***Champions League Final 2022 - Liverpool v Real Madrid***

[Samuel Camazzola]

Good effort to fulfill every fixture put in front of them but Liverpool simply not good enough Three finals and no goals scored. Two trophies because they had the better sets of penalties on the days.

 

League points were only as close due to Man City dropping points despite having extra gears to go through. 

 

 

[ArcticJambo]

Turn up at turnstile, won't scan your ticket, stile doesn't turn = commotion and delay. Same happening at other turnstile, same result.  People get frustrated, stewards trying to sort it out and crowd builds.  Few morer get in as tix are legit, then more fake causing more issues.  Then you get ticketless aggravating the immediate situation, folks shouting 'Open the Gates' we're legit, we're getting crushed'. lost control, and police decide to tear gas to get them back! Innocents obviously get caught up in it.

 

Don't buy fake tickets, don't try to enter the stadium or even get through the initial cordon if you don't have a legit ticket.  Respect the safety of your fellow fan - stop being an arsehole.  Too many arseholes at these events.  We've seen it at Tynecastle from Celticy types, Don't doubt Liverpool have a similar element.

[Mikey1874]

4 minutes ago, ArcticJambo said:

Turn up at turnstile, won't scan your ticket, stile doesn't turn = commotion and delay. Same happening at other turnstile, same result.  People get frustrated, stewards trying to sort it out and crowd builds.  Few morer get in as tix are legit, then more fake causing more issues.  Then you get ticketless aggravating the immediate situation, folks shouting 'Open the Gates' we're legit, we're getting crushed'. lost control, and police decide to tear gas to get them back! Innocents obviously get caught up in it.

 

Don't buy fake tickets, don't try to enter the stadium or even get through the initial cordon if you don't have a legit ticket.  Respect the safety of your fellow fan - stop being an arsehole.  Too many arseholes at these events.  We've seen it at Tynecastle from Celticy types, Don't doubt Liverpool have a similar element.

 

I don't blame Liverpool fans for Heysel, Hillsborough or Paris. 

 

But if you look closely there are questions as to whether all could have been avoided if masses of Liverpool fans hadn't turned up trying to and often succeeding in getting in without tickets. 

 

It's a problem Liverpool seem to have. 

[ArcticJambo]

12 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

I don't blame Liverpool fans for Heysel, Hillsborough or Paris. 

 

But if you look closely there are questions as to whether all could have been avoided if masses of Liverpool fans hadn't turned up trying to and often succeeding in getting in without tickets. 

 

It's a problem Liverpool seem to have. 

On the face of it it seems to be a tactic that has been employed for a very long time.  I wasn't there obviously but having gone to many matches, including many in england from the very early 80s right through to today, I'm not adverse to fan culture/behaviour, and how some take advantage of the situation.  There's a reluctance to have a go at other fans, your own fans but instead blame it on someone else, the authorities for over-reacting.  The vast majority are decent fans doing the right thing but with some clubs there seems to be a significant minority that are causing safety issues for their own fellow fans. But nahh, it's the authorities fault, again!

Edited May 29, 2022 by ArcticJambo

[luckydug]

1 hour ago, SectionDJambo said:

There definitely was a major impact on  the way the police reacted by the sudden appearance of local yobs at the stadium. Big events like this will attract trouble makers in any big city. Local police knowledge and intelligence usually can minimise this but the French authorities just started lobbing gas and sprays around anyone to combat it. Unacceptable, but nothing will be done about it.

I feel sorry for fans who just wanted to go and see their team play in a big game, only to get involved in shenanigans which seem to have been preventable with better planning and less pre conceived notions from the French police about English football fans.

A Sky reporter has just said that the Madrid fans had problems with the policing and organisation as well, though not with anything like the outcome Liverpool fans suffered.

The pre conceived notions from the French Police will have been enhanced by the recent bad behaviour at English end of season games. 

These clowns who invade pitches in their excitement do no favours to the reputation of their club and country. 

