Brexit Deal agreed ( updated )

[Unknown user]

16 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

Your reply had nothing to do with the post you were replying to.

The conversation was about whether no deal brexit was a good idea ffs! Ulysses posted some stats to back up his view on saving money through not paying the divorce bill, you questioned them. I asked if you think no deal brexit is a good idea, it was a reasonable question as part of the conversation. 

 

I never posted any stats, I never commented on them, I never even acknowledged them. I had nothing to deflect from, I was trying to discuss the topic with a person who'd joined the conversation. I mean, the nerve. 

[Ulysses]

3 minutes ago, Trapper John McIntyre said:

 

What's a few million between friends?

 

Cynics would say that George Osborne contributed to the overall EU/IMF effort because he was protecting a major export market.  Ireland is the UK's fifth largest export destination, and the UK has a significant trading surplus with Ireland.

 

Perhaps he was being cynical, as politicians often are.  But I think he and his government were also making an important symbolic gesture that acknowledged the need for a close relationship between the UK and its closest neighbour.

[Trapper John McIntyre]

2 minutes ago, Ulysses said:

 

Cynics would say that George Osborne contributed to the overall EU/IMF effort because he was protecting a major export market.  Ireland is the UK's fifth largest export destination, and the UK has a significant trading surplus with Ireland.

 

Perhaps he was being cynical, as politicians often are.  But I think he and his government were also making an important symbolic gesture that acknowledged the need for a close relationship between the UK and its closest neighbour.

 

But England's danger is Irelands' opportunity I thought. Isn't Leo loving his moment?

 

You're our neighbour.  But you will never be a friend.

[Francis Albert]

6 minutes ago, Smithee said:

The conversation was about whether no deal brexit was a good idea ffs! Ulysses posted some stats to back up his view on saving money through not paying the divorce bill, you questioned them. I asked if you think no deal brexit is a good idea, it was a reasonable question as part of the conversation. 

 

I never posted any stats, I never commented on them, I never even acknowledged them. I had nothing to deflect from, I was trying to discuss the topic with a person who'd joined the conversation. I mean, the nerve. 

The conversation at that stage  was about the stats not about my opinion of Brexit. If the question is remain or leave I was for remaining. But we have chosen to leave. If the question is May's deal or no deal it is a tricky one because all May's deal is about is the transition and negotiaton of the post-transition deal has barely begun. The political declaration on that is non-binding and Macron has already demonstrated that relying on the EU's good faith in implementing it would be unwise. 

 

That may not be the yes or no you wanted but that is my answer.

 

[Unknown user]

1 minute ago, Francis Albert said:

The conversation at that stage  was about the stats not about my opinion of Brexit. If the question is remain or leave I was for remaining. But we have chosen to leave. If the question is May's deal or no deal it is a tricky one because all May's deal is about is the transition and negotiaton of the post-transition deal has barely begun. The political declaration on that is non-binding and Macron has already demonstrated that relying on the EU's good faith in implementing it would be unwise. 

 

That may not be the yes or no you wanted but that is my answer.

 

You accused me of deflecting when all I did was engage you. Lesson learned, believe me.

[Ulysses]

1 minute ago, Trapper John McIntyre said:

 

You're our neighbour.  But you will never be a friend.

 

You clearly think that, and you're entitled to your opinion.  But there's not a chance that I can give it any credence or go along with it.

 

Your post shows a weak and outdated understanding of Ireland and its politics, as did your comments about the loan and Ireland's economic dependence on the UK.  Maybe, for want of another way to put it, you need to bring your awareness and knowledge up to date.  As the McDonagh article I linked to earlier in the thread showed, misunderstanding of Ireland's take on Brexit is happening to a larger than expected degree in British political and diplomatic circles.  I think it's part of a wider British mistrust, even paranoia, about the motivation of its European Union neighbours.

