SPFL and Covid ( Leagues 1 and 2 to restart )

[Hungry hippo]

10 minutes ago, Newton51 said:

Picture didn’t load but story from paper yesterday suggested league 1 and 2 have no way of restarting even with testing and fewer games

 

What was the reason given?

[Newton51]

18 minutes ago, Hungry hippo said:

 

What was the reason given?

https://www.pieandbovril.com/forum/applications/tapatalk/index.php?/topic/266676-Season-a-write-off%3F

[Hungry hippo]

34 minutes ago, Newton51 said:

https://www.pieandbovril.com/forum/applications/tapatalk/index.php?/topic/266676-Season-a-write-off%3F

 

Cheers.

 

I would say that is a very one sided opinion piece favouring scrapping the seasons.

 

Reasons such as the time players would get home after testing are nonsense. Pretty sure the part time Alloa players are coping fine.

[Newton51]

3 minutes ago, Hungry hippo said:

 

Cheers.

 

I would say that is a very one sided opinion piece favouring scrapping the seasons.

 

Reasons such as the time players would get home after testing are nonsense. Pretty sure the part time Alloa players are coping fine.

Probably one sided but couldn’t rule it out after shenanigans last year. Especially with Alloa bottom of the league and Brechin 

[Newton51]

Today (Monday 15th February) was the day that League One and Two clubs had scribbled in their diaries to return to training, ahead of resuming their paused season. Their ‘A Route to Playing’ document had rubber-stamped the club's desire to restart the game and scrap out for winners and losers until the end of the season.

After the previous summer of infighting and snidey comments from lower league Chairmen regarding the most affected clubs of the first COVID shutdown, it was quite heartening to see a plan submitted that would require testing across the board in order to restart the leagues.

However, the only losers look to be the clubs themselves, with the Scottish FA announcing yet again to despondent fans across the country that their beloved game is on hold until March at the very earliest. The SFA’s response was extremely surprising given that League One and Two clubs did what no-one thought possible a few weeks ago – worked together for the greater good.

The SFA’s response to this was “Regrettably, the government has today confirmed that – in cognisance of the current restrictions in place across the country – they cannot currently commit to return dates for those affected leagues in the coming weeks.”

The key takeaway from that statement should be that the Government has confirmed that there is no return in place. This was despite the initial Monday 11th January statement that explained it was an SFA decision to suspend the leagues. The footballing authorities threw the leagues below the Championship under an oncoming bus, without the courtesy of explaining why.

Outraged club chiefs have stated there was no pre-warning, no opportunity to test (which was offered to the Championship) and no guarantee that the leagues would actually restart. It kicked off yet another messy affair which led to allegations of ‘Zoom call muting’ as the decisions were supposedly explained well after the harm had been done.

After finally looking like the door to football was about to re-open, the nation’s governing body decided to once again slam it in the face of its members. Not just in the face of League One and Two, but the Highland League, Lowland League, along with Women's football and regional leagues.

Should it have continued at all?

The second wave of rising COVID cases means there is a strong argument that all football should not have recommenced until the coronavirus was suppressed. It can never be overstated just how tragic the past year has been, losing unnecessary lives as a result. Many fans argue from a mental health standpoint; it has great to have football continued at these levels. Whilst this may be true, it has been an absolute slog of a campaign, with the previous all-encompassing feeling of importance attached to the sport diminished to a shadow of its previous self.

The absence of fans, poor quality of football (not much new there) and general apathy towards the matches on television have left plenty of fans somewhat deflated. Nonetheless, the clubs have spent significant money on streaming to offset the fans' absence and keep them afloat until supporters can return. All the Scottish lower leagues were explicitly consulted at the start of the season whether they wanted to play the season or go into ‘hibernation’. The clubs agreed to play a 27-game shortened season, offering time to complete the campaigns in the event of COVID call offs. With that in mind, it was yet another betrayal of their trust that the SFA suspended their leagues on January 11th with no resume date on the horizon.

What happens now?

Make no mistake, the clubs, fans and players are once again being cast aside, possibly at the expense of the bigger clubs in Scotland. When a league campaign is started, it should be finished. This was what was laid out to the teams at the start of the season, yet the SFA have so far torn that idea up. What comes next is crucial for these clubs, and for the much-fabled word that seems to now be synonymous with football in this country's ‘sporting integrity’.

If the SFA choose to scrap the season, it sends the complete wrong message again to all of its members. There is still March, April and May to play, possibly with a shortened 18 game season. One idea mooted would be to sacrifice the Scottish Cup. TV contracts once again may prove to be far more significant to the Hampden bosses than any campaign completion for their smaller members. All eyes are now on the suits making the big decisions.

[Hungry hippo]

Just now, Newton51 said:

Probably one sided but couldn’t rule it out after shenanigans last year. Especially with Alloa bottom of the league and Brechin 

 

100% wouldn't rule it out as it is clearly what a lot of the lower league clubs are wanting. My point was just that the justifications being spouted as fact in that article are debatable at best.

[Hungry hippo]

4 minutes ago, Newton51 said:

Today (Monday 15th February) was the day that League One and Two clubs had scribbled in their diaries to return to training, ahead of resuming their paused season. Their ‘A Route to Playing’ document had rubber-stamped the club's desire to restart the game and scrap out for winners and losers until the end of the season.

After the previous summer of infighting and snidey comments from lower league Chairmen regarding the most affected clubs of the first COVID shutdown, it was quite heartening to see a plan submitted that would require testing across the board in order to restart the leagues.