[SectionDJambo]

8 minutes ago, luckydug said:

The pre conceived notions from the French Police will have been enhanced by the recent bad behaviour at English end of season games. 

These clowns who invade pitches in their excitement do no favours to the reputation of their club and country. 

It’s definitely a concern that this kind of behaviour has bounced back into the minds of some football fans. Whether it has been the break in attendance due to Covid, or not, there seems to be a different mindset growing that they can do what they like. 
Many of us remember fences and what those ultimately caused. Short of installing some kind of barrier, what are clubs to do about it? Reduce attendances to keep fans further back from the perimeters?
Invading pitches and attacking players cannot be allowed to continue. It’s a problem that needs to be eradicated before next season in England, or nutcases up here will copy them.

Whether that was in the thoughts of the French police yesterday, or what happened at Wembley last year, is another matter.

[Percival King]

I've never bought a resale ticket for a football match and probably never will but I can't honestly say I wouldn't if the circumstances were right. Let's say Hearts qualified for the Europa League final, I couldn't get a ticket through the club but 20,000 tickets had gone to non-finalists fans. I may be desperate enough to buy what I think is a genuine ticket to see what could be a once in a lifetime match/cup win and perhaps there would be folk who would prey on my desperation and that could make me vulnerable to buying a fake ticket. Another reason for giving the lion's share of tickets to the two clubs.

[benny]

[briever]

1 hour ago, Samuel Camazzola said:

Good effort to fulfill every fixture put in front of them but Liverpool simply not good enough Three finals and no goals scored. Two trophies because they had the better sets of penalties on the days.

 

League points were only as close due to Man City dropping points despite having extra gears to go through. 

 

 

FFS they lost 4 games out of 63.

[Angel eyes]

if Klippedy Klopp is not good enough to set up his teams to play against a defensive formation then that’s his/your lookout you honestly think teams are going to set up just please you so you take full advantage, idiot.

[Samuel Camazzola]

23 minutes ago, briever said:

FFS they lost 4 games out of 63.

And not good enough to win the big prizes.

[maroonsgotop]

26 minutes ago, briever said:

FFS they lost 4 games out of 63.

trouble is they didn't win any league games against Man City, Chelsea or Spurs. Also scored zero goals in 3 cup finals. Whilst there is no doubt they are an  an outstanding team, there are still some issues for Klopp to address

[Sooperstar]

I am more than happy to stick the boot into Liverpool and their fans, but there are plenty independent accounts of last night which give enough evidence to show that most of the issues were caused by the police and locals.

 

How could anyone think this was justified?

 

[Malinga the Swinga]

1 hour ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

I don't blame Liverpool fans for Heysel, Hillsborough or Paris. 

 

But if you look closely there are questions as to whether all could have been avoided if masses of Liverpool fans hadn't turned up trying to and often succeeding in getting in without tickets. 

 

It's a problem Liverpool seem to have. 

Hillsborough maybe, but they were 100% to blame for Heysel. Trouble is, they simply don't accept it.

Too soon to establish whose fault Paris is, but ticketless fans and fake tickets are supporter issues.

[Malinga the Swinga]

1 hour ago, briever said:

FFS they lost 4 games out of 63.

2 hours ago, Samuel Camazzola said:

Good effort to fulfill every fixture put in front of them but Liverpool simply not good enough Three finals and no goals scored. Two trophies because they had the better sets of penalties on the days.

 

League points were only as close due to Man City dropping points despite having extra gears to go through. 

 

 

Yep, a decent cup side but not good enough when it counted. 1 league title in 6 or 7 seasons proves they're not as good as the hype suggests 

 

 

[briever]

11 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

Hillsborough maybe, but they were 100% to blame for Heysel. Trouble is, they simply don't accept it.

Too soon to establish whose fault Paris is, but ticketless fans and fake tickets are supporter issues.

