Scottish independence and devolution superthread

[AyrJambo]

Just now, Ulysses said:

 

 

The Sun and The Times, at the moment.

The National as well

[Ulysses]

Humza Yousaf 'set to quit' as SNP hope fades embattled First Minister can continue | The Sun

 

Humza Yousaf set to resign as survival hopes fade (thetimes.co.uk)

[Ulysses]

1 minute ago, AyrJambo said:

The National as well

 

Just spotted that.  The Times already asking who will be the next leader.

[AyrJambo]

1 minute ago, Ulysses said:

 

Just spotted that.  The Times already asking who will be the next leader.

 

So the Tory VONC in Youaf would be cancelled

But Sarwar's VONC in SG still goes ahead

Alba have had no concessions from Yousaf and he's toast anyway so they vote with Sarwar VONC?

Or they figure it's a better look for them to support SNP SG?

What do the Greens do?

 

Interesting times

 

[BlueRiver]

7 minutes ago, AyrJambo said:

 

So the Tory VONC in Youaf would be cancelled

But Sarwar's VONC in SG still goes ahead

Alba have had no concessions from Yousaf and he's toast anyway so they vote with Sarwar VONC?

Or they figure it's a better look for them to support SNP SG?

What do the Greens do?

 

Interesting times

 

 

Have the Greens said anything at all about the Sarwar one? I've not been looking much over the weekend. 

[AyrJambo]

1 minute ago, BlueRiver said:

 

Have the Greens said anything at all about the Sarwar one? I've not been looking much over the weekend. 

 

Not much just that they would def support VONC against Yousaf

But they won't know who the new FM/leader will be before VONC in SG

Would they risk supporting SG to then see Kate Forbes installed?

[Ulysses]

13 minutes ago, AyrJambo said:

 

Not much just that they would def support VONC against Yousaf

But they won't know who the new FM/leader will be before VONC in SG

Would they risk supporting SG to then see Kate Forbes installed?

 

I'd guess the Greens' big issue would be the way Yousaf ditched the agreement and disrespected them.  It might look petty to carry on the argument once Yousaf is gone.  However, how long will it take to replace him?

[BlueRiver]

12 minutes ago, AyrJambo said:

 

Not much just that they would def support VONC against Yousaf

But they won't know who the new FM/leader will be before VONC in SG

Would they risk supporting SG to then see Kate Forbes installed?

 

As you say interesting times at Holyrood.

 

I do wonder what Forbes would do to the SNP vote as well considering she tacks further to the right than the party have presented itself for a good while. Guess we'll find out soon enough. Can't see anyone else beating her to the position. 

[AyrJambo]

14 minutes ago, Ulysses said:

 

I'd guess the Greens' big issue would be the way Yousaf ditched the agreement and disrespected them.  It might look petty to carry on the argument once Yousaf is gone.  However, how long will it take to replace him?

 

The have to replace him within 28 days or election follows

Can they run a leadership contest in that time?

Or can they install an interim FM to stave off an election?

[Ulysses]

8 minutes ago, AyrJambo said:

 

The have to replace him within 28 days or election follows

Can they run a leadership contest in that time?

Or can they install an interim FM to stave off an election?

 

I think they can replace him in that time.  If those are the rules it'd be daft for any party to have election procedures that ignored them.  Technically they might be able to install an interim, but politically it could be difficult.

[Lord Montpelier]

Reporting suggests leader of the Scottish Nationalist movement and serial over achiever Humza Yousaf close to raising the flag - white, and making way. 

 

Should that happen my money is on Jenny Gilruth being promoted as a replacement. Someone who will appeal perhaps to both the Green grifters and Murrell nationalists as next continuity candidate, in an attempt to lock Alba out and avoid an election. 

[TallPaul]

29 minutes ago, Lord Montpelier said:

Reporting suggests leader of the Scottish Nationalist movement and serial over achiever Humza Yousaf close to raising the flag - white, and making way. 

 

Should that happen my money is on Jenny Gilruth being promoted as a replacement. Someone who will appeal perhaps to both the Green grifters and Murrell nationalists as next continuity candidate, in an attempt to lock Alba out and avoid an election. 

Gilruth would be even worse than Humza she's a complete car crash of a politician. I'm guessing Kate Homophobic Forbes wouldn't win over the Greens though.

