Hearts announce financial results

[JamboAl]

The salary levels in 2005-06 & 2006-07 are a consequence of the signings & contracts awarded in August 2005 & January 2006 - post the scottish cup final win the following higher earners have been removed from the wage bill - Skacel, Webster, Pressley, Hartley, Jankauskas, Fyssas, Brellier, Barasa, Gordon, Pospisil & Bednar will soon leave - the only significant higher earners arriving have been Pinilla, Kingston & Nade.

 

I would imagine over the next year Tall, Makela, Beslija will leave and Kingston, Goncalves, Pinilla could be transferred - Neil McCann would be offered a much reduced contract factoring his age, injuries and lack of appearances.

 

I think the salary / turnover ratio will be much closer to what it should be by summer 2009.

 

Hopefully transfer fee income will have reduced the debt level by then also.

 

The most senible post of this thread.

You can add savings on the smaller salaries of many young players who I fear will be released. Some, like Pelosi, have been on loan for yonks and I suspect are not going to make it.

[Zico]

The salary levels in 2005-06 & 2006-07 are a consequence of the signings & contracts awarded in August 2005 & January 2006 - post the scottish cup final win the following higher earners have been removed from the wage bill - Skacel, Webster, Pressley, Hartley, Jankauskas, Fyssas, Brellier, Barasa, Gordon, Pospisil & Bednar will soon leave - the only significant higher earners arriving have been Pinilla, Kingston & Nade.

 

I would imagine over the next year Tall, Makela, Beslija will leave and Kingston, Goncalves, Pinilla could be transferred - Neil McCann would be offered a much reduced contract factoring his age, injuries and lack of appearances.

 

I think the salary / turnover ratio will be much closer to what it should be by summer 2009.

 

Hopefully transfer fee income will have reduced the debt level by then also.

 

To summarise, gross financial mismanagement from VR which makes the Pieman look like feckin Warren Buffett.

 

Whatever way you want to look at it, the ratio of 'employee costs' versus turnover is genuinely frightening.

[Nucky Thompson]

I guess that with those shocking numbers - and the Romanovs running out of money that there will be further player sales of any player who can be sold - and much more cost cutting on the playing staff.

Running out of money???

UBIG assets 537,000,000 Euros

UBIG turnover in 2006 392,000,000 Euros

What's the exchange rate to the Euro now? They'll soon be worth the same shortly ,the way things are going:mw_rolleyes:

[Dirk Diggler]

I suggest we try as hard as possible to pick over the finanical report and find things to moan about as much as we can, whether they are genuine concerns or not.

 

Will make us all feel better.

 

[bighalders]

Didn't he do well, thanks Vlad, doing a grand job, whats on the plan for next season, relegation and ?50M in debt perhaps, go on yer sel mate, cheers

Where's the Pieman these days????

[Terrible Trio]

no he didnt,

 

oh yes he did

[The cruckie cookie]

These figures are truly shocking but hey ho it's onwards and upwards for us eh.

 

No more players coming in on big wages in fact probably no more players coming in.

 

How are we to get out of this mess?

[monkfish1979]

OK, I know people are getting cross and skipping this bit but just between you and I -

 

Your link is about Chemical Ali, a dangerous and psychopathic lunatic - a Vladimir Romanov, if you will.

 

Your previous post showed Comical Ali, a harmless comedy figure whose job was to put forward hopeless spin - a Charlie Mann, if you like

 

The former is pushing up the daisies. The latter is sipping tea in Abu Dhabi.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad_Saeed_al-Sahhaf

 

Hope that helps

 

GC

 

Hehe, I'm such a dunce.....

 

You think they'll give me a managment job at tynie? Or financial controller, maybe?

 

FWIW, I think the statement's a load of pesh. Sometimes I think that site's aimed at the hard of thinking.....

[Colonel Kurtz]

oh yes he did

 

The SMG deal with Hearts was bad for them as was the Chris Evans deal.