Hillsborough maybe?  GTF

[Ked]

We have had similar with Celtic using fakes.Remember some of their support being locked out so we seem to have got on top of it.

I think quite a few other teams have problems regarding this.

Supporters knowingly doing this are putting their fellow support at risk.

Noticed now that the crowds are controlled in sections down Mcleod Street.

Liverpool supporters with fakes imo would have probably known this and I suspect so would the authorities been alerted to this.

England v Italy had similar.

Don't know the answer to this but perhaps if possible ticket checkpoints further back from turnstiles.

 

 

[ri Alban]

A few posters looking for a gig at the sun. Pathetic.

[SectionDJambo]

Oh dear

Old Nadine is weighing in on demanding an investigation. Was just a matter of time before some political gain was attempted to be gained by our government.

[Malinga the Swinga]

19 minutes ago, briever said:

Hillsborough maybe?  GTF

Heysel? I note you swept that name away. A stain on Liverpool that, despite the efforts of club and supporters, just won't wash off.

A club, like Celtic, that wallow in victim status.

[Des Lynam]

18 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

A few posters looking for a gig at the sun. Pathetic.

This. 
 

 

[McGlynn The Money]

6 hours ago, briever said:

 

Folk seem cool with Atkinson being this type of player on here.

 

Not as cool as Real Madrid winning the European Cup for the 14th time. Fourteen! Count them baby.

[Unknown user]

7 minutes ago, McGlynn The Money said:

 

Not as cool as Real Madrid winning the European Cup for the 14th time. Fourteen! Count them baby.

 

Why are you goading Hearts fans with some foreign team's achievements?

[briever]

41 minutes ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

Heysel? I note you swept that name away. A stain on Liverpool that, despite the efforts of club and supporters, just won't wash off.

A club, like Celtic, that wallow in victim status.

i am not defending their actions at Heysel, I am telling you to GTF for putting maybe after Hillsborough. 

[Fraggle]

Lots of various issues to be investigated in this to try and gain some understanding of what went wrong. Blame to be apportioned to all parties at some level, including sections of the Liverpool fans. Be interesting to see/hear what issues the Madrid fans experienced last night. 

[briever]

13 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

Why are you goading Hearts fans with some foreign team's achievements?

Indeed, anyone know a way of ignoring users viewing this on an iPad, easy on a PC you just hover over their profile.

[McGlynn The Money]

35 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

Why are you goading Hearts fans with some foreign team's achievements?

 

As opposed to someone goading Hearts fans about a Hearts player?

 

Anyway, I wasn't goading anyone.

[manaliveits105]

[Ulysses]

6 hours ago, Malinga the Swinga said:

Hillsborough maybe

 

Maybe? 

[Ulysses]

7 hours ago, briever said:

FFS they lost 4 games out of 63.

 

All the same, Didi Hamann asked some questions last night on RTÉ about how this will affect the team and the club going forward.  Worth a look.

 

 

[hereford_hearts]

I bet a couple of entrepreneurial Celtic fans cranked up their printing press, and travelled to Paris for the final😉😉

[wentworth jambo]

While we know the blame for previous events belongs in different areas, there is a constant theme running through Hillsborough, Heysel and Saturday night in Paris - ticketless fans attempting to gain entry to the stadium illegally. How come no other clubs (Celtic to a certain extent excluded) appear to have this issue of large numbers of ticketless or fake ticket holders ?

[McGlynn The Money]

Reading Real Madrid fans on Twitter and they are also saying it was a nightmare. Sounds like the stadium is in a really rough and rundown area. Gangs of youths hanging round assaulting and robbing folk on their way to and from the ground, hellish transport links and the police either absent or looking on doing nothing.

[benny]

 

[Boab]

46 minutes ago, McGlynn The Money said:

Reading Real Madrid fans on Twitter and they are also saying it was a nightmare. Sounds like the stadium is in a really rough and rundown area. Gangs of youths hanging round assaulting and robbing folk on their way to and from the ground, hellish transport links and the police either absent or looking on doing nothing.

