Legally, how does a shopping centre parking ticket hold up?

[Paul_C]

Some of you may remember this thread from last October, I didn't see a need to start a new one unless I couldn't find it.

 

I've just had more correspondence regarding the above parking ticket, a debt collection agency have been in touch demanding ?75 from me, so I phoned for some "proper" legal advice and it turns out they have a case after all. I literally have 2 choices now, I can pay up and say "its a fair cop" (even although its supposed to be ok to park there later in the day when no buses are ever there and the rest of the car park is full), or I can wait and see if they carry on with legal proceedings which would cost me around another ?30 on top of the ?75.

 

I'm tempted to just pay the damn thing as I cant be arsed with the hassle, however the solicitor I spoke said that it could just be a threatening tactic that most people will see and just panic and pay up, and its probably just a numbers game.

 

I've also got to consider that in my line of work I cant afford any CCJ's in my name as it reflects very poorly on me, so quite a lot to think about.

 

As I said earlier in the thread CCJ's don't exist in Scotland. They CAN take you to a civil claims court but the cost of bringing the case, not just in monetary terms but in what they lose by having to draft the case and spend a day in court means they are highly unlikely to pursue a single ticket against 1 person. I saw you mentioned at the start they didnt supply photos, they legally don't have to take a picture of the ticket being served on the vehicle, only Council wardens have to do this. The Sheriff Officers will keep on pestering but as others have said, just stand firm. If you need any more info PM me....

[jambogaz1968]

Your taking this too far....... Ignore all letters ect and they Will go away "Honest"

give them nothing it is Total scare mongering!

they have not got a leg to stand on.

[jambogaz1968]

Now dont waste anymore space on this forum as we need it for "Where is this"?

[The Old Tolbooth]

I would speak to a Scottish solicitor and find out exactly your position. 75 quid is not a lot of money in the long run and if you need to have a good record in your job, having this against you will be more serious.

 

Anyway, what I don't get is why John Mitchell was so certain there would be no coaches in Livingston on a Friday afternoon: Livingston were playing Berwick Rangers the next day (1-1) and surely some of the Berwick lads would have wanted to make a weekend of it. Did you not think of that?

 

Their tandem was parked just to the side of my car, it had a ticket on it too

Ive just forwarded this thread to the security team at Mcarthur Glen Designer Outlet.

Damn, I keep misplacing my middle finger emoticon

[The Old Tolbooth]

As I said earlier in the thread CCJ's don't exist in Scotland. They CAN take you to a civil claims court but the cost of bringing the case, not just in monetary terms but in what they lose by having to draft the case and spend a day in court means they are highly unlikely to pursue a single ticket against 1 person. I saw you mentioned at the start they didnt supply photos, they legally don't have to take a picture of the ticket being served on the vehicle, only Council wardens have to do this. The Sheriff Officers will keep on pestering but as others have said, just stand firm. If you need any more info PM me....

Cheers for that Paul, do you think I should bother with the letter of appeal then?

Now dont waste anymore space on this forum as we need it for "Where is this"?

I'm not allowed to play anymore because Linda doesn't let me

[Gorgiewave]

Their tandem was parked just to the side of my car, it had a ticket on it too

 

One always gets a cheery, friendly reply from John Mitchell

[scott_jambo]

 

Damn, I keep misplacing my middle finger emoticon

 

 

[jambogaz1968]

Cheers for that Paul, do you think I should bother with the letter of appeal then?

 

I'm not allowed to play anymore because Linda doesn't let me

 

 

And why not?

[Guest juvehearts]

John,

 

ignore like the plague, you should have never contacted them

 

this company have been on watchdog more times than i cam remember within the last 5years

 

IIRC they cant legally charge you or fine you for parking anywhere as they dont own the carpark & it is not private property.

 

honestly mate,

 

anything you get from them ignore, ignore, ignore.

 

juve.

[Paul_C]

Cheers for that Paul, do you think I should bother with the letter of appeal then?

 

 

I don't think so John, they will just keep on sending you 14 day and 28 day letters again.

[The Old Tolbooth]

And why not?

I won a point one night that she said she knew and she went in the cream puff, so now I let her play it as it gives me peace and quiet, personally I'd dock her 5 points for bullying a former member

 

I don't think so John, they will just keep on sending you 14 day and 28 day letters again.

