Sooks Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 A lot of people do not realise that Scottish English is a language . It is There are also an abundance of local dialects , and a great many beautiful words What are your favourites ? Mine are Radge , Ken , Nash , Shan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
New Town Loafer Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 Scottish English is just a variety (or varieties) of English spoken in Scotland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgan Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 Just now, New Town Loafer said: Scottish English is just a variety (or varieties) of English spoken in Scotland. Correct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnrazor Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 Nyaff. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morgan Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 Ben the room. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBigO Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 7 minutes ago, Morgan said: Ben the room. I raise you... ben the scullery Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
highlandjambo3 Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 What the fek happened to Aberdeen……where did they get that from……fit like loon………………..or as the dyslectic sheep shagger said to the shoe shop assistant…….fit, fit, fits fit fit.😁 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 11 minutes ago, New Town Loafer said: Scottish English is just a variety (or varieties) of English spoken in Scotland. It's a tough one. The Norman invasion brought a whole bunch of French words in to the English language down south that didn't happen up here. Our "English", or Scots, stayed truer to its Germanic roots. You can still see that with words like licht, coo and kirk. I dunno but I'd guess the Union of the Crowns probably killed Scots as its own distinct language. When the King and Royal Court all start to speak English as opposed to Scots, it's only a matter of time before everyone else does. If that didn't happen, you'd probably see Scots and English develop in a similar way to Portuguese and Spanish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
New Town Loafer Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 19 minutes ago, Norm said: It's a tough one. The Norman invasion brought a whole bunch of French words in to the English language down south that didn't happen up here. Our "English", or Scots, stayed truer to its Germanic roots. You can still see that with words like licht, coo and kirk. I dunno but I'd guess the Union of the Crowns probably killed Scots as its own distinct language. When the King and Royal Court all start to speak English as opposed to Scots, it's only a matter of time before everyone else does. If that didn't happen, you'd probably see Scots and English develop in a similar way to Portuguese and Spanish. Great post and I would tend to agree with your conclusion 👍 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JudyJudyJudy Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 Already been a thread about Scottish colloquial words ! It was Barry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manaliveits105 Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 40 minutes ago, TheBigO said: I raise you... ben the scullery scullery ! You were posh we had one of these and a cooker in the living room In Gorgie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Norm Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 28 minutes ago, JudyJudyJudy said: Already been a thread about Scottish colloquial words ! It was Barry Strangely enough, while "barry" is a Scottish colloquialism, it isn't a Scots word. It's Romani. As is gadgey and radge. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor FinnBarr Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 57 minutes ago, highlandjambo3 said: What the fek happened to Aberdeen……where did they get that from……fit like loon………………..or as the dyslectic sheep shagger said to the shoe shop assistant…….fit, fit, fits fit fit.😁 Doric which I think is a mixture of old Scots and Norse due to the amount of Norsemen that landed in the area. You'll not find it much in Aberdeen nowadays but the likes of Peterhead are still very broad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JudyJudyJudy Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 2 minutes ago, Norm said: Strangely enough, while "barry" is a Scottish colloquialism, it isn't a Scots word. It's Romani. As is gadgey and radge. 👍 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the posh bit Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 6 minutes ago, Doctor FinnBarr said: Doric which I think is a mixture of old Scots and Norse due to the amount of Norsemen that landed in the area. You'll not find it much in Aberdeen nowadays but the likes of Peterhead are still very broad. I raise you Morayshire East. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor FinnBarr Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 26 minutes ago, the posh bit said: I raise you Morayshire East. I know, thats why I said "the likes". I'm well aware how they speak in Portknockie, Cullen etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henrysmithsgloves Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 Fud🤔 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boof Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 Spaegie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnrazor Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 19 minutes ago, Boof said: Spaegie Sparrow? