland did get independence then it's all start again for political parties. It's hard to see what would happen to the SNP if it happened as many of its members would leave to join other parties more accurately reflecting their political views.

 

the clowns at SNP don't have any 'political views' other than independence DM

 

They are crusaders fighting a war that does not exist

 

they must be put to an end

[i8hibsh]

Keep it coming mate, you're increasing my happiness today EXPONENTIALLY.

 

:D :D :D :D

 

Do you feel your life would be better off being from an 'independent' Scotland and if so please kindly share why?

[EIEIO]

I utterly despise even the notion of independence and the thought of that fat wesel churns my unionist stomach!

 

When should a country exist as an independent entity? For example should Austria be a county of Germany both countries speak the same language after all why have two separate countries. Mr A Hitler tried it not so long ago.

[doctor jambo]

those nasty english eh

 

You will soon have your freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom!

 

I am half English, from a staunchly pro-unionist family

I am pro independence, and they are now

The social and economic costs of the union now outweight the benefits

We are being hobbled by Westminster with regards to renewables, taxation, Health policy, immigration, foreign policy ad nauseam

When people look out their windows and see the place turning to ****, it becomes very hard to convince them of the benefits of keeping the status quo

[upthehill]

This fear of controlling your own destiny and relying on blaming others for the state of the country was not shared by the voters of Glasgow East yesterday, hats of to them.or

 

Yawn. More guff. Unionists are not afraid of controlling their own destiny. That's another smear, politics for the very very dumb.

 

They make an informed decison to part of something bigger and stronger than the sum of it's parts, with more clout. To have a permanent seat on the UN security council for example, giving us more control of our destiny, not less.

 

Brown & Darling are proud Scots (believe it or not), Blair was also from our neck of the woods, they showed that they are Unionists, but are not afraid of controlling their own destiny.

[loveofthegame]

This fear of controlling your own destiny and relying on blaming others for the state of the country was not shared by the voters of Glasgow East yesterday, hats of to them.or

 

I control my own destiny everyday that i go to uni, every bit of work i put in, every time i take my g/f out, every time i hit the gym or exercise. Voting SNP will not overly change MY own destiny.

 

I don't for a minute believe that destroying the Union will suddenly make Scotland such a better place to live for all its inhabitants. And i refuse to believe that long term independence is viable. Its currently all if's and maybe's- people guessing at how the country would turn out.

 

Thankfully i still don't think independence is that close, despite some of the pish spouted on here from those who claim to know it all. You don't have to be a Union Jack waving, Hun ned to want to keep the Union as it is.

 

And certainly no hats off to any bampot, jakey ****bag from Glasgows east end who'll do anything to try and turn around there sorry lives- they'll listen to anyone who tells them what they want to hear. When they're still living short lives in abject poverty in 4years time they'll be back voting Labour.

[i8hibsh]

When should a country exist as an independent entity? For example should Austria be a county of Germany both countries speak the same language after all why have two separate countries. Mr A Hitler tried it not so long ago.

 

Right we are still Scotland anyone with a brain in the world knows this even under the banner Great Britain

we are all free and live in a society of which we are blessed

We live in a democratic capitalist country

We can do say as we wish, run free as we wish and have many doors open to become self made people

the ooprtunities are endless

we are part of a union that (because of that union) makes us an EXTREMELY important player in the world

We have the a seat in the top table in all the world's treaties and Unions

we have the strongest allies in the world

we have embassies all over the world

we have all the same blessigns that the english and Welsh have (contrary to pathetic SNP propoganda the english do not live in penthouse suites and we live in shacks)

The 2 most IMPORTANT people in British politics are Scottish

Even through economic hardhsip we stand steadfast and can stand even the toughest economic tests

we are intelligent race as we hvae great schooling (even better for some reason that our partners in this union)

We would not know political hardship or opression if it came up to hit us in our pasty white Scottish @sses

We are an extremely extremely fortunate country

 

 

Now can you please tell me how that is the same to Austria and Germany under Nazi rule?

[doctor jambo]

Yawn. More guff. Unionists are not afraid of controlling their own destiny. That's another smear, politics for the very very dumb.

