Was the McGhee affair "a Fiasco?"

[The People's Chimp]

I'm minded to think it wasn't. The word behind the secenes was McGhee for months. It appeared as if some kind of deal was sorted, and then the story grew and grew. It's also clear that he was on the verge of agreeing a deal. He was then, according to most, emotionally blackmailed into agreeing to stay at well.

 

Two points occur to me. The first is that any glance over McGhee's managerial career shows a stunning lack of loyalty. It would also appear that his behind the scenes manouevering with romanov and hearts showed a lack of loyalty to well. Hardly surprising really. The subsequent volte face could again be construed as reneging on his word to hearts.

 

I'd been very impressed by the way McGhee conducted himself at Motherwell this season. I wasn't impressed by his niggling, moaning, diving and dirty motherwell team, although they certainly got results. I'd never had much time for him prior to taking the well job, but as I said, his conduct and his interviews, led me to change my mind. But, whatever you think of that, I don't think it can be said that i'd trust him with my life if the chips were down. I don't think i'd trust him with hearts either, if the chips were down. And the way things are at the moment, we don't want someone who'll cut and run. We need someone who is committed.

 

Oh, and the second point? Well, i think we'll have the last laugh with McGhee. Motherwell won't do anything next season.

[Rawrrrrrrr]

Without a doubt

 

6 month hunt and we identify our man, we then either as you want to choose

 

1) tapped him up

2) acted incompetently and told well of our interest before things were concluded

 

An 8 day "interview"

 

Lets just tell it as it is, Romanov had decided on Mcghee, Romanov then got done over, its a complete embarassment that he chose Well over us, especially if you believe the figures touted about

 

Whats even more concerning is the 20% transfers and 80% team selection, completely contradicting January 1st

[Marmeladent?rtchen]

Oh, and the second point? Well, i think we'll have the last laugh with McGhee. Motherwell won't do anything next season.

 

 

I dont think so,,,, the way things are going I dont think we will do anything next season and everyone will be laughing at us,,,,,, again!!!

[Guest JamboRobbo]

Two points occur to me. The first is that any glance over McGhee's managerial career shows a stunning lack of loyalty. It would also appear that his behind the scenes manouevering with romanov and hearts showed a lack of loyalty to well. Hardly surprising really.

 

Yet HMFC seem surprised by it......

[The People's Chimp]

Without a doubt

 

6 month hunt and we identify our man, we then either as you want to choose

 

1) tapped him up

2) acted incompetently and told well of our interest before things were concluded

 

An 8 day "interview"

 

Lets just tell it as it is, Romanov had decided on Mcghee, Romanov then got done over, its a complete embarassment that he chose Well over us, especially if you believe the figures touted about

 

Whats even more concerning is the 20% transfers and 80% team selection, completely contradicting January 1st

 

I'd agree about that being an embarassment. But i don't think that this one is all hearts fault (for once). I just wonder how much you can trust McGhee? well fans would have been saying that if he'd come to us! But in terms of behind the scenes discussions people have been saying mcghee for ages. He must have given some indication to VR/CO which he has then gone back on.

[Guest JamboRobbo]

I just wonder how much you can trust McGhee?

 

So why did we trust him then?

[eddie fenwick]

mcghee turned it into a fiasco,so yes

[The People's Chimp]

Yet HMFC seem surprised by it......

 

I'd bet they are shocked by it.

[Rawrrrrrrr]

I'd agree about that being an embarassment. But i don't think that this one is all hearts fault (for once). I just wonder how much you can trust McGhee? well fans would have been saying that if he'd come to us! But in terms of behind the scenes discussions people have been saying mcghee for ages. He must have given some indication to VR/CO which he has then gone back on.

 

 

Don't get me wrong McGhee is a cockroach and will be off to the tims before long, however I think romanov's interference and less than traditional way of doing things is why he missed out on his man

 

He had 6 months to look into who he wanted and make a decision, to make someone travel to lithunia for an 8 day interview is farcical, it would put anyone off.

 

As soon as hearts chose mcghee he should have been interviewed immediatly and the job offered before well even got a chance to counter it

 

Instead romanovs games means well managed to talk him round

 

I also love how the whole Tapped up/Incompetent - we must be one of them - question is being avoided

 

Tbh McGhee was never my choice but it was clear he was the clubs and they completely ballsed it up

 

I also have to ask what sort of decent manager will see a 8 day interview as an acceptable application stage, not many i would guess

 

I have a very bad feeling we will end up with a complete diddy, someone was joking with me that Noel Whelan had been seen in a hearts tracksuit but that is the sort of diddy appointment we could end up with:mad:

[The People's Chimp]

So why did we trust him then?

