Booing Baningime Backpasses

[Hearts_fan]

Get it back the way even if we have an open goal to score into.

 

You know it makes sense. Complete passes mean points. 

 

[cocobeab]

When Beni, Frankie and Rowles are getting a hard time for their use of the ball it’s a pretty poor reflection on the support.
 

These guys are there to defend and for the most part never let us down in that regard.
 

If we’re now expecting them to be the creators too then a) there’s nae chance they’d be at Hearts if they could do both (see J Souttar) and b) what the **** are the other 7 or 8 doing cause they sure as siht weren’t making themselves available for the ball yesterday.

 

I’m not a boo boy but if folk must do it then at least target the right ones. Too many yesterday playing it safe.

 

And as a a last thought - nae bloody wonder - with our home crowd I’d be playing an easy ball back every time too 

[liam11]

While the booing is over the top, I did feel Beni went through a phase second half where everything through him was just played right back from where it came from.

I don’t know if he was carrying a bit of knock or was just fatigued, but we really weren’t going anywhere through the middle with him.

[Baxfee]

I think the whole stadium screamed FFS at the same time - the noise was crazy but justified. Back pass when forward options available but he ignored them. He needs to get the finger out as he ain’t doing it just now. 

[John Findlay]

2 hours ago, cocobeab said:

When Beni, Frankie and Rowles are getting a hard time for their use of the ball it’s a pretty poor reflection on the support.
 

These guys are there to defend and for the most part never let us down in that regard.
 

If we’re now expecting them to be the creators too then a) there’s nae chance they’d be at Hearts if they could do both (see J Souttar) and b) what the **** are the other 7 or 8 doing cause they sure as siht weren’t making themselves available for the ball yesterday.

 

I’m not a boo boy but if folk must do it then at least target the right ones. Too many yesterday playing it safe.

 

And as a a last thought - nae bloody wonder - with our home crowd I’d be playing an easy ball back every time too 

Sorry but every professional footballer regardless of the position they are playing should be able to pass the football. Plenty times yesterday players were making the runs in behind the defence but as the ball wasn't forthcoming, they always had to check their run. Yesterday there were numerous times when our back three had the opportunity to pass it forward but didn't take it. The midfield were also guilty on occasions too.

[Pasquale for King]

3 hours ago, cocobeab said:

When Beni, Frankie and Rowles are getting a hard time for their use of the ball it’s a pretty poor reflection on the support.
 

These guys are there to defend and for the most part never let us down in that regard.
 

If we’re now expecting them to be the creators too then a) there’s nae chance they’d be at Hearts if they could do both (see J Souttar) and b) what the **** are the other 7 or 8 doing cause they sure as siht weren’t making themselves available for the ball yesterday.

 

I’m not a boo boy but if folk must do it then at least target the right ones. Too many yesterday playing it safe.

 

And as a a last thought - nae bloody wonder - with our home crowd I’d be playing an easy ball back every time too 

Thats the problem with the formation though, these three were on the ball as they have to be the playmakers, as you say they are not up to the job. 

[Pasquale for King]

1 hour ago, liam11 said:

While the booing is over the top, I did feel Beni went through a phase second half where everything through him was just played right back from where it came from.

I don’t know if he was carrying a bit of knock or was just fatigued, but we really weren’t going anywhere through the middle with him.

He should’ve been off instead of Grant and Devlin put in his place, not as a 10. 

[HeartsandonlyHearts]

Thought Beni was pretty good yesterday.

Looking a lot more like first season Beni.

[bawheed]

13 hours ago, Sooks said:

They situations were completely different though if Beni did not pass back at that point he was firing it in to a crowd of St Johnstone players and hoping for the best 

How do you know you were not at the game, just days ago you were trying to sell

your fabulous seat for the game on KB.