 

Cheers Paul, I was in two minds whether to post it as the letter would be like me admitting I was guilty and asking them to let me off, I claimed in the appeal that a parking attendant advised me it was ok to park there and that there was no ticket on my car when I came out and that the debt collection agency was the first I had heard of it

[Miller Jambo 60]

Who did you phone for "proper" legal advice?

 

I have had several of these. One was chased up by a debt collecting agency. Threatening that they would be visiting my house to see what items they can take to cover the cost of the ticket!!!

 

At the bottom it had details of how i could pay the fine in order to prevent this so called debt collector coming to my door!

 

Total scare mongering! Old people or vulnerable people get the letter and think oh no i better pay!!

 

Get yourself on the various help forums on the net. They will be able to give you the best advice.

 

 

Cant take goods from houses in Scotland, England and Wales, YES,

To cover other debts., Council tax etc, Car repo if payments on car are behind.

 

Doug.

[Deek]

John I dont know if you read the article that Boris posted.

 

"The contractor or the supermarket will require to prove, on the balance of probabilities, that you parked your car for over an agreed period and that you are somehow liable for their penalty. How can they do this when they cannot prove who was driving the car at the time?

 

"The driver is not obliged in law to provide driver details as this is not a criminal law matter and these people do not have the authority of the state to demand details of the driver."

 

End of story, they cant prove who parked the vehicle and dont have the powers to ask the owner who was.

 

Ignore them,if you have not posted that letter, rip it up.

[The Old Tolbooth]

John I dont know if you read the article that Boris posted.

 

"The contractor or the supermarket will require to prove, on the balance of probabilities, that you parked your car for over an agreed period and that you are somehow liable for their penalty. How can they do this when they cannot prove who was driving the car at the time?

 

"The driver is not obliged in law to provide driver details as this is not a criminal law matter and these people do not have the authority of the state to demand details of the driver."

 

End of story, they cant prove who parked the vehicle and dont have the powers to ask the owner who was.

 

Ignore them,if you have not posted that letter, rip it up.

Its already ripped mate

[Hannibal Lecter]

Am I the only one who thinks there's far too many disabled parking spaces at these places too? There's far more people with kids than there is disabled imo.

 

 

I would definitely disagree with you on that one. On a lot of occasions I can't get into a disabled space as they are all full when I have my dad with me, who has lost both his legs and in a wheelchair. Then there is the hassle of having to use a normal parking space as there isn't usually a lot of room to open the door wide enough for him to transfer on to his wheelchair.

 

It really gets my coat when you see people using disabled bays because there are no other close parking spaces and are just being too lazy. Leave these bays fot the people who really need them.

[Hannibal Lecter]

Seriously?? No way - having a child isn't a disability. It may be an inconvenience having to park in a non-parent and child parking space, but it hardly compares to being genuinely disabled, does it?

 

Exactly. When I have my dad in the car it is near impossible to park in an ordinary bay as there isn't enough room to open the door fully and let him get on to his chair. The only other option is to park over 2 spaces so he has enough room but then I risk getting a parking ticket because there were no disabled bays available which are wider and more suitable.

[Beats]

Just had a letter from some mob wanting ?60.Half if it's paid within 14 days.I was through with the bairn and parked at Asda at almondvale.I was 12 mins over the time.I honestly didn't even notice it.

 

Anyway it came in the birds name and she has sent a letter to them.See what happens.Not planning on paying it anyway.

[jambogaz1968]

Beats?? You thick ****

 

Do nothing I MEAN NOTHING!!!!!!!!!!!

[trotter]

As has been said many times, these are not enforceable. The parking 'regulations' such as they are is displayed that by reading the sign, you agree to their conditions. Now, breach of this contract is therefore dealt with under contract law, not criminal.

 

They are entitled to charge you for 'damages' to the value of you breaching the 'contract'. Now, can you justify ?20 as damages for the use of a parking space? The answer is if you look at all the factors. No, you can't.

 

Go to www.pepipoo.com for more information.

[allanio]

To my knowledge, there have only been two cases for this in Scotland. Both were successful in favour of the pursuers (the Car Park company). However, they were for large sums of money where the defender had, in effect, stuck two fingers up to the owners of the property and repeatedly parked there consistently over a period of time.

 

However, the risk that they will actually pursue such an amount through the courts is unlikely.

 

I would, however, take the 'legal advice' of people from an internet website with a very large pinch of salt.

