...a bit disco Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 no don't dare Okay. Consider me forfeited then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hearts007 Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 Okay. Consider me forfeited then. you were on to it quick as a flash, I edited it within seconds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
...a bit disco Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 you were on to it quick as a flash, I edited it within seconds A matter of timing and nothing better to do. In bed with a chest infection and no Sky upstairs! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballfirst Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 Interesting observations on the changes to the RFC badge this season. http://www.thecoplandroad.org/2014/10/the-rangers-badge-mystery.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hearts007 Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 A matter of timing and nothing better to do. In bed with a chest infection and no Sky upstairs! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Comedian Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 Interesting observations on the changes to the RFC badge this season. http://www.thecoplandroad.org/2014/10/the-rangers-badge-mystery.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
...a bit disco Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 Interesting observations on the changes to the RFC badge this season. http://www.thecoplandroad.org/2014/10/the-rangers-badge-mystery.html What about all those poor Ra Berrs with their tattoos? Will Ashley be suing for copyright? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feeno Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 Ready badge been sold and reducing the damage is my hope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barney Rubble Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 Interesting observations on the changes to the RFC badge this season. http://www.thecoplan...ge-mystery.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FarmerTweedy Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 King raising the dosh via another share issue? Thought he was supposed to be using his own cash? The new share issue is how King proposes to invest and take control. He'll buy new shares, with the money going into the business, rather than buy existing shares from current shareholders which would mean the money went to them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FarmerTweedy Posted October 23, 2014 Share Posted October 23, 2014 The rush 3 years ago to get back to their rightful place at the head of the table has come back to bite them. Division 3 and probably 2 could have been won quite easily by a few seasoned veterans and good Scottish kids who would have fallen over themselves to play for Newco. Those kids would now be seasoned and probably would have managed to get them back up this year, even if through the play-offs. They decided to do it their own way and now are back in the doo doo. The money spent and lost is quite astounding. I don't actually think that the overspending you mention is the main cause of their problems. Sensible spending on the playing squad would have saved them maybe about ?3m a year, which would mean they wouldn't have run out of funds yet, but the main causes of their losses are the running costs of ?1brox and MP, plus the huge amounts the spivs are taking out. Long may it continue! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
7628mm Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Ready badge been sold and reducing the damage is my hope. I am not sure if this is or will be a problem for The Rangers in relation to image rights etc. I am familiar with both "badges" as will most othere JKB members and in reality makes no difference to "them" unless as was said on CRO that it is Ashley that now "owns" the Ready one. However I would just point out that the this photo would tend to suggest to me that they are a "NEW" club Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feeno Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 (edited) I am not sure if this is or will be a problem for The Rangers in relation to image rights etc. I am familiar with both "badges" as will most othere JKB members and in reality makes no difference to "them" unless as was said on CRO that it is Ashley that now "owns" the Ready one. However I would just point out that the this photo would tend to suggest to me that they are a "NEW" club Might be tucked away in Charles Greens vault as well though Edited October 24, 2014 by Feeno Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alva-Jambo Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 The current shares in Newco, and the problem around them. The key problem with any new shares issue is dilution. The present shares are worth say 20p but if it were a largish issue of say ?8 million, then all the shares would be worth perhaps 12 or 14p. The Board could keep issueing ?4M worth of new shares until the cows come home and the present shares worth say a penny each. The present board probably has that option. However, if they don't get funds one way or the other soon, the present shares will end up being worthless if they were to go into admin . Short term, the shares would simply be suspended from trading on AIM, and unless a white knight ploughed cash into the club, these shares would end up at zombie value, perhaps entirely worthless. THis is the background fear of Easdale and those behind him. Of course it is irrelevant to King, who has no current shares. But King's group, are not simply fighting Easdale and his allies. He is fighting the problem of the shares. Then to complicate matters, Ashley seems more likely to lend a large sum to the 'club' , a loan always has strings. Well, its all fun and games but something has to happen in the coming four or