Remember back to this time last year & all the talk of boycotts etc

[Guest casper]

Perfectly calm, thanks. Enjoying a good debate if that's alright with you.

 

In what way did Romanov get a jolt?

 

I've already stated the names of his targets, his mistakes and the time lines involved that resutled in the appointment of Csaba. I think I've clearly pointed out that the intention to get a manager was always there from Jan 1st 2008.

 

If you don't like debate, then stay out of this. You offer nothing here.

 

 

 

 

Buffalo Bill

 

.

 

Your timelines are not in dispute.

What was in dispute at the time was if the manager, whether it was McGhee, Csaba or anybody else, was going to be allowed to do his job.

This, despite the promise, was never that clear given the previous 2 years managment, and McGhee walking away so suddenly only increased the

scepticism that any manager would get full autonomy as some believed that it was because he saw told he would not have full control.

[Buffalo Bill]

your a bitter person ,i dont appreciate your last sentence one bit ....

 

yet another example of your holier than thou persona

 

 

 

il let the others carry on the debate as im not resorting to a slanging match with ones ego the size of a house

 

 

 

oh and please reduce the photograph of the kid in your stuff,im sure it aint good for the server

 

In what way am I bitter? I'm perfecty happy thanks, and enjoying posting on this thread, writing my bit and reading the opinions of others.

 

You don't appreciate my sentence?

 

Well I didn't appreciate your attack on me.

 

I've never once claimed to be 'holier than thou'. I'm always happy to discuss and debate, even if I'm proved to be wrong. I've even conceded a point on this thread to JR. He was right and I agreed with what he had to say. I've disagreed with JR loads of times but I respect his right to an opinion.

 

You don't seem to respect my right to mine.

 

Your opinion of my ego is just another insult, and again - it offers nothing to this debate. I would suggest that it is you who is bitter, on this occasion.

 

And if you've got a problem with my picture: report me to the Mods.

 

 

Best regards,

 

 

 

Buffalo Bill

 

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[Jammy T]

Whatever you say about Romanov he has caused a massive divide between fans of Hearts. This of itself is not a good thing.

 

For my part I can see why people hate him and I can see why people are less fussed or at least try and put him to one side

 

By the same token I can see that those that renewed were providing valuable support and cash to the club, equally I can see entirely why there was a chunky amount of people at the end of their tether and either 1. simply not prepared to go back at the time, or 2. try and send a message to Vlad in the only way it appeared to have a chance of success - financially

 

The reality is that neither camp, I think, can proclaim to be the victors - and neither should attempt to really.

 

I'd imagine that were there to never have been any sign of discontinent amongst Hearts fans over the last 18 months I doubt Csaba would be here and I doubt we'd have anything other than a puppet manager.

 

For Romanov to change he, or somebody in a position of influence somewhere, must have realised a number of things were at breaking point. The league placing might be one, finance would be another, but the backing of fans, or otherwise, has to come into it as it, by default impacts upon finance, and arguably the performance of the team also.

 

So a pragmatic way to look at it could be as follows

 

The still sizeable season ticket renewal proved and convinced that there was sufficient backing financially for Hearts to remain a worthy business, but the drop from previous seasons and murmur of discontent in the background helped convince that things needed to be changed on the football side of the club

 

I refuse to believe that Romanov woke up on 1 January a changed man as regards how he wanted things done, and I refuse to believe he took that decision in complete isolation of everything else going on

[Guest JamboRobbo]

The fact is JR, the club put this statement out on their website as they felt they had McGhee in the bag. Either way, I'm sure we all agree now that Csaba is allowed, under that banner, to be left to get on with his job.

 

I agree, people were probably weary of the statement and that's their choice. I also think people have the right not to re-new.

 

But if managerial autonomy is the one reason why folk didn't re-new: then why now, when we all know Csaba is his own man, did we only get 13,000 v Killie on Saturday?

 

Buffalo Bill

 

.

 

Because once the habit is broken, people will find a new vice.

 

That is why it was so frustrating to me.

 

We had such an opportunity. We had people hooked. Tynie was as good as sold out every week for almost 2 seasons. I think that was down to a new owner coming in, and something different happening. Something a lot of us had never seen before. People "believed" in HMFC.

 

Despite all the good that Csaba has done (and I think he's done an amazing job), it'll take a lot of time to build that belief again.

[Buffalo Bill]

Casper,

 

 

I accept your scepticisim, but McGhee made it clear that going to Hearts was never the problem: it was leaving Motherwell.