[jambo 71]

I was at Almondvale Saturday past and although I didn't park in the coaches allocation, the place was jammed packed with cars and this was at 3pm and not a ticket enforcer in site!

[The Old Tolbooth]

I've further developments to report regarding this, it looks like these clowns mean business!

 

I've now been sent a letter from a solicitors office saying they intend to take legal action, if I don't adhere to this they could put a CCJ against my name, and in my line of work I cannot afford that to happen.

 

The letter states that it is a requirement to send a notice of intended litigation before legal proceedings are issued in the county court, and the costs are broken down as followed

 

Claim issue fee ?30

Solicitors cost for issuing claim ?50

Judgement costs ?25

Warrant issue fee ?100

Solicitors costs for issuing warrant ?2.25

 

Total cost is ?207.25 and a CCJ against my name if I don't cough up

 

Thoughts?

[moz]

I've further developments to report regarding this, it looks like these clowns mean business!

 

I've now been sent a letter from a solicitors office saying they intend to take legal action, if I don't adhere to this they could put a CCJ against my name, and in my line of work I cannot afford that to happen.

 

The letter states that it is a requirement to send a notice of intended litigation before legal proceedings are issued in the county court, and the costs are broken down as followed

 

Claim issue fee ?30

Solicitors cost for issuing claim ?50

Judgement costs ?25

Warrant issue fee ?100

Solicitors costs for issuing warrant ?2.25

 

Total cost is ?207.25 and a CCJ against my name if I don't cough up

 

Thoughts?

 

Tricky one mate.......especially having a CCJ against you...

I was reading with interest as the mother in law got a ticket down there for taking up 2 spaces, but this was when we had the snow and the snow was piled up covering half of one of the spaces....she has taken photos and sent them off.......will let you know the reply.....

[Beats]

I've further developments to report regarding this, it looks like these clowns mean business!

 

I've now been sent a letter from a solicitors office saying they intend to take legal action, if I don't adhere to this they could put a CCJ against my name, and in my line of work I cannot afford that to happen.

 

The letter states that it is a requirement to send a notice of intended litigation before legal proceedings are issued in the county court, and the costs are broken down as followed

 

Claim issue fee ?30

Solicitors cost for issuing claim ?50

Judgement costs ?25

Warrant issue fee ?100

Solicitors costs for issuing warrant ?2.25

 

Total cost is ?207.25 and a CCJ against my name if I don't cough up

 

Thoughts?

 

 

Offer to pay them ?1 a week

[The Old Tolbooth]

Tricky one mate.......especially having a CCJ against you...

I was reading with interest as the mother in law got a ticket down there for taking up 2 spaces, but this was when we had the snow and the snow was piled up covering half of one of the spaces....she has taken photos and sent them off.......will let you know the reply.....

Yeah that's what I was thinking too, I also notice there's a statement at the bottom of the letter saying that failure to pay will result in the bailiffs coming round and taking goods from my home, I'd like to see the feckers try! Also i'm pretty sure its illegal to do that under Scottish law.

 

I cant believe they issued a ticket to your mother in law under those circumstances, these jokers need to get a bloody life ffs! Good luck with it mate.

 

Offer to pay them ?1 a week

It crossed my mind mate, but I even grudge these parasites that much!!!

[Hannibal Lecter]

Yeah that's what I was thinking too, I also notice there's a statement at the bottom of the letter saying that failure to pay will result in the bailiffs coming round and taking goods from my home, I'd like to see the feckers try! Also i'm pretty sure its illegal to do that under Scottish law.

I cant believe they issued a ticket to your mother in law under those circumstances, these jokers need to get a bloody life ffs! Good luck with it mate.

 

 

It crossed my mind mate, but I even grudge these parasites that much!!!

 

 

I'm pretty sure you're right with this one.

 

Also any ideas how it works with regards to CCJs? As we don't have them up here.

[Moriarty]

the moral of the story is to just pay your fecking parking tickets if you park in the wrong place.

[chester copperpot]

the moral of the story is to just pay your fecking parking tickets if you park in the wrong place.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

No, the moral of the story is to not park where you're not supposed to. John, sorry to hear it's got this far mate, but you really would not have had this problem if you had parked in the correct area in the first place.

 

I still think the letter etc is a pile of pish, however the lesson to learn is to park in the correct bay allocated for your type of vehicle.

[The Old Tolbooth]

I'm pretty sure you're right with this one.

