Understanding the North Korean nightmare.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

There's a difference between a protagonist and an antagonist/aggressor.  Kim is the only aggressor, I agree, and he's a nutcase.

 

But the protagonists are the leaders of China, the USA, Japan, and the two Koreas.  They all need to get in a room and sort it out.  Kim needs to be told that, no matter what, if he starts a fight with the USA, he's going to finish up dead and his country will be a smoking ruin.  Even nutcases understand that talk.

 

Especially if his one and only friend tells him this as well.

 

Again, step forward China.

[luckyBatistuta]

Aye coz assassinating the leader definitely won't trigger a knee-jerk invasion of the South, eh?

 

What's with the facepalms and rofl's Cade?

I don't agree that it will 'definitely' trigger a knee-jerk invasion of the South, but that's your opinion, which is a guess, not a fact.

 

Aye Iraq, Libya and Afghanistan have all worked out just grand after we got rid of the head honcho

All the people came together and made a new eden.

He's a product of his environment, so to us he seems mad, but he's quite sane, by North Korean standards.

 

And if you take him out, then the Generals take over.  They may be even worse!

 

 

 

There is a chance that could happen Boris. I know it could be worse at the moment, but he's acting like a lunatic at the moment and doesn't look like stopping, so maybe a chance worth taking. There are probably quite a few countries throughout history who have had their psychopathic leader taken out and not become far worse.

 

When do China, or indeed America for that matter, stop doing nothing though? As it seems that North Korea are going to continue doing what they are doing, do the powers that be wait for one of these rogue missiles to land on a Japanese town or city, or do they wait until they develop the capabilities to actually make them go where they want them to go, or worse still, till they develop a nuclear warhead?

Exactly

[michael_bolton]

I think China and America stop doing nothing if North Korea actually attacks someone.

 

It's simply an analysis game.

 

If North Korea attacks someone, it'll be really bad. A lot of people will probably die and North Korea will be destroyed. The regime will be killed or captured (then ultimately killed anyway) and North Korea will become even more of a human catastrophe than it already is, leading to a massive refugee crisis and South Korea and America inheriting a huge nation-building programme that they don't want and probably can't really afford. It also throws the Americans into direct political, and possibly military, conflict with the Chinese and maybe the Russians. The regime know they are finished if they attack anyone, and this is the massive constraint on this actually happening.

 

However, let's say some sort of pre-emptive action is taken by America. North Korea would lose, would be destroyed and the regime would be killed or captured and North Korea will become even more of a human catastrophe than it already is, leading to a massive refugee crisis and South Korea and America inheriting a huge nation-building programme that they don't want and probably can't really afford. It also throws the Americans into direct political, and possibly military, conflict with the Chinese and maybe the Russians.. Same, same, same. But, they would almost certainly retailiate before being finished off. Leading to lots of people dying somewhere else too. Tokyo, Seoul, possibly somewhere else.

 

So, the results of both courses of action are essentially the same. However, waiting for NK to attack someone is waiting for something that will probably never happen. It's not in the North's interests to do so, unless really provoked. Taking aggressive action against NK more or less guarantees that all of these bad things will happen.

[Jambo, Goodbye]

A viewpoint many here take is that the status quo suits both China and the US in many ways. They would both like the rocket firing to stop but the whole situation is like a political game. 

 

China enjoy their communist buffer. Essentially a vassal to china. 

 

The US gains from this too. From being able to post thousands of troops in Asia, install THAAD, station US navy ships in the region, some prominent in Busan, and back home supply all the data they need to keep fuelling their military budget. A budget that far exceeds anyone else and keeps a lot of people making a great deal of money. 

 

China's objection to THAAD was an example of the political bluster in this game. They know fine well the navy ships docked in Busan have far superior radar capabilities than THAAD does, which was their main grumble. 

 

It's all very "My ****** is bigger than your ******" and NK is the measuring tape. 

 

NK are only interested in self preservation. Jong Un needs a legacy and this is his way of showing strength to a nation which is beginning to show cracks. 

