***Official Rosenborg v Heart of Midlothian Match Thread***

[SectionDJambo]

A disappointing performance in the first half, not helped by playing Beni from the start in such a big game. He needed games to get up to match fitness, but surely the Partick game would have been a better option.

Second half changes helped us get back in the tie from a very precarious position. We’ll have more players available for the second leg in front of a capacity, noisy crowd. I think we’ll win the tie.
This result is not the disaster being shouted about on here. Losing to a team from Andorra would be a disaster. 
These games are not made any easier for Scottish clubs by them being played so early in our season.

[JimmyCant]

2 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

We just aren’t the same without a quick player ahead of Shankland stretching teams and making space, we were trying to force balls through the middle, where there was no room. 
We are better when we get the ball wide too, one decent cross creates the goal. 
All to play for though and i think we will beat them next week to progress. 

Shankland definitely can’t play as an out and out striker unless you’re playing 2 strikers. we got a bit hamstrung with our selection because of visa issues and we didn’t really have anyone good enough to run for Shankland. We know he’s not got a lot of pace. He doesn’t run channels or play on the shoulder. We knew in the summer it was a massive problem and we’ve fixed it, only to be tripped up by a daft immigration rule.

 

Game passed Lowry by tonight which was really disappointing. He wants to play in a front foot team where he can create, not be marking up in midfield and keeping a shape

 

Forrest tried but never got into it. Devlin was reckless all night and Beni simply should not have been picked to start. Defensively we were actually okay but 2 really bad goals lost through Beni, although I wondered if Clark could leap and punch the first one before it gets to the back post. Second goal is a shambles from 3 or 4 players letting runners go.

 

I think we’ll beat them next week but we might need a crowd to frighten them a bit and help the team to keep going if it’s not happening quickly

[Costanza]

21 minutes ago, JimmyCant said:

Hardly inexcusable. Most teams would be happy enough coming away with a 1 goal deficit against an experienced European campaigner with nearly double the co-efficient we have. Especially against a team who, now that we’ve seen them at close quarters, don’t have much to worry about.

 

Passive performance and a wee bit scaredy cat and disjointed Yes. Inexcusable is way over dramatic

Agreed

[DS98]

52 minutes ago, OTT said:

 

Got to say, I absolutely hate the amount of nothing passes our CBs do. Its like they make a pass 10 yards and immediately receive it back having gained zero ground and it just leaves you wondering WTF was the point. 

 

Would like to see us play with a bit more purpose. Not just knocking the ball about at the back for the sake of it. Christ, we're playing against a team that Crusaders just about put out by playing route 1, and we're trying to pass it through them? 

What would you have had us do? Launch the ball to an isolated Shankland? Might be different next week with Tagawa back and Boyce closer to fitness but we had limited options tonight. 

[No Idle Talk]

41 minutes ago, David McCaig said:

 

Next Thursday will be one of the great European nights at Tynecastle as we come from behind to beat Rosenborg and the Wee Team Hibs it in Switzerland 🙂

 

I might just have a wee wager on that. It's a definite possibility. 

[Bob Loblaw]

Beni shouldn't have started, but hindsight is a wonderful thing. He's been in full training all pre season, he's played friendlies and on paper this was a less physical game than he'll face in Scotland.  Naismith obviously thought he could get an hour or so out of him but it wasn't to be. Silly but we move on and thankfully we are still in the tie.

 

Not really a surprise, but it's a shame to see some people lose the head a bit by writing him off completely or saying he'll not be the player he was. He was out a long time, you don't come back at your best after that immediately. It is a long road and fans need to be patient, but he also has to be managed properly.  Maybe see him get another start against Partick in a couple of weeks.

[E3OBE]

36 minutes ago, hearts00 said:

Two games with Shankland up top and two games when it has really not worked. Surely plain to see for everyone now that Shankland needs someone with pace ahead of him. 

i think that’s always been pretty plain to see has it not!? Not a lot we could have done about that tonight with Tagawa, Mackay & Vargas unavailable. (I think we are banking a lot on the new boys this season btw). I’m confident they are decent but you just never know.