However, the only losers look to be the clubs themselves, with the Scottish FA announcing yet again to despondent fans across the country that their beloved game is on hold until March at the very earliest. The SFA’s response was extremely surprising given that League One and Two clubs did what no-one thought possible a few weeks ago – worked together for the greater good.

The SFA’s response to this was “Regrettably, the government has today confirmed that – in cognisance of the current restrictions in place across the country – they cannot currently commit to return dates for those affected leagues in the coming weeks.”

The key takeaway from that statement should be that the Government has confirmed that there is no return in place. This was despite the initial Monday 11th January statement that explained it was an SFA decision to suspend the leagues. The footballing authorities threw the leagues below the Championship under an oncoming bus, without the courtesy of explaining why.

Outraged club chiefs have stated there was no pre-warning, no opportunity to test (which was offered to the Championship) and no guarantee that the leagues would actually restart. It kicked off yet another messy affair which led to allegations of ‘Zoom call muting’ as the decisions were supposedly explained well after the harm had been done.

After finally looking like the door to football was about to re-open, the nation’s governing body decided to once again slam it in the face of its members. Not just in the face of League One and Two, but the Highland League, Lowland League, along with Women's football and regional leagues.

Should it have continued at all?

The second wave of rising COVID cases means there is a strong argument that all football should not have recommenced until the coronavirus was suppressed. It can never be overstated just how tragic the past year has been, losing unnecessary lives as a result. Many fans argue from a mental health standpoint; it has great to have football continued at these levels. Whilst this may be true, it has been an absolute slog of a campaign, with the previous all-encompassing feeling of importance attached to the sport diminished to a shadow of its previous self.

The absence of fans, poor quality of football (not much new there) and general apathy towards the matches on television have left plenty of fans somewhat deflated. Nonetheless, the clubs have spent significant money on streaming to offset the fans' absence and keep them afloat until supporters can return. All the Scottish lower leagues were explicitly consulted at the start of the season whether they wanted to play the season or go into ‘hibernation’. The clubs agreed to play a 27-game shortened season, offering time to complete the campaigns in the event of COVID call offs. With that in mind, it was yet another betrayal of their trust that the SFA suspended their leagues on January 11th with no resume date on the horizon.

What happens now?

Make no mistake, the clubs, fans and players are once again being cast aside, possibly at the expense of the bigger clubs in Scotland. When a league campaign is started, it should be finished. This was what was laid out to the teams at the start of the season, yet the SFA have so far torn that idea up. What comes next is crucial for these clubs, and for the much-fabled word that seems to now be synonymous with football in this country's ‘sporting integrity’.

If the SFA choose to scrap the season, it sends the complete wrong message again to all of its members. There is still March, April and May to play, possibly with a shortened 18 game season. One idea mooted would be to sacrifice the Scottish Cup. TV contracts once again may prove to be far more significant to the Hampden bosses than any campaign completion for their smaller members. All eyes are now on the suits making the big decisions.

 

That's a far better summary of the position that the Sunday Mail article on P&B.

[davemclaren]

39 minutes ago, Newton51 said:

Today (Monday 15th February) was the day that League One and Two clubs had scribbled in their diaries to return to training, ahead of resuming their paused season. Their ‘A Route to Playing’ document had rubber-stamped the club's desire to restart the game and scrap out for winners and losers until the end of the season.

After the previous summer of infighting and snidey comments from lower league Chairmen regarding the most affected clubs of the first COVID shutdown, it was quite heartening to see a plan submitted that would require testing across the board in order to restart the leagues.

However, the only losers look to be the clubs themselves, with the Scottish FA announcing yet again to despondent fans across the country that their beloved game is on hold until March at the very earliest. The SFA’s response was extremely surprising given that League One and Two clubs did what no-one thought possible a few weeks ago – worked together for the greater good.

The SFA’s response to this was “Regrettably, the government has today confirmed that – in cognisance of the current restrictions in place across the country – they cannot currently commit to return dates for those affected leagues in the coming weeks.”

The key takeaway from that statement should be that the Government has confirmed that there is no return in place. This was despite the initial Monday 11th January statement that explained it was an SFA decision to suspend the leagues. The footballing authorities threw the leagues below the Championship under an oncoming bus, without the courtesy of explaining why.

Outraged club chiefs have stated there was no pre-warning, no opportunity to test (which was offered to the Championship) and no guarantee that the leagues would actually restart. It kicked off yet another messy affair which led to allegations of ‘Zoom call muting’ as the decisions were supposedly explained well after the harm had been done.

After finally looking like the door to football was about to re-open, the nation’s governing body decided to once again slam it in the face of its members. Not just in the face of League One and Two, but the Highland League, Lowland League, along with Women's football and regional leagues.

Should it have continued at all?

The second wave of rising COVID cases means there is a strong argument that all football should not have recommenced until the coronavirus was suppressed. It can never be overstated just how tragic the past year has been, losing unnecessary lives as a result. Many fans argue from a mental health standpoint; it has great to have football continued at these levels. Whilst this may be true, it has been an absolute slog of a campaign, with the previous all-encompassing feeling of importance attached to the sport diminished to a shadow of its previous self.

