ST Renewals (merged threads)

[Cliffundo]

This isn't really relevant - the question is are some our young players good enough to become first team players for us? The answer is yes and it's the best thing for a club like Hearts to do - this was true in the eighties & nineties and remains true now.

 

We have better players than our opponents with certain young individuals likewise they have others who are better than ours - however very few at Rangers or Celtic will even get the chance to break through.

 

To be fair...if some of the youngsters were not better than what is playing in the 1st team now I would be gob smacked. This is a shocking team of players who have no fight or heart. I could put several players from Gretna and St mirren who finished below us in front of some of our 1st team so having a couple of youngsters breaking through is no suprise.

 

I think the academy has gone downhill.

[Charlie-Brown]

So what happened to Vlad talking about a ?10million player budget, challenging the OF, spending ?10 million on the right player and Rodney saying we shouldn't worry about the debt. What happened to winning the League in 3 years? Being regulars in the Champions League? When did the policy change from challenging to going with Youth as I can'tremember the Russian Trotters coming out with this?

 

NMH - I have asked you this before on two occasions but twice you have avoided the issue. Any answers?

 

In the 2 years for which accounts have been published whilst Romanov has been at Hearts the player budget was ?10.2M & ?12.5M so I don't so how you get there hasn't / wasn't a ?10M budget - however club income didn't rise above ?10.5M so the club was making horrific losses & debt rises but regardless if you look at Romanov's comments from several interviews in summer 2006 prior to the champions league games you will see he talked about progressing youth and this has happened since with Berra, Driver, Jonsson all becoming regulars and others more recently getting some game time as well.

[robbogoal]

I'm not sure tbh.

 

My thinking is: Why should I give a ****** when the players dont?

 

've seen worse Hearts teams with less ability, but supported them because they cared and tried for the club. This lot dont give a s**t.

 

HHHmmmm, what to do?

 

I've taken my son this season and he's been heartbroken most of the time, but he still loves going, until he gets there...

[shaun.lawson]

Who are the players that you speak of?

 

One shining light over the last 12 months is the emergence of Driver, Jonnson, Glen and McGowan - albiet he was only on the pitch for 20 mins I saw enought to tell me he will be quality.

 

Off the top of my head, Gordon, Kirk, Severin and Neilson, plus Sloan and Janczyk to a much lesser extent. Not Simmons, Goldie or O'Neil though, much as many of us thought they were the real deal.

 

My point is that a core from those youth sides made the step up to the SPL, and became first team regulars. Your examples are good too: I just have this depressing sense, though, that our youth system is nowhere near what it once was, and is contributing to the sense of disenfranchisement and loss of identity in the club that so many fans feel.

 

We went through a phase encompassing the emergence of Ritchie, Johnston, Locke and Naysmith; then onto Gordon, Severin and Kirk; and then a number of players who've attracted much scorn on these boards since, but who did a job for us as part of a considerably overachieving team under Levein. I genuinely used to believe that Hearts had comfortably the best youth system in Scotland; sadly, I don't get that feeling at all now.

 

Oh, one last thing. Are we still making use of developing young players signed from smaller Scottish clubs, as we did with, say, Webster, or even someone like Gary Wales?

[Charlie-Brown]

Ridgers, Husband & Templeton were all signed from Ross County, Cowdenbeath & Stenhousemuir in the last 18 months.

[bighusref]

Ridgers, Husband & Templeton were all signed from Ross County, Cowdenbeath & Stenhousemuir in the last 18 months.

 

And have contributed how much to the first team?

[Spikey]

And have contributed how much to the first team?

 

Precisely.

 

They're not being 'made use of'.

[bighusref]

Precisely.

 

They're not being 'made use of'.

 

Time will tell springhead.

 

We need to see the benefits of our youth team and very soon. Shoots of promise have appeared in Glen and McGowan and Rapnik appears on the fringes, we need to take this onto next season now, involve these players.

 

This will be made easier by getting rid of cowardly Frail.