[Maple Leaf]

31 minutes ago, Pans Jambo said:

Our slow laboured throw ins that seem to take forever and then we get closed down and inevitably give away posession. 

We were like that most of last year.  And we often throw backwards as well.

[No Idle Talk]

16 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

Mightve been an idea to play Toby instead of Beni if Pete needed a rest. 

 

Indeed.

[chrystaf]

1 hour ago, No Idle Talk said:

Well we are very much still in the tie. Which is about as much as we could have asked for at half time. The first half performance was dreadful. 

 

The management team got the starting lineup all wrong tonight. Dropping Stephen Kingsley was a bad move but the decision to play Beni from the start was inexplicable! Shankland up front on his own doesn't work either. 

 

Young managers will make mistakes as they learn. Tonight's team selection was one of those bumps in the road. Hopefully some lessons will have been learnt. 

 

The positives are that the tie is still there for us and we will have Tagawa available for the second leg. We are going to need his pace up front. 

 

All to play for next Thursday. 

In a nutshell.  Though even I would not have played beni.

[Sherbet]

12 minutes ago, JimmyCant said:

Shankland definitely can’t play as an out and out striker unless you’re playing 2 strikers. we got a bit hamstrung with our selection because of visa issues and we didn’t really have anyone good enough to run for Shankland. We know he’s not got a lot of pace. He doesn’t run channels or play on the shoulder. We knew in the summer it was a massive problem and we’ve fixed it, only to be tripped up by a daft immigration rule.

 

Game passed Lowry by tonight which was really disappointing. He wants to play in a front foot team where he can create, not be marking up in midfield and keeping a shape

 

Forrest tried but never got into it. Devlin was reckless all night and Beni simply should not have been picked to start. Defensively we were actually okay but 2 really bad goals lost through Beni, although I wondered if Clark could leap and punch the first one before it gets to the back post. Second goal is a shambles from 3 or 4 players letting runners go.

 

I think we’ll beat them next week but we might need a crowd to frighten them a bit and help the team to keep going if it’s not happening quickly

Agree re clark.  The ball was crossed across the 6 yard box and not very high. 

[MattyK82]

9 minutes ago, E3OBE said:

i think that’s always been pretty plain to see has it not!? Not a lot we could have done about that tonight with Tagawa, Mackay & Vargas unavailable. (I think we are banking a lot on the new boys this season btw). I’m confident they are decent but you just never know.

Most teams are.

[chrystaf]

12 minutes ago, DS98 said:

What would you have had us do? Launch the ball to an isolated Shankland? Might be different next week with Tagawa back and Boyce closer to fitness but we had limited options tonight. 

Agree but that was still no excuse for the horrendous display for circa 70 minutes.  Dominated by a speedy no 11 and a 16 year old kid. 

[DG_HMFC]

Taking everything into consideration, it's not a bad result to get out of there with a 2-1 defeat. 

 

They are well into their season, and we are still early days in terms of fitness and player availability. I'm hoping next week at Tynie we'll be on the front foot and put some of our chances away.

[colinmaroon]

2 hours ago, 1971fozzy said:

quite a feat to manage the worst post of the night but you did it. Tragic patter

 

Pile on.  Shanks was awful in first half.  His touch often is poor, if it wasn't he wouldn’t be at Tynecastle.  His career has been a balance of that shortcoming versus his poaching/goal scoring. 

 

Whether you agree or not that is a reasoned argument unlike your typical repetitive personal insults.   Grow up. 

Edited August 10, 2023 by colinmaroon

[colinmaroon]

2 hours ago, maggieb said:

Thoughts on Beni ?

Ridiculous to pitch him on from the start after over a year out, and in this game.  Plus, it was glaringly obvious he was way short of match fitness, cost the first goal.  No lesson learned, cost the second AND could have stretched a tendon/hamstring. 

 

Very poor management. 

 

 

[FJT]

Shankland - isolated up front first half and had very little to work with, looked frustrated. Not his best game by any stretch but I don’t get how people can’t see what stares them in the face sometimes and just throw criticism around without considering context. 
Wrong team selection at the outset, and I was surprised Kingsley and Haring didn’t start given the way the St Johnstone game went. 
Atkinson was very good again and the subs did pretty well. Boyce looks sharper than he was prior to his injury! We eventually picked up the pace and pushed forward more but that was pretty late on again.
bring on Thursday. I think there’s still a good chance we’ll be going through. 
 

