Who would you rather lost the league?

[rudi must stay]

Rangers. I think it would make the cup final more interesting, there'd be a lot of nervous supporters inside Hampden and that can't be bad for QoS

[Makween]

That comment shows how unrepresentative of Hearts fans YOU are.

 

I don't think that it does.

[Therapist]

This thread is symbolic of how unrepresentative Kickback truly is.

 

Correct. Fortunately, I think most non-Hearts fans on this forum will know the poll result is statistically insignificant and simply wrong.

 

Walk into Robbo's - a truly representative Hearts pub - and ask the question and an overwhelming majority of the clientele would wish ra sellik to lose out on the SPL. The same would be true of Dickens, Diggers, Westfield, BMC Club, Tynie Arms and Stratties etc albeit with a marginally smaller majority.

[magicTs]

Correct. Fortunately, I think most non-Hearts fans on this forum will know the poll result is statistically insignificant and simply wrong.

 

Walk into Robbo's - a truly representative Hearts pub - and ask the question and an overwhelming majority of the clientele would wish ra sellik to lose out on the SPL. The same would be true of Dickens, Diggers, Westfield, BMC Club, Tynie Arms and Stratties etc albeit with a marginally smaller majority.

 

[Craig R]

So a few select local pubs are more representative of the entire Hearts support than an online forum that has 11,000 members?

[Therapist]

So a few select local pubs are more representative of the entire Hearts support than an online forum that has 11,000 members?

 

Precisely.

[Makween]

So a few select local pubs are more representative of the entire Hearts support than an online forum that has 11,000 members?

 

Yes, I'd say so.

 

Talking to people in real life, for me, is a far better indication of their character than this forum is. A lot of people like to come on here and give it the big one about hating Rangers loads more than Celtic to show everyone how "right on" they are.

 

I also think that, by walking into pubs on a matchday, you're more likely to be talking to the fans who go to the games on a regular basis and are the lifeblood of the club. Not, of course, that their views are necessarily more important, but they do give a better impression of what the views at an actual game are likely to be like.

 

How many of Kickback's 11,000 members post on / view the board enough to be statistically relevant?

[I.J]

Why are a few folk getting upset about this?

 

The question is not: "Who do you want to win the league", it's "who do you want to lose the league".

 

By choosing Rangers to lose, simply because it'd be ****ing funny does not automatically make you a shamrock waving leprechaun.

 

If the positions were reversed, I'm sure the poll answers would be too.

 

Settle down chaps.

[Drew Busby !]

Correct. Fortunately, I think most non-Hearts fans on this forum will know the poll result is statistically insignificant and simply wrong.

 

Walk into Robbo's - a truly representative Hearts pub - and ask the question and an overwhelming majority of the clientele would wish ra sellik to lose out on the SPL. The same would be true of Dickens, Diggers, Westfield, BMC Club, Tynie Arms and Stratties etc albeit with a marginally smaller majority.

 

Robbo's and other pubs may or may not be representative of all Hearts pubs. Thats a statistical question in itself to do with pubs as the sampling unit. But you certainly cannot extrapolate any findings from fans in Hearts pubs (as the sample population) to the Hearts fanbase as a whole (the target population). Such an approach breaches the principles of random sampling and introduces systematic bias, ergo any findings would be invalid.

[davieholt]

Rangers.

 

Celtic must win the league for Strachan to stay so McGhee comes to Tynie.

 

Just logic Therapist. Nothing to do with leanings towards Celtic. If it wasn't for the McGhee factor (and the Rangers fan's triumph in Manchester !) I wouldn't give a toss which of these bawbags lose it.

[Therapist]

you certainly cannot extrapolate any findings from fans in Hearts pubs (as the sample population) to the Hearts fanbase as a whole (the target population).

 

I can, and I have.

[Makween]

Why are a few folk getting upset about this?

 

The question is not: "Who do you want to win the league", it's "who do you want to lose the league".

 

By choosing Rangers to lose, simply because it'd be ****ing funny does not automatically make you a shamrock waving leprechaun.

 

If the positions were reversed, I'm sure the poll answers would be too.

 

Settle down chaps.

 

I'm not that bothered, I just said that it showed that Kickback was unrepresentative and people started getting all worked up about it.

 

Robbo's and other pubs may or may not be representative of all Hearts pubs. Thats a statistical question in itself to do with pubs as the sampling unit. But you certainly cannot extrapolate any findings from fans in Hearts pubs (as the sample population) to the Hearts fanbase as a whole (the target population). Such an approach breaches the principles of random sampling and introduces systematic bias, ergo any findings would be invalid.

