Livi ratings (merged)

[i wish jj was my dad]

2 hours ago, Pasquale for King said:

Harsh on Gordon, he had to come out as their players were behind Kent and Atkinson, they were looking for that ball all day. 
Fraser finally showed something. 
Forrest a headless chicken. 
Tagawa makes great runs. 

 If that had been Zander, you would gave wanted his head on a plate. FWIW, as much as I think Craig could have done better I think the whole thing was a mess. For the rest of the season I want Naisy to pick his no.1 and give us our best chance of a trophy. If Craig shows anything like his best I'd pick him in the Euros. I know that won't happen but at the business end I'd always pick the best. Steve Clarke should know that from the last campaign. 

[DS98]

45 minutes ago, tiger Rudi said:

Your last sentence sums it up........ So why play him in the semi final? 

 

He's played a handful of games against poor opposition and the first game he's been put under pressure, he's struggled. 

Not blaming Gordon, but it would be crazy to drop Zander now. If it was the intention to play Gordon in the semi he would have been playing long before now in the league surely. 

Because it was decided after his return that whilst Zander and the defence are in good form then Zander is the league keeper and Craig the cup. Nothing has changed. The semi final is a cup game. Gordon played today so that he isn’t going into the game at Hampden cold. 
 

If he plays a blinder next week (like we all know he can) then it’ll go down as tremendous management. Got the mistakes out the way in a fairly meaningless game today in preparation for the big one. 
 

And I wouldn’t say he ‘struggled’ today. He could’ve played the 2nd half in his slippers. The mistake for the first goal apart. He, along with everyone else looked shaky when defending corners but Livi are like the Harlem Globetrotters and would cause any team problems at set pieces. 

Edited April 13 by DS98

[Pasquale for King]

11 minutes ago, i wish jj was my dad said:

 If that had been Zander, you would gave wanted his head on a plate. FWIW, as much as I think Craig could have done better I think the whole thing was a mess. For the rest of the season I want Naisy to pick his no.1 and give us our best chance of a trophy. If Craig shows anything like his best I'd pick him in the Euros. I know that won't happen but at the business end I'd always pick the best. Steve Clarke should know that from the last campaign. 

I complained last week about the goal Clark lost, where he did nothing, at least Gordon was trying to be proactive today to cover for Kent and Atkinson who were being targeted by long balls over the top. 
He ****ed up though. 
Couldnt care less about the Euros tbh, but playing Gordon today was a strange decision and havent heard an explanation of why. 
The manager has caused a bit of an issue now. 

[Gordons left glove]

Naismith has confirmed today was a warmup for Craig and that he'll play next week for anyone who missed it

[i wish jj was my dad]

6 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

I complained last week about the goal Clark lost, where he did nothing, at least Gordon was trying to be proactive today to cover for Kent and Atkinson who were being targeted by long balls over the top. 
He ****ed up though. 
Couldnt care less about the Euros tbh, but playing Gordon today was a strange decision and havent heard an explanation of why. 
The manager has caused a bit of an issue now. 

I thought once we'd got to the semis we should have decided who our no. 1 for the season was and stuck with it. I actually think Craig is but wanted to see him against top 6 before the semi. The game before wasn't the time to do it IMO.  He made some decent saves but looked rusty and despite his excellent performances in the cup games, my gut ATM is Zander deserves the gloves next week based on performances. Horrible decision but one thing I am certain of is Zander has had a season to be proud of. 

[i wish jj was my dad]

6 minutes ago, Gordons left glove said:

Naismith has confirmed today was a warmup for Craig and that he'll play next week for anyone who missed it

I didn't catch that but despite what I said in my post above. If we have decided on our no 1, i am all for it.  We have possibly never been better off for keepers in our history and we have to trust our coaches who seem to know what they are doing. 

[Saint Jambo]

A couple of random things that pleased me today...

 

It felt like the crowd were willing Tagwa to score when in the past we've collectively been on his back.