 

Well, most on here were also willing to trust him. I think we're just desperate to put it right, and I'm hoping that includes the board.

[Seymour M Hersh]

mcghee turned it into a fiasco,so yes

 

That's the way I see it as well. I think the club behaved professionally whic is more than rankers did when poaching the Scotland manager.

[Jam Tarts 1874]

Whats even more concerning is the 20% transfers and 80% team selection, completely contradicting January 1st

 

You have some evidence of this? Or are you just in one of your conspiracy dream modes?

[Rawrrrrrrr]

You have some evidence of this? Or are you just in one of your conspiracy dream modes?

 

 

A Member posted it a few days, I strongly believe it to be true given romanovs history

 

I suppose kurskis starting was all a conspiracy theory and never really happened?

[Boof]

Prancer...why do you keep calling it an '8 day interview'?

[Mr Romanov Saviour of HMFC]

If we don't have back-up plans then yes, it was a fiasco.

[jamborich]

Don't get me wrong McGhee is a cockroach and will be off to the tims before long, however I think romanov's interference and less than traditional way of doing things is why he missed out on his man

 

He had 6 months to look into who he wanted and make a decision, to make someone travel to lithunia for an 8 day interview is farcical, it would put anyone off.

 

As soon as hearts chose mcghee he should have been interviewed immediatly and the job offered before well even got a chance to counter it

 

Instead romanovs games means well managed to talk him round

 

I also love how the whole Tapped up/Incompetent - we must be one of them - question is being avoided

Tbh McGhee was never my choice but it was clear he was the clubs and they completely ballsed it up

 

I also have to ask what sort of decent manager will see a 8 day interview as an acceptable application stage, not many i would guess

 

I have a very bad feeling we will end up with a complete diddy, someone was joking with me that Noel Whelan had been seen in a hearts tracksuit but that is the sort of diddy appointment we could end up with:mad:

 

You rattle on about Mcghee being tapped up then say he should have been interviewed immediately.

Are you saying we should have interviewed him at the time we allegedly tapped him.

[bighusref]

I'm minded to think it wasn't. The word behind the secenes was McGhee for months. It appeared as if some kind of deal was sorted, and then the story grew and grew. It's also clear that he was on the verge of agreeing a deal. He was then, according to most, emotionally blackmailed into agreeing to stay at well.

 

Two points occur to me. The first is that any glance over McGhee's managerial career shows a stunning lack of loyalty. It would also appear that his behind the scenes manouevering with romanov and hearts showed a lack of loyalty to well. Hardly surprising really. The subsequent volte face could again be construed as reneging on his word to hearts.

 

I'd been very impressed by the way McGhee conducted himself at Motherwell this season. I wasn't impressed by his niggling, moaning, diving and dirty motherwell team, although they certainly got results. I'd never had much time for him prior to taking the well job, but as I said, his conduct and his interviews, led me to change my mind. But, whatever you think of that, I don't think it can be said that i'd trust him with my life if the chips were down. I don't think i'd trust him with hearts either, if the chips were down. And the way things are at the moment, we don't want someone who'll cut and run. We need someone who is committed.

 

Oh, and the second point? Well, i think we'll have the last laugh with McGhee. Motherwell won't do anything next season.

 

I am in two minds about this.

 

From the outside looking in, all we have done is ask for permission to speak to a manager only to find he does not want to come here. Hardly a new thing for football clubs.

 

However, the big issue, as prancer touches on, is the planning that has (seemingly) went into this. Here we sit days off of six months since the "new manager" statement, and we have only just made our first (public) forays into getting one. There can only be a few weeks until pre season, and to find that we now have to look for a plan B with such a small timeframe is quite scary.

 

However, I will not judge overly harshly until the pre-season is here. THAT is the key date for VR. Bring a decent manager to Hearts prior to that and we WILL better Motherwell next year and the McGhee situation will seem like a dodged bullet. Christ, to think we are now HOPING to be better than Motherwell ffs. Romanov has done a number on us; good and proper.

 

No manager for pre-season and the term "fiasco" would be apt.

[FORTHCLYDE]

I heard that McGhee was told there was no money whatsoever to buy players except fuds from the triangle that's why he said no. My source was second hand from Tynecastle so I cannot vouch for it.

[The People's Chimp]

I think its been a fiasco.

 

I have said on another thread we needed a manager in Jan. Not June.

 

If McGee was not available in that timescale. We move to our next prefered canditate and so on. Its not that complicated.