[Chuck Berry]

This is where we really miss a proper reserve league, where Beni, Boyce, Halkett, Gordon etc could ease themselves back into games.  They can't play for the B team, so they can only be eased back using the first team.

[Rods]

Hopefully the last we see of Lowry. Called it earlier but got pulled up for being a Tim or a Hibby. We have youngsters the boy Denholm was superb and his performance made my heart swell as he is one of our own. 

[Hansel]

1 minute ago, Rods said:

Hopefully the last we see of Lowry. Called it earlier but got pulled up for being a Tim or a Hibby. We have youngsters the boy Denholm was superb and his performance made my heart swell as he is one of our own. 

[Rods]

Just now, Hansel said:

Feeling guilty 

[Hansel]

1 minute ago, Rods said:

Feeling guilty 

[MarkDevriesScores4]

Saw the reaction videos with Frankie and Shanks. No mention of the mistakes made with team selection. Also, both seemed to think we played well which is concerning. 

[Rods]

Just now, Hansel said:

We have the players we don’t need Rangers players who contribute nothing. 
 

If you need further explanation pm me 

[BlueRiver]

7 minutes ago, Rods said:

Hopefully the last we see of Lowry. Called it earlier but got pulled up for being a Tim or a Hibby. We have youngsters the boy Denholm was superb and his performance made my heart swell as he is one of our own. 

 

Away and don't talk so much pish. Lowry was a gamechanger at the weekend. 

[FJT]

Just now, Rods said:

We have the players we don’t need Rangers players who contribute nothing. 
 

If you need further explanation pm me 

Did you see the game last weekend? 

 

And players plural? One, I thought?!

I get it that you have a point in not liking the fact we’ve got a loan from them, but in terms of assessing his potential worth on the pitch for us…? 

[Rods]

Just now, BlueRiver said:

 

Away and don't talk so much pish. Lowry was a gamechanger at the weekend. 

the formation was a game changer Lowry played his part but he was worse than horrendous this evening. Terrible performance and still unhappy he is ahead of our own talent. 

[BlueRiver]

1 minute ago, Rods said:

the formation was a game changer Lowry played his part but he was worse than horrendous this evening. Terrible performance and still unhappy he is ahead of our own talent. 

 

He'll play many more games in maroon because he's a good player. 

 

 

[The_razors_edge]

I only saw the first half as I had to take my daughter to football training but wow we were woeful. Glad to hear we improved in the second half and managed to sneak a goal. 

[MarkDevriesScores4]

1 minute ago, Rods said:

the formation was a game changer Lowry played his part but he was worse than horrendous this evening. Terrible performance and still unhappy he is ahead of our own talent. 

There was plenty of “our own talent” that were utter guff tonight Rods. Some of “our own talent” were crap on Saturday too whereas Lowry was a game changer. 
 

i understand your loyalty to hearts own players but I think you’re on your own thinking Lowry won’t be good for us. 

[Armageddon]

I thought Lowry was ok tonight.  Loved that we made a complete game plan change with the subs, a bold

move that we would never have done in times gone by.

 

Hoping with the 3 boys at home that we will have enough to get through.

[Rods]

1 minute ago, FJT said:

Did you see the game last weekend? 

 

And players plural? One, I thought?!

I get it that you have a point in not liking the fact we’ve got a loan from them, but in terms of assessing his potential worth on the pitch for us…? 

Watched the game. He played well on Saturday. He was terrible tonight pushed of the ball weak in the tackles. What positives did you see tonight over Smith or Grant. 

[DS98]

38 minutes ago, chrystaf said:

Agree but that was still no excuse for the horrendous display for circa 70 minutes.  Dominated by a speedy no 11 and a 16 year old kid. 

Horrendous? Have a word ffs. 

[Rods]

4 minutes ago, BlueRiver said:

 

He'll play many more games in maroon because he's a good player. 

 

 

We can agree to disagree on that one Blue 

[BlueRiver]

1 minute ago, Rods said:

Watched the game. He played well on Saturday. He was terrible tonight pushed of the ball weak in the tackles. What positives did you see tonight over Smith or Grant. 

