Annual report and financials

[Beave1874]

That's it done, Tiny bit of recovery hopefully....

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

14 minutes ago, Sheriffs said:

 

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

Seriously.

 

 

Yes, seriously. 

[Beast Boy]

Ooh edgy.

[DalryJambo]

Someone on Hibs.net actually thinks AB is the benefactor and she ploughing £3m plus a year in to the club to ‘save face’ and ensure she gets her loan £2.5m load back.  
 

That seems to me money well spent!!!  😳

[Beast Boy]

21 minutes ago, DalryJambo said:

Someone on Hibs.net actually thinks AB is the benefactor and she ploughing £3m plus a year in to the club to ‘save face’ and ensure she gets her loan £2.5m load back.  
 

That seems to me money well spent!!!  😳

They actually deserve the mess they are in with wee Ron. 😄

[hearts00]

3 hours ago, Jambo Hardhat said:

David Murray 🤣🤣🤣. He wouldn’t give you the reek of his 5h1te. The benefactor is a male senior partner in one of the biggest financial  investment companies in Edinburgh. A lifelong and diehard Jambo. 100% not DM 

That’s what I’ve heard as well.  Good on him!

[SMJ_1874]

2 hours ago, Bridge of Djoum said:

Thought he was owner/co owner of the firm. My ex bird used to work there. Good firm by all accounts. 

Not sure If there is one single owner but he’s definitely top of the tree. Aren’t they all associates there?  Probably the CEO and a good company to invest in for the future. Globally have made their mark in the financial world.
 

Was also told that when AB is no longer there then our benefactors will follow suit. We are lucky that AB has such great connections. Hope she’s here for a long time and her pals stay on board. 

[Arthur Morgan]

2 minutes ago, Jambo Hardhat said:

Not sure If there is one single owner but he’s definitely top of the tree. Aren’t they all associates there?  Probably the CEO and a good company to invest in for the future. Globally have made their mark in the financial world.
 

Was also told that when AB is no longer there then our benefactors will follow suit. We are lucky that AB has such great connections. Hope she’s here for a long time and her pals stay on board. 

 

I'm now hoping she stays long term

[Zico]

3 hours ago, Jambo Hardhat said:

The benefactor is a male senior partner in one of the biggest financial  investment companies in Edinburgh. A lifelong and diehard Jambo. 100% not DM 

One poster who knows his onions. Although I understood that other (non-Jambo) partners were involved who are supportive of community projects and were impressed by the fans doing what they did to save the club. 

[Bridge of Djoum]

6 minutes ago, Jambo Hardhat said:

Not sure If there is one single owner but he’s definitely top of the tree. Aren’t they all associates there?  Probably the CEO and a good company to invest in for the future. Globally have made their mark in the financial world.
 

Was also told that when AB is no longer there then our benefactors will follow suit. We are lucky that AB has such great connections. Hope she’s here for a long time and her pals stay on board. 

Yeah I think you're right. 

 

Good post, mate. Cheers.

[Cruyff Turn]

2 hours ago, DalryJambo said:

Someone on Hibs.net actually thinks AB is the benefactor and she ploughing £3m plus a year in to the club to ‘save face’ and ensure she gets her loan £2.5m load back.  
 

That seems to me money well spent!!!  😳

That’s why she bothers to charge interest on her initial re-payable loan she saved the club with.

 

What a ****ing spanner that laddie is. 

 

 

There are some very rich Hearts supporters out there and I’m sure there are very rich Hibs supporters as well. Perhaps if they were fan owned a rich benefactor would be more willing to help them out.

 

Unfortunately they’ve got into a bad situation with this American who’s only plan is to bleed them dry through player sales. No benefactor is going to give money to a privately owned club. 🤷🏼‍♂️

 

They are really jealous and this sort of thing brings it out time and time again. 

[SpruceBringsteen]

Hearing from Hibs fans it's bad news

 

Hearing from Rangers fans it's bad news

 

Hearing from Hearts fans it's bad news

 

Oh no. Should I start a gofundme?

