Dusk_Till_Dawn Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 Anyone watched the C4 documentary on this? Found it really interesting, the range of voices they’d managed to pull together and all the different opinions on it. A very good watch. I’ve no time for Thatcher but the series left me with the feeling that above all else, Scargill screwed up massively by dodging a national ballot. He looked like a genuinely broken man as he announced the return to work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddsyJR9 Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 I was a young man during the miners strikes, and still vividly remember the enormous effects it had across all spectrums of society at that time. While I admire Thatcher for her many great achievements, the devastation that it took to break the miners strikes, was heartbreaking. Scargill and the green brigade left wing unions used the miners to try to bring down the Tory government, and while they were the main architects of the destruction, I still have grave doubts regarding the endgame of coal production in the UK. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeffros Furios Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 14 minutes ago, doddsyJR9 said: I was a young man during the miners strikes, and still vividly remember the enormous effects it had across all spectrums of society at that time. While I admire Thatcher for her many great achievements, the devastation that it took to break the miners strikes, was heartbreaking. Scargill and the green brigade left wing unions used the miners to try to bring down the Tory government, and while they were the main architects of the destruction, I still have grave doubts regarding the endgame of coal production in the UK. Thatcher was a slag .. Tony Blair is a great man .tories are scum . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnrazor Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 I was in 2nd year at high school when it kicked off, it was a very very unpleasant period of my life. I saw poverty then, real poverty, people in real need of food banks, such a toxic period. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddsyJR9 Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 Just now, Jeffros Furios said: Thatcher was a slag .. Tony Blair is a great man .tories are scum . Thatcher hated Greens and the IRA. A good lady. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeffros Furios Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 7 minutes ago, doddsyJR9 said: Thatcher hated Greens and the IRA. A good lady. Thatcher was a Soviet agent .. Tony Blair was a great PM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddsyJR9 Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 1 minute ago, Jeffros Furios said: Thatcher was a Soviet agent .. Tony Blair was a great PM What age are you? Are you trying to goad me into a ban or something? If you are an Snp/plaid cymru/green/leftist/commie etc, then of course you would think tony blair was a great pm. Margaret Thatcher hated the IRA/Greens/Separatists/Commies etc. Greatest ever PM. As I said, I do have grave doubts over the miners who were duped by the green brigade into trying to bring down the Tory government. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlimOzturk Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 14 minutes ago, doddsyJR9 said: Thatcher hated Greens and the IRA. A good lady. 6 minutes ago, Jeffros Furios said: Thatcher was a Soviet agent .. Tony Blair was a great PM Both are thoroughly detestable people. Wtf is going on here. 😂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddsyJR9 Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 Just now, AlimOzturk said: Both are thoroughly detestable people. Wtf is going on here. 😂 Why are both detestable? Margaret fought the IRA and the Greens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Real Maroonblood Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 1 minute ago, doddsyJR9 said: Why are both detestable? Margaret fought the IRA and the Greens. You’re a slaver. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddsyJR9 Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 Just now, The Real Maroonblood said: You’re a slaver. A slaver to those who have their own agenda. Just someone who has their own opinion to other more open minded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeffros Furios Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 7 minutes ago, doddsyJR9 said: What age are you? Are you trying to goad me into a ban or something? If you are an Snp/plaid cymru/green/leftist/commie etc, then of course you would think tony blair was a great pm. Margaret Thatcher hated the IRA/Greens/Separatists/Commies etc. Greatest ever PM. As I said, I do have grave doubts over the miners who were duped by the green brigade into trying to bring down the Tory government. You are blind to the truth. Thatcher and her marxist green agenda ruined this great country.. Tony Blair was our saviour .. I can see through your woke agenda . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddsyJR9 Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 Just now, Jeffros Furios said: You are blind to the truth. Thatcher and her marxist green agenda ruined this great country.. Tony Blair was our saviour .. I can see through your woke agenda . Yeah, mon the IRA/Greens/Commies/Snp/Plaid Cymru/Red Army etc. Is that better for you comrade? