Fozzyonthefence Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 12 minutes ago, Chuck Berry said: He didn't though, and yes it was a great stop first half. It was a pretty basic save for a professional goalkeeper. Looked great at first viewing but a pretty comfortable save when seeing the replay. It’s one thing I’ve noticed with Clark, he never really has these “wow” saves that CG seems to pull off regularly. Perhaps that’s why ZC’s backers on here have a tendency to over exaggerate how good his saves are like you just did there. His penalty save at ER was, on the other hand, a great save. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Berry Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 3 minutes ago, Fozzyonthefence said: Third is pretty much done and dusted now and bringing a better keeper isn’t going to jeopardise that situation. I honestly can’t understand that line of thinking. I think CG will keep the gloves after the Morton barring a poor game but time will tell. The line of thinking with GK's is always the gloves holder stays in the starting XI unless his forms dips. That's why Angus Gunn will keep the gloves for Scotland, Gordon won't go back into national squads as No.1 either. We have a lot to be grateful for with having a keeper the quality of Zander Clark available to cover for when CG was injured. He's an international keeper. The desire from some to see him launched is a little disrespectful to him, and we'll still need him when CG inevitably retires. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Berry Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 2 minutes ago, Fozzyonthefence said: It was a pretty basic save for a professional goalkeeper. Looked great at first viewing but a pretty comfortable save when seeing the replay. It’s one thing I’ve noticed with Clark, he never really has these “wow” saves that CG seems to pull off regularly. Perhaps that’s why ZC’s backers on here have a tendency to over exaggerate how good his saves are like you just did there. His penalty save at ER was, on the other hand, a great save. Why are you talking him down? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
A_A wehatethehibs Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 24 minutes ago, Chuck Berry said: Why are you talking him down? Bias. There is, not unfairly, big time man love for Craig Gordon, as one of the best our club has produced. But the manager does not have that bias, does not look at the past, he’s looking 100% at the present day, he’s picking the keeper he feels deserves the gloves at this moment in time. Zander will IMO be in for Celtic. Gordon gets the cup games and therefore will be in for the following game vs Morton. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Berry Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 25 minutes ago, A_A wehatethehibs said: Bias. There is, not unfairly, big time man love for Craig Gordon, as one of the best our club has produced. But the manager does not have that bias, does not look at the past, he’s looking 100% at the present day, he’s picking the keeper he feels deserves the gloves at this moment in time. Zander will IMO be in for Celtic. Gordon gets the cup games and therefore will be in for the following game vs Morton. I love Craig, my all time favourite player alongside Robbo. I can't wait to see him back between the sticks. However, Clark is the man in possession of the gloves in league games, CG in cup games. That's the way it'll remain until loss of form/3rd mathematically secure, and rightly so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Burgundy Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 1 hour ago, Fozzyonthefence said: It was a pretty basic save for a professional goalkeeper. Looked great at first viewing but a pretty comfortable save when seeing the replay. It’s one thing I’ve noticed with Clark, he never really has these “wow” saves that CG seems to pull off regularly. Perhaps that’s why ZC’s backers on here have a tendency to over exaggerate how good his saves are like you just did there. His penalty save at ER was, on the other hand, a great save. Totally agree, anything not close to him goes past him. When he dives he gets no distance or height. I like him but he's a bog standard PL goalie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DS98 Posted March 1 Author Share Posted March 1 1 hour ago, Chuck Berry said: The line of thinking with GK's is always the gloves holder stays in the starting XI unless his forms dips. That's why Angus Gunn will keep the gloves for Scotland, Gordon won't go back into national squads as No.1 either. We have a lot to be grateful for with having a keeper the quality of Zander Clark available to cover for when CG was injured. He's an international keeper. The desire from some to see him launched is a little disrespectful to him, and we'll still need him when CG inevitably retires. If Gunn gets injured and doesn’t make Germany then you better believe Gordon would be number 1, no matter how many games he’s had for us. If it’s Gunn, Clark and Gordon as the goalies and Gunn gets sent off or injured, who do you think Steve Clarke would turn to? There’s only one answer. There is no way in hell Zander Clark would be playing for Scotland in an international tournament whilst Craig Gordon is on the bench. But he does for Hearts. Surreal situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Berry Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 14 minutes ago, DS98 said: If Gunn gets injured and doesn’t make Germany then you better believe Gordon would be number 1, no matter how many games he’s had for us. If it’s Gunn, Clark and Gordon as the goalies and Gunn gets sent off or injured, who do you think Steve Clarke would turn to? There’s only one answer. There is no way in hell Zander Clark would be playing for Scotland in an international tournament whilst Craig Gordon is on the bench. But he does for Hearts. Surreal situation. Of course, but as things stand Angus Gunn is No.1. It's open to speculation who would replace him if he gets injured, the upcoming friendlies I'd expect both to get game time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fozzyonthefence Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 2 hours ago, Chuck Berry said: Why are you talking him down? I think he’s distinctly average. He’s not a promising youngster, he’s 31 and was already