These 'Firesale' rumours (merged threads)

[Walter Bishop]

What is it? Are we doomed and heading for oblivion or are we suffering a minor blip and will recover and keep hold of our "better players"?

 

Personally i think Vlad`s reign is coming to an end.

[Dr. Bapswent]

What is it? Are we doomed and heading for oblivion or are we suffering a minor blip and will recover and keep hold of our "better players"?

 

Personally i think Vlad`s reign is coming to an end.

 

Which would you prefer.

 

I get the feeling the more fire and brimstone the better for the likes of you.

[jamboinglasgow]

in the long time we are fine, it is just we may lose some good players in the short run, but we should be running at a profit and could be debt free within 3 years.

[Charlie-Brown]

Ubig can't or won't subsidise further losses, the wage bill will be reduced by selling/releasing players, Hearts will continue, stabilise & recover.

[Rods]

Ubig can't or won't subsidise further losses, the wage bill will be reduced by selling/releasing players, Hearts will continue, stabilise & recover.

 

that is pretty much the way I see it

 

I am hoping though that this is the end for the mad one and somebody buys him out

[boabyarsebiscuit]

that is pretty much the way I see it

 

I am hoping though that this is the end for the mad one and somebody buys him out

 

Sadly, I think any buyers would rather deal with Administrators than the mad fud. But you never know.

[Big Broon]

I'm hoping that there will be some stabilization after january, hopefully with an owners statement, including realistic intentions/targets, whether or not we can hold on to some of our better players or not is yet to be seen, but if it is their wages that are bleeding the funds it is the only way to move forward. It sticks in my throat a wee bit that season ticket non-renewers, glory hunters or disenchanted fans, think that not renewing is affecting VR, when in fact empty seats affect the players and the imposing atmosphere at tynecastle. Back the team

[Martin_T]

Where exactly are they all coming from? It would seem to me that the source they are being most actively promoted on is JKB.

 

There are 3 things that have led to these rumours in my opinion:

 

-Hearts delayed and late payment of players wages/ creditors

-Campbell Ogilvies stated aim that for long term sustainability the club has to reduce the wage bill to 50% of turnover

-Fears over the impact the credit crunch has had on UBIG/ Ukio Bankas

 

This has led people to speculate that the club has to sell everything that isn't nailed down in order to improve cash flow and reduce the wage bill. As usual with KB, there is probably some element of truth, but I really doubt the situation is as extreme as many are suggesting.

 

Quite apart from anything else, it is very doubtful that the club will receive 10 'acceptable' offers for some of the players being speculated about. HMFC are not the only football club affected by the credit crunch, and even many clubs in the EPL have publicised that they are going to have to sell before they buy this January. In our own league, Rangers have openly admitted they are in the same situation.

 

History has shown us that an 'acceptable' price for Romanov, tends to be fairly pricey. It is naieve in the extreme to think that a man of his standing will not have salted away considerable personal wealth, so even if UBIG are in trouble, I severely doubt will allow his playing assets to be sold off on the cheap. Are there clubs out there who would both want to and have the capability to buy our players? There wont be many. When Csaba was asked about players leaving in a recent press conference, his reply was that it will be on Hearts terms.

 

I don't claim to have inside contacts or information, but I know one thing for certain, ill informed speculation is doing nothing to help the club.

[Drylaw Hearts]

Where exactly are they all coming from? It would seem to me that the source they are being most actively promoted on is JKB.

 

There are 3 things that have led to these rumours in my opinion:

 

-Hearts delayed and late payment of players wages/ creditors

-Campbell Ogilvies stated aim that for long term sustainability the club has to reduce the wage bill to 50% of turnover

-Fears over the impact the credit crunch has had on UBIG/ Ukio Bankas

 

This has led people to speculate that the club has to sell everything that isn't nailed down in order to improve cash flow and reduce the wage bill. As usual with KB, there is probably some element of truth, but I really doubt the situation is as extreme as many are suggesting.

 

Quite apart from anything else, it is very doubtful that the club will receive 10 'acceptable' offers for some of the players being speculated about. HMFC are not the only football club affected by the credit crunch, and even many clubs in the EPL have publicised that they are going to have to sell before they buy this January. In our own league, Rangers have openly admitted they are in the same situation.

 

History has shown us that an 'acceptable' price for Romanov, tends to be fairly pricey. It is naieve in the extreme to think that a man of his standing will not have salted away considerable personal wealth, so even if UBIG are in trouble, I severely doubt will allow his playing assets to be sold off on the cheap. Are there clubs out who would both want to and have the capability to buy our players? There wont be many. When Csaba was asked about players leaving in a recent press conference, his reply was that it will be on Hearts terms.

