Cup Replays

[Pasquale for King]

40 minutes ago, jambo1975 said:

Could be easily addressed by seeding teams up to a later stage.

Been addressed, done. Move on.

[4marsbars]

It occurs to me that the two biggest Tynecastle/ Easter Rd football crowds I've experienced were cup quarter-final replays, Hearts v Celtic in 72 and Hibs v Rangers in 73.

 

But I think football has moved on. Going to one-off games nowadays is expensive and fans deserve to get a result. Initially, I thought settling Cup Finals by penalties was crazy, but think of the investment fans make on a Cup Final day. 

 

In 1979, they replayed twice, eventually in front of 30,000, the first two ties a tedium fest (so it is reported).

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1979_Scottish_Cup_final

 

Reluctantly, I think that no replays at any stage is the right decision.

[Nookie Bear]

19 hours ago, Jim_Duncan said:

Imagine Hibs get one. Boyle would probably take it past the keeper and dive. 

 

Actually, what happened if a player was brought down by the keeper? Would he get a penalty or just given the goal?

[davemclaren]

The 1979 Scottish Cup final had two replays with Hibs eventually losing. 😎

[dannymack]

29 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

The 1979 Scottish Cup final had two replays with Hibs eventually losing. 😎

 

Before 2016 the Pub Quiz question was who was the last Hibs player to score the winning goal in a Scottish Cup Final ? 

[davemclaren]

1 minute ago, dannymack said:

 

Before 2016 the Pub Quiz question was who was the last Hibs player to score the winning goal in a Scottish Cup Final ? 

Arthur - iirc. 😄

[dannymack]

2 hours ago, 4marsbars said:

It occurs to me that the two biggest Tynecastle/ Easter Rd football crowds I've experienced were cup quarter-final replays, Hearts v Celtic in 72 and Hibs v Rangers in 73.

 

But I think football has moved on. Going to one-off games nowadays is expensive and fans deserve to get a result. Initially, I thought settling Cup Finals by penalties was crazy, but think of the investment fans make on a Cup Final day. 

 

In 1979, they replayed twice, eventually in front of 30,000, the first two ties a tedium fest (so it is reported).

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1979_Scottish_Cup_final

 

Reluctantly, I think that no replays at any stage is the right decision.

 

Too young for the Rangers replay in 1968 ? 

Tynecastle bursting at the seems saw a  Donald Ford winning goal with minutes to go. 

[dannymack]

3 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

Arthur - iirc. 😄

😏

[davemclaren]

2 minutes ago, dannymack said:

😏

I remember listening to the match live on the radio and getting nervous...until Arthur scored. 😎

 

He was a good player though. 

[Pasquale for King]

2 hours ago, 4marsbars said:

It occurs to me that the two biggest Tynecastle/ Easter Rd football crowds I've experienced were cup quarter-final replays, Hearts v Celtic in 72 and Hibs v Rangers in 73.

 

But I think football has moved on. Going to one-off games nowadays is expensive and fans deserve to get a result. Initially, I thought settling Cup Finals by penalties was crazy, but think of the investment fans make on a Cup Final day. 

 

In 1979, they replayed twice, eventually in front of 30,000, the first two ties a tedium fest (so it is reported).

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1979_Scottish_Cup_final

 

Reluctantly, I think that no replays at any stage is the right decision.

I think by the dates of those games you’ve proved the game has moved on. 

[4marsbars]

1 hour ago, dannymack said:

 

Too young for the Rangers replay in 1968 ? 

Tynecastle bursting at the seems saw a  Donald Ford winning goal with minutes to go. 

 

Yes, too young. But I was allowed to stay up late (actually summoned from my bed by my dad) to watch the highlights. Problem was, as everyone here of a certain age knows well, the footage of extra time didn't make it to the BBC studios in time to be edited into the programme.

 

And I got to go to the 1968 final. Great expectations met the Hampden experience, to be a recurring theme. 

