Playing like shitebags and rolling over to rangers

[Ricardo Quaresma]

Just now, HopeDiouf said:

well put it another way.  once they had a man sent off, we took total control.  Very impressive how good we were once we had the extra man.  Up till then, they'd missed a dodgy penalty and we had not looked in control.

 

They were kind of in a shitty state that rangers were in on Sunday, that about right?

[Ricardo Quaresma]

2 hours ago, GinRummy said:

I’d bet we don’t get major surgery.  Naisy pretty much said that he doesn’t like sweeping changes or words to that effect. 

 

Not too many in and out at once, or something like that, aye

[soonbe110]

5 minutes ago, Ricardo Quaresma said:

 

But we comfortably dealt with celtic twice, home and away, a team rangers can't beat?

Celtic away was one of those days. Two early goals and then a great defensive effort against a team that was off the boil that day.  Barley created a chance against us despite having all the ball 

Celtic home we played against 10 men for most of the game and just about shaded it. 
 

Both good wins but stretching it to say we went head to head with them 11 v 11, or gave it a go, and came out on top. 
 

Had we scored first on Sunday I’m pretty sure we would have won. Instead we gift them a goal inside five minutes. Game dynamics from each clubs previous fixtures changes completely. 
 

[Dazo]

6 minutes ago, HopeDiouf said:

well put it another way.  once they had a man sent off, we took total control.  Very impressive how good we were once we had the extra man.  Up till then, they'd missed a dodgy penalty and we had not looked in control.  if you're pretending the early red card didn't give us control of that particular game you are kidding yourself.

Gaining control after the red doesn’t mean we were struggling before it. I thought it was fairly and clearly gained an advantage after the red. We were never struggling though. 

[HopeDiouf]

Just now, Dazo said:

Gaining control after the red doesn’t mean we were struggling before it. I thought it was fairly and clearly gained an advantage after the red. We were never struggling though. 

struggling maybe not the right word, but it was looking like business as usual till that point.  They'd already missed a dodgy pen. Red swung the game to us.

[Dazo]

4 minutes ago, HopeDiouf said:

struggling maybe not the right word, but it was looking like business as usual till that point.  They'd already missed a dodgy pen. Red swung the game to us.

Not arguing about the red, it clearly swung it our way. Just don’t think we were struggling. 

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

Just watched the game again, we actually played pretty decent the middle 70 minutes.

 

Mistakes have cost us, in no way have we shit the bed or been outplayed, quite the reverse. We try to hold onto the ball, play it around the whole game, shitting it would be lumping it.

 

Unfortunately we are a half yard off it in the final third, if we are that bit sharper we get a couple of goals, seems to be a recurring theme against Rangers and Rangers alone.

 

September the 23rd was the last time we failed to score against any other team, in that time we have played Rangers 5 times, losing 2-1 and 3-1, the last 3 games 1-0 5-0 2-0.

 

We really have a problem with Rangers, alone

[rudi must stay]

I understand shitebags is a common phrase, unfortunately it's down to talent, they have players worth alot more than us. And a cup semi final they're going to show up in a game like that. Fouling isn't the answer, refs are quite happy to send our players off.

[CaptainShanks]

15 hours ago, OTT said:

 

Yep this in spades. 

 

Rangers were there for the taking. 

 

I hope it drives home to the board that our attack needs more than just Shankland to succeed. We've struggled to score goals this season, most games have been tight and cagey affairs despite dominating possession. The takeaway there should be that we currently lack the attacking talent to capitalise on that level of possession consistently. 

We are joint third highest scorers in the league. Decision making in the final third is our major downfall as we are well clear in third in terms of shots at goal. 

[Ricardo Quaresma]

3 minutes ago, Lord Beni of Gorgie said:

Just watched the game again, we actually played pretty decent the middle 70 minutes.

 

Mistakes have cost us, in no way have we shit the bed or been outplayed, quite the reverse. We try to hold onto the ball, play it around the whole game, shitting it would be lumping it.

 

Unfortunately we are a half yard off it in the final third, if we are that bit sharper we get a couple of goals, seems to be a recurring theme against Rangers and Rangers alone.