 

Ireland's government and its people would prefer that the UK didn't leave the EU at all.  We'd prefer that the UK's exit is done in an ordered, agreed and smooth way.  But, like our counterparts in the rest of the EU 27, this isn't our choice and we are managing the fallout as best we can

[Trapper John McIntyre]

1 minute ago, Ulysses said:

 

You clearly think that, and you're entitled to your opinion.  But there's not a chance that I can give it any credence or go along with it.

 

Your post shows a weak and outdated understanding of Ireland and its politics, as did your comments about the loan and Ireland's economic dependence on the UK.  Maybe, for want of another way to put it, you need to bring your awareness and knowledge up to date.  As the McDonagh article I linked to earlier in the thread showed, misunderstanding of Ireland's take on Brexit is happening to a larger than expected degree in British political and diplomatic circles.  I think it's part of a wider British mistrust, even paranoia, about the motivation of its European Union neighbours.

 

Ireland's government and its people would prefer that the UK didn't leave the EU at all.  We'd prefer that the UK's exit is done in an ordered, agreed and smooth way.  But, like our counterparts in the rest of the EU 27, this isn't our choice and we are managing the fallout as best we can

 

Nothing out of date about plain historical facts ie the turbulent relationship between Britain and Ireland. Yet we immediately came to your assistance during the crash without hesitation. 

 

'Weak and outdated understanding of Ireland and its politics?'

 

Yet you can make a statement like  ''British mistrust, even paranoia about the motivation of its European Union neighbours.'  I could respond along the lines of: you're not British, how do you know how we feel about anything? What gives you the right to opinionate on our affairs?

 

But I won't. 

 

 

 

[Ulysses]

1 minute ago, Trapper John McIntyre said:

 

But I won't. 

 

 

That's a great idea.  Can you move on and talk about Brexit now?

[Trapper John McIntyre]

Just now, Ulysses said:

 

That's a great idea.  Can you move on and talk about Brexit now?

Nah, too fecking confusing.

[Ulysses]

Just now, Trapper John McIntyre said:

Nah, too fecking confusing.

 

On that much, I think we can agree.

[Francis Albert]

33 minutes ago, Smithee said:

You accused me of deflecting when all I did was engage you. Lesson learned, believe me.

Your engaging with me has consisted of asking me a question and me replying. A reply which you clearly feel is not worthy of further engagement. Fair enough and if you have learnt a valuable lesson I am pleased for you.

[jake]

1 hour ago, Ulysses said:

 

You clearly think that, and you're entitled to your opinion.  But there's not a chance that I can give it any credence or go along with it.

 

Your post shows a weak and outdated understanding of Ireland and its politics, as did your comments about the loan and Ireland's economic dependence on the UK.  Maybe, for want of another way to put it, you need to bring your awareness and knowledge up to date.  As the McDonagh article I linked to earlier in the thread showed, misunderstanding of Ireland's take on Brexit is happening to a larger than expected degree in British political and diplomatic circles.  I think it's part of a wider British mistrust, even paranoia, about the motivation of its European Union neighbours.

 

Ireland's government and its people would prefer that the UK didn't leave the EU at all.  We'd prefer that the UK's exit is done in an ordered, agreed and smooth way.  But, like our counterparts in the rest of the EU 27, this isn't our choice and we are managing the fallout as best we can

The article you posted was not a revelation as I had kind of got Ireland moving on.

It's hard to explain.

It's nipped my head in a good way.

 

About your line on the UK mistrust of the EU and it's motivations .

Paranoia is the fine edge of the truth .

?

 

[ri Alban]

10 hours ago, Seymour M Hersh said:

 

Spot on. 

Aye, but the UK will still be in the single market and customs union, they'll just  be out of the EU.  Is that not right, because that's what the Brexiteers campaign leaders kept saying. 

Oh, and another thing, has the NHS received its money yet? Yes I know the UK hasn't left, but they could atleast have had a wee sub.

Edited December 15, 2018 by ri Alban

[ri Alban]

8 hours ago, Trapper John McIntyre said:

 

Maybe right. You're a great statistician after all.

 

In that case as we're going to be piss poor after a no-deal exit, can we get the bail out money back we gave your country when your economy went tits up at the last crash?