[Eddiepolio3]

Think it just highlighted both Beni and Kent's limited passing ability. The main person I blame for the lack of attacking drive is Grant because he should see that and be giving them both and easy option but he was anonymous the whole game. I really hope we never see him again (ironically) 

[Star Lizard]

6 hours ago, bawheed said:

How do you know you were not at the game, just days ago you were trying to sell

your fabulous seat for the game on KB.

I watched the match 

[manaliveits105]

7 hours ago, HeartsandonlyHearts said:

Thought Beni was pretty good yesterday.

Looking a lot more like first season Beni.

Yep 

[OmiyaHearts]

I wouldn't boo, but I get why supporters did. That game was awful on Saturday. 

 

It doesn't look very enjoyable playing for Robbie Naismith.

Edited November 27, 2023 by OmiyaHearts

[Berra than you]

9 hours ago, Baxfee said:

I think the whole stadium screamed FFS at the same time - the noise was crazy but justified. Back pass when forward options available but he ignored them. He needs to get the finger out as he ain’t doing it just now. 

This is it. I actually thought for the 5/10 minutes after we scored we controlled that game. Passed back, kept the ball, Cochrane took ages over throw ins, just making sure St Johnstone don't have a chance straight away. 

I've no issue with the ball going backwards when you keep possession and you're already winning, we don't have to play forward, and I didn't boo. But the one pass the OP is talking about was a shocker. He received the ball, facing their goal, with Cochrane I think in yards of space, and he turned 180 degrees to pass it back to Kent/Clark. That is frustrating, and Naismith was going as mad as the fans were.

[VargasDa]

Ridiculous to boo one of own players just for passing the ball back, how the hell is that going to encourage them to be brave on the ball,  we can have the best crowd when things are all rosy but as soon as things are tight we hinder not encourage the players. A few around us were giving Lowry it tight for trying some forward passes that didn't come off then going mental when players take the easy option, cannot win. Thought we played some very good football in patches on Saturday, always hard when team set up like that if we don't get the early goal. Some of the comments IMO on how appallingly bad the game was are pretty clueless for me. 

[john thomas]

3 minutes ago, VargasDa said:

Ridiculous to boo one of own players just for passing the ball back, how the hell is that going to encourage them to be brave on the ball,  we can have the best crowd when things are all rosy but as soon as things are tight we hinder not encourage the players. A few around us were giving Lowry it tight for trying some forward passes that didn't come off then going mental when players take the easy option, cannot win. Thought we played some very good football in patches on Saturday, always hard when team set up like that if we don't get the early goal. Some of the comments IMO on how appallingly bad the game was are pretty clueless for me. 

Yes I was a wee bit critical of Kent's hesitancy but , tbf , he had nowhere to pass to .

St Johnstone players were pretty disciplined. They wouldn't be drawn out of their own half .

Naismith has referred to this a few times . Think first priority when teams play like this is keep the ball . Not always pretty but we are showing good discipline . Early goal gives us a chance to play better football 

[TheBigO]

17 minutes ago, john thomas said:

Yes I was a wee bit critical of Kent's hesitancy but , tbf , he had nowhere to pass to .

St Johnstone players were pretty disciplined. They wouldn't be drawn out of their own half .

Naismith has referred to this a few times . Think first priority when teams play like this is keep the ball . Not always pretty but we are showing good discipline . Early goal gives us a chance to play better football 

Absolutely, Kent looked hesitant, but the truth was there was nowhere to go and I think he was often waiting for the positive pass.

 

St J did the Levein thing of stifling the game, right down to taking minutes at a time to take every set piece etc.  They were there for the draw and, knowing Levein, probably happy enough with a 1-0 loss to be honest.

 

I said on the match thread earlier, that in games like this, the midfield need to sometimes drop, take the pass, pop it back to the CH.  You're trying to get their CM to come with you and leave a space.  It happened a few times and we fed the ball to Boyce, sometimes Grant or Lowry.  We were essentially playing 3142 (kinda, you could also say 31213 or any sill arrangement but it was def 3 then 1).  That's where we were getting joy first 15-20 mins then St J closed it up, they stopped moving essentially, stayed in their block.  So we couldn't draw them.  There were no gaps.  It wasn't even easy to pass the other CHs.  It was quite a clever setup from Levein in a way.