 

September the 23rd was the last time we failed to score against any other team, in that time we have played Rangers 5 times, losing 2-1 and 3-1, the last 3 games 1-0 5-0 2-0.

 

We really have a problem with Rangers, alone

 

That's my take, not alone in that either

 

I think someone should start a new thread nearer the next encounter, with a slightly more euphemistic title and we can all drill deep down into it, hard talk style

 

Maybe even big talk style 👇

 

 

 

[OTT]

18 minutes ago, CaptainShanks said:

We are joint third highest scorers in the league. Decision making in the final third is our major downfall as we are well clear in third in terms of shots at goal. 

 

Can't help but think that is the equivalent of winning a fist fight against a toddler  

 

Shankland has scored the overwhelming majority of our goals, all of our games have been extremely cagey affairs - I don't believe we've won a single game this season by more than 2 clear goals. 

 

You're quite right about the decision making though. Shankland seems to be the only one that doesn't get a nose bleed when he gets a sight of goal. 

 

Putting a few quality players around Shanks (Dhanda, McKay, Spittal... Armstrong?) would see us winning games a lot more comfortably IMO - the fact only 1 of them are currently at the club speaks volumes about our lack of attacking talent. 

[CaptainShanks]

3 minutes ago, OTT said:

 

Can't help but think that is the equivalent of winning a fist fight against a toddler  

 

Shankland has scored the overwhelming majority of our goals, all of our games have been extremely cagey affairs - I don't believe we've won a single game this season by more than 2 clear goals. 

 

You're quite right about the decision making though. Shankland seems to be the only one that doesn't get a nose bleed when he gets a sight of goal. 

 

Putting a few quality players around Shanks (Dhanda, McKay, Spittal... Armstrong?) would see us winning games a lot more comfortably IMO - the fact only 1 of them are currently at the club speaks volumes about our lack of attacking talent. 

The question would be how much of that is down to players seeking out Shankland when it comes to crosses/balls into the box. Folk said the same with Kane at Tottenham when he left. 

 

I do agree though our other attacking players are too wasteful infront of goal and don't possess anywhere near the cutting edge of Shankland. Without Shankland we would be toiling for goals which is why we must recruit two strikers in the summer. I would rather take a punt on players who have banged them in at a lower level than an older player from a better league with an average track record.

 

I wouldn't say winning a game by two clear goals is a measure of anything. Once two goals up I would rather we kept the ball and saw the game out than go for another goal. Our city rivals have chucked loads of leads away by doing that exact thing. Haven't watched many of their games but that seems to be a common complaint amongst them. One goal leads in tight games often involves a team seeing the game out. I would say this year a lot of the teams in the league have improved. Killie and Dundee the obvious ones but St Mirren have performed well again. I can't remember many games across the league which have been hammerings this season outwith the OF.

 

As you said, it is clear the club recognise this issue with signings two attacking mids in Dhanda and Spittal. The striker signings will likely define how next season goes. 

[RustyRightPeg]

45 minutes ago, Lord Beni of Gorgie said:

Just watched the game again, we actually played pretty decent the middle 70 minutes.

 

Mistakes have cost us, in no way have we shit the bed or been outplayed, quite the reverse. We try to hold onto the ball, play it around the whole game, shitting it would be lumping it.

 

Unfortunately we are a half yard off it in the final third, if we are that bit sharper we get a couple of goals, seems to be a recurring theme against Rangers and Rangers alone.

 

September the 23rd was the last time we failed to score against any other team, in that time we have played Rangers 5 times, losing 2-1 and 3-1, the last 3 games 1-0 5-0 2-0.

 

We really have a problem with Rangers, alone

 

It wasn't bad, but did at any point anything get you up off your seat and screaming encouragement...didn't for me. It was all a bit huff and puff. Even Oda's chance was a bit like eugh, it wasn't a good strike, he was off balance and it went straight down the middle. Shanklands header, could see from the other side of the goal he'd gone the wrong side of Butland and he was never gonna score.