 

...just like Hearts forums, really.

[magicTs]

I think they are a little gutted that Rangers are losing the poll. Diddums, can your friends at Robbo's not use the net ?!

[Makween]

I think they are a little gutted that Rangers are losing the poll. Diddums, can your friends at Robbo's not use the net ?!

 

Actually, Rangers are winning the poll. I'm certainly not gutted about it, can't speak for anyone else.

[Therapist]

I think they are a little gutted that Rangers are losing the poll.

 

:dribble:

 

I have much bigger fish to fry than worry about a poll on KB, never mind one that's totally unrepresentative. I'm off to Moscow tomorrow to witness Chelsea FC winning the UEFA Champions League.

 

Blue is the colour.......

[Drew Busby !]

I'm not that bothered, I just said that it showed that Kickback was unrepresentative and people started getting all worked up about it.

 

 

 

...just like Hearts forums, really.

 

That is perfectly correct.

 

So it seems we agree. Neither Robbos (as a sample population) nor JKB (as a sample population) can be said to be representative of the Hearts fanbase as a whole.

 

Unless anyone has any plans to survey the entire Hearts fanbase and determine its chracteristics, then any "samples" taken from Robbo's or JKB cannot be considered as representative of the Hearts fanbase target population.

 

Roobos is representative of Robbos.

JKB is representative of JKB.

 

Thats all that can be said.

[magicTs]

:dribble:

 

I have much bigger fish to fry than worry about a poll on KB, never mind one that's totally unrepresentative. I'm off to Moscow tomorrow to witness Chelsea FC winning the UEFA Champions League.

 

Blue is the colour.......

 

Don't get in any dodgy taxi's

[chester copperpot]

Don't get in any dodgy taxi's

 

 

 

No please do!.

[Morgan]

If you'd asked me this question just a few short weeks ago I'd have said Celtic without even thinking about it.

 

That's because I'm a bigotted, Union Jack waving, bowler hat wearing proddie .

 

But, in view of Manchester and the arrogant "bears" I work with, I'd love Rangers to lose the league in the most heartbreaking fashion available to them.

[Toggie88]

Yes, I'd say so.

 

Talking to people in real life, for me, is a far better indication of their character than this forum is. A lot of people like to come on here and give it the big one about hating Rangers loads more than Celtic to show everyone how "right on" they are.

 

I also think that, by walking into pubs on a matchday, you're more likely to be talking to the fans who go to the games on a regular basis and are the lifeblood of the club. Not, of course, that their views are necessarily more important, but they do give a better impression of what the views at an actual game are likely to be like.

 

How many of Kickback's 11,000 members post on / view the board enough to be statistically relevant?

 

Surely a private poll where votes remain secret is more representative than a pub on match day which will (most likely) be belting out Rangers minded songs* - where the majority may feel intimidated by other supporters.

 

It's got nothing to do with getting a "better indication of their character". If someone said "I want a pint of Tennents" and after you met them and after speaking to them, would you think "I bet they would really want a pint of heavy".

 

*Talking about Robbo's

---

The clutching of straws and the inability to see logic by the most fundemental Rangers minded supporters on here is laughable. Now, whenever they associate themselves with any side of an argument, be it political, football or otherwise, it seriously damanges that sides argument.

 

A bit like that South Park episode with the KKK.

[colinmaroon]

As it's safe to say, most of us would rather neither of the Old Firm win the title...however it's going to happen, as always.

 

It's not about wanting Celtic to win the title for me, I want Rangers to lose it.

 

So my vote says I'd prefer to see Rangers lose the league.

 

Over to you guys.

 

 

 

Perfectly captured the essence of the argument!

 

 

Likewise, I have no desire for Celtic to win, but for the many reasosn documented recently, I have a desire for Rangers to lose!!!

 

 

 

..........................

[Victor Meldrew]

I voted Rangers.

 

As 1985-86 was my first season supporting the JTs I have always hated Celtic and been unable to wish them well in anything.

 

I despise both sets of Old Firm fans.

 

But recently, for some reason, Rangers have begun to annoy me more than any other team. They have whinged about the SPL not moving their fixtures when, quite frankly, whenever the Huns ask, the SPL lubes up and bends over for a rogering. They get all the breaks from the referees (and still whine about unfairness). Their fans behave with supreme arrogance and the scenes in Manchester were dreadful.