 

Just seen the footage on Hearts FB page from the end of the game. Good to see the togetherness among the squad. Shankland seems to be giving positive words to Tagwa who seems to be enjoying the win. Fraser also seems to be enjoying himself with other players. For two players who it hasn't really happened for and didn't do amazing things when they came on today, it is good to see they seem to be positive rather than negative presences in the tbe squad.

[tiger Rudi]

17 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

I complained last week about the goal Clark lost, where he did nothing, at least Gordon was trying to be proactive today to cover for Kent and Atkinson who were being targeted by long balls over the top. 
He ****ed up though. 
Couldnt care less about the Euros tbh, but playing Gordon today was a strange decision and havent heard an explanation of why. 
The manager has caused a bit of an issue now. 

I agree with this. A very strange decision to play Craig. He's a Hearts legend but not God. If the decision was taken with the intention of playing Craig in the semi final, it's poor management. Poor on Zander who some will say does not deserve to miss the semi, and poor on Craig, throwing him in at Hampden without a decent run of games under his belt. It doesn't matter what camp you are in regarding choice of keeper, it's poor management. 

 

Of course if it turns out Zander didn't play for other reasons, then disregard all of the above......... I think Naisy needs to clear this up tbh. 

[i wish jj was my dad]

2 minutes ago, Saint Jambo said:

A couple of random things that pleased me today...

 

It felt like the crowd were willing Tagwa to score when in the past we've collectively been on his back.

 

Just seen the footage on Hearts FB page from the end of the game. Good to see the togetherness among the squad. Shankland seems to be giving positive words to Tagwa who seems to be enjoying the win. Fraser also seems to be enjoying himself with other players. For two players who it hasn't really happened for and didn't do amazing things when they came on today, it is good to see they seem to be positive rather than negative presences in the tbe squad.

Great to see but as much as  I think Forrest was disappointing today he has had a smashing season and Naisy thinks so too. Big player next week. 

[Pasquale for King]

2 minutes ago, tiger Rudi said:

I agree with this. A very strange decision to play Craig. He's a Hearts legend but not God. If the decision was taken with the intention of playing Craig in the semi final, it's poor management. Poor on Zander who some will say does not deserve to miss the semi, and poor on Craig, throwing him in at Hampden without a decent run of games under his belt. It doesn't matter what camp you are in regarding choice of keeper, it's poor management. 

 

Of course if it turns out Zander didn't play for other reasons, then disregard all of the above......... I think Naisy needs to clear this up tbh. 

Looks like he did after the game, saying Gordon is playing next week so lets hope he and McKay have shaken off any rust. 

[tiger Rudi]

17 minutes ago, Gordons left glove said:

Naismith has confirmed today was a warmup for Craig and that he'll play next week for anyone who missed it

When did he say this? Very strange and not sure how it's justified. Should have been back playing regularly long before now if this was Naismith's intention. 

[Gordons left glove]

2 minutes ago, tiger Rudi said:

When did he say this? Very strange and not sure how it's justified. Should have been back playing regularly long before now if this was Naismith's intention. 

 

[BackOfTheNet]

2 hours ago, DC_92 said:

 

"Largely anonymous throughout" does not square with having a big hand in two goals in the 59 minutes he was on the pitch. He had some other good moments as well including a very good left footed cross.

 

Nobody else in the team makes the type of pass he did to Shankland before Grant's goal.

He had a big hand in the 3rd. But the man was either nowhere to be seen or was completing one outside of the foot pass out of ten. His overall performance was average, as his good play brought up his negative or non existent play. But overall it was average.

[upgotheheads]

Gordon - 5 - Second guessed coming out of their box at the first. Couldn't help the second

Kent - 4 - Nightmare of a first half cost two goals

Cochrane - 7 - Lovely ball for the 3rd goal and linked up well with McKay

Atkinson - 6 - Improved significantly when Vargas came on. Dodgy first half defending though

Rowles - 7 - Solid throughout

Bannigime, solid performance   I would give him 8, the work he does goes unnoticed because he's just quietly very effective.  