 

There wasn't enough intensity in the performance. Bar Vargas nicking the ball off Souttar, there was no powerful bursts at their defence. I'm discounting Forrest's run because others have shown on other threads he should've passed it 3 separate times.

 

We played well in possession because Rangers let us IMO. If they didn't get us on their initial press, they just sat off us knowing we had very little to break them down.  

[The Real Maroonblood]

3 hours ago, GinRummy said:

I’d bet we don’t get major surgery.  Naisy pretty much said that he doesn’t like sweeping changes or words to that effect. 

That’s pretty worrying.

[Dazo]

6 minutes ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

That’s pretty worrying.

It’s worrying he doesn’t like sleeping changes ? Surely you don’t think that. 

[GinRummy]

11 minutes ago, The Real Maroonblood said:

That’s pretty worrying.

For me it depends on the quality of the player. I think there was one season Levein brought in 19 players. You can go a bit nuts signing lots of players. 

[Gambo]

18 hours ago, Diego10 said:

Because they have far more money and consequently better players than the other teams?

But that argument about money goes out the window when we play the mighty Ross C etc????🙄

[kingantti1874]

3 hours ago, Gambo said:

But that argument about money goes out the window when we play the mighty Ross C etc????🙄

Sorry its just a really moronic point that deserves to be called out.  
 

we do spend more than Ross County and consequently, we are in general terms better than them - agreed? Good !

 

but our playing wage bill is maybe £6m more than Ross county !! 
 

Rangers playing wage bill is well north of £40million.  Nearly £40million more than ours . That’s 20 players on £20/30k per week when your include all of the other costs.  
 

You can’t seriously think the difference between us and Ross county and us and rangers is the same.  It’s not. And frankly it’s ****ing stupid to suggest that it is. 
 

Equally. Nothing is guaranteed in sport, there are multiple factors.  

Edited April 24 by kingantti1874

[Bazzas right boot]

Why is that every time someone beats the OF some folk then use that team as a yard stick for Hearts and use it to beat the club up with.

 

The OF normally lose max 3/4 games to non OF teams a season, they won't all be against us.

 

Aberdeen,  Ross county all being used as examples as trams that play well v them- both bottom 6.

Killie with their shite pitch and who can't beat us this season.

 

It's bat shit mental, some folks first thought really must be " why can't we do that" when a random club gets a one of result v them.

Second thought is I'll post on jkb and use it to highlight how shite we are.

 

 

 

 

It's clear every club has a shite record v them and the odd wins that clubs do get is not down a special tactic that we've missed, it's just football.

 

Our record v rangers is honking,  so is ours v celtic- folk have just forgetten as we've beaten them twice recently- we still have a poor record v them.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited April 25 by Bazzas right boot

[Sir PH]

1 minute ago, Bazzas right boot said:

Why is that every time someone beats the OF some folk the use that team as a yard stick for Hearts and use it to beat the club up with.

 

The OF normally lose max 3/4 games to non OF teams a season, they won't all be against us.

 

Aberdeen,  Ross county all being used as examples as trams that play well v them- both bottom 6.

Killie with their shite pitch and who can't beat us this season as well.

 

It's bat shit mental, some folks first though really must be " why can't we do that" when Aaron random club gets a 1 of result v them.

Second thought is I'll post on jkb and use it to highlight how shite we are.

 

 

 

 

It's clear every club has a shite record v them and the odd wins that clubs do get is not down a special tactic that we've missed, it's just football.

 

Our record v ramgers is honking,  so is ours v celtic- folk have just forgetten as we've beaten them twice recently- we still have a poor record v them.

 

 

 

 

 

 

So Killie giving Rangers a proper test every time they play has nothing to do with tactics? Interesting......

[Jim Panzee]

2 minutes ago, Sir PH said:

So Killie giving Rangers a proper test every time they play has nothing to do with tactics? Interesting......

 

posted this yesterday - kille v sevco -last 50 games.

 

[Sir PH]

8 minutes ago, Jim Panzee said:

 

posted this yesterday - kille v sevco -last 50 games.