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

22 minutes ago, SpruceBringsteen said:

Hearing from Hibs fans it's bad news

 

Hearing from Rangers fans it's bad news

 

Hearing from Hearts fans it's bad news

 

Oh no. Should I start a gofundme?

[1971fozzy]

2 hours ago, Icon of Symmetry said:

They actually deserve the mess they are in with wee Ron. 😄

yep. They never stood up and bought into HSL so hilariously they have made their bed

[1971fozzy]

2 hours ago, Jambo Hardhat said:

Not sure If there is one single owner but he’s definitely top of the tree. Aren’t they all associates there?  Probably the CEO and a good company to invest in for the future. Globally have made their mark in the financial world.
 

Was also told that when AB is no longer there then our benefactors will follow suit. We are lucky that AB has such great connections. Hope she’s here for a long time and her pals stay on board. 

👍👍👍

[Kiwidoug]

The benefactor Jambo Hardhat describes, and I don't doubt him, sounds suspiciously like Greenginger.  That's how he self describes.

[Phil D. Corners]

7 hours ago, Cruyff Turn said:

That’s why she bothers to charge interest on her initial re-payable loan she saved the club with.

 

What a ****ing spanner that laddie is. 

 

 

There are some very rich Hearts supporters out there and I’m sure there are very rich Hibs supporters as well. Perhaps if they were fan owned a rich benefactor would be more willing to help them out.

 

Unfortunately they’ve got into a bad situation with this American who’s only plan is to bleed them dry through player sales. No benefactor is going to give money to a privately owned club. 🤷🏼‍♂️

 

They are really jealous and this sort of thing brings it out time and time again. 

They had a benefactor putting money in with Tom Farmer. 

[Beast Boy]

I have a feeling we may have a stadium sponsorship deal on the way. Based on very little (nothing), just my own suspicions.

[GinRummy]

7 minutes ago, Icon of Symmetry said:

I have a feeling we may have a stadium sponsorship deal on the way. Based on very little (nothing), just my own suspicions.

How would you feel about that? 
 

Funny one to get your head round. 

[Leveins Battalion]

10 hours ago, Zico said:

One poster who knows his onions. Although I understood that other (non-Jambo) partners were involved who are supportive of  projects and were impressed by the fans doing what they did to save the club. 

Whats ironic is that the company that supports us has its office not far from Easter Road 🤣🤣🤣

[Beast Boy]

25 minutes ago, GinRummy said:

How would you feel about that? 
 

Funny one to get your head round. 

If it brought in enough money to win us something, I’d be delighted. I’d want it to be a name prefixed or suffixed to Tynecastle Park though.

[Bazzas right boot]

29 minutes ago, GinRummy said:

How would you feel about that? 
 

Funny one to get your head round. 

 

 

They could call it anything they want imo. 

 

Sell to the highest bidder I say. 

 

Fans will also call it Tynecastle no matter what. 

Always be Tynecastle. 

 

[GinRummy]

9 minutes ago, Icon of Symmetry said:

If it brought in enough money to win us something, I’d be delighted. I’d want it to be a name prefixed or suffixed to Tynecastle Park though.

makes sense the prefix. 

[GinRummy]

3 minutes ago, Smith's right boot said:

 

 

They could call it anything they want imo. 

 

Sell to the highest bidder I say. 

 

Fans will also call it Tynecastle no matter what. 

Always be Tynecastle. 

 

Part of me thinks this way but part of me wouldn’t like hearing it called something else

[gjcc]

Renaming would matter little to the fans who would still call it Tynecastle. 
 

In fact I’m all for naming it after Tesco just for the banter. 

[Francis Albert]

14 minutes ago, Icon of Symmetry said:

If it brought in enough money to win us something, I’d be delighted. I’d want it to be a name prefixed or suffixed to Tynecastle Park though.

Someone posted the sum Livi got from Tony Macaroni which was I think in the tens of thousands maybe 100k over I am not sure what period. We'd get more but nothing like enough to win us something.

[1953]

2 minutes ago, gjcc said:

Renaming would matter little to the fans who would still call it Tynecastle. 
 

