Vargas

[ramrod]

28 minutes ago, Birregrande said:

That international goal will hopefully build his confidence though no? Might be u/23's but the boy looks happy.  Let's get behind him and see what happens.  I personally think he'll come good, like very good. 

Hopefully m8

I'm right behind him, but he has contributed zero apart from running about a lot and tracking back.

As it stands the guy is an absolute myth on here, that's not to say he can't turn it round though. 

[Hackney Hearts]

34 minutes ago, ramrod said:

I'm right behind him, but he has contributed zero apart from running about a lot and tracking back.

 

Well it's not quite 'zero', is it? You yourself reminded us that he won the penalty against PAOK, others have mentioned various near things, including the screamer that came off the woodwork. Give it time.

[Fxxx the SPFL]

54 minutes ago, ramrod said:

Hopefully m8

I'm right behind him, but he has contributed zero apart from running about a lot and tracking back.

As it stands the guy is an absolute myth on here, that's not to say he can't turn it round though. 

I think you’re being a bit harsh on the lad he’s better with a team who play higher up the pitch wait until we play the scaffs from east end of weegie he’ll come good 👍 

[jamboinglasgow]

6 hours ago, Diadora Van Basten said:

I agree he has been close on a few occasions to scoring or creating but not quite managed it. I am thinking his cut back v PAOK away, his shot of the bar v Aberdeen and nearly getting on the end of Kingsley ball across the box versus Ross County.

 

I think it won’t be long before he becomes a very important player for us.

 

I would agree with that.

 

I understand why people are a bit down on him as he hasn't created too much. But I think the way he has worked hard, dug away doing the defensive side is a big sign why people should be optimistic. Its hard work and unglamourous but it sets the right mindset. As I said (I think) earlier in this thread, I think people have to understand that he is coming up against a completely different style of defence. Defences he will play against play more open and less pressing due to the game being slower, meaning players can get more joy against them with a turn of pace. In Scottish football its faster and defences like to play more compact, meaning you get less time to make decisions and you are facing up against more defenders. Vargas may never learn how to deal with this, but I am confident he will. He is needing to adapt his game to use his pace and technique to use against these teams. (I think its why against PAOK he had more joy as their defence played a bit more open.)

 

I also think he is playing in an attacking line up that constantly changes and has not yet got an understanding of each other. I think over the last few games are starting to see that. And that will make a big difference.

 

I do think Vargas will do well for us, I do want him to get his first goal for us as I think that will make a big difference. 

[Finlay James]

Vargas is going to be a very dangerous player for us.  Great scouting by the club.

[1971fozzy]

2 hours ago, Finlay James said:

Vargas is going to be a very dangerous player for us.  Great scouting by the club.

I agree. When he has Oda back and Tagawa gets a run also I think we will see the best of him. Settling into a new country never mind a club must be very hard.

watching the recent Beckham program on Netflix (I know it’s a different level) was an eye opener with his moving about and how it affected his family and him. Being alone in a different country must be hard no matter age or circumstances.

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

The goal he scored and every other YouTube clip I ever saw indicates he'd be better off inside

[Neverforgetfiveone]

14 hours ago, ramrod said:

Hopefully m8

I'm right behind him, but he has contributed zero apart from running about a lot and tracking back.

As it stands the guy is an absolute myth on here, that's not to say he can't turn it round though. 

Point I would make is that at least he is fit and playing. Weve made other signings that have made absolutely ZERO impact on the football club. 

[TheBigO]

1 hour ago, 1971fozzy said:

I agree. When he has Oda back and Tagawa gets a run also I think we will see the best of him. Settling into a new country never mind a club must be very hard.

watching the recent Beckham program on Netflix (I know it’s a different level) was an eye opener with his moving about and how it affected his family and him. Being alone in a different country must be hard no matter age or circumstances.

I think having Oda on the right hugging the touchline and Vargas starting on the left but with remit to make inverted runs on and off the ball will be a really good setup.  My hope is we go back to this, with 2 up top (Shanks and Tagawa).  No one will enjoy playing against it and it gives us options short and long.   Tagawa working across the opposition back line, looking to create gaps which Vargas can curve runs into for ball over the top etc.  Or we get the ball in to wingers feet and they play off the Cfs.  I like it a lot.  In theory!