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FWJ Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 This thread is like the Cod Wars 🎣🎣🎣🎣🎣🎣🎣 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazio Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 2 minutes ago, FWJ said: This thread is like the Cod Wars 🎣🎣🎣🎣🎣🎣🎣 And some are the fish and some the fishermen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howdy Doody Jambo Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 (edited) 1 hour ago, doddsyJR9 said: I was a young man during the miners strikes, and still vividly remember the enormous effects it had across all spectrums of society at that time. While I admire Thatcher for her many great achievements, the devastation that it took to break the miners strikes, was heartbreaking. Scargill and the green brigade left wing unions used the miners to try to bring down the Tory government, and while they were the main architects of the destruction, I still have grave doubts regarding the endgame of coal production in the UK. The Falkland conflict apart what do you remember of Thatcher's great achievements? I'm still scratching my head as I can only remember Scotland being used for the poll tax , ship building closing down, high unemployment and social deprivation, heavy drink and drug culture, nationwide football violence and street gangs running amok Thatchers Britain was shit for 99.5% of people was it not? Edited January 30 by Howdy Doody Jambo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnrazor Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 8 minutes ago, Tazio said: And some are the fish and some the fishermen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazio Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 Just now, Dawnrazor said: Wherever he lays his hat that’s his home. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawnrazor Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 Just now, Tazio said: Wherever he lays his hat that’s his home. 😂👍 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tian447 Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 18 minutes ago, doddsyJR9 said: Yeah, mon the IRA/Greens/Commies/Snp/Plaid Cymru/Red Army etc. Is that better for you comrade? What year do you think this is, out of interest? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddsyJR9 Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 1 minute ago, Howdy Doody Jambo said: The Falkland conflict apart what do you remember of Thatcher's great achievements? I'm still scratching my head as I can only remember Scotland being used for the poll tax , ship building closing down, high unemployment and social deprivation, heavy drink and drug culture, nationwide football violence and street gangs running amok Thatchers Britain was shit for 99.5% of people was it not? If you were a young man in the 70's Labour run Britain. You would remember it as being real poverty stricken times, brought about by as per usual union left wing green brigade self serving ness. Thatcher ushered in decades of empowerment, employment and growth for ordinary people. There were mistakes, the miners were used by the self serving union green brigade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
il Duce McTarkin Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 We need more Tony Blairs imo. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Real Maroonblood Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 5 minutes ago, doddsyJR9 said: If you were a young man in the 70's Labour run Britain. You would remember it as being real poverty stricken times, brought about by as per usual union left wing green brigade self serving ness. Thatcher ushered in decades of empowerment, employment and growth for ordinary people. There were mistakes, the miners were used by the self serving union green brigade. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doddsyJR9 Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 1 minute ago, The Real Maroonblood said: There was nothing funny about the marxist commies using the hard working, brave miners, for their own agenda, to bring down the Tory Government. Men died, impoverished, communities broken. What's funny about that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JimmyCant Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 (edited) I was a cop in 84. My old man was a miner. You can imagine the conflict in our family and it was never healed up until my dad passed (with a disease caused by mining) I remember well into the strike when things were getting really bad for communities. Groups of us were in what they called ‘Fast Action Response Teams’ FARTs for short. We used to patrol the Lothian hotspots in blacked out vans and got sent to Durham a few times. It was pretty hard for a lot of the working class cops (they were a majority in those days) seeing what was happening to those communities. Seeing the bucket raking at night and just struggling to feed their kids. One of the FART vans (not mine)under cover of darkness and rolling in shameful overtime payments, went to a big supermarket in Edinburgh and loaded up with cheap going out of date stuff. They filled the van so tight, they were sitting on each others knees. They drove to Mayfield (I think it was) might have been Easthouses miners welfare club and unloaded the stuff into the car park and covered it up. Getting back into the van and trying to sneak off anonymously a voice came out of the upstairs window ‘Thanks lads, God Bless you’ they had to grab hold of the guy and swear him to keep his mouth shut about where the stuff had come from. Story didn’t come out till years after the strike and was quickly buried as it didn't suit anyone’s