 

I don't claim to have inside contacts or information, but I know one thing for certain, ill informed speculation is doing nothing to help the club.

 

How do you know it's 'ill informed specualtion' ?

[Martin_T]

How do you know it's 'ill informed specualtion' ?

 

Because in most cases it seems to be based on hearsay and conjecture. Take Colonel Kurtz' thread earlier today, it was based on his opinion, nothing more.

 

Sadly it is in the mentality of many Hearts supporters, including yourself DH, to always fully embrace the very worst case scenario.

[Johanes de Silentio]

I asked this question on another thread today. I was told that these rumours emanate from staff in the McLeod Street offices.

 

Not good.

[Guest jambomickey]

Where exactly are they all coming from? It would seem to me that the source they are being most actively promoted on is JKB.

 

There are 3 things that have led to these rumours in my opinion:

 

-Hearts delayed and late payment of players wages/ creditors

-Campbell Ogilvies stated aim that for long term sustainability the club has to reduce the wage bill to 50% of turnover

-Fears over the impact the credit crunch has had on UBIG/ Ukio Bankas

 

This has led people to speculate that the club has to sell everything that isn't nailed down in order to improve cash flow and reduce the wage bill. As usual with KB, there is probably some element of truth, but I really doubt the situation is as extreme as many are suggesting.

 

Quite apart from anything else, it is very doubtful that the club will receive 10 'acceptable' offers for some of the players being speculated about. HMFC are not the only football club affected by the credit crunch, and even many clubs in the EPL have publicised that they are going to have to sell before they buy this January. In our own league, Rangers have openly admitted they are in the same situation.

 

History has shown us that an 'acceptable' price for Romanov, tends to be fairly pricey. It is naieve in the extreme to think that a man of his standing will not have salted away considerable personal wealth, so even if UBIG are in trouble, I severely doubt will allow his playing assets to be sold off on the cheap. Are there clubs out there who would both want to and have the capability to buy our players? There wont be many. When Csaba was asked about players leaving in a recent press conference, his reply was that it will be on Hearts terms.

 

I don't claim to have inside contacts or information, but I know one thing for certain, ill informed speculation is doing nothing to help the club.

 

we will know the facts come the close of the transfer window at the end of january

[HoGwash]

How do you know it's 'ill informed specualtion' ?

 

Because nobody has produced any facts or direct quotes to back it up.

[speedbump]

Martin T. Keeping a close eye on the situation:laugh:

[Dirk Diggler]

I was told that these rumours emanate from staff in the McLeod Street offices.

 

 

Only because they have nothing to do and spend all day on here.

 

[Martin_T]

I asked this question on another thread today. I was told that these rumours emanate from staff in the McLeod Street offices.

 

Not good.

 

Who are not likely to be privvy to decisions that will be made at boardroom level by UBIG.

[Guest jambomickey]

Who are not likely to be privvy to decisions that will be made at boardroom level by UBIG.

 

you say that as if we don't have a right to know?

[Johanes de Silentio]

Who are not likely to be privvy to decisions that will be made at boardroom level by UBIG.

 

So all these threads on JKB about our supposed 'January Sales' - what are they based on?

 

"Rumours, Rodney"!

[Charlie-Brown]

Csaba did say he expected / the club needed 8 first team players to leave and there was the possibility 3 might be able to come in depending on finances available, this was said at the Trust meeting last monday Martin, he couldn't say who was going and said it was entirely dependant on what bids might recieved as to who might go or stay. He did made it clear we would have to sell before we could buy and best case scenario the squad would reduce by 5.

[Charlie-Brown]

There was also comments made at the AGM that the club had to lose a further (number?) high earners before break even would be achieved.

[Basil Hayden]

My thoughts are almost exactly in line with the OP.

[Tiberius Stinkfinger]

History normally dictates that hardly any business is done in the transfer window apart from a few crazy panic buys from teams at the bottom of the EPL and this scenario looks highly likely this season as well because West Ham are skint.

[Drylaw Hearts]

Because in most cases it seems to be based on hearsay and conjecture. Take Colonel Kurtz' thread earlier today, it was based on his opinion, nothing more.

 

Sadly it is in the mentality of many Hearts supporters, including yourself DH, to always fully embrace the very worst case scenario.

 

When I think back to the 'hearsay and conjecture' that VR and Burley weren't getting along and their relationship wasn't working, it was often said it was merely mischief making etc.