 

Whilst the Celtic fans hae their Pro-IRA element (which I detest) you only have to see the comparison between the way the Mayor of Barcelona reacted to the two sets of fans to see which of the Ugly Sisters embarrasses Scotland abroad.

 

There are the following additional points:

 

1. A league win would see Celtic keeping Strachan, who the fans hate for not being 'Celtic Minded'.

 

2. Strachan will have achieved something their Beloved Martin O'Neill never did - 3 consecutive titles

 

3. Rangers could be left with only 1 Diddy Cup win in 3 seasons - worse than us in terms of trophies!!

 

4. Andy Webster will be sick as a parrot

[Victor Meldrew]

:dribble:

 

I have much bigger fish to fry than worry about a poll on KB, never mind one that's totally unrepresentative. I'm off to Moscow tomorrow to witness Chelsea FC winning the UEFA Champions League.

 

Blue is the colour.......

 

Playing Footy Manager are we?

 

Man Utd will win the real game (and before you start, I'm not a Man U fan).

[Victor Meldrew]

1986 = Celtic getting my vote

 

I dont give a real toss for either of them but as I said above 1986 still sticks in my throat as does the semi when they snatched it from us plus numerous personal bad experiences at Sellick Park. I wont in 100 years celebrate Rangers winning it but I'd smile at the thought of Sellick now thinking ts theirs only to see it being snatched from them.

 

Personally I'd like it to go to goal difference with say, Rangers narrowing that difference to 3 on Monday then snatching it by a late goal on Thursday

 

I can sympathise with that view Tom, but I stopped feeling as bad about it when they had 'helicopter Sunday' losing 2 late goals and the league title with it.

[Mysterion]

i hate both... but the arrogance of the rangers fans and down right cheek of the club (eg. making out Lyon had their game postponed in order to have their fixtures changed) makes me quite happy to see rangers lose

 

that and as i have been saying to my brother in law (he's a blue nose)... you can be in 4 competitions but it's 4 times the pain when you lose.

 

lets hope that come the end of the (working) week they've only won 1 cup and are in only one competition.

[Guest Dipped Flake]

I think it's hilarious watching the right-wing brigade attempt to justify why every thread that has a majority of posters arguing aginst their point of view is 'unrepresentative of the majority of real Hearts supportes'. As has been said time and time again, the majority of Hearts fans want nothing to do with any bias to do with religion/sectarianism. Face facts, you are a dying breed that is totally out of touch with modern-day thinking. Lots of our fans may hate celtic but it has nothing to do with being anti-catholic. Just as lots of our fans hate rangers without being a member of the ira.

p.s. any chance of a certain members ticket to Russia being one-way only:)

p.p.s I wish people would stop quoting his links so I have to read his views.

[Spikey]

Celtic.

 

If you all had to work with the bitter, twisted, persecuted, 'world owes us a living' tims that i do then i'm pretty sure your answer would be the same as mine.

 

Still hate Rangers though, albeit a little less.

[Therapist]

Playing Footy Manager are we?

 

I can feel your jealousy Vic.

[bil]

Walk into Robbo's - a truly representative Hearts pub

 

Nice wind-up there.

[Jam Tarts 1874]

Normally I'd say I just don't care, however the behaviour of Rangers fans on Wednesday edges me towards wanting Rangers to lose out.

 

Wouldn't it be funny if Rangers went into the game with QoS with only the diddy cup in their cabinet - squeeky bumtime for the knuckledraggers!

[Hilary Briss]

I dont like either but I detest Celtic far more. I would have guessed the majority of Hearts fans would dislike Celtic more because of football reasons and particularly 1986. Thats were my hatred for them started, after the worst day in any Hearts fan's life we had to endure every bridge or train station on way home from Dundee draped with celtic flags & tricolours with trampy ****bags giving it the big one. I was only 16 and it always stuck with me and I have detested the cretins ever since.

 

PS...I aint a mini hun, honest

[redm]

Correct. Fortunately, I think most non-Hearts fans on this forum will know the poll result is statistically insignificant and simply wrong.

 

Walk into Robbo's - a truly representative Hearts pub - and ask the question and an overwhelming majority of the clientele would wish ra sellik to lose out on the SPL. The same would be true of Dickens, Diggers, Westfield, BMC Club, Tynie Arms and Stratties etc albeit with a marginally smaller majority.

 

 

Your concept of what constitutes a representative cross-section of the support speaks volumes. You're only about a decade behind the times....

[Makween]

Surely a private poll where votes remain secret is more representative than a pub on match day which will (most likely) be belting out Rangers minded songs* - where the majority may feel intimidated by other supporters.