 

The true way to bring it all down might be to supply information to the population. Sending balloons over the border loaded with leaflets has been done in the past. I'd like to think we should be trying to set up satellites that will cover NK with free WI-FI. But that wouldn't suit the top officials in either China or the US unfortunately. 

 

The opinion in Korea certainly isn't to break the armistice. They have been at war continuously since 1950. Personally I think there is a steady escalation but can't see any benefit to an instigation from an outsider. Especially a western one no less. 

[michael_bolton]

NK's largest nuclear test so far conducted a couple of hours ago.

 

It'll be interesting to see the response from American, China, South Korea and Japan.

[Homme]

NK's largest nuclear test so far conducted a couple of hours ago.

 

It'll be interesting to see the response from American, China, South Korea and Japan.

Ten times larger than last year.

 

Certainly seems to have ruffled more feathers with Japan.

[deesidejambo]

Now that China public are starting to agitate on social media it may be China that gets destabilised now. It may now be too late.

 

Now the people of Japan and Soyth Korea are in extreme danger and the threat of destruction will never go away so they will have to live their lives, and their children's lives with an ever-present threat.

 

Time to take out the trash.

[Ibrahim Tall]

I'd imagine it also getting to point 'earthquake' wise that China won't be particularly happy having tests on its border especially given it has cities close by.

6.3 is pretty ****ing big, it's even larger than the ones which hit Italy in recent years that flattened whole villages.

[kingantti1874]

Tremors felt in vladivistok.. Suspect the Russian will. Be far from chuffed as well.. Rumours that the test was an H bomb..

[deesidejambo]

I'd imagine it also getting to point 'earthquake' wise that China won't be particularly happy having tests on its border especially given it has cities close by.

6.3 is pretty ******* big, it's even larger than the ones which hit Italy in recent years that flattened whole villages.

Apparently there is big alarm in China social media. The China Govt now have a major internal problem.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

NK are certainly pushing their luck, everytime Trump issues a new warning to NK, NK go right on and ignore it.

 

Something has to give, only a matter of time as this can't carry on.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

Apparently there is big alarm in China social media. The China Govt now have a major internal problem.

 

And that could be the tipping point where China says enough is enough and actually gets off their butt and deals with Kim.

[deesidejambo]

And that could be the tipping point where China says enough is enough and actually gets off their butt and deals with Kim.

Yes there is a win-win here. Flatten NK and transfer control of the Country to China. I bet SK would rather have a stable China on its border than an unstable NK

[michael_bolton]

To be fair, and at risk of being accused of racism, east Asians are proper drama queens. Everything creates a huge fuss on social media. Everything.

 

I doubt the Chinese government will be too bothered about that. Especially since they can just shut it down if they want.

[Ibrahim Tall]

Yes there is a win-win here. Flatten NK and transfer control of the Country to China. I bet SK would rather have a stable China on its border than an unstable NK

And take the responsibility for re-educating 25,000,000 brainwashed, malnourished people that are barely living in this century? The expected cost of Korean Unification is expected to be around a trillion dollars, a Chinese takeover would likely be even more expensive with the language differences and greater resistance to an 'occupier'. Also isn't factoring in if they manage to launch a missiles at Beijing/Shangai etc during any invasion.

 

China doesn't have any easy choices here either to be honest, shit situation for all.

[kingantti1874]

NK are certainly pushing their luck, everytime Trump issues a new warning to NK, NK go right on and ignore it.

 

Something has to give, only a matter of time as this can't carry on.

Tin Hat on but I don't think trump is doing much wrong here.. International community needs to step up and sort this out somehow

[deesidejambo]

And take the responsibility for re-educating 25,000,000 brainwashed, malnourished people that are barely living in this century? The expected cost of Korean Unification is expected to be around a trillion dollars, a Chinese takeover would likely be even more expensive with the language differences and greater resistance to an 'occupier'. Also isn't factoring in if they manage to launch a missiles at Beijing/Shangai etc during any invasion.