Oh look another no voting Brexiteer Hypocrite.

As for  Ireland they have already paid it back. So after Brexit, let's hope whoever Team GB owes, comes looking for their £2t debt it sponged, when it's economy went tits up. 

 

 

Oh and Scotland will be independent soon. So nae luck, your treacherous actions were not fatal. But hopefully you Brexiteering will be.

 

 

 

Tick Tock!!!

Edited December 15, 2018 by ri Alban

[ri Alban]

4 hours ago, jake said:

The article you posted was not a revelation as I had kind of got Ireland moving on.

It's hard to explain.

It's nipped my head in a good way.

 

About your line on the UK mistrust of the EU and it's motivations .

Paranoia is the fine edge of the truth .

?

 

Mistrust Jake, not paranoia. Personally, I think the EU is better off being shot of the UK. It's been nothing but trouble since they got involved. Good riddance to bad rubbish when March comes, will be the order of the day in the EU.

[The Real Maroonblood]

2 hours ago, ri Alban said:

Oh look another no voting Brexiteer Hypocrite.

As for  Ireland they have already paid it back. So after Brexit, let's hope whoever Team GB owes, comes looking for their £2t debt it sponged, when it's economy went tits up. 

 

 

Oh and Scotland will be independent soon. So nae luck, your treacherous actions were not fatal. But hopefully you Brexiteering will be.

 

 

 

Tick Tock!!!

[Dawnrazor]

10 hours ago, Ulysses said:

 

They're not my figures, and not my analysis.  They're published by your own Office for National Statistics.  All I'm doing is saying what the figures are.  I've referred you to rational, fact-based analysis published by an independent agency.  You've referred me to someone else on JKB who seems to agree with you and offered "a fella told me that a fella told him" stuff.  Where's your actual data and analysis to counter what your Office for National Statistics published? 

 

 

Just Google where the Office of National Statistics have got it wrong!! 

You seen to be able to get statistics when ever you like for the remain argument, I googled for about 30 seconds and found articles about the Offices data being called into question, now come on, you're a very good intlegent poster, one of the better ones imo but you're being intentionally obtuse on you're figures and deflectct questions, again, my opinion. 

Why don't you for the sake of balance and to us who don't seem to be as good at getting figures from the internet Post info on where the office of national statistics got thier numbers wrong? 

[Boris]

14 hours ago, Dawnrazor said:

That'll be the end of socialism then, if they've got no one else's money to spend. 

Or when the workers seize the means of production! 

[Boris]

17 hours ago, Seymour M Hersh said:

 

It was pretty clear last time ffs. In or Out. If that's not clear enough then maybe it's time to leave this thread.

 

 

 

What's not clear?

Eea

Efta

Both options not eu membership. But our debated clouded by single market/customs union membership. 

 

So question didn't ask about hard or soft Brexit, for want of a phrase, but that's where we are, in the hands of tory idealogues. We didn't get a vote on that. 

[Francis Albert]

8 minutes ago, Boris said:

Eea

Efta

Both options not eu membership. But our debated clouded by single market/customs union membership. 

 

So question didn't ask about hard or soft Brexit, for want of a phrase, but that's where we are, in the hands of tory idealogues. We didn't get a vote on that. 

The referendum was a stupid idea but having a mulltiple choice ballot paper would hardly have helped.

Of one thing I am certain - if the result had gone the other way, even by as small a margin, there would be no ongoing debate. No anguish over the deficiencies of the question or campaigns

 

Edited December 15, 2018 by Francis Albert

[The Mighty Thor]

3 hours ago, Dawnrazor said:

Just Google where the Office of National Statistics have got it wrong!! 

You seen to be able to get statistics when ever you like for the remain argument, I googled for about 30 seconds and found articles about the Offices data being called into question, now come on, you're a very good intlegent poster, one of the better ones imo but you're being intentionally obtuse on you're figures and deflectct questions, again, my opinion. 

