Orange marches this Saturday

[ycj]

Some great bands performing. Roll on Glasgow next Sat.

[Jimbinho]

I wasn't aware that there were large marches celebrating William Wallace or the battle of Bannockburn in major towns and cities across the provence of Northern Ireland?

 

If so then i'd recommend the local residents go watch them too. Same applies.

 

You just got owned SUCKA!!!

[speedbump]

The anti unionist, anti protestant bile in this thread is a disgrace. Some people need to take off the so called PC/one culture glasses and recognise that not everyone sings from the same hymn sheet.

 

I am a loyalist, unionist, church of Sotland anttendee, who doesn't hate catholics/people of other faith but of course some will judge my attendance at todays celebrations as a show of bigotry. Well in my eyes they are the bigots.

 

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/bigot

 

Simple enough for those who will glass me and try to drown me.

 

NEVER!

[King of the North]

Do the SNP have any Unionists?

 

The Orange order may be Protestant only, however that includes people from High Anglicans to Presbyterians, to Methodists etc. etc. There are African lodges and even a Mohawk Indian lodge. Indeed the OO refused to grant permission to lodges in South Africa because of Racism - well before it was "right on" to be P.C.

 

You say Modern Scotland be about ?inclusiveness?. However what if the "inclusiveness" didn't fit your agenda/beliefs/opinions? What if "inclusiveness" meant you were barracked for your beliefs? You would stand up and speak against it. Thats all the LOL are doing.

 

Just look at this thread for example, people are advocating burning, glassing and drowning people because they don't fit into their view of "inclusive",?modern? Scotland.

 

Depends what your beliefs are. If they are by their very nature the opposite of inclusive (i.e. anti Catholic) then of course they will not fit in to modern society. Like a neo nazi complaining that his 'civil rights' are being breached because people won't let him march up and down waving banners saying he hates Jews? Would he be taken seriously?

 

What a ridiculous thing to expect - you are suggesting that the lodge defends it''s right to be sectarian?

 

further evidence that the Orange Lodge is an anachronism. You as good as admit it in your post - 'inclusiveness doesn't suit your beliefs'

 

Outdated, unnecessary and divisive. Populated by bams, bigots and orcs.

[MacDonald Jardine]

Depends what your beliefs are. If they are by their very nature the opposite of inclusive (i.e. anti Catholic) then of course they will not fit in to modern society. Like a neo nazi complaining that his 'civil rights' are being breached because people won't let him march up and down waving banners saying he hates Jews? Would he be taken seriously?

 

What a ridiculous thing to expect - you are suggesting that the lodge defends it''s right to be sectarian?

 

further evidence that the Orange Lodge is an anachronism. You as good as admit it in your post - 'inclusiveness doesn't suit your beliefs'

 

Outdated, unnecessary and divisive. Populated by bams, bigots and orcs.

 

There's a distinction between being anti the Roman Catholic church and hating individuals who happen to be of that religion.

The Orange Order does nor propose the expulsion of Roman Catholics from this country.

In fact it stands for freedom of religion which includes the Roman Catholics, albeit it teaches against what it perceives as a flawed and corrupt religion.

 

So what your definition of "inclusiveness" boils down to is following the permitted line?

I wouldn't be allowed to describe any other group as consisting entirely of "bams, bigots and orcs" but the Orange Order are fair game in our modern inclusive society.

[DikT.]

As fair minded people standing for freedom of religion I guess they would like to see the act of succession repealed?

[brownkg]

There's a distinction between being anti the Roman Catholic church and hating individuals who happen to be of that religion.

The Orange Order does nor propose the expulsion of Roman Catholics from this country.

In fact it stands for freedom of religion which includes the Roman Catholics, albeit it teaches against what it perceives as a flawed and corrupt religion.

 

So what your definition of "inclusiveness" boils down to is following the permitted line?

I wouldn't be allowed to describe any other group as consisting entirely of "bams, bigots and orcs" but the Orange Order are fair game in our modern inclusive society.

 

No I'd say the very same for BNP for a start

[Ray Winstone]

Some of the posts on this thread are the most ignorant I have ever read on this forum.

 

The orange marches at this time of year are leading up to the main 12th July celebrations.

 

What is the celebration for on the 12th of July? Do you require a history lesson?

 

You 'people' can dress it up as something it clearly is not if you like but dont try and pass off that propoganda drivel on here.

[The Baldmans Comb]

I echo the sentiments.

 

Bannockburn - even after 7 centuries - is about one nation striving to achieve freedom from another. Bannockburn marchers however do not get buses down to London and demand to march along Whitehall to rub Englands noses in it.

