Rods Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 1 hour ago, The Verminator said: He may have been right, which is a first! https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/52941423 I think he meant it as no reconstruction at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Boy Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 1 hour ago, DETTY29 said: Once this shit fest is over will someone please propose 2 senior professional leagues. No plastic in top league Regionalised pyramid system below that. Promotion is not mandatory to the senior leagues if clubs don't want to or can't meet the criteria. Colt clubs are permitted in the pyramid structure, but must start at the bottom and can't be promoted to senior leagues. 32 team knockout league cup. Also capped percentage of tickets allowed to be sold to the opposition. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soonbe110 Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 1 hour ago, Lone Striker said: An alternative view of having the Bigot Brothers colt teams playing in L2 is that most of their young players will not be good enough to get anywhere near their first teams ..... but their experience of playing senior football in L2 probably makes them decent signing targets for Champ and Premier teams. Not the worst outcome I'd suggest. Good post, similar to us if we have a colts team in lowland league which is probably stronger than current reserve league which is mostly youth players. None of the colts players will be anywhere near the first team in any case. The ones closest to first team will be out on loan in Championship and League 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kidd’s Boots Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 1 minute ago, FinnBarr Saunders said: Stand a better chance getting a tune fi bagpipes. As long as it's in Jig time and not a slow march, I'm more than happy with that!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OTT Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 14-10-10-10 meets the needs of everyone. This idea of colt teams is nothing more than an attempt to grab more cash. They'd hoover up more youngsters and tie them up in their colt teams. Its a god awful idea and will just further the gap between Hearts, Aberdeen and Hibs (financially) and the OF. We need that gap to shrink, not get bigger. Also, 21 is too old IMO and they'd almost certainly push for '3 over 21s' which would grow and grow to the point that they'd be napping senior players like Burke at Killie to help develop their own kids making the other clubs even worse. We need the league to get stronger together, not further the gap. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor FinnBarr Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 2 minutes ago, Kidd’s Boots said: If DS stays I would say yes. Let someone who can actually contribute to the bigger picture with experience and a huge book of contacts and networks put in place people who fit the model for the club going forward. No more square pegs in round holes Should a manager/head coach not have these contacts away? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NANOJAMBO Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 3 minutes ago, RENE said: Don't think the Rangers colts plan is a goer. Clubs already needing money to carry on, adding another Two plus Lowland league and Highland teams isn't going to work. As I said before it's Doncaster's plan of a 14 team Premiership eague they've been asked to consider not ABs 14-14-14. It invigorates the bottom division, puts some cash into their pockets and maintains some integrity for the football pyramid. They'll get testing paid for/other possible support from the JA cash ? Alternative ? Mothball L1 & L2 for at least a year ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo66 Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 1 minute ago, OTT said: 14-10-10-10 meets the needs of everyone. This idea of colt teams is nothing more than an attempt to grab more cash. They'd hoover up more youngsters and tie them up in their colt teams. Its a god awful idea and will just further the gap between Hearts, Aberdeen and Hibs (financially) and the OF. We need that gap to shrink, not get bigger. Also, 21 is too old IMO and they'd almost certainly push for '3 over 21s' which would grow and grow to the point that they'd be napping senior players like Burke at Killie to help develop their own kids making the other clubs even worse. We need the league to get stronger together, not further the gap. 100% this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lone Striker Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 7 minutes ago, Kidd’s Boots said: An interesting proposal to re-invest money from the new Sky deal further down the leagues with joining/ license fee each season etc and the guarantee of taking 200 tickets (£3k per week) to keep the Lower leagues afloat and with their hand on the yes button. When the need for testing cost coverage subsides, I would hope Mr Anderson et al re-direct a significant investment towards the Hearts Academy and support our own Colts for the foreseeable future. Staying away from court, if this proposal is passed, will allow resources to Ben refocused on securing a strong Director of Football for our future. If we stay in the Premiership DS has a valid contract and he needs the support. Here's a name for the position of DoF- Neil Warnock. Excellent post. Hopefully JA re-focuses on Hearts as soon as possible - as you say, there's loads of work to be done behind the scenes. I'd trust Warnock to improve things - loads of experience at English Champ and Premier level. Not sure he'd be willing the embark on a new project at his age though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jamboelite Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 26 minutes ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said: I’m talking about the shite you and others have been backing for months. Backing what exactly ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soonbe110 Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 1 hour ago, Skiba said: What happens if Sevco draw Sevco Colts in one of the cups. Doubt colts teams will be in Betfred or Scottish cups. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flux Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 Hearts should vote against colts just to be different. Looks like Hickey will be the captain of the celtic colt team then for 3 years.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor FinnBarr Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 4 minutes ago, soonbe110 said: Good post, similar to us if we have a colts team in lowland league which is probably stronger than current reserve league which is mostly youth players. None of the colts players will be anywhere near the first team in any case. The ones closest to first team will be out on loan in Championship and League 1 You do know we don't actually have a reserve league? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo66 Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 Just now, NANOJAMBO said: It invigorates the bottom division, puts some cash into their pockets and maintains some integrity for the football pyramid. They'll get testing paid for/other possible support from the JA cash ? Alternative ? Mothball L1 & L2 for at least a year ? Except it doesn't maintain integrity for the football pyramid. 2 teams will never be relegated from that bottom league because they are paying to be in it. That's why it's bribery. I'd go as far as to suggest it's illegal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kidd’s Boots Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 Just now, Lone Striker said: Excellent post. Hopefully JA re-focuses on Hearts as soon as possible - as you say, there's loads of work to be done behind the scenes. I'd trust Warnock to improve things - loads of experience at English Champ and Premier level. Not sure he'd be willing the embark on a new project at his age though. Was linked and quoted in the press at the time as 'interested' before DS was appointed. Think he is just the right age for this and would make an impact at Board level too given his experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kila Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 1 minute ago, NANOJAMBO said: It invigorates the bottom division, puts some cash into their pockets and maintains some integrity for the football pyramid. They'll get testing paid for/other possible support from the JA cash ? Alternative ? Mothball L1 & L2 for at least a year ? We don't know what lower league clubs will commit to playing football this year, even with JA money or the Old Firm coin. Oh and another point I thought of - while the money will be nice for the third tier to begin with, once the colts are promoted to the 2nd tier the third tier will be left in tatters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qferryjam Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 10 minutes ago, Captain Canada said: I don't think having a colt team is the advantage others think it is. Getting your younger players booted all over the place on rubbish pitches and probably still not able to make the jump into the first team is more likely the reality of it. The best thing for us is to stay up for all kinds of reasons, so I'm prioritising that over anything else that might happen as a result. Playing competitive football winning games having that structure allied to their superiority in the top league and ready to go replacements albeit under 21s , they could be playing in the championship , I notice there are no other invitations to other teams as per they want to be in control of the Agenda , other countries have healthy following for their b teams this is about their Brands continuing to dominate no altruism involved Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riccarton3 Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 11 minutes ago, Riccarton3 said: It's a face saving exercise for these *****. Other clubs will be screaming from the rooftops, fighting to get a quote in. Eh, nah. Shower of hypocrites will be crawling back under their stones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soonbe110 Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 1 hour ago, JamboGraham said: No issue with this new proposal.... Objective 1, we (correctly) stay in the top flight. In time all of the SPFL bottom feeders will be replaced with colt sides of Hearts, Hibs, Aberdeen, etc. (Good for us!). In time Scottish football transitions to 28 proper professional clubs and a group of second sides/aspiring ambitious clubs coming in and out via the pyramid. Yep, it’s a major step forward for most clubs. Not sure I understand why there is so much opposition to it on here. For us it means we stay in top league and we can put a colts team into lowland league and eventually leagues 1 or 2. Much better for developing players than current reserve set-up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OTT Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 3 minutes ago, Lone Striker said: Excellent post. Hopefully JA re-focuses on Hearts as soon as possible - as you say, there's loads of work to be done behind the scenes. I'd trust Warnock to improve things - loads of experience at English Champ and Premier level. Not sure he'd be willing the embark on a new project at his age though. Give the propensity for these chairmen to believe they can have their cake and eat it, I fully expect there still to be an expectation that JA will still put in his £2m. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lone Striker Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 8 minutes ago, Smithee said: As I say I haven't seen much evidence of it being a great positive, but let's assume you're right, why would I be behind a proposal that improves Celtic and the rangers' young players and no one else's? I've been saying forever that this is the first step to them leaving, one day the main team will join a big league and the colts will be rebranded as the domestic squad or something and will remain in the league. They'll get to have their pie and eat it. It's not massively attractive IMO Who is going to want them and their repulsive fans invading their cities every fortnight ? Maybe some crackpot Euro league idea might get dreamt up by UEFA ...... in which case it would be wonderful to wave the bon voyage !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Boy Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 Colt teams being allowed to reach the Championship is a big no-no for me. League 2 or whatever, fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henryheart Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 20 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said: I would prefer to stay demoted and start games in October than back this. If we go down the colt route, why just Rangers and Celtic colt teams? Do other teams not have young players? In fact, other teams have better young players than the OF. Just because it is Rangers and Celtic I suppose, yet we criticise other because they are voting against reconstruction on an anti-Hearts ticket? I have no issue with what is proposed and it happens to a small extent already in the Challenge Cup - this system works very well in Germany and Spain, so why not in Scotland? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rods Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 If Anne Budges proposal is defeated but we remain in the league does that give the hobos a get out of jail card. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billybuffjaw Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 17 minutes ago, Heartsmad1874 said: They can aslong as they pay 25K to get into Highland or Lowland League. But there's only 2 places, what if we Hibs and Aberdeen want a place? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qferryjam Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 17 minutes ago, Kidd’s Boots said: He may know how to get a tune out of him Only if Damour plays the piano Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soonbe110 Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 55 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said: Colt teams are fine as long as every club that wants to can do it. Proposal says they can I believe so it seems fair enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yoda Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 18 minutes ago, gashauskis9 said: Warnock recommended Damour. He can GTF. Didn't play him all season, then found a gullible idiot called Craig Levein to give him a 4 year contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soonbe110 Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 54 minutes ago, JamboGraham said: Our average age in the Championship season was 24...the only time we started a match with an average age of 21 we were defeated 4-1 by Livi in the challenge cup. No squad players over 21 is a massive restriction. It is and would almost certainly restrict their promotion chances. If the rules are the same as other countries re B teams they can only promote players from colts to first team squad during the summer transfer window so that restricts them as well Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unknown user Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 4 minutes ago, Lone Striker said: Who is going to want them and their repulsive fans invading their cities every fortnight ? Maybe some crackpot Euro league idea might get dreamt up by UEFA ...... in which case it would be wonderful to wave the bon voyage !! But that's the point, they'd be leaving their colts behind to financially dominate the domestic game. No ta. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NANOJAMBO Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 Meanwhile over at the lunatic asylum- "This Rangers proposal just can’t happen. Here is a scenario, a few years down the line the Hun colts have made it to the Championship. A global pandemic causes major revenue problems and the Huns have a bang average season and then enter administration, getting hit with a points deduction. The points deduction is enough to get them relegated. The Huns and the Huns colts now play in the same league. Whilst it is a creative scenario it is not beyond the realms of complete fantasy, surely the constitution of the SPFL simply wouldn’t allow for it?