 

When was the last time Rangers gave Kilmarnock a proper humping? 9 times out of 10 they are tight games, with only one goal separating them. 

[Carter]

52 minutes ago, Sir PH said:

So Killie giving Rangers a proper test every time they play has nothing to do with tactics? Interesting......

That particular poster never misses an opportunity to take aim at fellow supporters. Very strange behaviour.

[Sir PH]

46 minutes ago, Carter said:

That particular poster never misses an opportunity to take aim at fellow supporters. Very strange behaviour.

He's blind when it comes to Hearts. He backed Levein and Neilson to the hilt, including the Livi and Brora disasters. His opinion means very, very little. 

[Jim Panzee]

2 hours ago, Sir PH said:

When was the last time Rangers gave Kilmarnock a proper humping? 9 times out of 10 they are tight games, with only one goal separating them. 

no idea mate as I only watch out for scores.

 

killie still lose though, still don't get a point and again - on average - finish below us in the league.

 

Obvs get your point that it's frustrating some games killie v sevco games have closer scorelines - but think killie's pitch and sevco knowing they don't need to up their game against them are factors.

 

From our off the field investments, I think the club are focusing all they can on allowing Hearts to bring more expensive players to the club. That's really what is going to close the gap - the other option is keeping budget the same and finding a McInnes / Steve Clarke type manager with a bit of Jesus Christ thrown in to somehow get (relatively) average players to punch way way above their weight.

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

19 hours ago, RustyRightPeg said:

 

It wasn't bad, but did at any point anything get you up off your seat and screaming encouragement...didn't for me. It was all a bit huff and puff. Even Oda's chance was a bit like eugh, it wasn't a good strike, he was off balance and it went straight down the middle. Shanklands header, could see from the other side of the goal he'd gone the wrong side of Butland and he was never gonna score.

 

There wasn't enough intensity in the performance. Bar Vargas nicking the ball off Souttar, there was no powerful bursts at their defence. I'm discounting Forrest's run because others have shown on other threads he should've passed it 3 separate times.

 

We played well in possession because Rangers let us IMO. If they didn't get us on their initial press, they just sat off us knowing we had very little to break them down.  

The pass to Shankland was never on, Grant was open, the pictures shown earlier are a bit Spot the Ball. Rangers are covering Shankland as they did all afternoon, it did free Grant had he disguised a pass to Shankland.

 

Tend to agree it didnt scream encouragement, but I could say that nearly every week, yet we win. Because we show patience. 

[boag1874]

Couldn’t give two shiny shites what other teams have managed to beat Rangers more often than us tbh. Our record is poor and we will need to change it but I don’t see how saying “this diddy team managed a result against them” matters with regards to hearts other than if they finish above us in the league with results v the OF being the difference.

[RustyRightPeg]

21 minutes ago, Lord Beni of Gorgie said:

The pass to Shankland was never on, Grant was open, the pictures shown earlier are a bit Spot the Ball. Rangers are covering Shankland as they did all afternoon, it did free Grant had he disguised a pass to Shankland.

 

Tend to agree it didnt scream encouragement, but I could say that nearly every week, yet we win. Because we show patience. 

 

It was if he played it first time. After his first touch he also could've passed it inside to Grant, who in tow could've went left or right to either Shankland or Vargas in a 3v2 situation. It was the worst possible choice he could've made. 

 

It's a one off game though. He spent the whole week preaching we'd learned since the November game at Hampden. Did you see any improvement? I didn't from an offensive perspective. Go at them - they were so frail coming into that game and we let them off the hook. It was shite. 

[Dazo]

54 minutes ago, boag1874 said:

Couldn’t give two shiny shites what other teams have managed to beat Rangers more often than us tbh. Our record is poor and we will need to change it but I don’t see how saying “this diddy team managed a result against them” matters with regards to hearts other than if they finish above us in the league with results v the OF being the difference.

Another one gets it. Ross county ffs. 

[The Old Tolbooth]

On 23/04/2024 at 23:27, cazzyy said:

 

That's a better post than the one screaming for players to get emptied that you put up before.

If those players go do you think we would just stick with the shite that's left? I reckon we'd probably try to replace them.