Saint-Denis.

Went through it a few years back and you had to have your wits about you !

Not sure what it's like now but won't be back to find out.

[Sooks]

It would help Liverpool's cause if they could make a concession that the fake ticket fans were a part of the problem I have just watched some really embarrassing guy from a Liverpool podcast refusing to accept LFC fans should take any of the blame

[benny]

27 minutes ago, Sooks said:

It would help Liverpool's cause if they could make a concession that the fake ticket fans were a part of the problem I have just watched some really embarrassing guy from a Liverpool podcast refusing to accept LFC fans should take any of the blame

A huge part that sadly ended up with innocent fans getting involved in scenes that was not their fault.

[Sooks]

1 minute ago, benny said:

A huge part that sadly ended up with innocent fans getting involved in scenes that was not their fault.

 

Exactly the French police and UEFA obviously have to take a major share of the blame but the LFC fans and the media are just point blank refusing to accept the part that fake tickets have caused in this ......................................... there would be more sympathy if they would concede this very important point while rightly demanding answers from the authorities

[wentworth jambo]

1 hour ago, Sooks said:

It would help Liverpool's cause if they could make a concession that the fake ticket fans were a part of the problem I have just watched some really embarrassing guy from a Liverpool podcast refusing to accept LFC fans should take any of the blame

Always the victims....the Celtic of England

[Sooks]

7 minutes ago, wentworth jambo said:

Always the victims....the Celtic of England

 

I mean it does look as though the football and Paris authorities and the police made an arse of dealing with things and the local gangs issue has been widely enough reported but we have seen our selfs the problems that cloned and fake tickets have caused on a much smaller scale at our own stadium

[McGlynn The Money]

1 hour ago, Boab said:

Saint-Denis.

Went through it a few years back and you had to have your wits about you !

Not sure what it's like now but won't be back to find out.

 

Sounds like it's even worse now. Young kids caught up in it all too which is shocking.

[Cruickie's Moustache]

3 hours ago, McGlynn The Money said:

Reading Real Madrid fans on Twitter and they are also saying it was a nightmare. Sounds like the stadium is in a really rough and rundown area. Gangs of youths hanging round assaulting and robbing folk on their way to and from the ground, hellish transport links and the police either absent or looking on doing nothing.

Sounds like our own Hampdump.

 

Seriously the fake ticket thing seems to be a bit of a distraction.

The authorities must know there is always chance of such tickets circulating, therefore a systems  should be in place to deal with it efficiently.

 

The Sky video showing the small gap where fans were funneled through is shocking, as is the apparent situation of only a couple of gates open to allow 20k fans through.

 

Lord knows I've been stuck in a queues along the Wheatfield Place when our club has underestimated the number of fans for things like a mid week League Cup group stage game.

 

So, like traffic jams, build ups of crowds are very sensitive and one or two issues going wrong (like a turnstile failing)  can end up with a nightmare pretty quickly.

 

The question I would be asking of Liverpool FC is did the club's security and UEFA liaison officers see these plans and agree to them or did the Police and onsite stadium guys change any earlier agreed approach to crowd management.

 

Shambles all round, fake tickets or not.

[Sooks]

12 minutes ago, Cruickie's Moustache said:

Seriously the fake ticket thing seems to be a bit of a distraction.

The authorities must know there is always chance of such tickets circulating, therefore a systems  should be in place to deal with it efficiently.

 

How do they do this though if as the French authorities have just stated at a press conference and thousands of illegitimate tickets were used to try and gain access to the stadium ..................................... they can not just let every one in with a hooky ticket or the situation would have been many times worse than it was

[ArcticJambo]

I suspect the funnel was to prevent a situation where you have a massive fan-shaped congregation of heaving fans around a few turnstiles and the inevitability of crushing due to tickets not working or not.  I'm not excusing the logistics btw just trying to explain it, possibly.