The absence of fans, poor quality of football (not much new there) and general apathy towards the matches on television have left plenty of fans somewhat deflated. Nonetheless, the clubs have spent significant money on streaming to offset the fans' absence and keep them afloat until supporters can return. All the Scottish lower leagues were explicitly consulted at the start of the season whether they wanted to play the season or go into ‘hibernation’. The clubs agreed to play a 27-game shortened season, offering time to complete the campaigns in the event of COVID call offs. With that in mind, it was yet another betrayal of their trust that the SFA suspended their leagues on January 11th with no resume date on the horizon.

What happens now?

Make no mistake, the clubs, fans and players are once again being cast aside, possibly at the expense of the bigger clubs in Scotland. When a league campaign is started, it should be finished. This was what was laid out to the teams at the start of the season, yet the SFA have so far torn that idea up. What comes next is crucial for these clubs, and for the much-fabled word that seems to now be synonymous with football in this country's ‘sporting integrity’.

If the SFA choose to scrap the season, it sends the complete wrong message again to all of its members. There is still March, April and May to play, possibly with a shortened 18 game season. One idea mooted would be to sacrifice the Scottish Cup. TV contracts once again may prove to be far more significant to the Hampden bosses than any campaign completion for their smaller members. All eyes are now on the suits making the big decisions.

Do you have a link to this?

[Rogue Daddy]

47 minutes ago, Newton51 said:

Today (Monday 15th February) was the day that League One and Two clubs had scribbled in their diaries to return to training, ahead of resuming their paused season. Their ‘A Route to Playing’ document had rubber-stamped the club's desire to restart the game and scrap out for winners and losers until the end of the season.

After the previous summer of infighting and snidey comments from lower league Chairmen regarding the most affected clubs of the first COVID shutdown, it was quite heartening to see a plan submitted that would require testing across the board in order to restart the leagues.

However, the only losers look to be the clubs themselves, with the Scottish FA announcing yet again to despondent fans across the country that their beloved game is on hold until March at the very earliest. The SFA’s response was extremely surprising given that League One and Two clubs did what no-one thought possible a few weeks ago – worked together for the greater good.

The SFA’s response to this was “Regrettably, the government has today confirmed that – in cognisance of the current restrictions in place across the country – they cannot currently commit to return dates for those affected leagues in the coming weeks.”

The key takeaway from that statement should be that the Government has confirmed that there is no return in place. This was despite the initial Monday 11th January statement that explained it was an SFA decision to suspend the leagues. The footballing authorities threw the leagues below the Championship under an oncoming bus, without the courtesy of explaining why.

Outraged club chiefs have stated there was no pre-warning, no opportunity to test (which was offered to the Championship) and no guarantee that the leagues would actually restart. It kicked off yet another messy affair which led to allegations of ‘Zoom call muting’ as the decisions were supposedly explained well after the harm had been done.

After finally looking like the door to football was about to re-open, the nation’s governing body decided to once again slam it in the face of its members. Not just in the face of League One and Two, but the Highland League, Lowland League, along with Women's football and regional leagues.

Should it have continued at all?

The second wave of rising COVID cases means there is a strong argument that all football should not have recommenced until the coronavirus was suppressed. It can never be overstated just how tragic the past year has been, losing unnecessary lives as a result. Many fans argue from a mental health standpoint; it has great to have football continued at these levels. Whilst this may be true, it has been an absolute slog of a campaign, with the previous all-encompassing feeling of importance attached to the sport diminished to a shadow of its previous self.

The absence of fans, poor quality of football (not much new there) and general apathy towards the matches on television have left plenty of fans somewhat deflated. Nonetheless, the clubs have spent significant money on streaming to offset the fans' absence and keep them afloat until supporters can return. All the Scottish lower leagues were explicitly consulted at the start of the season whether they wanted to play the season or go into ‘hibernation’. The clubs agreed to play a 27-game shortened season, offering time to complete the campaigns in the event of COVID call offs. With that in mind, it was yet another betrayal of their trust that the SFA suspended their leagues on January 11th with no resume date on the horizon.

What happens now?

Make no mistake, the clubs, fans and players are once again being cast aside, possibly at the expense of the bigger clubs in Scotland. When a league campaign is started, it should be finished. This was what was laid out to the teams at the start of the season, yet the SFA have so far torn that idea up. What comes next is crucial for these clubs, and for the much-fabled word that seems to now be synonymous with football in this country's ‘sporting integrity’.

If the SFA choose to scrap the season, it sends the complete wrong message again to all of its members. There is still March, April and May to play, possibly with a shortened 18 game season. One idea mooted would be to sacrifice the Scottish Cup. TV contracts once again may prove to be far more significant to the Hampden bosses than any campaign completion for their smaller members. All eyes are now on the suits making the big decisions.

Its amazing that all through the shenanigans of last year, the spfl continually spouted the usual "we just do what we are told" crap, we just carry out the will of the clubs. So much so, they asked clubs to vote to give the spfl/sfa 'special powers' to be able to decide to call the league how they (spfl/sfa) see fit and avoid a shambles like last year. Needless to say, virtually all cubs voted no to that. But here we are, leagues 1 & 2 shut down (or postponed) with no re-start in sight... nobody voted, nobody was consulted. The spfl/sfa just did what they wanted. 

So, what is it spfl/sfa - do you do what you want when it suits you?... or do you really only do what you are told?

Why do we in Scottish football put up with this crap?! Year after year after year!

[Newton51]

29 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

Do you have a link to this?

 

[Newton51]

40 minutes ago, davemclaren said:

Do you have a link to this?