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boof Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 5 minutes ago, Dawnrazor said: Sparrow? Muscle pain caused by lactic acid build up due to overuse of previously underused muscles. Highly noticeable after first football game of season, digging garden etc. It's such a 'one word works' thing that Biology teachers here have to remind pupils NOT to use it in SQA exams which will be marked by folk sooth! You can have spaegie or be spaegied. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ArcticJambo Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 I'm going to chuck in coorie. Might be my favourite. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnrazor Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 Just now, Boof said: Muscle pain caused by lactic acid build up due to overuse of previously underused muscles. Highly noticeable after first football game of season, digging garden etc. It's such a 'one word works' thing that Biology teachers here have to remind pupils NOT to use it in SQA exams which will be marked by folk sooth! You can have spaegie or e spaegied. 👍 I thought it was the correct spelling of Spyuggy(?) meaning a Sparrow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henrysmithsgloves Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 (edited) 51 minutes ago, Dawnrazor said: Sparrow? Speug* spelling? Boaby. Fugly. Keepin shoatie. Edited January 15 by henrysmithsgloves Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Byyy The Light Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 Sleekit Shoogly Rammy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SectionDJambo Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 When I was working, I once was telling my English, but based in Scotland for a number of years, boss what a scunner something was. I got a look of confusion from him and had to explain what a scunner is. He’d never heard it before in his years of living here. I had thought it was used in England too, but maybe not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JudyJudyJudy Posted January 15 Share Posted January 15 “ messages “ as getting them or even bleaching them !!! 😂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sooks Posted January 15 Author Share Posted January 15 5 hours ago, New Town Loafer said: Scottish English is just a variety (or varieties) of English spoken in Scotland. No , there is a Scots language as well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sooks Posted January 15 Author Share Posted January 15 5 hours ago, Morgan said: Correct. Incorrect Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Cockade Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 Scots was a distinct language but probably extinct now although some words remain in use obviously there a lot of Scottish dialects but some of the words mentioned on here are slang rather dialect Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sooks Posted January 16 Author Share Posted January 16 1 minute ago, The White Cockade said: Scots was a distinct language but probably extinct now although some words remain in use obviously there a lot of Scottish dialects but some of the words mentioned on here are slang rather dialect Scots is still an English dialect Scottish is a language Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The White Cockade Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 7 minutes ago, Sooks said: Scots is still an English dialect Scottish is a language the Scottish language was called Scots Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulysses Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 36 minutes ago, Sooks said: No , there is a Scots language as well There is a fair amount of academic disagreement about whether Scots is a dialect or a language. I know two linguists who take a side each in that debate. As an aside, I asked a Manx speaker once what was the difference between a dialect and a language. She replied "an army and a navy". Whether a language or a dialect, Scots is in the same linguistic family as English and Friesian, and is also broadly related to other West Germanic languages including German, Dutch and Luxembourgish. Gàidhlig, on the other hand, is not related to Scots or to English, and is a Goidelic language. It is very similar to Gaelg (Manx) and similar to Gaeilge (Irish), and is a more distant cousin of Welsh, Cornish and Breton. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
highlandjambo3 Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 Gadgy, radge, pagger, and barry…..in a single Edinburgh sentence: “You used to be a barry gadgy but, you’ve turned into a pure radge, I think I’ll pagger you. Im sure the WW2 code deciphers must have use our coded language to beat the Germans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulysses Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 58 minutes ago, JudyJudyJudy said: “ messages “ as getting them or even bleaching them !!! 😂 Messages is used in some places on this side of Ireland to describe groceries, but I'm not sure where we got it. Message, singular, is also used to describe an errand. Where standard English would say "run an errand", Irish people (Dublin people in particular) would say "doing a message" or possibly "going on a message". It is said that this comes from the idea that the original errands that people would be sent on would involved delivering messages to other people. So "message" and "errand" were regarded as having overlapping meanings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazio Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 Just now, highlandjambo3 said: Gadgy, radge, pagger, and barry…..in a single Edinburgh sentence: “You used to be a barry gadgy but, you’ve turned into a pure radge, I think I’ll pagger you. Im sure the WW2 code deciphers must have use our coded language to beat the Germans. As I e mentioned on many of these type of threads the words we consider Edinburgh words are traveller or Romany words. Which explains why some of them appear in places like Northumbria as well. The travellers traditionally moved up and down following the farming seasons so the language moved to the same places. And the traditional home of the king of the gypsies is in Yetholm just on the border. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazio Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 1 minute ago, Ulysses said: Messages is used in some places on this side of Ireland to describe groceries, but I'm not sure where we got it. Message, singular, is also used to describe an errand. Where standard English would say "run an errand", Irish people (Dublin people in particular) would say "doing a message" or possibly "going on a message". It is said that this comes from the idea that the original errands that people would be sent on would involved delivering messages to other people. So "message" and "errand" were regarded as having overlapping meanings. There’s also the conundrum of Ulster Scots. Like the word craic which is a loan word with altered spelling and from the Ulster Scots and Scot’s crack. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henrysmithsgloves Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 https://www.scotsman.com/heritage-and-retro/heritage/scots-leid-native-scottish-language-explained-3743342 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulysses Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 3 minutes ago, Tazio said: There’s also the conundrum of Ulster Scots. Like the word craic which is a loan word with altered spelling and from the Ulster Scots and Scot’s crack. Craic was, AFAIK, a deliberately invented spelling done here in the late 1960s or early 70s, because the Irish language doesn't use the letter k. I was taken to task and given the "correct" spelling in 1978, so it was around before then. But the word taken into Irish was "crack", and AFAIK it was taken from Ulster Scots. Apparently its origins go back to Middle English, where "crak" was "loud chat". The spread of Scots into the east of Ulster echoes an earlier spread of Gàidhlig into Ulster. Gàidhlig and Gaeilge are hauntingly similar but frustratingly different. They look quite similar, but a lot of the time they don't sound the same. But the strongest connections between - or across - the languages was to be found in the south-west of Scotland, the Isle of Man and south-east Ulster. One theory is that the ancient Irish brought their language to Scotland, the two languages evolved and diverged, and the Scots then brought their language or elements of it back to south-east Ulster and into the Isle of Man. Another is that there was a common language with sub-dialects across the whole region perhaps 1800-2000 years ago, and that they then evolved in different directions over the centuries. Although they went in different directions, the sea links between the south-west of Scotland, the south-east of Ulster and the Isle of Man meant that many words and phrases ended up being shared by people in all three areas. If that sounds strange, keep in mind that until the Victorian era it was easier for a person in south-western Scotland to travel by boat to the Isle of Man or Ulster than to travel overland to the Highlands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazio Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 It’s interesting how the Isle Of Man is sort of forgotten a lot in terms of history and where it sits in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henrysmithsgloves Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 54 minutes ago, Tazio said: It’s interesting how the Isle Of Man is sort of forgotten a lot in terms of history and where it sits in it. You can see five kingdoms from its highest peak🧐 Also the three legged symbol on the flag predates history 🧐 According to a podcast I listened to the other day😂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sooks Posted January 16 Author Share Posted January 16 2 hours ago, Ulysses said: There is a fair amount of academic disagreement about whether Scots is a dialect or a language. I know two linguists who take a side each in that debate. As an aside, I asked a Manx speaker once what was the difference between a dialect and a language. She replied "an army and a navy". Whether a language or a dialect, Scots is in the same linguistic family as English and Friesian, and is also broadly related to other West Germanic languages including German, Dutch and Luxembourgish. Gàidhlig, on the other hand, is not related to Scots or to English, and is a Goidelic language. It is very similar to Gaelg (Manx) and similar to Gaeilge (Irish), and is a more distant cousin of Welsh, Cornish and Breton. Indeed . Guess which side I take in that particular debate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ulysses Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 20 minutes ago, Sooks said: Indeed . Guess which side I take in that particular debate And TBH I'm inclined to the same view, mainly because I speak a minority language and that influences my views. One way or the other, I readily admit I'm no expert in the field. I've been dabbling with Gàidhlig recently. Hence my earlier comment about it and Gaeilge being hauntingly similar but frustratingly different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 10 hours ago, Sooks said: A lot of people do not realise that Scottish English is a language . It is There are also an abundance of local dialects , and a great many beautiful words What are your favourites ? Mine are Radge , Ken , Nash , Shan Scots and Scottish English are different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 10 hours ago, New Town Loafer said: Scottish English is just a variety (or varieties) of English spoken in Scotland. Scots is a language. Scottish English is just accents with the odd word thrown in. 10 hours ago, Morgan said: Correct. If you're both trying to say Scots isn't a language you're full of shit. And fwiw, no-one on hear can speak early Scots or Middle English, its feck all like the language imposed on Scotland. Christ English from the 1800 would be struggle. 