 

[4marsbars]

34 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

I think by the dates of those games you’ve proved the game has moved on. 

 

Especially its pricing structure, and the need to buy a ticket in advance nowadays. First two cup finals I attended were pay at the gate. 1968 was probably no more than 20p at the boys gate (4 shillings then). A normal league game was 12.5 pence. I sound like my granddad.

 

[upgotheheads]

The game has lost its connection with the people but that has been going on for years. There might be an argument for doing away with replays from the last 16 or the last 8, but before that, when the smaller teams are involved, the big teams have the resources to play two games in a tie.

 

 

[DesertDawg]

12 hours ago, 4marsbars said:

 

Yes, too young. But I was allowed to stay up late (actually summoned from my bed by my dad) to watch the highlights. Problem was, as everyone here of a certain age knows well, the footage of extra time didn't make it to the BBC studios in time to be edited into the programme.

 

And I got to go to the 1968 final. Great expectations met the Hampden experience, to be a recurring theme. 

 

But they did show it later, just before "Late Call," of all things, well after midnight if I remember correctly.

 

Nothing like being there though.  I was just to the left of the goal at the school end where visting fans are located now, when, with just a couple of minutes left, Donald Ford got the ball from a throw-in near the old stand dugout, pushed it past the Rangers' left back on the outside, sprinted past him on the inside then re-connected with the ball that he then swept right inside the far post.  Cue complete bedlam in the school end, the old stand and the Wheatfield covered terracing as well as  total silence from the hordes behind the Gorgie Road goal.   

 

A once in a lifetime experience, from the days of replays. 😁

[John Findlay]

22 hours ago, davemclaren said:

The 1979 Scottish Cup final had two replays with Hibs eventually losing. 😎

Up until 2016, Arthur Duncan was the Hibs player to score a winner in a Scottish Cup final😉.

[AC Mallin_51]

With the amount of games we’re potentially gonna have to play in Europe next year I think cup replays are the last thing we’d need. I’m glad they’re a thing of the past 

[4marsbars]

15 hours ago, DesertDawg said:

But they did show it later, just before "Late Call," of all things, well after midnight if I remember correctly.

 

Nothing like being there though.  I was just to the left of the goal at the school end where visting fans are located now, when, with just a couple of minutes left, Donald Ford got the ball from a throw-in near the old stand dugout, pushed it past the Rangers' left back on the outside, sprinted past him on the inside then re-connected with the ball that he then swept right inside the far post.  Cue complete bedlam in the school end, the old stand and the Wheatfield covered terracing as well as  total silence from the hordes behind the Gorgie Road goal.   

 

A once in a lifetime experience, from the days of replays. 😁

 

I've never seen a clip of that goal. Donald Ford, give us a goal, the song of my youth.

[DesertDawg]

3 hours ago, 4marsbars said:

 

I've never seen a clip of that goal. Donald Ford, give us a goal, the song of my youth.

Given that the BBC used real film back then it's probably been destroyed or just deteriorated in some basement or other.

[john thomas]

3 hours ago, 4marsbars said:

 

I've never seen a clip of that goal. Donald Ford, give us a goal, the song of my youth.

Media of the day kept telling us Rangers didn't lose replays

[DesertDawg]

Here's another one from the following season about six months later.

 

 

[4marsbars]

52 minutes ago, DesertDawg said:

Here's another one from the following season about six months later.

 

 

 

 

I remember that one. 

[Samuel Camazzola]

On 18/04/2024 at 13:54, The Real Maroonblood said:

Remember they tried the Golden Goal at the 2004 Euros.

'Silver Goal'. As others mentioned, this replaced the golden goal from the two previous tournaments. 

[martoon]

On 19/04/2024 at 10:11, davemclaren said:

I remember listening to the match live on the radio and getting nervous...until Arthur scored. 😎

 

He was a good player though. 

 

I remember watching the original 0-0 on telly but have no memory of the 1st replay.