 

Unfortuately for us it there was fire where there was smoke.

 

There were stories of us being in financial difficulties as far back as the summer and with each passing week there is another debt revelation.

 

Again....

 

Where there was smoke there was fire.

 

 

I don't think there is any doubt whatsoever there is a number of players being put up for sale as it seems obvious to me that the salaries are hurting this club like never before.

 

 

It may just be coincidence but if you look at some of the clues :

 

Csaba openly telling Hearts fans that he needs/wants to move 8 players in January.

 

Kingston's advert on HeartsTV completely contradicting an article he was quoted in only days previous.

 

Berra moving Agent 3 weeks before the Transfer Window.

 

Bruno discussing his contract situation.

 

 

Maybe I'm looking into it too deeply but I doubt it.

[blairdin]

To be fair Martin, I don't think there is so much rumour-mongering for a change. There is a helluva lot of speculation though.

 

We can't ignore the wage problems we have experienced twice in the last two months. It is entirely reasonable to conclude that we need to sunstantially reduce our wage bill at the first opportunity.

 

Coupled with our manager himself saying he wants to reduce the squad size and needs to sell before he can bring in some of his own targets, it is reasonable to speculate that we are destined lose some of our higher value players and (hopefully) some of our high earning low value players.

[Drylaw Hearts]

Because nobody has produced any facts or direct quotes to back it up.

 

At the moment it's just speculation.

 

1st February will tell us wether it was 'ill informed' or not.

[Martin_T]

Csaba did say he expected / the club needed 8 first team players to leave and there was the possibility 3 might be able to come in depending on finances available, this was said at the Trust meeting last monday Martin, he couldn't say who was going and said it was entirely dependant on what bids might recieved as to who might go or stay. He did made it clear we would have to sell before we could buy and best case scenario the squad would reduce by 5.

 

I think it depends on what players we manage to shift. If it's Kingston, Makela, Basso, Banks and Elliot...that would be minimal impact to the first team coupled with sizeable wage bill reduction. Add in the return of Kaunas loanees Kello, Mrowiec and Ksanvicius and you have what I think would be Csaba's ideal departures.

 

At the end of the day it depends on what the bids are, I expect even in the harsh financial climate we are experiencing currently, Romanov will have placed high reserve prices on the likes of Berra, Wallace, Jonsson and Driver.

[Tambojambo]

Martin, the "speculation" on this board, in my humble opinion, comes largely from the eternally anti-Romanov squad who, at the risk of boring us to death, need something else to moan about and this being the "window", provides just another opportunity to vent their spleens!! It's sad that, without any real evidence at this stage that we will be selling off our better players in January, some Hearts supporters feel the overwhelming need to "fuel the weegie press and hobo fire"! They need no help from us in wishing our club ill, so why do it and why seemingly take so much pleasure in their dubious contributions? Par for the course during the last couple of years, I suppose, but before they criticise other Jambos for having their heads in the sand, perhaps they should return from planet DOOM first! For my part, I'll wait until we are nearer the window and see some indication of factual information, before commenting on any possible "window" business.

 

I think it depends on what players we manage to shift. If it's Kingston, Makela, Basso, Banks and Elliot...that would be minimal impact to the first team coupled with sizeable wage bill reduction. Add in the return of Kaunas loanees Kello, Mrowiec and Ksanvicius and you have what I think would be Csaba's ideal departures.

 

At the end of the day it depends on what the bids are, I expect even in the harsh financial climate we are experiencing currently, Romanov will have placed high reserve prices on the likes of Berra, Wallace, Jonsson and Driver.

[TheBigO]

I think it depends on what players we manage to shift. If it's Kingston, Makela, Basso, Banks and Elliot...that would be minimal impact to the first team coupled with sizeable wage bill reduction. Add in the return of Kaunas loanees Kello, Mrowiec and Ksanvicius and you have what I think would be Csaba's ideal departures.

 

At the end of the day it depends on what the bids are, I expect even in the harsh financial climate we are experiencing currently, Romanov will have placed high reserve prices on the likes of Berra, Wallace, Jonsson and Driver.

 

You're speaking sense here mate. I worry about Bruno and Larry going (Bruno due to nearing end of contract, Larry just cos it's Larry, we'd get a few quid maybe tho), but otherwise, i dont see anyone else who we'd really miss going.

 

If we got really good offers for the likes of Driver and Berra, then they'll go, but that's no different to any other club in the world

 

The 8 you've mentioned above as going are the ones i'd imagine to be on Csaba's list - maybe add Ruben

[Drylaw Hearts]

Martin, the "speculation" on this board, in my humble opinion, comes largely from the eternally anti-Romanov squad who, at the risk of boring us to death, need something else to moan about and this being the "window", provides just another opportunity to vent their spleens!!