In fact I’m all for naming it after Tesco just for the banter. 

Look at BT Murrayfield as an example, the BT bit gets quoted on tv, in the media and on anything official but to everyone else it's just Murrayfield. Getting cash for renaming the stadium would be ok with me but Tynecastle still needs to be part of it imo.

[Sheriffs]

2 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

Someone posted the sum Livi got from Tony Macaroni which was I think in the tens of thousands maybe 100k over I am not sure what period. We'd get more but nothing like enough to win us something.

 

Wouldn't that depend on who we managed to get involved. 

A high profile manager and a bit of national coverage might be all it takes to twist the arm for some big company to splash out on advertising.

[Beast Boy]

12 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

Someone posted the sum Livi got from Tony Macaroni which was I think in the tens of thousands maybe 100k over I am not sure what period. We'd get more but nothing like enough to win us something.

I think we would get many multiples of what Livi got. I also don’t think we would bother if we didn’t.

[Beast Boy]

9 minutes ago, Sheriffs said:

 

Wouldn't that depend on who we managed to get involved. 

A high profile manager and a bit of national coverage might be all it takes to twist the arm for some big company to splash out on advertising.

It would also be dependent on who was negotiating and attracting the sponsorship deal at boardroom level. Something Ann Budge is brilliant at; not underselling our value as a football club. Some of our fans really should bring their own valuations in line with hers imo.

[Mikey1874]

15 hours ago, Castle rock said:

Some imagination the hubz have 😂

 

Reply

greenginger 06:01 PM Today 

Profit of £ 2.9 million and no tax paid.

That’s because they are allowed to use the huge losses sustained during the Vlad years to offset any profit.

Doesn’t seem to matter that the debts created were written off , they can still use those losses to their advantage.
 

Reply

ian

 

That being normal accounting practice.

 

I understand people not being so aware of that. But an experienced financial expert like Greenginger must know that is simple routine practice actually encouraged. 

[ericb]

43 minutes ago, 1953 said:

Look at BT Murrayfield as an example, the BT bit gets quoted on tv, in the media and on anything official but to everyone else it's just Murrayfield. Getting cash for renaming the stadium would be ok with me but Tynecastle still needs to be part of it imo.

PureGym tynecastle park, with the third floor being a gym 🤫

[kila]

53 minutes ago, 1953 said:

Look at BT Murrayfield as an example, the BT bit gets quoted on tv, in the media and on anything official but to everyone else it's just Murrayfield. Getting cash for renaming the stadium would be ok with me but Tynecastle still needs to be part of it imo.

 

Really hope it doesn't come to that. I'm for removing more ads from football, with none on the strip, no flashing ads around the side of the pitch, traditional naming of the cups etc. PaddyPower's PR stunt for the teams they are sponsoring leading the way with plain strips.

 

 

[FarmerTweedy]

16 hours ago, OTT said:

I'm very confused about the benefactor. Why would they be so determined to remain anonymous ? Surely the adoration of the hearts fans for their considerable investment is a good thing? Only thing that could make me question why would be if there would be some perceived backlash against them for that. I.e if Edinburgh based would Hibs fans stop shopping with them? 

 

The M clue above, makes me wonder if its David Murray? Then again, it could be Mrs Budge  Can't think of anyone who could be interested in participating in funding the club with a first name starting with M. Surnames a plenty e.g. Jim Mellon... Apparently JK Rowlings partner's last name is Murray too. 

 

I just think the whole secrecy is really odd. Who gives money away no questions asked? Not many people have millions sitting around that they're quite happy to see spent by a Scottish football team. 

You only have to look at the grief Ann Budge has been getting in recent months to see why someone would want to remain anonymous.  If they were known, they'd have been getting pelters too, as well as folk demanding they put their hands in their pockets to pay her off more quickly/front up money to pay Levein off, etc.  And they'd start facing constant questioning about whether they were placing conditions on their financial support, and if so why, and if not why not!

 

The reality is that the vast majority of football club owners/directors get nothing but grief for it any time things aren't going absolutely wonderfully, and even if these benefactors stayed away from actual ownership and directorships, they'd almost certainly end up getting the same sort of grief!