five weeks. I'm reminded of that song.. " pressure" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.T.K Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 The current shares in Newco, and the problem around them. The key problem with any new shares issue is dilution. The present shares are worth say 20p but if it were a largish issue of say ?8 million, then all the shares would be worth perhaps 12 or 14p. The Board could keep issueing ?4M worth of new shares until the cows come home and the present shares worth say a penny each. The present board probably has that option. However, if they don't get funds one way or the other soon, the present shares will end up being worthless if they were to go into admin . Short term, the shares would simply be suspended from trading on AIM, and unless a white knight ploughed cash into the club, these shares would end up at zombie value, perhaps entirely worthless. THis is the background fear of Easdale and those behind him. Of course it is irrelevant to King, who has no current shares. But King's group, are not simply fighting Easdale and his allies. He is fighting the problem of the shares. Then to complicate matters, Ashley seems more likely to lend a large sum to the 'club' , a loan always has strings. Well, its all fun and games but something has to happen in the coming four or five weeks. I'm reminded of that song.. " pressure" Kinda of what I'm thinking. Why does King not offer to by the shares he needs rather then sneak control by share dilution? I'm pretty sure some of these shadowy money men would take a deal if it right and walk away before the crash. As you said 'a loan always has strings' and I think Kings 16 million will be the same. I also find it funny that King is suggesting he is the good guy saving the club from people who running in to the ground!!! Um..... Mr King what went happened last time you were a custodian of a club called Rangers? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I P Knightley Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Kinda of what I'm thinking. Why does King not offer to by the shares he needs rather then sneak control by share dilution? I'm pretty sure some of these shadowy money men would take a deal if it right and walk away before the crash. If he doesn't subscribe to new shares, he has to buy existing shares from existing shareholders. This lines the pockets of the existing shareholders but the company then gets nothing. The only two ways the company can get additional cash is through subscription for new shares or by borrowing. Subscription for new shares can either be by "rights issue" (which is what they had last month & doesn't dilute ownership/control) or an issue of new shares to new shareholders which results in dilution. The latter happens often enough in big companies where there are many, many shareholders & noboby with a significant or controlling interest. It's not going to happen at Rangers where there are a few big, sticky fingers in the pie and they're unlikely to let go. If King only wanted the club to have some of his money so it could thrive, he could set up a low (or zero) interest bond with a very long date for redemption, or plans for the debt to convert to shares after 10 years or so. He won't do this because, as a lender, he'd have little to no say in how the company is run. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thomaso Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 (edited) I don't actually think that the overspending you mention is the main cause of their problems. Sensible spending on the playing squad would have saved them maybe about ?3m a year, which would mean they wouldn't have run out of funds yet, but the main causes of their losses are the running costs of ?1brox and MP, plus the huge amounts the spivs are taking out. Long may it continue! The cause of Rangers continued financial disaster IS the cash that the Spivs have drained and continue to plunder out of the Club. Running costs and player wages are high however with home crowds averaging around 35k to 40k there should be more than enough revenue to run the Club. They are in financial meltdown and as every day passes the threat of yet another Administration becomes stark reality - great isn't it! Edited October 24, 2014 by Thomaso Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deevers Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 If he doesn't subscribe to new shares, he has to buy existing shares from existing shareholders. This lines the pockets of the existing shareholders but the company then gets nothing. The only two ways the company can get additional cash is through subscription for new shares or by borrowing. Subscription for new shares can either be by "rights issue" (which is what they had last month & doesn't dilute ownership/control) or an issue of new shares to new shareholders which results in dilution. The latter happens often enough in big companies where there are many, many shareholders & noboby with a significant or controlling interest. It's not going to happen at Rangers where there are a few big, sticky fingers in the pie and they're unlikely to let go. If King only wanted the club to have some of his money so it could thrive, he could set up a low (or zero) interest bond with a very long date for redemption, or plans for the debt to convert to shares after 10 years or so. He won't do this because, as a lender, he'd have little to no say in how the company is run. That's the sticking point - "control of the club" - I believe that King wants to place his own directors on the board but won't say who they might be and who is in cahoots with him in all of this. Shady just does not describe this adequately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seymour M Hersh Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Maybe green held the rights to the crest & is an onerous contract generating a payment for him, hence the