 

I remember myself, at the Belgium WC qualifying decider game in Brussels, 2003 or something, along with many others getting(intentionally joing a heaving mass) that pushed into the main Scotland section as we didn't have tickets for that part of the ground, as we had bought them locally.  Was it dangerous? Yes, but I guess we were willing to take that chance! Was it wrong? Yes, clearly! Did we think it was a calculated risk? Probably.  This was teh redeveloped Heysel, afterall.

 

Fans often don't think clearly, especially when drunk, and an element simply don't care.  I wouldn't do it now, as I'm older and wiser (mainly) but back then ....

 

Not sure how teh authorities are meanto control huge numbers of folks, esspecially around stadiums in residential areas.  Balance but thst relies on a degree of cooperation from the fans also.

[Pasquale for King]

2 hours ago, Sooks said:

It would help Liverpool's cause if they could make a concession that the fake ticket fans were a part of the problem I have just watched some really embarrassing guy from a Liverpool podcast refusing to accept LFC fans should take any of the blame

There doesn’t seem to be evidence of any fake tickets, how could the police tell with so many stuck in that big queue and two out of thirteen turnstiles open? 
No doubt there was some but they’re saying 70% of the people there had fakes. 

[Pasquale for King]

23 hours ago, Mikey1874 said:

 

I don't blame Liverpool fans for Heysel, Hillsborough or Paris. 

 

But if you look closely there are questions as to whether all could have been avoided if masses of Liverpool fans hadn't turned up trying to and often succeeding in getting in without tickets. 

 

It's a problem Liverpool seem to have. 

It’s not just Liverpool, our own shameful gruesome twosome do it constantly. 
When Rangers played the second leg of their EL semi at Ibrox you couldn’t see the stairs in any of the three stands opposite the main stand..

We know all to well about Celtic fans at Tynecastle with fakes. 

[Sooks]

Just now, Pasquale for King said:

There doesn’t seem to be evidence of any fake tickets, how could the police tell with so many stuck in that big queue and two out of thirteen turnstiles open? 
No doubt there was some but they’re saying 70% of the people there had fakes. 

 

I am sure there will be evidence and it will come to light but come on mate surely you are not naive enough to think this does not happen we have seen the problems that it causes with policing the Roseburn stand ....................................... the french authorities are accepting there were huge mistakes in how they dealt with the situation but the English media and LFC fans just flat refusing to acknowledge that there were issues with dodgy tickets and that this would have caused a problem

[benny]

Seemingly Liverpool turned down the offer of electronic entry to the ground.

[Sooks]

Just watched Liverpool fan lawyer Susanne Gower on BBC News she seems to think she saw all the tickets that were used to try and gain entry to the stadium because otherwise I can not see how she can categorically state that the Liverpool fans were not trying to gain entry with dodgy ones ........................................ this is the sort of thing i mean one side is accepting criticism and blame for some of the issues while the Liverpool element are just closing ranks and denying any responsibility on the part of LFC fans 

[ArcticJambo]

2 minutes ago, Sooks said:

Just watched Liverpool fan lawyer Susanne Gower on BBC News she seems to think she saw all the tickets that were used to try and gain entry to the stadium because otherwise I can not see how she can categorically state that the Liverpool fans were not trying to gain entry with dodgy ones ........................................ this is the sort of thing i mean one side is accepting criticism and blame for some of the issues while the Liverpool element are just closing ranks and denying any responsibility on the part of LFC fans 

It appears to be similar to what we see along the M8, deny everything! Give no quarter.  Wrt to the never the fans fault, I think it comes back to what a lot of football fans from a certain vintage (those that went from 70s through 90s) 'know' how it works in real life, that there is an element, and a far lager element it appears when it comes to certain clubs, that are willing to take advantage of the situation.  That makes it very difficult for all involved; treading around eggshells these days.  As someone mentioned elsewhere, probably targetting some of the chancers for proper baton treatment, would work wonders.