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Jamhammer

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Cracking doc on C4 just now about SAF

For those who say we can’t possibly catch Celtic & Rangers. We absolutely can.

SAF and glum Jim have proved it.

 

Discuss

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2 minutes ago, deejtee said:

Different era financially. 

Agree but only to a degree 

Remarkable success at Aberdeen domestically and in Europe mainly driven by his I expect you to beat the OF attitude 

 

well worth a watch

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20 minutes ago, Jamhammer said:

Cracking doc on C4 just now about SAF

For those who say we can’t possibly catch Celtic & Rangers. We absolutely can.

SAF and glum Jim have proved it.

 

Discuss

No chance competing with them now over the course of a season.

our only chance ever would be if it went to a 20 team league and we only played them twice.

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2 minutes ago, 1874robbo said:

No chance competing with them now over the course of a season.

our only chance ever would be if it went to a 20 team league and we only played them twice.

Personally I think it would take the stars aligning and  period where more than one team can take points off them

 

Us

Dons

Dundee Utd or someone else

 

a la 86

 

Could it happen again 

 

 

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Nookie Bear
20 minutes ago, Jamhammer said:

Agree but only to a degree 

Remarkable success at Aberdeen domestically and in Europe mainly driven by his I expect you to beat the OF attitude 

 

well worth a watch


A massive degree unfortunately. 
 

Why don’t West Ham ever win the league? 

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Unknown user
8 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said:


A massive degree unfortunately. 
 

Why don’t West Ham ever win the league? 

Because they're wankers, but Leicester proved it is possible, even once in a blue moon.

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John Findlay

Major difference between now and then.

Not all stadiums were all seated, Ibrox and Pittodrie being exceptions. Celtic Park and Ibrox were not filled every other game. Went to a Rangers v Hearts game at Ibrox in 1985 and the attendance was 12,000.

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Nookie Bear
23 minutes ago, Smithee said:

Because they're wankers, but Leicester proved it is possible, even once in a blue moon.

😂

 

 

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48 minutes ago, 1874robbo said:

No chance competing with them now over the course of a season.

our only chance ever would be if it went to a 20 team league and we only played them twice.

We don't have to beat the OF to win the league, we just need to beat everyone else.

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The Gorgie
38 minutes ago, Smithee said:

Because they're wankers, but Leicester proved it is possible, even once in a blue moon.

Just spat my gin out over the wife. She's crying now, thanks 😂

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49 minutes ago, Nookie Bear said:


A massive degree unfortunately. 
 

Why don’t West Ham ever win the league? 

Because they don’t have the key components required to win the 1966 World Cup.  😎

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4 minutes ago, Sir Craig Gordon said:

Just spat my gin out over the wife. She's crying now, thanks 😂

Poor Gordon.

 

 

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The biggest difference between now and the Aberdeen era isn't money imo, it's player contracts.  Very unlikely Aberdeen would have retained their best players in the current environment.

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Fozzyonthefence
8 minutes ago, Kiwidoug said:

The biggest difference between now and the Aberdeen era isn't money imo, it's player contracts.  Very unlikely Aberdeen would have retained their best players in the current environment.


Or produce / sign Scottish players good enough to win the league. 

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14 minutes ago, Kiwidoug said:

The biggest difference between now and the Aberdeen era isn't money imo, it's player contracts.  Very unlikely Aberdeen would have retained their best players in the current environment.

I think you're right. 

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Mr Elwood P
1 hour ago, Jamhammer said:

Cracking doc on C4 just now about SAF

For those who say we can’t possibly catch Celtic & Rangers. We absolutely can.

SAF and glum Jim have proved it.

 

Discuss


This is the kind of thinking that saw Aberdeen fans become disillusioned with McInnes. Be very careful what you wish for ...

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Very very different circumstances nowadays. Ferguson’s the best ever but the way things are now with the way money has gone & the amount of power players now wield the tasks got harder than ever. Barring a freak accident it’s going to take years of sustained improvements to get closer.

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Saint Jambo

For those who say we can’t possibly catch Celtic & Rangers. We absolutely can. 

Tommy Walker proved it.

 

That may seem silly, but there was 25 years between us winning our last title and Aberdeen winning their last title. There has been 37 years since then.

 

It is a different era. Fergie's success at Aberdeen isn't a relevant comparison.

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Saint Jambo
44 minutes ago, Cruyff said:

We don't have to beat the OF to win the league, we just need to beat everyone else.

 

If Hearts won every game against non-OF teams we would pick up 90 points. Celtic finished on 93 points.

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Mr Elwood P
1 hour ago, Cruyff said:

We don't have to beat the OF to win the league, we just need to beat everyone else.


We'd need to at least not lose to the Old Firm or win the home games and lose away games to balance it out.

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1 hour ago, Cruyff said:

We don't have to beat the OF to win the league, we just need to beat everyone else.

But you need the others to take points off them also and if they’re meeting them potentially 4 times a season it becomes very difficult 

 

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1 hour ago, Cruyff said:

We don't have to beat the OF to win the league, we just need to beat everyone else.