 

Hearts made the mistake of allowing him to travel alone. If someone like Ogilvie had escorted him to Lithuania then I believe he would've been the next Hearts manager. McGhee was full of praise for Hearts in the summer.

 

But again, I ask: why was there only 13,000 there on Saturday?

 

 

Coco suggests the economy and entertainment. Little to do with 'autonomy'.

 

 

 

Buffalo Bill

 

.

[bigandy]

buffalo why dont you just calm down chief,the fact is that romanov got a jolt from the non `real fans` last season.........you and your mob should now accept that

 

 

like it or leave it,please stop stirring the pot

 

 

accept closure on the matter,its gone

 

 

a horrible chapter that has now moved on thanks to those who said no with their integrity and hard earned money

 

I'm not sure what mob you think Buffalo Bill belongs to? He certainly isnt one of the posters on here who blindly follows everything Romanov says or does. Certainly this time last year BB was posting on here criticising the way things were happening at Tynecastle.

 

At the end of the day we got what we all (we being Hearts fans) wanted - a proper manager appointed with control over the footballing side of things. As admitted by BB the club/Romanov made a shop front of getting to that point but we got there eventually. I dont personaly think that the non renewal of season tickets made much or any difference as Romanov has shown no signs that he listens to or bows to pressure from anyone. Lets just be happy that we are where we are now rather than where we were 12 months ago.

[Buffalo Bill]

Because once the habit is broken, people will find a new vice.

 

That is why it was so frustrating to me.

 

We had such an opportunity. We had people hooked. Tynie was as good as sold out every week for almost 2 seasons. I think that was down to a new owner coming in, and something different happening. Something a lot of us had never seen before. People "believed" in HMFC.

 

Despite all the good that Csaba has done (and I think he's done an amazing job), it'll take a lot of time to build that belief again.

 

 

I agree with all of this, JR.

 

I know we both hope that one day, Tynecastle will be brimming again.

 

For that, we need great results.

 

 

Buffalo Bill

 

.

[Jammy T]

 

But again, I ask: why was there only 13,000 there on Saturday?

 

 

.

 

Its fairly simple - the way Romanov had run things for the previous two seasons and the impact this had on the quality of football

 

It isnt simply because we were 8th. There was more to it than that. The enjoyment had gone out of the game for a lot of people - complete disenfranchising from the team, the way the club was run etc

 

There was no obvious sign that things would change. For somebody to cough up a few hundred quid to be ****ed off every second Saturday was a lot to ask.

 

There was nothing to suggest it was going to change - we had had about 3 world wide manager searches over the previous 2 seasons without anything other than Kaunas patsies coming on board.

 

This season was make or break. Csaba was the appointment needed to convince our fans AND everyone else in football that the managers job at Hearts was worthy of the title any more

 

I said this at the time of his appointment and I stick to it now. No matter if Csaba leaves, as long as it is not through Romanov madness, the job will now have a bit more trust - both amongst our own fans and amongst potential applicants.

 

That is the most important thing from this season IMO

[deejtee]

Everything still black and white to some people. Firstly things have been much worse than last season in previous eras. Secondly this year is not fabulous but is much better. I think Vlad had to change things because he is a business man who realised he had got things wrong and one of his companies was losing money and taking big backward steps. I don't agree with the people who feel they achieved anything by their stances. One simple fact is the club needs our support to survive and compete at as high a level as possible. Surely we should be able to sell out our home games until the end of the season and anyone who has the option of going and does not is not a "real fan" irrespective of their views on Vlad.

[Ryan Gosling]

I honestly believe if Phil O'Donnell was still alive, Mark McGhee would be our manager.

[topcat]

your a bitter person ,i dont appreciate your last sentence one bit ....

 

yet another example of your holier than thou persona

 

il let the others carry on the debate as im not resorting to a slanging match with ones ego the size of a house

 

oh and please reduce the photograph of the kid in your stuff,im sure it aint good for the server

 

 

It is not often that I agree with the above poster and indeed there have been times when I've wondered whether they are in fact a hobo, a victim of a childhood brain injury or just someone who was home educated by a ****** of junkie baboons in Methil but like the jests of the majzub there are the occasional grains of truth in his demented ravings. He speaks sagely on the matter of the photo in your signature.

[Victorian]

Casper,

 

 

I accept your scepticisim, but McGhee made it clear that going to Hearts was never the problem: it was leaving Motherwell.