 

I think it was a bit stupid to wait 6 months for McGee when anything could have happened to throw a spanner in the works ie. another team approaching him.

 

We now face a situation where a new manager will have to hit the ground running. With no time to assess the squad and underatke the major overhaul that is required. This should have been planned and organised at the end of last season. The fact that it was not IMO was stupid.

 

We now potentially face writing another season or part of the season off, whilst a new management team beds in. Furthermore, they will have little or not time to undertake the squad re-building. That truelly is a fiasco.

 

Bottom line nearly 6 months and we still have not appointed someone. That'ss not good enough.

 

TBH that's a seperate issue. Of course the 6 month manager search was in itself a fiasco. but in terms of the mcghee affir over the last few weeks, i'd say it was mcghee who made it a fiasco. But agreed, we should have been seriously trying to get a manager in january. If one wasn't available, then we should have moved on.

[Nelly Terraces]

Hearts spend 6 months trying to get this bloke, laying on their stupid little trips to Lithland to meet the Lithumaniac in person.

 

In 1 hour, the Mudderhell chairman persuedes him, over the phone, to stay put.

 

Nah, not a fiasco, just another ****g embarrassing shambles, in a long list of them , perpetrated by the goons and incompetents in 'charge' of HMFC.

[Nelly Terraces]

They had 6 months in which to get 1 employee.

 

They didn't manage it.

 

As I said, incompetents.

[Heartbeat]

By all accounts it looks like Hearts identified their man early on if you go by the talk 107 report stating McGhee was in Lithuania in January so obviously MM didnt kick it into touch there and then. The Phil O`donnel situation and the sensitivity surrounding this must have played a part. I think that in January if Hearts had proposed the move then with the money on offer and the P`OD thing had not occured he would be with us but the passage of time and well now in Europe and waiting til the season had finished played a part. I think that MM deciding to have a change of heart as he was about to board the plane cannot be vlads fault however if I was being over critical I think vlad should have sought permission and got off his ar$@ to come and see MM maybe that would have looked better. I still think there is more to it. MM has no long emotional ties with well and the fact he was gonna get four time his salary despite his contract at well being now increased tells me a story. I dont think he will be at well too long and think there may be something in the smeltic stories but worries me that if Boyle knew this did he persuade MM to stay on the back of this and by his actions it looks like he would prefer him going anywhere than Hearts. By the way is this the Boyle that is now a pillar of good ethics that effectively wound Motherwell up a few years ago and sacked everybody and refused to honour contracts and had to be taken to court. They cannot survive on about 4000 every week so if the money gets tight again will he be happy to honour MM new improved deal

[The People's Chimp]

By all accounts it looks like Hearts identified their man early on if you go by the talk 107 report stating McGhee was in Lithuania in January so obviously MM didnt kick it into touch there and then. The Phil O`donnel situation and the sensitivity surrounding this must have played a part. I think that in January if Hearts had proposed the move then with the money on offer and the P`OD thing had not occured he would be with us but the passage of time and well now in Europe and waiting til the season had finished played a part. I think that MM deciding to have a change of heart as he was about to board the plane cannot be vlads fault however if I was being over critical I think vlad should have sought permission and got off his ar$@ to come and see MM maybe that would have looked better. I still think there is more to it. MM has no long emotional ties with well and the fact he was gonna get four time his salary despite his contract at well being now increased tells me a story. I dont think he will be at well too long and think there may be something in the smeltic stories but worries me that if Boyle knew this did he persuade MM to stay on the back of this and by his actions it looks like he would prefer him going anywhere than Hearts. By the way is this the Boyle that is now a pillar of good ethics that effectively wound Motherwell up a few years ago and sacked everybody and refused to honour contracts and had to be taken to court. They cannot survive on about 4000 every week so if the money gets tight again will he be happy to honour MM new improved deal

 

Some interesting points. Certainly don't have any time for boyle, who is an eejit. But at the end of the day, we're the ones who still haven't sorted anyone after 6 months.

[Nelly Terraces]

Would love to've seen this as a task on The Apprentice.

 

Big Al: "You've got 6 months to go out and get me one member of staff, yep, that's right, SIX whole months"

 

...6 months later, in the boardroom...

 

Big Al: "WHAT DO YOU MEAN YOU DIDN'T GET ANYONE!?! THIS IS A BLOODY SHAMBLES - YOU'RE ALL FIRED!!!"

[Cut The Crap]

Ethics, schmethics. These sorts of deals should be discussed, agreed, wrapped up, and watertight before the media get even the merest sniff that something is going on.