 

China doesn't have any easy choices here either to be honest, shit situation for all.

The reason they are now being destabilised is their own fault.. now we have the whole population of Japan in range for a long time.

 

WW3 on the way

[michael_bolton]

Yes there is a win-win here. Flatten NK and transfer control of the Country to China. I bet SK would rather have a stable China on its border than an unstable NK

 

A knowledge of Korean history would tell you that foreign occupation would not be accepted. Likely not by the South either.

[michael_bolton]

Now that China public are starting to agitate on social media it may be China that gets destabilised now. It may now be too late.

 

Now the people of Japan and Soyth Korea are in extreme danger and the threat of destruction will never go away so they will have to live their lives, and their children's lives with an ever-present threat.

 

Time to take out the trash.

 

The language in this post actually reads very similarly to a North Korean press release.

 

I think you need to have a wee sit down.

[Ibrahim Tall]

The reason they are now being destabilised is their own fault.. now we have the whole population of Japan in range for a long time.

WW3 on the way

Could argue the fault lies with Bush tbh, Clinton was genuinely on the verge of 'peace' in 2000 before Bush came in and labelled them part of the "Axis of Evil" in his first state of the union speech.

[deesidejambo]

The language in this post actually reads very similarly to a North Korean press release.

 

I think you need to have a wee sit down.

So what's your solution?

[michael_bolton]

So what's your solution?

 

I've already given it.

 

Do nothing.

 

North Korea is not going to attack anyone.

 

This weapon is their guarantee against regime change. That's what their regime wants. They haven't developed these weapons to attack anyone as a first strike. To do so would be suicide.

 

What the international community has to learn from this is how to handle other would-be nuclear states in the future. North Korea could and should have been dealt with decades ago. The failures of the past mean that we now have to accept a nuclear-armed North Korea. There is now no alternative.

 

Action almost certainly results in lots of deaths. Inaction almost certainly results in no deaths.

 

Many people keep saying 'something must be done' without realising the blindingly obvious. Nothing can now be done.

[deesidejambo]

I've already given it.

 

Do nothing.

 

North Korea is not going to attack anyone.

 

This weapon is their guarantee against regime change. That's what their regime wants. They haven't developed these weapons to attack anyone as a first strike. To do so would be suicide.

 

What the international community has to learn from this is how to handle other would-be nuclear states in the future. North Korea could and should have been dealt with decades ago. The failures of the past mean that we now have to accept a nuclear-armed North Korea. There is now no alternative.

 

Action almost certainly results in lots of deaths. Inaction almost certainly results in no deaths.

 

Many people keep saying 'something must be done' without realising the blindingly obvious. Nothing can now be done.

So you are happy for a nuclear power to have sway over people forever?

 

I'm not sure the people of Japan will agree.

 

And your solution depends on a hope that nothing gets worse.

 

1939

[The Real Maroonblood]

The reason they are now being destabilised is their own fault.. now we have the whole population of Japan in range for a long time.

WW3 on the way

We're doomed.

[Governor Tarkin]

Bolton advocating the sensible approach and providing a good summary.

[Riddley Walker]

I've already given it.

 

Do nothing.

 

North Korea is not going to attack anyone.

 

This weapon is their guarantee against regime change. That's what their regime wants. They haven't developed these weapons to attack anyone as a first strike. To do so would be suicide.

 

What the international community has to learn from this is how to handle other would-be nuclear states in the future. North Korea could and should have been dealt with decades ago. The failures of the past mean that we now have to accept a nuclear-armed North Korea. There is now no alternative.

 

Action almost certainly results in lots of deaths. Inaction almost certainly results in no deaths.

 

Many people keep saying 'something must be done' without realising the blindingly obvious. Nothing can now be done.

Your posts on this have been pretty much spot-on. If there was ever a time for "action", that time has long gone. There are some experts that believe N Korea is actually a lot closer than people think to having a nuclear bomb ready for launch - meaning they are now untouchable as a state.