 

Come on - one so-so game and we bin him? Grant and Smith have been rotten in plenty games as well. 

 

Unrealistic to expect him to dazzle every match. 

[Pasquale for King]

51 minutes ago, JimmyCant said:

Shankland definitely can’t play as an out and out striker unless you’re playing 2 strikers. we got a bit hamstrung with our selection because of visa issues and we didn’t really have anyone good enough to run for Shankland. We know he’s not got a lot of pace. He doesn’t run channels or play on the shoulder. We knew in the summer it was a massive problem and we’ve fixed it, only to be tripped up by a daft immigration rule.

 

Game passed Lowry by tonight which was really disappointing. He wants to play in a front foot team where he can create, not be marking up in midfield and keeping a shape

 

Forrest tried but never got into it. Devlin was reckless all night and Beni simply should not have been picked to start. Defensively we were actually okay but 2 really bad goals lost through Beni, although I wondered if Clark could leap and punch the first one before it gets to the back post. Second goal is a shambles from 3 or 4 players letting runners go.

 

I think we’ll beat them next week but we might need a crowd to frighten them a bit and help the team to keep going if it’s not happening quickly

Agree with all that, Rowles made the first mistake then Devlin dives in, poor defending all round for the goal but the cross goes really close to Clark. 
Lowry for me, like McKay needs to be in space and playing as a 10 puts him up against too many players as opposed to isolating him on w full back, better cutting in from the left. 
Forrest, and Devlin,  are honest triers but you need more at this level. 
These two games were always going to be a problem so early in the season with players not fully fit, prepared and ready for a variety of reasons. 

[BlueRiver]

1 minute ago, Rods said:

We can agree to disagree on that one Blue 

 

Fair play Rods. All the best and regardless of the starting XI next week let's hope we're all delighted come full time! 

[Pasquale for King]

20 minutes ago, Rods said:

Hopefully the last we see of Lowry. Called it earlier but got pulled up for being a Tim or a Hibby. We have youngsters the boy Denholm was superb and his performance made my heart swell as he is one of our own. 

I get where you’re coming from but he's here now and will be used for as long as we have him. 

[Rods]

2 minutes ago, MarkDevriesScores4 said:

There was plenty of “our own talent” that were utter guff tonight Rods. Some of “our own talent” were crap on Saturday too whereas Lowry was a game changer. 
 

i understand your loyalty to hearts own players but I think you’re on your own thinking Lowry won’t be good for us. 

game changer based on what?  He was honking tonight poor corners and soft in the tackle. I hope that me and you expect better. Discuss end of season. 

[DesertDawg]

1 hour ago, OTT said:

 

Got to say, I absolutely hate the amount of nothing passes our CBs do. Its like they make a pass 10 yards and immediately receive it back having gained zero ground and it just leaves you wondering WTF was the point. 

 

Would like to see us play with a bit more purpose. Not just knocking the ball about at the back for the sake of it. Christ, we're playing against a team that Crusaders just about put out by playing route 1, and we're trying to pass it through them? 

 

We were back to "Neilson-ball" today, especially in the first half.  

 

Makes you wonder, was Frankie McAvoy calling the shots then too?  He certainly wasn't when Naismith was running the show in the last 7 games of the 2022-23 season.

 

If he was, and is doing it again....he has to go, even if just for the Baningime nonsense today.  We have an admittedly good player, who by his own admission, has flaws in his game but has been working at eliminating them.  He comes on near the end at Perth on Saturday, after more than a year out due to a serious injury, and positions himself well as he always has, but, I can only recall him touching the ball once. 

 

McAvoy today drops him into a key midfield position in a knock-out European tie that potentially is worth millions to the club. Does that make any sense?  It sure as hell doesn't to me.  I've been fired from jobs where my personnel decisions were not nearly as incorrect.

 

Using the U.S. management dogma of, "How much money did you make for me today?" he was a great header from Shankland from being redundant tonight.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Rods]

1 minute ago, Pasquale for King said:

I get where you’re coming from but he's here now and will be used for as long as we have him. 