I think Dhanda and Penrice could be great additions, no idea how we replace Beni and Shanks though, two very high quality players that don’t come along too often for clubs like us, also, a less flippant tone would be nice, thanks 👍

[boag1874]

2 minutes ago, Dazo said:

Another one gets it. Ross county ffs. 

I just don’t get it. Great, they got their first ever win v Rangers, they can enjoy that huge result while being favourites to finish 2nd bottom, about to lose their talisman to Hearts in the summer and early exits in both cups, while we seal Europe and potentially hit our best points total in over 15 years. I know where I’d rather be.

[John Findlay]

17 minutes ago, boag1874 said:

I just don’t get it. Great, they got their first ever win v Rangers, they can enjoy that huge result while being favourites to finish 2nd bottom, about to lose their talisman to Hearts in the summer and early exits in both cups, while we seal Europe and potentially hit our best points total in over 15 years. I know where I’d rather be.

Yes exactly.

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

1 hour ago, RustyRightPeg said:

 

It was if he played it first time. After his first touch he also could've passed it inside to Grant, who in tow could've went left or right to either Shankland or Vargas in a 3v2 situation. It was the worst possible choice he could've made. 

 

It's a one off game though. He spent the whole week preaching we'd learned since the November game at Hampden. Did you see any improvement? I didn't from an offensive perspective. Go at them - they were so frail coming into that game and we let them off the hook. It was shite. 

We aren't changing our style for any one off game, its as simple as that, to this point its been more successful than not, regardless of opponent. Shapes may change etc, but we are never going to be a blood and thunder team with the current management team.

[Bazzas right boot]

On 24/04/2024 at 14:21, Ricardo Quaresma said:

 

But we comfortably dealt with celtic twice, home and away, a team rangers can't beat?

 

Our record is poor v them as well, we went on a big winless run v them as well, these 2 games are just the same as a random team beating rangers.

 

It happens from time to time, but ultimately if you take 20 games v them you'll be lucky if a team has 2/3 wins.

 

I thought that was the best we played v Rangers.

 

In the 1-2, it would have been a great win, but luck is involved.

There's the stats from that day.

 

We competed and played much better on Sunday imo, the early shitty goal was the frustration for me.

 

Ultimately every club has a poor record v them both, but will win now and then.

 

 

[Gillsland jack]

Our inability to just tackle Dessers in our box, at the first goal, the more I watch it the more frustrated I become.

[Ricardo Quaresma]

1 hour ago, Bazzas right boot said:

 

Our record is poor v them as well, we went on a big winless run v them as well, these 2 games are just the same as a random team beating rangers.

 

It happens from time to time, but ultimately if you take 20 games v them you'll be lucky if a team has 2/3 wins.

 

I thought that was the best we played v Rangers.

 

In the 1-2, it would have been a great win, but luck is involved.

There's the stats from that day.

 

We competed and played much better on Sunday imo, the early shitty goal was the frustration for me.

 

Ultimately every club has a poor record v them both, but will win now and then.

 

 

 

The thing people are highlighting is that there is a 'the rangers' problem

 

Head to head, they are the most pressing concern

[Bazzas right boot]

3 minutes ago, Ricardo Quaresma said:

 

The thing people are highlighting is that there is a 'the rangers' problem

 

Head to head, they are the most pressing concern

 

It was celtic a few seasons ago.

 

I'd be happy with building on our wins v the other ten, games v celtic/ Rangers don't concern me too much.

 

I'd like to beat Aberdeen away, no real excuse fuor that and v hibs, especially at home we really don't beat them enough- too many draws.

Killie also have a great record at Tynecastle is recent seasons.

 

Lots of areas to improve,  the Rangers fascination is getting a little boring.

 

When we do beat them, it won't reverse anything, it will just put folk at rest,  when in reality a win or two in between 10/12/20 non wins doesn't really change the landscape of the fixture,  it will just make folk feel better.

 

If we continue ti be top 3/4, we'll get better and stronger and right many of these wrongs.