 

The political and religous significance of an Orange March, is very much though about civil division rather than national unity. Orange lodge marchers are making a point that state-protestantism won the day over the previous catholic order. Its a "reminder" from those who give a feck (mainly bigots) and it's a blatant piece of intimidation dressed up as a musical parade. Anyone who says that this is NOT part of the agenda of an Orange march is being completely disingenuous. The Orange heartlands in Ulster and the West of Scotland are fuelled more by bog-standard anti-catholicism than they are by any notion of principled protestantism. The latter would indeed involve some degree of religous devotion...the older generation of marchers may be church-goers to some degree, but the younger ones are mostly out to rub catholic noses in it by banging the drum.

 

Well said Mr Busby and again it is great to see a reasonable fair minded person come to such an obvious and sensible conclusion.

 

There is a very small number of Hearts supporters on this board who are quite offensive and sadly once you scratch below the surface very probably intollerant bigots as well and I always enjoy reading posts that expose there rather twisted agendas

 

Well done.

[Makween]

There is a hugely significant difference in the respective outlooks of these groups.

 

The Bannockburn march will of course in the main be attended by Scottish nationalists. Many card-carrying Scot Nats are English born and have moved here in recent times. At the last count, some 7 Scot Nat MSP's were born in England. Dozens of Scot Nat councillors are either of English or Asian origin initially and thats a reflection of the SNP membership as a whole. More generally it's a reflection of our wider attitude to "being Scottish". You don't have to be born here. You dont have to be called MacDonald or Fraser. You just have to live or work here and thats enough. You're considered to be Scottish and it's this natural inclusiveness that makes this country what it is. The more English, Asians and Poles who want to live and work and contribute here, the better I like it. We're already a mongrel race of Celts, Saxons, Vikings, Picts and the rest ... and everyone knows that mongrels are smarter than so called pedigrees :-) It's about social inclusion.

 

The Orange Order does of course have the "right" to maintain and parade it's own enclosed and insular view of the world. But how inclusive is it ? Does it contain any catholic members ? Does it contain any asian members ? No ??? Of course not, these are just rhetorical questions... It's a strictly "protestant only" group and by it's very nature, the complete antithesis of what a modern inclusive society is all about..and therefore the complete antithesis of what Scotland is - or at least should be - about.

For the record I decry catholic schooling for the very same reason. Orange order, catholic schooling... It's about social division.

 

Inclusion and unity ... over exclusion and division... it's a no-brainer.

 

The Orange Lodge is an anti-Vatican organisation - which is very different to being anti-Catholic. There are very strong arguments against the Vatican, which are in no way bigoted or sectarian - I'm sure that you're aware of them, so I don't see any real reason to take this thread off topic by going into detail about them.

 

For obvious reasons, any political organisation which is against the Vatican is unlikely to have any Catholics in its numbers. Their viewpoints are diametrically opposed. There's obvious baggage that goes along with the marches, but you'll get an extreme fringe within any political movement - the SNP is no different in this regard.

 

As I've already said, these marches aren't really my idea of a good time. If it was up to me, all marches of any sort would be banned because they block up streets and basically just get right on my tits, but I don't see how anyone can say that one march is "okay", whilst another which is along similar lines (ie, celebrating a battle which happened years ago) isn't.

 

Some of the posts on this thread are the most ignorant I have ever read on this forum.

 

The orange marches at this time of year are leading up to the main 12th July celebrations.

 

What is the celebration for on the 12th of July? Do you require a history lesson?

 

You 'people' can dress it up as something it clearly is not if you like but dont try and pass off that propoganda drivel on here.

 

Please enlighten us. What is the celebration for?

 

By the looks of things, it's you that needs the history lesson.

[Boab Mugabe]

The 'Right On' Brigade strikes again.

 

Anyone who goes on the marches is well within their rights to. Just because some don't like them is nowhere near a reason to drown all attached.

 

Then again, classic 'Right On' school of thought. Make out to be all-inclusive, benevolent and caring - so long as you agree with everything they say.

[Acey]

I like it how everyone's taken my "they should be drowned" comment entirely seriously.

 

[Ray Winstone]

The Orange Lodge is an anti-Vatican organisation - which is very different to being anti-Catholic. There are very strong arguments against the Vatican, which are in no way bigoted or sectarian - I'm sure that you're aware of them, so I don't see any real reason to take this thread off topic by going into detail about them.