 

We tried a few longer balls, which I was happy to see tbh, and we won some territory from it.

 

We also isolated their LB a good number of times.  It's not by chance we managed to do this.  We moved them and the ball intentionally to create these moments for Forrest high up the pitch.  His quality was lacking and we got nothing from it.  Maybe he managed to get us one corner!  So as far as set up, it worked.  We got our winger playing RWB one on one against their LB with men in the box.  He fluffed his lines each time.  Not a go at Forrest, I don't mind him and his final product has been good in the past.  He was poor on Saturday though.  This was a much bigger issue than Beni popping the ball back to the CHs.

 

There were a couple of times second half where Beni should have realised he had time to take it in and there was a switch or a forward pass on.  These were poor decisions, but 90% of the time, he was doing what was needed.  As I said on the other thread, if you can't tell the difference between a midfielder keeping the ball moving and trying to draw space, and a midfielder refusing to play forward, then perhaps just enjoy your bovril and don't try booing.  You look silly.

 

In general, teams come to Tynecastle (and at their own ground as I'm sure we'll see next Sat on the plastic) and try to do what St J did.  If you don't score early - and we have a bloody good go - you are in for a turgid afternoon.  You win it and move on.  The OF, and teams at the top of many leagues have plenty of these games.  They're the ones you forget but that get you your end league position.  They're also the ones not too long ago we always lost.  Think back to our demotion season and the season prior. Gawd, think back to February, or even September!!!!!

 

Be thankful.  Win these games, while still working out how to best deal with them, and while still having perhaps two of the most important players in these scenarios out with injury (I'd take Barrie over Lowry and Natty over Forrest every day of the week).

 

Also, not sure if mentioned, and not sure if they'd have played, but Oda, Vargas and Newy all had half-way round the world international trips during the week.  Happens if you recruit in those markets, so no complaint, but is a factor in selection.

[john thomas]

3 minutes ago, TheBigO said:

Absolutely, Kent looked hesitant, but the truth was there was nowhere to go and I think he was often waiting for the positive pass.

 

St J did the Levein thing of stifling the game, right down to taking minutes at a time to take every set piece etc.  They were there for the draw and, knowing Levein, probably happy enough with a 1-0 loss to be honest.

 

I said on the match thread earlier, that in games like this, the midfield need to sometimes drop, take the pass, pop it back to the CH.  You're trying to get their CM to come with you and leave a space.  It happened a few times and we fed the ball to Boyce, sometimes Grant or Lowry.  We were essentially playing 3142 (kinda, you could also say 31213 or any sill arrangement but it was def 3 then 1).  That's where we were getting joy first 15-20 mins then St J closed it up, they stopped moving essentially, stayed in their block.  So we couldn't draw them.  There were no gaps.  It wasn't even easy to pass the other CHs.  It was quite a clever setup from Levein in a way.

 

We tried a few longer balls, which I was happy to see tbh, and we won some territory from it.

 

We also isolated their LB a good number of times.  It's not by chance we managed to do this.  We moved them and the ball intentionally to create these moments for Forrest high up the pitch.  His quality was lacking and we got nothing from it.  Maybe he managed to get us one corner!  So as far as set up, it worked.  We got our winger playing RWB one on one against their LB with men in the box.  He fluffed his lines each time.  Not a go at Forrest, I don't mind him and his final product has been good in the past.  He was poor on Saturday though.  This was a much bigger issue than Beni popping the ball back to the CHs.

 

There were a couple of times second half where Beni should have realised he had time to take it in and there was a switch or a forward pass on.  These were poor decisions, but 90% of the time, he was doing what was needed.  As I said on the other thread, if you can't tell the difference between a midfielder keeping the ball moving and trying to draw space, and a midfielder refusing to play forward, then perhaps just enjoy your bovril and don't try booing.  You look silly.