3 hours ago, Ulysses said: Craic was, AFAIK, a deliberately invented spelling done here in the late 1960s or early 70s, because the Irish language doesn't use the letter k. I was taken to task and given the "correct" spelling in 1978, so it was around before then. But the word taken into Irish was "crack", and AFAIK it was taken from Ulster Scots. Apparently its origins go back to Middle English, where "crak" was "loud chat". The spread of Scots into the east of Ulster echoes an earlier spread of Gàidhlig into Ulster. Gàidhlig and Gaeilge are hauntingly similar but frustratingly different. They look quite similar, but a lot of the time they don't sound the same. But the strongest connections between - or across - the languages was to be found in the south-west of Scotland, the Isle of Man and south-east Ulster. One theory is that the ancient Irish brought their language to Scotland, the two languages evolved and diverged, and the Scots then brought their language or elements of it back to south-east Ulster and into the Isle of Man. Another is that there was a common language with sub-dialects across the whole region perhaps 1800-2000 years ago, and that they then evolved in different directions over the centuries. Although they went in different directions, the sea links between the south-west of Scotland, the south-east of Ulster and the Isle of Man meant that many words and phrases ended up being shared by people in all three areas. If that sounds strange, keep in mind that until the Victorian era it was easier for a person in south-western Scotland to travel by boat to the Isle of Man or Ulster than to travel overland to the Highlands. They argue all they want. Scots may have originated from invisible, but it has incorporated separate additions from what would become English. The great vowel shift being the biggest change. Anyone who thinks the Anglos and their language of immigrants from 1500 years ago still exist are delusion. Triggers brush . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 4 hours ago, Sooks said: Scots is still an English dialect Scottish is a language You have that back to front. Scottish Gaelic, Scots and Scottish English are the three languages used in Scotland. Mostly English with Scottish accent m, since we were colonised and recognised 10 years ago. You'll have the thick ***** who believe we are all the same people and speak English, delusion hoosejocks who should just go to England. Embarrassing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 Norwegian and Swedish are pretty much the same language. Coming from Old Norse. Both now have their own armed forces, so speak Norwegian and Swedish. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i wish jj was my dad Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 It would be a shame to lose local dialects and auld Scots. We'll all end up speaking like Cary Grant if that happens. I remember being mocked in my early days at work because of my quite broad, schemey accent and I unconsciously softened it over time. Because of that I've developed my own unconscious bias when I hear people speaking in public with a broad accent. I even noticed it yesterday in a meeting. I was less interested in what was being said than how they were saying it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 (edited) Let's not make out we could understand Braid Scoats fauk speaking Braid Scoats in times before the Scottish cringe was beaten into us and The Scots language beaten out of us by Hoosejocks. No-one on hear could read write or speak Braid Scoats from before James VI, so keep your cringe to yourself. Danelaw, Vowel shift, different migration from Northern Europe and Gaelic makes Broad Scots different from Middle English. And two different countries gives two different names of said languages. As for Scottish Standard English, English with a rhotic sound, and scottish accent. Scottish people mostly speak in a continuum of Scottish Standard English and Scots words. Nothing lazy about anything Scots or Scottish, it's just the way it is. Christ have you heard the way Londoners now speak. Give it another 50 years and the English cringe will be in full effect. Edited January 16 by ri Alban Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JudyJudyJudy Posted January 16 Share Posted January 16 7 hours ago, Tazio said: As I e mentioned on many of these type of threads the words we consider Edinburgh words are traveller or Romany words. Which explains why some of them appear in places like Northumbria as well. The travellers traditionally moved up and down following the farming seasons so the language moved to the same places. And the traditional home of the king of the gypsies is in Yetholm just on the border. That’s very interesting , explains a lot . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sooks Posted January 16 Author Share Posted January 16 4 hours ago, ri Alban said: You have that back to front. Scottish Gaelic, Scots and Scottish English are the three languages used in Scotland. Mostly English with Scottish accent m, since we were colonised and recognised 10 years ago. You'll have the thick ***** who believe we are all the same people and speak English, delusion hoosejocks who should just go to England. Embarrassing. Indeed , I got that the wrong way around apologies Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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