[Lord Montpelier]

5 minutes ago, TallPaul said:

Gilruth would be even worse than Humza she's a complete car crash of a politician. I'm guessing Kate Homophobic Forbes wouldn't win over the Greens though.

Forbes doesn't appeal to greens or lib dems

[manaliveits105]

Stephen Flynn has warned opposition MSPs that voting for a Tory motion of no confidence in Humza Yousaf "will never be forgotten".

The SNP leader at Westminster spoke out today as the First Minister faces a make-or-break week at Holyrood.

He put the public before politics and others would be well served to do likewise. 

"And MSPs would do well to remember that it will be the public who judge their decision. Backing the Tories might be regarded as just and brave by some, but it will never be forgotten by others."
 

aye - beat it ya dick !

[doctor jambo]

58 minutes ago, manaliveits105 said:

Stephen Flynn has warned opposition MSPs that voting for a Tory motion of no confidence in Humza Yousaf "will never be forgotten".

The SNP leader at Westminster spoke out today as the First Minister faces a make-or-break week at Holyrood.

He put the public before politics and others would be well served to do likewise. 

"And MSPs would do well to remember that it will be the public who judge their decision. Backing the Tories might be regarded as just and brave by some, but it will never be forgotten by others."
 

aye - beat it ya dick !

This is why the SNP are getting it so wrong- consensus can never be reached as long as they would never, ever,ever back anything the Conservatives put forward.

No matter how sensible.

Our politicians are utterly incapable of putting the people first.

[joondalupjambo]

The greater good here is making sure that Scotland does not need to go to the polls before the next GE to elect new MSP's.   If that happens it would be a disgrace.  I am hoping that politicians from all the Scottish parties understand that. If it happens voters will turn away in droves, even more so than before IMHO.  All the parties can squabble as much as they like, that is politics but failing and deliberately costing Scottish tax payers further is not on.

[dtgj]

BBC reporting that Humza Yousaf will resign today. 

[Japan Jambo]

2 hours ago, Lord Montpelier said:

Reporting suggests leader of the Scottish Nationalist movement and serial over achiever Humza Yousaf close to raising the flag - white, and making way. 

 

Should that happen my money is on Jenny Gilruth being promoted as a replacement. Someone who will appeal perhaps to both the Green grifters and Murrell nationalists as next continuity candidate, in an attempt to lock Alba out and avoid an election. 

 

👏 well played sir! 🤣🤣

[Japan Jambo]

 

[Lord Montpelier]

19 minutes ago, joondalupjambo said:

The greater good here is making sure that Scotland does not need to go to the polls before the next GE to elect new MSP's.   If that happens it would be a disgrace.  I am hoping that politicians from all the Scottish parties understand that. If it happens voters will turn away in droves, even more so than before IMHO.  All the parties can squabble as much as they like, that is politics but failing and deliberately costing Scottish tax payers further is not on.

Why would it be a disgrace ?

 

Feels like one of the very few sensible options right now. 

[doctor jambo]

13 minutes ago, joondalupjambo said:

The greater good here is making sure that Scotland does not need to go to the polls before the next GE to elect new MSP's.   If that happens it would be a disgrace.  I am hoping that politicians from all the Scottish parties understand that. If it happens voters will turn away in droves, even more so than before IMHO.  All the parties can squabble as much as they like, that is politics but failing and deliberately costing Scottish tax payers further is not on.

as a scottish tax payer I want an election.

this government have wrecked everything and are not fit to govern.

the budget was a wrecking ball through the finances of working people.

billions wasted, education falling off a cliff, patients stacked in corridors in hospital, everyone taxed to their back teeth.

Drs retiring early due to the tax burden, and not working out of hours shifts as its not worth it due to the cliff edges.

We need root and branch change

labour in power both sides of the border would be ideal

 

[Boris]

If Yousaf does resign, either today or due to losing a confidence vote, then I'd agree there is an argument to call new elections.

 

The Tories at Westminster have rightly been called out for the revolving door at number 10 and the lack of direct endorsement by the electorate since Johnson fell.

 

For the SNP to avoid this at Holyrood would smack of hypocrisy.  IMO.

[Mikey1874]

Stephen Flynn sending warnings like some hard man.

 

Maybe he could have warned the SNP leadership (unclear if he is part of that) that ditching the agreement with the Greens could lead to bringing down the leader. 