in the Scotland squad (albeit I think uncapped) at St Johnstone and once he was available on a free nobody appeared to want to take a punt on him except Hearts as a no 2. That says a lot to me and I’m not overly convinced by his performances (I judge him, like any other player on his performances and not just whether or not he gets a clean sheet). He’ll never play for a bigger club than Hearts. He’s done a mostly decent job as a stand in (a bit like if Boyce came in for Shankland for a season and scored 10/12 goals) but had a fair number of unconvincing games too. However, he’s flappy on cross balls, although generally stays rooted to his line even when it is a keeper’s ball (you could argue similar to Gordon but CG definitely commands his area better as we even saw in his couple of cup games this season), his positioning is sometimes suspect and he’s often slow to react / move his feet. Gordon might be 10 years older but is still much more agile. And he doesn’t bring off those world class saves that we’re so used to seeing CG make. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Berry Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 1 minute ago, Fozzyonthefence said: I think he’s distinctly average. He’s not a promising youngster, he’s 31 and was already in the Scotland squad (albeit I think uncapped) at St Johnstone and once he was available on a free nobody appeared to want to take a punt on him except Hearts as a no 2. That says a lot to me and I’m not overly convinced by his performances (I judge him, like any other player on his performances and not just whether or not he gets a clean sheet). He’ll never play for a bigger club than Hearts. He’s done a mostly decent job as a stand in (a bit like if Boyce came in for Shankland for a season and scored 10/12 goals) but had a fair number of unconvincing games too. However, he’s flappy on cross balls, although generally stays rooted to his line even when it is a keeper’s ball (you could argue similar to Gordon but CG definitely commands his area better as we even saw in his couple of cup games this season), his positioning is sometimes suspect and he’s often slow to react / move his feet. Gordon might be 10 years older but is still much more agile. And he doesn’t bring off those world class saves that we’re so used to seeing CG make. I don't neccesarily disagree with some of that, however Clark is the man in possession of the gloves and like it or not, CG has been out the game for a long time and bringing him back also involves a certain amount of risk, match sharpness etc. Clark has not let us down, and with 9 league games remaining I don't think SN will change it unless he has to. If we reach the Cup Final, there will come a point where we have secured third place and at that point he may bring him back in for remaining league games to get him sharp. However, I do fully expect CG to be installed as No.1 next season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fozzyonthefence Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 25 minutes ago, Chuck Berry said: I don't neccesarily disagree with some of that, however Clark is the man in possession of the gloves and like it or not, CG has been out the game for a long time and bringing him back also involves a certain amount of risk, match sharpness etc. Clark has not let us down, and with 9 league games remaining I don't think SN will change it unless he has to. If we reach the Cup Final, there will come a point where we have secured third place and at that point he may bring him back in for remaining league games to get him sharp. However, I do fully expect CG to be installed as No.1 next season. I agree with most of that although I don’t really buy the “in possession of the gloves” line. Like any other position you should play your best players (yes, of course there will be an element of doubt about CG getting back to near his best). Having said that I think goalkeeper is the least of our concerns right now - the thought of having a defence without either of Halkett or Kent is a frightening thought. On top of the ongoing RB problem and an uncreative midfield and almost complete reliance on Shankland at the other end. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricardo Quaresma Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 4 hours ago, Carter said: To be fair the was some amount of calamity at the goal before ZC became a factor. I still believe Cochrane is primarily culpable at the goal as it became a mess the minute he decided not to contest an aerial dual with Miller and passed the buck to Kingsley. They did catch us in the middle of a forward phase and it didn't cover us in glory, to say the least; I think Cochrane was wary of boyle going to the right and kept himself back for that When they were approaching, Clark heads back to goal to prevent the lob, quite rightly Then, when boyle's inside the box, he should've came out, preventing the shot, forcing a pass which had limited chance of doing them any good; but no, he came out too late, legs open and got 'megged! There were other opportunites for our players to do better than they did at every part of that, but the nutmeg should not be happening Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carter Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 18 minutes ago, Ricardo Quaresma said: They did catch us in the middle of a forward phase and it didn't cover us in glory, to say the least; I think Cochrane was wary of boyle going to the right and kept himself back for that When they were approaching, Clark heads back to goal to prevent the lob, quite rightly Then, when boyle's inside the box, he should've came out, preventing the shot, forcing a pass which had limited chance of doing them any good; but no, he came out too late, legs open and got 'megged! There were other opportunites for our players to do better than they did at every part of that, but the nutmeg should not be happening It should never have got that far though. Cochrane is terrible at the goal. Not only does he put Kingsley in a difficult spot, he also gets in way of Kent. It was calamitous from him. Cochrane is continually poor in games against Rangers, Celtic and Hibs. That's very concerning for a player we clearly have intentions to cash in on at some point. He couldn't handle English Championship level at the moment imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricardo Quaresma Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 (edited) 17 minutes ago, Carter said: It should never have got that far though. Cochrane is terrible at the goal. Not only does he put Kingsley in a difficult spot, he also gets in way of Kent. It was calamitous from him. Cochrane is continually poor in games against Rangers, Celtic and Hibs. That's very concerning for a player we clearly have intentions to cash in on at some point. He couldn't handle English Championship level at the moment imo. Dunno, you could blame all the players a bit; Kingsley was miles up the park; only ones back were 2, 14, 19 & 13 - Edited March 1 by Ricardo Quaresma Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pasquale for King Posted March 1 Share Posted March 1 9 hours ago, DS98 said: If Gunn gets injured and doesn’t make Germany then you better believe Gordon would be number 1, no matter how many games he’s had for us. If it’s Gunn, Clark and Gordon as the goalies and Gunn gets sent off or injured, who do you think Steve Clarke would turn to? There’s only one answer. There is no way in hell Zander Clark would be playing for Scotland in an international tournament whilst Craig Gordon is on the bench. But he does for Hearts. Surreal situation. Spot on, Clarke picking Clark ahead of Gordon would be crucified. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pasquale for King Posted March 2 Share Posted March 2 8 hours ago, Fozzyonthefence said: I think he’s distinctly average. He’s not a promising youngster, he’s 31 and was already in the Scotland squad (albeit I think uncapped) at St Johnstone and once he was available on a free nobody appeared to want to take a punt on him except Hearts as a no 2. That says a lot to me and I’m not overly convinced by his performances (I judge him, like any other player on his performances and not just whether or not he gets a clean sheet). He’ll never play for a bigger club than Hearts. He’s done a mostly decent job as a stand in (a bit like if Boyce came in for Shankland for a season and scored 10/12 goals) but had a fair number of unconvincing games too. However, he’s flappy on cross balls, although generally stays rooted to his line even when it is a keeper’s ball (you could argue similar to Gordon but CG definitely commands his area better as we even saw in his couple of cup games this season), his positioning is sometimes suspect and he’s often slow to react / move his feet. Gordon might be 10 years older but is still much more agile. And he doesn’t bring off those world class saves that we’re so used to seeing CG make. Good points Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pasquale for King Posted March 2 Share Posted March 2 8 hours ago, Fozzyonthefence said: I agree with most of that although I don’t really buy the “in possession of the gloves” line. Like any other position you should play your best players (yes, of course there will be an element of doubt about CG getting back to near his best). Having said that I think goalkeeper is the least of our concerns right now - the thought of having a defence without either of Halkett or Kent is a frightening thought. On top of the ongoing RB problem and an uncreative midfield and almost complete reliance on Shankland at the other end. I think that with our defensive injuries that it’s even more important to play Gordon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigAlim Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 I was wrong, Clark deserves the gloves Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muppetboy Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 Just now, BigAlim said: I was wrong, Clark deserves the gloves On today's showing definitely. I stand totally corrected in my thinking of him and how good he is. Immense Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cruyff Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 Outstanding today. Really was. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomaso Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 No more talk of dropping Zander! He was fantastic today! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomaso Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 On 02/03/2024 at 00:02, Pasquale for King said: I think that with our defensive injuries that it’s even more important to play Gordon. Big man proved you wrong mate! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Berry Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 On 02/03/2024 at 00:02, Pasquale for King said: I think that with our defensive injuries that it’s even more important to play Gordon. No, you play the man who has played all season, and turns in a MOTM performance today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
colinmaroon Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 Much as love Gordon, can't drop Zander. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pasquale for King Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 35 minutes ago, Chuck Berry said: No, you play the man who has played all season, and turns in a MOTM performance today. He was fantastic today, that discussion is for another day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck Berry Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 Just now, Pasquale for King said: He was fantastic today, that discussion is for another day. Agreed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pasquale for King Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 37 minutes ago, Thomaso said: Big man proved you wrong mate! Absolutely 👍🏽, couldn’t be happier for him and us. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Armageddon Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 So this place is currently empty of the wanks dying to slate Zander at every opportunity?? Great stuff 👌🏼🤭 Well done big man 💪🏼 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i wish jj was my dad Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 Big man was absolutely immense. I'm delighted for him. Hopefully, the obsessive scrutiny desperate to find fault subsides and we just appreciate how lucky we are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon_1874 Posted March 3 Share Posted March 3 Clark is our number 1 keeper, Gordon can step in for cup games. Close thread Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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