[Finlay James]

3 hours ago, 1971fozzy said:

I agree. When he has Oda back and Tagawa gets a run also I think we will see the best of him. Settling into a new country never mind a club must be very hard.

watching the recent Beckham program on Netflix (I know it’s a different level) was an eye opener with his moving about and how it affected his family and him. Being alone in a different country must be hard no matter age or circumstances.

Aye, I think folk play FIFA or football manager and fail to see reality.  I get that some players just hit the ground running but that’s not the norm and very much depends on their ability to adapt in every sense.

 

What I do know is that hearts have put lots in place to help overseas players adapt.

[1971fozzy]

42 minutes ago, Finlay James said:

Aye, I think folk play FIFA or football manager and fail to see reality.  I get that some players just hit the ground running but that’s not the norm and very much depends on their ability to adapt in every sense.

 

What I do know is that hearts have put lots in place to help overseas players adapt.

indeed. And from what I’ve heard the players also help settle overseas players as well. 

[Chong]

Surely factor in the fact he hasn't had a consistent team around him too. Different full back behind him each week and the frequent abominations in midfield for what seemed like forever when he first came in can't have helped. 

 

Settled team would benefit him a lot. 

 

Also think he could offer us the "Gino effect" through the middle which hasn't been possible due to injuries.

 

More to come for sure but he hasn't been bad at all. 

 

[TheBigO]

Just now, Chong said:

Surely factor in the fact he hasn't had a consistent team around him too. Different full back behind him each week and the frequent abominations in midfield for what seemed like forever when he first came in can't have helped. 

 

Settled team would benefit him a lot. 

 

Also think he could offer us the "Gino effect" through the middle which hasn't been possible due to injuries.

 

More to come for sure but he hasn't been bad at all. 

 

When we've had Danny Amankwaa and Aidy White on the wings in recent memory and Gnando and Connor Sammon down the middle.  Even, with no disrespect, the likes of Lewis Moore and Euan Henderson....

 

Kenny is gonna be just fine.

 

He's laid a few on which if they were finished properly he'd be sitting with "stats".  I wonder what his big chances created stats are, not his fault if someone else fluffs their lines.

 

Once we have Oda and Tagawa back, not to mention Barrie and even Pollock, Kenny will have more impact I think.  Both because he can be used sparingly but also just more threat in the team to divide the opposition's attention, which is MASSIVE.  If a team has like one danger man, well not hard to defend!

[jamboinglasgow]

1 hour ago, Finlay James said:

Aye, I think folk play FIFA or football manager and fail to see reality.  I get that some players just hit the ground running but that’s not the norm and very much depends on their ability to adapt in every sense.

 

What I do know is that hearts have put lots in place to help overseas players adapt.

 

Yup. I can understand why people want players to hit the ground running, and of course that would be ideal but signings need to be viewed as long term especially ones with players moving from overseas. Was listening to a podcast that talked about teams building up squads with a view of a year or two in future, so you sign players now and bed them in for the next season, which players who had been signed the year before are bedded in for this season. And that is the reality. Of course you want longer term contracts to make that work. 

 

Glad that Hearts are working hard to get the players to adapt. 

 

22 minutes ago, TheBigO said:

When we've had Danny Amankwaa and Aidy White on the wings in recent memory and Gnando and Connor Sammon down the middle.  Even, with no disrespect, the likes of Lewis Moore and Euan Henderson....

 

Kenny is gonna be just fine.

 

He's laid a few on which if they were finished properly he'd be sitting with "stats".  I wonder what his big chances created stats are, not his fault if someone else fluffs their lines.

 

Once we have Oda and Tagawa back, not to mention Barrie and even Pollock, Kenny will have more impact I think.  Both because he can be used sparingly but also just more threat in the team to divide the opposition's attention, which is MASSIVE.  If a team has like one danger man, well not hard to defend!