 

For obvious reasons, any political organisation which is against the Vatican is unlikely to have any Catholics in its numbers. Their viewpoints are diametrically opposed. There's obvious baggage that goes along with the marches, but you'll get an extreme fringe within any political movement - the SNP is no different in this regard.

 

As I've already said, these marches aren't really my idea of a good time. If it was up to me, all marches of any sort would be banned because they block up streets and basically just get right on my tits, but I don't see how anyone can say that one march is "okay", whilst another which is along similar lines (ie, celebrating a battle which happened years ago) isn't.

 

 

 

Please enlighten us. What is the celebration for?

 

By the looks of things, it's you that needs the history lesson.

 

 

They say ignorance is bliss - Is that correct?

[Makween]

They say ignorance is bliss - Is that correct?

 

Apparently so - what's the celebration for? I look forward to hearing about this from an expert like you.

[Ray Winstone]

Apparently so - what's the celebration for? I look forward to hearing about this from an expert like you.

 

I suggest we dont start this.

 

I will tell you what it is for and you will disagree and tell me the celebration is for something else and we shall go round in circles arguing the point and in the end neither of us will agree with each other and we are back to square one.

 

I for one have much more interesting things to be getting on with while enjoying a couple of days of work.

[Makween]

I suggest we dont start this.

 

I will tell you what it is for and you will disagree and tell me the celebration is for something else and we shall go round in circles arguing the point and in the end neither of us will agree with each other and we are back to square one.

 

I for one have much more interesting things to be getting on with while enjoying a couple of days of work.

 

Sound.

 

If you were going to say that it celebrates hatred of Catholics, though, then it's already been covered in this thread that Catholics fought under King Billy.

[John Findlay]

Sound.

 

If you were going to say that it celebrates hatred of Catholics, though, then it's already been covered in this thread that Catholics fought under King Billy.

 

And Protestants fought on top of him. He liked being the meat in the sandwich;)

 

 

 

 

John

[ycj]

50 Bands I believe for parade on Saturday. 11.30 approx leaving v Blyswood.

[Makween]

And Protestants fought on top of him. He liked being the meat in the sandwich;)

 

 

 

 

John

 

Don't see how that's even slightly relevant. Not that that's unusual coming from you. I'd just like to take this opportunity to thank all the Indian paramedics out there. Cheers, lads.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Makween

[mda]

I have to say that its the buckied-up neds in hun tops which are the main thing I have against these parades. Each to their own, if they want to march then fair enough, but its the following they attract which causes the real problems imo.

[MacDonald Jardine]

And Protestants fought on top of him. He liked being the meat in the sandwich;)

 

 

 

 

John

 

Yet again someone taking the moral high ground on bigotry finds homophobia quite acceptable.

[John Findlay]

Yet again someone taking the moral high ground on bigotry finds homophobia quite acceptable.

 

Prove the Protestants on top of him or the Catholics underneath him were not all females?

 

See the smiley emoticon it was a give away that it was a joke. A joke you or Makween didnt find funny. Fair enough but, they day I lose sleep over humourless people on kickback is the day I finally depart this earth.

 

 

 

John

[Makween]

Prove the Protestants on top of him or the Catholics underneath him were not all females?

 

See the smiley emoticon it was a give away that it was a joke. A joke you or Makween didnt find funny. Fair enough but, they day I lose sleep over humourless people on kickback is the day I finally depart this earth.

 

 

 

John

 

I feel the same way about pompous, overbearing dullards.

 

Thanks to all the ginger haired firefighters out there.

 

 

 

 

Makween

[MacDonald Jardine]

Prove the Protestants on top of him or the Catholics underneath him were not all females?

 

See the smiley emoticon it was a give away that it was a joke. A joke you or Makween didnt find funny. Fair enough but, they day I lose sleep over humourless people on kickback is the day I finally depart this earth.

 

 

 

John

 

And if I posted anti Catholic or black jokes that would be okay if I used a smiley?

[monkfish1979]

Like Christmas and Easter, think we should stop having them too?

 

Christmas is a pagan festival and therefore not related to any specific event in history. Christians hijacked it mainly, I believe, because they couldn't get rid of it. Easter is about the chocolate bunnies and eggs.

 

The Orange order is basically a bunch of spakkers out to pi$$ all the non-mutants off, IMO.

[Makween]

Christmas is a pagan festival and therefore not related to any specific event in history. Christians hijacked it mainly, I believe, because they couldn't get rid of it. Easter is about the chocolate bunnies and eggs.

 

The Orange order is basically a bunch of spakkers out to pi$$ all the non-mutants off, IMO.

 

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