 

Hearts made the mistake of allowing him to travel alone. If someone like Ogilvie had escorted him to Lithuania then I believe he would've been the next Hearts manager. McGhee was full of praise for Hearts in the summer.

 

But again, I ask: why was there only 13,000 there on Saturday?

 

 

Coco suggests the economy and entertainment. Little to do with 'autonomy'.

 

 

Buffalo Bill

 

.

 

BB, regarding the missing numbers from our gates... i suspect that there was a significant element who might be described as 'glory hunters' who joined the ranks of season ticket holders in 2005/2006. people who were latent hearts fans but did not attend the games. at some point during the past couple of seasons, i again suspect that a couple of thousand of them have realised that hearts are not going to be the de facto 3rd member of the old firm and winning leagues and cups every year, and have since taken the opportunity to return to their previous status of being non-attending fans. there is a possibility that some of these used the romanov interference issue as a convenient excuse to do give up their season tickets.

 

i don't think there's a big element of regular season ticket holders (before 2005/2006) who are still staying away.

[Chad Sexington]

It is not often that I agree with the above poster and indeed there have been times when I've wondered whether they are in fact a hobo, a victim of a childhood brain injury or just someone who was home educated by a ****** of junkie baboons in Methil but like the jests of the majzub there are the occasional grains of truth in his demented ravings. He speaks sagely on the matter of the photo in your signature.

 

[Buffalo Bill]

Its fairly simple - the way Romanov had run things for the previous two seasons and the impact this had on the quality of football

 

It isnt simply because we were 8th. There was more to it than that. The enjoyment had gone out of the game for a lot of people - complete disenfranchising from the team, the way the club was run etc

 

There was no obvious sign that things would change. For somebody to cough up a few hundred quid to be ****ed off every second Saturday was a lot to ask.

 

There was nothing to suggest it was going to change - we had had about 3 world wide manager searches over the previous 2 seasons without anything other than Kaunas patsies coming on board.

 

This season was make or break. Csaba was the appointment needed to convince our fans AND everyone else in football that the managers job at Hearts was worthy of the title any more

 

I said this at the time of his appointment and I stick to it now. No matter if Csaba leaves, as long as it is not through Romanov madness, the job will now have a bit more trust - both amongst our own fans and amongst potential applicants.

 

That is the most important thing from this season IMO

 

OK Jammy T, I'll try and make this my last post on this subject as so not to over-egg the pudding.

 

What you're saying is entirely true, and last summer, I was bored stiff with everything to do with Hearts and Romanov.

 

But that's just it. Your post makes sense, but more-so had it been written last summer.

 

What about now: April 2008 with Hearts gunning for Europe? The football isn't half as bad as folk make our either.

 

What about gaps in the stands for the up-coming Celtic game?

 

The credit crunch is one thing: but wanting a manager in full control makes no sense to me now: because quite simply, we have one!!

 

Yes, Vlad made a mess of 2006-2008 but as a suporter of a football team, I like to live in the present day.

 

 

 

Buffalo Bill

 

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[Guest casper]

Casper,

 

 

I accept your scepticisim, but McGhee made it clear that going to Hearts was never the problem: it was leaving Motherwell.

 

Hearts made the mistake of allowing him to travel alone. If someone like Ogilvie had escorted him to Lithuania then I believe he would've been the next Hearts manager. McGhee was full of praise for Hearts in the summer.

 

But again, I ask: why was there only 13,000 there on Saturday?

 

 

Coco suggests the economy and entertainment. Little to do with 'autonomy'.

 

 

 

Buffalo Bill

 

.

 

If McGhee needed a minder then maybe he wasn't the right man for the job anyway. Csaba has done a good job considering where we were last season.

There are numerous reasons why the stands are not full as others have said. Another could be that although we have been winning games some of the football has been dire or that there is still a deep distrust of romanov.

Csaba has made mistakes too. Playing Eggart up front in the cup game was one of them.

There is a big closed season coming up. With all the rumours of players leaving in January it could all happen in the summer. Let's hope Csaba can continue doing his job in deciding who comes and goes.

[Buffalo Bill]

If McGhee needed a minder then maybe he wasn't the right man for the job anyway. Csaba has done a good job considering where we were last season.

There are numerous reasons why the stands are not full as others have said. Another could be that although we have been winning games some of the football has been dire or that there is still a deep distrust of romanov.