 

In general, teams come to Tynecastle (and at their own ground as I'm sure we'll see next Sat on the plastic) and try to do what St J did.  If you don't score early - and we have a bloody good go - you are in for a turgid afternoon.  You win it and move on.  The OF, and teams at the top of many leagues have plenty of these games.  They're the ones you forget but that get you your end league position.  They're also the ones not too long ago we always lost.  Think back to our demotion season and the season prior. Gawd, think back to February, or even September!!!!!

 

Be thankful.  Win these games, while still working out how to best deal with them, and while still having perhaps two of the most important players in these scenarios out with injury (I'd take Barrie over Lowry and Natty over Forrest every day of the week).

 

Also, not sure if mentioned, and not sure if they'd have played, but Oda, Vargas and Newy all had half-way round the world international trips during the week.  Happens if you recruit in those markets, so no complaint, but is a factor in selection.

Bang on 

[Ari Gold]

Beni done the right thing. Play a 5/10 yard pass to keep the ball when winning or try a more difficult 40 yard ball out wide, seems fairly obvious when not needing to chase the game.

 

Some folk can't see passed the ball going forward at every opportunity. 

 

End of the day, we got the 3 points and that's all that matters. 

[Ari Gold]

11 hours ago, Pasquale for King said:

He should’ve been off instead of Grant and Devlin put in his place, not as a 10. 

Grant was dire on Saturday. Offered absolutely nothing considering he's meant to be a creative player.

[Ribble]

On 26/11/2023 at 11:01, Rick Sanchez said:

I don't understand the people who moan when we're 1-0 up and Kent isn't moving the ball quickly enough.

 

They were still backs to the wall defending. Let him wait as long as it takes for them to come to him so we can draw them out.

 

We're winning 🤷‍♂️

 

I had no issue with Kent taking his time, my issue was with the players ahead of him (beni especially bad for standing behind a st johnstone midfielder any time kent was in posession) having zero movement and not giving him options. 

 

Yes were winning but how many times in the last few years have we been on top in a game, took our time, not capitalised and then see the opposition grow into the game before equalising or going onto win.

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

I can see both sides.

 

Some folk just dont understand that losing the ball makes it even harder, because you have to win it back again. A pass back the way is better than knocking it out for a throw or goal kick which really does slow the game right down.

 

However I do think we are a bit pedestrian at times, we do need to move it quicker even if it is going back the way. We started the right way, we often do, then really dont keep up the pace or intensity of the game.

[colinmaroon]

3 minutes ago, Lord Beni of Gorgie said:

I can see both sides.

 

Some folk just dont understand that losing the ball makes it even harder, because you have to win it back again. A pass back the way is better than knocking it out for a throw or goal kick which really does slow the game right down.

 

However I do think we are a bit pedestrian at times, we do need to move it quicker even if it is going back the way. We started the right way, we often do, then really dont keep up the pace or intensity of the game.

 

Stupidity personified.  The booing I mean. 

[The Wrinkly Ninja]

The biggest boo and an incredible amount of groaning including from me came following our winger Oda having possession out wide about 30 yards out faced with a full back who was showing him inside towards a second st Johnstone player. Rather that try to go outside and use his best attribute which would have at the very least taken both those players with him and pulled the left centre half acceoss it went straight back and then back again and then back to Clark who booted it to lose possession to the st Johnstone back line who had then taken the opportunity to move out by about 20 yards away from their 18 yard box.

 

None of those choices done anything to break them down or move any of their players out of position to create space. Simply taking two touches and as few as three steps forward would have allowed an attempted cross or allowed the backwards pass to be made to a player who had the opportunity to cross or play a sideways pass to one of our players 20 yards out.

Edited November 27, 2023 by The Wrinkly Ninja

[kila]

26 minutes ago, Lord Beni of Gorgie said:

I can see both sides.

 

Some folk just dont understand that losing the ball makes it even harder, because you have to win it back again. A pass back the way is better than knocking it out for a throw or goal kick which really does slow the game right down.