Why don't you for the sake of balance and to us who don't seem to be as good at getting figures from the internet Post info on where the office of national statistics got thier numbers wrong? 

Here's a suggestion, you post the articles and statistics that show the benefits of firstly Brexit with a deal and secondly Brexit with no deal.

Include the sources and the methodology and we can then examine the veracity of them.

[Mysterion]

33 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

The referendum was a stupid idea but having a mulltiple choice ballot paper would hardly have helped.

Of one thing I am certain - if the result had gone the other way, even by as small a margin, there would be no ongoing debate. No anguish over the deficiencies of the question or campaigns

 

 

Tend to agree with this. 

What i do find amusing though is Farage (at the time) banging the drum for a 2nd vote if Leave lost by a narrow margin because he felt a tight result was showing people moving towards leave.

 

He’s not so keen on it now. 

[Victorian]

Close ally of the nebulous liar,  Amber Rudd,   not a renowned stickler for the truth herself,   is making noises about parliament coming together and working out a solution of consensus.    Thus far the Tories have adopted a strict policy of absolute exclusion for the views of everyone else in parliament.     Perhaps most insidiously attempting to bypass parliament altogether.

 

So why the sudden appetite to be (or appear to be) more open minded / less warped by control freakery?

 

Deceptive language to appear conciliatory when the real motive is for others to fall in line behind the deal?

 

Rudd acting as May's proxy to actually be conciliatory because May is not capable of dropping the shan Iron Lady routine?

 

More chiccanery wont get the job done.    If there is a genuine will for anyone else to get a say then visible actions will need to be in evidence.

Edited December 15, 2018 by Victorian

[Cade]

[SwindonJambo]

8 hours ago, ri Alban said:

Oh look another no voting Brexiteer Hypocrite.

As for  Ireland they have already paid it back. So after Brexit, let's hope whoever Team GB owes, comes looking for their £2t debt it sponged, when it's economy went tits up. 

 

 

Oh and Scotland will be independent soon. So nae luck, your treacherous actions were not fatal. But hopefully you Brexiteering will be.

 

 

 

Tick Tock!!!

 

The UK has nowhere near the highest National Debt as % of GDP in the EU. France and Italy, both a similar size have even bigger debts, Italy by a huge margin. 

 

Ireland has done very well in its recovery, paying back the bailout money kindly lent by the U.K. and EU in its hour of need. It still has a biggish National Debt of 70% of GDP.

 

https://www.statista.com/statistics/269684/national-debt-in-eu-countries-in-relation-to-gross-domestic-product-gdp/

[ri Alban]

7 minutes ago, SwindonJambo said:

 

The UK has nowhere near the highest National Debt as % of GDP in the EU. France and Italy, both a similar size have even bigger debts, Italy by a huge margin. 

 

Ireland has done very well in its recovery, paying back the bailout money kindly lent by the U.K. and EU in its hour of need. It still has a biggish National Debt of 70% of GDP.

 

https://www.statista.com/statistics/269684/national-debt-in-eu-countries-in-relation-to-gross-domestic-product-gdp/

90% of GDP isn't really great is it. Especially with so called austerity. The deficit is down, with all the cuts to public services, why has the debt more than doubled under Tory governments.

[SwindonJambo]

8 hours ago, ri Alban said:

Mistrust Jake, not paranoia. Personally, I think the EU is better off being shot of the UK. It's been nothing but trouble since they got involved. Good riddance to bad rubbish when March comes, will be the order of the day in the EU.

 

Really? It is the 2nd biggest net contributor to the EU’s budget after Germany. After we leave, the grants dished Out to net recipients of aid will have to be cut drastically. It will have to completely rethink all of its budgets. I voted remain btw, even though I think the EU is wasteful. It was a better being inside the tent pissing out thing for me.

[SwindonJambo]

3 minutes ago, ri Alban said:

90% of GDP isn't really great is it. Especially with so called austerity. The deficit is down, with all the cuts to public services, why has the debt more than doubled under Tory governments.