 

I do remember listening to the 2nd replay on the radio with a Hibs supporting pal and wanting them to win.

 

Tbf, I wasn't quite 11 yo back then and was not full of the bile and hatred I now have toward that 5h1tty wee club and it's vile, emailing fanbase. 😊

[davemclaren]

22 minutes ago, martoon said:

 

I remember watching the original 0-0 on telly but have no memory of the 1st replay.

 

I do remember listening to the 2nd replay on the radio with a Hibs supporting pal and wanting them to win.

 

Tbf, I wasn't quite 11 yo back then and was not full of the bile and hatred I now have toward that 5h1tty wee club and it's vile, emailing fanbase. 😊

😄

[dannymack]

On 19/04/2024 at 11:09, 4marsbars said:

 

Yes, too young. But I was allowed to stay up late (actually summoned from my bed by my dad) to watch the highlights. Problem was, as everyone here of a certain age knows well, the footage of extra time didn't make it to the BBC studios in time to be edited into the programme.

 

And I got to go to the 1968 final. Great expectations met the Hampden experience, to be a recurring theme. 

 

 

[4marsbars]

19 hours ago, dannymack said:

 

I think my dad probably made the right call to give this game a miss.

 

Random memory kicks in.

Bizarrely, I had attended an Ibrox replay in the previous round. They beat Dundee 4-1 after extra time (the same round we beat Dundee Utd 6-5). A pal's dad was a big Dundee fan and took a carload through. That was a late night, extended by a stop for chips in Bathgate on the way home (a school-night).

[dannymack]

21 minutes ago, 4marsbars said:

I think my dad probably made the right call to give this game a miss.

 

Random memory kicks in.

Bizarrely, I had attended an Ibrox replay in the previous round. They beat Dundee 4-1 after extra time (the same round we beat Dundee Utd 6-5). A pal's dad was a big Dundee fan and took a carload through. That was a late night, extended by a stop for chips in Bathgate on the way home (a school-night).

 

Dundee v Rangers kicked off slightly earlier then Dundee Utd v Hearts at 2pm.

 

33k at Dens, just over 9k at Tannadice.  

 

Aerial images as the two games were being played. 

 

 

 

[The Real Maroonblood]

3 hours ago, 4marsbars said:

I think my dad probably made the right call to give this game a miss.

 

Random memory kicks in.

Bizarrely, I had attended an Ibrox replay in the previous round. They beat Dundee 4-1 after extra time (the same round we beat Dundee Utd 6-5). A pal's dad was a big Dundee fan and took a carload through. That was a late night, extended by a stop for chips in Bathgate on the way home (a school-night).

Was at the United game.

 

[Marty-man]

I've been having a few "discussions" about this on twitter

I just don't understand how any football fan is in favour of replays, especially in a country dominated by very large clubs. It detracts from the romance of the cup where any team can get a result on the day. Yes - the media always go on about the finances for smaller clubs, and I understand that argument, but that is mainly the focus of Chairmen and club owners. It does NOTHING for us - the fans.  Surely the romance of the cup is evident when minnows are knocking out the big sides. Scrapping replays increases the chance of that happening.

 

Look at it here in Scotland. Prior to the change, how many times had we seen battling draws at home against the Old Firm over the decades, only to be on the end of the inevitable humping in the return leg in Glasgow? Replays really did benefit the Old Firm. Without replays, the underdog has a much better chance to progress.  The chances of the minnow actually winning the tie increases.

You will see far more cup shocks and defeats for the 'big teams' after extra time and penalties. Replays are good for clubs' bank accounts but bad for the fans and entertainment as a whole. Any fans complaining about this are just buying the spin from the money men at their club.

And I'm hearing it from fans of lower league clubs in England who are against scrapping replays. It's just nuts. As a football fan what is better for the fan experience? What will go down in history more? Knocking out a team three/four divisions above you? Or having a good day out on the lash, at a "big ground". I just don't get it.