 

However I do think we are a bit pedestrian at times, we do need to move it quicker even if it is going back the way. We started the right way, we often do, then really dont keep up the pace or intensity of the game.

 

We don't want to lose the ball so we'll just pass it back to the keeper who'll lump it up the park 🤷‍♂️

 

The style of play is honking right now. I don't believe it is the players not being good enough, it's the training and tactics. So slow, safe and pedestrian. If you keep the ball your opponent can't score, yes, but if you keep the ball in your own half you ain't scoring either.

 

[busbyfth]

Re folk not being happy with amount of back passing and sedate style of play - Read the interview Naismith gave to Scottish Sun on Saturday - he says he learned a lot from Levein who is a person that he has a lot of time for. Depends on your mindset if this Says it all really ? 

[chrisyboy7]

We should go forward when we can...goals aren't score in our own half... we started well...we lack quality in forward positions....starting euth Forrest and Grant ain't the answer..Lorries is a good player fir about 30 minutes..not fit...he's a 300k player at best..

[colinmaroon]

The context of the question is Beni NOT general play, and Beni looked to move the ball forward throughout the game.  It was only in last ten he deliberately played safe holding onto and passing back. 

 

If a certain Scottish midfielder had done that a few years ago we would have beaten England. 

 

 

[Agentjambo]

The problem is there is no creativity from midfield to attack.I also think apart from Shanks our forward players aren’t good enough,Forrest,Vargas and Oda aren’t going to contribute with the number of assists and goals that we need during a season.Another revamp of the attacking players needed.

[TexasAndy]

59 minutes ago, colinmaroon said:

The context of the question is Beni NOT general play, and Beni looked to move the ball forward throughout the game.  It was only in last ten he deliberately played safe holding onto and passing back. 

 

If a certain Scottish midfielder had done that a few years ago we would have beaten England. 

 

 

Exactly.  He was right to tell everyone to calm the F down.  They were not getting the ball after we scored.  In a game like that the win is all that matters.

[TheBigO]

1 hour ago, Agentjambo said:

The problem is there is no creativity from midfield to attack.I also think apart from Shanks our forward players aren’t good enough,Forrest,Vargas and Oda aren’t going to contribute with the number of assists and goals that we need during a season.Another revamp of the attacking players needed.

I think Newy can absolutely be creative.  Let's revisit this in a few months on that front.

He played one blind pass inside on Saturday instead of the easy one out wide which put us 3 on 2ish (which we then effed up of course).  He has that in his locker.  He generally always looks to pass forward then follow the ball.  I have a feeling the lad is currently a bit undervalued by our support and is going to be very good for us.  He's as close as we've had to a number 8 in quite a while.

[Agentjambo]

13 minutes ago, TheBigO said:

I think Newy can absolutely be creative.  Let's revisit this in a few months on that front.

He played one blind pass inside on Saturday instead of the easy one out wide which put us 3 on 2ish (which we then effed up of course).  He has that in his locker.  He generally always looks to pass forward then follow the ball.  I have a feeling the lad is currently a bit undervalued by our support and is going to be very good for us.  He's as close as we've had to a number 8 in quite a while.

In general we don’t create enough going forward as the stats suggest.

[TheBigO]

3 minutes ago, Agentjambo said:

In general we don’t create enough going forward as the stats suggest.

I'd agree with that (though do think I've seen stats which contradict this, but then there are so many stats these days and all called different things!!!).

 

I think we create good positions, especially wide but a combo of poor final ball/decision and perhaps numbers in the box stop us making big chances from these opps.

 

Duno.

 

My point is that I think Newy will release our players a lot more with a one touch pass, or a disguised ball than anyone else we have who can play the CM role.  He's quite an all rounder.  Considering he's new, had a bit of injury to deal with, I think he's done pretty well so far.  I just have a wee feeling, as I say, that the lad will become a big player for us.