 

Because a deficit means the debt will  continue to grow, albeit more slowly. With 8/9 years of office, over a period of time, I would expect that. If you wanted the National Debt frozen or reduced, then much more brutal austerity would have been needed, which even the Tories (who I’ve never voted for )  didn’t do. Deficit v Debt again. Scotland has higher public spending than the U.K. average btw. While I don’t doubt that Scotland could cope on its own, the early years would be extremely tough, with severe cuts needed before hopefully finding its feet later.  

[jambo89]

8 hours ago, ri Alban said:

Oh look another no voting Brexiteer Hypocrite.

As for  Ireland they have already paid it back. So after Brexit, let's hope whoever Team GB owes, comes looking for their £2t debt it sponged, when it's economy went tits up. 

 

 

Oh and Scotland will be independent soon. So nae luck, your treacherous actions were not fatal. But hopefully you Brexiteering will be.

 

 

 

Tick Tock!!!

 

Did you not vote for independence!? Talk about hypocrisy!

 

What annoys me is all the capitalist pigs bleating on about how young people won’t get the chance to travel Europe like they did! I’d be more concerned young people can’t get on the property ladder and probably never will.

 

Wages have not increased in line with economic growth / inflation since th 1970’s (around the time we joined the EU funnily enough). 

 

Business’ are dismayed about brexit as it means they can no longer pay s**t wages to our Eastern European counterparts.

 

Of course brexit means big business can no longer get away with it and that’s the real reason they’re against it! Do you think big business’ and the likes give a shiney shite about you!? 

 

Those who constantly argue for remain/ mock those who voted for leave as nothing but racists are as bad as the swivelled eyed cock goblins who go on about how immigration was the main reason they voted to leave.

Edited December 15, 2018 by jambo89

[pablo]

10 minutes ago, SwindonJambo said:

 

Really? It is the 2nd biggest net contributor to the EU’s budget after Germany. After we leave, the grants dished Out to net recipients of aid will have to be cut drastically. It will have to completely rethink all of its budgets. I voted remain btw, even though I think the EU is wasteful. It was a better being inside the tent pissing out thing for me.

 

I agree. I was very much in the remain camp, think leaving is bonkers. But this view that the UK leaving doesn't weaken the EU, just doesn't make sense.

[Dawnrazor]

2 hours ago, The Mighty Thor said:

Here's a suggestion, you post the articles and statistics that show the benefits of firstly Brexit with a deal and secondly Brexit with no deal.

Include the sources and the methodology and we can then examine the veracity of them.

Here's a suggestion, do it yourself, I'm no good at posting links and that stuff, I'm sure you could if you wanted to, it doesn't suit your pont of view though. 

[Dawnrazor]

2 hours ago, Boris said:

Or when the workers seize the means of production! 

So they're thieves too?

[jambo89]

2 hours ago, Boris said:

Or when the workers seize the means of production! 

 

Not allowed under EU competition rules.

 

Business rights over workers rights ala Viking and Laval rulings. 

 

But you knew that already.

[Francis Albert]

Meanwhile The Guardian gleefully reports on its front page that we will need to pay £6 for a three year visa waiver to visit Europe. A whole 2 quid a year. So its back to Blackpool or Portobelly then.

 

(See the UK government taxes on air travel for a real barrier to "free movement")

 

[Francis Albert]

2 hours ago, jambo89 said:

 

Not allowed under EU competition rules.

 

Business rights over workers rights ala Viking and Laval rulings. 

 

But you knew that already.

Indeed. Why Jeremy wants out. Building the socialist paradise he dreams of won't be possible if we remain.

[Dawnrazor]

9 minutes ago, Francis Albert said:

Indeed. Why Jeremy wants out. Building the socialist paradise he dreams of won't be possible if we remain.

Is he still going to model his "utopia" on Chile? That looks like it worked out well. 

[Francis Albert]

23 minutes ago, Dawnrazor said:

Is he still going to model his "utopia" on Chile? That looks like it worked out well. 

Venezuela. 1000% inflation. Or was it  10000?