 

[Newton51]

 

[davemclaren]

1 minute ago, Newton51 said:

 

Thanks 👍

[SectionDJambo]

As has been said, Doncaster’s constant narrative was to say, during all the shenanigans of the summer, that he was only following the wishes of the SPFL clubs. It was nothing to do with him, he’s only the administrator of the what the clubs want to happen.

So now, we find that huge decisions are made without the clubs being consulted, decisions that could affect the financial well-being of the clubs concerned or hinder their future playing ambitions. More sinisterly, it opens up the likelihood that Brechin City, again, and Alloa Athletic may avoid relegation, by a decision made involving their representatives on the board of the SPFL. 
The meeting called to discuss this pause in the playing of matches in leagues 1 and 2, and other matters, was subject to previously written questions, being submitted for approval of the SPFL board, being raised during the meeting. Then, during the meeting itself, the voices of participants were muted, so as to suppress their examinations of what was going on.

And nobody in the Scottish sports media sees fit to give any high profile coverage or investigation of this kind of behaviour.

If these clubs in leagues 1 and 2 don’t realise now that they were used for other club’s agendas during the summer, then they are as thick as the hills. 
Scottish football has never been so openly corrupt of decision making or disrespectful of the fans who pay money into their clubs, and others. It is a disgrace and it’s high time that the clubs got together to propose a motion of no confidence in the SPFL board.

But it won’t happen. Too many chairmen apparently in the pockets of the few who actually control the game in Scotland.

[Newton51]

Ladbrokes League 1 & League 2 (15 supporting votes needed)

this is the magic number of clubs will have to approve restarting league 1 and 2 with a likelier 18 game season on the table. There are too many whose best interest are to stop now until next season

 

[Rogue Daddy]

3 minutes ago, Newton51 said:

Ladbrokes League 1 & League 2 (15 supporting votes needed)

this is the magic number of clubs will have to approve restarting league 1 and 2 with a likelier 18 game season on the table. There are too many whose best interest are to stop now until next season

 

...unless you add in promotion and relegation to where teams stand now (which, granted, would be a joke considering how many games have been played... but, hey, this is Scottish football!)

[Jambo in Yorkshire]

I mentioned previously that over 100 teams are playing in Serie D in Italy.

 

There were dozens of amateur teams playing in the French Cup at the weekend, some from very small villages.

 

How can Italy and France keep football going when we have stopped the cup and Leagues 1&2?

[Hungry hippo]

49 minutes ago, Newton51 said:

Ladbrokes League 1 & League 2 (15 supporting votes needed)

this is the magic number of clubs will have to approve restarting league 1 and 2 with a likelier 18 game season on the table. There are too many whose best interest are to stop now until next season

 

 

Why is a 75% majority required to restart the league when no votes were required to "pause" the leagues in the first place. The SPFL is one contradiction after another

 

Edit - I think I've answered my own question. That vote would be to authorise the reduced season rather than simply restarting the league.

Edited February 15, 2021 by Hungry hippo

[Newton51]

1 minute ago, Hungry hippo said:

 

Why is a 75% majority required to restart the league when no votes were required to "pause" the leagues in the first place. The SPFL is one contradiction after another

 They will have to agree to reduce to 18 games so this will have to go to a vote. Reckon this further delay is to push teams on this. No way some of these teams will pay for testing

[Hungry hippo]

1 minute ago, Newton51 said:

 They will have to agree to reduce to 18 games so this will have to go to a vote. Reckon this further delay is to push teams on this. No way some of these teams will pay for testing

 

Yeah, any change to the agreed season would need a vote including null and void or calling the and 18 games would seem most likely to suit enough to gain approval.

[Guest ToqueJambo]

4 hours ago, Newton51 said:

https://www.pieandbovril.com/forum/applications/tapatalk/index.php?/topic/266676-Season-a-write-off%3F

 

The desperation from some lower league fans for all of football to be called off just because their part-time clubs can't operate properly during a pandemic is something to behold. And the clubs they support have a vote that can affect the livelihoods of people who take football seriously enough to make it their career. Total disgrace. I used to support part-time clubs being part of the setup but the actions of a lot of their fans shows they don't give a shit about Scottish football as a whole. One thing that should come out of this whole thing is restructuring to focus on full-time clubs only.

[Des Lynam]

2 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

The desperation from some lower league fans for all of football to be called off just because their part-time clubs can't operate properly during a pandemic is something to behold. And the clubs they support have a vote that can affect the livelihoods of people who take football seriously enough to make it their career. Total disgrace. I used to support part-time clubs being part of the setup but the actions of a lot of their fans shows they don't give a shit about Scottish football as a whole. One thing that should come out of this whole thing is restructuring to focus on full-time clubs only.

 

Fully agree. I used to have some romantic feelings for these lower league clubs and their standing within Scottish football but now I think they hold it back. Shitey wee clubs who should be muted permanently. 

[Saint Jambo]

1 hour ago, SectionDJambo said:

As has been said, Doncaster’s constant narrative was to say, during all the shenanigans of the summer, that he was only following the wishes of the SPFL clubs. It was nothing to do with him, he’s only the administrator of the what the clubs want to happen.

So now, we find that huge decisions are made without the clubs being consulted, decisions that could affect the financial well-being of the clubs concerned or hinder their future playing ambitions. More sinisterly, it opens up the likelihood that Brechin City, again, and Alloa Athletic may avoid relegation, by a decision made involving their representatives on the board of the SPFL. 
The meeting called to discuss this pause in the playing of matches in leagues 1 and 2, and other matters, was subject to previously written questions, being submitted for approval of the SPFL board, being raised during the meeting. Then, during the meeting itself, the voices of participants were muted, so as to suppress their examinations of what was going on.