 

Vargas has had a few times where he is inches away from connecting onto a shot or just half a second behind the defender. I do think of Oda against Livi last season. His first start and he is probably an inch just too slow to properly connect. If that was towards the end of the season Oda would have got it. I do think thats the same with Vargas, its all about adapting his game to utilise his strengths to fit the speed and physicality of Scottish football.

 

One of the most positive things at the start of the season was the depth of our attack, you could easily make two front fours:

                            

                              Tagawa

        McKay       Shankland       Oda

 

                              Vargas

       Lowry             Boyce          Forrest

 

You could mix and match them but it looked strong, pacy and had a mix of styles. It would allow the club to bring on strong attackers if we are struggling to bring down defences. The problem is that injury has denied us that chance so far. And players bedding in is also taking time. Though its pleasing seeing Forrest who I put down in that 8 at the start of the season purely because we had no one else, now staking the chance and showing what he can do.

 

I would agree, that being able to come off the bench would help Vargas as well. It does look like we are shortly about to have all our attack except McKay back.

 

As for your last point, so true. Always thought the best example of that was in 10/11 season, where we were flying with Templeton on fire with Kyle leading the line. The moment Kyle got injured, it removed a player who required to have two defenders marking him because of his presence. This meant teams could double up on Templeton and nullified his attack, meaning the team struggled to score.

[Arthur Morgan]

On 16/10/2023 at 14:31, jamboinglasgow said:

                            Tagawa

        McKay       Shankland       Oda

 

                              Vargas

       Lowry             Boyce          Forrest

 

Lowry has to be in the number 10 role going forward, imo.

[LogicalEric]

Another goal for Kenneth last night 

 

https://twitter.com/tdmas_cr/status/1714434660460065059?s=19

[BackOfTheNet]

 

[naeclue]

Nice goal Kenny, well done.

[Famous 1874]

Try him in the Gino role perhaps. But then leaves us with a headache in other areas especially with Shankland. 
 

Lowry can’t play outwide that efficiently in comparison to the number 10.

 

Shanks obvs can’t play outwide. Either in the 10 or up top. 
 

Forrest and Oda (and Vargas) look better on the right wing in comparison with the left. 

[BackOfTheNet]

Translation of the tweet is: “Great goal by Kenneth Vargas The future has arrived!”

[Lord Beni of Gorgie]

1 hour ago, Famous 1874 said:

Try him in the Gino role perhaps. But then leaves us with a headache in other areas especially with Shankland. 
 

Lowry can’t play outwide that efficiently in comparison to the number 10.

 

Shanks obvs can’t play outwide. Either in the 10 or up top. 
 

Forrest and Oda (and Vargas) look better on the right wing in comparison with the left. 

Absolutely crying out for this

[OTT]

1 hour ago, Famous 1874 said:

Try him in the Gino role perhaps. But then leaves us with a headache in other areas especially with Shankland. 
 

Lowry can’t play outwide that efficiently in comparison to the number 10.

 

Shanks obvs can’t play outwide. Either in the 10 or up top. 
 

Forrest and Oda (and Vargas) look better on the right wing in comparison with the left. 

 

Lowry isn't our player. 

 

If we can get more out of Shankland and Vargas by playing them in the 10 and Gino role, then its a no brainer as far as I'm concerned. 

 

Being benched doesn't mean not being a part of the match day squad, or not getting minutes. 

 

I would rather see Shanks playing as a striker, but for whatever reason, he seems to be less prolific as a CF - or perhaps the way we're playing isn't to his benefit.. 

[Sooks]

Isnt it strange how all these players do well for their countries but are less effective at Hearts ? To the casual observer it would appear that they are actually very good players who we are not getting the best out of . Now in that scenario where would you say the blame and solution lies 

[johnking123]

Still sa it's coaching that is the problem. Not our signings. 

[Sooks]

2 minutes ago, johnking123 said:

Still sa it's coaching that is the problem. Not our signings. 

Correct 

[CMc]

On 16/10/2023 at 13:49, TheBigO said:

When we've had Danny Amankwaa and Aidy White on the wings in recent memory and Gnando and Connor Sammon down the middle.  Even, with no disrespect, the likes of Lewis Moore and Euan Henderson....