 

There isn't anything that can be done militarily as it would result in massive loss of civilian life. The instant N Korea realised they were under attack Seoul would be flattened. It's not logistically possible to wipe out their military before this happens.

 

Another option could be assassination but the resultant power vacuum it would leave would be counter-productive. And NK could well view that as an attack and strike back.

 

When folk are saying it's "time to act" there's really not much that can be done.

 

I'd encourage folk to listen to Sam Harris' podcast with Mark Bowden, it's one of the best things I've listened to on this topic.

[Riddley Walker]

If Trump were to attack N Korea it would be against the advice of every one of his generals.

[michael_bolton]

So you are happy for a nuclear power to have sway over people forever?

 

I'm not sure the people of Japan will agree.

 

And your solution depends on a hope that nothing gets worse.

 

1939

 

I am pretty sure the people of Japan agree with me and not you. The Korean people I know certainly agree with me, in the main. They don't fancy burning to death in the inevitable retaliatory attack that would come in the result of an attack on North Korea. I see no reason why the Japanese would feel any different.

 

It's easy for you to sit where you are and mouth off about 'something should be done', but with all respect, you are not going to live with the consequences of that, and you don't seem to fully understand what the consequences would be.

 

Again, I mean this in a completely non-aggressive tone, but pretty much everything you've written on this thread is wrong and shows no understanding of the reality of the situation.

 

Here's a list of basic things that I don't think you have understood.

 

1) North Korea absolutely does not want a war.

2) North Korea will not attack anyone unless they are attacked first or feel certain they are about to be.

3) Attacking North Korea militarily will almost guarantee attacks on civilians in the surrounding countries and guarantee many deaths.

4) Attacking North Korea may well lead to a conventional war in the border area of the two Koreas. The North would lose, but it would take time and many would die.

5) It is unacceptable to the Chinese for Korea to be unified and pro-US.

6) It is unacceptable to Koreans to have their country (or part of it) run by a foreign power. They've been there before.

7) Just as the Chinese do not want the Americans at their border, so it would be wholly unacceptable to the Americans and South Koreans to have China control the North and station troops near Seoul and the American soldiers there.

8) Anyway, China would have no desire to pay the cost required to rebuild and run North Korea.

9) The Russians, the Chinese and the South Koreans all have a strong interest in avoiding unrest in the region. Attacking North Korea guarantees regional unrest, possibly leading to global unrest. A rake of refugees, a (potentially nuclear) conflict involving the US, China, Russia and other regional, and eventually global, powers, almost certainly leading to a huge load of conventional weapons, biological weapons and perhaps nuclear weapons going missing when the North Korean state collapses. This is in nobody's interests.

 

In short, none of the things you have mentioned are a good idea, and some of them are completely implausible.

 

I don't know where you're getting your information to form your opinion on this matter, but I'd suggest you look elsewhere and get a better handle on the situation.

[deesidejambo]

I am pretty sure the people of Japan agree with me and not you. The Korean people I know certainly agree with me, in the main. They don't fancy burning to death in the inevitable retaliatory attack that would come in the result of an attack on North Korea. I see no reason why the Japanese would feel any different.

 

It's easy for you to sit where you are and mouth off about 'something should be done', but with all respect, you are not going to live with the consequences of that, and you don't seem to fully understand what the consequences would be.

 

Again, I mean this in a completely non-aggressive tone, but pretty much everything you've written on this thread is wrong and shows no understanding of the reality of the situation.

 

Here's a list of basic things that I don't think you have understood.

 

1) North Korea absolutely does not want a war.

2) North Korea will not attack anyone unless they are attacked first or feel certain they are about to be.

3) Attacking North Korea militarily will almost guarantee attacks on civilians in the surrounding countries and guarantee many deaths.

4) Attacking North Korea may well lead to a conventional war in the border area of the two Koreas. The North would lose, but it would take time and many would die.

5) It is unacceptable to the Chinese for Korea to be unified and pro-US.

6) It is unacceptable to Koreans to have their country (or part of it) run by a foreign power. They've been there before.