 

I'm not putting the weight of history on this or next seasons Hearts team, imo it's irrelevant,  let's just continue this form and improvement. 

 

 

[Ricardo Quaresma]

55 minutes ago, Bazzas right boot said:

 

It was celtic a few seasons ago.

 

I'd be happy with building on our wins v the other ten, games v celtic/ Rangers don't concern me too much.

 

I'd like to beat Aberdeen away, no real excuse fuor that and v hibs, especially at home we really don't beat them enough- too many draws.

Killie also have a great record at Tynecastle is recent seasons.

 

Lots of areas to improve,  the Rangers fascination is getting a little boring.

 

When we do beat them, it won't reverse anything, it will just put folk at rest,  when in reality a win or two in between 10/12/20 non wins doesn't really change the landscape of the fixture,  it will just make folk feel better.

 

If we continue ti be top 3/4, we'll get better and stronger and right many of these wrongs.

 

I'm not putting the weight of history on this or next seasons Hearts team, imo it's irrelevant,  let's just continue this form and improvement.

 

Yes, let's do that, nobody will ask any questions as there'll be none to ask

 

The longer it continues to be the case, however, that performances are lesser than we have seen from most of the team, the louder the moans are going to get

 

Next game's the last of our Season, it's going to be interesting

[Gambo]

23 hours ago, kingantti1874 said:

 

Edited April 25 by Gambo

[Bazzas right boot]

51 minutes ago, Ricardo Quaresma said:

 

Yes, let's do that, nobody will ask any questions as there'll be none to ask

 

The longer it continues to be the case, however, that performances are lesser than we have seen from most of the team, the louder the moans are going to get

 

Next game's the last of our Season, it's going to be interesting

 

I won't be getting my knickers in a twist either way. 

It will keep the moaners happy tho, especially when the slimings are pick.

 

It's been a good season whether we beat rangers or not.

I certainly won't be comparing Hearts to Ross county,  killie, Aberdeen etc or looking to them for inspiration.

 

Rangers might not lose another game this season and  it won't make us better or worse if we beat them.

 

 

[Go for it 1308]

Close thread maybe? 

[The Real Maroonblood]

25 minutes ago, Go for it 1308 said:

Close thread maybe? 

[Hectormasson]

On 24/04/2024 at 15:23, CaptainShanks said:

The question would be how much of that is down to players seeking out Shankland when it comes to crosses/balls into the box. Folk said the same with Kane at Tottenham when he left. 

 

I do agree though our other attacking players are too wasteful infront of goal and don't possess anywhere near the cutting edge of Shankland. Without Shankland we would be toiling for goals which is why we must recruit two strikers in the summer. I would rather take a punt on players who have banged them in at a lower level than an older player from a better league with an average track record.

 

I wouldn't say winning a game by two clear goals is a measure of anything. Once two goals up I would rather we kept the ball and saw the game out than go for another goal. Our city rivals have chucked loads of leads away by doing that exact thing. Haven't watched many of their games but that seems to be a common complaint amongst them. One goal leads in tight games often involves a team seeing the game out. I would say this year a lot of the teams in the league have improved. Killie and Dundee the obvious ones but St Mirren have performed well again. I can't remember many games across the league which have been hammerings this season outwith the OF.

 

As you said, it is clear the club recognise this issue with signings two attacking mids in Dhanda and Spittal. The striker signings will likely define how next season goes. 

🤞🤞🤞🤞🤞🤞🤞🇱🇻🇱🇻🇱🇻🇱🇻🇱🇻🇱🇻

[gar jambo]

On 24/04/2024 at 14:45, rudi must stay said:

I understand shitebags is a common phrase, unfortunately it's down to talent, they have players worth alot more than us. And a cup semi final they're going to show up in a game like that. Fouling isn't the answer, refs are quite happy to send our players off.

Nothing to do with naismith this was 2 shocking errors I just watched the game back! The first goal we had 3 chanced to clear the first goal then it's plan B, 1 player runs at 3 players for the second then 2 chances he had before scoring! We also had the Oda chance and vargas who froze so it was quite equal! But yes they took their 2 chances!