[Beast Boy]

3 minutes ago, kila said:

 

Really hope it doesn't come to that. I'm for removing more ads from football, with none on the strip, no flashing ads around the side of the pitch, traditional naming of the cups etc. PaddyPower's PR stunt for the teams they are sponsoring leading the way with plain strips.

 

 

Would only work if it happened globally. Much like the ticket price campaign, it would just further reduce the quality on the park here, and you’d see more people complaining about the quality of football and crowds would drop.

[Beast Boy]

3 minutes ago, FarmerTweedy said:

You only have to look at the grief Ann Budge has been getting in recent months to see why someone would want to remain anonymous.  If they were known, they'd have been getting pelters too, as well as folk demanding they put their hands in their pockets to pay her off more quickly/front up money to pay Levein off, etc.  And they'd start facing constant questioning about whether they were placing conditions on their financial support, and if so why, and if not why not!

 

The reality is that the vast majority of football club owners/directors get nothing but grief for it any time things aren't going absolutely wonderfully, and even if these benefactors stayed away from actual ownership and directorships, they'd almost certainly end up getting the same sort of grief!

Nailed it. The majority of football supporters are greedy, ungrateful and ignorant when it comes to things like investment and infrastructure. This place and social media are testament to that.

[TheOak88]

1 hour ago, Icon of Symmetry said:

I have a feeling we may have a stadium sponsorship deal on the way. Based on very little (nothing), just my own suspicions.

 

To do with the financial institution of the benefactor? 

[Francis Albert]

As usual with the accounts (any accounts not just ours) first reading is always positive with the the Directors Report providing a coating of gloss. 

Overall still very positive but the reliance on benefactors for profit and cash flow is not healthy except as a temporary measure to get us through the "stadium redevelopment" phase.

I will be interested to se at the AGM or perhaps more likely in next years accounts (once a full year of increased hospitality and facility letting is shown) how profitable these are - increased turnover/revenue is great but only if profitable. Ann has suggested next year's accounts will not be as strong … (less benefactor contributions fewer cup semi/final  bonuses not matched by increase in non-football earnings?)

Edited November 16, 2019 by Francis Albert

[Mikey1874]

If FoH subs have gone down its not a bad thing. 

 

Same as Ann was saying income from ticket sales and hospitality has gone down this season.

 

Should help keep everyone on their toes and not just assume a certain income. 

[Phil D. Corners]

3 minutes ago, Icon of Symmetry said:

Nailed it. The majority of football supporters are greedy, ungrateful and ignorant when it comes to things like investment and infrastructure. This place and social media are testament to that.

I had to laugh at the Celtic fans doing a protest against the board after winning the treble treble. WTF

[Sheriffs]

7 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

As usual with the accounts (any accounts not just ours) first reading is always positive with the the Directors Report providing a coating of gloss. 

Overall still very positive but the reliance on benefactors for profit and cash flow is not healthy except as a temporary measure to get us through the "stadium redevelopment" phase.

I will be interested to se at the AGM or perhaps more likely in next years accounts (once a full year of increased hospitality and facility letting is shown) how profitable these are - increased turnover/revenue is great but only if profitable. Ann has suggested next year's accounts will not be as strong … (less benefactor contributions fewer cup semi/final  bonuses not matched by increase in non-football earnings?)

 

Why are you interested in a profit.

Living within our means is the only criteria, if we don't have a benefactor or donations then we don't spend.

As long as the accounts don't ever show a loss then everything financially is ticketyboo.

 

 

[Beast Boy]

4 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

As usual with the accounts (any accounts not just ours) first reading is always positive with the the Directors Report providing a coating of gloss. 

Overall still very positive but the reliance on benefactors for profit and cash flow is not healthy except as a temporary measure to get us through the "stadium redevelopment" phase.

I will be interested to se at the AGM or perhaps more likely in next years accounts (once a full year of increased hospitality and facility letting is shown) how profitable these are - increased turnover/revenue is great but only if profitable. Ann has suggested next year's accounts will not be as strong … (less benefactor contributions fewer cup semi/final  bonuses not matched by increase in non-football earnings?)