I've just watched the second season of the Wrexham doc and been reminded of a perfect example: Last season when non-league Wrexham were at home to Sheffield Utd in the cup  (a full three leagues higher than them and about to be promoted to the Premier League), the match finished 3-3. In the replay at Bramall Lane, inevitably ... Sheffield Utd beat them 3-1. Wrexham would have had a far better chance of winning the tie if that 1st game was played to a finish.

I just can't understand why many football fans seem to want a "nice day out" rather than their team giving the big teams a bloody nose and going through to the next round.

Can someone please explain to me, without going on about money, why football fans would want this? What do replays actually do for the game and and the fan experience?

Edited April 22 by Marty-man

[Pasquale for King]

On 19/04/2024 at 11:13, 4marsbars said:

 

Especially its pricing structure, and the need to buy a ticket in advance nowadays. First two cup finals I attended were pay at the gate. 1968 was probably no more than 20p at the boys gate (4 shillings then). A normal league game was 12.5 pence. I sound like my granddad.

 

Exactly. I don’t even remember my first one in 76, probably a good thing. 

[Pasquale for King]

5 minutes ago, Marty-man said:

Yeah - I've been having a few "discussions" about this on twitter

I just don't understand how any football fan is in favour of replays, especially in a country dominated by very large clubs. It detracts from the romance of the cup where any team can get a result on the day. Yes - the media always go on about the finances for smaller clubs, and I understand that argument, but that is mainly the focus of Chairmen and club owners. It does NOTHING for us - the fans.  Surely the romance of the cup is evident when minnows are knocking out the big sides. Scrapping replays increases the chance of that happening.

 

Look at it here in Scotland. Prior to the change, how many times had we seen battling draws at home against the Old Firm over the decades, only to be on the end of the inevitable humping in the return leg in Glasgow? Replays really did benefit the Old Firm. Without replays, the underdog has a much better chance to progress.  The chances of the minnow actually winning the tie increases.

You will see far more cup shocks and defeats for the 'big teams' after extra time and penalties. Replays are good for clubs' bank accounts but bad for the fans and entertainment as a whole. Any fans complaining about this are just buying the spin from the money men at their club.

And I'm hearing it from fans of lower league clubs in England who are against scrapping replays. It's just nuts. As a football fan what is better for the fan experience? What will go down in history more? Knocking out a team three/four divisions above you? Or having a good day out on the lash, at a "big ground". I just don't get it.

I've just watched the second season of the Wrexham doc and been reminded of a perfect example: Last season when non-league Wrexham were at home to Sheffield Utd in the cup  (a full three leagues higher than them and about to be promoted to the Premier) League, the match finished 3-3. In the replay at Bramall Lane, inevitably ... Sheffield Utd beat them 3-1. Wrexham would have had a far better chance of winning the tie if that 1st game was played to a finish.

I just can't understand why many football fans seem to want a "nice day out" rather than their team giving the big teams a bloody nose and going through to the next round.

Can someone please explain to me, without going on about money, why football fans would want this? What do replays actually do for the game and and the fan experience?

I couple be wrong but I just think they don’t like change, look at the furore over VAR, especially when it appears to be driven by foreigners. 

[Mr Benn]

On 19/04/2024 at 07:20, Bungalow Bill said:

We had 2 replays against Killie in the 3rd round, I had no idea. 

 

The first replay had a bit of what the Police saw as "trouble" after Killie scored. There was a big sway at the segregation fence area and people ended up on the trackside. I think people were trying to get away from the crush but the police saw it as trouble and started arresting people. 

[4marsbars]

12 hours ago, Pasquale for King said:

Exactly. I don’t even remember my first one in 76, probably a good thing. 

 

1976 - I got soaked and cold, was ill for a fortnight afterwards. Miserable all round. It was called the North Enclosure in these days but for me it was the North Exposure.