[Dennis Reynolds]

Good riddance. Has been an absolute disaster in every role he's had. Promised the earth in his leadership campaign and delivered nothing.

[BlueRiver]

15 minutes ago, Boris said:

If Yousaf does resign, either today or due to losing a confidence vote, then I'd agree there is an argument to call new elections.

 

The Tories at Westminster have rightly been called out for the revolving door at number 10 and the lack of direct endorsement by the electorate since Johnson fell.

 

For the SNP to avoid this at Holyrood would smack of hypocrisy.  IMO.

 

SNP barely missed an opportunity to rant about unelected leaders but when Humza was chosen that was different somehow. 

[Boris]

1 minute ago, BlueRiver said:

 

SNP barely missed an opportunity to rant about unelected leaders but when Humza was chosen that was different somehow. 

 

I think when a PM/FM stands down, the next leader gets a bit of slack (depending on the reason for the incumbent resigning!), however when you get on to the next "unelected" FM/PM then there is an ethical argument for going to the country.  IMO.

[doctor jambo]

17 minutes ago, Boris said:

If Yousaf does resign, either today or due to losing a confidence vote, then I'd agree there is an argument to call new elections.

 

The Tories at Westminster have rightly been called out for the revolving door at number 10 and the lack of direct endorsement by the electorate since Johnson fell.

 

For the SNP to avoid this at Holyrood would smack of hypocrisy.  IMO.

this.

of course we elect a party, not the leader, but when the SNP were so strident in their objections to the crowbarring in of substandard Tory leaders, they should take their own medicine.

[Australis]

Fantastic news, yousless yousaf about to resign.

On BBC reports.

 

His arrogance will never be missed.

 

Just wait for the race card and that everyone else is to blame.

 

[Cranston]

19 minutes ago, doctor jambo said:

as a scottish tax payer I want an election.

this government have wrecked everything and are not fit to govern.

the budget was a wrecking ball through the finances of working people.

billions wasted, education falling off a cliff, patients stacked in corridors in hospital, everyone taxed to their back teeth.

Drs retiring early due to the tax burden, and not working out of hours shifts as its not worth it due to the cliff edges.

We need root and branch change

labour in power both sides of the border would be ideal

 

Its looking likely that the political winds of change have shifted massively in their direction, across the UK. 

 

If the polls are correct, they will very probably take the UK back into the EU, within a decade, maybe earlier. 

 

There are definite supra signs of big political maneuvering, taking place, behind the scenes. 

 

 

 

 

[doctor jambo]

2 minutes ago, Cranston said:

Its looking likely that the political winds of change have shifted massively in their direction, across the UK. 

 

If the polls are correct, they will very probably take the UK back into the EU, within a decade, maybe earlier. 

 

There are definite supra signs of big political maneuvering, taking place, behind the scenes. 

 

 

 

 

I suspect that if there was a Scottish election labour would trounce the SNP.

Normally Tory voting Scot’s now see labour as a lower tax party thanks to the snp.

that is quite the achievement.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

3 minutes ago, Cranston said:

Its looking likely that the political winds of change have shifted massively in their direction, across the UK. 

[B]

If the polls are correct, they will very probably take the UK back into the EU, within a decade, maybe earlier. [/B]

 

There are definite supra signs of big political maneuvering, taking place, behind the scenes. 

 

 

 

 

With the need for a referendum, no Schengen opt outs and a commitment to join the Euro? Good luck with that one.

 

 

[ToadKiller Dog]

Just now, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

With the need for a referendum, no Schengen opt outs and a commitment to join the Euro? Good luck with that one.

 

 

And the EU might not want us back ,France said no a good few times before we were originally let in to the then EEC .

The polling sage John Curtis thinks around 2040 before we will be asked again.

[Australis]

When the party whip goes around all your MSPs and you have to tell youseless that half those MSPs are going to vote to get rid of him. 😀😁😄

 

[TallPaul]

1 minute ago, ToadKiller Dog said:

And the EU might not want us back ,France said no a good few times before we were originally let in to the then EEC .

The polling sage John Curtis thinks around 2040 before we will be asked again.

The EU would take the UK back in a second on the terms we had before Brexit. They may not admit that now but they would.

[TallPaul]

I'm guessing the next FM will be Gilruth. lesbian and Left so she will get the nod from Patrick.

[hughesie27]

14 minutes ago, Australis said:

 

Just wait for the race card and that everyone else is to blame.