Grant - 7 - Key first goal and linked up well

Devlin - 7 - Busy throughout and finished off our best team goal of the season

Shankland - 9 - MoM. Involved in all 4 goals, including his pen. Excellent throughout

McKay - 8 - The perfect game for him to start. Lovely ball to Shanks for the first

Oda - 7 - Scored and won the penalty through his pace and workmate

Subs:

Vargas - 6 - Made a difference. Unlucky not to score

Kingsley - 4 - Couple of decent crosses

Fraser - 4 - Tidy cameo

Forrest - 2 - Wasteful in good positions

Tagawa - 3 - Tried like a bear and made some excellent runs. The supply was poor, alas. Tagawa made three or four great runs but wasn't given the ball quickly enough, there's a player in there, I just hope he's given a few starts after the Cup semi

 

 

 

[stevie]

Thought at 2-0 Devlin stepped up and ran the midfield,MOTM for me.

Really wish we started games with a much higher tempo.

[tiger Rudi]

17 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

Looks like he did after the game, saying Gordon is playing next week so lets hope he and McKay have shaken off any rust. 

Let's hope so, mainly for Craig's sake. It will either be a masterstroke or fingers will be pointing at Naismith. Big risk changing things as late as this in my view.

Let's hope CG has a match-winning performance! 🤞

 

[Saint Jambo]

29 minutes ago, i wish jj was my dad said:

Great to see but as much as  I think Forrest was disappointing today he has had a smashing season and Naisy thinks so too. Big player next week. 

I think you might have misread my post. I was talking about Fraser not Forrest. Agree with you entirely about Forrest.

[i wish jj was my dad]

12 minutes ago, Saint Jambo said:

I think you might have misread my post. I was talking about Fraser not Forrest. Agree with you entirely about Forrest.

Sorry. Red wine tends to have that effect  on my capacity for logic 🤦

[Farmer1]

Felt Jorge Grant was our best player today, even in the first 20 min when we were struggling he always retained possession.

 

looking forward to seeing Grant link with Spittal and Dhanda next year as well as the Hoff. Today it was clear to see we were a considerably better “footballing” side despite conceding cheap goals from early livi pressure 

[longmalx]

We are a much better team with Grant and McKay in it - so much more space for others.

 

no surprise first start for McKay led to our 1st 4 goal score for a while.

 

Grant/Shankland best for me - Grant MoM. Kent had a bizarrely inept first 30 mins and Gordon sadly reminded how bad he is at crosses and with his feet these days. Probably more worrying was his lack of reaction to the 2nd than the brain fart for the 1st.

 

Forrests form is a worry - his decision making is appalling and his selfishness unlike all the others. If I was Tagawa I’d be raging he didn’t roll it across for a tap in.

 

Tagawa showed some signs of life but desperately short of confidence. Nice to see players appear to be trying to help him out.

[longmalx]

Devlin was also shocking first 30 mins and I was sure he’d be subbed at half time. Credit to him he was excellent for the rest of the game and unlucky not to get a 2nd.

[Saint Jambo]

3 minutes ago, i wish jj was my dad said:

Sorry. Red wine tends to have that effect  on my capacity for logic 🤦

😂 No worries.

[XB52]

Craig will be in goals next week and in the final

[i wish jj was my dad]

6 minutes ago, Saint Jambo said:

😂 No worries.

Awfly decent of you 👍

[Benny Factor]

1 hour ago, tcjambo said:

Gordon - 5 - Let down by his defence but looked very rusty

Kent - 5 - Worst game for us first half

Cochrane - 7 - Left side of degfence andgoing forward were good

Atkinson - 5 - Another crap performance yet Toby does better and gets more stick

Rowles - 8 - excellent - our best defender and I say that as someone who hasn't been a fan

Baningime - 6 - Decent

Grant - 7 - Good performance. Showed he can do it

Devlin - 8 - MoM. tireless. hacked down frequently saving us in defence. great goal

Shankland - 7 - MoM. 2 great assists. Good awareness but not everything worked for hiim

McKay - 6 - getting back on form

Oda - 7 - My original MoM but subbed with quite a while to go

Subs:

Vargas - 6 - A veruy important player for ius these days

Kingsley - 4 - Curate's egg

Fraser - 4 - Did well in distribution

Forrest - 2 - seems to be having a dip in form

Tagawa - 2 - Never seems to anticipate anything but certainly tried. needs a proper run out or two.