[innerjambo]

I think that under 19 table is a true reflection unfortunately. They are not great, the coaching is not great either. What has really happened, is that the fans have been sold the idea that we have a great youth policy. If you regard the likes of Elliot, Mole, Wallace and Johnson as great, then fine. They have won nothing in reality, and at best they are average players, with the exception of Elliot, who is 2nd division at best. Time will tell, but for the fans who think we have a great academy, I think you will be disappointed. Andrew Driver is the only exceptional young talent we have. Watch this space!!

It's time to ditch old man Murray, the man is vastly overated!!

[Guest JamboRobbo]

There is no possible way Frail can be given the gig. I firmly believe that someone will come in who some wil be delighted with, some will be so so with and some will be unsure.

 

Action HAS to happen after this season.

 

Just my opinion like.

 

 

I hope you're right mate. Your feelings are exactly what I was thinking last year.

 

I thought action had to happen. A year later, I'm still waiting.

[PTBCAL]

Off the top of my head, Gordon, Kirk, Severin and Neilson, plus Sloan and Janczyk to a much lesser extent. Not Simmons, Goldie or O'Neil though, much as many of us thought they were the real deal.

 

My point is that a core from those youth sides made the step up to the SPL, and became first team regulars. Your examples are good too: I just have this depressing sense, though, that our youth system is nowhere near what it once was, and is contributing to the sense of disenfranchisement and loss of identity in the club that so many fans feel.

 

We went through a phase encompassing the emergence of Ritchie, Johnston, Locke and Naysmith; then onto Gordon, Severin and Kirk; and then a number of players who've attracted much scorn on these boards since, but who did a job for us as part of a considerably overachieving team under Levein. I genuinely used to believe that Hearts had comfortably the best youth system in Scotland; sadly, I don't get that feeling at all now.

 

Oh, one last thing. Are we still making use of developing young players signed from smaller Scottish clubs, as we did with, say, Webster, or even someone like Gary Wales?

 

Other than Gordon & Severin I think the likes of McGowan, Jonnson and Glen will easily progress their careers further than Kirk, Sloan etc....

[Guest JamboRobbo]

I think that under 19 table is a true reflection unfortunately.

 

The league table never lies.

 

If we had better youths than our competitors, we'd be higher up the youth league tables. We aren't.

[Charlie-Brown]

The league table never lies.

 

If we had better youths than our competitors, we'd be higher up the youth league tables. We aren't.

 

It's more important that our young players are good enough to become good first team players for Hearts than how they compare with other teams at U19 or SPL reserve level - also Bowman, Mackay & Robertson were not as good as McStay, Durrant or McCoist but they were still capable of being really good / great players for Hearts.

[Guest JamboRobbo]

It's more important that our young players are good enough to become good first team players for Hearts than how they compare with other teams at U19 or SPL reserve level - also Bowman, Mackay & Robertson were not as good as McStay, Durrant or McCoist but they were still capable of being really good / great players for Hearts.

 

Thats just not true.

 

If the players coming through the other youths teams are better at winning football matches(as the league tables prove) than our youths, then our SPL rivals will have better youth football players coming through than us.

[Heartbeat]

Back to the issue of ST renewals.

 

I decided donks ago that I would make my own wee protest by putting off til the last minute to renew although I am now decidedly swaying as to do so or not but probably will. Anyway I seemed to get confused over the deadline for renewals and for some reason had 22nd May in my head so dug out the renewal info that I had retained and it states Friday 1st June is final day for renewals so to double check I thought I would call the ticket center and the option tells me the final date is Friday 30th May. So that must be the date. I just thought it pretty bad that they have spent all this money on info and getting it printed but cant even get the date on it correct cos 1st June is a Monday. They were even as specific to tell us it is 5PM but got the date wrong

[magicTs]

NMH, I'm sorry but you are talking utter rot. Our youth players as a whole are held in far higher esteem by you (and a few others) than is in anyway justifiable. I think because everything else you have clinged to over the last 30 months has almost entirely been found to be nonsense this is your latest offering of justification for the way our club is run.