I want the guy to be brilliant for the heart of Midlothian. Just don’t see it. 
 

on a side note Denholm’s performance was fantastic and I hope to see more of him. 

[Rods]

5 minutes ago, BlueRiver said:

 

Fair play Rods. All the best and regardless of the starting XI next week let's hope we're all delighted come full time! 

Reconvene end of season bro. Preferably at Hampden lol

[Hansel]

2 minutes ago, Rods said:

We have the players we don’t need Rangers players who contribute nothing. 
 

If you need further explanation pm me 

You're writing him off after one start 😆 🤣 

 

Also, why would I be "feeling guilty"

 

Why would I PM you

 

[JimmyCant]

12 minutes ago, Pasquale for King said:

Agree with all that, Rowles made the first mistake then Devlin dives in, poor defending all round for the goal but the cross goes really close to Clark. 
Lowry for me, like McKay needs to be in space and playing as a 10 puts him up against too many players as opposed to isolating him on w full back, better cutting in from the left. 
Forrest, and Devlin,  are honest triers but you need more at this level. 
These two games were always going to be a problem so early in the season with players not fully fit, prepared and ready for a variety of reasons. 

There’s just no point playing Lowry and getting him to be disciplined and mark space and tackle back. Needs a free role or to be an advanced winger. Might have been better right up front if you’re going to play him away in Europe and you don’t have pace there from someone else

 

Funny team selection tonight. I was never sure what the intention was. Keep it low scoring and escape or have a right go. We had no cohesion and drive at all until the last 20 minutes or so 

Edited August 10, 2023 by JimmyCant

[theshed]

11 minutes ago, Rods said:

Watched the game. He played well on Saturday. He was terrible tonight pushed of the ball weak in the tackles. What positives did you see tonight over Smith or Grant. 

Think that was his weakness at rangers as pushed off the ball all the time and doesn’t look like that’s changed much

 

Still a good player 

[Pasquale for King]

2 minutes ago, Rods said:

I want the guy to be brilliant for the heart of Midlothian. Just don’t see it. 
 

on a side note Denholm’s performance was fantastic and I hope to see more of him. 

We all him to do well, and hopefully we will see more of Denholm who i have to admit had no idea who he was when took his training top off 🤦🏽. 
Different players though and hopefully Denholm is learning off all the guys who play beside him who all have different strengths. 

[Pasquale for King]

1 minute ago, JimmyCant said:

There’s just no point playing Lowry and getting him to be disciplined and mark space and tackle back. Needs a free role or to be an advanced winger. Might have better right up front if you’re going to play him away in Europe and you don’t have pace there from someone else

 

Funny team selection tonight. I was never sure what the intention was. Keep it low scoring and escape or have a right go. We had no cohesion and drive at all until the last 20 minutes or so 

Good point about Lowry, not sure he’s quite quick enough to be right up front though. Im sure we will find his best position, and we will more options going forward. I think he was mindful of the fitness of Haring and Kingsley and thought Beni would keep the ball better. Always good that a manager can alter any mistakes they make during a game. 

[jamboinglasgow]

8 minutes ago, Rods said:

I want the guy to be brilliant for the heart of Midlothian. Just don’t see it. 
 

on a side note Denholm’s performance was fantastic and I hope to see more of him. 

 

I dont think you do want him to be brilliant, I think you have made up your mind on him when he signed and undervalue when he does well and overvalue when he does badly, because it suits your initial view.

 

Denham did well and I am pleased for him.

[Pasquale for King]

6 minutes ago, theshed said:

Think that was his weakness at rangers as pushed off the ball all the time and doesn’t look like that’s changed much

 

Still a good player 

Was thinking that early on, but I think most of our players could do with a bit more strength tbh. 

[JimmyCant]

Just now, Pasquale for King said:

Good point about Lowry, not sure he’s quite quick enough to be right up front though. Im sure we will find his best position, and we will more options going forward. I think he was mindful of the fitness of Haring and Kingsley and thought Beni would keep the ball better. Always good that a manager can alter any mistakes they make during a game. 

Indeed. Our bench really helped us tonight, but the Beni ‘mistake’ should have been fixed by the 10 minute mark. He toiled from minute 1