 

It's got nothing to do with getting a "better indication of their character". If someone said "I want a pint of Tennents" and after you met them and after speaking to them, would you think "I bet they would really want a pint of heavy".

 

*Talking about Robbo's

---

The clutching of straws and the inability to see logic by the most fundemental Rangers minded supporters on here is laughable. Now, whenever they associate themselves with any side of an argument, be it political, football or otherwise, it seriously damanges that sides argument.

 

A bit like that South Park episode with the KKK.

 

That's not particularly nice. You're certainly no longer on the Christmas card list.

 

I'm confused by this "Rangers minded" stuff. What are you getting at? It's quite sad that, in a club with a relatively small support, so many are keen to make that support smaller by pretending that a large section of the support actually prefer another team.

 

Quite a lot of the rest of your post doesn't actually make any sense. I'd say that a pub on matchdays is a pretty good indication of the support who go to games on a regular basis. I also think that a lot of people on here have a "persona" that they like to play up to. I also think that it's strange when a Hearts fan who I know personally, and who hasn't been to a fraction as many games as me in recent seasons (in fact, hasn't been regularly since '05/06), tries to call me "Rangers minded".

[Victor Meldrew]

I can feel your jealousy Vic.

 

I certainly envy you being there - should be a cracking game. But as I say, I think Man U will win it.

 

Have a great time.

[Toggie88]

That's not particularly nice. You're certainly no longer on the Christmas card list.

 

I'm confused by this "Rangers minded" stuff. What are you getting at? It's quite sad that, in a club with a relatively small support, so many are keen to make that support smaller by pretending that a large section of the support actually prefer another team.

 

Quite a lot of the rest of your post doesn't actually make any sense. I'd say that a pub on matchdays is a pretty good indication of the support who go to games on a regular basis. I also think that a lot of people on here have a "persona" that they like to play up to. I also think that it's strange when a Hearts fan who I know personally, and who hasn't been to a fraction as many games as me in recent seasons (in fact, hasn't been regularly since '05/06), tries to call me "Rangers minded".

 

Where once did I call you Rangers minded?

 

Those who got to pubs after and before games are hardly a fair representative of those who go to games. It's more representative of those who also like to get bevvied. I assume you are based your interaction with other fans in pubs, solely on interactions with those in Robbo's. I do not think this is fairly representative giving the songs that are normally heard from that certain pub on matchdays. Take a stroll up the road to Diggers or the Cale Sample Rooms and you would maybe get a better picture. I remember when we first went up there and met other JKBers, we did get chucked out but if you asked any of them who they would prefer to win the league, I bet it would have been pretty split - or the resounding majority would have said "I don't give a ****".

 

 

I also had a season ticket up until last season (2006/07) - I've been to about 10 home games this season. The reason I never got a season ticket this season was i)I have other commitments on Saturday's ii) Couldn't afford it at the time iii)Atmospheres **** iv)It's not enjoyable.

[eddie fenwick]

tic to lose the league in dundee on goal differance on the last day,hmmmmmm thats a hard one

[Therapist]

I remember when we first went up there and met other JKBers, we did get chucked out

 

:eek: :eek:

 

Does Alex know you're a hoolie Togster?

[Makween]

Where once did I call you Rangers minded?

 

Oops, I'm sorry, you just hinted at it.

 

Those who got to pubs after and before games are hardly a fair representative of those who go to games. It's more representative of those who also like to get bevvied. I assume you are based your interaction with other fans in pubs, solely on interactions with those in Robbo's. I do not think this is fairly representative giving the songs that are normally heard from that certain pub on matchdays. Take a stroll up the road to Diggers or the Cale Sample Rooms and you would maybe get a better picture. I remember when we first went up there and met other JKBers, we did get chucked out but if you asked any of them who they would prefer to win the league, I bet it would have been pretty split - or the resounding majority would have said "I don't give a ****".

 

...and those who post on internet messageboards are hardly a fair reprenstation of those who go to games. In fact, they're a shocking one. It's more representative of people who use their computer on a regular basis. Whether or not they go to games is more or less irrelevant.

 

As for the rest of your post, it's all conjecture. I speak to Hearts fans before, after and during games in many settings other than Robbo's. I don't even necessarily always go to Robbo's.

 

Anyway, why should the Diggers or the Caley sample rooms be seen as more representative than Robbo's?

 

I also had a season ticket up until last season (2006/07) - I've been to about 10 home games this season. The reason I never got a season ticket this season was i)I have other commitments on Saturday's ii) Couldn't afford it at the time iii)Atmospheres **** iv)It's not enjoyable.