 

They make an informed decison to part of something bigger and stronger than the sum of it's parts, with more clout. To have a permanent seat on the UN security council for example, giving us more control of our destiny, not less. Brown & Darling are proud Scots (believe it or not), Blair was also from our neck of the woods, they showed that they are Unionists, but are not afraid of controlling their own destiny.

 

Usually I agree with you, but not here.

The security council is run by others- Russia, China being the prime ewxamples ie over Zimbabwe, Sudan

We toe the Yankee line

Many small countries are small and that offers some protection from world issues

I'd rather Scotland was small and could pick and choose where our young men fought and died based on the wishes of our people

People mocked the french over their stance in the middle east

Who looks feckin stupid now? Not the "cheese eating surrender monkeys" thats for sure

[EIEIO]

Yawn. More guff. Unionists are not afraid of controlling their own destiny. That's another smear, politics for the very very dumb.

 

They make an informed decison to part of something bigger and stronger than the sum of it's parts, with more clout. To have a permanent seat on the UN security council for example, giving us more control of our destiny, not less.

 

Brown & Darling are proud Scots (believe it or not), Blair was also from our neck of the woods, they showed that they are Unionists, but are not afraid of controlling their own destiny.

 

Brown and Blair are indeed British Nationalists no argument there. However they are also lap dogs of USA which resulted in us (GB) being embroiled in an illegal war (according to the rules of the UN). Scotland is a Eurpean country and should not be isolated from it's neighbours politically and economically both Labour and Tories are split down the middle on Europe (one sceptical the other anti).

[i8hibsh]

I am half English, from a staunchly pro-unionist family

I am pro independence, and they are now

The social and economic costs of the union now outweight the benefits

We are being hobbled by Westminster with regards to renewables, taxation, Health policy, immigration, foreign policy ad nauseam

When people look out their windows and see the place turning to ****, it becomes very hard to convince them of the benefits of keeping the status quo

 

so what you say is now, presently we are being 'shafted' we will bail as things could be better (for a while)

A partnership isn't about that!!

 

They bailed us out and for 300 years it has been an extremely equal partnership

 

Believe it or not we are not due anything and likewise we don't owe anything

 

it is give take

 

I know that fat vile cretin Salmond wants us to believ it is give give I assure you it is not

 

Now as for the half English bit yawn yawn. That hackitt wench Nicola Sturgeon has that one on ice for an argument. whenever anyone accuses her of hating the English (which she does) she comes out witht he my Great Great Gran was English

 

B0llox utter pigswill!

 

You seem to use the half english for convenience

[Drew Busby !]

Do you feel your life would be better off being from an 'independent' Scotland and if so please kindly share why?

 

Take this as an opening premise. If Scotland had access to the revenue from oil 30 years ago, then this country would look very different to the way it does today. Better, richer, fairer to all. An independent Scotland would not have allowed Glasgow East citizens to descend to a quality of life that sees their lifespan compare to that of 3rd world countries. The dependency mentality that Labour and the UK has engendered in areas like this is a disgrace.

 

With the recent revelations that there is enough oil in the ground for another 20-30 years, I do not intend to see this country miss a second chance at hugely improving the economic prospects and life-chances of its citizens ... whether they were born here or not ... English, Asian, Polish, Protestant or Catholic... it doesn't matter a freeking damn. There are 5 million of us who can take responsibility for improving our own lives without a government 400 miles away "allocating" us a budget.

 

For every nay-sayer like you who wants the first flight out, I will welcome another incomer from England, Europe or Asia who will make a go of it in Scotland. The more the merrier in the best "mongrel-race" country on this planet

 

Send us a postcard once you're settled in Newcastle or London or where-ever

[troonjambo]

 

Thankfully i still don't think independence is that close, despite some of the pish spouted on here from those who claim to know it all. You don't have to be a Union Jack waving, Hun ned to want to keep the Union as it is.

 

brillant point mate just one thing drop the bawbag east end glasgow ****e there is not a labour held seat in the ****ing whole united kingdom labour could have held on to last night byelections are nearly always lost by the sitting government thatcher lost a staggering number between all her election victory's. byelections allows people to let the government know there unhappy without actually changing jack **** nobody in there right mind thinks this seat is staying snp at the general

[i8hibsh]

Nationalism is wrong!!!