agenda at the time It wasn’t all ‘them against us’ Most cops knew we were being used by Maggie but big huge pay rises a few years earlier made it a bit of a non issue. When you did a picket line and it was just local Lothian miners, it was virtually trouble free and respectful. A but of pushing and shoving but quite disciplined on both sides. Although you knew you were getting a fight some days when the Durham and Yorkshire guys came up. What really stuck in the throat is many of us had to give employment tribunal evidence against guys who had been sacked for being arrested. We just couldn’t help them without perjuring ourselves. That’s my biggest regret, having to do that, but the redundancies took them all out of work within a few years anyway. Edited January 30 by JimmyCant Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i wish jj was my dad Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 6 minutes ago, il Duce McTarkin said: We need more Tony Blairs imo. We actually do need more governments like his to grow standards of living. I'm 50 but other than the period between the latter end of Major's govt and the crash of 2017 most of my life has witnessed downturn. The post war consensus was hardly dynamic but it didn't shite all over the working guy. And looking after him keeps the economy healthy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballfirst Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 8 minutes ago, Howdy Doody Jambo said: The Falkland conflict apart what do you remember of Thatcher's great achievements? I'm still scratching my head as I can only remember Scotland being used for the poll tax , ship building closing down, high unemployment and social deprivation, heavy drink and drug culture, nationwide football violence and street gangs running amok Thatchers Britain was shit for 99.5% of people was it not? Thatcher only won the 1983 election because of the Falklands war. My brother was a miner who was on strike both in 1974 and 1984. Scargill was actually right about the government's intention to shut down the coal industry, along with just about every other major manufacturing industry. She created division in society and made it acceptable to make profit by sacking people and the impacting on the future of their communities. Among her other claimed successes, was privatisation, selling off the nations assets then allowing them to profit, for a one off boost to the treasury coffers. That same thing happened with the sale of council houses. How many new houses were built with the proceeds? ......... Virtually none. That's her legacy. The Specials' Ghost Town is a good reflection of the times, even from Thatcher's early days. This town, is coming like a ghost town Bands won't play no more Too much fighting on the dance floor Do you remember the good old days before the ghost town? We danced and sang, and the music played in a de boomtown This town, is coming like a ghost town Why must the youth fight against themselves? This town, is coming like a ghost town Government leaving the youth on the shelf This town, is coming like a ghost town No job to be found in this country Can't go on no more The people getting angry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henrysmithsgloves Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 Lived it😳 was scary,the auld man was in the NACODS union,but never crossed the NUM pickets if they didn't want him to. He was previously a NUM delegate late 60s early 70s. I will leave it at that😳 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tazio Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 (edited) The press did a number on the miners during the 70’s as well with all their stories about miners making a fortune on overtime and living a life of luxury. So by the time the strikes started the hard of thinking had no sympathy. Then you get told it’s an industry on its last legs, so how do people have to do overtime if it’s knackered? Then we spend years subsidising polish mining by importing coal. Genius. Edited January 30 by Tazio Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaddysBar Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 9 minutes ago, JimmyCant said: I was a cop in 84. My old man was a miner. You can imagine the conflict in our family and it was never healed up until my dad passed (with a disease caused by mining) I remember well into the strike when things were getting really bad for communities. Groups of us were in what they called ‘Fast Action Response Teams’ FARTs for short. We used to patrol the Lothian hotspots in blacked out vans and got sent to Durham a few times. It was pretty hard for a lot of the working class cops (they were a majority in those days) seeing what was happening to those communities. Seeing the bucket raking at night and just struggling to feed their kids. One of the FART vans (not mine)under cover of darkness and rolling in shameful overtime payments, went to a big supermarket in Edinburgh and loaded up with cheap going out of date stuff. They filled the van so tight, they were sitting on each others knees. They drove to Mayfield (I think it was) might have been Easthouses miners welfare club and unloaded the stuff into the car park and covered it up. Getting back into the van and trying to sneak off anonymously a voice came out of the upstairs window ‘Thanks lads, God Bless you’ they had to grab hold of the guy and swear him to keep his mouth shut about where the stuff had come from. Story didn’t come out till years after the strike and was quickly buried as it didn't suit anyone’s agenda at the time It