7) Just as the Chinese do not want the Americans at their border, so it would be wholly unacceptable to the Americans and South Koreans to have China control the North and station troops near Seoul and the American soldiers there.

8) Anyway, China would have no desire to pay the cost required to rebuild and run North Korea.

9) The Russians, the Chinese and the South Koreans all have a strong interest in avoiding unrest in the region. Attacking North Korea guarantees regional unrest, possibly leading to global unrest. A rake of refugees, a (potentially nuclear) conflict involving the US, China, Russia and other regional, and eventually global, powers, almost certainly leading to a huge load of conventional weapons, biological weapons and perhaps nuclear weapons going missing when the North Korean state collapses. This is in nobody's interests.

 

In short, none of the things you have mentioned are a good idea, and some of them are completely implausible.

 

I don't know where you're getting your information to form your opinion on this matter, but I'd suggest you look elsewhere and get a better handle on the situation.

 

Good luck. Now the people of Japan live in perpetuity with the threat of their destruction. Time for them to get nukes

[deesidejambo]

And Iran will be happy. Cheap nukes on the web

[Ibrahim Tall]

Good luck. Now the people of Japan live in perpetuity with the threat of their destruction. Time for them to get nukes

More nukes won't help the situation, in the event of an attack NK will already get erased by an overwhelming American Nuclear response a few extra coming from Japan won't make a difference to anyone.

[deesidejambo]

Och on rellection you are right.

 

Just let NK keep on building nukes as much as they want.

 

Then let them export nukes all over the world.

 

What could possibly go wrong?

[Seymour M Hersh]

And Iran will be happy. Cheap nukes on the web

 

Dark web only surely?

[deesidejambo]

I am pretty sure the people of Japan agree with me and not you. The Korean people I know certainly agree with me, in the main. They don't fancy burning to death in the inevitable retaliatory attack that would come in the result of an attack on North Korea. I see no reason why the Japanese would feel any different.

 

It's easy for you to sit where you are and mouth off about 'something should be done', but with all respect, you are not going to live with the consequences of that, and you don't seem to fully understand what the consequences would be.

 

Again, I mean this in a completely non-aggressive tone, but pretty much everything you've written on this thread is wrong and shows no understanding of the reality of the situation.

 

Here's a list of basic things that I don't think you have understood.

 

1) North Korea absolutely does not want a war.

2) North Korea will not attack anyone unless they are attacked first or feel certain they are about to be.

3) Attacking North Korea militarily will almost guarantee attacks on civilians in the surrounding countries and guarantee many deaths.

4) Attacking North Korea may well lead to a conventional war in the border area of the two Koreas. The North would lose, but it would take time and many would die.

5) It is unacceptable to the Chinese for Korea to be unified and pro-US.

6) It is unacceptable to Koreans to have their country (or part of it) run by a foreign power. They've been there before.

7) Just as the Chinese do not want the Americans at their border, so it would be wholly unacceptable to the Americans and South Koreans to have China control the North and station troops near Seoul and the American soldiers there.

8) Anyway, China would have no desire to pay the cost required to rebuild and run North Korea.

9) The Russians, the Chinese and the South Koreans all have a strong interest in avoiding unrest in the region. Attacking North Korea guarantees regional unrest, possibly leading to global unrest. A rake of refugees, a (potentially nuclear) conflict involving the US, China, Russia and other regional, and eventually global, powers, almost certainly leading to a huge load of conventional weapons, biological weapons and perhaps nuclear weapons going missing when the North Korean state collapses. This is in nobody's interests.

 

In short, none of the things you have mentioned are a good idea, and some of them are completely implausible.

 

I don't know where you're getting your information to form your opinion on this matter, but I'd suggest you look elsewhere and get a better handle on the situation.

Your condescending and patronising approach you can stick up your Jacksie.

 

The issue is of global importance, not just the Korean Peninsula. But you don't have the broad perspective to see that.

 

But hey, just do nothing, let them build as many nukes, chemical weapons, bio weapons as they want. Then let them export to whoever hates the west.