 

Also any ideas how it works with regards to CCJs? As we don't have them up here.

I'm actually beginning to quite enjoy the fight on this one now as I've just learned that the solicitors are breaching their code of practice by trying to pursue someone in Scotland through English law, and emails of complaint will be winging their way to them as they cannot do this, I'll be threatening them with reporting them to OFT and also the Credit Services Association mate.

 

Your spot on about the CCJ's too mate, they cant register this against me in Scotland from an English court room, I thought that this was the case but started to doubt myself as I started to think they may have a way around it, so double checked.

 

This could be fun telling English lawyers to ram it!

[The Old Tolbooth]

the moral of the story is to just pay your fecking parking tickets if you park in the wrong place.

 

 

No, the moral of the story is to not park where you're not supposed to. John, sorry to hear it's got this far mate, but you really would not have had this problem if you had parked in the correct area in the first place.

 

I still think the letter etc is a pile of pish, however the lesson to learn is to park in the correct bay allocated for your type of vehicle.

Ah, but that part of the car park is supposed to be used when the rest of the car park is full (as it was on that day), and thus I have since learned that I was in fact breaking no rules whatsoever.

 

Get it up ye's!

[Hannibal Lecter]

I'm actually beginning to quite enjoy the fight on this one now as I've just learned that the solicitors are breaching their code of practice by trying to pursue someone in Scotland through English law, and emails of complaint will be winging their way to them as they cannot do this, I'll be threatening them with reporting them to OFT and also the Credit Services Association mate.

 

Your spot on about the CCJ's too mate, they cant register this against me in Scotland from an English court room, I thought that this was the case but started to doubt myself as I started to think they may have a way around it, so double checked.

 

This could be fun telling English lawyers to ram it!

 

 

Ah, but that part of the car park is supposed to be used when the rest of the car park is full (as it was on that day), and thus I have since learned that I was in fact breaking no rules whatsoever.

 

Get it up ye's!

 

 

From what you've said it appears you could be in the right so don't back down on it mate.

 

As for the CCJ's I thought that was the case so keep fighting with them. I'd be interested to hear what happens next.

[rdewar42]

What a pathetic defence.. They should have clamped the lot of you parking in the coach spaces.

 

There's always one!

 

A promising career as a traffic warden awaits you, Mr.G.

[The Doctor]

Stick with it John, you've got them by the nuts, they're bluffing.

 

Mind you, it's not my reputation or my business that's at risk...

 

I would be exactly where you are though. I still have a ticket in the door pocket of my car from a private firm which I ignored and I never heard a thing, that was about 18 months ago.

 

Stick it to the man!

[jambogaz1968]

People shiting themself's

 

That's why these jokers are still in buisness.......

[The Old Tolbooth]

Stick with it John, you've got them by the nuts, they're bluffing.

 

Mind you, it's not my reputation or my business that's at risk...

 

I would be exactly where you are though. I still have a ticket in the door pocket of my car from a private firm which I ignored and I never heard a thing, that was about 18 months ago.

 

Stick it to the man!

Cheers Doc, I spoke to someone who couldn't even speak English and hadn't a clue about Scottish law, I told him that his company were breaking the law by threatening to send the bailiffs in to take my stuff away, and also by threatening CCJ's which don't even exist in Scotland, then guy couldn't answer me! I also told them I would be reporting them to OFT and the Credit Services Association for breaching the debt collection guidance.

 

The guy then said he would pass my comments onto the proper person to deal with this and I would receive a phone call back because I made it an official complaint.

 

Then I contacted the debt recovery company and told them exactly the same thing that they had to pursue me through a Scottish court and couldn't do it through an English court etc, and to back off or I would be reporting them too, the guy (who could speak perfect English this time) hadn't a clue what to say to me either, fingers crossed they wont bug me again but if they do I have the proper people ton report them to.

 

People shiting themself's

 

That's why these jokers are still in buisness.......

Exactly my thinking too mate, parasites!

[Jambo83]

I had a similar problem about 18 months ago for parking in the flats behind the Shandon.

 

Luckily enough, my pal's boyfriend is a Barrister and he drafted two letters for me to send (by recorded delivery) to both the parking company's solicitors and also the debt collectors who got involved.

 

As soon as they received my letters they just gave up and told me the issue was now considered closed.