Non-football income had gone up by a million recently. 
 

The benefactor money was accounted for before it was received. Our outgoings are at an exceptionally high level because we are building our infrastructure. Once that infrastructure is complete, it will bring more money in, and not be a drain on our (and our benefactors’) cash. 
 

I’d rather we built it this way, and posted profits each season, than the financial millstone Aberdeen are embarking upon, or built up debts and mortgages the size that Hibs we’re dealing with. In Hibs’ case it was that debt that left them open to wee Ron’s pony club takeover and the dismantling of their fan ownership vehicle.

 

4 minutes ago, Mikey1874 said:

If FoH subs have gone down its not a bad thing. 

 

Same as Ann was saying income from ticket sales and hospitality has gone down this season.

 

Should help keep everyone on their toes and not just assume a certain income. 

 

The only positive I can see in the drop in FoH subs, is it gives us a clearer picture of those who can be relied upon not to withdraw it when things are not to their liking on the pitch.
 

2 minutes ago, Phil D. Corners said:

I had to laugh at the Celtic fans doing a protest against the board after winning the treble treble. WTF

 

Idiots. We have a lot of them ourselves though.

[Francis Albert]

Just now, Sheriffs said:

 

Why are you interested in a profit.

Living within our means is the only criteria, if we don't have a benefactor or donations then we don't spend.

As long as the accounts don't ever show a loss then everything financially is ticketyboo.

 

 

I was kind of hoping profits from non-football activities would support the "footballing department" and that we are not operating the non football side of the business on a break even basis.

[Beast Boy]

2 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

I was kind of hoping profits from non-football activities would support the "footballing department" and that we are not operating the non football side of the business on a break even basis.

Break even is my preferred model. Spend the money you have on being the best you can be.

[adso7]

2 minutes ago, Icon of Symmetry said:

Break even is my preferred model. Spend the money you have on being the best you can be.

There's no point in a football club running their hospitality etc at break even. You want them to profit and feed the football operations. An overall result of break even is ok.

[Beast Boy]

Just now, adso7 said:

There's no point in a football club running their hospitality etc at break even. You want them to profit and feed the football operations. An overall result of break even is ok.

Ah, sorry. I think I picked FA up wrong. What I meant was I want all money we raise to be pumped in to the footballing side of things. 

[Francis Albert]

1 minute ago, Icon of Symmetry said:

Break even is my preferred model. Spend the money you have on being the best you can be.

Of course there is no point in the business as a whole generating profits and paying tax and in that sense break even is the objective.

But the non-football side should financially support the football side, as is surely the point of hospitality, conference and meeting room rental etc.

And of course if the non-football side ever became a drain on the football side as did the ill fated social club of the 60s then that would be disastrous, even if we are breaking even overall.

[Francis Albert]

1 minute ago, Icon of Symmetry said:

Ah, sorry. I think I picked FA up wrong. What I meant was I want all money we raise to be pumped in to the footballing side of things. 

My last post crossed with yours so we don't disagree!

[Sheriffs]

4 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

I was kind of hoping profits from non-football activities would support the "footballing department" and that we are not operating the non football side of the business on a break even basis.

 

Apart from the odd pop up restaurant and the fans bar being open on non match days I don't know what your on about with regards the non football side of the business.

Care to elaborate?

[Francis Albert]

6 minutes ago, Sheriffs said:

 

Apart from the odd pop up restaurant and the fans bar being open on non match days I don't know what your on about with regards the non football side of the business.

Care to elaborate?

 I think Icon of Symmetry and I sorted our misunderstanding. 

But for clarity the core football business is IMO what is needed to put a football side on the pitch including players and coaching staff costs and wages necessary ground maintenance subs to the SFA rates stewarding and policing costs etc. and revenue from STs, walk ups cup runs, player sales. Hospitality, suite and exhibition space rentals, the shop, the fans bar, etc are there to subsidise the football business and never the other way round.

Broadly speaking I suppose but a distinction worth making and accounting for.