And nobody in the Scottish sports media sees fit to give any high profile coverage or investigation of this kind of behaviour.

If these clubs in leagues 1 and 2 don’t realise now that they were used for other club’s agendas during the summer, then they are as thick as the hills. 
Scottish football has never been so openly corrupt of decision making or disrespectful of the fans who pay money into their clubs, and others. It is a disgrace and it’s high time that the clubs got together to propose a motion of no confidence in the SPFL board.

But it won’t happen. Too many chairmen apparently in the pockets of the few who actually control the game in Scotland.

 

Football below the Championship was suspended by the SFA not the SPFL. That was why no vote was required. It was also why a single decision could take in not just League 1 and League 2 but all the leagues that were still operating below that (tiers 5 to 7) and all levels of women's football that were operating. The SFA is in a position to suspend football and restart football (subject to Government permission, although there is some confusion over whether that is really being withheld). However, the SFA are not in a position to decide whether to null and void a league, call it early or decide to extend the season. For Leagues 1 and 2 that would be a decision for the SPFL by way of a members vote.

 

33 minutes ago, Jambo in Yorkshire said:

I mentioned previously that over 100 teams are playing in Serie D in Italy.

 

There were dozens of amateur teams playing in the French Cup at the weekend, some from very small villages.

 

How can Italy and France keep football going when we have stopped the cup and Leagues 1&2?

 

It isn't a question of the science should that Activity X is safe or not safe. All activity where people are together has a risk of transmission of the virus. Government are working to reduce overall risk, balanced against other negative impacts (economic, societal, other health impacts). Different Governments will come to different decisions about both what they are prioritising to allow to happen and what overall level of risk of transmission they are happy with. This will also be informed by other factors such as transmission rates and health care capacity which will vary by country. It really is not as simple as saying 'if activity X can happen in one place, it should be able to happen everywhere'. Unfortunately that is the impression that the media give, particularly in Scotland with their constant desire to make simplistic comparisons to England.

[Guest ToqueJambo]

4 minutes ago, Saint Jambo said:

 

Football below the Championship was suspended by the SFA not the SPFL. That was why no vote was required. It was also why a single decision could take in not just League 1 and League 2 but all the leagues that were still operating below that (tiers 5 to 7) and all levels of women's football that were operating. The SFA is in a position to suspend football and restart football (subject to Government permission, although there is some confusion over whether that is really being withheld). However, the SFA are not in a position to decide whether to null and void a league, call it early or decide to extend the season. For Leagues 1 and 2 that would be a decision for the SPFL by way of a members vote.

 

 

It was the JRG that made the decision I think, which includes Neil Doncaster. There's no leadership anywhere basically. People just passing the buck and blaming everyone else.

Edited February 15, 2021 by ToqueJambo

[Rogue Daddy]

1 minute ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

It was the JRG that made the decision I think, which includes Neil Doncaster. There's no leadership anywhere basically. People just passing the buck and blaming everyone else.

Exactly- the Spfl/SFA are pretty much one in the same... they share board members, so there’s no way they are not coordinated to suit whatever the agenda is on any given day. 
Their remits differ on paper only, it’s the same incompetents making the decisions. 

[Saint Jambo]

4 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

It was the JRG that made the decision I think, which includes Neil Doncaster. There's no leadership anywhere basically. People just passing the buck and blaming everyone else.

 

No. It was the SFA. It presumably acted on a recommendation from the JRG, but the power to suspend football sits with the SFA (or the Government).

 

Scottish FA Board confirms three-week suspension of professional football beneath SPFL Championship

"The Scottish FA Board met last night to discuss the escalating COVID-19 situation across the country and its impact on the national game at all levels.

While the updated Scottish Government guidance permits the continuation of professional sport, the board meeting, which followed a Joint Response Group discussion on the matter last Friday, nevertheless considered the implications of doing so at all tiers of the Scottish football professional pyramid, against a backdrop of increased positive cases across the country."

https://www.scottishfa.co.uk/news/scottish-fa-board-confirms-three-week-suspension-of-professional-football-beneath-spfl-championship/?rid=13929

[Saint Jambo]

8 minutes ago, Rogue Daddy said:

Exactly- the Spfl/SFA are pretty much one in the same... they share board members, so there’s no way they are not coordinated to suit whatever the agenda is on any given day. 
Their remits differ on paper only, it’s the same incompetents making the decisions. 

 

There are 2 SPFL appointees on the SFA Board from a total of 8 members. Do they 'co-ordinate'? Yes, of course. It would be bizarre if the governing body and the main league didn't talk to each other. But to say their remits differ on paper only is a misunderstanding of how the two organisations work in practice.

[John Findlay]

8 minutes ago, Saint Jambo said:

 

No. It was the SFA. It presumably acted on a recommendation from the JRG, but the power to suspend football sits with the SFA (or the Government).

 

Scottish FA Board confirms three-week suspension of professional football beneath SPFL Championship

"The Scottish FA Board met last night to discuss the escalating COVID-19 situation across the country and its impact on the national game at all levels.