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heartsmad1874 Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 3 minutes ago, Billybuffjaw said: But there's only 2 places, what if we Hibs and Aberdeen want a place? Not sure maybe the SPFL can have some robust conversations with the Lowland League chairman again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gmcjambo Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 2 minutes ago, henryheart said: Just because it is Rangers and Celtic I suppose, yet we criticise other because they are voting against reconstruction on an anti-Hearts ticket? I have no issue with what is proposed and it happens to a small extent already in the Challenge Cup - this system works very well in Germany and Spain, so why not in Scotland? On what basis should Celtic and Rangers be treated differently to other SPL teams though? Their arrogance is astonishing. They are being opportunists trying to take advantage in a crisis. As a matter of principle I'm dead against this. The good news is they have had to come out in favour of recon and they don't want to see teams unfairly relegated so they can't turn back on that now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Merse Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 Struggle to understand the outrage on this proposal tbh. Would snap their hand off for it. I really don’t think the Old Firm would benefit to any level which would impact us by entering the colt teams. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soonbe110 Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 56 minutes ago, Anything2 said: Now the uglies have decided what they want, it's probably inevitable that will come to pass. Overall it's a win for us as the diabolical decision to demote us, Partick and Stranraer will be overturned so primary objective achieved. However, using the current situation to engineer some additional benefits for yourself is just plain wrong, in fact is corrupt as they are basically saying we want colt teams or we are vetoing reconstruction, and the assumption that they should go straight in and other teams can bid to join the lowland/Highland leagues is off the charts arrogant. What if anyone else wanted to join? And, it just messes with the whole integrity of the championship as a competition, you could finish 3rd and get automatic promotion and what if it's a close run in and you have B teams with objectives other than winning the game playing teams who are in a championship race. It just feels wrong to me. They are paying £125k each upfront to go straight in. Not sure many, if any, other top league teams would want to do that. Also paying extra money in each of next three seasons. We have to pay £25k to join lowland league. Will we do that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kidd’s Boots Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 3 minutes ago, OTT said: Give the propensity for these chairmen to believe they can have their cake and eat it, I fully expect there still to be an expectation that JA will still put in his £2m. I'm sure he will and more if needed. I just crossed my mind that this is an opportunity and again if voting passes this proposal, that this is the kind of grassroots opportunity he may find really worthwhile and strongly get behind for our youngsters. As I say, the first team management structure will require serious investment, normally to the detriment of developing talent. We have the infrastructure, guaranteed long term investment would be the icing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stanley_ Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 It'll be a joke if colt teams are allowed in League Two. None of the fans of those clubs want to see their teams play against colt sides and will likely boycott the matches and the colt teams are likely to get a terrible support as well (there are not tonnes of people out their desperate to see Celtic colts v Elgin City). It's bad enough having two Old Firm clubs in our league without adding another two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctor FinnBarr Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, The Merse said: Struggle to understand the outrage on this proposal tbh. Would snap their hand off for it. I really don’t think the Old Firm would benefit to any level which would impact us by entering the colt teams. Not us, them Sorry, buggered up in the reading of your statement. Edited June 5, 2020 by FinnBarr Saunders Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beast Boy Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 1 minute ago, The Merse said: Struggle to understand the outrage on this proposal tbh. Would snap their hand off for it. I really don’t think the Old Firm would benefit to any level which would impact us by entering the colt teams. Championship is too high a level though. It would affect promotion from the league below. If they weren’t allowed to get any higher than L2 (L1 at an absolute push), then I’d be less fussy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neilnunb Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 I quite like the Rangers proposal...hopefully they'd both finish above shite like Brechin, Cowdenbeath and see them relegated for good. 