 

Kenny is gonna be just fine.

 

He's laid a few on which if they were finished properly he'd be sitting with "stats".  I wonder what his big chances created stats are, not his fault if someone else fluffs their lines.

 

Once we have Oda and Tagawa back, not to mention Barrie and even Pollock, Kenny will have more impact I think.  Both because he can be used sparingly but also just more threat in the team to divide the opposition's attention, which is MASSIVE.  If a team has like one danger man, well not hard to defend!

He’s created six shooting chances for team mates in the league so far. Of non-forwards, only Lowry and Kingsley are ahead of him (on 7). Shanks and Boyce on 12 and 9 

[TheBigO]

5 minutes ago, CMc said:

He’s created six shooting chances for team mates in the league so far. Of non-forwards, only Lowry and Kingsley are ahead of him (on 7). Shanks and Boyce on 12 and 9 

And I guess that doesn't count any that we've failed to shoot from.

 

Basically, the kid has come in from bloody Costa flippin Rica been thrown in with weight on his shoulders and given a good account of himself - shown character along with flashes of his talent.  As I've mentioned, he's our only "threat" in real terms, so when we have some guys back from injury, he'll be freed up a little.  Even having Lowry and Forrest on form will help him now, though we go in to OF matches.  In a way, perhaps his pace against the OF works - Gino always did well against Celtic I felt.

[Gizmo]

4 hours ago, Sooks said:

Isnt it strange how all these players do well for their countries but are less effective at Hearts ? To the casual observer it would appear that they are actually very good players who we are not getting the best out of . Now in that scenario where would you say the blame and solution lies 

It's difficult to reach a different conclusion. The clincher, setting aside new parent being an exhausting period, is Shanks regressing. 

We seem to never want to play to people's strengths. The rare exception for me was when we moved Gino to the #9 position.

Sibbick just showed he is very capable at FB, forcing Boyle to switch wings. What's the betting we hang him out to dry in midfield or CB next time he plays.

If we really want jack-of-all-trade players we should have pushed the boat out to sign Dr Funk. Otherwise, play players in the ****ing positions they excel in. It's NOT difficult. 

[Arthur Morgan]

I wish he was scoring goals like that for us! 😂 Hopefully the start of something good 👍🏻

[wavydavy]

3 minutes ago, Arthur Morgan said:

I wish he was scoring goals like that for us! 😂 Hopefully the start of something good 👍🏻

 

Maybe we should try playing him more through the middle and he may score.

[Arthur Morgan]

21 minutes ago, wavydavy said:

 

Maybe we should try playing him more through the middle and he may score.

 

Yeah I'm surprised we haven't tried him through the middle yet. 

[Sooks]

1 hour ago, Gizmo said:

It's difficult to reach a different conclusion. The clincher, setting aside new parent being an exhausting period, is Shanks regressing. 

We seem to never want to play to people's strengths. The rare exception for me was when we moved Gino to the #9 position.

Sibbick just showed he is very capable at FB, forcing Boyle to switch wings. What's the betting we hang him out to dry in midfield or CB next time he plays.

If we really want jack-of-all-trade players we should have pushed the boat out to sign Dr Funk. Otherwise, play players in the ****ing positions they excel in. It's NOT difficult. 

Totally , but every one is twisting themselves in knots to lay the blame anywhere but at the coaches doors . It would be quite amusing if it was not so frustrating and depressing  

 

It was the same with Stendel and Locke . There are know it all football types who can not accept when they get something wrong , and they just twist and turn from the reality before their eyes . Stendel was hopeless but you still have folk trying to find somewhere else to lay the blame other than at his door . Naismith might come good , but he has got us off to a poor start and he is not getting the best out of the squad we have . But no , it is Budge , McKinlay , Savage , Neilson , Rowles or the kit man to blame . No way could these football intelligentsia state so assertively that these guys were the real deal and not be right

 

Sometimes it is not a deep conundrum or an enigma . There is no fifth column to blame and there is no sabotage or lack of backing . Sometimes the really obvious answer is the correct one  

[Cambo]

All the youtube footage of him before his arrival, appeared as though he was playing centrally, although not a traditional number 9 as such. His instincts will be diminished by playing out wide.