 

 

Your theory fell flat on it's face after only one sentence I'm afraid.

 

Now I obviously know who first told me and I know who told him - neither of those guys are Anti-Romanov.

[davjambo]

Martin, the "speculation" on this board, in my humble opinion, comes largely from the eternally anti-Romanov squad who, at the risk of boring us to death, need something else to moan about and this being the "window", provides just another opportunity to vent their spleens!! It's sad that, without any real evidence at this stage that we will be selling off our better players in January, some Hearts supporters feel the overwhelming need to "fuel the weegie press and hobo fire"! They need no help from us in wishing our club ill, so why do it and why seemingly take so much pleasure in their dubious contributions? Par for the course during the last couple of years, I suppose, but before they criticise other Jambos for having their heads in the sand, perhaps they should return from planet DOOM first! For my part, I'll wait until we are nearer the window and see some indication of factual information, before commenting on any possible "window" business.

 

Oh man their going to kill you.

[Victorian]

the way i see it re the coming transfer window...

 

if a few tempting bids come in for various players and they are KB'd.... perhaps good news and encouraging signs that the financial picture isn't as desperate as some would like to believe, and more to the point... as some would love to have hearts fans believe.

 

if players are swiftly sold at the first or second bids.... perhaps not so good news and a sign that the picture is indeed bleak. maybe even a sign that assets are being 'realised' at the beginning of some kind of exit strategy to come in the not too distant future.

 

it all depends on who actually wants to buy any of the players but this window may tell us 100 times more about our financial health than we will get anywhere else.

[simplesimon]

Even if the speculation is true I remember we were told the bank forced us to sell mccann, cameron, macpherson, and many more. This is not new ground, just another bank.

[Tambojambo]

And you???!!!!

 

 

Your theory fell flat on it's face after only one sentence I'm afraid.

 

Now I obviously know who first told me and I know who told him - neither of those guys are Anti-Romanov.

[Drylaw Hearts]

Even if the speculation is true I remember we were told the bank forced us to sell mccann, cameron, macpherson, and many more. This is not new ground, just another bank.

 

Were you happy that the bank made us sell these players ?

 

Even though their transfers were necassery I still remember cursing The Bank Of Scotland when they made us sell Alan McLaren just prior to a match at ER.

 

And anyway why are we having to sell players ?

 

We have no debt !

 

Or was that just another wee joke by VR/RR ?

[davjambo]

And you???!!!!

 

Helmets on standby:mw_rolleyes:

[Drylaw Hearts]

And you???!!!!

 

And me ?

 

Guess.

[Tambojambo]

Wouldn't dare, as it would only be speculation!!

 

 

And me ?

 

Guess.

[JAYEL]

Martin, the "speculation" on this board, in my humble opinion, comes largely from the eternally anti-Romanov squad who, at the risk of boring us to death, need something else to moan about and this being the "window", provides just another opportunity to vent their spleens!! It's sad that, without any real evidence at this stage that we will be selling off our better players in January, some Hearts supporters feel the overwhelming need to "fuel the weegie press and hobo fire"! They need no help from us in wishing our club ill, so why do it and why seemingly take so much pleasure in their dubious contributions? Par for the course during the last couple of years, I suppose, but before they criticise other Jambos for having their heads in the sand, perhaps they should return from planet DOOM first! For my part, I'll wait until we are nearer the window and see some indication of factual information, before commenting on any possible "window" business.

 

 

 

 

 

 

About sums it up.

 

 

.

[hisnameis]

I'm hoping that there will be some stabilization after january, hopefully with an owners statement, including realistic intentions/targets, whether or not we can hold on to some of our better players or not is yet to be seen, but if it is their wages that are bleeding the funds it is the only way to move forward. It sticks in my throat a wee bit that season ticket non-renewers, glory hunters or disenchanted fans, think that not renewing is affecting VR, when in fact empty seats affect the players and the imposing atmosphere at tynecastle. Back the team

 

So it's the fans fault . Get a grip. There is one man to blame for the mess . No club has the right to act the way ours has towards it's supporters and expect them to continue backing this inept regime. Campbell Og and David Southern both stated that the only thing Vlad would take notice of is empty seats. Some people have had enough. Why cant you respect that.

[lawriejambo]

For my part, I'll wait until we are nearer the window and see some indication of factual information, before commenting on any possible "window" business.