 

It causes conflict all over the world and has done since time began(although that is the period Salmond the fat embarrassment lives in)

 

 

A United Kingdom, A United Europe!!

[cosanostra]

Nationalism is wrong!!!

 

It causes conflict all over the world and has done since time began(although that is the period Salmond the fat embarrassment lives in)

 

 

A United Kingdom, A United Europe!!

 

I agree with the united Europe part. An independant Scotland as part of the EU would prosper. It would also allow us to take a step away from the labour UK government's foreign policy of attacking countries with their powerful allies. I'd rather stick with the EU than go it alone with the US when they decide who they'd like to attack next.

[i8hibsh]

Take this as an opening premise. If Scotland had access to the revenue from oil 30 years ago, then this country would look very different to the way it does today. Better, richer, fairer to all. An independent Scotland would not have allowed Glasgow East citizens to descend to a quality of life that sees their lifespan compare to that of 3rd world countries. The dependency mentality that Labour and the UK has engendered in areas like this is a disgrace.

 

With the recent revelations that there is enough oil in the ground for another 20-30 years, I do not intend to see this country miss a second chance at hugely improving the economic prospects and life-chances of its citizens ... whether they were born here or not ... English, Asian, Polish, Protestant or Catholic... it doesn't matter a freeking damn. There are 5 million of us who can take responsibility for improving our own lives without a government 400 miles away "allocating" us a budget.

 

For every nay-sayer like you who wants the first flight out, I will welcome another incomer from England, Europe or Asia who will make a go of it in Scotland. The more the merrier in the best "mongrel-race" country on this planet

 

Send us a postcard once you're settled in Newcastle or London or where-ever

 

Is that oil as in the oil that wil, be no longer required as EVERY car manufacturer on the planet is putting absolutely EVERYTHING into finding a more environmentally sound energy?

 

That oil?

 

The fact is if those rigs werent there the SNP would still want independence

 

As at the end of the day You all hate the English and have a 1000 year old chip on your shoulders!!!

 

 

Freeedom!

 

Those heroes that dies int he trenches would spin in their unmarked graves if they heard you talking like that

 

the lot of you Nationalists need to wake up!

[i8hibsh]

I agree with the united Europe part. An independant Scotland as part of the EU would prosper. It would also allow us to take a step away from the labour UK government's foreign policy of attacking countries with their powerful allies. I'd rather stick with the EU than go it alone with the US when they decide who they'd like to attack next.

 

you mean the foreign policy that wants the world to be empowered and live in peace?

 

that foreign policy?

[cosanostra]

Is that oil as in the oil that wil, be no longer required as EVERY car manufacturer on the planet is putting absolutely EVERYTHING into finding a more environmentally sound energy?

 

That oil?

 

The fact is if those rigs werent there the SNP would still want independence

 

As at the end of the day You all hate the English and have a 1000 year old chip on your shoulders!!!

 

 

Freeedom!

 

Those heroes that dies int he trenches would spin in their unmarked graves if they heard you talking like that

 

the lot of you Nationalists need to wake up!

 

You let yourself down with that sort of stuff mate. It's not constructive or funny, it just makes it harder to take your decent points seriously.

[loveofthegame]

brillant point mate just one thing drop the bawbag east end glasgow ****e there is not a labour held seat in the ****ing whole united kingdom labour could have held on to last night byelections are nearly always lost by the sitting government thatcher lost a staggering number between all her election victory's. byelections allows people to let the government know there unhappy without actually changing jack **** nobody in there right mind thinks this seat is staying snp at the general

 

Fair point, i probably went in too hard for which i apologise.

[Patrick Bateman]

Curran is a simply vile woman who could barely string a coherent sentence together, its no wonder that she lost.

 

Is anyone else getting tired of i8hibsh's tedious arguments based on childlike logic and baseless accusations? To say that wanting independence is a matter of being "Anti" anyone is a preposterous thing to say - Would you consider Gandhi anti-english? As for Salmond being a "cretin", perhaps you should examine your sophistry and grammar before attacking him.

[cosanostra]

you mean the foreign policy that wants the world to be empowered and live in peace?

 

that foreign policy?

 

"Peace through war-mongering."