 

Make your mind up, @tcjambo!!!!

[DC_92]

51 minutes ago, BackOfTheNet said:

He had a big hand in the 3rd. But the man was either nowhere to be seen or was completing one outside of the foot pass out of ten. His overall performance was average, as his good play brought up his negative or non existent play. But overall it was average.

 

He had an even bigger hand in the first.

 

He did well to complete 68% of his passes if only 1 in 10 of the fancy ones reached their target. He also touched the ball as much as Oda despite playing 20 minutes less.

[bringonthesevco]

2 hours ago, Daveandal said:

The Gordon stuff is crazy.

 

For the first he dug Kent and to a lesser extent Akinson out a hole. His problem was trying to play a pass. If he'd just leathered it no issue.

 

A great save at 1-0 ( he didn't know it would be called back).

 

Yes could have done better at the 2nd.

 

But always looked to move it quickly.

 

Probably a 6 today. It was Kent who was all over the place for 30 mins.

Interesting take ..

 

The Gordon stuff is crazy then you go on to say ...

 

"If he'd just leathered it no issue" - but he didn't and it cost us a goal.

"Yes could have done better at the 2nd."

 

Really not that crazy then is it ....... 

[soonbe110]

1 hour ago, Saint Jambo said:

The idea that there are lots of Hearts fans just waiting for an opportunity to criticize Gordon is definitely one of the weirdest takes ever on jkb. I was delighted to see him in the starting line up but no question he had a stinker today. Gordon will be one of the best players I ever see at Hearts and I love him, but that doesn't change the fact he made mistakes today. Rushing out his box and not dealing with things has been a bit of a recurring issue for him over the years. I recall him making several mistakes like that at Celtic and he conceded a similar goal last season.

 

Kent was terrible as well. Worst I've seen him play. Hopefully a one off and now out the system.

 

From 25 minutes to 70 minutes the midfield and attack were very good, before becoming a bit of a training match for last 20.

 

Gordon and Kent 4s.

Shankland and Grant 8.

All other starters 7.

It’s an interesting one. Kent has been Mr Reliable at the back all season and the primary reason for the improvement in our goals against stats. Playing behind him Clark has benefitted but still played decently when called on.  Gordon returns to league duty today and Kent has a horror show, clearly his poorest performance of the season and culpable at both  of their goals.  Bit harsh to pin a lot of blame on Gordon for the goals.  Yes he could have done better but he was left exposed at both and that hasn’t been the case with Clark. 

[soonbe110]

1 hour ago, Pasquale for King said:

I complained last week about the goal Clark lost, where he did nothing, at least Gordon was trying to be proactive today to cover for Kent and Atkinson who were being targeted by long balls over the top. 
He ****ed up though. 
Couldnt care less about the Euros tbh, but playing Gordon today was a strange decision and havent heard an explanation of why. 
The manager has caused a bit of an issue now. 

Match practice for next week, pretty simple thinking really. Meaningless game against bottom of league today. 

[tcjambo]

Sorry used the original template and forgot to change Shaks lol. Devlin for me.

Edited April 13 by tcjambo

[feedthefox]

1 hour ago, stevie said:

Thought at 2-0 Devlin stepped up and ran the midfield,MOTM for me.

Really wish we started games with a much higher tempo.

I think “ran the midfield” is a stretch but yes after a very underwhelming start he improved as game went on. 

[merrymac]

1 minute ago, feedthefox said:

I think “ran the midfield” is a stretch but yes after a very underwhelming start he improved as game went on. 