 

Sorry heading for 1,000,000%

Edited December 15, 2018 by Francis Albert

[Dawnrazor]

1 minute ago, Francis Albert said:

Venezuela. 1000% inflation. Or was it  10000?

Was it Venezuela? My mistake? 

[Unknown user]

3 hours ago, Dawnrazor said:

Here's a suggestion, do it yourself, I'm no good at posting links and that stuff, I'm sure you could if you wanted to, it doesn't suit your pont of view though. 

 

I notice you went quiet when I asked you for quotes from reputable business sources that think a no deal brexit was a good idea.

 

You said there were plenty of them, so should be easy to find. As you can't copy and paste, just say what site you see them on, who the quotes are from and I'll find them from there.

 

 

[Dawnrazor]

15 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

I notice you went quiet when I asked you for quotes from reputable business sources that think a no deal brexit was a good idea.

 

You said there were plenty of them, so should be easy to find. As you can't copy and paste, just say what site you see them on, who the quotes are from and I'll find them from there.

 

 

Never went quiet thanks, had things to do that's all. I posted a reply, I've not seen them all on line, seen most of them on the TV, various political programs and the news but I'm sure you could find them if you wanted to. 

Not much point in saying I saw them on the BBC or Sky as people just wouldn't accept that, seems any news outlet these days isn't credible if they show things that don't suit your personal agenda. 

Edit. 

A few seconds finds this link, I'm sure you could have found it in the it took to post your retort. 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/05/15/eu-referendum-more-than-300-business-leaders-back-a-brexit/amp/

I'm not sure if it'll work, if it doest, try having a look for yourself. 

Edited December 15, 2018 by Dawnrazor

[Unknown user]

2 minutes ago, Dawnrazor said:

Never went quiet thanks, had things to do that's all. I posted a reply. 

 

Your went quiet because you had things to do then, cool, that's fair enough. 

 

I never got a notification that you'd quoted me but I'll get over it. So what sources have you got to back up the claim?

I ask because I searched myself and found nothing, not one quote from a reputable business source that says a no deal brexit is a good idea.

 

The UK imports 40% of its food, and that's on a Just in Time basis. That means there's no backup stocks, and if we don't have anything in place, we're not getting 40% of the food we need to feed ourselves, immediately. How is this a good idea?

[Dawnrazor]

1 minute ago, Smithee said:

 

Your went quiet because you had things to do then, cool, that's fair enough. 

 

I never got a notification that you'd quoted me but I'll get over it. So what sources have you got to back up the claim?

I ask because I searched myself and found nothing, not one quote from a reputable business source that says a no deal brexit is a good idea.

 

The UK imports 40% of its food, and that's on a Just in Time basis. That means there's no backup stocks, and if we don't have anything in place, we're not getting 40% of the food we need to feed ourselves, immediately. How is this a good idea?

Again a few second finds Tim Martin for Brexit, how does your business success compare to his? 

[Dawnrazor]

3 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

Your went quiet because you had things to do then, cool, that's fair enough. 

 

I never got a notification that you'd quoted me but I'll get over it. So what sources have you got to back up the claim?

I ask because I searched myself and found nothing, not one quote from a reputable business source that says a no deal brexit is a good idea.

 

The UK imports 40% of its food, and that's on a Just in Time basis. That means there's no backup stocks, and if we don't have anything in place, we're not getting 40% of the food we need to feed ourselves, immediately. How is this a good idea?

And what percentage of food production de we export? 

[Dawnrazor]

13 minutes ago, Smithee said:

 

Your went quiet because you had things to do then, cool, that's fair enough. 

 

I never got a notification that you'd quoted me but I'll get over it. So what sources have you got to back up the claim?

I ask because I searched myself and found nothing, not one quote from a reputable business source that says a no deal brexit is a good idea.

 

The UK imports 40% of its food, and that's on a Just in Time basis. That means there's no backup stocks, and if we don't have anything in place, we're not getting 40% of the food we need to feed ourselves, immediately. How is this a good idea?

You've went quite! 