 

If you want me to send you one of the letters i'm sure i've still got a copy on my work p.c mate

[Jambo83]

P.S What were the names of the parking company and solicitors?

 

I can't remember the name of the parking company but the solicitor was called Graham White i'm sure. The same names kept coming up on google searches for similar incidents

[southside1874]

When I stayed up the southside I parked in Homebase carpark now and then. I received these tickets all the time and took them of my car and dropped them on the ground where i was parked. I don't think I ever got a letter. You see, I'm not sure the DVLA can tell these folk your address from the info they give, your registration number. I'm pretty sure its only the police or local councils that can get that info. So if you don't tell them, no one else will

[The Old Tolbooth]

P.S What were the names of the parking company and solicitors?

 

I can't remember the name of the parking company but the solicitor was called Graham White i'm sure. The same names kept coming up on google searches for similar incidents

That's exactly the solicitor who is chasing me mate, I took great delight in spelling out Scottish law to them this afternoon!

 

If you could send me the letters please mate it would be greatly appreciated, I'll PM you my email addy

 

Cheers for that

 

EDIT: I've actually found your email address and sent you an email mate, cheers again.

[Beats]

That's exactly the solicitor who is chasing me mate, I took great delight in spelling out Scottish law to them this afternoon!

 

If you could send me the letters please mate it would be greatly appreciated, I'll PM you my email addy

 

Cheers for that

 

EDIT: I've actually found your email address and sent you an email mate, cheers again.

 

I've not heard back from them.Sent a letter telling them to beat it a couple of weeks back.

 

They can go and get messed.

 

 

Edit: I never said go and get messed i said go and get messed

 

2nd Edit: Forget it

[Carl Fredrickson]

John

You should also check out the Law Societys website and the Law Society of Scotlands website.

 

If you think the Solicitor is acting unethically or outside the law, there may be a complaints procedure....

[The Old Tolbooth]

I've not heard back from them.Sent a letter telling them to beat it a couple of weeks back.

 

They can go and get messed.

 

 

Edit: I never said go and get messed i said go and get messed

 

2nd Edit: Forget it

Cobra or Peroni?

 

John

You should also check out the Law Societys website and the Law Society of Scotlands website.

 

If you think the Solicitor is acting unethically or outside the law, there may be a complaints procedure....

I took advice on that one too mate, apparently making a phone call to them to let them know "I'm onto them" is enough normally to scare these pesky little cretins off, next stage if they keep hassling me will be actually reporting it

[Beats]

Cobra or Peroni?

 

 

I took advice on that one too mate, apparently making a phone call to them to let them know "I'm onto them" is enough normally to scare these pesky little cretins off, next stage if they keep hassling me will be actually reporting it

 

******* cheek

[The Old Tolbooth]

******* cheek

Must be Efes or wine then

[Beats]

Must be Efes or wine then

 

That is a shocking thing to say John.

 

 

Ok might have had a couple earlier

[championsleaguefan]

They have no way to find out who you are or where you live. They would need access to PNC and they don't have that. The only way they would get your address is if you write to them so just keep stoom and they will give up.

[Paul_C]

They have no way to find out who you are or where you live. They would need access to PNC and they don't have that. The only way they would get your address is if you write to them so just keep stoom and they will give up.

 

Am afraid that's not right.

 

The DVLA will give out the registered keepers details of a car to any parking company (private or local authority) who are registered with the British Parking Association and are part of their Approved Operators Scheme.

 

In fact, they don't just give out your details, they sell them as each company has to pay for every trace they send to Swansea.

[The Old Tolbooth]

They have no way to find out who you are or where you live. They would need access to PNC and they don't have that. The only way they would get your address is if you write to them so just keep stoom and they will give up.

They got my details no problem and sent stuff to my personal address mate, all from my registration number.

[jambogaz1968]

The dvla sell info to them for a pound

[Jambo83]

That's exactly the solicitor who is chasing me mate, I took great delight in spelling out Scottish law to them this afternoon!

 

If you could send me the letters please mate it would be greatly appreciated, I'll PM you my email addy

 

Cheers for that

 

EDIT: I've actually found your email address and sent you an email mate, cheers again.

 

Sorry mate, not been on here for a few days. I will check my work p.c tomorrow and send you on a copy of the letter for you to amend as/if necessary. I can GUARANTEE you they will drop the case like a hot potato, it was a ??? an hour advocate who drafted it for me (free of charge of course)