 

A quick look at the results would indicate that we are just run of the mill at all youth levels with a few good prospects but plenty players who are never going to enhance our first team and willl end up playing in lower league football.

 

The famed 'Academy' will certainly never churn out players with the current management and coaches and your assertion that the people working within it at the moment are doing a good job could not be further from the truth in my opinion. We need quality personnel at all levels of the club and certainly far better than Murray and Murray.

[Charlie-Brown]

Well we will see - I have watched a lot of Hearts youth teams through the years - of course more players will fail than succeed however I have seen every Hearts youngster since Bowman & MacKay until the present - the overall standard is higher now than it was in the past and there are individuals now who are capable of becoming seriously good players - I reckon I know decent players when I see them - so let's revisit this in summer 2009 & 2010 & there-after, I am certain the Academy will bear fruit.

[Ray Winstone]

Renew now people while the discounts hot!

 

I wonder how many on here will loose their bottle with the beginning of the season nearing and get one anyway?

[Boris]

The league table never lies.

 

If we had better youths than our competitors, we'd be higher up the youth league tables. We aren't.

 

It's not that we don't have good players. I believe at U-19 level we employ a squad rotation policy that means we very rarely play the same line up two games in a row.

[Guest Freewheelin' Jambo]

Renew now people while the discounts hot!

 

I wonder how many on here will loose their bottle with the beginning of the season nearing and get one anyway?

 

No doubt plenty.

 

Like waiting for a manager/change/Vladtohaveapersonalitytransplant.

 

Time will tell.

[i8hibsh]

New season, new dawn, new fecking manager:rolleyes:

 

New season, same manager, same owners, same half hearted 2nd rate lazy ersed players, same SFA, same Old Firm

 

I have no interest in any of it

[Fenerjambo]

Currently on the biggest cruise ship in the world and just arrived in Lisbon.Went to see a show last night and even the comedian had a go at Hearts!!! What an embarrassment and really made me cringe!

 

I'm usually proud to wear my Hearts Top on my holidays but have left it witht the rest of the dirty washing as I don't even feel like looking at it! Renewing my season ticket?? I wouldn't encourage the pathetic circus that has seriously put our club's future at risk and it's time to let these lunatics know this!! I'm not a good Jambo?? Sorry I'm not a fool!!

[JamboAl]

New season, same manager, same owners, same half hearted 2nd rate lazy ersed players, same SFA, same Old FirmI have no interest in any of it

 

I hope things do change but, if they did not, it would be interesting to see how the "we want a manager" brigade would react if we went on an unbeaten run.

[Guest Freewheelin' Jambo]

I hope things do change but, if they did not, it would be interesting to see how the "we want a manager" brigade would react if we went on an unbeaten run.

 

Jesus Christ.

[magicTs]

- so let's revisit this in summer 2009 & 2010 & there-after, I am certain the Academy will bear fruit.

 

Absolutely priceless. Is this the new time frame ? Fecking wonderful stuff.

[magicTs]

I hope things do change but, if they did not, it would be interesting to see how the "we want a manager" brigade would react if we went on an unbeaten run.

 

FFS.

[Jammy T]

Absolutely priceless. Is this the new time frame ? Fecking wonderful stuff.

 

Oh come on.

 

Its going to be just like Man Utd when Giggs, Scholes and Beckham all came through

[The Mighty Thor]

I hope things do change but, if they did not, it would be interesting to see how the "we want a manager" brigade would react if we went on an unbeaten run.

 

Afternoon Mr Frail. I'd imagine we'd **** our pants just like you would.

[innerjambo]

Well we will see - I have watched a lot of Hearts youth teams through the years - of course more players will fail than succeed however I have seen every Hearts youngster since Bowman & MacKay until the present - the overall standard is higher now than it was in the past and there are individuals now who are capable of becoming seriously good players - I reckon I know decent players when I see them - so let's revisit this in summer 2009 & 2010 & there-after, I am certain the Academy will bear fruit.