While the updated Scottish Government guidance permits the continuation of professional sport, the board meeting, which followed a Joint Response Group discussion on the matter last Friday, nevertheless considered the implications of doing so at all tiers of the Scottish football professional pyramid, against a backdrop of increased positive cases across the country."

https://www.scottishfa.co.uk/news/scottish-fa-board-confirms-three-week-suspension-of-professional-football-beneath-spfl-championship/?rid=13929

There is no TV contract for leagues 1 and 2. Simple as that.

[SectionDJambo]

28 minutes ago, Saint Jambo said:

Football below the Championship was suspended by the SFA not the SPFL. That was why no vote was required. It was also why a single decision could take in not just League 1 and League 2 but all the leagues that were still operating below that (tiers 5 to 7) and all levels of women's football that were operating. The SFA is in a position to suspend football and restart football (subject to Government permission, although there is some confusion over whether that is really being withheld). However, the SFA are not in a position to decide whether to null and void a league, call it early or decide to extend the season. For Leagues 1 and 2 that would be a decision for the SPFL by way of a members vote.

Still got Doncaster on both boards, the SPFL and the SFA. He said that he only actions decisions made by the clubs. He was part of the SFA committee who forced this onto the clubs in divisions 1 and 2.

 The JRG also has a mix of people on it from both camps. There's not much likelihood of the SFA making a call like this without having ran it past the SPFL board first.

Given the deceitful behaviour by many of officials of both bodies during the summer, it's not too big a stretch to imagine them trying to blow smoke in the faces of any clubs who would question their actions, by trying to claim it was nothing to do with the SPFL board. It's not that long ago the JRG tried to pin the blame, for our enforced pause in training, on the Scottish Government, when it had nothing to do with them.

We still have a situation where Brechin City could be saved from a relegation for the second year in a row, whilst having their chairman on the board of the SPFL. 

[Saint Jambo]

2 minutes ago, SectionDJambo said:

Still got Doncaster on both boards, the SPFL and the SFA. He said that he only actions decisions made by the clubs. He was part of the SFA committee who forced this onto the clubs in divisions 1 and 2.

 The JRG also has a mix of people on it from both camps. There's not much likelihood of the SFA making a call like this without having ran it past the SPFL board first.

Given the deceitful behaviour by many of officials of both bodies during the summer, it's not too big a stretch to imagine them trying to blow smoke in the faces of any clubs who would question their actions, by trying to claim it was nothing to do with the SPFL board. It's not that long ago the JRG tried to pin the blame, for our enforced pause in training, on the Scottish Government, when it had nothing to do with them.

We still have a situation where Brechin City could be saved from a relegation for the second year in a row, whilst having their chairman on the board of the SPFL. 

 

But the reason they could stop football without a vote of clubs, when votes have been required for other things is that it was a decision of the SFA to stop suspend football below the Championship and the SFA governance doesn't require any vote of members to make that decision. This really isn't a controversial statement. It is a simple explanation of the governance arrangements in Scottish football. 

[Rogue Daddy]

20 minutes ago, Saint Jambo said:

 

There are 2 SPFL appointees on the SFA Board from a total of 8 members. Do they 'co-ordinate'? Yes, of course. It would be bizarre if the governing body and the main league didn't talk to each other. But to say their remits differ on paper only is a misunderstanding of how the two organisations work in practice.

Misunderstanding? Yeah you’re probably right, I’m definitely not privy to their inner workings (completely baffled may be closer!)... I get that they have different practices, but I don’t believe for one minute that they don’t plan on what ‘hat’ to wear when making their decisions and in that respect, for me, they are one in the same (I’ll refer to them as the cabal from now on). 
For instance, while you quite rightly stated it was the SFA who stalled leagues 1&2, I’m guessing this is only because the spfl were denied (by a vote) to be given ‘special powers’. At the end of the day, the cabal got their way.  
The spfl got their way last year calling the leagues and denying Kelty & Brora (SFA) a play-off. You can’t tell me they weren’t in cahoots. The silence from SFA in all that nonsense was deafening. No, I’m sorry, they are one in the same to me - it just depends on what ‘angle’ they are coming from. 
A tad simplistic maybe, but the levels of incompetence by both parties is equally embarrassing. 

[SectionDJambo]

Just now, Saint Jambo said:

 

But the reason they could stop football without a vote of clubs, when votes have been required for other things is that it was a decision of the SFA to stop suspend football below the Championship and the SFA governance doesn't require any vote of members to make that decision. This really isn't a controversial statement. It is a simple explanation of the governance arrangements in Scottish football. 

I agree with you on all of this.

My concern is that the SFA committee, who must have a close relationship with the SPFL board through a cross over of representatives on both boards and the JRG, could do the deed that those on the SPFL board do not have the power to do. The very power that they asked the SPFL clubs for and were refused. 

I just do not trust any of those people to do what is best for the whole of the SPFL and lower leagues, when they have demonstrated a lack of willingness to avoid harm to all clubs, during the summer. The SFA did nothing during the shenanigans of the summer. Why are they so interested in telling the SPFL what to do now?

[Guest ToqueJambo]

1 hour ago, Saint Jambo said:

 

No. It was the SFA. It presumably acted on a recommendation from the JRG, but the power to suspend football sits with the SFA (or the Government).

 

Scottish FA Board confirms three-week suspension of professional football beneath SPFL Championship

"The Scottish FA Board met last night to discuss the escalating COVID-19 situation across the country and its impact on the national game at all levels.