change to using the Rfc crest now to possibly starve that revenue stream out?. I also see kings statement about journalists had started a thread with posters beginning to make veiled threats etc. the thread has since been deleted but it's a worrying escalation as the blame game begins. Intimidation and the threat of violence appears to be their only negotiating tool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rods Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Intimidation and the threat of violence appears to be their only negotiating tool. I seen this coming earlier in this thread. Like I said Mad Vlad knew and they all laughed at him at the time. I am still not sure admin will happen or not but what will ensue is bitter in fighting which I hope has a negative effect on the playing side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I.T.K Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 If he doesn't subscribe to new shares, he has to buy existing shares from existing shareholders. This lines the pockets of the existing shareholders but the company then gets nothing. The only two ways the company can get additional cash is through subscription for new shares or by borrowing. Subscription for new shares can either be by "rights issue" (which is what they had last month & doesn't dilute ownership/control) or an issue of new shares to new shareholders which results in dilution. The latter happens often enough in big companies where there are many, many shareholders & noboby with a significant or controlling interest. It's not going to happen at Rangers where there are a few big, sticky fingers in the pie and they're unlikely to let go. If King only wanted the club to have some of his money so it could thrive, he could set up a low (or zero) interest bond with a very long date for redemption, or plans for the debt to convert to shares after 10 years or so. He won't do this because, as a lender, he'd have little to no say in how the company is run. Thanks... understand now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itsnomarooned Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Going back a couple of pages and Brick Tamland's report of his swanky dinner with financial fat-cats. Quoted from the post - "...... McCoist knows about the onerous contracts as he has one." Maybe this has been covered before but this has all sorts of inappropriate, conflict of interest type feelings about it. I think I'd be pretty furious if I was a Rangers fan and realised that the manager was reaping rewards from this type of deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
...a bit disco Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Going back a couple of pages and Brick Tamland's report of his swanky dinner with financial fat-cats. Quoted from the post - "...... McCoist knows about the onerous contracts as he has one." Maybe this has been covered before but this has all sorts of inappropriate, conflict of interest type feelings about it. I think I'd be pretty furious if I was a Rangers fan and realised that the manager was reaping rewards from this type of deal. But, but, but Soopur Doopur Ally's a Ranjurs legned don't you know? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tartofmidlothian Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Going back a couple of pages and Brick Tamland's report of his swanky dinner with financial fat-cats. Quoted from the post - "...... McCoist knows about the onerous contracts as he has one." Maybe this has been covered before but this has all sorts of inappropriate, conflict of interest type feelings about it. I think I'd be pretty furious if I was a Rangers fan and realised that the manager was reaping rewards from this type of deal. Is he not just referring to the fact McCoist's highly paid? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballfirst Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 keith jackson ?@tedermeatballs 2m2 minutes ago But with regards the ongoing Rangers situation, there will be significant breaking news coming up on here very shortly... A Jack Irvine Sandy Easdale press release perhaps? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo 4 Ever Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 keith jackson ?@tedermeatballs 2m2 minutes ago But with regards the ongoing Rangers situation, there will be significant breaking news coming up on here very shortly... A Jack Irvine Sandy Easdale press release perhaps? Any guesses about what this is about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommy Brown Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Going back a couple of pages and Brick Tamland's report of his swanky dinner with financial fat-cats. Quoted from the post - "...... McCoist knows about the onerous contracts as he has one." Maybe this has been covered before but this has all sorts of inappropriate, conflict of interest type feelings about it. I think I'd be pretty furious if I was a Rangers fan and realised that the manager was reaping rewards from this type of deal. He has played them like a fiddle since the start. He's the fan doing his best for the club, dishing out the occasional soundbite for the hoards and they lap it all up. His snout is so deep in the trough along with his managerial inability make it impossible to sack him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swavkav Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 When they going tae die? I have a party to plan! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