If anybody lost money out of Hearts shares ,then I am afraid its down to their lack of acumen.

[bishop1874]

Am i the only one who is wondering how much we have actually lost. I am at work so had a quick look at the figures and you are looking at 2million (ish) difference between turnover and wages.

 

Do salarys include all staffing and policing etc.?

 

I thought the previous debt was 26ish so if we are looking at 36-38million debt then where is the rest going?

 

someone please help me understand this?

[cylawny]

Am i the only one who is wondering how much we have actually lost. I am at work so had a quick look at the figures and you are looking at 2million (ish) difference between turnover and wages.

 

Do salarys include all staffing and policing etc.?

 

I thought the previous debt was 26ish so if we are looking at 36-38million debt then where is the rest going?

 

someone please help me understand this?

 

 

The ?12 M was for the staff only.

 

The other part of the loss will be other running costs.

 

I would also bet the figures will show ? 2M going into the coffers of Ukio Bankas in interest payments.

[virgilhiltz]

we are in safe hands.

Ukio bank made ?4m profit.

[bishop1874]

we are in safe hands.

Ukio bank made ?4m profit.

 

 

that will be our interest then

[Francis Albert]

So the results are pretty much bang in line with what everyone has been expecting and predicting.

[pivotno1]

the differance jambo robbo,between romanov and robinson,is that romanov has the money to bankroll us,the fat rat almost put us out of business,

who knows where we will end up,but i am still not at the stage of the sleepless nights,which i had with the mess the fat chap from balerno put us in.the debt will become an issue sometime,but right at this moment we are still at tynecastle,still trading,and have plans to reduce the wage bill,

romanov tried to buy success,it failed,a lot to do with his handling of the teams affairs,but he was also let down by a lot of big earners,i think he will now go down a differant route,and maybe this might be his last chance to get us back on side,but one thing i often think about even through all this mess is where we might have been without romanov.

[JamboAl]

It would be wise to wait until the full accounts are available and analysed before spouting forth but then some people just cannot wait to put the boot in. Non-recurring expenditure, loans written off, depreciation/write-offs etc etc can often give a misleading picture. The underlying position could be better or worse than the quoted loss would seem to suggest.

A couple of years ago, a club not too far from Tynie came up with accounts which pointed to a club breaking even over the year but that was only after the parent company had gifted them ?2m.

[Nucky Thompson]

we are in safe hands.

Ukio bank made ?4m profit.

It didn't say that in the link:confused: It did say UBIG turnover was 392,000,000 Euros:) It doesn't suit your agenda though.

[269miles]

Can someone please confirm :

 

turnover up to ?10 million (pretty much maxed up , I would say)

 

but we spent ?12 million on players wages

 

we also pay ?4 million per season on interest (or , insert number of choice) to (insert name of choice) ?

 

Oh , and the directors didn't take a salary. Take a salary from what ? You can't get blood out of a stone.

 

Looks to me like some very lean times ahead on the playing/ managerial front.

[Dirk Diggler]

the differance jambo robbo,between romanov and robinson,is that romanov has the money to bankroll us,the fat rat almost put us out of business,

who knows where we will end up,but i am still not at the stage of the sleepless nights,which i had with the mess the fat chap from balerno put us in.the debt will become an issue sometime,but right at this moment we are still at tynecastle,still trading,and have plans to reduce the wage bill,

romanov tried to buy success,it failed,a lot to do with his handling of the teams affairs,but he was also let down by a lot of big earners,i think he will now go down a differant route,and maybe this might be his last chance to get us back on side,but one thing i often think about even through all this mess is where we might have been without romanov.

 

I can't believe the difference between the two of them would need to be explained but there you go.