Agree   share points with the old firm, after that it's what we do against the rest

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2 hours ago, Jamhammer said:

Ruthless 

Honest

Determined

Driven

 

Will we see the likes again?

That’s the premise you need to work on. 
 

it may not make you champions but it may make you more successful than 3 cups in 24 years. 

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kingantti1874

Different era.. he couldn’t do it  today - players like McLeish and Miller who were top class would have been away in the blink of an eye. 

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1 hour ago, Saint Jambo said:

 

If Hearts won every game against non-OF teams we would pick up 90 points. Celtic finished on 93 points.

That's how tough it is. 

54 minutes ago, Mr Elwood P said:


We'd need to at least not lose to the Old Firm or win the home games and lose away games to balance it out.

Yep.

47 minutes ago, 1874robbo said:

But you need the others to take points off them also and if they’re meeting them potentially 4 times a season it becomes very difficult 

 

But it doesn't matter if there's 12 teams or 20 teams in the league playing twice or 4 times. We still need to beat everyone else to win the league or, at the very least, give ourselves the chance. 

 

I don’t think our chances improve whether we play them twice or 4 times each. In fact, i think it would make it even more impossible than it already is if we only played one another twice. 

Edited by Cruyff
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1 hour ago, Kiwidoug said:

The biggest difference between now and the Aberdeen era isn't money imo, it's player contracts.  Very unlikely Aberdeen would have retained their best players in the current environment.

Freedom of contract would’ve slaughtered that Aberdeen team. 

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Bazzas right boot
3 hours ago, Jamhammer said:

Agree but only to a degree 

Remarkable success at Aberdeen domestically and in Europe mainly driven by his I expect you to beat the OF attitude 

 

well worth a watch

 

Not too a degree, talking multiple times difference. 

For every  £1 Aberdeen spent to Celtic and rangers pound it was close, fast forward to now and it's about 6 times the difference. 

 

Nothing to discuss. 

 

Aberdeen v Real Madrids  budget is now over 30 times difference. 

 

There is little to discuss, the answer is obvious. 

 

Bosman ruling also thrown in for good measure. 

 

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Doctor FinnBarr

Aw shit, I thought the thread title meant we were going to be discussing that mad old potty mouthed tool that supported Hamilton!

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3 hours ago, Cruyff said:

We don't have to beat the OF to win the league, we just need to beat everyone else.

We need to beat everyone else but we would defo need to win some games against the old firm as games against them are almost a quarter of the season. If we only played each team twice then it would be far easier to win the league. 

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Mr Elwood P
1 hour ago, Cruyff said:

That's how tough it is. 

Yep.

But it doesn't matter if there's 12 teams or 20 teams in the league playing twice or 4 times. We still need to beat everyone else to win the league or, at the very least, give ourselves the chance. 

 

I don’t think our chances improve whether we play them twice or 4 times each. In fact, i think it would make it even more impossible than it already is if we only played one another twice. 


You'll need to explain that one?

 

A 20 team league would also mean we only need to go to Easter Road once and Aberdeen once. Surely replacing those games and games against the Old Firm with  Championship teams would increase our points total?

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J.T.F.Robertson
1 hour ago, Russ1977 said:

We need to beat everyone else but we would defo need to win some games against the old firm as games against them are almost a quarter of the season. If we only played each team twice then it would be far easier to win the league. 

 

If we literally were beating everyone else (everyone) it would be them shitting their pants and not us.

Never gaunnie happen tho'. :(

 

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7 hours ago, Cruyff said:

We don't have to beat the OF to win the league, we just need to beat everyone else.

We will never win 30 games and if we did, 90 points still won't be enough.

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Watt-Zeefuik
8 hours ago, Jamhammer said:

Agree but only to a degree 

Remarkable success at Aberdeen domestically and in Europe mainly driven by his I expect you to beat the OF attitude 

 

well worth a watch

 

One of the greatest football managers in the history of the game brought a lot more than an "I expect you to beat the OF" attitude.

 

Yes, I think SAF could beat the OF were he given three years at Hearts because he was that good. We have never had a manager as good as SAF and we likely never will, and that's no great insult to any of our managers.

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ToadKiller Dog

We would need both uglies to have poor seasons at the same time ,realistically that's not likely to happen. Plus the gfa whistler's would have their input.

I think we can cut the points gap a bit and who knows the odd poor season from one if them could see us take a 2nd place .

Truthfully finance wise they are to big for our league but too backward for any major league .

 

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Aside from the massive difference in wages, we now have to play them each 4 times. Which is another huge advantage for them. 

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Finlay James
1 hour ago, ToadKiller Dog said:

We would need both uglies to have poor seasons at the same time ,realistically that's not likely to happen. Plus the gfa whistler's would have their input.

I think we can cut the points gap a bit and who knows the odd poor season from one if them could see us take a 2nd place .

Truthfully finance wise they are to big for our league but too backward for any major league .