While the updated Scottish Government guidance permits the continuation of professional sport, the board meeting, which followed a Joint Response Group discussion on the matter last Friday, nevertheless considered the implications of doing so at all tiers of the Scottish football professional pyramid, against a backdrop of increased positive cases across the country."

https://www.scottishfa.co.uk/news/scottish-fa-board-confirms-three-week-suspension-of-professional-football-beneath-spfl-championship/?rid=13929

 

They're in cahoots all the way. 

[SectionDJambo]

1 hour ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

They're in cahoots all the way. 

I’m with you on this one.

I don’t trust any of them. They’ve shown how deceitful and untrustworthy they are, with plausible excuses for most suspicious decisions. 
After the “lost” email that started all of the shenanigans of the summer, I don’t believe that there are any depths to which they wouldn’t go to manipulate their agendas. 
 

[Guest ToqueJambo]

6 minutes ago, SectionDJambo said:

I’m with you on this one.

I don’t trust any of them. They’ve shown how deceitful and untrustworthy they are, with plausible excuses for most suspicious decisions. 
After the “lost” email that started all of the shenanigans of the summer, I don’t believe that there are any depths to which they wouldn’t go to manipulate their agendas. 
 

 

Yep, the SFA, prompted by Doncaster, suspend the league. The SPFL then finishes the job. I think they'll move heaven and earth to finish the Premiership for TV deal reasons, unlike last season, but the Championship is definitely as risk due to the part-time clubs playing in it. If they think that stopping all football below the Premiership will appease the Scottish gov and help the top league finish they'll absolutely try to do it. That's what the writing to Championship clubs was all about.

[Rogue Daddy]

13 minutes ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

Yep, the SFA, prompted by Doncaster, suspend the league. The SPFL then finishes the job. I think they'll move heaven and earth to finish the Premiership for TV deal reasons, unlike last season, but the Championship is definitely as risk due to the part-time clubs playing in it. If they think that stopping all football below the Premiership will appease the Scottish gov and help the top league finish they'll absolutely try to do it. That's what the writing to Championship clubs was all about.

I’m worried if they stop leagues 1&2, where does that leave promotion and relegation? I’d doubt there would be any for 1&2, so what happens to the championship? No relegation- does that mean no promotion?... will they just decide to start again, as you were, next season? I mean would they really have just 1 promotion (us, hopefully) and a relegation from the prem, out of four leagues? What a feckin mess. Only our incompetent cabal could concoct this farce. 
I’ll say it again, why oh why do we put up with it in Scotland. How do they get away with it?

 

[sunblestjambo]

44 minutes ago, Rogue Daddy said:

I’m worried if they stop leagues 1&2, where does that leave promotion and relegation? I’d doubt there would be any for 1&2, so what happens to the championship? No relegation- does that mean no promotion?... will they just decide to start again, as you were, next season? I mean would they really have just 1 promotion (us, hopefully) and a relegation from the prem, out of four leagues? What a feckin mess. Only our incompetent cabal could concoct this farce. 
I’ll say it again, why oh why do we put up with it in Scotland. How do they get away with it?

 

While this is nagging concern for me too, surely the precedent was presumably set last year with promotion from League 2 but no relegation?

[Hungry hippo]

1 hour ago, Rogue Daddy said:

I’m worried if they stop leagues 1&2, where does that leave promotion and relegation? I’d doubt there would be any for 1&2, so what happens to the championship? No relegation- does that mean no promotion?... will they just decide to start again, as you were, next season? I mean would they really have just 1 promotion (us, hopefully) and a relegation from the prem, out of four leagues? What a feckin mess. Only our incompetent cabal could concoct this farce. 
I’ll say it again, why oh why do we put up with it in Scotland. How do they get away with it?

 

 

Why would the required 8 Championship teams vote for that? There is no incentive this time.

[Fozzyonthefence]

1 hour ago, sunblestjambo said:

While this is nagging concern for me too, surely the precedent was presumably set last year with promotion from League 2 but no relegation?

They didn’t scrap relegation from League 2 last season, they scrapped the play off.  All play offs. 

[Rogue Daddy]

8 hours ago, Hungry hippo said:

 

Why would the required 8 Championship teams vote for that? There is no incentive this time.

I’m not saying they would, but further up the thread we're discussing how the spfl can’t make a decision on calling the season but the SFA (apparently) can, as they have stalled leagues 1&2 with out consultation. 
I don’t honestly think the prem and championship will be stopped, And I think we will be promoted... I was really just making the point how the ‘cabal’ have made such a mess of things and tend to get exactly what THEY want. Remember, dungcaster was asked what would have happened  if ‘The vote’ hadn’t carried... and his response was they would have kept going until it did pass. 
They just seem to be stumbling from one bad decision to the next, who knows what they are going to come up with next. 

[Rogue Daddy]

9 hours ago, sunblestjambo said:

While this is nagging concern for me too, surely the precedent was presumably set last year with promotion from League 2 but no relegation?

Yes, the spfl set a precedent... not the SFA. A few posts up, I was making the point that, for me, the SFA and spfl are the same (and operating as one.) They just swap hats to suit what decision they require eg. halting leagues 1&2 without consultation. Apparently the SFA have the right to suspend football, the spfl doesn’t (as was voted on recently). 

[TheBigO]

I'm Gina throw in here that the testing is a joke too. The JRG have dictated both the type of test and "highly recommended" one company to carry it out. And it's extortionate.

 

Someone's making money.

 

This is something I'm quite close to and the clubs are being bled. The. L1&2 clubs in particular could be easily doing testing pretty affordable and reliably. They'd know on match day if they had any cases. There'd be zero risk.