 

The bottom line is that we spent six months carefully placing all our eggs in a single basket, and then proceeded to drop the basket. The kindest word I could find to describe it all is "careless." There are plenty of others that are less charitable.

[Craigieboy]

We asked.

 

He considered & decided no.

 

All over in 72 hours.

 

End of story.

 

.

[Guest JamboRobbo]

We asked.

 

He considered & decided no.

 

All over in 72 hours.

 

End of story.

 

.

 

If this was the fourth of January rather than 28th of May, I'd agree with you.

[Craigieboy]

I do wonder if the apparant press leak was also driven by a desire to improve ST sales?

 

Not so much the approach, but the speculation it was a 'done deal' etc. I think some people may have got a little bit ahead of themeselves.

 

Realistically, as I have said before, how many ST's did they shift in that time period?

 

.

[John Findlay]

Let me get this straight. It is only a fiasco because McGee said no instead of yes.

 

So everything leading upto his no or yes was not a fiasco?

 

It wasnt a fiasco. Mark McGee for reasons we will not know about until he spills his version in his autobiography changed his mind and said no.

 

As I said if he had said yes no-one would be calling all the events leading upto his saying a yes a fiasco.

 

McGee is now history with Hearts. We all move on.

 

 

 

 

John

[Pants Shaton]

I don't think it was that important to have a manager in place in January as our season was over by then (No Europe - No Relegation).

 

However it seems we have waited until the end of May for a guy who then pulled the rug from under us. A competent administration would have plan B, C and D in reserve and be pulling out all the stops to secure a manager before the season ticket deadline expires.

 

As things stand there are going to be 3 spare STs in section C.

[K1874M]

They had 6 months in which to get 1 employee.

 

They didn't manage it.

 

As I said, incompetents.

 

You missed a bit.... 5.85 months later, go public AND miss out on him.

 

Pathetic.

 

People will say MM shat on us but surely the working recruitment party spent time getting to know the beast before finalising business with it.

[Nelly Terraces]

Ethics, schmethics. These sorts of deals should be discussed, agreed, wrapped up, and watertight before the media get even the merest sniff that something is going on.

 

The bottom line is that we spent six months carefully placing all our eggs in a single basket, and then proceeded to drop the basket. The kindest word I could find to describe it all is "careless." There are plenty of others that are less charitable.

 

SPOT ON #1.

 

You missed a bit.... 5.85 months later, go public AND miss out on him.

 

Pathetic.

 

People will say MM shat on us but surely the working recruitment party spent time getting to know the beast before finalising business with it.

SPOT ON #2.

 

If something like this had happened anywhere else I've ever worked, i.e. a 6month long project going tits up due to competitors pulling rug from under it due to a 1 hour phonecall, heads would've rolled, without question. And quite rightly so.

[Dazo]

Ethics, schmethics. These sorts of deals should be discussed, agreed, wrapped up, and watertight before the media get even the merest sniff that something is going on.

 

The bottom line is that we spent six months carefully placing all our eggs in a single basket, and then proceeded to drop the basket. The kindest word I could find to describe it all is "careless." There are plenty of others that are less charitable.

 

 

That's a good post mate and IMO sum it perfectly in a couple of paragraphs.

[K1874M]

SPOT ON #1.

 

 

SPOT ON #2.

 

If something like this had happened anywhere else I've ever worked, i.e. a 6month long project going tits up due to competitors pulling rug from under it due to a 1 hour phonecall, heads would've rolled, without question. And quite rightly so.

 

Yup..... their would have been another few needs for recruitment.

 

I wonder if hearts ever asked...

 

"And what if lady man ups your wages?"

[Graham Thomson]

No

[TheBigO]

Why is everything a fiasco and a disaster?

 

We wanted McGhee;

we asked McGhee;

he said 'aye' after discussing initial terms;

we got official permission to fly him oot for a full interview and signy up type meeting;

Mcghee decided at airport that he wants to see it oot at 'well cos they're in Europe and it's been a right old emotional time recently.

 

He was initially lured by bigger money and bigger club and decided 11th hour that he should stay at Motherwell and fair feckin play to him. If our manager (ahem) turned down a big job after we had a great season in which our captain passed away, we'd love him for it.

 

And VR done the right thing going for him. It took 6 months cos we couldny get him earlier, that's that.

[magicTs]

A complete fiasco in finalising, securing and sealing the deal for our NUMBER 1 target.

 

Naive and complacent at best, incompetent, arrogant and inept more accurately.

 

The fact they never had at least one of the regime puppets escorting him on his 8 day Lithuanian adventure (God I bet that was a real bonus) was complete folly and lost us his signature.

[SlyNB]

How can it be anything other than a fiasco?