...a bit disco Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Any guesses about what this is about? Wee Stevie promoted to Director of Football? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rods Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 My bet is good news for Rangers the way Jackson words things on his tweets makes it obvious. He prompts the knuckledragers to prepare themselves for bad news so he does not get hounded. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctor jambo Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 There is no news. King cannot buy in, and cannot wrest control/ He will not loan without security, which he will not get Ashley wont surrender (how ironic) his commercial deals- remember he buys distressed brands and milks them (Lonsdale, Dunlop and so on)- Rangers would be one of his stable for this process and this is typical Ashley commercial looting in action. Easdale is not rich enough to sacrifice his financial stake NO-one knows who the others are but if Rizvi is anything to go by I wouldn't mess with them. Remember 1- Easdale is a convicted fraudster 2-King is a convicted fraudster 3- Rizvi is a convicted fraudster 4 Craig Whyte is banned from being a director 5- Green is being investigate by the SFO for his sleight of hand over the Rangers assets -nice people there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilson Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 K Jackson has update on Record web site- a piece not unsurprisingly confirming that MA has tabled emergency funding package. Subject to removal of Wallace and Nash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jambovambo Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 (edited) K Jackson has update on Record web site- a piece not unsurprisingly confirming that MA has tabled emergency funding package. Subject to removal of Wallace and Nash. http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/rangers-power-battle-mike-ashley-4499365#.VEpMFJUYRX8.twitter indeed. Edited October 24, 2014 by jambovambo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Feeno Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Keith Jackson re-hashing an old story to stem the civil unrest when they blue morons realise Kings no got a pot to piss in. Keith Jackson, Hero Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo 4 Ever Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 http://www.dailyreco...FJUYRX8.twitter indeed. Is this new news? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rods Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Team Ashley deliver the death blow to the lying king. Panning out just as planned. Looks like admin wont be a possibility then and just bitter infighting instead. Drop in crowds expected soon enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rods Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Admin was never on the cards m8, why kill the cow that you can milk everyday. Lots of people have a vested interest in keeping it afloat. Yeh but if the cows udders are running dry would it not be better to kill it rather than continue to feed it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walter Bishop Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Phil MacGiollaBhain ?@Pmacgiollabhain 54s55 seconds ago I see that Mr Mike Ashley is about to donate generously to the #Hopeathon Whattaguy.... #RIFC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deevers Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 It won't, fans are fickle creatures & once Sevco get investment & are able to put out a winning team on the park they'll all come back to the fold. They'll forget about king when they are challenging for trophies & their sense of entitlement has been massaged enough etc. It's opium for the masses. Don't know that the amounts that Ashley will put in will actually have that effect - more likely just keep them going till the next crisis in a few months time. I still suspect that it''s the stadium he is after in the long term. I'll bet all these loans are ultimately secured on that. He knows that when the crash comes they will yet again rise from the ashes - but next time they will be renting Ibrox from him and making him plenty! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harvey05 Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 There is no news. King cannot buy in, and cannot wrest control/ He will not loan without security, which he will not get Ashley wont surrender (how ironic) his commercial deals- remember he buys distressed brands and milks them (Lonsdale, Dunlop and so on)- Rangers would be one of his stable for this process and this is typical Ashley commercial looting in action. Easdale is not rich enough to sacrifice his financial stake NO-one knows who the others are but if Rizvi is anything to go by I wouldn't mess with them. Remember 1- Easdale is a convicted fraudster 2-King is a convicted fraudster 3- Rizvi is a convicted fraudster 4 Craig Whyte is banned from being a director 5- Green is being investigate by the SFO for his sleight of hand over the Rangers assets -nice people there! What a motley crew! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballfirst Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Admin was never on the cards m8, why kill the cow that you can milk everyday. Lots of people have a vested interest in keeping it afloat. As I said yesterday, Ashley will make his "offer" and if the terms of it cross certain red lines (e.g. on the handover of further branding rights or securities over Ibrox and/or Murray Park), then the Board (which is not exactly pro Ashley) could reject it on the basis that it is not in the interests of the shareholders. Should that happen then we could still see a voluntary "managed" administration with compliant administrators. The other shareholders may see that as a better outcome in terms of a return on the value of their investments via a CVA or Newco purchase of assets, than having Ashley siphon further funds out of the club. Ashley would get the blame for being greedy, King would retain his white knight status and the Spivs would still get a pay off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unknown user Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 It won't, fans are fickle creatures & once