Csaba has made mistakes too. Playing Eggart up front in the cup game was one of them.

There is a big closed season coming up. With all the rumours of players leaving in January it could all happen in the summer. Let's hope Csaba can continue doing his job in deciding who comes and goes.

 

Fair points, all.

 

 

I would love to see Tynecastle full again, watching a good Hearts team.

 

 

Buffalo Bill

 

.

[Jammy T]

What you're saying is entirely true, and last summer, I was bored stiff with everything to do with Hearts and Romanov.

 

But that's just it. Your post makes sense, but more-so had it been written last summer.

 

What about now: April 2008 with Hearts gunning for Europe? The football isn't half as bad as folk make our either.

 

What about gaps in the stands for the up-coming Celtic game?

 

.

 

It comes back to what JR says I think

 

There was a new dawn 4 years ago. Everyone at the club at the time - I include Romanov, Burley AND Anderton - hit the bullseye with the way they maximised it.

 

But this was a once in a generation opportunity and it was royally ****ed on from about 6 months in.

 

Once you lose people who bought into the original goodwill and feelgood it is near impossible to get all of them back. That is partly why it has been so frustrating to see Romanov look as if he was doing everything possible to ensure no season tickets were renewed.

 

That said we are still averaging our biggest crowds in the modern era.

 

Its a great platform to build on - it just might not happen as quickly as it did first time round

[Frankenstein Jambo.]

No offence Shaun but many on here can't see you as a genuine Hearts fan. Your association with the press, however tentative, also puts people against you. Many see you as a stirrer and wonder why you take the trouble to post on here so much.This I think prompted the comment from Chad. Many agreed something had to be done, but someone from so far away was not the right way to go about it. My personal opinion about you comes from your defence of certain journolists, who appear to be on Hearts side, but it was proved that they too jump on the band wagon and stick the boot in, if it means they sell papers.

 

Excuse me? Who voted and made you the voice of many kickbackers? Can you please name these many kickbackers because i certainaly am not.

 

Before you start spouting pish please think about what you post before posting it. I Actually like shaun and respect what he says.

[Guest JamboRobbo]

I agree with all of this, JR.

 

I know we both hope that one day, Tynecastle will be brimming again.

 

For that, we need great results.

 

 

Buffalo Bill

 

.

 

Agreed mate.

 

p.s. For great results, we need a manager.

[jambovambo]

Group hug, anyone ?

 

I was one who was part of the meetings to discuss what needed to be done ... when we were managerless for months etc ... and at that time, things were very grim.

 

There's no sense in people being revisionist and saying "bah, I trusted Vlad (!) all along and knew he'd get it right - he just needed time" - that's simply not the case.

 

Hats off to Csaba for doing a great job so far.

 

Hats off to the team for their league position - much better than I feared.

 

And hats off to Vlad for apparently keeping his nose out of things.

 

I said at that time that I feared the worst. I'm happy to say things are much better now.

[topcat]

Actually gates don't seem too bad when viewed from a historical perspective.

 

Home League Gates against Kilmarnock Since they got promoted.

Games with a bigger gate than last saturday in bold.

 

Ranking in Brackets.

 

18 Sep 1993: 8,309 (30)

22 Jan 1994: 9,204 (27)

 

24 Sep 1994: 9,302 (25)

11 Feb 1995: 8,374 (29)

 

11 Nov 1995: 10,442 (20)

27 Apr 1996: 11,329 (16)

 

17 Aug 1996: 10,854 (18)

08 Feb 1997: 11,020 (17)

 

23 Nov 1997: 16,015 (5)

14 Mar 1998: 15,338 (6)

 

07 Nov 1998: 14,363 (8)

03 Apr 1999: 14,689 (7)

 

27 Oct 1999: 12,541 (13)

26 Feb 2000: 14,243 (10)

 

24 Sep 2000: 10,379 (22)

14 Mar 2001: 9,195 (28)

 

15 Dec 2001: 10,027 (24)

 

31 Aug 2002: 11,912 (14)

 

08 Feb 2003: 10,426 (21)

13 Dec 2003: 10,154 (23)

 

21 Aug 2004: 11,403 (15)

12 Feb 2005: 9,220 (26)

 

26 Oct 2005: 16,536 (3)

15 Apr 2006: 16,497 (4)

 

21 Oct 2006: 16,849 (2)

07 Apr 2007: 17,019 (1)

 

05 Jan 2008: 14,346 (9)

10 May 2008: 10,512 (19)

 

04 Oct 2008: 13,189 (12)

04 Apr 2009: 13,659 (11)

 

Note that the two Scottish cup attendances were lower still

05 Feb 2005: 10,308

07 Jan 2006: 12,831

[jaminetime]

happy birthday craigieboy, all together guys, happy birthday to u,happy birthday to u,

[Coco]

Anyone think that the empty corporate seats are due to the lack of management autonomy?