[paulah]

I cant believe the wage bill,get theses players out the door,and start doin what Hibs do and cap the wages at 2 grand a week,we'r paying huge money and cant even get in the top 6

[Nucky Thompson]

start doin what Hibs do and cap the wages at 2 grand a week

Who told you that? Try 30 bob and a bag of jube jubes:)

[portobellojambo1]

Your previous post showed Comical Ali, a harmless comedy figure whose job was to put forward hopeless spin - a Charlie Mann, if you like

 

The former is pushing up the daisies. The latter is sipping tea in Abu Dhabi.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muhammad_Saeed_al-Sahhaf

 

Hope that helps

 

GC

 

Had me confused for a second there LJ, I thought you meant Alastair was taes up and Charlie Mann was sipping tea in Abu Dhabi.

[super_vlad]

Only a handful of clubs around the world make a profit ! if you take out the English premiership then you can count the rest on your hand.

 

I don't think for a mintue that the results are good, but there is a risk involved in football that you need to spend money first then hope thoses big earners will pay for themselves on the pitch. Comerically without a doubt we are much better than under Pieman, i know a lot of people will go on about the ****e we have had to watch over the last year but we have had to cut back the squad to stop getting into a worse postion.

 

Its a lose/lose situtaion for romanov, if he investes in the team then people will say we are wasting money on rubbish players, if he cuts the squad back then he is not investing in the team. There has to be a balance. And before i get shot down, every single player is a risk when you sign him, it just depends if he is worth it ! Look at Adam, the man was class for us, till he signed that contract worth 10k a week !

[paulah]

Who told you that? Try 30 bob and a bag of jube jubes:)

 

Well m8 for their 30 bob a week their above us in the league and they hardly have any debt

[Peebo]

Seems ironic that the figures are issued the very day Vlad is in town.

 

I don't see anything remotely ironic about that.

[Peebo]

Only a handful of clubs around the world make a profit ! if you take out the English premiership then you can count the rest on your hand.

 

I don't think for a mintue that the results are good, but there is a risk involved in football that you need to spend money first then hope thoses big earners will pay for themselves on the pitch. Comerically without a doubt we are much better than under Pieman, i know a lot of people will go on about the ****e we have had to watch over the last year but we have had to cut back the squad to stop getting into a worse postion.

 

Its a lose/lose situtaion for romanov, if he investes in the team then people will say we are wasting money on rubbish players, if he cuts the squad back then he is not investing in the team. There has to be a balance. And before i get shot down, every single player is a risk when you sign him, it just depends if he is worth it ! Look at Adam, the man was class for us, till he signed that contract worth 10k a week !

 

Amen to that.

[Dirk Diggler]

Well m8 for their 30 bob a week their above us in the league and they hardly have any debt

 

I passed a tramp on Princes Street today.

 

I doubt he has much debt.

 

I wouldn't swap my life for his.

[maroonedinoz]

If we go bottom up, I don't want to do so without having asked a few questions.

 

Why is there no mention of the current debt levels in the statement.....is this another "don't you worry about that".....patronising statement

 

I can't see any positives....a club that spends a fortune and doesn't even make the top six!!

 

does this give us confidence for the future?...I can't see where it does..the only hope is that somehow we will be misamanged to a lesser degree..

 

And building a new stand with a hotel is going somehow to be our salvation!!???

 

right......anybody want to buy the Sydney Harbour bridge..I'm selling shares in it...

[maroonedinoz]

I passed a tramp on Princes Street today.

 

I doubt he has much debt.

 

I wouldn't swap my life for his.

 

You are quite right not to.

 

However, because of his life style, it is very likely he will die a long time before you.

[Dirk Diggler]

You are quite right not to.

 

However, because of his life style, it is very likely he will die a long time before you.

 

Exactly.

[Colonel Kurtz]

A terrible way to manage wages would be for Vlads appointees to fix up jobs for their wifes at Tynecastle.

[upthehill]

Apologies, I thought he was, but nothing about it up yet apart from this - http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/7270396.stm

 

Chemical and Comic are two different guys called Ali who were both henchmen of Saddam. 1 rightly executed, 1 rightly an international figure of ridicule!