 


The refs had their say in the 80’s as much as they do now.  There is a good reason we couldn’t stand Bob Valentine and Brian Mcginlay (although if the song is to be believed, they didn’t hate each other).

 

Fergie knew how to get inside the refs heads, even back then and his team also managed the ref on the park.  Willie Miller in particular was always in the refs ear.

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7 hours ago, Cruyff said:

That's how tough it is. 

Yep.

But it doesn't matter if there's 12 teams or 20 teams in the league playing twice or 4 times. We still need to beat everyone else to win the league or, at the very least, give ourselves the chance. 

 

I don’t think our chances improve whether we play them twice or 4 times each. In fact, i think it would make it even more impossible than it already is if we only played one another twice. 

You’ve lost me on that one?

 

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6 hours ago, Mr Elwood P said:


You'll need to explain that one?

 

A 20 team league would also mean we only need to go to Easter Road once and Aberdeen once. Surely replacing those games and games against the Old Firm with  Championship teams would increase our points total?

Aye, and it would also increase the OF's points total even more because they only need to go to Tynecastle, Pittodrie, Tannadice, Easter Rd etc.. once as well. 

2 hours ago, ri Alban said:

We will never win 30 games and if we did, 90 points still won't be enough.

We'd have to win 30 games minimum to win the league. 90 pts some seasons is enough to win the SPL. 

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5 minutes ago, 1874robbo said:

You’ve lost me on that one?

 

If we only played each other twice in a 20 team league, Rangers and Celtic would win even more games mate as explained above. 

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2 minutes ago, Cruyff said:

If we only played each other twice in a 20 team league, Rangers and Celtic would win even more games mate as explained above. 

We would only play them twice and I’d fancy our chances on picking up home points v them.

we would then need to beat the rest obviously but with championship teams filling the extra 8 spaces in the league I’d fancy our chances to get very close.

certainly closer than we do now in this 12 team pish.

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11 hours ago, Jamhammer said:

Cracking doc on C4 just now about SAF

For those who say we can’t possibly catch Celtic & Rangers. We absolutely can.

SAF and glum Jim have proved it.

 

Discuss

 

The last time Aberdeen won the league in 1985, they had a bigger wage budget than Celtic.

 

Celtic now have a wage bill 8x that of Aberdeen. It's never happening again with that disparity.

 

 

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Nookie Bear
6 minutes ago, Martin_T said:

 

The last time Aberdeen won the league in 1985, they had a bigger wage budget than Celtic.

 

Celtic now have a wage bill 8x that of Aberdeen. It's never happening again with that disparity.

 

 


And I know everyone says “but Leicester”, it’s not a direct comparison because they were still able to offer top wages and, crucially, hold on to their players  

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Just now, 1874robbo said:

We would only play them twice and I’d fancy our chances on picking up home points v them.

we would then need to beat the rest obviously but with championship teams filling the extra 8 spaces in the league I’d fancy our chances to get very close.

certainly closer than we do now in this 12 team pish.

The OF drop more points going to Tynecastle, Easter Road, Tannadice, Pittodrie etc... twice.. than going there just once. 

 

Adding 8 cannon fodder teams to the equation means they'll just win even more games. 

 

And if we're ever good enough to win 90-100% of games v non OF teams, we'd be good enough to take points of the OF at home. Having those 4 games against them at home may even prove to be the difference, especially after the split. 

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Nookie Bear
8 hours ago, Bazzas right boot said:

 

Not too a degree, talking multiple times difference. 

For every  £1 Aberdeen spent to Celtic and rangers pound it was close, fast forward to now and it's about 6 times the difference. 

 

Nothing to discuss. 

 

Aberdeen v Real Madrids  budget is now over 30 times difference. 

 

There is little to discuss, the answer is obvious. 

 

Bosman ruling also thrown in for good measure. 

 


Around that time, hibs signed Steve Archibald directly from Barca ffs

 

They are now trying to entice Cole Stockton back north. 

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4 minutes ago, Cruyff said:

The OF drop more points going to Tynecastle, Easter Road, Tannadice, Pittodrie etc... twice.. than going there just once. 

 

Adding 8 cannon fodder teams to the equation means they'll just win even more games. 

 

And if we're ever good enough to win 90-100% of games v non OF teams, we'd be good enough to take points of the OF at home. Having those 4 games against them at home may even prove to be the difference, especially after the split. 

Unfortunately we will never find out who’s right or wrong here as a 20 team league would never be voted for as too many teams want their potential 2 home games v the old firm.

 

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LarrysRightFoot

Not read all thread but I’m sure it’s been suggested on here before we wanted to bring him to Tynecastle should have not have beaten Palace back in 90 (?).

 

Anyway I completely agree you need his drive and belief to topple the OF. Things are different however but I still believe it can be done. A bigger league with x2 season would help IMO though. 

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We absolutely can compete with the old firm...but only if we suddenly get loads more money and a top manager.

 

For all his success, Ferguson wouldn't do much for us in this day and age. He's a relic or a time gone by.

Edited by Taffin
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