[bighalders]

Right.

 

 

So, then we have a manager, and he's getting on with his job.

 

That was what we were promised and that's what we got.

 

 

Buffalo Bill

 

.

 

I am as delighted as anyone at the success Csaba has made of things. However although Hearts were looking for a manager and got the right one in Csaba it was not down to any strategy it was luck, Csaba was never on the radar until everone else had turned the job down, Vlad and the board don't deserve any credit here at all, Csaba does though.

[Geoff Kilpatrick]

I think those throwing brickbats should be thankful that this thread can exist at all. After all, at this time last year, we were an utter shambles and people were extremely p*ssed off.

[PresidentRomanov]

I am as delighted as anyone at the success Csaba has made of things. However although Hearts were looking for a manager and got the right one in Csaba it was not down to any strategy it was luck, Csaba was never on the radar until everone else had turned the job down, Vlad and the board don't deserve any credit here at all, Csaba does though.

 

Mr Romanov appointed Csaba, your post is completely nonsensical.

[Victorian]

Mr Romanov appointed Csaba, your post is completely nonsensical.

i think you're wasting your time trying to point that out mate, some people are determined that romanov should never ever get any credit for appointing csaba.

[Chad Sexington]

I am as delighted as anyone at the success Csaba has made of things. However although Hearts were looking for a manager and got the right one in Csaba it was not down to any strategy it was luck, Csaba was never on the radar until everone else had turned the job down, Vlad and the board don't deserve any credit here at all, Csaba does though.

 

So Csaba just walked in off the street and asked to be manager?

 

The board and Romanov didn't source him? Interview him? Fund his appointment?

 

Jesus! Some folk are so wrapped up in their hatred for Romanov that they are as bitter and deluded as any hobo.

[PresidentRomanov]

i think you're wasting your time trying to point that out mate, some people are determined that romanov should never ever get any credit for appointing csaba.

 

Either that, or they're just thick

[Jammy T]

I seem to recall Romanov had already contacted Csaba within 6 months (either before or after) of us playing Ferencvaros - possibly to replace Burley or to replace Robbo

 

Cant remember, but Csaba had been on the radar previously

 

So, I dont even begrudgingly say that Romanov should be credited with sourcing Csaba - it might be luck that he has done well in the SPL but Csaba has something and Romanov clearly saw it

 

So we can say that it appears that Romanov gets 1 in every 8 management appointments right. Whoopeee

 

(that's a wee joke by the way....)

[Dusk_Till_Dawn]

The trouble with Romanov is that sneaky feeling in the back of your mind that something could kick off at any moment.

[leginten]

I think it was a pretty good idea to get in a manager.

 

Agreed. I think it's those in the "we don't need a manager" and "I don't care what kind of management set-up we have as long as it works" camps who ought to be feeling a bit sheepish at the moment. As well as those who insisted that having a manager was so last-century, obviously. In fact the list of things for certain parties to feel sheepish about is so long that it would takes several threads to deal with it, so maybe this isn't the place to discuss the Pyramid and the "We have no debt, stupid" lobby.

 

I think the January 1st statement - an acknowledgement that Romanov's methods had failed spectacularly - was issued to pre-empt the de facto pressure group which was starting to emerge anyway - the group that was beginning to vote with its feet and stay away. There's a limit to how long people will find someone like Kurskis amusing. I've no doubt merchandise sales dropped too. And there was the drastically early season-ticket launch. Someone within Romanov's inner circle either upped his medication or got him to see sense.

 

People who talked of boycotts/action groups/protests? They're maybe about 99th in the silliness list for 2005-9.

[Sherlock]

I can't believe this pish has got to 4 pages.

 

What was the point of this thread? We're sitting third going into the split so lets go back to the hatkicker/vlad-sheep days?

[Feeno]

The trouble with Romanov is that sneaky feeling in the back of your mind that something could kick off at any moment.

 

Daily Record post imo

[PresidentRomanov]

Hearts fans fickle?

 

Never