 

Letting your mask slip a wee bit there?

[That thing you do]

1 minute ago, TallPaul said:

The EU would take the UK back in a second on the terms we had before Brexit. They may not admit that now but they would.

I agree. They would

 

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

1 minute ago, TallPaul said:

The EU would take the UK back in a second on the terms we had before Brexit. They may not admit that now but they would.

There is no danger the UK would get those conditions again, particularly the rebate.

[John Findlay]

1 minute ago, TallPaul said:

The EU would take the UK back in a second on the terms we had before Brexit. They may not admit that now but they would.

I think they may insist on us adopting the Euro as our currency, if we asked for re-admittance.

[TallPaul]

Just now, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

There is no danger the UK would get those conditions again, particularly the rebate.

They would. We would be top 2/3 largest economies in the EU.

[Cranston]

6 minutes ago, doctor jambo said:

I suspect that if there was a Scottish election labour would trounce the SNP.

Normally Tory voting Scot’s now see labour as a lower tax party thanks to the snp.

that is quite the achievement.

Its incredible to watch the winds of change occurring. 

 

While the other parties turn in on themselves, Labour are making huge gains across the spectrum, quite literally, in absence of doing anything much. 

 

 

[ToadKiller Dog]

1 minute ago, TallPaul said:

The EU would take the UK back in a second on the terms we had before Brexit. They may not admit that now but they would.

Nah I disagree France and Germany are pissed off with us ,more so after The Tories and Labour turned down flatly the youth freedom of movement plan .

Only takes one nation to say no ,

[Cranston]

9 minutes ago, Geoff Kilpatrick said:

With the need for a referendum, no Schengen opt outs and a commitment to join the Euro? Good luck with that one.

 

 

Simply mere hurdles to overcome. If the polls are to be believed, with Labour making inroads here in Scotland, Sir Keir could have us back in the EU, post a fairly sizable referendum majority win, within a decade. 

[doctor jambo]

4 minutes ago, TallPaul said:

I'm guessing the next FM will be Gilruth. lesbian and Left so she will get the nod from Patrick.

what kind of lesbian though?

 Green compliant lesbian or same sex attracted lesbian?

Last thing we need is another SNP + Greens link up.

They are literally bankrupting the country

[hughesie27]

11 minutes ago, doctor jambo said:

I suspect that if there was a Scottish election labour would trounce the SNP.

Normally Tory voting Scot’s now see labour as a lower tax party thanks to the snp.

that is quite the achievement.

Not sure they would trounce them but could see them have fairly equal footing. But depending on who SNP elect as their leader that could swing things back to SNP too. I think Forbes would be a brilliant FM as she was last time round.

[doctor jambo]

Just now, hughesie27 said:

Not sure they would trounce them but could see them have fairly equal footing. But depending on who SNP elect as their leader that could swing things back to SNP too. I think Forbes would be a brilliant FM as she was last time round.

Forbes would be great, I agree.

There is no way on this green earth that the Greens would tolerate a socially conservative leader of the SNP.

So it would be right back to where we were unless the Libdems agreed a deal.

[Lord Montpelier]

2 minutes ago, doctor jambo said:

Forbes would be great, I agree.

There is no way on this green earth that the Greens would tolerate a socially conservative leader of the SNP.

So it would be right back to where we were unless the Libdems agreed a deal.

Cole Hamilton on the wireless this morning did not seem to have much support for Forbes 

[Hagar the Horrible]

I think they will struggle to get somebody else in,  Kate Forbes, NON-Progressive which is not what the Greens want, Ash Regan, is a party of one!, Flynn would be good for the country but he wont take a poison chalice right now, Cherry the same.

 

I think there might need to be a Horyrood Election, then see who leads the SNP.

 

Forbes will split the SNP in two,  Tartan Tories v Leftie Luddites  but her half will be stronger because the left will sub divide further

[Hagar the Horrible]

Just now, Lord Montpelier said:

Cole Hamilton on the wireless this morning did not seem to have much support for Forbes 

Then she would be good.  Remember she got a budget passed through in a matter of hours

[doctor jambo]

2 minutes ago, Lord Montpelier said:

Cole Hamilton on the wireless this morning did not seem to have much support for Forbes 

yes, I heard that.

Lib dems hooking for an election.

Carion crows swooping over an ailing SNP