[Francis Albert]

It would be wise to wait until the full accounts are available and analysed before spouting forth but then some people just cannot wait to put the boot in.

 

Not the JKB way. When the publication of the accounts was delayed - cue (quite accurate) speculation about the results and (quite unjustified) hysteria about the probable sinister reason for delay. Then Hearts publish a statement which, like all companies do, tries to put as positive slant on things as possible - cue synthetic shock and horror about how appalling the (predictable and predicted) results are. When the accounts are available - cue redoubling of synthetic shock, horror, etc.

[McJambo]

Can someone please confirm :

 

turnover up to ?10 million (pretty much maxed up , I would say)

 

but we spent ?12 million on players wages

 

we also pay ?4 million per season on interest (or , insert number of choice) to (insert name of choice) ?

 

Oh , and the directors didn't take a salary. Take a salary from what ? You can't get blood out of a stone.

 

Looks to me like some very lean times ahead on the playing/ managerial front.

 

Pretty sure Robinson was on a very high wage whilst he mismanaged the club into high levels of debt. Whereas at the moment although we are doing just as bad no one is getting paid (directly) from us.

 

Although Ukio/Ubig is probably benefitting in some way

[Cut The Crap]

Not the JKB way. When the publication of the accounts was delayed - cue (quite accurate) speculation about the results and (quite unjustified) hysteria about the probable sinister reason for delay. Then Hearts publish a statement which, like all companies do, tries to put as positive slant on things as possible - cue synthetic shock and horror about how appalling the (predictable and predicted) results are. When the accounts are available - cue redoubling of synthetic shock, horror, etc.

 

People are merely forming and expressing opinions based on information as it becomes available. Personally I don't see anything wrong with that. In fact, I'd say that is exactly what this forum is for?

[droid]

Pretty sure Robinson was on a very high wage whilst he mismanaged the club into high levels of debt. Whereas at the moment although we are doing just as bad no one is getting paid (directly) from us.

 

Although Ukio/Ubig is probably benefitting in some way

 

 

cetainly did and highest salary of all the chairmen in the spl if i remember correctly...and the fat bassa had the audacity to call us parasites!!!!

[pivotno1]

i dont think we will ever find out how much that rat took out the club,with his club credit cards paying for meals,petrol, ect,but thankfully his time ran out.

[Coco]

People are merely forming and expressing opinions based on information as it becomes available. Personally I don't see anything wrong with that. In fact, I'd say that is exactly what this forum is for?

 

There are some people who prefer to make snide remarks about other people rather than debate the issues.

 

A bit like this post.

 

I am still dumbfounded by the figures. I had people assuring me on this site that my suspicions about cash flow problems and cost cutting efforts - in January-February 2007 - were unfounded because the European games, more strip sales, Hartley sale, Pressley off the wage bill etc would mean revenue would be up substantially and costs down.

 

Quite stunning financial mismanagement. How many of the people who have got us into this financial mess are getting the sack?

[lost in leith]

Would be interested to see detail of turnover. Turnover for the year to 31/7/06 was was ?10.277m. Turnover for the year to 31/7/07 is ?10.32m.

 

The first year includes income from the Scottish Cup run, but the income from the second year should include increased commercial income, income from 3 big crowds for European games at Murrayfield and the Barca game.

 

I assume this announcement means that the accounts are on their way, so best to wait until they arrive. Once they do I'm sure Francis Albert can explain why everything in the garden is rosy and we've nothing to worry about

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

The revenue figures are the real surprise to me as well and I thought it would be the costs (on the costs, I still think the Kaunas wages were coming out of the club's account last year rather than being directly funded from Lithuania as they were in 2005-06) that would be harder to explain. Turnover has been almost static despite 3 30,000+ crowds for European games, full houses every week, merchandise increases etc. Questions need to be asked on that front.