Sevco get investment & are able to put out a winning team on the park they'll all come back to the fold. They'll forget about king when they are challenging for trophies & their sense of entitlement has been massaged enough etc. It's opium for the masses Sorry for going off topic so wildly but every time I hear that phrase I think "Chewing gum for the eyes". "No thanks Ted" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jambo-Jimbo Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 There is no news. King cannot buy in, and cannot wrest control/ He will not loan without security, which he will not get Ashley wont surrender (how ironic) his commercial deals- remember he buys distressed brands and milks them (Lonsdale, Dunlop and so on)- Rangers would be one of his stable for this process and this is typical Ashley commercial looting in action. Easdale is not rich enough to sacrifice his financial stake NO-one knows who the others are but if Rizvi is anything to go by I wouldn't mess with them. Remember 1- Easdale is a convicted fraudster 2-King is a convicted fraudster 3- Rizvi is a convicted fraudster 4 Craig Whyte is banned from being a director 5- Green is being investigate by the SFO for his sleight of hand over the Rangers assets -nice people there! And that's just the ones that we know about, I bet there are other's behind the scenes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkishcap Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 As I said yesterday, Ashley will make his "offer" and if the terms of it cross certain red lines (e.g. on the handover of further branding rights or securities over Ibrox and/or Murray Park), then the Board (which is not exactly pro Ashley) could reject it on the basis that it is not in the interests of the shareholders. Should that happen then we could still see a voluntary "managed" administration with compliant administrators. The other shareholders may see that as a better outcome in terms of a return on the value of their investments via a CVA or Newco purchase of assets, than having Ashley siphon further funds out of the club. Ashley would get the blame for being greedy, King would retain his white knight status and the Spivs would still get a pay off. Dont mind me asking but what is a managed admin.....would that be no points deduction? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don Dan Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Don't know that the amounts that Ashley will put in will actually have that effect - more likely just keep them going till the next crisis in a few months time. I still suspect that it''s the stadium he is after in the long term. I'll bet all these loans are ultimately secured on that. He knows that when the crash comes they will yet again rise from the ashes - but next time they will be renting Ibrox from him and making him plenty! Sure it will the following, final death of Ra People and ?Brox demolished to make way for a Tesco Super Store. Which would fall inline with MA recent share purchases. Obviously my imagination has been affect by cold beers but nothing would surprise me in the slightest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballfirst Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 (edited) Dont mind me asking but what is a managed admin.....would that be no points deduction? A points deduction would happen anyway. By a managed admin I mean that RIFC will select their own administrators and they will work in tandem to achieve a specific outcome. i.e. It will be TRFC that is placed in admin. RIFC will be the largest creditor by some distance (money loaned from the IPO) and can veto bids for TRFC that they don't like. RIFC can either take ownership of the property assets and rent them out to a buyer for TRFC, or they can seek a higher price which would include the assets. If it is the former then the RIFC will have a nice little earner as a property company, or if it is the latter then the money received would be paid out to shareholders as a special dividend. Edited October 24, 2014 by Footballfirst Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Comedian Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Ashley has them by the goolies. Why wouldn't he ask for the good stuff like stadium an that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkishcap Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 A points deduction would happen anyway. By a managed admin I mean that RIFC will select their own administrators and they will work in tandem to achieve a specific outcome. i.e. It will be TRFC that is placed in admin. RIFC will be the largest creditor by some distance (money loaned from the IPO) and can veto bids for TRFC that they don't like. RIFC can either take ownership of the property assets and rent them out to a buyer for TRFC, or they can seek a higher price which would include the assets. If it is the former then the RIFC will have a nice little earner as a property company, or if it is the latter then the money received would be paid out to shareholders as a special dividend. Cheers, potential good news! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballfirst Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Cheers, potential good news! Not necessarily. The alternative is that Ashley keeps them on life support while sweating the assets (including IP) as far as he can. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doctor jambo Posted October 24, 2014 Share Posted October 24, 2014 Not necessarily. The alternative is that Ashley keeps them on life support while sweating the assets (including IP) as far as he can. This is my dream scenario and IMO the most likely outcome- it is his modus operandi. It matters not a jot if Rangers return to their former power to him. He will bleed the club for as long as he can Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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