 

Great plan.

 

Why didn't Ghandi or Jesus think of that?

[i8hibsh]

Wouldn't you?

 

No matter your feeling on the outcome of the by-election it is a sad fact that these poor people will now be forgotten again: cut adrift, disenfranchised and hidden away. Until the next time someone needs their vote.

 

What a pitiful attitude to have towards people less fortunate than yourself, who have no opportunities in life and are given no incentives to turn things around by the powers that be.

 

The Conservatives screwed these people and New Labour did NOTHING to help.

 

Time for the SNP to give it a shot I say.

 

 

Come on mate do you honestly believe that? These people have had EVERY opportunity that we have had. Enough of this 'victim of circumstance' pigswill

 

they are just bad seeds - who want to blame the world for their situation

 

most of them are total sc** that is the sad fact

 

Anyone who lives in the UK who wants to work very hard, succeed at everything and most importantly be honest law obiding citizens will become something

 

these folk are born criminals - pure vile

[i8hibsh]

"Peace through war-mongering."

 

Great plan.

 

Why didn't Ghandi or Jesus think of that?

 

Because Jesus is a fictitious character perhaps

[i8hibsh]

Curran is a simply vile woman who could barely string a coherent sentence together, its no wonder that she lost.

 

Is anyone else getting tired of i8hibsh's tedious arguments based on childlike logic and baseless accusations? To say that wanting independence is a matter of being "Anti" anyone is a preposterous thing to say - Would you consider Gandhi anti-english? As for Salmond being a "cretin", perhaps you should examine your sophistry and grammar before attacking him.

 

Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom!

[Patrick Bateman]

you mean the foreign policy that wants the world to be empowered and live in peace?

 

that foreign policy?

 

A peace that has involved the deaths of hundreds of thousands of Iraqis and millions displaced? I'm beginning to think your posts are entirely ironic, I refuse to believe that anyone could be so laughably unaware of the world around them.

 

But yeah, its all the SNP's fault

[Morry]

You let yourself down with that sort of stuff mate. It's not constructive or funny, it just makes it harder to take your decent points seriously.

 

Second that one.

 

Well done SNP - love them or loathe them you know it makes sense for change. Or would you rather labour/conservative London governments dragging Scotland down with England and Wales? The UK is a complete mess.

[Drew Busby !]

Is that oil as in the oil that wil, be no longer required as EVERY car manufacturer on the planet is putting absolutely EVERYTHING into finding a more environmentally sound energy?

 

That oil?

 

The fact is if those rigs werent there the SNP would still want independence

 

As at the end of the day You all hate the English and have a 1000 year old chip on your shoulders!!!

 

 

Freeedom!

 

Those heroes that dies int he trenches would spin in their unmarked graves if they heard you talking like that

 

the lot of you Nationalists need to wake up!

 

Hate the English ? CAN YOU READ ?

 

I've just told you. The more English people in this country, the better. They love to work here, they contribute hugely and once they've set foot across the border they are co-opted as Scots like any other.

 

Your simplistic misrepresentation convinces no-one but yourself and a few other nutters. Like I say, when you're gone, I hope to see some energetic Geordie or Scouser come up here and take your place.

 

Wheres your preferred exit destination ? Australia ? Canada ?? Enjoy !!!

[doctor jambo]

Is that oil as in the oil that wil, be no longer required as EVERY car manufacturer on the planet is putting absolutely EVERYTHING into finding a more environmentally sound energy?

 

That oil?

 

The fact is if those rigs werent there the SNP would still want independence

 

As at the end of the day You all hate the English and have a 1000 year old chip on your shoulders!!!

 

 

Freeedom!

 

Those heroes that dies int he trenches would spin in their unmarked graves if they heard you talking like that

 

the lot of you Nationalists need to wake up!

 

we all hate the English- chill out mate!

no we dont

And the oil will run out in thirty years, about the same time it will take to develop and efficient car for western consumers, so that is fine

But oil is also used in manufacture of plastics, chemicals etc

It will always be needed, and as it runs out the price goes up

Sont you want a piece of that?

It could rejuvenate our country for ALL its citizens

And our heroes in their unmarked graves would have been doing a lot of spinning over the state the country has got into anyway- what is left of what they died for?