[Graham Thomson]

Come on son 😊 this is your stage 

Let's see your potential against the unwashed. 👍 

[rudi must stay]

On 18/10/2023 at 17:23, wavydavy said:

 

Maybe we should try playing him more through the middle and he may score.

 

I like him best through the middle

[OmiyaHearts]

Naismith playing someone out of their preferred position? That's a first.

[rudi must stay]

1 minute ago, OmiyaHearts said:

Naismith playing someone out of their preferred position? That's a first.

 

Sir Alex Ferguson did that too with Ryan Giggs. Didn't turn out too badly. I believe all players should be good enough pros to play anywhere apart from in goals.

[JimmyCant]

On 18/10/2023 at 11:25, OTT said:

 

Lowry isn't our player. 

 

If we can get more out of Shankland and Vargas by playing them in the 10 and Gino role, then its a no brainer as far as I'm concerned. 

 

Being benched doesn't mean not being a part of the match day squad, or not getting minutes. 

 

I would rather see Shanks playing as a striker, but for whatever reason, he seems to be less prolific as a CF - or perhaps the way we're playing isn't to his benefit.. 

Vargas isn’t our player either

 

Lowry is a better player than Vargas has so far been

[HeartsandonlyHearts]

6 minutes ago, JimmyCant said:

Vargas isn’t our player either

 

Lowry is a better player than Vargas has so far been

🤔

Goals wise, yes. 
As a hustling hustler, I’ve still got a lot to prove type player? Lowry doesn’t come close to Vargas. 

[OTT]

16 minutes ago, JimmyCant said:

Vargas isn’t our player either

 

Lowry is a better player than Vargas has so far been

 

Fairly certain Vargas is loan to buy which is entirely different. 

[Graham Thomson]

2 hours ago, HeartsandonlyHearts said:

🤔

Goals wise, yes. 
As a hustling hustler, I’ve still got a lot to prove type player? Lowry doesn’t come close to Vargas. 

And Vargas has done what exactly? 

[hearts00]

I want to really like Vargas and he works hard but his contribution this season has been winning a pen vs. PAOK. 
 

No goals and no assists aint good enough. 

[Victor Meldrew]

Doesn't it say something about the management that such a bright talent (who scores for his country) can't score in the SPL.

 

He, like so many others, should come good if / when we sack the current management team and get a decent one.

[Graham Thomson]

35 minutes ago, Victor Meldrew said:

Doesn't it say something about the management that such a bright talent (who scores for his country) can't score in the SPL.

 

He, like so many others, should come good if / when we sack the current management team and get a decent one.

What difference would it make who the management are if he can't assist or score a goal? His job is pretty straightforward. 

[BackOfTheNet]

Tried in the Ginnelly role today, but unlike when we had Ginnelly our CB’s inexplicably were playing high balls Jo to the shortest guy on the park. Such a waste of possession. Our players are absolute idiots if they think that’s a good idea. That or they’re not extremely limited on the ball and should be nowhere near a side of our stature.

[ramrod]

We simply cant be making his move permanent on what we've seen so far. 

That could change obviously but on what we've seen so far he hasn't earned a permanentl deal .

[MoncurMacdonaldMercer]

sitting on the bench after being substituted grinning like a Cheshire Cat

 

maybe not expecting him to be in tears or solemnly contemplating the meaning of life but looked like he absolutely didn’t give a **** that we were getting absolutely rag-dolled with zero hint of resistance

 

to be fair when he’s on the park he does run about a lot - not sure that in itself is enough either but worryingly possibly one of our better players 😔

 

 

[Sarah O]

I like Vargas and thought he did well today. Would have switched Boyce for Shanks. 

 

Maybe that's why I'm no football manager. 

[Balaclava]

Headless chicken with 0 goals or assists. Shite 

[RoiK]

With the game gone, I thought that it was actually a good idea to try Vargas through the middle. The problem was that we didn’t really do anything to support that tactical switch. Substituting him just compounded that nonsense.