 

It's a real joke.

[vegas-voss]

11 hours ago, ToqueJambo said:

 

Yep, the SFA, prompted by Doncaster, suspend the league. The SPFL then finishes the job. I think they'll move heaven and earth to finish the Premiership for TV deal reasons, unlike last season, but the Championship is definitely as risk due to the part-time clubs playing in it. If they think that stopping all football below the Premiership will appease the Scottish gov and help the top league finish they'll absolutely try to do it. That's what the writing to Championship clubs was all about.

Crazy only teams in breach of Covid rules have been Prem teams but Championship punished so they can finish 🤣 only in Scotland eh.

[SectionDJambo]

50 minutes ago, Rogue Daddy said:

Yes, the spfl set a precedent... not the SFA. A few posts up, I was making the point that, for me, the SFA and spfl are the same (and operating as one.) They just swap hats to suit what decision they require eg. halting leagues 1&2 without consultation. Apparently the SFA have the right to suspend football, the spfl doesn’t (as was voted on recently). 

I agree with you about the SFA and SPFL boards. We cannot trust the SFA to make a decision that won't suit the SPFL. The events of last summer should have made it clear that the cabal will stop at nothing to make sure that their interests are satisfied, whether or not that adversely affects other clubs.

Maxwell has not hidden his desire to jump on any bandwagon that suits their mutual agenda, when he sent those letters to the Championship clubs, asking if they wanted to suspend playing, as they claimed a club had made an enquiry as to the possibility. That claim was something they couldn't  substantiate when asked. They were trying to take advantage of John Robertson talking about the current pressures he is under.

I also agree that promotion will take place. It's relegation I think that is limely to be the subject of any shenanigans, given the current positions of Alloa and Brechin.

I would imagine that Rangers will come down very hard on any of their players who were involved in that party last weekend. It beggars belief that any Rangers player would risk the 10 in a row being revitalised, by any repercussions of attending illegal social events.

[Rogue Daddy]

42 minutes ago, TheBigO said:

I'm Gina throw in here that the testing is a joke too. The JRG have dictated both the type of test and "highly recommended" one company to carry it out. And it's extortionate.

 

Someone's making money.

 

This is something I'm quite close to and the clubs are being bled. The. L1&2 clubs in particular could be easily doing testing pretty affordable and reliably. They'd know on match day if they had any cases. There'd be zero risk.

 

It's a real joke.

Hi Gina... 😂

Wasn't aware that clubs were being dictated to over testing but certainly doesn't surprise me. Nothing surprises me anymore when it comes to the running of Scottish football... whenever somebody in the premier league (usually celtic or rangers) f**ks up, it's the leagues below that are punished. It makes me sick to the pit of my stomach that they are ALLOWED to get away with it... I mean, the 'cabal' aren't even embarrassed at how blatantly corrupt/incompetent they are any more.

[Rogue Daddy]

5 minutes ago, SectionDJambo said:

I agree with you about the SFA and SPFL boards. We cannot trust the SFA to make a decision that won't suit the SPFL. The events of last summer should have made it clear that the cabal will stop at nothing to make sure that their interests are satisfied, whether or not that adversely affects other clubs.

Maxwell has not hidden his desire to jump on any bandwagon that suits their mutual agenda, when he sent those letters to the Championship clubs, asking if they wanted to suspend playing, as they claimed a club had made an enquiry as to the possibility. That claim was something they couldn't  substantiate when asked. They were trying to take advantage of John Robertson talking about the current pressures he is under.

I also agree that promotion will take place. It's relegation I think that is limely to be the subject of any shenanigans, given the current positions of Alloa and Brechin.

I would imagine that Rangers will come down very hard on any of their players who were involved in that party last weekend. It beggars belief that any Rangers player would risk the 10 in a row being revitalised, by any repercussions of attending illegal social events.

Absolutely! How they twisted Robbo's article was nothing short of disgusting - and we haven't yet heard the outcome from the sfa!

....what I find really bizarre is that we could potentially (and as things stand - more than likely) be looking at a season where, over 4 leagues, there is only 1 promotion and 1 relegation. If anything worries me, it's this.... what would be the likelihood of the 'cabal' saying - 'that's ridiculous, we can't have that!' I wouldn't put anything past them.... but they seem to be digging such a hole, and making such a mess of things, it's difficult to say, for certain, how this will all play out.

[TheBigO]

28 minutes ago, Rogue Daddy said:

Hi Gina... 😂

Wasn't aware that clubs were being dictated to over testing but certainly doesn't surprise me. Nothing surprises me anymore when it comes to the running of Scottish football... whenever somebody in the premier league (usually celtic or rangers) f**ks up, it's the leagues below that are punished. It makes me sick to the pit of my stomach that they are ALLOWED to get away with it... I mean, the 'cabal' aren't even embarrassed at how blatantly corrupt/incompetent they are any more.

Well hello there!!  haha

[colinmaroon]

SPFL and SFA reminds me of the last days of Tsarist Russia and the Soviet Union but with more staying power, because the "peasants" are revolting but its all a pun with that corrupt and incompetent bunch of sheisters. 

 

There are more cabals in the SS, sorry, SPFL and the Gestapo, sorry, SFA, than in Westminster.

 

 

[neilnunb]

 

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/football/6692053/hibs-player-self-isolating-coronavirus/

 

Doesn't mention who though.

 

[Newton51]

 

second bottom of league 2. Wonder why this is?