[HopeDiouf]

I wouldn't be booing anyone, but part of Naismith's appointment was the swashbuckling football we were gonna be playing.  I've yet to see anything hugely different from the style we played under Robbie.

[Agentjambo]

3 minutes ago, TheBigO said:

I'd agree with that (though do think I've seen stats which contradict this, but then there are so many stats these days and all called different things!!!).

 

I think we create good positions, especially wide but a combo of poor final ball/decision and perhaps numbers in the box stop us making big chances from these opps.

 

Duno.

 

My point is that I think Newy will release our players a lot more with a one touch pass, or a disguised ball than anyone else we have who can play the CM role.  He's quite an all rounder.  Considering he's new, had a bit of injury to deal with, I think he's done pretty well so far.  I just have a wee feeling, as I say, that the lad will become a big player for us.

We also need creativity from our wide forwards Vargas,Oda and Forrest.If we are going to progress as a team we need forward players with 20+ goal contributions (assists + goals).

[TheBigO]

1 minute ago, HopeDiouf said:

I wouldn't be booing anyone, but part of Naismith's appointment was the swashbuckling football we were gonna be playing.  I've yet to see anything hugely different from the style we played under Robbie.

There's an issue there. The football we saw under Naisy tailend of last season (other than St M first half) was genuinely great to watch.  Front foot, direct, pressing style.  But almost all his games (other than St M!!) were against teams you can kinda do that against.

 

That style simply doesn't work against St J at home, or Livvy, or Killie away or any of these games.  I think we started the season with two things - injuries! and the thought we could play like this every week.  What happened was we soon found out that you need space to do it and in this league, you're playing against a brick wall most weeks.  We reverted to safe, meaningless passing.

 

What has changed in the last few games has been us still playing the ball deep, but with much more purpose.  If you watch close enough, you can see we're trying to probe and move teams around.  We were using our LCB and RCB well (Kye especially) as an attacking outlet too.  But then St J stopped that on Sat and we needed to work that one out.  We're using our WBs pretty well - we'll be better when Nat is back.

 

It's a massive difference to how we played under Robbie if you ask me.  That said "how we played under Robbie" was largely pretty succesful and at times there was a very good football on show.  It got away from him, but 90% of his time with us was well above average.

 

Teams set up like this against us.  These games will rarely be exciting.  Not really.  We've lacked an early goal against Livvy and St J.  Both games we could have had an early goal.  That comes, we'll see the team find space and punish teams.  The first 15-20 mins on Saturday flew by - we were playing really nice stuff and just couldn't find that final punch.

 

So swashbuckling!?  Not even Celtic are swashbuckling mate - look at them against a Motherwell team we quite easily put away.

[TheBigO]

5 minutes ago, Agentjambo said:

We also need creativity from our wide forwards Vargas,Oda and Forrest.If we are going to progress as a team we need forward players with 20+ goal contributions (assists + goals).

I still think Oda has this.  No worries there.  Both he and Vargas looked pretty dangerous I thought on Sat.

 

We have Barrie coming back too.

[Agentjambo]

Just now, TheBigO said:

There's an issue there. The football we saw under Naisy tailend of last season (other than St M first half) was genuinely great to watch.  Front foot, direct, pressing style.  But almost all his games (other than St M!!) were against teams you can kinda do that against.

 

That style simply doesn't work against St J at home, or Livvy, or Killie away or any of these games.  I think we started the season with two things - injuries! and the thought we could play like this every week.  What happened was we soon found out that you need space to do it and in this league, you're playing against a brick wall most weeks.  We reverted to safe, meaningless passing.

 

What has changed in the last few games has been us still playing the ball deep, but with much more purpose.  If you watch close enough, you can see we're trying to probe and move teams around.  We were using our LCB and RCB well (Kye especially) as an attacking outlet too.  But then St J stopped that on Sat and we needed to work that one out.  We're using our WBs pretty well - we'll be better when Nat is back.