 

McGhee chooses Motherwell over us.

 

We wasted six months waiting on this chump, only for him to shaft us at the last minute.

 

We could have got in another manager 6 months and maybe salvaged something from this season.

 

Due to us believing we had McGhee in the bag, there's no plan B, so now we're in a worse position than Jan 1st.

 

Aye, everythings mint right enough. Total shambles.

[SlyNB]

A complete fiasco in finalising, securing and sealing the deal for our NUMBER 1 target.

 

Naive and complacent at best, incompetent, arrogant and inept more accurately.

 

The fact they never had at least one of the regime puppets escorting him on his 8 day Lithuanian adventure (God I bet that was a real bonus) was complete folly and lost us his signature.

 

Exactly, the words p!ss up and brewery spring to mind.

[TheBigO]

Prove there's nae plan B....

[Drew Busby !]

It may not have started out down the fiasco route but it finished up as one.

 

• VR not coming here to close the deal right at the end
  
• MM summoned for an 8 day interview
  
• MM deciding at the very last minute that it was a non-starter
  
• Hearts being knocked back by MM in favour of Murderwell
  

 

If someone gets knocked back at the alter, that to me is a freaking fiasco !

[No Nonsense]

Not a fiasco in my opinion. Hearts have been plagued by fiasco after fiasco in the last few years but this isn't one of them. I think it may look like one due to "boy who cried wolf" fable i.e. Vlad has caused so many fiascos so this must be one. What I think happened is taht we bided our time to approach McGhee because he wanted to be fair to Motherwell and wait till the end of the season. When we finally did approach, he said No. Simple. Plenty of potential managers turn down job offers after an approach. Look at England- they get down to their 4th choice just about every time there is a vacancy. Lets bide our time and see what hearts come up with....

[Guest Freewheelin' Jambo]

Fiasco is for me too harsh a word because it all turned on one phone call so something tells me if a man is sitting in an airport awaiting to board a plane to basically finalise a deal and one phone call changes everything it means McGhee has had doubts all along and the phonecall has chrystallised the situation for him and whatever was said has finally helped him make up his mind. Human and understandable.

 

I think McGhee was probably the wrong target in the first place because of his history. But I would have taken him.

 

Vlad and CO must just dust themselves off and find someone else quick. I cannot believe a professional like Ogilvie will not have a contingency in place. If not, THAT would be criminal.

 

I pray its Levein, would love JJ.

 

Just get the right guy.

[Nelly Terraces]

Not a fiasco in my opinion. Hearts have been plagued by fiasco after fiasco in the last few years but this isn't one of them. I think it may look like one due to "boy who cried wolf" fable i.e. Vlad has caused so many fiascos so this must be one. What I think happened is taht we bided our time to approach McGhee because he wanted to be fair to Motherwell and wait till the end of the season. When we finally did approach, he said No. Simple. Plenty of potential managers turn down job offers after an approach. Look at England- they get down to their 4th choice just about every time there is a vacancy. Lets bide our time and see what hearts come up with....

 

Yes, let's wait another 6 months for the answer to be absolutely nobody.

 

Completely out their depth this mob. Turning bumbling ineptitude into an artform at any given opportunity.

[SlyNB]

fiasco:

noun [C] plural fiascos or ESP. US fiascoes

something planned that goes wrong and is a complete failure, usually in an embarrassing way

 

Under the defination laid out by the Cambridge dictionary, then this certainly classifies as a fiasco.

[Erik]

Its a fiasco of proportions big enough that only HMFC could even attempt to achieve.

[djf]

Not to sure what Hearts could have done differently.

 

McGhee was the A target. Due to circumstances Hearts could not approach him until close season. Hearts made efforts at that stage to negotiate his arrival. McGhee turned us down before any official discussions took place.

 

It will be a fiasco if we don't have a workable plan B and plan C.

[Rudi Skacel]

Why are people saying 6 months? Its not even 5 months.

 

I think it was a farce. Why go public? Now whoever we go for next will know they were 2nd choice (or more pending on further developments). Id rather Hearts refused to comment untill such time neccessary.

[djf]

Why are people saying 6 months? Its not even 5 months.

 

I think it was a farce. Why go public? Now whoever we go for next will know they were 2nd choice (or more pending on further developments). Id rather Hearts refused to comment untill such time neccessary.

 

The only official statement Hearts released was a note they weren't interviewing McGhee for the position.

[Rudi Skacel]

The only official statement Hearts released was a note they weren't interviewing McGhee for the position.

 

Sorry did I imagine the official statement saying they had approached Motherwell?