 

Good luck with that.

[Unknown user]

Your condescending and patronising approach you can stick up your Jacksie.

 

The issue is of global importance, not just the Korean Peninsula. But you don't have the broad perspective to see that.

 

But hey, just do nothing, let them build as many nukes, chemical weapons, bio weapons as they want. Then let them export to whoever hates the west.

 

Good luck with that.

I don't get why you're being like that, the guys made some good points and you've come back with sarcasm and contempt.

I don't think he's been that patronising at all

[Homme]

I don't get why you're being like that, the guys made some good points and you've come back with sarcasm and contempt.

I don't think he's been that patronising at all

I think he sounded patronising as feck, and a little like the leader ok NK

[AlphonseCapone]

Your condescending and patronising approach you can stick up your Jacksie.

 

The issue is of global importance, not just the Korean Peninsula. But you don't have the broad perspective to see that.

 

But hey, just do nothing, let them build as many nukes, chemical weapons, bio weapons as they want. Then let them export to whoever hates the west.

 

Good luck with that.

I think you are overreacting a bit mate. Michael Bolton has been pretty spot with his analysis where as yours reads like a red top, no offence.

 

People in the West are horrific at understanding the multifaceted complexities involved in other cultures. Yer man Kim is actually behaving rationally when you look at it from his perspective. Russia's actions in Crimea were also rational (note rational doesn't mean justified), but you wouldn't think it from the discourse over here.

 

China won't be collapsing because some citizens are angry or upset online. The Chinese have been run monocratically for essentially their entire existence and there probably hasn't been as powerful a grip on the country as the Communist Party currently has.

 

There won't be a WW3 over this. For as long as I can remember whenever things like this happens, inevitably folk claim WW3 is coming, I've done it myself.

 

The fact is, the whole world lives under the threat of nuclear war. It isn't nothing new.

[Unknown user]

I think he sounded patronising as feck, and a little like the leader ok NK

I suppose that's how pub fights start.

 

That, and looking at people's bursds obviously.

[deesidejambo]

I think you are overreacting a bit mate. Michael Bolton has been pretty spot with his analysis where as yours reads like a red top, no offence.

 

People in the West are horrific at understanding the multifaceted complexities involved in other cultures. Yer man Kim is actually behaving rationally when you look at it from his perspective. Russia's actions in Crimea were also rational (note rational doesn't mean justified), but you wouldn't think it from the discourse over here.

 

China won't be collapsing because some citizens are angry or upset online. The Chinese have been run monocratically for essentially their entire existence and there probably hasn't been as powerful a grip on the country as the Communist Party currently has.

 

There won't be a WW3 over this. For as long as I can remember whenever things like this happens, inevitably folk claim WW3 is coming, I've done it myself.

 

The fact is, the whole world lives under the threat of nuclear war. It isn't nothing new.

Well his posts to me have been instruction to read up on Korean history and "what I don't understand".

 

Well I don't claim to be an expert in Korean history but I don't like being told to go and read books when I give an opinion, educated or otherwise.

 

Anyway I take a more global view. Allowing any state to build and export nukes is not going to end well in the long run.

[elvoys]

My thing is what do we actually know about the little fat w%?k?

 

Is he happy to use their creation myth, propaganda state, enslavement of his people etc as other power mad totalitarians of the 20th century did? Or does he actually believe it? Doe he believe they are on a path to defeating all and sundry? What measures if any stop him having a midnight fever dream and detonating an h bomb on Seoul or Tokyo?

 

On a side note, even though NK seem like a relic from the 20th century's communist death machine we shouldnt forget Pol Pot got his ideas from his time amongst rich, hippy, postmodern w%&ks of the west at the Sorbonne a long time after Stalin's numbers were toted up.

 

Down with the neo Marxists and their new oppression pyramids.

[The Real Maroonblood]

Och on rellection you are right.

Just let NK keep on building nukes as much as they want.

Then let them export nukes all over the world.

What could possibly go wrong?