 

Which makes it a bit strange that you're accusing others of being "Rangers minded".

[Therapist]

I certainly envy you being there - should be a cracking game. But as I say, I think Man U will win it.

 

Have a great time.

 

Cheers.

 

I'm a bit worried that Terry will insist on playing even if he's not 100% fit. We also need to make sure Essien plays in midfield, rather than starting him at full back then pushing him forward if things don't go our way.

[Toggie88]

Oops, I'm sorry, you just hinted at it.

 

The second bit was aimed at you, hence the three "---".

 

...and those who post on internet messageboards are hardly a fair reprenstation of those who go to games. In fact, they're a shocking one. It's more representative of people who use their computer on a regular basis. Whether or not they go to games is more or less irrelevant.

 

As for the rest of your post, it's all conjecture. I speak to Hearts fans before, after and during games in many settings other than Robbo's. I don't even necessarily always go to Robbo's.

Anyway, why should the Diggers or the Caley sample rooms be seen as more representative than Robbo's?

 

 

Robbo's, rightly or wrongly, has gained a reputation. It's seen, rightly or wrongly, as a haunt for casuals/thugs/hooligans/bigots etc.

I don't mind Robbo's, it can create an amazing atmosphere on big games. I know a fair amount of fans though, that wouldn't go anywhere near the place.

 

Which makes it a bit strange that you're accusing others of being "Rangers minded".

I don't think so - I can't make every home game due to other commitments, I go when I can.

[Kinkster]

Oops, I'm sorry, you just hinted at it.

 

 

 

...and those who post on internet messageboards are hardly a fair reprenstation of those who go to games. In fact, they're a shocking one. It's more representative of people who use their computer on a regular basis. Whether or not they go to games is more or less irrelevant.

 

As for the rest of your post, it's all conjecture. I speak to Hearts fans before, after and during games in many settings other than Robbo's. I don't even necessarily always go to Robbo's.

 

Anyway, why should the Diggers or the Caley sample rooms be seen as more representative than Robbo's?

 

 

 

Which makes it a bit strange that you're accusing others of being "Rangers minded".

 

Im impressed you know the difference between second and third person (honest). But please stop the " Im a bigger fan than you" chat. If your conjecture is correct, then the voice of the people is to be found in boozers before/after a game, interesting hypothesis.

[Makween]

Robbo's, rightly or wrongly, has gained a reputation. It's seen, rightly or wrongly, as a haunt for casuals/thugs/hooligans/bigots etc.

I don't mind Robbo's, it can create an amazing atmosphere on big games. I know a fair amount of fans though, that wouldn't go anywhere near the place.

 

You used to be different back in the old days

 

Im impressed you know the difference between second and third person (honest). But please stop the " Im a bigger fan than you" chat. If your conjecture is correct, then the voice of the people is to be found in boozers before/after a game, interesting hypothesis.

 

I'm going to use lots of long words just to prove how clever I am.

 

Antidisestablishmentarianism!

[Andrew Gilbert Wauchope]

I have no time for either of them and I really don't care which one wins the league. So I haven't voted.

 

As in so many things, Shakespeare had the words we're looking for.

 

Romeo:

Hold, Tybalt! Good Mercutio!

 

Mercutio:

I am hurt. A plague a' both your houses!

 

Mercutio was clearly not an Ugly Sister fan.

[Kinkster]

You used to be different back in the old days

 

 

 

I'm going to use lots of long words just to prove how clever I am.

 

Antidisestablishmentarianism!

 

And I thought Robbos was firmly a disestablishment shop. Just shows you.

[Therapist]

I don't think so - I can't make every home game due to other commitments, I go when I can.

 

I guess being a political activist and freedom fighter doesn't leave you with much spare time.

[Toggie88]

I guess being a political activist and freedom fighter doesn't leave you with much spare time.

 

That, and masterbat.....yeah...politics.

[Toggie88]

You used to be different back in the old days

 

 

So were you

 

 

 

 

Should we put on some nostalgic music now?

[Rods]

I put Celtic to lose the league

 

This is because I am a bigot, only messing lol.

 

I put this because, Celtic have won the last 2.

 

If it was the other way round, I would have put Rangers

[JimmyMince]

A week ago, I'd have said Celtic, but the idea of Rangers fans celebrating the league after that shenanigans in Manchester? Naw. They're a disgrace and we're all tarred with their tarry brush.

[Paisley Jambo]

No contest, Celtic.