 

I hope you are right, but I, like others, am begining to have doubts. Are you trying to tell me that Elliot and Mole are good prospects?

[Charlie-Brown]

Absolutely priceless. Is this the new time frame ? Fecking wonderful stuff.

 

Time frame for what?

 

I simply meant lets look again next year & the year after regards whether we think Hearts are producing good young players or not, we already have some established players we produced & others starting to push through - let's see how this continues.

 

Iam betting that in 2009 & 2010 yourself & others will be talking more positively about Hearts Youth System than you are now.

 

Let's see how these players progress?

 

Bjornsson, Ridgers, J.Brown, McGowan, Rapnik, Balatoni, Deland, Husband, D.Thomson, Woods, McCallion, Glen, Templeton, Visconte, Robinson & Love.

 

Those are who I currently think are our best prospects aged 16-19 but others might emerge - let's see how many can break through - of course not all will but I reckon most stand a good chance - so let's see how they progress in the next 24 months & how many can step up.

[leginten]

I hope things do change but, if they did not, it would be interesting to see how the "we want a manager" brigade would react if we went on an unbeaten run.

 

For the above, just substitute "the Hearts support".

Because it wants a manager, just about in its entirety. There are still a few individuals around who, for whatever reason or inducement, are mocking the idea of having a proper manager, and I realise that you stated recently that the appointment of Frail as permanent manager would be "an enactment of the Jan. 1st statement". But you're a dying breed, thankfully.

[Jammy T]

 

Let's see how these players progress?

 

Bjornsson, Ridgers, J.Brown, McGowan, Rapnik, Balatoni, Deland, Husband, D.Thomson, Woods, McCallion, Glen, Templeton, Visconte, Robinson & Love.

 

.

 

If this is the best group of youth for a couple of decades they should be handled with care

 

It would be a shame if their progress was delayed or their motivation impacted by the lack of a meritocratic team selection process, and average Lithuanian signings being played ahead of them

 

Sounds as if McGowan has already been held back by around a season more than needed....

[Leebo]

Re-newed my season ticket 3 weeks ago, now regreting it.....!! Should have waited! But done it now, and have to get on with it!

[suds66]

I decided to collect my season tickets this morning, I could not believe the length of the queue!..........................................................................

 

Walked straight up to the counter, got served straight away, not another sole near the place, brilliant! What an improvement, nothing worse than standing in these long queue's waiting to be served before the sold up signs come out.

 

It's good to see that HMFC have taken on board the fans views regarding the poor running of ticket sales..................................Treat the supporters like *****e, sign third rate players, no manager, and play a brand of football unlikely to win you the pup league title and hay presto, reduced queue's at the ticket office..................................

[JamboRossi79]

I think that under 19 table is a true reflection unfortunately. They are not great, the coaching is not great either. What has really happened, is that the fans have been sold the idea that we have a great youth policy. If you regard the likes of Elliot, Mole, Wallace and Johnson as great, then fine. They have won nothing in reality, and at best they are average players, with the exception of Elliot, who is 2nd division at best. Time will tell, but for the fans who think we have a great academy, I think you will be disappointed. Andrew Driver is the only exceptional young talent we have. Watch this space!!

It's time to ditch old man Murray, the man is vastly overated!!

 

Apologies if this has been mentioned already but don't we effectively play our U17s in the main for the U19s.

[Guest JamboRobbo]

Jesus Christ.

 

I know mate. It's frightening sometimes.

[Guest JamboRobbo]

I hope things do change but, if they did not, it would be interesting to see how the "we want a manager" brigade would react if we went on an unbeaten run.

 

:rofl: truly unbelievable.

[Guest JamboRobbo]

It's not that we don't have good players. I believe at U-19 level we employ a squad rotation policy that means we very rarely play the same line up two games in a row.

 

If that is true, sounds like they'll be well prepared to continue their under acheivement when they reach the first team then.