I think in the second half there was a hint of Beni and Cammy re establishing the rapport they used to have

that would be a real positive for the rest of the season if the Hoff is not back anytime soon 

[Sleepy head]

1 hour ago, longmalx said:

We are a much better team with Grant and McKay in it - so much more space for others.

 

no surprise first start for McKay led to our 1st 4 goal score for a while.

 

Grant/Shankland best for me - Grant MoM. Kent had a bizarrely inept first 30 mins and Gordon sadly reminded how bad he is at crosses and with his feet these days. Probably more worrying was his lack of reaction to the 2nd than the brain fart for the 1st.

 

Forrests form is a worry - his decision making is appalling and his selfishness unlike all the others. If I was Tagawa I’d be raging he didn’t roll it across for a tap in.

 

Tagawa showed some signs of life but desperately short of confidence. Nice to see players appear to be trying to help him out.

Not a fan. He has the vision and awareness of a pissed Stevie Wonder.

[BackOfTheNet]

59 minutes ago, DC_92 said:

 

He had an even bigger hand in the first.

 

He did well to complete 68% of his passes if only 1 in 10 of the fancy ones reached their target. He also touched the ball as much as Oda despite playing 20 minutes less.

Listen, I’m not saying he played badly. I’m just saying that he’s not worthy of anything as high as an 8. 68% is not actually great, it’s not bad either, which matches the mark of 6 I’ve given him.

[Watt-Zeefuik]

2 hours ago, BackOfTheNet said:

He had a big hand in the 3rd. But the man was either nowhere to be seen or was completing one outside of the foot pass out of ten. His overall performance was average, as his good play brought up his negative or non existent play. But overall it was average.

McKay is a bit like a striker in grading him IMO. He's good for 3-4 passes per game that no one else on the team can make. They create chances.

 

It's like the inverse of getting on Baningime's back because he doesn't make killer passes, just retains possession and finds men in maroon. Aye, I'd be thrilled if Barrie held possession like Beni or if Beni picked a ball into the box like Barrie, but yadda yadda wouldn't be at Hearts and all that.

[Bull's-eye]

What are the rules for these threads ?

 

Is it all about contribution for goals at both ends of the pitch and nothing inbetween ?

[BackOfTheNet]

16 minutes ago, Watt-Zeefuik said:

McKay is a bit like a striker in grading him IMO. He's good for 3-4 passes per game that no one else on the team can make. They create chances.

 

It's like the inverse of getting on Baningime's back because he doesn't make killer passes, just retains possession and finds men in maroon. Aye, I'd be thrilled if Barrie held possession like Beni or if Beni picked a ball into the box like Barrie, but yadda yadda wouldn't be at Hearts and all that.

I get what you’re saying, his game isn’t tackles and ball retention. And if he didn’t try killer passes, he may have not had that season with double figures assists for us like he did. Which is fine, when it comes off and he has the impact. He had some impact today, but for me not enough to warrant a high score. Which is not to say he warranted a bad score, he doesn’t. He was on around 60 minutes and contributed an overall average performer, with some good and some bad.

[DC_92]

22 minutes ago, BackOfTheNet said:

Listen, I’m not saying he played badly. I’m just saying that he’s not worthy of anything as high as an 8. 68% is not actually great, it’s not bad either, which matches the mark of 6 I’ve given him.

 

68% wouldn't be great for someone who plays like Baningime, for example. For someone trying to play a lot of intricate passes, it's pretty good, and suggests more than 1 in 10 of those came off as you claimed.

 

There were three players between McKay and Shankland before the first goal and his pass took them all out of the game. Nobody else in the squad does that. Us coming back from 2-0 was far from an inevitability and that moment was the turning point.

 

The vast majority of our threat in the first half came down the left and he also zipped the pass into Shankland's feet which ultimately led to the third. His contribution was critical, much better than average in my opinion.

[BackOfTheNet]

7 minutes ago, DC_92 said:

 

68% wouldn't be great for someone who plays like Baningime, for example. For someone trying to play a lot of intricate passes, it's pretty good, and suggests more than 1 in 10 of those came off as you claimed.