What a drama queen.

[Sharpie]

Just don't understand the panic, he only tested a hydrogen bomb that caused a 6.3 earthquake, and we are all protected by Donald Trump, so why the concern.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

Following on from his 'Fire & Fury' statement, Trump has taken to twitter following the NK nuclear test.

 

He's said a few things but perhaps the most significant is this - ?South Korea is finding, as I have told them, that their talk of appeasement with North Korea will not work, they only understand one thing!?

http://nypost.com/2017/09/03/trump-north-koreas-actions-continue-to-be-hostile-and-dangerous-to-us/

 

Later Trump was asked by reporters if he'll launch an attack on NK, his reply - "We'll see"

[Jambo-Jimbo]

Trump has just said that the US is considering stopping all trade with any country doing business with North Korea.

 

That of course means stopping all trade with China.

 

This shit is getting real and serious, folks.

[Gizmo]

Well his posts to me have been instruction to read up on Korean history and "what I don't understand".

 

Well I don't claim to be an expert in Korean history but I don't like being told to go and read books when I give an opinion, educated or otherwise.

 

Anyway I take a more global view. Allowing any state to build and export nukes is not going to end well in the long run.

Irony alert. Donald, go back to twitter mate. 

[Maple Leaf]

Following on from his 'Fire & Fury' statement, Trump has taken to twitter following the NK nuclear test.

 

He's said a few things but perhaps the most significant is this - ?South Korea is finding, as I have told them, that their talk of appeasement with North Korea will not work, they only understand one thing!?

http://nypost.com/2017/09/03/trump-north-koreas-actions-continue-to-be-hostile-and-dangerous-to-us/

 

Later Trump was asked by reporters if he'll launch an attack on NK, his reply - "We'll see"

Trump's bellicose words are not helping the situation.  Kim will interpret those words as a threat, and justification for NK's need to develop a nuclear deterrent.

 

I think that Bannon was right when he said that there's no military solution to this problem, unless seeing millions of Koreans die is regarded as a solution.

 

The ones with the the most clout are the Chinese, so they need to be having a quiet word with their neighbour.  And some grown-up in Washington needs to be having a quiet word with Trump.

[Gizmo]

Trump has just said that the US is considering stopping all trade with any country doing business with North Korea.

 

That of course means stopping all trade with China.

 

This shit is getting real and serious, folks.

The US cannot afford not to trade with China. Particularly considering the Chinese banks own most of their debt. It's just bluster, the sensible heads work behind the scenes. 

[Sharpie]

If you are susceptible as I am to watching the lying media, you would also have heard that again he is tweeting statements that are contradictory to those of some of his highest advisers including the military.  He is still inferring about military action and the others suggest diplomacy.  I think he is in the planning prtion of writing his Presidential history and his legacy, consistent with his general approach to planning and action,nonsense, he does not seem to realise if he goes down the fire and fury path there will be none of us around to read about how wonderful, great, and something the world has never seen the like of,  his  story would tell.

 

If you were to read this guys writings on JKB you would say he is nuts, he's not a member is he?.

[Jambo-Jimbo]

The US cannot afford not to trade with China. Particularly considering the Chinese banks own most of their debt. It's just bluster, the sensible heads work behind the scenes. 

 

Of course it's just bluster, however when you make threats there often comes a point when you have to actually carry them out or back down.

 

Neither Trump or Kim strike me to be the kind of men to back down.

[Unknown user]

If you are susceptible as I am to watching the lying media, you would also have heard that again he is tweeting statements that are contradictory to those of some of his highest advisers including the military. He is still inferring about military action and the others suggest diplomacy. I think he is in the planning prtion of writing his Presidential history and his legacy, consistent with his general approach to planning and action,nonsense, he does not seem to realise if he goes down the fire and fury path there will be none of us around to read about how wonderful, great, and something the world has never seen the like of, his story would tell.

 

If you were to read this guys writings on JKB you would say he is nuts, he's not a member is he?.

I'd personally say Donald Trump is definitely a member.