wasn’t all ‘them against us’ Most cops knew we were being used by Maggie but big huge pay rises a few years earlier made it a bit of a non issue. When you did a picket line and it was just local Lothian miners, it was virtually trouble free and respectful. A but of pushing and shoving but quite disciplined on both sides. Although you knew you were getting a fight some days when the Durham and Yorkshire guys came up. What really stuck in the throat is many of us had to give employment tribunal evidence against guys who had been sacked for being arrested. We just couldn’t help them without perjuring ourselves. That’s my biggest regret, having to do that, but the redundancies took them all out of work within a few years anyway. Good post. I was a kid in easthouses / mayfield during the ‘84 strike, albeit my dad wasn’t a miner. It was brutal but the community rallied. Miner’s kids getting free access to the Sunday club at Newbattle high for example and loads more I would have been too young to know about. FARTS though😂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Footballfirst Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 21 minutes ago, doddsyJR9 said: If you were a young man in the 70's Labour run Britain. You would remember it as being real poverty stricken times, brought about by as per usual union left wing green brigade self serving ness. Thatcher ushered in decades of empowerment, employment and growth for ordinary people. There were mistakes, the miners were used by the self serving union green brigade. Crap! My dad died in the 70s of emphysema, at age 56, after having worked in the pits for 30 years. No wonder the miners sought better pay and conditions. I was still able to go to university in the 70s (the first in my family to do so), with no tuition fees, a maximum grant, and no student debt. I was able to buy my first flat on a mortgage at 2.5 times my salary, also in the 70s. How does someone in their 20s fare today trying to do the same as I did. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaddysBar Posted January 30 Share Posted January 30 37 minutes ago, Howdy Doody Jambo said: The Falkland conflict apart what do you remember of Thatcher's great achievements? I'm still scratching my head as I can only remember Scotland being used for the poll tax , ship building closing down, high unemployment and social deprivation, heavy drink and drug culture, nationwide football violence and street gangs running amok Thatchers Britain was shit for 99.5% of people was it not? You forgot the biggie, selling off pretty much all the nation’s silver to her government’s rich pals. I’ve had dealings with doddsy on here before and I won’t be doing it again. Utter bellend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
il Duce McTarkin Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 6 minutes ago, Footballfirst said: I was still able to go to university in the 70s (the first in my family to do so), with no tuition fees, a maximum grant, and no student debt. I was able to buy my first flat on a mortgage at 2.5 times my salary, also in the 70s. How does someone in their 20s fare today trying to do the same as I did. They don't stand a ****ing chance. Simple as that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howdy Doody Jambo Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 (edited) 42 minutes ago, doddsyJR9 said: If you were a young man in the 70's Labour run Britain. You would remember it as being real poverty stricken times, brought about by as per usual union left wing green brigade self serving ness. Thatcher ushered in decades of empowerment, employment and growth for ordinary people. There were mistakes, the miners were used by the self serving union green brigade. Unemployment up, then down, then up again. The unemployment rate rose from 5.3 per cent to a high of 12 per cent in 1984, before falling to 7.5 per cent when Thatcher left office. It began to rise again in 1990, and continued to do so after she left, reaching a high of 10.8 per cent in January 1993. Decades of employment and growth for ordinary people Naw she didnay Edited January 31 by Howdy Doody Jambo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FWJ Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 (edited) 44 minutes ago, i wish jj was my dad said: We actually do need more governments like his to grow standards of living. I'm 50 but other than the period between the latter end of Major's govt and the crash of 2017 most of my life has witnessed downturn. The post war consensus was hardly dynamic but it didn't shite all over the working guy. And looking after him keeps the economy healthy Hear, hear. Attlee in the 40s, Wilson & Jenkins in the 60s and Blair & Brown in the 00s made huge improvements to this country. (And I have no doubt Tories like McMillan, Eden & Douglas-Home would be horrified at what their party has become) Edited January 31 by FWJ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FWJ Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 41 minutes ago, PaddysBar said: You forgot the biggie, selling off pretty much all the nation’s silver to her government’s rich pals. I’ve had dealings with doddsy on here before and I won’t be doing it again. Utter bellend. … and it was an Tory ex-PM (Harold MacMillan) that called her out for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pasquale for King Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 58 minutes ago, Footballfirst said: Thatcher only won the 1983 election because of the Falklands war. My brother was a miner who was on strike both in 1974 and 1984. Scargill