😁 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gashauskis9 Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 Sun saying the proposal is ‘officially’ dead. Good, get on with legal proceedings while Rangers float their colts idea about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NANOJAMBO Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 Just now, Stanley_ said: It'll be a joke if colt teams are allowed in League Two. None of the fans of those clubs want to see their teams play against colt sides and will likely boycott the matches and the colt teams are likely to get a terrible support as well (there are not tonnes of people out their desperate to see Celtic colts v Elgin City). It's bad enough having two Old Firm clubs in our league without adding another two. Just about every one dog town their colts team will be visiting have OF fans who will be quite happy to see their teams play. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heartsmad1874 Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 1 minute ago, Stanley_ said: It'll be a joke if colt teams are allowed in League Two. None of the fans of those clubs want to see their teams play against colt sides and will likely boycott the matches and the colt teams are likely to get a terrible support as well (there are not tonnes of people out their desperate to see Celtic colts v Elgin City). It's bad enough having two Old Firm clubs in our league without adding another two. Both have committed to buying 200 tickets at £15 each for each away game plus will pay £1000 if streaming facilities are available and will pay £125K with further payments each year to enter, if your the chairman of a League Two club you'd snap their hands off for it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Billybuffjaw Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 1 minute ago, Special Officer Doofy said: Championship is too high a level though. It would affect promotion from the league below. If they weren’t allowed to get any higher than L2 (L1 at an absolute push), then I’d be less fussy. That's where I am on it, there should be absolutely NO promotion from the bottom tier for any colt team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anything2 Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 2 minutes ago, soonbe110 said: They are paying £125k each upfront to go straight in. Not sure many, if any, other top league teams would want to do that. Also paying extra money in each of next three seasons. We have to pay £25k to join lowland league. Will we do that? If they paid £500,000 would you let them straight into the championship? It's not the money, it's the assumption that they are the only ones who will have the opportunity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stanley_ Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 Just now, NANOJAMBO said: Just about every one dog town their colts team will be visiting have OF fans who will be quite happy to see their teams play. I think you're totally overestimating the interest. There are glory hunters supporting the Old Firm in every city in Scotland but they seriously aren't likely to be interested in watching a colt side. They "support" the clubs because they are top two in the Premier almost every season, they aren't really interested in lower league football. If they were then the Challenge Cup crowds would have been an awful lot higher. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambof3tornado Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 12 minutes ago, Special Officer Doofy said: Colt teams being allowed to reach the Championship is a big no-no for me. League 2 or whatever, fine. Yup, no higher than league 2. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamboAl Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 Rightly or wrongly, I was always undet the impression that one owner could not own 2 clubs which, if correct, would rule out any notion of colts clubs in the main leagues plus it would be tantamount to putting 2 fingers up to the pyramid system Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Randy Marsh Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 4 minutes ago, NANOJAMBO said: Meanwhile over at the lunatic asylum- "This Rangers proposal just can’t happen. Here is a scenario, a few years down the line the Hun colts have made it to the Championship. A global pandemic causes major revenue problems and the Huns have a bang average season and then enter administration, getting hit with a points deduction. The points deduction is enough to get them relegated. The Huns and the Huns colts now play in the same league. Whilst it is a creative scenario it is not beyond the realms of complete fantasy, surely the constitution of the SPFL simply wouldn’t allow for it?" Similar thing happened in Spain 8 years ago. Villarreal got relegated to the 2nd tier where Villarreal B had just finished 6th in that league. Obviously the B team weren't eligible for promotion to La Liga so didn't contest the playoffs. They were placed in the regional 3rd tier the next season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheBigO Posted June 5, 2020 Share Posted June 5, 2020 4 minutes ago, The Merse said: Struggle to understand the outrage on this proposal tbh. Would snap their hand off for it. I really don’t think the Old Firm would benefit to any level which would impact us by entering the colt teams. I'm not sure my thoughts on colt teams. Other countries seem to do it successfully. The issue is the scum using this situation to suit themselves rather than do a single thing to help our game. I'm sick. Bloody sick of those two riding roughshod over our game. No bones about it this whole situation has been created because Celtic snapped their fingers. And a different shitstorm would have been Brought about had both sets of scum been level on points. We need to be the club to burn the system down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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