[Unknown user]

1 minute ago, Dawnrazor said:

And what percentage of food production de we export? 

Sorry if I wasn't clear - we do not produce enough food to feed ourselves, we're a net importer. 40% of the food we need to live comes from elsewhere, mostly the EU. 

 

Thanks for replying by the way, I just read an interview with Tim Martin there, quite astonishing. He seems to think that a no deal brexit will mean no tariffs instead of the WTO tariffs that would come into effect. He also seems unaware that we'd immediately be unregulated and without recognised standards for trading. I don't know how that would effect his particular business to be fair, but it's a very big deal. It's an especially big deal if we're hoping for understanding and cooperation from the EU after telling them to ram the 39 billion our PM agreed to.

 

To be fair though, that's you got one to back you up, but you also said there were plenty.

 

I was looking for someone who understands the logistical problems that immediately face us on 30/3 but he didn't even mention it in anything I've read. I'll be grateful if you can find someone who goes into this

[Unknown user]

2 minutes ago, Dawnrazor said:

You've went quite! 

Hardly, I put some goodwill into reading and digesting what you put forward, then put a reply together. You had to wait a whole 12 minutes!

 

 

[Dawnrazor]

5 minutes ago, Smithee said:

Sorry if I wasn't clear - we do not produce enough food to feed ourselves, we're a net importer. 40% of the food we need to live comes from elsewhere, mostly the EU. 

 

Thanks for replying by the way, I just read an interview with Tim Martin there, quite astonishing. He seems to think that a no deal brexit will mean no tariffs instead of the WTO tariffs that would come into effect. He also seems unaware that we'd immediately be unregulated and without recognised standards for trading. I don't know how that would effect his particular business to be fair, but it's a very big deal. It's an especially big deal if we're hoping for understanding and cooperation from the EU after telling them to ram the 39 billion our PM agreed to.

 

To be fair though, that's you got one to back you up, but you also said there were plenty.

 

I was looking for someone who understands the logistical problems that immediately face us on 30/3 but he didn't even mention it in anything I've read. I'll be grateful if you can find someone who goes into this

So, how does his business success and experience compare to yours? 

I prosume he knows nothing through years of running a successful business but you do because you're good at finding things on the Internet that suit you remain point of view? 

[Dawnrazor]

5 minutes ago, Smithee said:

Hardly, I put some goodwill into reading and digesting what you put forward, then put a reply together. You had to wait a whole 12 minutes!

 

 

I went for a shite or I would've been quicker! 

[Dawnrazor]

10 minutes ago, Smithee said:

Sorry if I wasn't clear - we do not produce enough food to feed ourselves, we're a net importer. 40% of the food we need to live comes from elsewhere, mostly the EU. 

 

 

So what % of production do we export? 

[Ulysses]

27 minutes ago, Dawnrazor said:

Never went quiet thanks, had things to do that's all. I posted a reply, I've not seen them all on line, seen most of them on the TV, various political programs and the news but I'm sure you could find them if you wanted to. 

Not much point in saying I saw them on the BBC or Sky as people just wouldn't accept that, seems any news outlet these days isn't credible if they show things that don't suit your personal agenda. 

Edit. 

A few seconds finds this link, I'm sure you could have found it in the it took to post your retort. 

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/05/15/eu-referendum-more-than-300-business-leaders-back-a-brexit/amp/

I'm not sure if it'll work, if it doest, try having a look for yourself. 

 

 

Good to see you making an effort at finding sources instead of asking everyone else to do it for you.

 

So, one news report in the Telegraph, dating from before the referendum, and including business leaders who were no longer in business at the time the article was published.

 

None of those asked for a no-deal Brexit.  Why do you?

 

5.4% of economic output lost compared to a Brexit with some kind of a deal, which is what your business leaders want.  That's £110 billion of economic output every year, and close to £37 billion of lost tax revenue.  So, that's a little more than £700 million a week lost to taxpayers and lost to public services.  That's not my opinion.  It's what your ONS thinks, it's what your national central bank thinks, and it's what your Treasury people think.