A name, a flag, an idea, not much else.

Grinding poverty, economic collapse, world beating debt, failing health service,

yeah, loving the Union

[Patrick Bateman]

Freeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeedom!

 

Witty riposte right enough

 

Not "Freedom" but fiscal and financial autonomy, thanks. Sorry if that doesn't fit with your simplistic political view.

[loveofthegame]

Come on mate do you honestly believe that? These people have had EVERY opportunity that we have had. Enough of this 'victim of circumstance' pigswill

 

they are just bad seeds - who want to blame the world for their situation

 

most of them are total sc** that is the sad fact

 

Anyone who lives in the UK who wants to work very hard, succeed at everything and most importantly be honest law obiding citizens will become something

 

these folk are born criminals - pure vile

 

Pretty much what i was getting at although i went in a bit hard. But i refuse to believe that people in Glasgow's East End couldn't make their lives better if they tried to change. Change will have to stem from them.

 

I don't see why their lives should get so much better from everyone elses handouts. They should have to work for it, like we have too, not just sit on benefits and GIRO.

[i8hibsh]

I've been on this thread for 30 minutes and my blood is bloiling. It is simply a waste of time.

 

Question for the Nats.......Do you believe the English have it 'better'?

[cosanostra]

Second that one.

 

Well done SNP - love them or loathe them you know it makes sense for change. Or would you rather labour/conservative London governments dragging Scotland down with England and Wales? The UK is a complete mess.

 

The UK is in a mess and the London Labour government's foreign policy has been a shambles. Why anyone thought it would be a good idea to side with the US against the EU is beyond me. The sooner we move away from the UK and back towards European stability and rational, democratic foreign policy, the better. The UK must be the 2nd most hated country in the world now, how is that benefitting the people of Scotland?

[doctor jambo]

Hate the English ? CAN YOU READ ?

 

I've just told you. The more English people in this country, the better. They love to work here, they contribute hugely and once they've set foot across the border they are co-opted as Scots like any other.

 

Your simplistic misrepresentation convinces no-one but yourself and a few other nutters. Like I say, when you're gone, I hope to see some energetic Geordie or Scouser come up here and take your place.

 

Wheres your preferred exit destination ? Australia ? Canada ?? Enjoy !!! [/QUOTE]

 

Both of which left old blighty behind and are fine on their own ta very much

[i8hibsh]

Witty riposte right enough

 

Not "Freedom" but fiscal and financial autonomy, thanks. Sorry if that doesn't fit with your simplistic political view.

 

This is my biggest fear!

[i8hibsh]

Pretty much what i was getting at although i went in a bit hard. But i refuse to believe that people in Glasgow's East End couldn't make their lives better if they tried to change. Change will have to stem from them.

 

I don't see why their lives should get so much better from everyone elses handouts. They should have to work for it, like we have too, not just sit on benefits and GIRO.

 

The Nats blame the Union for all of Scotlands decay

[cosanostra]

I've been on this thread for 30 minutes and my blood is bloiling. It is simply a waste of time.

 

Question for the Nats.......Do you believe the English have it 'better'?

 

You are misunderstanding the point in becoming independent.

 

It's not about England. Whether English have it better is simply not an issue.

 

It's about Scotland and making a country for ourselves that is the best it can be. I firmly believe that our potential as in independent country within the EU is far superior than it is as a region within the UK.

[Patrick Bateman]

I've been on this thread for 30 minutes and my blood is bloiling. It is simply a waste of time.

 

Question for the Nats.......Do you believe the English have it 'better'?

 

 

I prefer to see England as a collection of regions. Anywhere outside the South East of England gets treated quite poorly, whereas the London economy and infrastructure gets propped up quite a bit more (Millennium Dome, 2012 Olympics, that rail network) but you could also argue that they generate more money and hence deserve the higher spending.

 

I want Scotland to be independent because I think we'd be better off raising our own taxes and spending our own money, making our own international decisions and ultimately fending for/representing ourselves on the international stage. Britain was created as an economic union and for a great deal of time, it was very successful, but the days of Empire ended after the 2nd World War so the UK is no longer a viable political entity.

 

But sure, its 'cause we all hate the English right enough