was actually right about the government's intention to shut down the coal industry, along with just about every other major manufacturing industry. She created division in society and made it acceptable to make profit by sacking people and the impacting on the future of their communities. Among her other claimed successes, was privatisation, selling off the nations assets then allowing them to profit, for a one off boost to the treasury coffers. That same thing happened with the sale of council houses. How many new houses were built with the proceeds? ......... Virtually none. That's her legacy. The Specials' Ghost Town is a good reflection of the times, even from Thatcher's early days. This town, is coming like a ghost town Bands won't play no more Too much fighting on the dance floor Do you remember the good old days before the ghost town? We danced and sang, and the music played in a de boomtown This town, is coming like a ghost town Why must the youth fight against themselves? This town, is coming like a ghost town Government leaving the youth on the shelf This town, is coming like a ghost town No job to be found in this country Can't go on no more The people getting angry Great post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pap Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 Tony Blair the war criminal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OBE Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 Didnae ken the power station workers were bought by, Thatcher. Their company pensions were enhanced handsomely when they didn't come out in support of the miners Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 7 hours ago, doddsyJR9 said: What age are you? Are you trying to goad me into a ban or something? If you are an Snp/plaid cymru/green/leftist/commie etc, then of course you would think tony blair was a great pm. Margaret Thatcher hated the IRA/Greens/Separatists/Commies etc. Greatest ever PM. As I said, I do have grave doubts over the miners who were duped by the green brigade into trying to bring down the Tory government. She hated Scotland. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 Feck being a miner or his family a couple of hundred years ago. You were all fecked to slavery. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henrysmithsgloves Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 1 minute ago, ri Alban said: Feck being a miner or his family a couple of hundred years ago. You were all fecked to slavery. As well as the rest of the lower class were subservient 🤬 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ri Alban Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 1 hour ago, henrysmithsgloves said: As well as the rest of the lower class were subservient 🤬 Indeed. But I was astounded when I read a wee while ago about miners in the 1700s in Scotland and elsewhere. 🤯 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dusk_Till_Dawn Posted January 31 Author Share Posted January 31 Hmm. Well anyway, good series Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XB52 Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 10 hours ago, Jeffros Furios said: Thatcher was a slag .. Tony Blair is a great man .tories are scum . Yes, No, Yes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ehcaley Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 10 hours ago, doddsyJR9 said: I was a young man during the miners strikes, and still vividly remember the enormous effects it had across all spectrums of society at that time. While I admire Thatcher for her many great achievements, the devastation that it took to break the miners strikes, was heartbreaking. Scargill and the green brigade left wing unions used the miners to try to bring down the Tory government, and while they were the main architects of the destruction, I still have grave doubts regarding the endgame of coal production in the UK. As ,possibly,the only person on this thread that was on strike, I find your description and analysis fascinating,your insight gets right to the heart of the conflict! Dimmer than my cap lamp at the end of a shift🖕 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallPaul Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 11 hours ago, Dusk_Till_Dawn said: Anyone watched the C4 documentary on this? Found it really interesting, the range of voices they’d managed to pull together and all the different opinions on it. A very good watch. I’ve no time for Thatcher but the series left me with the feeling that above all else, Scargill screwed up massively by dodging a national ballot. He looked like a genuinely broken man as he announced the return to work. Just finished episode 2, shame it became police v miners. Neither side covered themselves in glory the behavior on the picket lines coupled with police brutality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henrysmithsgloves Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 1 hour ago, ri Alban said: Indeed. But I was astounded when I read a wee while ago about miners in the 1700s in Scotland and elsewhere. 🤯 Just over 100 years😳 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TallPaul Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 8 hours ago, Pap said: Tony Blair the war criminal. Had no idea he started life down the pit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pap Posted January 31 Share Posted January 31 34 minutes ago, TallPaul said: Had no idea he started life down the pit. He slid out one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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