 

Similarly, a question needs to be asked on when this debt for equity swap is planned. The interesting thing is, if it is approved, then Romanov/UBIG gets over 90% and can make the club his own private plaything (officially) for the first time. No need to worry about accounts and AGM's again.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

BTW, on the gain from player sales, was the Skacel sale included in the 2005-06 accounts, in which case in effect turnover outside the gain on player sales might have actually increased by around ?600K, since Skacel went for ?1.6m?

[Peebo]

The revenue figures are the real surprise to me as well and I thought it would be the costs (on the costs, I still think the Kaunas wages were coming out of the club's account last year rather than being directly funded from Lithuania as they were in 2005-06) that would be harder to explain. Turnover has been almost static despite 3 30,000+ crowds for European games, full houses every week, merchandise increases etc. Questions need to be asked on that front.

 

Perhaps the positives you list were countered by negatives - less revenue from cup games etc?

 

Assuming the auditors have acted competently, I would hope that the questions that need to be asked already have been.

[Peebo]

BTW, on the gain from player sales, was the Skacel sale included in the 2005-06 accounts, in which case in effect turnover outside the gain on player sales might have actually increased by around ?600K, since Skacel went for ?1.6m?

 

Skacel, if I recall correctly, was sold during the period covered by the previous annual statements.

[lost in leith]

Skacel, if I recall correctly, was sold during the period covered by the previous annual statements.

 

Correct.

[lost in leith]

Perhaps the positives you list were countered by negatives - less revenue from cup games etc?

 

Assuming the auditors have acted competently, I would hope that the questions that need to be asked already have been.

 

I would hope so too, but it's hard to believe that the reduction in income from Scottish Cup ties explains it all. We had 3 home ties in 2005/6, but a lot of ST holders had the cup top up so got in for free, and we had to give half of the receipts to the away teams. Total attendance for the European games was around 90,000. When you add in TV money and corporate income then it would be surprising if income from these games was less than ?2m.

[loveofthegame]

1 word: PROPOGANDA

[Peebo]

I would hope so too, but it's hard to believe that the reduction in income from Scottish Cup ties explains it all. We had 3 home ties in 2005/6, but a lot of ST holders had the cup top up so got in for free, and we had to give half of the receipts to the away teams. Total attendance for the European games was around 90,000. When you add in TV money and corporate income then it would be surprising if income from these games was less than ?2m.

 

Indeed. Without knowing the intricacies, and without wishing to focus solely on the Scottish Cup, I would guess that we also earned some not insubstantial revenues from the games at Hampden in 05-06.

 

Looking at the European games, only two games fell within the period covered by these latest results. Were either of them on TV? I cannot recall.

[Peebo]

1 word: PROPOGANDA

 

Absolutely. I have never read anything else when reading press releases regarding company accounts - and I've looked at a hell of a lot of them.

[lost in leith]

Indeed. Without knowing the intricacies, and without wishing to focus solely on the Scottish Cup, I would guess that we also earned some not insubstantial revenues from the games at Hampden in 05-06.

 

Looking at the European games, only two games fell within the period covered by these latest results. Were either of them on TV? I cannot recall.

 

 

D'h. Dates mixed up - home leg v Siroki was in the year to 31//706, away leg after. I'm sure the AEK game was on TV, and the biggest money spinner of the 3 (32,459 with tickets at ?35 for large sections of the ground and pretty serious corporate numbers).

[Peebo]

D'h. Dates mixed up - home leg v Siroki was in the year to 31//706, away leg after. I'm sure the AEK game was on TV, and the biggest money spinner of the 3 (32,459 with tickets at ?35 for large sections of the ground and pretty serious corporate numbers).

 

Yup, and no doubt it earned us a lot of revenue. I just wonder if it earned us huge sums more than the Scottish Cup semi-final vs Hibs, for example?

 

My general point was in response to a post from which I drew the inference that suspicions exist surrounding the latest reported turnover, in view of the the two seasons being discussed. Personally, I cannot see that there was a huge difference in terms of the potential of the 05/06 and 06/07 seasons bringing in money into the coffers.