 

It's a massive difference to how we played under Robbie if you ask me.  That said "how we played under Robbie" was largely pretty succesful and at times there was a very good football on show.  It got away from him, but 90% of his time with us was well above average.

 

Teams set up like this against us.  These games will rarely be exciting.  Not really.  We've lacked an early goal against Livvy and St J.  Both games we could have had an early goal.  That comes, we'll see the team find space and punish teams.  The first 15-20 mins on Saturday flew by - we were playing really nice stuff and just couldn't find that final punch.

 

So swashbuckling!?  Not even Celtic are swashbuckling mate - look at them against a Motherwell team we quite easily put away.

All teams set up defensively against Celtic and Rangers but they have the quality to break them down….we don’t.

[Agentjambo]

Just now, TheBigO said:

I still think Oda has this.  No worries there.  Both he and Vargas looked pretty dangerous I thought on Sat.

 

We have Barrie coming back too.

Oda was billed as some kind of flying machine before he signed…he can’t beat a man in a foot race..it’s ok them looking dangerous but they have to “be” dangerous.

[TheBigO]

1 minute ago, Agentjambo said:

All teams set up defensively against Celtic and Rangers but they have the quality to break them down….we don’t.

Indeed.  And even then, they often labour their way through or need, ahem, asisstance....

[TheBigO]

Just now, Agentjambo said:

Oda was billed as some kind of flying machine before he signed…he can’t beat a man in a foot race..it’s ok them looking dangerous but they have to “be” dangerous.

Oda has "been" dangerous.  In fact, I think he "is" dangerous.

[Agentjambo]

6 minutes ago, TheBigO said:

Oda has "been" dangerous.  In fact, I think he "is" dangerous.

Not really….

[H2]

On 26/11/2023 at 11:09, Sooks said:

Beni literally played a fantastic forward through ball in our last game before yesterday which released Shankland and led to a goal 

and he put in a really good tackle about 5 mins from the end on Saturday. Other than he was square ball - back pass - move so he can't get the ball. Prettty poor stuff, we know he can do much better, he's got the quality. What's up?
 

[Star Lizard]

Just now, H2 said:

and he put in a really good tackle about 5 mins from the end on Saturday. Other than he was square ball - back pass - move so he can't get the ball. Prettty poor stuff, we know he can do much better, he's got the quality. What's up?
 

I saw him charging down a player on the touch line too . That is just the stand out incidents . He does not hide like you are suggesting either 

[H2]

Just now, Sooks said:

I saw him charging down a player on the touch line too . That is just the stand out incidents . He does not hide like you are suggesting either 

Og great that's three positives in two games! - square ball - back pass - move so he can't get the ball. Prettty poor stuff, we know he can do much better, he's got the quality. What's up?

[Star Lizard]

Just now, H2 said:

Og great that's three positives in two games! - square ball - back pass - move so he can't get the ball. Prettty poor stuff, we know he can do much better, he's got the quality. What's up?

What is up , is you are patently not seeing the good things he does and playing him down . He did a lot more than that , but you are in some kind of negative loop where you are convincing yourself that he is not playing well . No idea why you are wanting to do that , or if you even realise that is what you are doing 

[Star Lizard]

This the same 

6 hours ago, Agentjambo said:

Not really….

He was out injured for ages . I know Japan are quality at robotics but I think you are expecting way too much 

[Agentjambo]

Just now, Sooks said:

This the same 

He was out injured for ages . I know Japan are quality at robotics but I think you are expecting way too much 

So if he’s not fully fit and ready to play why play him??

[Star Lizard]

6 hours ago, Agentjambo said:

In general we don’t create enough going forward as the stats suggest.

Oh well , I will just console myself with the league division table since we are showing up so poorly on these more important ones 

[Star Lizard]

1 minute ago, Agentjambo said:

So if he’s not fully fit and ready to play why play him??

How do you think a player gets fit enough to play ? I was only joking about the robotics but now I suspect you really do think players are machines that you just turn on and off