 

Sensible

 

But the fact is. There is a cash flow problem.

 

And the next few weeks will give Vlad a chance to remedy that.

 

If we don't lose Berra , Bruno, Larry, Big Zal etc... Fantastic.

 

I think we probably will though..

 

Hope i'm wrong. Only being realistic..

[Cade]

Selling our best players every transfer window to reduce wage bill/debt.

 

The team struggling as a result and being a mid table side.

 

It's going to be a long, painful, frustrating ride from here on, I'm afraid.......

[Drylaw Hearts]

Wouldn't dare, as it would only be speculation!!

 

[gorgiestars]

kinda been discussed on a couple of previous threads...my thinking on this however is slightly different.

 

when we started shipping out the likes of hartley/gordon, bednar et all, can we all agree that for the most part we got top dollar for them? Certainly now when a team comes sniffing we can tell them to 'show us the money', rather than letting players go for a fraction of what we hoped/wanted.

 

When Gordon went, i for one did not look at the team and think we could get another 10m for what was left. Now if we have to possibly sell berra, kingston driver, wallace, eggert we might be looking at getting somthing like that.

 

If we all really think about it, do we not think that significantly reducing the debt is better in the long run. Unfortunaley, this will all come at a time when we hit a bit of form. But levein has proved that you dont have to spend big to make an impact on this league to a point werre we would say we are being successful (i.e 3rd)

 

When i look around at the other teams in the league, i dont see anyone else having the potential value in their squad than we do.

As gutted as i would be to see most of these guys go, are any of them truely ireplaceable? Cant think of anyone on the team who hasnt had a bit of a hard time on the board this season.

 

None of these players will stay at the club forever, so why dont we play the market for their full worth while we still can...it does make good business sense. which is needed at the moment if the club is to move forward.

 

Thoughts??

[JamboJen]

Thoughts??

 

Merge?

[MacDonald Jardine]

As I've said before it's the one area so far Romanov has almost always done well in: when players are sold they go for decent fees.

You're also right that I can't think of anyone in that team that's irreplaceable, although we'd miss Berra or Driver.

 

If the more extreme theories on here are right that might change though.

 

Time will tell.

[brownkg]

yet another thread asking the same question as in 90% of today's new threads. Is it now compulsory to open your own thread to display hand-wringing. Jeez we face the Dark denziens of Dante's inner circle of depravity on Saturday where a win would put us 8 points behind the them and all we can do is individually and collectively fuel the rumours of imminent melt-down. I think we should have a new forum for this type of trolling where a weekly subject is printed and all that can be done is reply to that thread not start new ones. AND BTW IT SHOULD BE COMPULSORY to post ther before you are allowed to infect the terrace with such nonsense:evilno::ahhhhhhh::ahhhhhhh:

[The Old Tolbooth]

My thoughts are that all Vlad is interested in at this moment in time is reducing the crippling wage bill (which is his own doing) and raking in as much cash as possible.

 

Even although we're probably going to be selling these players either in Jan or June, I cant honestly see Csaba being happy with just selling them and not replacing them with some form of cheaper players, whether that be from lower leagues in Scotland, or Lithuania.

 

I see us as at a crossroads, where the club has been so poorly run that serious decision need to be made, and it's a shame as it could all have been avoided.

[d(>_<)b]

Were you happy that the bank made us sell these players ?

 

Even though their transfers were necassery I still remember cursing The Bank Of Scotland when they made us sell Alan McLaren just prior to a match at ER.

 

And anyway why are we having to sell players ?

 

We have no debt !

 

Or was that just another wee joke by VR/RR ?

 

DH.....in a cynical view, the current goings on and rumours could be seen as asset stripping.

 

I don't trust the current regime one jot.....but simply live in hope that I'm wrong.

[gorgiestars]

'..and it's a shame as it could all have been avoided. '

i agree, however, if a player for hearts is playing well and is on the horizon of other clubs, whether we are being run fantastically well or not...they will mostly all look to head to bigger and better things....at least now, badly run as we are... we can play the market better than we ever have done in the past...

[PTBCAL]

I'll be honest - I get to hear a few things now and then - from good sources usually direct from Hearts or the media (broadsheet).

 

We will be selling players in Jan.

 

We will be releasing players in Jan.

 

We will be reducing the wage bill.

 

We will be promoting 2 or 3 youngsters to 1st team squad proper.

 

Old adage but short term pain for long term gain. Hearts need the money to get through to the summer and we need to be run on a more mangeable basis - both will happen.

 

Short term the team will suffer but long term it's what is required to help ensure this is not repeated.