 

There were three players between McKay and Shankland before the first goal and his pass took them all out of the game. Nobody else in the squad does that. Us coming back from 2-0 was far from an inevitability and that moment was the turning point.

 

The vast majority of our threat in the first half came down the left and he also zipped the pass into Shankland's feet which ultimately led to the third. His contribution was critical, much better than average in my opinion.

The 1 in 10 referred to the outside of the foot passes, not every one of his passed. And we kept the ball down our left because Atkinson and Kent were having an absolute nightmare on the right. And yes, we wanted McKay to create, but he would have large spells without touching the ball.

 

I’m not saying he’s shite or anything. Just expressing an opinion that his performance was alright and expressing some surprise that people are rating his performance - today - so highly. Of course he’s a great player that can be one of the best in the league when on form, but just because he’s got the talent and is a fan favourite doesn’t give him a pass for unwarranted high scores or to ignore what he didn’t do well, or didn’t do at all.

[BigAlim]

I watched Scott Fraser closely today and he reminded me of one of those 50 year old former professional’s playing in soccer aid. Don’t even think he spat out his chewing gum!
 

Very obviously knows how to play football but spent most of the time walking and playing 5 yard passes, I really hope he doesn’t stay here.

 

 

Edited April 13 by BigAlim

[Graham Thomson]

I wonder why we changed keepers at this time of the season. 

Z C  had done nothing wrong  to be dropped.

The defence are used to playing in front of him, don't change it unless you have too. 

[Dazo]

18 minutes ago, Graham Thomson said:

I wonder why we changed keepers at this time of the season. 

Z C  had done nothing wrong  to be dropped.

The defence are used to playing in front of him, don't change it unless you have too. 

It was a warm up for our cup keeper. Done agree but understand the reasoning. 

[Uncle Buck]

Grant was the best player on the park by a country mile today. Shankland, Devlin and Oda were quite good too. Everyone else was pretty poor. Special mention to Kent who was absolutely shocking.

[Uncle Buck]

2 hours ago, Graham Thomson said:

I wonder why we changed keepers at this time of the season. 

Z C  had done nothing wrong  to be dropped.

The defence are used to playing in front of him, don't change it unless you have too. 

You’d have to be a bit simple to not understand why Gordon played today.

[Pasquale for King]

5 hours ago, tiger Rudi said:

Let's hope so, mainly for Craig's sake. It will either be a masterstroke or fingers will be pointing at Naismith. Big risk changing things as late as this in my view.

Let's hope CG has a match-winning performance! 🤞

 

Absolutely 👍🏽

[Pasquale for King]

2 hours ago, Graham Thomson said:

I wonder why we changed keepers at this time of the season. 

Z C  had done nothing wrong  to be dropped.

The defence are used to playing in front of him, don't change it unless you have too. 

I’m pretty sure they’re all 

comfortable playing with Gordon too, apart from Kent the others have played dozens of times with him. 

[Pasquale for King]

2 hours ago, BigAlim said:

I watched Scott Fraser closely today and he reminded me of one of those 50 year old former professional’s playing in soccer aid. Don’t even think he spat out his chewing gum!
 

Very obviously knows how to play football but spent most of the time walking and playing 5 yard passes, I really hope he doesn’t stay here.

 

 

That was his best performance too 😆

[gorgierulesapply88]

2 goals lost from 2 long balls, Kent flat footed both times.

 

Never ever seen Gordon come for a ball launch the 1st.

[hereford_hearts]

10 hours ago, colinmaroon said:

 

MacKay 8 Nobody else could have played that ball through to Shanks. A wand of a right foot. 

 

 

I remember watching the game and seeing him try that we flick pass with the outside of his right foot 3 or 4 times, but it not quite coming off. I was thinking, don't stop doing them, as one will eventually come off, then that peach to Shanks happened. 

[pettigrewsstylist]

Goals win games. Running around, working hard and  boost stats metrics should translate to that, but not a given.

Baz Mckay and Cochrane down the left 👏👏 Great performance with actual effect.